Magnesium: Amount and serving times vs Calcium for MBD treatment?

[Diggie's Friend]

Digestion in humans is slower than that of rats and other small rodents. Lab Research has determined that rats absorb nutrients and anti-nutrients like the insoluble form of (Calcium oxalate), into their bloodstream, better than humans.

In support of older squirrels, and all those the age of weaning, that no longer have incisors; combining ground rodent block and nutrient powders with liquid food grade sources added (cold pressed (organic) virgin coconut oil, food grade nutraceutical oils, and purified water) to support a gruel consistency. Mixtures that have a thicker, and/or sticky gooey consistency, have a tendency to stick to the flap on the back of the throat of rodents, where they can continue to build up and lead to gagging while eating. If a mixture is thick, thin it out before feeding; and should it dry out to where it thickens up; then add some drops of water to thin it out. As the saying goes; "Better to be safe than sorry.".

Take care, DF

[BigNibbler]

Hi BN:
... ( PARAPHRASED I have seen NO evidence in regard to Squirrels per se ,,,I really don't believe that there is much going on in the way of determining either Ca;Mg ratios, nor in the efficacy of serving them together, as opposed to discreetly as in separate feedings

... and you could not simple directly measure out corresponding amounts of the Calcium and Magnesium Sources; you would need to first figure out the percentages of Elemental Calcium and Elemental Magnesium present in the particular Ca and Mg salts that you chose!

...the recommendation from NROLA: Ca:Phos Ration of ~1.7:1 and a Ca:Mg Ratio of 10:1 (quite a difference form the commonly cited 2:1 Ratio)!

there is a true paucity of any definitive or convincing evidence available in support of utilizing some variation of the concept of a Ca:Mg Ratio and for that reason, BN, I just don't worry about it BUT I would love to other who may have evidence supporting this concept or particular reasoning that might lead to my reappraising what I just wrote!

Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

YES - I paraphrased all that you wrote, and THAT is why I am asking ... and will be adding to...

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

YES - I paraphrased all that you wrote, and THAT is why I am asking ... and will be adding to...

????!
StS

[BigNibbler]

????!
StS

Well it sounded like you basically agreed I need to do more research. That there were more unanswered considerations. And that is why I asked and was hoping for answers.

Believe that my condensed version, covered all key points....Please forgive me, if I omitted something. MySquirrel may have distracted me.

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

Well it sounded like you basically agreed I need to do more research. That there were more unanswered considerations. And that is why I asked and was hoping for answers.

Believe that my condensed version, covered all key points....Please forgive me, if I omitted something. MySquirrel may have distracted me.

Hi BN:
No problem really, I just didn't understand what you meant. I started using the Nutrient Requirements of Laboratory Animals (NROLA),: Fourth Revised Edition, 1995 utilizing the Rat Chapter when I first began making Blocks from scratch! I still use it as a guide even though I now make Blocks usually using Teklad 2018 and I have availed myself of this reference ever since! It is quite thorough, relatively easy to use, and is evidence based. I wish that a new edition would appear but probably that is going to be it. Maybe there is something similar that I have somehow overlooked in my searches.

Another source that I have used, BN, is to "reverse engineer" using the very detailed Data Sheets that are available for all of the Teklad Blocks. I absolutely hate the parent company, Inotive and their subsidiaries Envigo and Teklad (At one time Harlan-Teklad) because of Envigo's animal cruelty case involving many horribly mistreated beagles being removed by authorities and a fine and restrictions ordered as well and for the fact that these companies raise laboratory animals. Somehow I am able to indulge in some mental gymnastics and separate the food the company makes from their less wholesome activities with raising and selling laboratory animals!

There are lots of questions and far les answers in the world of Nutrition and unfortunately, the lack of data doesn't prevent someone from writing what are really their opinions as if it was based upon irrefutable evidence or even some quality evidence! Oh well!

If you find some answer, BN, please bring them back to TSB! Certainly all of your question and ours as well, are worthy of answers!

Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[Diggie's Friend]

Though not a given, considering your squirrel's age, his kidneys may not be able to handle as much magnesium as could if he were younger.
You may want to try reducing the amount of the Magnesium L. threonate capsule by "Double Wood" by half, to give a quarter of the total with each meal, instead of adding half the capsule contents with each meal.

[BigNibbler]

Though not a given, considering your squirrel's age, his kidneys may not be able to handle as much magnesium as could if he were younger.
You may want to try reducing the amount of the Magnesium L. threonate capsule by "Double Wood" by half, to give a quarter of the total with each meal, instead of adding half the capsule contents with each meal.

Thank you, but as I said not only is the amount of elemental Magnesium so insignificant in that mix - but MySquirrel did not like it!