Need advice on surgery for malocclusion and recommendation about neuter

[Squirrel Girl 1961]

I started rehabbing last summer so I'm pretty new at this - need some advice. I just love helping squirrels.
I've successfully rehabbed and released two sets, am on the 3rd set which I'm over-wintering and will be releasing the first of March. I live on 5 acres of wooded land surrounded by 60 acres of squirrel haven so I am lucky to be able to release them at my home.
My issue is with a single male squirrel that was born late in the season that I am currently caring for. A facebook friend found him after an apparent fall. He had a bloody nose from the fall but adjusted well to the Fox Valley formula I offered him. I tried him on solid soft food and noticed he struggled eating a shelled pecan and upon further investigation realized he has severe malocclusion of his upper 2 front teeth. BTW, I named the little guy "Willie".
Willie is about 11 weeks old now.
I suspect Willie's mother discarded him from the nest because of his orthodontic issues. His top teeth don't meet his bottom incisors and in fact turn backward and go down his throat. I would have no problem trimming the bottom, however, I did not feel comfortable trimming the upper teeth that follow the roof of his mouth so I took him to a vet (who works on wildlife) twice for trimming, which we were able to do without anesthesia by just wrapping him up, covering his eyes, and my holding him for the procedure. The vet used a drill type device and has trimmed successfully on both occasions. Willie was a trooper but I know the sound of the machine probably stressed him out. The vet deemed willie unreleasable so I have a forever furry friend and want the best for him. There was discussion about the teeth being removed and I think that would be in Willie's best interested. My question is should I only have the affected teeth (the upper two which are deformed and go backwards down his throat) removed and leave the normal bottom teeth and just trim the bottom ones myself once a month (I've watched numerous videos and purchased a special tool to assist), or should I have both the top and bottom surgically removed? I'm thinking just the affected upper teeth should be removed for less trauma but want to get some advice from some of you who may have been through this before.
Will he adjust okay just having only 2 bottom teeth or could he eat better if there were no teeth in the front?
Also, while Willie is under anesthesia, since I have to keep him as a pet, what are thoughts about neutering him also to help with demeanor. Right now he is extremely active and playful and has not exhibited a mean streak, he just likes to be on constant GO. He can't bite so I don't have to worry about that. The wildlife vet did not know if neutering would calm him down or not and told me to search on the internet. I'm not sure how much squirrel experience he has had but he has been very kind to assist me with trimming and is happy to try to help remove teeth and/or neuter. Has anyone had experience with neutering calming a squirrel down? Willie won't be able to self-mutiliate because of the malocclusion but I don't want to put him through any undue pain if it's not a 75% chance it will help his demeanor as he progresses in age. Lastly, if the vet who assists wildlife is not able to help with this and I end up paying for the surgery, can anyone share the cost they were charged by their vet for teeth removal in a squirrel and/or for neutering?

[stepnstone]

I started rehabbing last summer so I'm pretty new at this - need some advice. I just love helping squirrels.
I've successfully rehabbed and released two sets, am on the 3rd set which I'm over-wintering and will be releasing the first of March. I live on 5 acres of wooded land surrounded by 60 acres of squirrel haven so I am lucky to be able to release them at my home.
My issue is with a single male squirrel that was born late in the season that I am currently caring for. A facebook friend found him after an apparent fall. He had a bloody nose from the fall but adjusted well to the Fox Valley formula I offered him. I tried him on solid soft food and noticed he struggled eating a shelled pecan and upon further investigation realized he has severe malocclusion of his upper 2 front teeth. BTW, I named the little guy "Willie".
Willie is about 11 weeks old now.
I suspect Willie's mother discarded him from the nest because of his orthodontic issues. His top teeth don't meet his bottom incisors and in fact turn backward and go down his throat. I would have no problem trimming the bottom, however, I did not feel comfortable trimming the upper teeth that follow the roof of his mouth so I took him to a vet (who works on wildlife) twice for trimming, which we were able to do without anesthesia by just wrapping him up, covering his eyes, and my holding him for the procedure. The vet used a drill type device and has trimmed successfully on both occasions. Willie was a trooper but I know the sound of the machine probably stressed him out. The vet deemed willie unreleasable so I have a forever furry friend and want the best for him. There was discussion about the teeth being removed and I think that would be in Willie's best interested. My question is should I only have the affected teeth (the upper two which are deformed and go backwards down his throat) removed and leave the normal bottom teeth and just trim the bottom ones myself once a month (I've watched numerous videos and purchased a special tool to assist), or should I have both the top and bottom surgically removed? I'm thinking just the affected upper teeth should be removed for less trauma but want to get some advice from some of you who may have been through this before.
Will he adjust okay just having only 2 bottom teeth or could he eat better if there were no teeth in the front?
Also, while Willie is under anesthesia, since I have to keep him as a pet, what are thoughts about neutering him also to help with demeanor. Right now he is extremely active and playful and has not exhibited a mean streak, he just likes to be on constant GO. He can't bite so I don't have to worry about that. The wildlife vet did not know if neutering would calm him down or not and told me to search on the internet. I'm not sure how much squirrel experience he has had but he has been very kind to assist me with trimming and is happy to try to help remove teeth and/or neuter. Has anyone had experience with neutering calming a squirrel down? Willie won't be able to self-mutiliate because of the malocclusion but I don't want to put him through any undue pain if it's not a 75% chance it will help his demeanor as he progresses in age. Lastly, if the vet who assists wildlife is not able to help with this and I end up paying for the surgery, can anyone share the cost they were charged by their vet for teeth removal in a squirrel and/or for neutering?

The most experienced and recommended Veterinarian mentioned on this board when it comes to malocclusion and other serious teeth issues would be Dr. Emerson at Ravenwood Veterinary Clinic in Port Orange, Fla. Many members have traveled across several States to put their babies in her care especially when it comes to surgery. My own Veterinarian in this State is taking instruction from her and learning her surgery procedures in hopes to become as successful, she's just that good.

Unless due to a life threatening issue I do not believe one should neuter a squirrel. I personally find it cruel, unnecessary, and can not be unbiased about it.

Lastly, if the vet who assists wildlife is not able to help with this and I end up paying for the surgery, can anyone share the cost they were charged by their vet for teeth removal in a squirrel and/or for neutering?

Share with who?? Many vets will give some slack with the expense of treating wildlife, depending on procedure some may not even charge except for material. If you are asking if there is some organization that pays/helps with a rehabber's expense there is none that I know of. Otherwise I am unsure what it is your asking and would need you to clarify.

[Rhapsody]

My question is

should I only have the affected teeth (the upper two which are deformed and go backwards down his throat) removed and leave the normal bottom teeth and just trim the bottom ones myself once a month (I've watched numerous videos and purchased a special tool to assist), or should I have both the top and bottom surgically removed? I'm thinking just the affected upper teeth should be removed for less trauma but want to get some advice from some of you who may have been through this before.
Will he adjust okay just having only 2 bottom teeth or could he eat better if there were no teeth in the front?

Also, while Willie is under anesthesia, since I have to keep him as a pet, what are thoughts about neutering him also to help with demeanor. Right now he is extremely active and playful and has not exhibited a mean streak, he just likes to be on constant GO. He can't bite so I don't have to worry about that. The wildlife vet did not know if neutering would calm him down or not and told me to search on the internet. I'm not sure how much squirrel experience he has had but he has been very kind to assist me with trimming and is happy to try to help remove teeth and/or neuter. Has anyone had experience with neutering calming a squirrel down? Willie won't be able to self-mutiliate because of the malocclusion but I don't want to put him through any undue pain if it's not a 75% chance it will help his demeanor as he progresses in age.

My Marvin who is almost 5 years old had both his upper and lower front teeth removed when he was around 8 months due to severe Malocclusion, he was also neutered at the same time and I can say with out a doubt that it did nothing to help his demeanor...... he is still as mean as ever, but at least his biting teeth are gone and I am completely safe from that terror - lol.

As far as eating goes, Marvin can eat just about any thing the other squirrels eat .... I just have to chop the food, plants and nuts up small for him.
Marvin had to drink fluids the first 30 days after surgery. I can give you the recipe if you are interested in it for your squirrel after his surgery.

Let me know if you have any other questions.

btw --I went to Dr. Nick Maldenado in New Port Richey
4041 Little Road, NPR Florida 34655 / 1 - (727) 376-7600


P.S.
Story about My Marvin:
http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/s...ghlight=Marven

[Squirrel Girl 1961]

Thank you both for the response.
What I meant about "share" is can anyone tell me approximately what this surgery usually costs? (Removal of upper teeth)

[Rhapsody]

Thank you both for the response.
What I meant about "share" is can anyone tell me approximately what this surgery usually costs? (Removal of upper teeth)

The cost for Marven's surgery was $1,200 .... that included: surgery, 2 f/u apts, pain meds, antibiotics
he had both upper & lower front teeth removed

[kcassidy]

Hi,

I had one of my releases incisors removed. I did both top and bottom and from what I know of squirrels teeth you have to do all 4 or the ones left in will continue to grow and grow. Since teeth trimming is stressful, if it were me, I'd just do all 4.

Wow I can't believe you all had to pay, I guess FL is so different because you are allowed to keep pets. Here in NY my vet can't and doesn't charge me a dime, so Otter's teeth were removed on her lunch breaks. I didn't have to feed her liquids, because we only pulled the tops first, then the bottoms 2 weeks later.

She is happy as a clam and actually released back outside. Of course she gets fed every day and is usually the first one to the balcony for breakfast, lunch and dinner

Good luck.

[squirrelgirl338]

OMG, I'm so glad I'm back and found this thread!

It sounds like you are going through EXACTLY what we went through with our little Newton last spring. It was almost the exact same situation! If you search "Newton," I'm sure all of his threads will pop up.

Newton actually had his top teeth removed surgically yesterday by our local wildlife vet, in addition to being neutered. I know I'll probably catch some flak for the neutering, and maybe even the tooth removal, but here's how it went down:

We had been trimming the uppers and lowers ourselves for about 7 months-so I know firsthand how hard it is to do those top teeth when they grow like that! I had never even considered tooth removal as a possibility, but during a trip to the vet a few weeks ago for a bald spot (from overgrooming, nothing serious!), she suggested BOTH neutering and top tooth removal. My husband and I went back and forth on both procedures, because we were scared to put him under and put him through anything unnecessarily, but we ultimately decided that removing his top teeth was for the best. I wasn't sold on neutering, but his vet suggested we just get it over with while he was already under.

I was still conflicted yesterday about having done the surgery, until I went to pick him up after I got the call that he was up and resting comfortably. As soon as I arrived, the doctor came into the waiting room to meet me, and showed me Newton's ROOTS that she had pulled out, and said that we probably saved his life yesterday by having the procedure done, as he was VERY uncomfortable, and for sure headed in the direction of an odontoma.

I know surgery isn't an option or even the right answer for everyone, but it was a good solution for Newton, as he hadn't been using his top teeth his whole life (he has a really good system now where he splits his food as best he can with his bottom teeth, and then tosses it back to his molars to chew-it's so cute!), so with you being in a very similar situation, it sounds like it could be a great option! I will say the healing so far has been as rough on me as it is on him-he's been sneezing blood and wheezing since we got home (which our doctor assured me is totally normal). It's very hard to see him in pain, but we've been giving him infant ibuprofen every 4 hours religiously. And I can't speak for another vet, but I was SHOCKED to find out at the counter that the surgery was less than $100!

Please let me know if you have any questions at all-sorry I was so late to the game!

[Squirrel Girl 1961]

OMG, I'm so glad I'm back and found this thread!

It sounds like you are going through EXACTLY what we went through with our little Newton last spring. It was almost the exact same situation! If you search "Newton," I'm sure all of his threads will pop up.

Newton actually had his top teeth removed surgically yesterday by our local wildlife vet, in addition to being neutered. I know I'll probably catch some flak for the neutering, and maybe even the tooth removal, but here's how it went down:

We had been trimming the uppers and lowers ourselves for about 7 months-so I know firsthand how hard it is to do those top teeth when they grow like that! I had never even considered tooth removal as a possibility, but during a trip to the vet a few weeks ago for a bald spot (from overgrooming, nothing serious!), she suggested BOTH neutering and top tooth removal. My husband and I went back and forth on both procedures, because we were scared to put him under and put him through anything unnecessarily, but we ultimately decided that removing his top teeth was for the best. I wasn't sold on neutering, but his vet suggested we just get it over with while he was already under.

I was still conflicted yesterday about having done the surgery, until I went to pick him up after I got the call that he was up and resting comfortably. As soon as I arrived, the doctor came into the waiting room to meet me, and showed me Newton's ROOTS that she had pulled out, and said that we probably saved his life yesterday by having the procedure done, as he was VERY uncomfortable, and for sure headed in the direction of an odontoma.

I know surgery isn't an option or even the right answer for everyone, but it was a good solution for Newton, as he hadn't been using his top teeth his whole life (he has a really good system now where he splits his food as best he can with his bottom teeth, and then tosses it back to his molars to chew-it's so cute!), so with you being in a very similar situation, it sounds like it could be a great option! I will say the healing so far has been as rough on me as it is on him-he's been sneezing blood and wheezing since we got home (which our doctor assured me is totally normal). It's very hard to see him in pain, but we've been giving him infant ibuprofen every 4 hours religiously. And I can't speak for another vet, but I was SHOCKED to find out at the counter that the surgery was less than $100!

Please let me know if you have any questions at all-sorry I was so late to the game!

Thanks for sharing about Newton.
I did end up taking Willie to the Ravenwood Clinic in Port Orange for surgery upon recommendation of a Squirrel Board member (thank you!) and was VERY PLEASED with Dr. Alica Emerson, Willie's vet. We discussed both teeth being removed and neutering but ultimately the vet decided that only removing the uppers at this time would be the best route as he is still a juvenile and his lower jaw bone is only about the size of a toothpick and can easy to break when they are young. She suggested possible future removal of lower incisors along with neutering when he is about 10 months old. (Willie is about 12 weeks old now). Willie had a little sniffling/sneezing going on night of and day after but he was like a new little squirrel day after the surgery. He did not appear to have any pain at all and was acting completely normal and well adjusted. I simply chop up his food in smaller pieces now which is no problem. I will have to trim the bottom teeth once a month or so. On neutering, the vet mentioned that male squirrels can spray so closer to 10 months I'll decide if I want to continue trimming and/or if spraying is a problem and if so, venture on to the 2nd surgery for lower removal and neutering. I traveled a total of 8 hours to and from my home for little Willie's surgery but can't say enough about the valued information I gained from my post surgery consultation with Dr. Emerson. She took a lot of time with me and answered all of my questions. I also had her neuter my guinea pig at the same time. My GP is doing wonderful too! No post-surgery problems at all.
Very happy I did and the surgery done. Cost for was VERY reasonable. Thank you Squirrel Board for being there!

[squirrelgirl338]

Willie had a little sniffling/sneezing going on night of and day after but he was like a new little squirrel day after the surgery. He did not appear to have any pain at all and was acting completely normal and well adjusted. Very happy I did and the surgery done. Cost for was VERY reasonable. Thank you Squirrel Board for being there!

Awesome news for you, Willie, and the GP!

Newton is unfortunately not feeling too well even a few days after surgery, but I can tell that he's doing better each day...so it's good to know Willie made it out okay! And that sounds spot on to me...we estimate Newton was about 6 weeks when we found him on May 5th, so he's probably right around 10 months (maybe 11) right now.

If you'd like, once he's healed, I can let you know if the neuter did anything for us...he was pretty docile to begin with, so the only real issue we have is him loving to stick his little weewee out of the cage and pee on me, my husband, or the wall