I'm new; any help appreciated

[TomahawkFlyers]

Excellent news on the syringe. Is the surrogate nipple necessary? No, but it will help him associate with you as his mom, and it helps to avoid aspiration if he's face down. He is then literally sucking the formula and self-regulating how much he ingests with each swallow. Those nipples have a flange that goes over your syringe. It would be impossible for your little guy to inhale or swallow that. Long story short? I would, but it is not absolutely necessary.

AP presents with constant clicking. It's a tricky thing, and mistaking constant with intermittent can lead to a misdiagnosis. Watch him like a hawk. If the clicking returns, post his weight here at the time he is newly clicking along with the antibiotics you have on hand and an admin will give you the proper dosage.

Your understanding of feeding position is correct. In that position, he is much less likely to aspirate. If he coughs while eating, the formula will go straight out and down to your lap or the floor - not back into his throat or nose for him to inhale and aspirate.

Flyers are nocturnal. They live their lives after dark (as many of us would like to do but can't!) and sleep through the daylight hours. With their eyes, they can see in close to total darkness what we can see on a bright, sunny day. Imagine being in a well-lit room and having a power failure with no emergency lighting. You can't see anything. Now reverse that. A flyer, whose natural up and about time is dark, cannot see much of anything if a room goes from dark to fully lit. They thrive in darkness. As you place something over the tub to achieve that darkness, please remember that fresh air must circulate for him.

The way you are handling him and communicating with him after feeding is perfect. His response tells the story. Before too long, you'll want a bonding pouch for him. Actually, now would be great! Position it over your heart. He rides around with you all day (while asleep, he is still actively growing closer to you,) coming out for feeding, cuddling, communication, and play. Many pouches come in, shall we say, less than manly prints. I'm 6'4", 270 pounds, and sport a ZZTop beard. When called for, I sport a bonding pouch. When someone gives me "the eye," I just look right in their eyes and silently invite them to comment. No takers yet. Seriously, if you are of a mind to be a life-long buddy to your squirrel, the pouch is the second half of the care equation and will help make him as much your buddy as you are his. You will not regret it.

Jamie

P.S. - I just saw your question about rodent blocks and vegetables. At this age, he is getting all the nutrients he needs from the powdered formula for puppies and/or 20/50. I would not consider solids at this point. First Esbilac, then 20/50, and then solid foods.

Thank you for the advice. All nearby pharmacies are closed so I will have to wait until tomorrow before I am able to get a 1 mL syringe unfortunately, but I will get one ASAP.

Fortunately, he hasn't seemed to make those clicking sounds since the single incident that I noticed. Not sure if maybe what I heard was another noise similar or if he may still potentially have aspiration pneumonia. He hasn't shown any other symptoms or signs of being unwell.
and
I've been feeding him with his head level but his body is usually prompt up in my hand. I can alter this and feed him on all fours next time to be safe. If I'm misunderstanding, please correct me.

I can put something thicker on top of his enclosure to block out more light so it's darker for him. This may sound silly, but I worried without enough light, he wouldn't be able to find his water dish, though I assume now it should be OK.

I have been talking gently with him and holding and petting him for long periods after each feeding, and he seems to feel safe and calm when cupped in my hands.

Is a surrogate nipple necessary by the way? He seems to latch fine without one and I worry about him choking if it comes loose. I will be sure to keep you updated. Thank you for taking an interest in his well-being.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Thank you. I can order a no auto shut off heating pad although it wouldn't arrive until September 10th, almost 2 weeks away. I will attempt to find one in a nearby store. I have a friend who will bring me a pill of amoxicillin tonight. I believe she said the dosage was 250 mg but I will double check when I've got it.

If I am able to get the pill, would I start dosing him as soon as the proper dose is determined, or is there still a chance I won't need to use it just yet. It just fills my stomach with a pit worrying that he may be terribly sick.

As for the syringe, I was thinking about taking a spoonful of his feeding and putting it in a sealed plastic bag, then putting that in a bowl of very warm water so I can refill the syringe more quickly after he finishes it. Would this be a viable solution?

Thank you for all the help.

Note that standard Amoxicillin and Amox-Clava is different. Hope your friend has Amox-clav ??? (its prefered for A/P)

==> Just read, its Amox 250mg capsule. Keep it dry and put in safe place.

Sounds like you are leaning toward NOT A/P at this moment. So that would mean holding off on AB, just have pill available.

[Craig]

Note that standard Amoxicillin and Amox-Clava is different. Hope your friend has Amox-clav ??? (its prefered for A/P)

==> Just read, its Amox 250mg capsule. Keep it dry and put in safe place.

Sounds like you are leaning toward NOT A/P at this moment. So that would mean holding off on AB, just have pill available.

I checked the bottle and unfortunately it is Amoxicillin, not Amox-Clava, it was from my friend's family member's unfinished prescription. It is currently sealed in a labeled plastic sandwich bag.

I am relieved to hear that A/P may not be the case. I will keep the antibiotic nearby in case I need it. Would normal amoxicillin still be fine if needed? Also, what signs should I watch out for? And as for administering the medication if he does require it, how would I go about that?

[Craig]

Excellent news on the syringe. Is the surrogate nipple necessary? No, but it will help him associate with you as his mom, and it helps to avoid aspiration if he's face down. He is then literally sucking the formula and self-regulating how much he ingests with each swallow. Those nipples have a flange that goes over your syringe. It would be impossible for your little guy to inhale or swallow that. Long story short? I would, but it is not absolutely necessary.

AP presents with constant clicking. It's a tricky thing, and mistaking constant with intermittent can lead to a misdiagnosis. Watch him like a hawk. If the clicking returns, post his weight here at the time he is newly clicking along with the antibiotics you have on hand and an admin will give you the proper dosage.

Your understanding of feeding position is correct. In that position, he is much less likely to aspirate. If he coughs while eating, the formula will go straight out and down to your lap or the floor - not back into his throat or nose for him to inhale and aspirate.

Flyers are nocturnal. They live their lives after dark (as many of us would like to do but can't!) and sleep through the daylight hours. With their eyes, they can see in close to total darkness what we can see on a bright, sunny day. Imagine being in a well-lit room and having a power failure with no emergency lighting. You can't see anything. Now reverse that. A flyer, whose natural up and about time is dark, cannot see much of anything if a room goes from dark to fully lit. They thrive in darkness. As you place something over the tub to achieve that darkness, please remember that fresh air must circulate for him.

The way you are handling him and communicating with him after feeding is perfect. His response tells the story. Before too long, you'll want a bonding pouch for him. Actually, now would be great! Position it over your heart. He rides around with you all day (while asleep, he is still actively growing closer to you,) coming out for feeding, cuddling, communication, and play. Many pouches come in, shall we say, less than manly prints. I'm 6'4", 270 pounds, and sport a ZZTop beard. When called for, I sport a bonding pouch. When someone gives me "the eye," I just look right in their eyes and silently invite them to comment. No takers yet. Seriously, if you are of a mind to be a life-long buddy to your squirrel, the pouch is the second half of the care equation and will help make him as much your buddy as you are his. You will not regret it.

Jamie

P.S. - I just saw your question about rodent blocks and vegetables. At this age, he is getting all the nutrients he needs from the powdered formula for puppies and/or 20/50. I would not consider solids at this point. First Esbilac, then 20/50, and then solid foods.

Ok thank you, I will watch him closely to check for clicking. I do hope he is fine, as I worry I may not notice clicking if he does end up doing it again. I use a red solo cup to help try to listen for it but it makes it difficult as I can hear the cup adjusting under my grip and brushing against my hair as I do so. I have noticed that in the past, the clicking is accompanied by his mouth moving, which makes me think they could just be sounds he is making with his mouth but again I am unsure. If there are other warning signs to look out for, please let me know and I will stay vigilant.

I will keep those in mind regarding lighting and feeding position. As for a bonding pouch, is there any affordable ones you recommend? I was looking at this one on Amazon but some of the reviews and design choices have made me hesitant to purchase it quite yet. https://a.co/d/5ueUGz3

[supersquirrelgirl]

Amox works but Amox-Clav is better. Maybe as you have time now, keep looking. You can start on Amox and transition to Amox-clav directly.

Signs to watch for: constant clicking during breathing, activity level going down to lethargic, feeding going down to low.

If AB dosing is needed, there are a few of us that can help. You just post the need on the open board, one of us will read and respond accordingly and then send dosing instruction by Private Message (PM). We don't post it on open board.

[TomahawkFlyers]

I saw your question about bonding pouches. You could spend days going over all the options on Etsy. I just looked, and they actually have some with at least neutral prints ...

[Craig]

I saw your question about bonding pouches. You could spend days going over all the options on Etsy. I just looked, and they actually have some with at least neutral prints ...

I've went ahead and ordered a pouch. It should arrive in a couple of days.

I've recorded two more videos of what might be clicking. I'm unsure if the sounds I'm hearing are A/P related or just normal squirrel sounds.

I only notice it after feeding. Also he hasn't shown any other symptoms that I can tell. Other than when I was slow refilling the syringe, he eats until I he's had close to his upper limit if I'm not cutting him off. He also seems to be active and I heard him running around his enclosure about an hour before feeding him. He also climbs on me and doesn't seem lethargic.

https://imgur.com/a/wC8SNQX

That was around an hour ago. As I was writing this, I heard what I believe to be potentially more clubbing. I quickie recorded some. He seems to be making quite a lot of noise now. It is late so I understand if I don't get a reply quickly. It's almost 3 am for me and I may fall asleep soon but I will await a response for a bit.

https://imgur.com/a/8nfy1hQ

He currently weighs 19.37 grams after feeding. The clicking worries me, though I've reread your post and overlooked that you said A/P is constant clicking. it is not constant, but the sounds did carry on for maybe a minute while I wrote those post.

[supersquirrelgirl]

I've went ahead and ordered a pouch. It should arrive in a couple of days.

I've recorded two more videos of what might be clicking. I'm unsure if the sounds I'm hearing are A/P related or just normal squirrel sounds.

I only notice it after feeding. Also he hasn't shown any other symptoms that I can tell. Other than when I was slow refilling the syringe, he eats until I he's had close to his upper limit if I'm not cutting him off. He also seems to be active and I heard him running around his enclosure about an hour before feeding him. He also climbs on me and doesn't seem lethargic.

https://imgur.com/a/wC8SNQX

That was around an hour ago. As I was writing this, I heard what I believe to be potentially more clubbing. I quickie recorded some. He seems to be making quite a lot of noise now. It is late so I understand if I don't get a reply quickly. It's almost 3 am for me and I may fall asleep soon but I will await a response for a bit.

https://imgur.com/a/8nfy1hQ

He currently weighs 19.37 grams after feeding. The clicking worries me, though I've reread your post and overlooked that you said A/P is constant clicking. it is not constant, but the sounds did carry on for maybe a minute while I wrote those post.

Squirrel seems active and eating well so I would not suspect A/P at this time. Sounds like squirrel is active at night in cage. This gives you a good reference to watch for any changes. Nice to see 2g weight gain.

[Craig]

Sounds good! I still have to wait until sometime September 3rd before Fox Valley 20/50 comes in so I've been using the same puppy milk replacement liquid until then. I did freeze some in a silicone container as I read that that may allow it to last longer, though I haven't used it yet as I haven't felt I needed to.

I did notice today however, after his last feeding session and holding, I put him back in his enclosure where he promptly used the bathroom. I did notice it was more of the consistency of diarrhea. I took a picture and wiped it up. Is this a big concern? I can start using the portion of the milk replacement I had frozen a few days ago if it's a result of the liquid having sat in the fridge for too long. I should also mention that I hadn't considered freezing it until it was already 2-3 days open.

He will only eat it for a few more feedings, rest of today and all tomorrow, as well as however long on Tuesday until the replacement arrives. Is this OK?

https://imgur.com/a/Gp3ei65

[supersquirrelgirl]

Sorry, need the pro's to answer these questions. I thought this was mentioned above so reread the thread to see.

[Craig]

Ok thank you, I will check back in every once in a while for a response. Until then, I've thawed out a section which I am warming up and about to feed him now. Wondering if his bowel movements warrant giving him rehydration fluid and how I would go about doing that if necessary. He has a cap full of water in his enclosure as well.

[Craig]

Update: just finished feeding him. He had pooped shortly before or while being fed. It seemed soft and moist but had form and isn't accompanied by a puddle of water. Granted it was on a cloth but there doesn't seem to be a damp spot under it either. I looked up causes for diarrhea and overfeeding was listed as a potential reason. I fed him a little less than 7%, , giving him closer to 6% or around 1.2 mL instead of 1.3 mL. I can continue to limit his intake closer to 5% if it continues and it is necessary to do so. Wanted to detail this update in case it is relevant.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Good news is the little one is eating strong. I'm hoping tonight, the activity is also good running around the cage. This would be another datapoint where its not A/P. Keep up the good work! (really, really glad you changed to 1ml syringe! Just worked a case where 10ml was used and outcome was not good - nothing could be done.)

[Craig]

Good news is the little one is eating strong. I'm hoping tonight, the activity is also good running around the cage. This would be another datapoint where its not A/P. Keep up the good work! (really, really glad you changed to 1ml syringe! Just worked a case where 10ml was used and outcome was not good - nothing could be done.)

Oh I'm terribly sorry to hear that. I will monitor his activity tonight. He just fed recently and all is well. He is eager to eat and must be cut off once he's had enough.

It has come to my attention that I will need to purchase more items for him, such as a cage, proper bedding, a shallow ceramic drinking bowl, a nest cube, some toys etc.

While I was not initially anticipating to spend so much money, I am capable and will pay for what I need for his well-being.

That being said, when might be a good time to transfer him to a proper cage? He is currently in a large plastic storage bin. His water is currently in a well rinsed recycled plastic cap. I've added a small branch for him to climb on and have an old tshirt for bedding and shelter to crawl into. I understand this is not ideal, and it was only the quickest thing I could put together.

I've written down that I will eventually need to purchase a proper cage, a nest cube, Henry's Healthy blocks, potentially another syringe, wooden toys and rope commonly used for parrots, proper bedding and a proper water dish. This list is quite long and probably quite expensive. Which items should I purchase now and which items can wait until he is older? Also is there any recommended sites or stores where I can find the listed supplies at an affordable price? Lastly, is there anything else I should purchase for him, either now or later? Thank you.

[TomahawkFlyers]

Hi Craig,

The liquid puppy formula is not ideal, but if your little guy is having reasonably solid poops, I'd guess he'll be ok until Tuesday. I wouldn't go longer that that. That formula does not have proper flyer nutrition. The reason he is ravenous is that he's not getting what he needs to feed his body's needs. It's kind of like having a family-size bag of Cheetos. You eat a bunch and feel full. A little while later you crave and eat more until you feel full. You might eat the entire bag in a day because though you feel full because of the mass of the Cheetos, your body gets zero nutrition and sends hunger signals over and over again. Then you make yourself sick eating yet more. You want to make sure he is well fed (appropriate and quality, not quantity) now, as his long term health (lifespan up too a decade or more) will be affected one way or another by how he develops now. You will notice a marked uptick in vitality once the 20/50 replaces the liquid puppy formula.

By far, the most expensive one-time item you buy will be his cage. Critter Nation (not the one for ferrets) is the standard. I suggest that you start looking at Craigslist etc. since these cages are often sold there for much less than new and they are often in very good shape. The next most costly item will be the ongoing expense of food. Henry's Blocks are the Gold Standard. If you can bake, Henry's sells vitamins packets and protein packets with which you can bake your own. If you are in an area with a Costco, the nuts for the blocks are ridiculously inexpensive there.

Keep at it Craig - you're doing a great job. The most pressing things now are being vigilant for AP and getting the liquid puppy formula out of his diet.

By the way, on many days I don't get online until late at night. If you are worried about something and you think it is time-sensitive, please do feel free to call me. Our number is in the PM I sent you.

Jamie

[TomahawkFlyers]

Addendum.

Listening to your clip with headphones and the volume turned up, it sounds like baby chirping and not what I have come to recognize as AP. He's talking to you. Another observation. That kid is already bonding with you in a big way. I predict that you will be each other's best friends for a very, very long time. Welcome to the world of flyers. You are in for the time of your life!

Jamie

[Craig]

Ok, I will keep that in mind. The 20/50 should arrive by Tuesday according to Amazon delivery, although it hasn't been labeled with having been shipped yet. However, I dont usually encounter shipping delays.

Just in case though, I would like to be safe. If it does happen to be delayed, do you have any recommendations on anything that might he better to feed him until then? To my knowledge, 20/50 can only be ordered online. If it is crucial, I do not mind having to go out and purchase something better that I can use for a few days if the 20/50 order ends up being delayed.

I will be sure to save your number in case I need a more urgent response, thank you.

[supersquirrelgirl]

See Post # 11 by Spanky above if Fox 20/50 is delayed.

[Craig]

See Post # 11 by Spanky above if Fox 20/50 is delayed.

I reread post #11 and I went ahead and found some esbilac puppy milk replacement powder online in a nearby store that can be delivered tomorrow around noon to 3. I figured I should order it regardless if the 20/50 is delayed as it would probably be best to mix the two as the post suggested. I can also switch to using it by itself until the 20/50 comes in. Thank you for the advice

[Spanky]

I reread post #11 and I went ahead and found some esbilac puppy milk replacement powder online in a nearby store that can be delivered tomorrow around noon to 3. I figured I should order it regardless if the 20/50 is delayed as it would probably be best to mix the two as the post suggested. I can also switch to using it by itself until the 20/50 comes in. Thank you for the advice

Not surprising he is developing diarrhea... I was surprised he did not have it earlier which is why I was very cautious is saying it *may* be okay to continue with that). Switching formulas often can be hard on their little systems and thankfully this baby is older and *hopefully* will have less impact.

Since he is having diarrhea now I would strongly suggest switching to the temporary homemade goat's formula until and unless you get either the FV 20/50 or the Esbilac powder.

Homemade Goat Milk Formula (HGMF):

• 3 tablespoons goat milk
  
• 3 tablespoons plain yogurt
  
• 2 tablespoons heavy cream
  

These should be available at the local grocery store, and if the do not have goat's milk in a carton in the diary section they will have a powdered version on the shelf somewhere. The HGMF is usually tolerated very well, but is only a temporary fix since it lacks all the necessary nutrients (and the Esbilac liquid lacks them as well).