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Thread: Korean Yam ?

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    Default Korean Yam ?

    Can someone please point me to a Calcium Phosphorus Ratio chart or DATA on Korean Yams?
    I had been feeding a lot of them to my squirrels for some years.
    Then I stopped for some reason... possibly due to questioning this ratio.

    Now I am trying to help a squirrel overcoming MBD, gain weight and am searching for this data.
    Not finding clear data on BATATA or Korean Yam.

    I see that IR has said it has a good Ca/PH ratio... but feel I should do my own due diligence on this as potatoes in general don't.

    ANYONE PLEASE?

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    Default Re: Korean Yam ?

    Quote Originally Posted by BigNibbler View Post
    Can someone please point me to a Calcium Phosphorus Ratio chart or DATA on Korean Yams?
    I had been feeding a lot of them to my squirrels for some years.
    Then I stopped for some reason... possibly due to questioning this ratio.

    Now I am trying to help a squirrel overcoming MBD, gain weight and am searching for this data.
    Not finding clear data on BATATA or Korean Yam.

    I see that IR has said it has a good Ca/PH ratio... but feel I should do my own due diligence on this as potatoes in general don't.

    ANYONE PLEASE?
    Hi BN:
    I'm at work so only have a moment. Here is a link to someone's nutritional breakdown of Baked Korean Sweet Potatoes and the Ca:Phos Ratio of about 1:1. IMO, I would not use it! https://www.eatthismuch.com/food/nut...tatoes,934818/

    More to the point however is that newly discovered MBD is at best an urgency and really should be considered an Emergency! I would recommend sticking STRICTLY to Henry's Emergency Treatment protocol for MBD at least until your Squirrel is well into recovery and vary this then, ONLY if you have identified particular needs for the variance; https://henryspets.com/emergency-treatment-for-mbd/

    That being said, once your Squirrel has reached the point which is still considerably "down the road," where he has been given all of the necessary Supplemental Calcium and he is then on an appropriate and complete Maintenance Calcium protocol. Then more variances are quite appropriate as long as your do as you are concerned about now and that is maintain a good Ca:Phos Ratio of IMO at least 1.75:1 and best at 2:1 and you keep giving at least 80% of the diet as Quality Blocks and the rest of the diet from the lower levels of the Healthy Food Pyramid; https://henryspets.com/healthy-diet-for-pet-squirrels/ .

    Please post updates about your Squirrel!

    Regards,
    SamtheSquirrel

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    Default Re: Korean Yam ?

    Thank you Sam for that INFORMATION PACKED minute!

    My squirrel is 9.5 to 10 years old.
    She has always had slight rear leg difficulties since a dog broke them when she was about five months old.
    She would often walk more like like a rabbit. And she was always slightly lighter than well fed squirrels.

    I have had her since January of 2014. She had a tremendous fear of other squirrels, that took her many years to overcome.
    After her finally making friends with a neuro that I rescued... and them being friends for some years, she experienced a tail bite attack from him,
    because as he aged he would compensate for lessening mobility by biting.

    She has had a very full life including a few litters of babies. And gets a lot of sunshine and healthy blocks.

    When she was about 8 years old, I thought she was ten and figured she did not have that much longer.
    I decided that quality of life trumped longevity.
    She and I would go for long walks together ( harnessed ) , and she would want to bury lots of nuts.
    It was her mission to makes sure she invested in her future!

    Of course after working so hard to bury nearly ten nuts - she seemed like she was expecting I could conjure them up as needed.
    Yes she would remember most of them, and when given the chance she would search, check and often find them.
    But she was reluctant to eat them, while we walked. She preferred doing so after fully grooming and being able to sit down - at one of her dining spaces, indoors.

    THAT is when she would look to me for nuts.
    Anyway, as she was getting on in age, I figured she should be able to enjoy her remaining days, and so I would loosen my lock on the nuts I gave her.
    Hazelnuts were her drug of choice last year and while I would clamp down a month here or there, after feelings of overgenerosity, some months she probably consumed 5-8 nuts a day.
    Always along with HHB and high calcium foods.

    There was a period where I noticed the beginning of a slight balance issue, and so cut off all nuts entirely and started saturating her food with Calcium after first forcing a few tums early on.
    But with the warm summer last year and her becoming so well trained in our walks to stay off of private lawns, not climb any trees, and immediate stop when I said "NO!" I would take her out on the house lawn ( always harnessed ),
    where she would not only find her own buried treasures but also those that my wild friends had saved. And THOSE were a LOT! She was happy and seemed healthy being able to run at my maximum speed for three plus blocks at a time.

    Then this past November she got a UTI, and responded well to Baytril. But simultaneously was having serious balance issues, when grooming, eating, sitting up, etc.
    One or the other of her hind legs would often collapse from under her. And soon she was dragging to the point I had to Vaseline the fronts of her legs to prevent fur loss and scabbing.

    There are days now, she seems more perky and high-haunched. I have been experimenting with a variety of delivery methods for calcium citrate which I decided is far more acceptable than carbonate.
    I make a mix of ingredients to provide magnesium and Calcium and she really does love those balls I make. But it is hard to evaluate how much and how widely spread out over the day she eats them.
    Invariably to have any chance of consuming sufficient calcium, runs the risk of having far too much than could be metabolized, or not adversely affect her in other ways.

    She still eats at least two HHB, and lettuce, as well as a lot of Butternut Squash seeds ( have never been able to find the Nutritional Data for those! )
    Daily she has some of the following too: Cooked/Raw Butternut Squash, Kale, Spinach, Honey Crackers, Empire Apple, and often the ubiquitous Harlad Teklad 2018 that she was raised on.

    She has for much of her life, NOT been caged and knows many rooms here. She used to always run up and down the stairs, but stopped doing so in November.
    I built "pee pads" both in her "cave" as well as strategically about. It is humbling to see how hard she works to get to one of those as she - now- on in years is peeing more often.

    I have created ramps for the room she is in, so that she can go from her "cave" to the other side of the room where she loves to look out the window.
    Just as she loves looking about - up and down this and that street, as I carry her nowadays, rather than her balancing skillfully on my shoulder.

    And I have three LED UVB lamps strategically placed to light her, over the gloomy winter. But I am resuming her outdoor walks.
    Sadly, there are days that I don't harness her anymore because we both know that she does not need to be restrained.

    Both personally and as a rehabber, I strongly believe that life's quality far outweighs length. I don't want to force her to live one day more than she enjoys being alive.

    Bottom line is - at her age, are MBD symptoms possible to reverse without taxing her kidneys too far?
    She feels and behaves best when she is 550 to 580 grams. But lately she is around 520, and feels more like a bag of bones.

    THAT is why I am considering Batata. She would eat that, and it could help her gain a bit of weight. I would have to watch that she continues to eat the other stuff.
    BUT I would not want to find out that the Yam actually had sabotaged all our joint efforts.

    One last thing, on days after I am sure that she has consumed a lot of calcium, it certainly seems that she has better muscle tone and walks higher up with more gusto.
    Balance does not seem to improve much even on those days.

    Still, daily I question if I should wake her from her peaceful slumber to get her to eat, not always with success, or just to let her remain as close to a vision of heaven anyone will ever get!

    Anyway... is this the end of the line for her... or could it be a new beginning that both of us would feel happy about. And might any foodstuff be helpful now?

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    Default Re: Korean Yam ?

    For more on, Kidney disease in rodents: https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...ial-treatments

    Key points, Calcium citrate for extending kidney function, and link to 2nd Chance kidney veterinary research long term study in rats to determine what extends their kidney function.

  6. Serious fuzzy thank you's to Diggie's Friend from:

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    Default Re: Korean Yam ?

    Thank you Diggi!
    Included in my Calcium mix I already am using Pine Bark Extract.
    That is the Pycnogenol that you mention.

    How much magnesium citrate to use is still a guess.
    She eats varying amounts of calcium each day.
    I have not been adding Magnesium except as I include almonds in the Ca mix.

    Almonds are controversial I understand but I have found contradicting info, and have a huge amount of empirical experience of old squirrels eating a lot of them for years..
    along with healthy high calcium foods of course.

    Butternut squash too has magnesium. I would love to include elemental magnesium in some form but with so many variables.... and a squirrel who balks if any food varies slightly from her
    expectation....its frustrating.

    IF I am mixing a large batch, what should the ratio of Calcium Citrate to Magnesium citrate be, so that it helps metabolize the calcium, without the downside of being excessive.
    Perhaps I could mix it based on the maximum amount one might eat in a day.


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    Default Re: Korean Yam ?

    Quote Originally Posted by BigNibbler View Post
    Thank you Sam for that INFORMATION PACKED minute!

    My squirrel is 9.5 to 10 years old.
    She has always had slight rear leg difficulties since a dog broke them when she was about five months old.
    She would often walk more like like a rabbit. And she was always slightly lighter than well fed squirrels.

    I have had her since January of 2014. She had a tremendous fear of other squirrels, that took her many years to overcome.
    After her finally making friends with a neuro that I rescued... and them being friends for some years, she experienced a tail bite attack from him,
    because as he aged he would compensate for lessening mobility by biting.

    She has had a very full life including a few litters of babies. And gets a lot of sunshine and healthy blocks.

    When she was about 8 years old, I thought she was ten and figured she did not have that much longer.
    I decided that quality of life trumped longevity.
    She and I would go for long walks together ( harnessed ) , and she would want to bury lots of nuts.
    It was her mission to makes sure she invested in her future!

    Of course after working so hard to bury nearly ten nuts - she seemed like she was expecting I could conjure them up as needed.
    Yes she would remember most of them, and when given the chance she would search, check and often find them.
    But she was reluctant to eat them, while we walked. She preferred doing so after fully grooming and being able to sit down - at one of her dining spaces, indoors.

    THAT is when she would look to me for nuts.
    Anyway, as she was getting on in age, I figured she should be able to enjoy her remaining days, and so I would loosen my lock on the nuts I gave her.
    Hazelnuts were her drug of choice last year and while I would clamp down a month here or there, after feelings of overgenerosity, some months she probably consumed 5-8 nuts a day.
    Always along with HHB and high calcium foods.

    There was a period where I noticed the beginning of a slight balance issue, and so cut off all nuts entirely and started saturating her food with Calcium after first forcing a few tums early on.
    But with the warm summer last year and her becoming so well trained in our walks to stay off of private lawns, not climb any trees, and immediate stop when I said "NO!" I would take her out on the house lawn ( always harnessed ),
    where she would not only find her own buried treasures but also those that my wild friends had saved. And THOSE were a LOT! She was happy and seemed healthy being able to run at my maximum speed for three plus blocks at a time.

    Then this past November she got a UTI, and responded well to Baytril. But simultaneously was having serious balance issues, when grooming, eating, sitting up, etc.
    One or the other of her hind legs would often collapse from under her. And soon she was dragging to the point I had to Vaseline the fronts of her legs to prevent fur loss and scabbing.

    There are days now, she seems more perky and high-haunched. I have been experimenting with a variety of delivery methods for calcium citrate which I decided is far more acceptable than carbonate.
    I make a mix of ingredients to provide magnesium and Calcium and she really does love those balls I make. But it is hard to evaluate how much and how widely spread out over the day she eats them.
    Invariably to have any chance of consuming sufficient calcium, runs the risk of having far too much than could be metabolized, or not adversely affect her in other ways.

    She still eats at least two HHB, and lettuce, as well as a lot of Butternut Squash seeds ( have never been able to find the Nutritional Data for those! )
    Daily she has some of the following too: Cooked/Raw Butternut Squash, Kale, Spinach, Honey Crackers, Empire Apple, and often the ubiquitous Harlad Teklad 2018 that she was raised on.

    She has for much of her life, NOT been caged and knows many rooms here. She used to always run up and down the stairs, but stopped doing so in November.
    I built "pee pads" both in her "cave" as well as strategically about. It is humbling to see how hard she works to get to one of those as she - now- on in years is peeing more often.

    I have created ramps for the room she is in, so that she can go from her "cave" to the other side of the room where she loves to look out the window.
    Just as she loves looking about - up and down this and that street, as I carry her nowadays, rather than her balancing skillfully on my shoulder.

    And I have three LED UVB lamps strategically placed to light her, over the gloomy winter. But I am resuming her outdoor walks.
    Sadly, there are days that I don't harness her anymore because we both know that she does not need to be restrained.

    Both personally and as a rehabber, I strongly believe that life's quality far outweighs length. I don't want to force her to live one day more than she enjoys being alive.

    Bottom line is - at her age, are MBD symptoms possible to reverse without taxing her kidneys too far?
    She feels and behaves best when she is 550 to 580 grams. But lately she is around 520, and feels more like a bag of bones.

    THAT is why I am considering Batata. She would eat that, and it could help her gain a bit of weight. I would have to watch that she continues to eat the other stuff.
    BUT I would not want to find out that the Yam actually had sabotaged all our joint efforts.

    One last thing, on days after I am sure that she has consumed a lot of calcium, it certainly seems that she has better muscle tone and walks higher up with more gusto.
    Balance does not seem to improve much even on those days.

    Still, daily I question if I should wake her from her peaceful slumber to get her to eat, not always with success, or just to let her remain as close to a vision of heaven anyone will ever get!

    Anyway... is this the end of the line for her... or could it be a new beginning that both of us would feel happy about. And might any foodstuff be helpful now?
    Thank you for all you have written! I'll get back with you when I finally return home from work but of course others are already here with you! You sure do love this little Squirrel, BN! I believe you both are so very fortunate to have each other!
    Regards,
    StS

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    Default Re: Korean Yam ?

    Quote Originally Posted by SamtheSquirrel2018 View Post
    Thank you for all you have written! I'll get back with you when I finally return home from work but of course others are already here with you! You sure do love this little Squirrel, BN! I believe you both are so very fortunate to have each other!
    Regards,
    StS

    I hope so Sam. She deserves the best.

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    Default Re: Korean Yam ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Diggie's Friend View Post
    For more on, Kidney disease in rodents: https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...ial-treatments

    Key points, Calcium citrate for extending kidney function, and link to 2nd Chance kidney veterinary research long term study in rats to determine what extends their kidney function.

    Beautiful and very comprehensive references. Thank you.

    Magnesium Citrate has always felt more like Calcium Carbonate - as far as granular rough powder that always seems foreign.
    That is why I have been using natural foods like Almonds.

    Based on your suggestion I ordered the Magnesium Citrate. Many seem to complain across all brands that the powder is granular and unpleasant
    Is there any food liquid that it dissolves in easily ?

    You suggest 1.6 Ca to 1 Mg would be optimal ?



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    Default Re: Korean Yam ?

    Sorry about that; I would see if you can return the Mag citrate.

    See my latest post in Kidney disease thread on, "Magnesium threonate" I put on the other day. _Double Wood_ available on Amazon.com

    Mag threonate is easier on the gut, and well available to the body.

    Most mineral sources aren't soluble in water; one that is, has an off taste. taste bad. Once in the stomach C. citrate and Mag threonate is very absorbable even without food. This is another reason why I prefer C. citrate for MBD treatment, for is is readily available without having to support it with food as C. carbonate.

    You can add the content of 1 capsule of Mag Threonate daily from this source, into a moist food fed daily, or a recipe like the Homemade version of HHB.

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    Default Re: Korean Yam ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Diggie's Friend View Post
    Sorry about that; I would see if you can return the Mag citrate.

    See my latest post in Kidney disease thread on, "Magnesium threonate" I put on the other day. _Double Wood_ available on Amazon.com

    Mag threonate is easier on the gut, and well available to the body.

    Most mineral sources aren't soluble in water; one that is, has an off taste. taste bad. Once in the stomach C. citrate and Mag threonate is very absorbable even without food. This is another reason why I prefer C. citrate for MBD treatment, for is is readily available without having to support it with food as C. carbonate.

    You can add the content of 1 capsule of Mag Threonate daily from this source, into a moist food fed daily, or a recipe like the Homemade version of HHB.


    Diggie, didn't you say that you been using Mag Citrate for years ? Why the sudden change?
    Is this Threonate available as powder, not just capsules ?


    Yes, I had to overcome the "conventional" use of Calcium Carbonate, to switch to Citrate some years ago.

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    Default Re: Korean Yam ?

    Diggie, I see this is a powder only version, but it has zero reviews. ??

    https://www.amazon.com/Methyl-Life-M...zcF9hdGY&psc=1

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    Default Re: Korean Yam ?

    Here's the one; good price point, and the least additives.

    https://www.amazon.com/Magnesium-Thr...s%2C172&sr=8-5

    Magnesium L-threonate, by "Double Wood". Again, split one capsule to add half to each of two meals fed daily.

    This form has as less known, as Mag citrate that has been out for a very long time; it has been found to be more bioavailable.

    Magnesium L-threonate is a form of magnesium that was developed in 2010. It’s highly bioavailable, and some studies suggest this form of magnesium has a higher absorption and retention rate than magnesium chloride, citrate, glycinate, and gluconate.

    This form of magnesium may help reduce neuroinflammation and correct magnesium deficiency, and may have pain-relieving properties.
    It is also an excellent source to use to calm wildlife cared for in captivity. brings up commercial rat diet to the closer (Ca:Mg) ratio than that noted on the diet requirement page, was found to increase calcium bone density in lab rats. Magnesium also inhibits the loss of calcium and so stone formation by moving more calcium instead into the bones, which is explained why in this quote:

    Check out In the Nutrition forum,, "Vital Nutrients: Natural bioidentical forms of vitamins vs. toxic sourced, those included in in commercial rodent block diets. I came across the oroginal article some years ago; which I added my notes to.

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    Default Re: Korean Yam ?

    Diggie, I appreciate all your help.
    and I cancelled the first powder delivery.

    Yes, I Have seen a lot of that research and been trying to find a practical way of balancing the calcium citrate with magnesium.

    I like the Magnesium L-threonate approach.
    HOWEVER, I mix a bunch at a time. I really do not want to deal with capsules.
    Anything in the capsule should be available, without the capsules as powder!


    But domestically, I only see small quantities being sold at high prices.
    WORSE: most of the powders have flavor added.
    I HATE THOSE FLAVORS and my squirrels hate them too I think.

    IF flavors need to be added, probably means the powder sucks!
    Also the powders often claim to be 98% pure. What is with that other two percent. What is that ?!?




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    Default Re: Korean Yam ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Diggie's Friend View Post
    Magnesium L-threonate, by "Double Wood". Again, split one capsule to add half to each of two meals fed daily.
    You are saying that a one pound squirrel gets 50% the does that a 200 pound human should get ?

    that is a whole gram ?

    How much of that Magnesium L-threonate will practically be usable magnesium ?

    You said Ca/Mg should be 1.6:1 right ?


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    Default Re: Korean Yam ?

    Point taken.

    Another source on Amazon in capsule form at a lower price point; offers the same 144 mg. in 3 capsules with 48 mg. elemental magnesium per capsule.

    https://www.amazon.com/2000mg-Magnes...%2C155&sr=8-16

    Other than this, the source you found notes pure Magnesium L-threonate in bulk form with 1/5 Tsp. an odd measurement; perhaps a measuring scoop that comes with it?

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    Default Re: Korean Yam ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Diggie's Friend View Post
    Point taken.

    Another source on Amazon in capsule form at a lower price point; offers the same 144 mg. in 3 capsules with 48 mg. elemental magnesium per capsule.

    https://www.amazon.com/2000mg-Magnes...%2C155&sr=8-16

    Other than this, the source you found notes pure Magnesium L-threonate in bulk form with 1/5 Tsp. an odd measurement; perhaps a measuring scoop that comes with it?
    How much each of Ca Citrate and Magnesium Threonate must she have DAILY by WEIGHT IN MILLIGRAMS?

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    Default Re: Korean Yam ?

    OK. I see 2000 mg of magnesium L-threonate only contains 144 mg of elemental magnesium.

    THATS ONLY 7% !

    Also you can get 1KG of powdered magnesium Threonate for $80 including the $45 DHL from China. Note: You must be a company to order white looking powder from China.

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