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Thread: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

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    Default *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    **Antibiotic dosage needed please **

    Hi everyone. Im UK-based. We need antibiotic dosing advice please for our *wild* grey squirrel friend who lost her tail (we suspect possibly infected, partly necrotic tissue). We befriended her in a local wooded area we commonly walk through and weve been feeding her every day for a year and a half. On Christmas Day, she had her tail bitten off (suspect dog attack, but there are also cats in the area). Initially, there were a few inches of floppy skin and fur hanging off. A few days ago, that fell off or she gnawed it off. What was left was what looked like red raw flesh and bone, sticking out of skin casing (the tail skin/ glove was a bit shorter than the red nub). Since a couple of days ago, the red nub got darker and there is much less swelling/ it has retracted into the skin. We thought scabbing, but now it looks quite dark and Im wondering about necrotic tissue and an infection.
    The skin under the tail and around the injured nub seems pink and she is able to move whats left of her tail well (Ive seen her do the up and down danger signal with it). She moves well (even though more cautious in trees) and is eating well (hazelnuts, avocado, walnuts, etc.) and even asking us for nuts in shell to bury for her stash. She seems herself, behaviour-wise and Ive even seen her chase a squirrel away (she was always dominant in the area). she is more anxious but that's normal I think after an attack.

    Please, could you help us with treating her infected tail? I am very worried about her tail if there is an infection and necrosis. Local rehabber will not take her (have been told point blank that the law does not allow it, given eastern greys are considered an invasive species) and that she wouldnt survive without her tail anyway. Now, I know theyre hugely impaired without a tail. But I have also heard of enough squirrels managing ok without one.
    Vets wont treat unless to pts, Ive been told. I would happily have paid to treat her and get her released again but that's illegal.

    So, after some research I have ordered Baytril 10% (pets). I also have Clavamox/ Amoxiclav but the latter is for humans. Baytril 10% is liquid. I also have pill form Enrofloxacin (5 mg pills for pets). We cant handle her, she wont allow it. Im thinking liquid will be easier to administer on a nut. Is it safe? Ive seen something on a thread about possible neurological damage. But perhaps thats a risk worth taking with her tail. Id be very grateful for your advice regarding dosing and administering of the antibiotic, and any other advice you might have about her tail. Anything topical I can squirt on her tail without pain? We did saline wash once or twice but it freaked her out, so we stopped (more important she gets food, we figured). We love her very much and it looks like were the only chance shes got. Please tell me something can be done to help her. Thanks very much!

    Photo 1: her tail now
    Photo with red arrow: tail nub injury a few days ago for comparison
    Attached Images Attached Images   

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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    Poor baby ☹️
    Squirrels tails will break off when attacked by a predator but yes this does look more like it was bitten off. If it were a cat antibiotics are necessary however this has been a few days now so I'm guessing it wasn't a cat.
    It's hard to say if it's infected looking at the pic.
    Others can chime in👍
    I've had wilds who lost their tails, they do quite well in the wild.
    If antibiotics are necessary looks like you would have no problem giving them to your friend😉 meds added to a little nut butter spread on a half of pecan I bet would be easy to give.
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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    It looks like an old injury. If you dont see any inflammation and redness or oozing from the stump I dont think Id treat. I suppose it wouldnt be harmful to treat but in order for the antibiotic to be effective it should be treated daily for 7-10 days. Clavamox is typically given 2 times a day, Baytril can be given 1 time a day but tastes terrible. I question how well you could conceal its bitter taste well enough to have a wild willingly take it on a nut.

    My advice is to watch and see.

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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    I forgot to ad that if there is any exposed bone it typically dries up and falls off.that could be the dark youre seeing at the injury sight. An infection will be more red, swollen and possibly wet-looking.

    Squirrels can do just fine in the wild without a tail. Im sure it affects their balance and most have more of a tail left than this one, but she seems spunky enough to get past it.

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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    Thanks very much for the reassurance. That's good to know that you guys don't think there's necessarily necrosis.

    I'd still like the Baytril 10% liquid dosage and the Clavamox dosages, if anyone who is knowledgeable on dosing can chime in. Just in case I do need to jump in and treat after all, I'd like to be ready.

    Today I managed to get updated pictures - it looks like there is more red underneath now, and it looks like she has possibly gnawed off some of the very dark crusty scab, revealing darker red tissue underneath. No bleeding, so to me it still looks like scabbing. But i i would be grateful for advice on whether this needs treating orally with antibiotics and whether a local squirt with, say, diluted Iodine Povidone would be beneficial (or a squirt with anything else, like saline wash). Only problem is she's out and about burying nuts, and it's very muddy out there. I don't know whether I should let the tissue dry naturally or attempt to moisturise it when I see her (once a day). I cannot touch it, best i could do is squirt (I'd have to balance this with the fact that it freaks her out, and I would much rather she kept coming to me for good nutrition).

    **I am updating one of the pictures to today's for an updated idea of what her tail is like.**

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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    Here are two updated pictures from today. Looks like a bit more red amongst the dark, if you look really closely. I am guessing she either gnawed off the very dark bits of skin or they fell off, revealing what looks to me a darker red scab underneath. so, there is red there, but dark red. I hope she doesn't keep going with the gnawing and makes it red raw again... It's very cold here now. -2 celsius. Is that good or bad for an injury healing? Thank you so much to everyone replying, we are extremely grateful for the help for our little Buddy.
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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    Thanks very much, Mel! Would the new pictures I added below more indicative of an infection? I took those today, and it looks like it's not so black/quite as dry anymore. Or would you say that looks more like scabbing, with the more reddish bits among the darker ones?


    Quote Originally Posted by Mel1959 View Post
    I forgot to ad that if there is any exposed bone it typically dries up and falls off.that could be the dark youre seeing at the injury sight. An infection will be more red, swollen and possibly wet-looking.

    Squirrels can do just fine in the wild without a tail. Im sure it affects their balance and most have more of a tail left than this one, but she seems spunky enough to get past it.

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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    Thanks very much, Chucky Charles! That's reassuring to hear. Would you happen to know the Baytril 10% dose, in case I do need to treat? I have uploaded some pictures from today, below. There is a bit more red, although scab-looking, I think. Your opinion would be much appreciated.

    Quote Originally Posted by Charley Chuckles View Post
    Poor baby ☹️
    Squirrels tails will break off when attacked by a predator but yes this does look more like it was bitten off. If it were a cat antibiotics are necessary however this has been a few days now so I'm guessing it wasn't a cat.
    It's hard to say if it's infected looking at the pic.
    Others can chime in👍
    I've had wilds who lost their tails, they do quite well in the wild.
    If antibiotics are necessary looks like you would have no problem giving them to your friend😉 meds added to a little nut butter spread on a half of pecan I bet would be easy to give.

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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    In your latest picture it does not look inflamed or angry. I think Id continue to watch it.

    If its decided that medication is needed you will have the best chance of getting her to take your human version of Clavamox. We can break it down and dose it based on her approximate weight and the strength of the medicine. A full picture of her would be needed to approximate her weight.something Im very bad at because our Florida squirrels are quite a bit smaller than other grays.

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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    Yes to a squirt of diluted betadyne - it at least helps keep it clean and kills a boatload of nasties. It also doesn't burn or sting. We usually dilute at 1/4 teaspoon to 1/4 cup water (1.25ml to 60ml water). If you heat the mixture to about body temp (104F, 40C)
    they don't really notice that anything has happened when you dribble it on the bad area.

    If you can give the info on the amoxicillin clavulanate - how big is the pill in milligrams? Your grays are relatively small so I will do a guess on weight. I can dose both for you, but the amoxicillin clavulanate would be by far my choice for this. The Baytril is one of the most vile tasting things on the planet, and it wouldn't be a first choice for a wound like this if it was delicious.

    You will need a 1ml or smaller syringe to dilute and dose this. I will send the info as well as some ideas to make it taste pretty good and then incorporate it into a treat filled goody.

    I won't lie - that is really pulled of short as is there is zero tail left. The center of that wound is HER SPINE. Hopefully the addition of at least the betadyne will help. I don't like that it is red - she is doing that because it itches. It needs to heal ASAP. In captivity you could give Betadyne to help with the itchiness of healing but sleepy squirrels are NOT a good idea in the wild...

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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    Thanks very much, CritterMom. That's worrying... Do you think with so little tail left she has a low chance? Is it mostly the wound you are concerned about? And do you think that the itchiness and redness indicates an infection and I should start antibiotics? I did see her scratching, a few times. And trying to get to her nub with her mouth while on a branch.

    Ok, so weight. I am useless with judging these things, but she's petite, she doesn't look chunky like the other squirrels. In fact, I think she's thinner now, but that may be because she's not yet pregnant (or is, but not showing yet). I am attaching a few photos with my husband's hand for reference.

    On the Clavamox. I have pills that are a mix of Amoxicillin Trihydrate 500m mg + 125 mg of clavulanic acid as potassium clavulanate diluted (both in the same pill). The pills are pretty big, even for me.

    Will be waiting on instructions, I have ordered the Betadyne. Thank you so much!

    Quote Originally Posted by CritterMom View Post
    Yes to a squirt of diluted betadyne - it at least helps keep it clean and kills a boatload of nasties. It also doesn't burn or sting. We usually dilute at 1/4 teaspoon to 1/4 cup water (1.25ml to 60ml water). If you heat the mixture to about body temp (104F, 40C)
    they don't really notice that anything has happened when you dribble it on the bad area.

    If you can give the info on the amoxicillin clavulanate - how big is the pill in milligrams? Your grays are relatively small so I will do a guess on weight. I can dose both for you, but the amoxicillin clavulanate would be by far my choice for this. The Baytril is one of the most vile tasting things on the planet, and it wouldn't be a first choice for a wound like this if it was delicious.

    You will need a 1ml or smaller syringe to dilute and dose this. I will send the info as well as some ideas to make it taste pretty good and then incorporate it into a treat filled goody.

    I won't lie - that is really pulled of short as is there is zero tail left. The center of that wound is HER SPINE. Hopefully the addition of at least the betadyne will help. I don't like that it is red - she is doing that because it itches. It needs to heal ASAP. In captivity you could give Betadyne to help with the itchiness of healing but sleepy squirrels are NOT a good idea in the wild...
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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    Thanks very much with the dosing help, Mel. As I said to CritterMom, the Co-Amoxiclav tablets are 500mg. Amoxicillin plus 125 mg Clavulanic acid. She is small, I think? Attaching pictures.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mel1959 View Post
    In your latest picture it does not look inflamed or angry. I think Id continue to watch it.

    If its decided that medication is needed you will have the best chance of getting her to take your human version of Clavamox. We can break it down and dose it based on her approximate weight and the strength of the medicine. A full picture of her would be needed to approximate her weight.something Im very bad at because our Florida squirrels are quite a bit smaller than other grays.
    Attached Images Attached Images    

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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    Hi CritterMom,

    Just checking because I will most likely be checking these when you are not online (UK time) - is it in my messages I should look out for the dosing advice and how to make it tasty? Many thanks for all your help!

    Quote Originally Posted by CritterMom View Post
    Yes to a squirt of diluted betadyne - it at least helps keep it clean and kills a boatload of nasties. It also doesn't burn or sting. We usually dilute at 1/4 teaspoon to 1/4 cup water (1.25ml to 60ml water). If you heat the mixture to about body temp (104F, 40C)
    they don't really notice that anything has happened when you dribble it on the bad area.

    If you can give the info on the amoxicillin clavulanate - how big is the pill in milligrams? Your grays are relatively small so I will do a guess on weight. I can dose both for you, but the amoxicillin clavulanate would be by far my choice for this. The Baytril is one of the most vile tasting things on the planet, and it wouldn't be a first choice for a wound like this if it was delicious.

    You will need a 1ml or smaller syringe to dilute and dose this. I will send the info as well as some ideas to make it taste pretty good and then incorporate it into a treat filled goody.

    I won't lie - that is really pulled of short as is there is zero tail left. The center of that wound is HER SPINE. Hopefully the addition of at least the betadyne will help. I don't like that it is red - she is doing that because it itches. It needs to heal ASAP. In captivity you could give Betadyne to help with the itchiness of healing but sleepy squirrels are NOT a good idea in the wild...

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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    Quote Originally Posted by AndraP View Post
    Hi CritterMom,

    Just checking because I will most likely be checking these when you are not online (UK time) - is it in my messages I should look out for the dosing advice and how to make it tasty? Many thanks for all your help!
    I am having problems with the private messaging right now - I've tried to send you the dosing several times. As an Admin, I have access to the email address you used to sign up here and have sent the directions there!

    Usually they chew when things start to heal - in one of the worst immune system design bungles, wounds itch when they start to heal, making you want to claw at them and open them to rampant infection and death which all seems to be a really awful idea. It is the reason for E-collars which is very much not an option here.

    It may also hurt. If you could get your hands on some infant ibuprophen you could administer the same way I have suggested for the antibiotic. It won't cause sleepiness and if she can just get it to where skin is growing OVER the open end then it will stop being quite so scary...

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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    Thanks very much, CritterMom! I have replied to the antibiotic dosing email and have sent an email just now asking about the infant Ibuprofen dosing and checking it's the right product we have over here, in terms of concentration. What do you think about her size, is she smallish?



    Quote Originally Posted by CritterMom View Post
    I am having problems with the private messaging right now - I've tried to send you the dosing several times. As an Admin, I have access to the email address you used to sign up here and have sent the directions there!

    Usually they chew when things start to heal - in one of the worst immune system design bungles, wounds itch when they start to heal, making you want to claw at them and open them to rampant infection and death which all seems to be a really awful idea. It is the reason for E-collars which is very much not an option here.

    It may also hurt. If you could get your hands on some infant ibuprophen you could administer the same way I have suggested for the antibiotic. It won't cause sleepiness and if she can just get it to where skin is growing OVER the open end then it will stop being quite so scary...

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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    LOL. Up here in NEW England where I live, all of the *small* animal are twice the size of everyone else's! Size provides an edge in super cold temps. My Maine squirrels could eat a Florida squirrel and it wouldn't even leave a lump! I am terrible at judging but from what I have seen, the grays in the UK are more Florida size.

    I will send you the dosing for the ibuprophen but can you check on something? Here in the US, they market ibuprophen for small children in TWO sizes, both liquid, on "Children" and one "Infant." The "Infant" is twice as strong (it is marked "concentrated") which is very attractive when working with little critters because you can give less. The one you pointed me to is the same as our "Children" strength. See if there is another strength for infants vs. toddlers and let me know what the strength on it is. It would be an easier choice.

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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    LOL! Then I am glad we don't have your squirrels over here, if they could eat our little ones. (kidding, I know they wouldn't).

    Ok, so on the infant Ibuprofen, I can't seem to find another concentration. There is another product for infants, but it's 125 ml of *Paracetamol* per 5 ml. I will keep looking. Is it the case that I'd have to give her a lot of the other one, since it's for children and not infants? Any worry about the little squirrel kidneys, with processing Ibuprofen?

    I have just realised that the Iodine product I ordered is made up of elemental iodine in distilled water (it's a spray for wounds). Any good, or should I look for Iodine Povidone? I think these products are not sold here otc, the only one I can find is a Greek product.

    I saw Buddy today and fed her. It was even difficult to get the red juice (go figure), but that's on the way, for the antibiotics. She ate, and the tail looked the same (if less red). She does seem itchy and jumpy, and I worry about her opening it up. The sooner these products arrive, the better. Thanks again for the advice. I'd be grateful for the Ibuprofen dosage too, if you think the one I found is appropriate.

    Quote Originally Posted by CritterMom View Post
    LOL. Up here in NEW England where I live, all of the *small* animal are twice the size of everyone else's! Size provides an edge in super cold temps. My Maine squirrels could eat a Florida squirrel and it wouldn't even leave a lump! I am terrible at judging but from what I have seen, the grays in the UK are more Florida size.

    I will send you the dosing for the ibuprophen but can you check on something? Here in the US, they market ibuprophen for small children in TWO sizes, both liquid, on "Children" and one "Infant." The "Infant" is twice as strong (it is marked "concentrated") which is very attractive when working with little critters because you can give less. The one you pointed me to is the same as our "Children" strength. See if there is another strength for infants vs. toddlers and let me know what the strength on it is. It would be an easier choice.

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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    Info sent by email.

    Paracetamol is the same as our acetaminophen (Tylenol). Info is all over the place regarding safety for squirrels so we don't recommend it, especially given that the ibuprophen works so well for them.

    If the iodine is for wounds, it sounds like they are basically making the same mixture we mix up. Wow - what a profitable enterprise given how little iodine is needed!

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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    Thank you, CritterMom. Your help is very much appreciated! I really want to get her tail in a better state asap. I'm frustrated by not being able to get this infant formula for Ibuprofen. I will keep looking, but may have to go with the 'child' version. I even had trouble getting Pomegranate juice and ended up getting a 'concentrate'. Should be ok I guess, since I am aiming for syrup. I'll avoid Acetaminophen.

    Quote Originally Posted by CritterMom View Post
    Info sent by email.

    Paracetamol is the same as our acetaminophen (Tylenol). Info is all over the place regarding safety for squirrels so we don't recommend it, especially given that the ibuprophen works so well for them.

    If the iodine is for wounds, it sounds like they are basically making the same mixture we mix up. Wow - what a profitable enterprise given how little iodine is needed!

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    Default Re: *ANTIBIOTIC ADVICE PLEASE TAIL LOST NECROSIS INFECTION*

    Quote Originally Posted by AndraP View Post
    Thank you, CritterMom. Your help is very much appreciated! I really want to get her tail in a better state asap. I'm frustrated by not being able to get this infant formula for Ibuprofen. I will keep looking, but may have to go with the 'child' version. I even had trouble getting Pomegranate juice and ended up getting a 'concentrate'. Should be ok I guess, since I am aiming for syrup. I'll avoid Acetaminophen.
    AMAZON should have infant formula Ibuprofen, probably pomegranate juice as well👍
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