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Thread: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

  1. #1
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    Default Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    First it was an issue with my squirrel destroying his nipples making formula control difficult. From that issue, suspected AP that I used amoxicillin for. Then bad diarrhea due to a batch of formula I unknowingly mixed too concentration when switching to larger batch, (or maybe the amoxicillin too?) Stopped everything and started rehydration fluid for 24 hours. Diarrhea improved and I started adding back some formula in incremental feedings. Between formula and rehydration fluid he was taking 6-7% at his feeding (4) yesterday. Last night he acted normal. This morning he slept in and I woke him up to find him dehydrated feeling, lethargic and quite weak on his feet! I gave him 6 of his 8 ml of formula (he was transitioning 1/2 formula to 1/2 rehydration fluid) but he only took 3ml of the fluid. I tried again in an hour and got 3-5ml more in, then maybe 6 ml and hour later. He seemed a bit steadier after the first feeding but is weak again. I have no experience SQing a squirrel but I think he needs help fast! I have some .9% sodium chloride on hand. BUT PLEASE let me bring this squirrel to someone!! Iím just not experienced enough and I think Iím going to lose him! He can be saved if he can get help soon! I think Nancy in NY is only an hour and a half away from me. Could someone ask her to take him please!

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    Are you mixing his formula with hydration fluid? Or giving them at the same time? If so, stop. Formula is to be mixed with WATER. If giving hydration fluid, you want to give him his formula, wait an hour or two, then give him hydration, then wait again until he gets formula.

    How long have you been giving hydration fluid? It is meant to be used for 24 hours. At that point the salt begins to build up in his system.

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    I have him the homemade rehydration fluid for slightly less than 24 hours, then started back using 1/4 formula and 3/4 fluid, but not mixed together! I didnít want to push the transition and using did the 1/4 for two feeding, the 1/2 this morning. But I didnít wait the hour between. I gave him his formula first and topped off with the hydration which he did not take all of.
    Omígoodness! Re: ďAt that point the salt begins to build up in his system.Ē

    I had been using the homemade stuff until this morning. Then I got out the sodium chloride for SQing (that I have no experience except on my cat) and I USED THAT FOR HYDRATION FLUID THIS MORNING!!! I have the Wild Mammal Baby book and it said it could be used orally.

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    To clarify better, I used his normal formula mixed with water. Fed that, and the fluid separately.

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    OK. First, calm down. He can feel your panic and it isn't helping. Heck, I can feel your panic. Breathe.

    Make a new batch of formula, mixed the way it is intended to be made - one part formula powder and 2 parts water. Stick it in the fridge.

    Give him some plain old water - nothing added. Warm it up just like you would formula. Then let him (and you) chill for an hour.

    Then warm his formula up - maybe a little warmer than you usually do, and give him some of that.

    Then an hour later, some more warm water. Remember, he will be getting water in the formula as well as the plain water you are giving him.

    Over the balance of the day, try to get him back on a regular schedule with his formula, and in between those feedings, offer him some of the warm water

    I am not trying to be snotty when I tell you to calm down. Mammals get the vast majority of their communication from the energy of those around them - not from your words, not from your voice, but from your energy, and if that energy is panicky, they will panic. While you are with him, say all of the calming words you want to convey to him SILENTLY, in your head. They will change your energy to match your thoughts, and that will soothe him. Panic will frighten him and that is not going to make him want to eat and drink.

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    No offense taken Crittermom, I am definitely in a panic and fumbling all over myself. Your directives are settling me down. New formula made, water warming, and me trying to take slow deep breaths. Thank you.

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    I have reread your post a couple times and I think that his weakness and lethargy may be related to hypoglycemia from lack of actual nutrition. It looks like he was only on hydration for a while because of the diarrhea, and then you have been doing the REALLY lean super diluted formula for a bit. Think about how shaky you get when you don't eat for a while. ALSO, formula diluted that way tastes like crap! Take whatever milk you normally drink, dilute it to 25% milk and 75% water and take a swig! Yuck! That will make him not want to eat, too.

    So I am going to modify my directions a little. Give him the water like I said, and then give him one drop of something like honey or pancake syrup. Not a lot, we don't want to get the diarrhea going again, but one drop will start to bring his blood sugar up. Then push his formula feeding up - let him chill with water and the drop of syrup for a half hour, and then offer him the formula. If he shows some enthusiasm, let him have between half and 3/4 as much as he should be getting for his weight, not the entire amount. Continue offering water an hour after that, and at his next regularly scheduled feeding, get a little closer to his normal feeding amount. At the feeding after that one, go ahead and let him have the full 5-7% of formula.

    I am trying to get nourishment into him but not trigger the diarrhea again.

    If he balks at taking plain water, give him the drop of sugar or syrup, wait 10 minutes or so, and go right into his formula feedings.

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    The little squirrel took 3ml of the plain water, then hid his head and refused more. I put him back to bed.

    I’m about 20 minutes away from giving him his formula (due 1:45). I see him out and eating his block which he likes and will eat many of in a day. He is obviously much steadier on his feet and not nearly as weak appearing. Throughout all the issues of the last week I never took away the block because I thought at least he was getting some nutrition. Should I take it away so he’ll take more formula and hydration fluids? And if so when should I give it back?

    I too am feeling much better.

    EDIT: oops after posting this I saw you left another post that I have to review.

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    Nope. Let him have his block. The more blocks he eats, the less formula he is going to want.

    Are they the Henry's blocks? And which formula is he eating?

    Here is a tip: Before you go to bed at night, mix up ALL of the formula you are going to use the next day and stick it in the fridge. When you are feeding him the next day, place the container on the counter and swirl it around a few times (don't shake it), take out only as much of the mixed up formula as you are going to feed him at that feeding, and warm only that up and leave the rest in the fridge. Discard any uneaten formula from the amount you took after you feed him. That night, throw out any formula you have leftover, and do it all again.

    Here is why: When you initially mix the powder and water together, it only STARTS to dissolve. It takes a while for the powder to completely absorb the water. It LOOKS mixed up, but actually, the powder is in "suspension" - the powder is floating in the water and coloring it white but it hasn't actually absorbed all of the water and thoroughly dissolved. It is MUCH harder for the animal to digest that way and can actually be the reason behind diarrhea. I always use VERY hot water to mix formula and that helps some but nothing helps as much as just letting it sit in the fridge for hours. Swirling it before you "decant" what you will use at that feeding will mix up any sludge that has collected on the bottom of the container without adding air bubbles to everything.

    Floating your little single serving container in a larger cup or something of hot water to heat it is a good idea - you can leave it there to float and it will stay warm through the feeding.

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    2:45- He took 10.5 ml of water, seemed quite perked up, sat on his haunches well and ate THREE zupreem blocks one right after the other! 3:00-4:00 He refused the water and only took only a couple sips. He seemed tired halter 3 blocks) so I let him sleep but in actually he was going downhill again. I tried giving water again and only got 2.5 ml into him. After feeling plump after the first two feedings heís feeling Ďgauntí again and looking weak.

    PS. He is on FV 20/50 and eats Zupreem monkey chow. He had also been nibbling on some vegetables but I took them away for the last two days. Thanks for the Tip on making the formula the night before. I had only allowed about 4 hours. BTW, this little squirrel is the nipple eating monster from an earlier post this week ďAspiration pneumonia suspected. What antibiotic should I use?l and I am on my third original miracle nipple of the DAY!

    Tried again before sending this and got another 4.5 ml in. He seems slightly better but not as well as he was earlier.
    I just noticed the time and it would have been time for his formula. Should I wait and whole hour from now or offer in a half hour?

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    Quote Originally Posted by EarlsMom View Post
    2:45- He took 10.5 ml of water, seemed quite perked up, sat on his haunches well and ate THREE zupreem blocks one right after the other! 3:00-4:00 He refused the water and only took only a couple sips. He seemed tired halter 3 blocks) so I let him sleep but in actually he was going downhill again. I tried giving water again and only got 2.5 ml into him. After feeling plump after the first two feedings heís feeling Ďgauntí again and looking weak.

    PS. He is on FV 20/50 and eats Zupreem monkey chow. He had also been nibbling on some vegetables but I took them away for the last two days. Thanks for the Tip on making the formula the night before. I had only allowed about 4 hours. BTW, this little squirrel is the nipple eating monster from an earlier post this week ďAspiration pneumonia suspected. What antibiotic should I use?l and I am on my third original miracle nipple of the DAY!

    Tried again before sending this and got another 4.5 ml in. He seems slightly better but not as well as he was earlier.
    I just noticed the time and it would have been time for his formula. Should I wait and whole hour from now or offer in a half hour?
    No, he can eat ANY time after having water - he may just not want as much.

    Best antibiotic for A/P is cipro. You would only need one pill. Can you ask around - women in particular as it is sometimes given for UTIs. Animal version of cipri is Baytril.

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    I think heís passing away. He is now on his side and breathing strangely. Not clicking or gasping.

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    Quote Originally Posted by EarlsMom View Post
    I think heís passing away. He is now on his side and breathing strangely. Not clicking or gasping.
    I am so sorry. I really am at a loss here. If he will let you hold him, put him on your chest and let him know how you love him.

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    WTH! He popped up and ran down and grabbed a block! Five minutes ago he was a limp noodle, laying on his side, with staring glazed eyes!!

    Heís on his second block as I write this! He ate three in a row at 3:00 About to see if heíll take formula!
    Attached Images Attached Images  

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    Well he is going to give ME a heart attack.

    This is starting to sound like seizure activity. The shakiness, lying in one place, "staring with glazed eyes" all sound "seizure-ish to me.

    Squirrels with A/P don't "chow down" on blocks or anything else. Squirrels with some sort of illness don't either. When he went down so fast I started questioning a heart issue but again, the enthusiastic eating doesn't square with that at all.

    Do you have any almonds? Or, do you have any Rolaids? Not Tums, Rolaids. Both of these things have magnesium in them.

    It seems that SOME (not all) humans that suffer from idiopathic (nobody knows why it happens) seizures need additional magnesium. It is NOT that they have a deficient diet, it is that for some reason they do not metabolize magnesium as effectively as everyone else. Many of these people take Rolaids and control seizures they have had for a lifetime and been on all manner of medication for. It also seems that it happens with squirrels, too. Island Rehabber had a seizure squirrel that enjoyed a much improved quality of life with additional almonds! We have members in Costa Rica that have been treating a seizure squirrel with additional magnesium as well.

    Neither Rolaids nor some almonds are going to hurt him (and I can guarantee that he will prefer the almonds) and it sure would be interesting to see if something changes when they are added.

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    A couple things:
    He took 5 ml of formula before he gave me his bad boy ears and muttered some nasty things about my mom. Then he promptly ran and got another block. Interestingly (and a bit worrisome), he seems quite wobbly for the amount of improvement Iím seeing. I think he should be better on his feet.

    He just discovered the water bottle and drank and drank from it! Now Iím thinking of putting his formula in one at feeding time. Iím serious, considering his mounting miracle nipple bill.

    AndÖhe eating A LOT of block, like 5-7 a day, 6 since 3 pm.He leaves a few crumbles but heís eating most of it! Considering whatís going on, do I still try to get 5-7% formula in him per feeding? If he refuses is that okay and I just keep pushing the fluids? Show him the water bottle? He drank for 5 full minutes!

    He produced a normal looking poo for which Iím very grateful for.

    CritterMom I canít thank you enough! Im off to the grocery store.

    Oh, what do I do overnight? Should I getup and hydrate him?

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    Quote Originally Posted by EarlsMom View Post
    A couple things:
    He took 5 ml of formula before he gave me his bad boy ears and muttered some nasty things about my mom. Then he promptly ran and got another block. Interestingly (and a bit worrisome), he seems quite wobbly for the amount of improvement Iím seeing. I think he should be better on his feet.

    He just discovered the water bottle and drank and drank from it! Now Iím thinking of putting his formula in one at feeding time. Iím serious, considering his mounting miracle nipple bill.

    AndÖhe eating A LOT of block, like 5-7 a day, 6 since 3 pm.He leaves a few crumbles but heís eating most of it! Considering whatís going on, do I still try to get 5-7% formula in him per feeding? If he refuses is that okay and I just keep pushing the fluids? Show him the water bottle? He drank for 5 full minutes!

    He produced a normal looking poo for which Iím very grateful for.

    CritterMom I canít thank you enough! Im off to the grocery store.

    Oh, what do I do overnight? Should I getup and hydrate him?
    It sounds like he is pretty hydrated, and now that he has found the water bottle he will probably return to it. I think they enjoy drinking from them - they make a cool noise. Don't put formula in it. I am concerned that he will get over-enthusiastic about the formula and aspirate.

    Considering how much block he is eating I would be surprised if he eats much formula. Go ahead and offer but don't worry too much if he doesn't want to eat a full amount.

    I am sure he will enjoy his almonds! Give him a couple before bed.

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    Crittermom after pulling the squirrel back from dehydration, I kept seeing a worrisome weakness in him that wasnít keeping pace with the recovery. In fact it got worse as evening progressed. Something wasnít making sense, he was eating, taking fluids, and should have been perked up. Here are some things that I began to noticed over the day. He seemed to squeak in pain when I held him (I used fleeces so my hands werenít hurting him), he stopped sitting upright and was hunched and resting on curled under front feet, his nose was down resting on the ground often. He wobbled walking, was weak, and had a weird gait. Then just before he crawled into bed his hind quarters gave out and start dragging! Earlier I noticed a bit of jerking or twitching. And thenÖwhen he looked at deathís door all glazed eyed and staring, lying on his side. AndÖreally the block eating yesterday was a bit bizarre. He chowed three blocks one after another, two separate times. Almost as if he was frantic!

    Anyways..as far fetched as it may seemÖI think heís metabolic. When I started thinking how that could be being formula fed, I saw lots of opportunity over the last two weeks for that to creep in with all the unrelated issues that were going on at the same time. With the nipple issue and aspiration he was inconsistent with his formula intake. His bed he spent all day in was on the bottom of the Critter Nation cage (because I could put a heating pad under that shelf and he couldnít get to the cord), he got NO Vit D, only in the late evening did he come out to play, or exercise, groom my hands etc.,
    Because of the feeding inconsistency and potential for dehydration I would offer a grape a couple times a day (smh). I also got orange for him because it was better C:P ratio. I had a few other veggies he tried (spinach, snap peas, acorn sq) He got the hang of actually eating the block as opposed to shredding it and would eat several over the course of a day. When he got the diarrhea I think that escalated the calcium deficiency. He got no formula but upped his intake of the mostly CORN Zupreem block!! Then the frantic eating of three at a time twice over yestterday says to me he was instinctively looking for something to fix him! When I saw Iím getting weaker even though he was hydrated it didnít make sense until I saw him drag his legs as he went to bed! Then it hit me!!! While I have no experience with it, Iíve read enough posts over the years to know what it is and signs of it. He wouldnít eat the Roland or a calcium pill of mine, so I made a slurry of a powdered calcium pill and 3 ml of formula and force fed him that with a prayer. This morning he was better, walking stronger,
    Unfortunately, today he is absolutely refusing everything!!! I managed to get 3 ml of formula in him but it took 1 1/2 hours. Seeing him going down hill again I made a thin slurry with water and more calcium and gave him like maybe .4 ml. When he roused slightly an hour later I gave him a ml of water. I donít know what else to do. Anything I do is exhausting and agitating to him. Iím now at a loss to how much intervention do I tax him to. Could I give him some Tylenol for comfort and if so how much.

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    I suppose it is possible, and actually treating him for it won't hurt him.

    The Zupreem is made of corn like so many animal foods are, but it is also supplemented with calcium to bring the calcium to phosphorus level to where it should be. That said, I sure would rather see him eating the Henry's blocks. They are pricey but at 2 to 3 per day it isn't too bad. They also taste good, and are actually both a vitamin supplement and a food. Do order some. https://henryspets.com/diets/ I strongly recommend the hazelnut flavor, with the picky blocks coming in 2nd. Henry's ships really fast.

    You need to use caution with your calcium pills. Calcium supplements for humans are heavily supplemented with Vitamin D usually. Squirrels need D but not in the quantities human supplements have, and high levels of vitamin D are actually used as a rodenticide - to KILL them, so you can see why too much is bad. This is why we recommend using the Tums (not rolaids this time). Tums have only calcium carbonate in them - no D. Also, while at the Henry's site, if you go to the supplements section, they sell little bags of straight calcium carbonate powder.

    Yes, he can have INFANT IBUPROPHEN. It is a liquid - make sure you get the infant, not childrens strength. We need his weight to really correctly dose him with it. While there, pick up a bottle of Tums - get the regular chewable tablets, not the new gummy chews or anything like that. Go for fruit flavor. Turn the bottle around and look at the black box info on the back. You want the highest amount of ELEMENTAL CALCIUM per tablet (check the number of tablets they are calling a serving). The amount of calcium shown on the front label means very little - check the back.

    Is he still willing to eat his Zupreem blocks? You can use those to get the calcium into him. Grind up a couple of the blocks and mix with enough peanut butter or almond butter or even Nutella so you have something the texture of stiff cookie dough. You can then grind up the Tums and add to the dough, then roll it into little balls for him to eat.

    So your next shopping list is infant ibuprophen (generic is fine), Tums tablets (generic is fine) and "glue" for the calcium balls - peanut or almond butter or nutella. And remember we need his weight. And place an order from Henrys for both the blocks and some calcium powder. Don't buy the MBD kit if you see it - it has stuff you don't need and your money is better spent on just the blocks and powdered calcium.

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    Default Re: Please My Squirrel Needs somebody experienced fast!

    Would plain calcium citrate work? I have that on hand to dust some veggies with? I have infant Tylenol, any chance that could work?

    Ugh, heís not even taking fluids at all.

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