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Thread: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

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    Default Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    Hi, really new to this and I’ve seen that the recommendation of preparing the formula for the milk with the esbilac and part of heavy whipping cream. Also read that it would support the vitamin D required to absorb the calcium but the issue is that every heavy whipping cream is 0% in calcium and vitamin D. Can you clarify this and also if possible provide brands recommendations. Thank you

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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    Hi! I'm confused. You mean the nutritional analysis specifically states that there is 0% calcium, or it just isn't listed? Because it does have calcium. But the reason it is added to formula is to boost the fat content because squirrel milk has very high fat content.

    Are you using Esbilac? There were problems with it last year and it's not recommended anymore. Check the banner at the top of the page. I think it will direct you to safer alternatives.

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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    Quote Originally Posted by Chirps View Post
    Hi! I'm confused. You mean the nutritional analysis specifically states that there is 0% calcium, or it just isn't listed? Because it does have calcium. But the reason it is added to formula is to boost the fat content because squirrel milk has very high fat content.

    Are you using Esbilac? There were problems with it last year and it's not recommended anymore. Check the banner at the top of the page. I think it will direct you to safer alternatives.


    Thank you for the reply, i was thinking on moving my baby to fox valley formula however he is currently on esbilac based on the breeder. How would i transition to fox valley. Also i was reference to this publication at another page. Again im totally new on this my first new baby is arriving tomorrow.

    https://www.squirrelsandmore.com/pag...-2019-concerns

    Again thank you for your response

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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    IMHO you should get the fox valley now and skip the Esbilac due to nutritional problems.

    Your getting your first baby tomorrow?

    How old is it? How much does it weigh?

    What diet is it on now?

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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    Quote Originally Posted by RockyPops View Post
    IMHO you should get the fox valley now and skip the Esbilac due to nutritional problems.

    Your getting your first baby tomorrow?

    How old is it? How much does it weigh?

    What diet is it on now?
    He is 6 weeks and he is on esbilac i would say, im excited to receive him. Also wanted to be prepared

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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    Quote Originally Posted by insupitilla View Post
    Thank you for the reply, i was thinking on moving my baby to fox valley formula however he is currently on esbilac based on the breeder. How would i transition to fox valley. Also i was reference to this publication at another page. Again im totally new on this my first new baby is arriving tomorrow.

    https://www.squirrelsandmore.com/pag...-2019-concerns

    Again thank you for your response
    Hi insupitilla,
    Welcome to TheSquirrelBoard

    Let me just say that most on this board categorically reject the statement issued by Chris Clark at Chris’s Squirrels and More regarding the Esbilac disaster. Most, including myself were very angry about the statement. Basically what she was saying was that the rehabbers were at fault for the problem. Somehow they forgot how to mix formula after using it successfully for years. Seriously, that is nonsense. They were not newbie rehabbers. They were very experienced rehabbers. The product was clearly defective so her defending the product is frankly, indefensible. PetAg has supposedly corrected the problems. I don’t know if that’s true and I don’t care if it’s true because I will never use it or recommend it. There is still defective product on the shelves because they didn’t recall it. I have personally helped 2 people this week with babies that were not growing on Esbilac. With the first group the poster couldn’t understand why they were so small. She had them 2 weeks and they had not gained a single gram. That is a problem. When she switched formula, they immediately started gaining. The second poster has a singleton on Esbilac for 3 weeks, the baby is now 5-6 weeks old and weighs 52g. The FoxValley 20:50 will arrive today and I hope she can save the baby but the photos show a small, frail malnourished baby.

    I’m sorry but I am very opinionated on this subject. I saw the X-rays of the broken bones and the frail babies. Please don’t take a chance that you will get a can of ‘good’ Esbilac. They will never convince me that they are anything other than a irresponsible, cheap company that cares more about their profits than the lives of animals.

    How old is your baby? Order FoxValley 20:50.
    I see you are in FL. Publix has heavy whipping cream. All cream has calcium. It might not be on the label but it has calcium. All dairy products have calcium. Make sure you don’t get some weird, non-dairy product.

    Last year was a nightmare and we continue to see the fallout from the defective product. I’m going to get a link for you of the baby that we HOPE we can save. When you read it, you will understand.
    https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...MBD-question!-!

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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    One thing you said just caught my eye. You said breeder. Is this a flyer or a grey squirrel? As far as I know, only flyers come from breeders.

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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    Also, you are looking for the cream IN A CARTON - it will be in the refrigerator case with the half and half. It is what is used to make whipped cream from scratch, not a pre-made whipped topping. You can't shoot a mouthful of this from a can when nobody is looking, in other words! It may be called "heavy cream" or "heavy whipping cream." If you have a choice, buy the one that has the highest milkfat.

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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    Quote Originally Posted by HRT4SQRLS View Post
    Hi insupitilla,
    Welcome to TheSquirrelBoard

    Let me just say that most on this board categorically reject the statement issued by Chris Clark at Chris’s Squirrels and More regarding the Esbilac disaster. Most, including myself were very angry about the statement. Basically what she was saying was that the rehabbers were at fault for the problem. Somehow they forgot how to mix formula after using it successfully for years. Seriously, that is nonsense. They were not newbie rehabbers. They were very experienced rehabbers. The product was clearly defective so her defending the product is frankly, indefensible. PetAg has supposedly corrected the problems. I don’t know if that’s true and I don’t care if it’s true because I will never use it or recommend it. There is still defective product on the shelves because they didn’t recall it. I have personally helped 2 people this week with babies that were not growing on Esbilac. With the first group the poster couldn’t understand why they were so small. She had them 2 weeks and they had not gained a single gram. That is a problem. When she switched formula, they immediately started gaining. The second poster has a singleton on Esbilac for 3 weeks, the baby is now 5-6 weeks old and weighs 52g. The FoxValley 20:50 will arrive today and I hope she can save the baby but the photos show a small, frail malnourished baby.

    I’m sorry but I am very opinionated on this subject. I saw the X-rays of the broken bones and the frail babies. Please don’t take a chance that you will get a can of ‘good’ Esbilac. They will never convince me that they are anything other than a irresponsible, cheap company that cares more about their profits than the lives of animals.

    How old is your baby? Order FoxValley 20:50.
    I see you are in FL. Publix has heavy whipping cream. All cream has calcium. It might not be on the label but it has calcium. All dairy products have calcium. Make sure you don’t get some weird, non-dairy product.

    Last year was a nightmare and we continue to see the fallout from the defective product. I’m going to get a link for you of the baby that we HOPE we can save. When you read it, you will understand.
    https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...MBD-question!-!

    Thanks a lot for the hones and quick reply, the bad thing is that i only have esbilac for tomorrow when he arrives and i ordered the fox valley but it arrives on Saturday, also im unsure how to safety transition from one to the other one. Please advice. Thank you ☺️

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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    Quote Originally Posted by insupitilla View Post
    Thanks a lot for the hones and quick reply, the bad thing is that i only have esbilac for tomorrow when he arrives and i ordered the fox valley but it arrives on Saturday, also im unsure how to safety transition from one to the other one. Please advice. Thank you ☺️

    I’m sure he is already on the Esbilac so go ahead and use it until you receive the Fox Valley. I hope you ordered the Fox Valley 20:50.

    When it arrives mix a batch of both formulas. THEN, you will transition by incrementally reducing the Esbilac.

    75% Esbilac..... with 25% Fox Valley ( 2 feedings )
    50% Esbilac..... with 50% Fox Valley ( 2 feedings )
    25% Esbilac..... with 75% Fox Valley ( 2 feedings )
    100% Fox Valley

    When the baby arrives, can you post a pic so we can assess the condition? I hope to see a fat, healthy baby but if not I would transition faster. Is this a flyer or grey?

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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    Quote Originally Posted by HRT4SQRLS View Post
    I’m sure he is already on the Esbilac so go ahead and use it until you receive the Fox Valley. I hope you ordered the Fox Valley 20:50.

    When it arrives mix a batch of both formulas. THEN, you will transition by incrementally reducing the Esbilac.

    75% Esbilac..... with 25% Fox Valley ( 2 feedings )
    50% Esbilac..... with 50% Fox Valley ( 2 feedings )
    25% Esbilac..... with 75% Fox Valley ( 2 feedings )
    100% Fox Valley

    When the baby arrives, can you post a pic so we can assess the condition? I hope to see a fat, healthy baby but if not I would transition faster. Is this a flyer or grey?

    It’s a flyer and I think he is healthy 😊 should i use 20:50 or 32:40 since he is 6 weeks?
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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    20/50.

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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    Awww.... a flyer.

    When you said breeder, my mind went straight to flyer. It’s illegal to breed grey squirrels as far as I know.

    Actually, for a flyer you can use either FoxValley. The FoxValley 32:40 is the preferred formula for flyers because it has more protein and flyers need more protein. There was a hysteria years ago because the FV 32:40 was causing ‘cement gut’ in babies and not being digested. Through all of this, my boys never had a problem with it. I have 2 flyers. One of my boys will be 10 in September. The other is 7. They will take either one.
    Some adult flyers will still take formula and if your guy is one that will, it’s good to continue it even as an adult.

    He looks perfectly healthy but because of inconsistency with PetAg products I wouldn’t leave him on it.

    Edit.. I saw C M post. Either is fine but to err on the side of caution the 20:50 will work.

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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    Discovering that you were referring to a flyer, that changes things a bit. The heavy cream added to the FV will be fine while he is still a baby but I definitely would not give heavy cream fortified formula to an adult. They mature faster than grey squirrels and would be considered independent at 8 weeks if I remember correctly. Let me check that. One of my flyers is rollie pollie obese. Obese isn’t healthy for flyers either. After a few weeks I would drop the cream.

    Edit... it is 84 days that they are capable of living independently. That is 12 weeks.

    Here is a presentation by one of our members that you might find helpful. Anne is a flyer expert.

    https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4f...m9LVTd6QQ/view

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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    Thank you for the response, I cancelled the fv 32:40 that i ordered but was to late lol and ordered the 20:50 instead still arrive the same day through. I will send more pictures when the little boy arrives

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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    I have a question i just realized that everything i read is using powder esbilac but i have liquid one !!!! And no even the ingredients are the same im so confused right now, im going tomorrow to the store to get the powder one but would only be for few days because i will be transitioning to fv. I shouldn’t be using the liquid one right. I just wanted to prepared from today for it to mix and be ready for him tomorrow.

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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    Received the little baby today the hand feeding process was horrendous he got milk all over and under his mouth i had to dampened him and I felt super bad

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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    Besides i got a boy that is 5 weeks so how much milk should i give him any advice?

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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    Quote Originally Posted by insupitilla View Post
    Besides i got a boy that is 5 weeks so how much milk should i give him any advice?

    By "milk" you mean the Fox Valley formula?

    The absolute best way to feed baby squirrels (flyers or greys) is by weight. They will get 5% - 7% of their body weight per feeding... so a 50gram flyer would get 2.5ml - 3.5ml. I will include a cheat sheet.

    For a flyer, I would recommend using only a 1ml syringe and nothing larger. The danger is aspiration of the formula: they inhale it into their lungs, often with formula coming out of their noses. The fluid in their lungs can result in Aspiration Pneumonia (AP) which is the #1 killer of baby squirrels in human care. Sooo.. best to have proper antibiotics on hand just in case.. cipro (or baytril) or Augmentin (or clavamox).

    PS Please don't buy any more babies from breeders.



    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Default Re: Which one is the right heavy whipping cream

    Omg thank you so much for the tips and im really concern that today the hand feeding process may have not been proper. What signs would i have to look in case I suspect aspiration may had happened. Please help I don’t want nothing to happen to him.


    Quote Originally Posted by Spanky View Post

    By "milk" you mean the Fox Valley formula?

    The absolute best way to feed baby squirrels (flyers or greys) is by weight. They will get 5% - 7% of their body weight per feeding... so a 50gram flyer would get 2.5ml - 3.5ml. I will include a cheat sheet.

    For a flyer, I would recommend using only a 1ml syringe and nothing larger. The danger is aspiration of the formula: they inhale it into their lungs, often with formula coming out of their noses. The fluid in their lungs can result in Aspiration Pneumonia (AP) which is the #1 killer of baby squirrels in human care. Sooo.. best to have proper antibiotics on hand just in case.. cipro (or baytril) or Augmentin (or clavamox).

    PS Please don't buy any more babies from breeders.




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