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Thread: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

  1. #41
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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    Quote Originally Posted by Chirps View Post
    I am sure you are right. They probably found a cheaper (and inferior) foreign source for the calcium. I wonder how it changed their profit margin, at the expense of all the dedicated rehabbers and suffering babies.
    It is painful to contemplate. You'd think they would have tested it out first. QC is alarmingly lacking. And really, calcium carbonate is so inexpensive, it boggles the mind how they came to that fateful (and fatal) decision.

  2. #42
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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    My three squirrels are doing much better. The older two were going downhill fast. Very lethargic and they had become aggressive towards me. I have had them and cared for them well before they opened their eyes so the aggressive behavior was concerning. They were not passing BMs much at all. I was concerned enough yesterday afternoon that I did the crushed tums treatment for MBD. That seemed to boost them a bit, even right away.

    The younger one was also exhibiting the same symptoms but was more lethargic and also weak. Would not lay straight when I was feeding her but cocking her head sideways. Also seemed to be in pain when I pottied her.

    24 hrs on temporary goat milk formula and they are much more energetic and passing BMs. Iím really shocked and saddened that PetAg would make such changes and not let the rehabbing community know ahead of time. What devastating effects could be avoided and could have been avoided by a simple warning on their part. Yes we used their product off label but they are aware of that and should have care/concern for the animals whose lives are affected by the change.

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  4. #43
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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    Iím glad to hear they are better. MBD is a painful condition so that would explain the aggression. After a day or two babies arenít usually aggressive. Once they get over the initial fear and loss they usually respond well to the human that supplies the food. Aggression isnít typical.

    I think supplementing with a little calcium is a good idea. You can add a little to the formula. Donít overdo it though. I think you will see them start responding even more when you get them on Fox Valley 20:50.

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  6. #44
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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    Thx! The Fox Valley should arrive tomorrow. I am so thankful for this board. So helpful to squirrels and their caretakers!

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  8. #45
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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    I’m a bit distressed. The younger of my three squirrels has developed a limp front right limb/paw. Nothing notable happened that I’m aware of. She was pretty lethargic and not having BMs until I recognized (thx to the banner on the front page) that there was an issue with the Esbilac. So we stopped the Esbilac earlier this week, did the homemade goat milk formula, and I tried to get some emergency Tums water into them... but then at the first feeding this morning I noticed her paw was just hanging. She wasn’t using it to hold onto the syringe... then after the feeding when I set her down she would not bear weight on it. It does look a bit swollen and slightly pink. What could have happened? Is this from MBD? Will her paw heal? I’ll post a pic next.

    FWIW — the Fox Valley arrived mid morning. She has now had two feedings with that. She is eating and urinating fine. She is passing BMs now but not as much as I think there should be.

  9. #46
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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    Since she was on the bad Esbilac , can you get her seen by a vet. If her leg is broken, it will need to be splinted. So sorry to hear this. I would keep her in a small container so she canít jump or climb.
    redwuff
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  10. #47
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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    Donít know if this conveys the problem:

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  11. #48
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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    Is it her right upper arm?
    redwuff
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  12. #49
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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    Can you feel anything in the arm that is troubling her?
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  13. #50
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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    Yes itís the right upper arm that seems swollen. When I feel it just seems swollen. She wonít bear weight on it or use the paw.

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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...1&d=1567688998



    This is Peteys X-ray. His right humorous area became swollen before he went to the vet. That is what that area looked like on X-ray.
    redwuff
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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    You are in the land of approachable vets. I hope you can get her seen. A break is easily a possibility.
    redwuff
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  17. #53
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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    Esbilac issue info:
    I spoke with Chris Clark of squirrelsandmore.com about esbilac. She is a distributor for them and has been in contact with them over our problem. We are advising people to try to be patient. PetAg is working on new formula with the old finer ground dicalcium phosphate in it. That will take us back to the good old esbilac. If you purchased yours from chris, she will take it back. I have spoken to another rehabber who called Amazon and they told her they didn't need it back but gave her credit and she purchased fox valley 20/50. If you purchased it somewhere else, our suggestion is to simply return it there.
    For feeding babies: Esbilac goat's milk formula and full fat yogurt with NO ARTIFICIAL SWEETENERS (3 parts formula to 1 part yogurt) up until 4 weeks and then switch over to Fox valley 20/50 with nothing extra added.
    There is a lot of talk about other things needed in fv 20/50. There is nothing that needs adding.
    Miracle Nipples are newly made and work wonderfully. I used one for way over 3000 feedings and it only gave out because of teeth! Chris has them now if you would like to order them.
    Squirrels, squirrels and more squirrels....
    Prayers for the people who make this a better world...
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  19. #54
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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    I am sorry but there are too many babies with shattered bones to hang in with Esbilac. First the 2008 disaster with the SSSD formula drying method causing our little ones to turn into skeletons with formula that seemed like cement in their tummies ... and then they died. All the while, Pet Ag denying anything had changed. Now 2019, our precious little babies have pain, shattered bones and are having to be euthanized by the hundreds. I will not give PetAg anymore business.

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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    I used Esbilac and added 1/3 part heavy cream for added calcium. Cans marked made in USA. Could the problem be with Esbilac made outside of USA sold on Amazon or other sources? Is adding heavy cream enough calcium? My squirrels wouldn't eat the fox 20/50. They are also starting solid foods rich in calcium so this isn't an issue for me now. Are the people reporting issues with formula not adding heavy cream or calcium supplement? Esbilac has worked very well for the rehabbers ive talked to. Could diarrhea be caused by another issue? Or perhaps some are sensitive to the heavy cream especially if too much is added? Hmm mm any additional information regarding this is appreciated. Really not a fan of the20/50 and wonder if Esbiliac is to blame for problems??? Thank you! ( I would suggest never buyer Esbilac on Amazon, cannot guarantee if authentic)

  22. #56
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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    Quote Originally Posted by Kasha View Post
    I used Esbilac and added 1/3 part heavy cream for added calcium. Cans marked made in USA. Could the problem be with Esbilac made outside of USA sold on Amazon or other sources? Is adding heavy cream enough calcium? My squirrels wouldn't eat the fox 20/50. They are also starting solid foods rich in calcium so this isn't an issue for me now. Are the people reporting issues with formula not adding heavy cream or calcium supplement? Esbilac has worked very well for the rehabbers ive talked to. Could diarrhea be caused by another issue? Or perhaps some are sensitive to the heavy cream especially if too much is added? Hmm mm any additional information regarding this is appreciated. Really not a fan of the20/50 and wonder if Esbiliac is to blame for problems??? Thank you! ( I would suggest never buyer Esbilac on Amazon, cannot guarantee if authentic)
    While this problem is being seen earlier with cans from Amazon, it has nothing to do with their not being authentic. There was at the very least, a change to one of the ingredients - the calcium source - in Esbilac, as reported by the manufacturer when questioned. It appears that the "Made in the USA" cans were manufacturer BEFORE the change, and the "Crafted in the US" cans were manufactured AFTER the change. Your brick and mortar Petcos and Tractor Supplies keep this stuff in stock but they don't turn it over at even a fracture of the speed Amazon does, so Amazon sold all of their old esbilac long ago, while you can still go to your neighborhood pet shop and find the old stuff.

    A product that is represented as a milk replacer really shouldn't need a bunch of add ins, and adding heavy cream to boost the taste and fat is one thing; having to add additional calcium is quite another.

    I am surprised your guys didn't like the 20/50. Did you do a gradual transition or just switch formulas abruptly? You have to ease them into change.

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  24. #57
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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    Quote Originally Posted by Kasha View Post
    I used Esbilac and added 1/3 part heavy cream for added calcium. Cans marked made in USA. Could the problem be with Esbilac made outside of USA sold on Amazon or other sources? Is adding heavy cream enough calcium? My squirrels wouldn't eat the fox 20/50. They are also starting solid foods rich in calcium so this isn't an issue for me now. Are the people reporting issues with formula not adding heavy cream or calcium supplement? Esbilac has worked very well for the rehabbers ive talked to. Could diarrhea be caused by another issue? Or perhaps some are sensitive to the heavy cream especially if too much is added? Hmm mm any additional information regarding this is appreciated. Really not a fan of the20/50 and wonder if Esbiliac is to blame for problems??? Thank you! ( I would suggest never buyer Esbilac on Amazon, cannot guarantee if authentic)
    Hi Kasha. to The Squirrel Board

    In answer to your question IF Esbilac is responsible for this problem.

    Let me state for the record... unequivocally PetAg’s puppy Esbilac is 100% responsible for this heartbreaking problem.
    It isn’t their distributors, how it’s stored, Amazon vs Non-Amazon, how it’s shipped or counterfeit product. It is a defective product .... no question about it.
    This wasn’t a malicious action on their part. IMO, it was a supply chain change of an ingredient from the suppliers of raw materials.

    I’m very happy that the can you used was Made in the USA. Those cans, for the most part, appear to be from last years stock and have shown virtually no or very little problem. I myself, used Esbilac in the spring this year. I had no problems at all.

    This problem is new. You can’t go by how it performed in the past. We ALL had great results IN THE PAST. I would highly recommend that you reconsider the Fox Valley 20:50 for your babies in the future. We don’t recommend the FV 32:40 due to problems with pinkies and young squirrels. We don’t know how or when this will be corrected by PetAg. Frankly, I don’t care when or IF they correct it because I will never use their products again. I had considered using their formula made for wildlife (Zoologic Milk Matrix) but I have changed my mind. I won’t be using any of their products. It will take a long time to get the images of broken and suffering babies out of my mind.

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  26. #58
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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    Quote Originally Posted by SammysMom View Post
    Esbilac issue info:
    I spoke with Chris Clark of squirrelsandmore.com about esbilac. She is a distributor for them and has been in contact with them over our problem.
    I guess while Iím on it I might as well let my opinion be known on this as well.

    I have never been more disappointed than I am with the statement issued by Chrisís Squirrel and More regarding this very REAL problem.
    You can read it on the website and decide for yourself. Seriously!?

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  28. #59
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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    Quote Originally Posted by HRT4SQRLS View Post
    I guess while I’m on it I might as well let my opinion be known on this as well.

    I have never been more disappointed than I am with the statement issued by Chris’s Squirrel and More regarding this very REAL problem.
    You can read it on the website and decide for yourself. Seriously!?

    I was shocked and saddened to see a person in
    her position take an "stance" for a product that the
    rest of us knows, is crippling and killing babies.
    Last edited by Nancy in New York; 09-21-2019 at 09:05 PM.

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  30. #60
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    Default Re: Esbilac Warning (Fall 2019)

    Anyone else find it curious that now all Esbilac puppy milk replacer by PetAg at CS&M is "out of stock?"
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