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Thread: Advanced MBD?

  1. #1
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    Default Advanced MBD?

    This is my first rodeo with what seems to be an advanced case of MBD. At least I hope that is the problem, because the alternative is a all too severe injury.

    Sammysmom routed these two my way from a third person (off board) who deserves a ton of credit for working diligently for days to get the person that had these 2 sweeties to relinquish them. On top of that she drove many, many hours round trip today to bring them to me (I cannot say how grateful I am when folks are willing to bring them right to the door... too many of us know just how hard it is to get away for 5 or 6 hours to pick up babies… when we are hopping during baby season!). They were given Henry’s and Bok-Choy on the drive which they seemed to enjoy… which you would not think for squees living on a diet of corn and seeds. Oh, and this will not surprise anyone but KT is out of town (what surprises await her return!!! I digress). I have some of the backstory, but I doubt much what was provided by the person that had them for months is accurate…

    These are 2 sisters, fall 2018 babies, are both woefully underweight, showing all the signs of poor nutrition. The better off of the two is a little heavier, very active and mobile. Her tail is recently de-gloved though, about 2 – 3 inches worth.

    Her sister has rear end paralysis but she can move her right rear leg some and I have seen her tail flicker and flinch. I have felt spasms in her tail when I am holding her.

    I am not sure what kind of hell on earth these two have lived their short lives, but I am sure it is the kind of hell that no animal deserves. They are both so scared you would have thought they were plucked from a nest today and saw a hoomin for the first time.

    They have both been started on the MBD protocol. I am working on gaining their trust… anytime I approach, pick up, touch, pet or otherwise interact with the paralysis girl her sister stands vigil in her neighboring cage. They arrived in separate cages that is believed to be where they had been housed for months (a cat carrier and what I am guessing is a mouse cage... I need to post a pic of that thing). And I am keeping them in smaller, separate cages for now. Both their bottoms are a mess and they were swimming in dried corn... apparently corn and seeds were their diet. They both took their doses of calcium well, thank goodness. Paralysis girl seems to like FV… her sis not so much. Both LOVE Henry’s… so this certainly it not a case where they "refused" to eat their block... they were just never given any block.

    Here is a picture of sis standing guard and her sister investigating what I suspect is her first squirrel appropriate meal in her lifetime and a couple quick vids of them... scared little munchkins that they are..

    This is the ever vigilant girl wit the partially de-gloved tail:
    Name:  MBD Sis2.jpg
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    And this is the one with the rear end paralysis:
    Name:  MBD Sis1.jpg
Views: 153
Size:  145.6 KB


    https://youtu.be/sckvo7KzO0I

    https://youtu.be/wDvpaxTr3yo

    https://youtu.be/118yhEL9joo

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  3. #2
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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    Thank you Spanky. The girls lives have taken a HUGE turn for the better. Look forward to seeing them get healthy and strong.

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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    The videos make me weep with relief for them... you are their hero as well as mine. I seem to send more than my fair share your way, Spanky. You never turn away from them, even with many other things on your plate. Thank you...
    Squirrels, squirrels and more squirrels....
    Prayers for the people who make this a better world...
    savesquirrels@sbcglobal.net



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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    There seems to be a lot about the information passed along about these girls that does not add up. For starters, they were said to be a year old... we know they are fall babies though.

    Another thing is the report that the paralyzed girl has been this way for 2 - 3 MONTHS. I hope this is also inaccurate and I am thinking if that were true she'd have signs of dragging, but looking at her (and this pic) I don't see any evidence of this.... but I know there are so many more TSB folks out there that have so much more experience with long term paralyzed squees: What do you think?

    Name:  20190305_NoDrag.jpg
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Size:  113.0 KB

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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    Here is a pic of the little cage the paralyzed girl arrived in... it is less than 1 cubic foot. Behind it is the "Ware" cage that we use for 5 - 7 week olds and many are familiar for size comparison. I wish I had thought to take a picture of the mess she arrive in (form the original owner)... a folded towel in the bottom of the cage and she was laying in a pool of dried corn and sunflower seeds. A cotton receiving blanket for her to hide under. I just threw the whole mess away before I thought to take a picture. The other was in what looks like a brand new cat-sized pet carrier.... very pink! It did not seem like her permanent home like the little cage did for the paralysis sufferer.

    I do have them in a pair of the Ware cages for now... I think the more healthy one will graduate to a larger cage soon.

    Name:  LittleCage.jpg
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Size:  152.4 KB

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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    Hey, I would also make sure you pick up a couple of reptile UV lights for them. I know the blocks have Vitamin D in them but the lights really do help them metabolize the calcium, which these poor babies need to do.

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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    Quote Originally Posted by Spanky View Post
    There seems to be a lot about the information passed along about these girls that does not add up. For starters, they were said to be a year old... we know they are fall babies though.

    Another thing is the report that the paralyzed girl has been this way for 2 - 3 MONTHS. I hope this is also inaccurate and I am thinking if that were true she'd have signs of dragging, but looking at her (and this pic) I don't see any evidence of this.... but I know there are so many more TSB folks out there that have so much more experience with long term paralyzed squees: What do you think?

    Name:  20190305_NoDrag.jpg
Views: 149
Size:  113.0 KB
    Hi Spanky,

    Thank you so much for taking these girls on. You da bomb! The paralyzed squirrels that have come to us, when held in the manner you are holding that little one, would totally hang the legs. Something is working somewhere in that girl. Can she urinate and defacate alright?
    redwuff
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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    Thank you, thank you, thank you for getting these two! They deserve SO much better than what they have had in the past and now they will get a real chance for a decent life. All those video are terribly sad but the 2nd one really is a heart breaker.

    The way they are so terrified, one with a degloved tail and another with hind end paralysis makes me wonder if they lived in a home with dogs? If not properly supervised and contained, the dogs may have gotten a hold of these two poor squirrels. Dog attack/shaking could explain the degloved tail on one squirrel and the hind end injury of the other squirrel. I hope it is not this and MBD disease instead (at least for the hind end paralyzed squirrel). If it was a dog attack then pred would be better but all this is speculation and with that diet, MBD is not a matter of it but when.
    See my wild squirrel adventures in the thread "Squirtle's yard!":
    https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...quirtle-s-Yard!

    See the sisters Pip and Nip!
    https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...-(Pip-and-Nip)!

    Loving dad to Sir Max, 2017-2018. There is no foot so small that it cannot leave an imprint on this world.

    "Once in a while you get shown the light, In the strangest of places if you look at it right."
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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    Quote Originally Posted by redwuff View Post
    Can she urinate and defacate alright?
    Yes, she can do her business on her own.

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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    Thank goodness the sisters are with you
    I never dealt with mbd until December of last year and then again the end of January. It was so sad to see them in so much pain and struggling to get around. Fortunately I think they'll both make a full recovery.
    Sending prayers for the sisters to make a full recovery too

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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    Just wanted to pass along this heartwarming update... tonight when I approach the paralyzed girls cage to give an evening dose of Ca, she crawled out from under her fleeces and greeted me. Even tried to climb (pull herself) out of the cage when I opened it. Not chattering. No vocalizations. No shaking... and she enjoyed some snuggles. She was such a sweetie.

    Her sister, well.. she is still chattering but she is at the stage of doing it more for show than anything, so she is coming along too.

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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    See my wild squirrel adventures in the thread "Squirtle's yard!":
    https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...quirtle-s-Yard!

    See the sisters Pip and Nip!
    https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...-(Pip-and-Nip)!

    Loving dad to Sir Max, 2017-2018. There is no foot so small that it cannot leave an imprint on this world.

    "Once in a while you get shown the light, In the strangest of places if you look at it right."
    -Grateful Dead

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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    Wonderful news!

    Island Rehabber
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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    A video of the paralyzed one...

    https://youtu.be/sMsWyu65D0U

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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    I can't tell you how glad I am that you took them out of that hell hole
    they were living in.
    I can't imagine what their lives were like before you!


    Charlie is there a lump on her back or is it just the way she
    turned.
    At first I thought it was an indentation, where the yellow arrow is,
    but watching the video again, I'm unsure.
    You can see it better around the 20-27 mark.

    Is she on Gabapentin?


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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    These girls are so lucky to have landed with you. . Would prednisone and Gabapentin be okay to give along with the MBD treatment? It seems like you might cover all the bases then.

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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    Are you able to get a spinal X-ray? I notice the same area that Nancy noticed. I still wonder about a broken pelvis too. Hopefully she has not been like that for 2 months.

    Lord what is wrong with people....
    redwuff
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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    Of course those babies know you're a safe guy! We know how smart they are!
    Squirrels, squirrels and more squirrels....
    Prayers for the people who make this a better world...
    savesquirrels@sbcglobal.net



  32. #19
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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    Quote Originally Posted by redwuff View Post
    Are you able to get a spinal X-ray? I notice the same area that Nancy noticed. I still wonder about a broken pelvis too. Hopefully she has not been like that for 2 months.

    Lord what is wrong with people....

    Yes I can get her X-Rayed. I resisted the impulse to take her for an X-ray immediately because of the backstory and presumption of MBD. That backstory made less and less sense as I heard more and more of the pieces. No one's fault, it was relayed to me and from all accounts the person that had them was evasive and not forthcoming from what I understand. If she had been like this for months (or even weeks), it would require a doting caretaker for her not to have drag burns/marks, hair loss, urine scald and yellow urine stains... or at least that is what I would imagine? And none of that was in evidence in the little cage she arrived in... she was not put in there just for the hand-off, the linens were a few days old. On the flip side, I am pretty sure her sister was only in the pet carrier for the transfer. Then there is the sister's freshly de-gloved tail and her being so much better off in terms of MBD, despite shared crappy diets. Two traumas too coincidental IMO.

    My clinic is closed Wednesday afternoons.



    Quote Originally Posted by Mel1959 View Post
    Would prednisone and Gabapentin be okay to give along with the MBD treatment?
    She is currently on gabapentin, but not pred (or dex or any steroid). And tramadol for pain.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nancy in New York View Post
    Charlie is there a lump on her back or is it just the way she
    turned.
    At first I thought it was an indentation, where the yellow arrow is,
    but watching the video again, I'm unsure.
    You can see it better around the 20-27 mark.

    Is she on Gabapentin?

    When I checked, I did not think there was anything there. But I have noticed a "hitch" in her spine a bit lower (praying it is nothing). I do not feel any obvious structural issues (bones) other than that possible spot on her lower spine.

    Her left foot is definitely worse off, toes seems to be listless. But she can move both legs but her right leg is much better. She even does the scratching thing with that right leg in short bouts. I have not seen any tail movement today...

    This is new to me.. unlike the other paralysis I have treated.. of course, I was certain those were traumas. Like I said to start, my first up close personal with MBD if that is what this is... I hope it is. I fear it is not.




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    Default Re: Advanced MBD?

    Doc says there are no breaks in the legs or pelvis, he sees a bit of misalignment in her lower spine. Below is the x-ray, though not a great clear picture. You can see the lower 4 vertebra (maybe?) that are pushed up a bit. (Yes, those are human hands (actually mine) holding her... ).

    He gave her a more thorough physical exam (rough?) than I had and during that time she did move that left leg (she has always moved the right more) and her tail. You can see her legs extended for the X-Ray, she was pulling them back up (both).
    He is convince she is suffering advanced MBD and to stay the course and not add an anti-inflammatory. He believes she has a good chance of recovering... and he told me it was better than what he was expecting before the x-ray.

    Name:  Radiograph.jpg
Views: 94
Size:  38.3 KB

    I am feeling much better now...

    The bad news is her sister is not feeling well, she did not eat any breakfast this morning.. it was still untouched when I got home. I am going to add heat to her cage and increase the Ca (her poo is still dark); her sister's Ca is being reduced / tweaked since she has been pooing some Ca.

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