Hi sandy, don't know how to add a link, but you can put Emergency treatment of Metabolic bone disease in the search box in upper right of page and it will pop up.
Hi sandy, don't know how to add a link, but you can put Emergency treatment of Metabolic bone disease in the search box in upper right of page and it will pop up.
redwuff
State Licensed
Master Wildlife Rehabilitator
UDoWhat (09-18-2017)
I started her mbd tx today. I mixed up two blocks n one tums w nut butter. Well c. Fingers crossed she eats it!! I'm so scared n worried about her. Her tail is thinning n that makes me nervous. Even when she was eating well n being her crazy self I always worried. Now my anxiety is thru the roof. Thanks again for helping me!!
Hopefully the Henry's picky blocks will get here soon. She better est them BC Idk what else to do. I've tried everything!! I just don't understand y she was fine one day the very next day she stopped eating her favs. It was like a switch went off. Not gradual at all. Just bam! Not eating but still crazy n full of energy. Thanks again!! It means more than u'll ever know!!
redwuff (08-14-2017)
Here's the link to the MBD protocol.
Follow this, and you can't go wrong.
Remember with the tums, what you are looking for is the elemental calcium.
Let me look for a thread that may help you with the tums.
EDIT:I hope no one minds I went ahead and did a short piece on how to decipher how much elemental calcium is in any supplement, including the new Tums, which are no longer very clearly labeled IMO. (I spoke with yet another person today--TSB member--who's been dosing her MBD sq based on the assumption that TUMS EXTRA 750 contains 750 mg CA per tablet. Sq has only been getting around 200 mg/day. Luckily, sq is doing well.) Anyhow, hope someone finds this useful.
Attachment 249610
Attachment 249611
Attachment 249612
MBD Protocol:
https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...-MBD-Treatment
redwuff (08-14-2017)
Thank u very much!! Really, it means alot!! I definitely feel the love is this group. U guys r great!! I'm doing tough love today. I mixed up the blocks I have now w a tums in nut butter. Hopefully she eats it BC that's all she's getting. Yeah right, I know I'll at least give her some avocado BC it's the only thing left she eats. I'm worried that the very lil amount she is eating is going to sneak up on her n she's going to decline. GOD forbid!! It's just so frustrating BC she is all over the place. It's like she's too busy to eat. Play play play is all she wants to do. Someone else said that their baby also went thru this for a few wks. N it happened every season so that helps w my nerves alil bit. Lately she's been from window to window showing interest in outside. That's new too. I have her in the sunroom never caged so she has alot of room to run around. I just hope her energy stays up. That's the only thing keeping me somewhat sane. GOD forbid!! KNOCK ON WOOD, FINGERS CROSSED n any other crazy ocd things u can think of lol. Just waiting for henrys blocks to get here. Thanks again!! It means so very much to me!!
redwuff (08-14-2017)
https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...7&d=1232419601
https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...8&d=1232419601
Sandy, I promised to explain about the calcium : phosphorus ratio of foods.
Above you will find 2 links that give the ratios of different foods . The second chart puts the foods in GOOD, FAIR and RISKY.
It not just the amount of calcium that determines if a food is good or bad.
The amount of phosphorus is also important. For optimal bone health, the intake of calcium should be approximately twice that of phosphorus (or a Ca: P ratio of 2:1). When the phosphorus exceeds the calcium in the diet, a hormone is produced by the parathyroid that breaks down the bones. In simple terms, calcium is pulled from the bones. For large mammals like us, osteoporosis would be the result. For small mammals, brittle bones is only ONE of the complications. Metabolic Bone Disease is much more than thinning of the bones. It is a complex metabolic syndrome that is characterized by hind end paralysis, seizures and death.
This is the reason diet is so important for our little friends. When you look at the chart, I think you will understand why seeds and nuts are so harmful when fed in quantity. Highlighting a few... Pumpkin seeds (1:27) Pine nuts (1:36) Pecans (1:4). All of these are bad Ca: P ratios. Actually, pine nuts are SO bad most people never feed them. The best foods are those that have a ratio of 2:1.
You mentioned mushrooms. I actually forgot that mushrooms have a bad ratio. (1:29) They are good for Vitamin D but they are very high in phosphorus. Flyers get them for the Vitamin D because they are nocturnal and don't get much from sunlight. Squirrels can have mushrooms but moderation is important.
I think the key is variety. Some veggies are better than others.
Don't go overboard on the high phosphorus foods. Nuts and seeds are especially bad. Actually seeds are much worse than nuts. That's why they are considered treats only.
Last but not least.... All of this information highlights WHY feeding rodent block is SO important. Rodent blocks have been formulated to meet the nutritional needs of rodents. They contain vitamins and minerals that are needed for good health. We can't match the diet that squirrels get in nature so we do the best we can. The rodent block helps to fill in the gaps that exist due to our inability to match a natural diet that they would normally eat.
This was probably way TMI but I hope it gives you an idea about selecting foods. Nutrition is very complex and involves a lot more than just calcium and phosphorus but we highlight that because most of the problems we see are related to MBD.
Nancy in New York (08-13-2017), redwuff (08-14-2017)
I just looked at the tums label. It's calcium carbonate. Will it still work? I heard that any supplements in pill form r a no no. N I just bought vit d3. What n how do I get these vitamins in her? She has cuttle bones that also have all the vits on them too. She chews the crap out of those. I thought that was a good source n enough to keep her nutrient levels on track. I'm going to get some more tomoro. Is there anything else I can get vitamin n mineral wise til the blocks get here? N I guess it's a good idea to have them for her on a daily basis to make sure she's getting the proper amount. Thanks again!!
redwuff (08-14-2017)
redwuff (08-14-2017)
The calcium carbonate is exactly what you want. There are other forms of calcium but we usually use the calcium carbonate because it is readily available AND a more important reason is because most calcium supplements have Vitamin D in them. While it is fine to oversupplement with calcium (while treating MBD), it is NOT OK to oversupplement Vitamin D. Vitamin D is used as a rodenticide (rat poison) by some manufacturers of that product. Too much Vitamin D is harmful or can be lethal. Squirrels do need Vitamin D for calcium uptake but please be careful. A highly respected vet in FL said it is OK to add a TINY pinch of Vitamin D3 when treating for MBD. Just be careful.
Cuddle bones are great. The fact that she 'chews the crap' out of it shows that she is calcium deficient. Most squirrels ignore them but when their body craves it they will really go after it.
The blocks will be there in a few days. I wouldn't add anything right now other than the treatment. I think you will find that she likes the Henry blocks. 2 per day is what she would get unless she is large and then she could have 3 maximum per day. Store them in the freezer as they have no preservatives.
redwuff (08-14-2017)
Not at all tmi!! Ty very much!! I want all the info in the world for my babys health n happiness!! She didn't eat the mushrooms anyway. N I've eliminated the seeds completely, she stopped eating them anyway. N nuts were given once or twice a month due to her being over weight. Her main diet was fruits veggies n blocks cuttle bones. She barely eats the fruits n doesn't eat the blocks anymore. Her fav for dinner was raw yam. She barely eats that now too. Til Henry's picky blocks get here I have to get her to eat something so it's been avocado n white sweet corn cob, which she is now snubbing that. N she had two almonds yesterday. Today I mixed two blocks that I have w one tums tab n nut butter. Hopefully she eats it BC it's all I offered her.
Thank u so much for the info n helping me so much!! I didn't look at the links yet but will ASAP.
I bought vit d3 but saw any vits in pill form r a no no. N the vita drops r bad which I don't have anyway. I'm assuming the links will give me the info I need to make sure she gets the nutrition she needs. The tums label says calcium carbonate, is that OK for now? N when the blocks get here will that b enough to get her on track? I'm sorry to ask stupid questions. I'm just so worried n beyond exhausted over all this. I have health issues so it's been taking a toll on me eventho if I were healthy it still would BC she my world!! I need her!! She makes me feel like I purpose plus the bond we have is amazing. I love her more than anything in this world!! I can't loose her as I'm sure I've said before lol. Is her tail loosing fur due to deficiency or shedding foe winter? I think it's BC she has stopped eating mostly everything I give her. I just hope het energy level stays up. GOD forbid it doesn't!! It's like she's too busy to eat. Just wants to play play play. N is showing interest outside. Runs from one window to the next. Then jumps on me n plays. She's in a sunroom so she gas plenty of room to run n play. Her cage is back there to but she is never locked in there. She likes to chill on the top of it so I kept it back there for her. I'm getting off track here. R the Henry's picky blocks enough to get her on track n get the proper nutrition? Now I think nk I'm repeating myself. Gonna look at the links now. Thanks again!! I'm forever in ur debt!!
redwuff (08-14-2017)
Just read links. What an eye opener!! So basically everything is bad lol. The ratio should be 2:1 right? It seemed like collard greens n greens in that family r the only ones that r safe n oranges. I tried kale before which she didn't eat. She's never was big on the veggies except for the yam. But I c thats bad. U better believe that as soon as those Henry's blocks get here that's all she's getting!! Thanks again. I'll keep u posted. In the meantime she has to eat something so it has to b almonds n avocado til those blocks get here. I read that if a squirrel does not eat anything in a 24 hr period they will die. Is this true? I tried to do alot of research before I took her in so would b prepared but boy m I way off. I'm going to offer her a piece of orange BC right now her blocks r mixed w peanut butter n I just saw the ratio is terrible!! Thanks again!! As far as the tums, is it still OK to give eventho it's calcium carbonate? N how often is a treat such as fruit or seeds or nuts OK to b given? She only got nuts once or twice a month. N the pumpkin seeds once a day but I'm sure it was too many. Thankfully she's over weight so whatever weight has been lost has brought her to a good weight now. That's y she only got the nuts once or twice a month. Socagain how often can she get treats?
redwuff (08-14-2017)
So I just got back from buying endive, snap peas, collards, kale, beet greens n something else I think. She chewed on all of them got me so excited n spit it all out. Guess I can't expect a miracle on day one. I'm just worried she's using energy she doesn't have anymore fro the lack of food. I now know I was over feeding her so maybe she's eating enough. Idk I'm just so stressed. My friend has the high protein Henry's blocks n giving them to me tomoro. I'll try them til the picky blocks get here. I saw she ate sone of the nut butter mixed w tums n my blocks but not that much. I said f it, here nyka take a tums. She ate some of it n hid it in my hand lol. I'm sorry I keep posting n bothering everyone I'm just so worried about my baby. Thanks again!! Fingers crossed everyone!!
redwuff (08-14-2017)
Nancy in New York (08-15-2017)
She always craved the bones since she was a baby n weaning off formula. She did ignore for quite awhile but I saw she started to chew them again. Thank u!! That helps me. She was bigger BC I know now I over fed her n she was a chunker but now she's at a good weight. Just hope she doesn't lose anymore!
Thanks again!!
redwuff (08-14-2017)
Is there a way to upload videos to this forum?
Thank u very much! This is very helpful. I changed her diet completely. Lots of veggies (not that she really eating them). Started the mbd tx yesterday. Was able to syringe feed her about 500mg calcium from tums. Is it OK to give her plain yogurt? I'm hoping her Henry's picking blocks get here today! More importantly I hope she likes them!! Fingers crossed please. Thanks again.
Nancy in New York (08-15-2017)
Is it OK to give my one yr old gray plain yogurt? I started her on tums yesterday. Was able to syringe feed her about 500mg. I'd like to add some yogurt for even more calcium due to the syringe feeding being pretty difficult. Apparently her diet was way off. I ordered Henry's picky blocks. She was eating the blocks I had for her but stopped eating them, w pretty much everything else I fed her. I changed her diet to more veggies which she barely touches. Her energy is thru the roof. It's like she's too busy to eat. Just wants to play play play. N now she's running from one window to next. She lives in a sun room. So there's lots of windows but I know that she's not getting the proper sun exposure she needs for vita d. I started a thread about a WK ago when I joined n got so much feed back so I'm on the right the track now but still would like to add extra calcium til her blocks arrive. So long story long, is yogurt allowed?
Some pix of my baby girl. Most r w her winter coat
More recent pix
I can tell how much you love your girl!!
Thank you so much for listening and learning and giving us feedback. It makes every effort we put in on this board worthwhile.
redwuff
State Licensed
Master Wildlife Rehabilitator