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Thread: My gray squirrel Nyka

  1. #41
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    Default Re: My gray squirrel Nyka

    Hi sandy, don't know how to add a link, but you can put Emergency treatment of Metabolic bone disease in the search box in upper right of page and it will pop up.
    redwuff
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    Default Re: My gray squirrel Nyka

    Quote Originally Posted by redwuff View Post
    I have never heard if Vita prima subscription blocks. Can you tell me about them? Sounds like you have done a lot of work yourself on learning about diet. Good for you!

    Squirrels do wax and wane on eating, and the first thing to go is eating block.
    Please start the MBD protocol. It won't hurt and it could be vital.

    I am looking up the food vita prima sunscription block to see what it is made of. Are u using the Rat, mouse, and gerbil formula or Critter Cubes Formulated diet.

    We are in the process of trying to figure out where your girls diet is . It sounds better than first thought if you are feeding the block. Remember block needs to be 80% of her diet. If you have been feeding Rat, Mouse, and Gerbil Formula (seed mix) then you MUST start MBD treatment without delay, also many people 'feed' block but their squirrels don't eat enough of the block, but instead eat the other goodies, which is not a proper diet to prevent MBD. That is why we are suggesting to start the treatment
    Until we have more info on what is going on. One symptom of MBD is lack of appetite.

    Let us know how she is doing!

    Trysh
    I started her mbd tx today. I mixed up two blocks n one tums w nut butter. Well c. Fingers crossed she eats it!! I'm so scared n worried about her. Her tail is thinning n that makes me nervous. Even when she was eating well n being her crazy self I always worried. Now my anxiety is thru the roof. Thanks again for helping me!!
    Hopefully the Henry's picky blocks will get here soon. She better est them BC Idk what else to do. I've tried everything!! I just don't understand y she was fine one day the very next day she stopped eating her favs. It was like a switch went off. Not gradual at all. Just bam! Not eating but still crazy n full of energy. Thanks again!! It means more than u'll ever know!!

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  4. #43
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    Default Re: My gray squirrel Nyka

    Here's the link to the MBD protocol.
    Follow this, and you can't go wrong.
    Remember with the tums, what you are looking for is the elemental calcium.
    Let me look for a thread that may help you with the tums.

    EDIT:
    I hope no one minds I went ahead and did a short piece on how to decipher how much elemental calcium is in any supplement, including the new Tums, which are no longer very clearly labeled IMO. (I spoke with yet another person today--TSB member--who's been dosing her MBD sq based on the assumption that TUMS EXTRA 750 contains 750 mg CA per tablet. Sq has only been getting around 200 mg/day. Luckily, sq is doing well.) Anyhow, hope someone finds this useful.

    Attachment 249610


    Attachment 249611

    Attachment 249612


    MBD Protocol:
    https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...-MBD-Treatment

  5. Serious fuzzy thank you's to Nancy in New York from:

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    Default Re: My gray squirrel Nyka

    Quote Originally Posted by Shewhosweptforest View Post
    Oh my goodness she is beeeutiful welcome to you both please don't beat yourself up...my Baby was a year and a half old when I came here...and her diet was far worse than Nyka's when I got my picky eater blocks I just did tough love and only offered her the block...by the end of the first day she was eating them

    You can really tell that she is well loved and cared for

    My squirrels also go through periods when they slow down on their eating...and I have females...and they do drag their bottoms sometimes...I've even seen my releases do that I have always assumed they are marking their territory I wouldn't worry I think she's going to love the blocks and she'll be fine
    Thank u very much!! Really, it means alot!! I definitely feel the love is this group. U guys r great!! I'm doing tough love today. I mixed up the blocks I have now w a tums in nut butter. Hopefully she eats it BC that's all she's getting. Yeah right, I know I'll at least give her some avocado BC it's the only thing left she eats. I'm worried that the very lil amount she is eating is going to sneak up on her n she's going to decline. GOD forbid!! It's just so frustrating BC she is all over the place. It's like she's too busy to eat. Play play play is all she wants to do. Someone else said that their baby also went thru this for a few wks. N it happened every season so that helps w my nerves alil bit. Lately she's been from window to window showing interest in outside. That's new too. I have her in the sunroom never caged so she has alot of room to run around. I just hope her energy stays up. That's the only thing keeping me somewhat sane. GOD forbid!! KNOCK ON WOOD, FINGERS CROSSED n any other crazy ocd things u can think of lol. Just waiting for henrys blocks to get here. Thanks again!! It means so very much to me!!

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  8. #45
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    Default Re: My gray squirrel Nyka

    https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...7&d=1232419601

    https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...8&d=1232419601

    Sandy, I promised to explain about the calcium : phosphorus ratio of foods.
    Above you will find 2 links that give the ratios of different foods . The second chart puts the foods in GOOD, FAIR and RISKY.

    It not just the amount of calcium that determines if a food is good or bad.
    The amount of phosphorus is also important. For optimal bone health, the intake of calcium should be approximately twice that of phosphorus (or a Ca: P ratio of 2:1). When the phosphorus exceeds the calcium in the diet, a hormone is produced by the parathyroid that breaks down the bones. In simple terms, calcium is pulled from the bones. For large mammals like us, osteoporosis would be the result. For small mammals, brittle bones is only ONE of the complications. Metabolic Bone Disease is much more than thinning of the bones. It is a complex metabolic syndrome that is characterized by hind end paralysis, seizures and death.

    This is the reason diet is so important for our little friends. When you look at the chart, I think you will understand why seeds and nuts are so harmful when fed in quantity. Highlighting a few... Pumpkin seeds (1:27) Pine nuts (1:36) Pecans (1:4). All of these are bad Ca: P ratios. Actually, pine nuts are SO bad most people never feed them. The best foods are those that have a ratio of 2:1.

    You mentioned mushrooms. I actually forgot that mushrooms have a bad ratio. (1:29) They are good for Vitamin D but they are very high in phosphorus. Flyers get them for the Vitamin D because they are nocturnal and don't get much from sunlight. Squirrels can have mushrooms but moderation is important.

    I think the key is variety. Some veggies are better than others.
    Don't go overboard on the high phosphorus foods. Nuts and seeds are especially bad. Actually seeds are much worse than nuts. That's why they are considered treats only.

    Last but not least.... All of this information highlights WHY feeding rodent block is SO important. Rodent blocks have been formulated to meet the nutritional needs of rodents. They contain vitamins and minerals that are needed for good health. We can't match the diet that squirrels get in nature so we do the best we can. The rodent block helps to fill in the gaps that exist due to our inability to match a natural diet that they would normally eat.

    This was probably way TMI but I hope it gives you an idea about selecting foods. Nutrition is very complex and involves a lot more than just calcium and phosphorus but we highlight that because most of the problems we see are related to MBD.

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    Nancy in New York (08-13-2017), redwuff (08-14-2017)

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    Default Re: My gray squirrel Nyka

    Quote Originally Posted by SandyC View Post
    Thank u very much!! Really, it means alot!! I definitely feel the love is this group. U guys r great!! I'm doing tough love today. I mixed up the blocks I have now w a tums in nut butter. Hopefully she eats it BC that's all she's getting. Yeah right, I know I'll at least give her some avocado BC it's the only thing left she eats. I'm worried that the very lil amount she is eating is going to sneak up on her n she's going to decline. GOD forbid!! It's just so frustrating BC she is all over the place. It's like she's too busy to eat. Play play play is all she wants to do. Someone else said that their baby also went thru this for a few wks. N it happened every season so that helps w my nerves alil bit. Lately she's been from window to window showing interest in outside. That's new too. I have her in the sunroom never caged so she has alot of room to run around. I just hope her energy stays up. That's the only thing keeping me somewhat sane. GOD forbid!! KNOCK ON WOOD, FINGERS CROSSED n any other crazy ocd things u can think of lol. Just waiting for henrys blocks to get here. Thanks again!! It means so very much to me!!
    I just looked at the tums label. It's calcium carbonate. Will it still work? I heard that any supplements in pill form r a no no. N I just bought vit d3. What n how do I get these vitamins in her? She has cuttle bones that also have all the vits on them too. She chews the crap out of those. I thought that was a good source n enough to keep her nutrient levels on track. I'm going to get some more tomoro. Is there anything else I can get vitamin n mineral wise til the blocks get here? N I guess it's a good idea to have them for her on a daily basis to make sure she's getting the proper amount. Thanks again!!

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  12. #47
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    Default Re: My gray squirrel Nyka

    Quote Originally Posted by SandyC View Post
    I just looked at the tums label. It's calcium carbonate. Will it still work? I heard that any supplements in pill form r a no no. N I just bought vit d3. What n how do I get these vitamins in her? She has cuttle bones that also have all the vits on them too. She chews the crap out of those. I thought that was a good source n enough to keep her nutrient levels on track. I'm going to get some more tomoro. Is there anything else I can get vitamin n mineral wise til the blocks get here? N I guess it's a good idea to have them for her on a daily basis to make sure she's getting the proper amount. Thanks again!!
    Here you go, read the parts where the green arrows are:
    This will explain about elemental calcium.
    On this particular bottle remember it states the elemental calcium is for 2 tums.



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    Default Re: My gray squirrel Nyka

    Quote Originally Posted by SandyC View Post
    I just looked at the tums label. It's calcium carbonate. Will it still work? I heard that any supplements in pill form r a no no. N I just bought vit d3. What n how do I get these vitamins in her? She has cuttle bones that also have all the vits on them too. She chews the crap out of those. I thought that was a good source n enough to keep her nutrient levels on track. I'm going to get some more tomoro. Is there anything else I can get vitamin n mineral wise til the blocks get here? N I guess it's a good idea to have them for her on a daily basis to make sure she's getting the proper amount. Thanks again!!
    The calcium carbonate is exactly what you want. There are other forms of calcium but we usually use the calcium carbonate because it is readily available AND a more important reason is because most calcium supplements have Vitamin D in them. While it is fine to oversupplement with calcium (while treating MBD), it is NOT OK to oversupplement Vitamin D. Vitamin D is used as a rodenticide (rat poison) by some manufacturers of that product. Too much Vitamin D is harmful or can be lethal. Squirrels do need Vitamin D for calcium uptake but please be careful. A highly respected vet in FL said it is OK to add a TINY pinch of Vitamin D3 when treating for MBD. Just be careful.

    Cuddle bones are great. The fact that she 'chews the crap' out of it shows that she is calcium deficient. Most squirrels ignore them but when their body craves it they will really go after it.

    The blocks will be there in a few days. I wouldn't add anything right now other than the treatment. I think you will find that she likes the Henry blocks. 2 per day is what she would get unless she is large and then she could have 3 maximum per day. Store them in the freezer as they have no preservatives.

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    Default Re: My gray squirrel Nyka

    Quote Originally Posted by HRT4SQRLS View Post
    https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...7&d=1232419601

    https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...8&d=1232419601

    Sandy, I promised to explain about the calcium : phosphorus ratio of foods.
    Above you will find 2 links that give the ratios of different foods . The second chart puts the foods in GOOD, FAIR and RISKY.

    It not just the amount of calcium that determines if a food is good or bad.
    The amount of phosphorus is also important. For optimal bone health, the intake of calcium should be approximately twice that of phosphorus (or a Ca: P ratio of 2:1). When the phosphorus exceeds the calcium in the diet, a hormone is produced by the parathyroid that breaks down the bones. In simple terms, calcium is pulled from the bones. For large mammals like us, osteoporosis would be the result. For small mammals, brittle bones is only ONE of the complications. Metabolic Bone Disease is much more than thinning of the bones. It is a complex metabolic syndrome that is characterized by hind end paralysis, seizures and death.

    This is the reason diet is so important for our little friends. When you look at the chart, I think you will understand why seeds and nuts are so harmful when fed in quantity. Highlighting a few... Pumpkin seeds (1:27) Pine nuts (1:36) Pecans (1:4). All of these are bad Ca: P ratios. Actually, pine nuts are SO bad most people never feed them. The best foods are those that have a ratio of 2:1.

    You mentioned mushrooms. I actually forgot that mushrooms have a bad ratio. (1:29) They are good for Vitamin D but they are very high in phosphorus. Flyers get them for the Vitamin D because they are nocturnal and don't get much from sunlight. Squirrels can have mushrooms but moderation is important.

    I think the key is variety. Some veggies are better than others.
    Don't go overboard on the high phosphorus foods. Nuts and seeds are especially bad. Actually seeds are much worse than nuts. That's why they are considered treats only.

    Last but not least.... All of this information highlights WHY feeding rodent block is SO important. Rodent blocks have been formulated to meet the nutritional needs of rodents. They contain vitamins and minerals that are needed for good health. We can't match the diet that squirrels get in nature so we do the best we can. The rodent block helps to fill in the gaps that exist due to our inability to match a natural diet that they would normally eat.

    This was probably way TMI but I hope it gives you an idea about selecting foods. Nutrition is very complex and involves a lot more than just calcium and phosphorus but we highlight that because most of the problems we see are related to MBD.
    Not at all tmi!! Ty very much!! I want all the info in the world for my babys health n happiness!! She didn't eat the mushrooms anyway. N I've eliminated the seeds completely, she stopped eating them anyway. N nuts were given once or twice a month due to her being over weight. Her main diet was fruits veggies n blocks cuttle bones. She barely eats the fruits n doesn't eat the blocks anymore. Her fav for dinner was raw yam. She barely eats that now too. Til Henry's picky blocks get here I have to get her to eat something so it's been avocado n white sweet corn cob, which she is now snubbing that. N she had two almonds yesterday. Today I mixed two blocks that I have w one tums tab n nut butter. Hopefully she eats it BC it's all I offered her.
    Thank u so much for the info n helping me so much!! I didn't look at the links yet but will ASAP.
    I bought vit d3 but saw any vits in pill form r a no no. N the vita drops r bad which I don't have anyway. I'm assuming the links will give me the info I need to make sure she gets the nutrition she needs. The tums label says calcium carbonate, is that OK for now? N when the blocks get here will that b enough to get her on track? I'm sorry to ask stupid questions. I'm just so worried n beyond exhausted over all this. I have health issues so it's been taking a toll on me eventho if I were healthy it still would BC she my world!! I need her!! She makes me feel like I purpose plus the bond we have is amazing. I love her more than anything in this world!! I can't loose her as I'm sure I've said before lol. Is her tail loosing fur due to deficiency or shedding foe winter? I think it's BC she has stopped eating mostly everything I give her. I just hope het energy level stays up. GOD forbid it doesn't!! It's like she's too busy to eat. Just wants to play play play. N is showing interest outside. Runs from one window to the next. Then jumps on me n plays. She's in a sunroom so she gas plenty of room to run n play. Her cage is back there to but she is never locked in there. She likes to chill on the top of it so I kept it back there for her. I'm getting off track here. R the Henry's picky blocks enough to get her on track n get the proper nutrition? Now I think nk I'm repeating myself. Gonna look at the links now. Thanks again!! I'm forever in ur debt!!

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    Default Re: My gray squirrel Nyka

    Just read links. What an eye opener!! So basically everything is bad lol. The ratio should be 2:1 right? It seemed like collard greens n greens in that family r the only ones that r safe n oranges. I tried kale before which she didn't eat. She's never was big on the veggies except for the yam. But I c thats bad. U better believe that as soon as those Henry's blocks get here that's all she's getting!! Thanks again. I'll keep u posted. In the meantime she has to eat something so it has to b almonds n avocado til those blocks get here. I read that if a squirrel does not eat anything in a 24 hr period they will die. Is this true? I tried to do alot of research before I took her in so would b prepared but boy m I way off. I'm going to offer her a piece of orange BC right now her blocks r mixed w peanut butter n I just saw the ratio is terrible!! Thanks again!! As far as the tums, is it still OK to give eventho it's calcium carbonate? N how often is a treat such as fruit or seeds or nuts OK to b given? She only got nuts once or twice a month. N the pumpkin seeds once a day but I'm sure it was too many. Thankfully she's over weight so whatever weight has been lost has brought her to a good weight now. That's y she only got the nuts once or twice a month. Socagain how often can she get treats?

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    Default Re: My gray squirrel Nyka

    Quote Originally Posted by Nancy in New York View Post
    Here's the link to the MBD protocol.
    Follow this, and you can't go wrong.
    Remember with the tums, what you are looking for is the elemental calcium.
    Let me look for a thread that may help you with the tums.

    EDIT:



    MBD Protocol:
    https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...-MBD-Treatment
    So I just got back from buying endive, snap peas, collards, kale, beet greens n something else I think. She chewed on all of them got me so excited n spit it all out. Guess I can't expect a miracle on day one. I'm just worried she's using energy she doesn't have anymore fro the lack of food. I now know I was over feeding her so maybe she's eating enough. Idk I'm just so stressed. My friend has the high protein Henry's blocks n giving them to me tomoro. I'll try them til the picky blocks get here. I saw she ate sone of the nut butter mixed w tums n my blocks but not that much. I said f it, here nyka take a tums. She ate some of it n hid it in my hand lol. I'm sorry I keep posting n bothering everyone I'm just so worried about my baby. Thanks again!! Fingers crossed everyone!!

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    Default Re: My gray squirrel Nyka

    Quote Originally Posted by Nancy in New York View Post
    Here you go, read the parts where the green arrows are:
    This will explain about elemental calcium.
    On this particular bottle remember it states the elemental calcium is for 2 tums.


    Very helpful!! Thank u!! So she has one tab that she chewed alil of n one tab in her block nut butter mix so that 15002= 600mg of calcium. Ty very very much!!!

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  24. #53
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    Default Re: My gray squirrel Nyka

    Quote Originally Posted by HRT4SQRLS View Post
    The calcium carbonate is exactly what you want. There are other forms of calcium but we usually use the calcium carbonate because it is readily available AND a more important reason is because most calcium supplements have Vitamin D in them. While it is fine to oversupplement with calcium (while treating MBD), it is NOT OK to oversupplement Vitamin D. Vitamin D is used as a rodenticide (rat poison) by some manufacturers of that product. Too much Vitamin D is harmful or can be lethal. Squirrels do need Vitamin D for calcium uptake but please be careful. A highly respected vet in FL said it is OK to add a TINY pinch of Vitamin D3 when treating for MBD. Just be careful.

    Cuddle bones are great. The fact that she 'chews the crap' out of it shows that she is calcium deficient. Most squirrels ignore them but when their body craves it they will really go after it.

    The blocks will be there in a few days. I wouldn't add anything right now other than the treatment. I think you will find that she likes the Henry blocks. 2 per day is what she would get unless she is large and then she could have 3 maximum per day. Store them in the freezer as they have no preservatives.
    She always craved the bones since she was a baby n weaning off formula. She did ignore for quite awhile but I saw she started to chew them again. Thank u!! That helps me. She was bigger BC I know now I over fed her n she was a chunker but now she's at a good weight. Just hope she doesn't lose anymore!
    Thanks again!!

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    Default Re: My gray squirrel Nyka

    Quote Originally Posted by redwuff View Post
    I have never heard if Vita prima subscription blocks. Can you tell me about them? Sounds like you have done a lot of work yourself on learning about diet. Good for you!

    Squirrels do wax and wane on eating, and the first thing to go is eating block.
    Please start the MBD protocol. It won't hurt and it could be vital.

    I am looking up the food vita prima sunscription block to see what it is made of. Are u using the Rat, mouse, and gerbil formula or Critter Cubes Formulated diet.

    We are in the process of trying to figure out where your girls diet is . It sounds better than first thought if you are feeding the block. Remember block needs to be 80% of her diet. If you have been feeding Rat, Mouse, and Gerbil Formula (seed mix) then you MUST start MBD treatment without delay, also many people 'feed' block but their squirrels don't eat enough of the block, but instead eat the other goodies, which is not a proper diet to prevent MBD. That is why we are suggesting to start the treatment
    Until we have more info on what is going on. One symptom of MBD is lack of appetite.

    Let us know how she is doing!

    Trysh
    Successfully syringed half her tums solution. Other half this afternoon. Yay!!

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    Default Re: My gray squirrel Nyka

    Is there a way to upload videos to this forum?

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    Default Re: My gray squirrel Nyka

    Quote Originally Posted by Nancy in New York View Post
    Here's the link to the MBD protocol.
    Follow this, and you can't go wrong.
    Remember with the tums, what you are looking for is the elemental calcium.
    Let me look for a thread that may help you with the tums.

    EDIT:



    MBD Protocol:
    https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/...-MBD-Treatment
    Thank u very much! This is very helpful. I changed her diet completely. Lots of veggies (not that she really eating them). Started the mbd tx yesterday. Was able to syringe feed her about 500mg calcium from tums. Is it OK to give her plain yogurt? I'm hoping her Henry's picking blocks get here today! More importantly I hope she likes them!! Fingers crossed please. Thanks again.

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    Default My one year old eastern gray Nyka

    Is it OK to give my one yr old gray plain yogurt? I started her on tums yesterday. Was able to syringe feed her about 500mg. I'd like to add some yogurt for even more calcium due to the syringe feeding being pretty difficult. Apparently her diet was way off. I ordered Henry's picky blocks. She was eating the blocks I had for her but stopped eating them, w pretty much everything else I fed her. I changed her diet to more veggies which she barely touches. Her energy is thru the roof. It's like she's too busy to eat. Just wants to play play play. N now she's running from one window to next. She lives in a sun room. So there's lots of windows but I know that she's not getting the proper sun exposure she needs for vita d. I started a thread about a WK ago when I joined n got so much feed back so I'm on the right the track now but still would like to add extra calcium til her blocks arrive. So long story long, is yogurt allowed?

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    Default Re: My one year old eastern gray Nyka

    Some pix of my baby girl. Most r w her winter coat
    Attached Images Attached Images     

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    Default Re: My one year old eastern gray Nyka

    More recent pix
    Attached Images Attached Images     

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    Default Re: My one year old eastern gray Nyka

    I can tell how much you love your girl!!

    Thank you so much for listening and learning and giving us feedback. It makes every effort we put in on this board worthwhile.
    redwuff
    State Licensed
    Master Wildlife Rehabilitator

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