ANOTHER injury?

[redwuff]

I took a released rescue to a vet back a year or so with similar sounding symptoms. I thought he might have been hbc or face plant from a fall. It turned out to be a respiratory issue nut very similar symptoms. Any chance of getting a picture of his face? Let me see what antibiotics were used. [U]Do you guys experience bortatella down there?
[




The only sure way to know what you are dealing with is to get a culture done of the infection in his nose. Many of these respiratory issues are very contagious. The release that I was talking about that had the blood blackened nose ( looked like his nose was raw/ hamburgery looking) we were pretty sure he had bordatella bronciioseptica. The antibiotics that were used to treat it were doxycycline and Baytril.

[Coffeeculturegvl]

Posted on social media asking friends for a loaner ferret cage. Meanwhile, I'll keep her with Grayson tonight and hopefully she'll calm down and sleep now it's dark outside. I'll go get at least a single decker ferret cage tomorrow.

My only alternative is confinement in the release enclosure but she'll be hard to catch and care for. It's a big enclosure.

I just REALLY hope she doesn't get as bad as Grayson did despite treating now. Viral or bacterial, it's a NASTY one.

I realize I saw one of my wilds with goopy eyes today.
I wouldn't know how to treat my wild backyard ones, which makes me sad.

Do you have another alternative?

[HRT4SQRLS]

Oh good grief!!! I thought this was a wounded nose and a punctured palate.
I overnighted 3 antibiotics that will arrive by 3PM tomorrow. I sent Clavamox, Clindamydin and I threw in SMZ-TMP for good measure. Now that this appears to be respiratory, none of those are appropriate. Oh well.

Actually, the Azithromycin that was prescribed is an excellent drug for something like this. It would target Bordetella and Mycoplasma and other possible bacterial causes. I think your best bet would be to see if the vet will give you more Azithromycin. I could send a link where you can buy some BUT a bottle of 30 pills is $70. I think you could get it at the vets cheaper than that.

Another good antibiotic for a respiratory infection of unknown cause would be doxycycline. It has a very broad spectrum and targets a lot of the atypical causes of respiratory issues. I don't have any because I sent out all that I had and it's not a drug I keep after it expires.

I would definitely keep these squirrels separated.

Let me know if the antibiotics arrive tomorrow. If Grayson's nose appears infected from the 'wound'??? we could stack the Clavamox with the Azithromycin.

By the way, Azithromycin is the antibiotic in a Z-pak. If anyone you know has a left over pill we could dose it. There usually aren't any left over though because the pack has only 5 or 6 pills.

You might get lucky on this. I read that a 3 day course might be enough. If that was the case you might have enough to treat both squirrels or at least get you started.

I think I might actually have a couple Azithromycin tablets. Let me check.

[Coffeeculturegvl]

Oh good grief!!! I thought this was a wounded nose and a punctured palate.

If Miney hadn't shown up this evening with similar symptoms, I would have continued thinking the same!

My head's spinning it keeps changing so much.

I'm worried how I'm going to continue caring for THREE of them, two very ill, when I'm going to be in a post-surgical oxycodone coma and barely mobile 7 days from now.

So, I have 6 days to get these two babies at least healthy enough they'll just need feeding and pray Nugget doesn't catch this.

And I'll throw this out there....
Could this illness be deliberately caused by a toxin or chemical? My husband voiced the concern over our crazy, squirrel hating/threatening neighbor. That would present more with foaming, seizures, imbalance, etc, right?

[HRT4SQRLS]

And I'll throw this out there....
Could this illness be deliberately caused by a toxin or chemical? My husband voiced the concern over our crazy, squirrel hating/threatening neighbor. That would present more with foaming, seizures, imbalance, etc, right?

Uhmm, then there is THAT. Mr Wonderful. That is very concerning. Is it possible that the black noses are dried, bloody noses?
Rat poisons are anticoagulants that cause bleed outs. I sure hope this is not rat poison.

[HRT4SQRLS]

That thought is really bothering me. I reread your thread and yesterday you posted that it appeared Grayson was dying.... nearing the end. He was clearly acutely ill. Now I'm beginning to wonder. If he was poisoned, falling from the trees could certainly have caused all this face/mouth damage.

Just to be sure, I would definitely spend some time outside tomorrow observing the wilds and looking for other 'sick' squirrels. The though, sickens me!!!

[Coffeeculturegvl]

Uhmm, then there is THAT. Mr Wonderful. That is very concerning. Is it possible that the black noses are dried, bloody noses?
Rat poisons are anticoagulants that cause bleed outs. I sure hope this is not rat poison.

Yes. The black mucus scabs have dried blood in them. They arent noticeably bleeding from the noses, though. Just look like snot-noses, and the black scabs are slow accumulations.

What about their white pus-like goopy eyes? Grayson's stopped doing that after a couple days.

Is there a tox-screen to rule it out? Is there any specific treatment?

I don't even have the words to describe the rage I feel right now just suspecting he's responsible.

[TubeDriver]

[HRT4SQRLS]

Yes. The black mucus scabs have dried blood in them. They arent noticeably bleeding from the noses, though. Just look like snot-noses, and the black scabs are slow accumulations.

What about their white pus-like goopy eyes? Grayson's stopped doing that after a couple days.

Is there a tox-screen to rule it out? Is there any specific treatment?

I don't even have the words to describe the rage I feel right now just suspecting he's responsible.

The 'white pus-like goopy eyes' could be white years. Squirrels have white tears as a result of pain or other health issues. The nose calamity would certainly have been enough to cause white tears.

We can't get ahead of ourself here but I'm not ready to say it's not possible. The treatment for rat poison is Vitamin K injections to reverse the anticoagulant effects. My mom's dog gobbled down a rat poison block once. The vet gave Vitamin K injections.

I'm not sure about tox-screens. I think if you start seeing dying or dead squirrels around your property you'll have a pretty high suspicion. Let's not suspect the worse just yet.

From your description, it sounds like Grayson might be turning the corner and getting better.

[Coffeeculturegvl]

The 'white pus-like goopy eyes' could be white years. Squirrels have white tears as a result of pain or other health issues.

From your description, it sounds like Grayson might be turning the corner and getting better.

The vet didn't say anything about white tears. His explanation was the lacrimal ducts connect with the nose. They see a few pet squirrels at UF but in general, they're the rare patient. His take sounds like a best guess now. Thank you for explaining.

Grayson is more alert when awake in general now, thank goodness, but he's lost an alarming amount of weight and still sleeps 99% of the time. His abscess is healing, his breathing is much better, and I don't feel anymore like he could die at any moment, though I'm watching him very closely.

To answer an earlier question, I'm NOT sleeping much :/

[Coffeeculturegvl]

Just to be sure, I would definitely spend some time outside tomorrow observing the wilds and looking for other 'sick' squirrels.

I already noticed one young female who developed the white tears. I didn't notice any black around her nose, but she's always around and I'll watch her. The vet on call at UF said it sounded like an outbreak. While scary, that's preferable to deliberate poisoning.
Trust me, I'll be scrutinizing every fuzzy butt that comes around.
Maybe it's a good idea not to feed the wilds for awhile to avoid them congregating here. I usually have 6-10 at a time every time I open my window.

[redwuff]

I already noticed one young female who developed the white tears. I didn't notice any black around her nose, but she's always around and I'll watch her. The vet on call at UF said it sounded like an outbreak. While scary, that's preferable to deliberate poisoning.
Trust me, I'll be scrutinizing every fuzzy butt that comes around.
Maybe it's a good idea not to feed the wilds for awhile to avoid them congregating here. I usually have 6-10 at a time every time I open my window.

If this is a contagious agent like bordatella, it is already too late to stop congregating to have any effect on spread. They need all the easy support they can get with high quality food and fresh water.

This does not present like a poisoning. Like I mentioned in post #3, I had a release a few years ago that presented just like your boy. UDoWhat had seen a horrific outbreak of something that had killed over 100 babies at the biggest center in Maryland. Marty lost 8 out of 11 babies she had. She had 3 necropsy done and bordatella was confirmed in all cases. So when my release came back with his symptoms, she strongly suspected bordatella and I started on a 21 day course of doxycycline and Baytril. He was re- released w/out further complications.

[Jennefer]

[U]Do you guys experience bortatella down there?
[.

Redwuff...we do have bordetella doen here in Florida. I havent heard of any outbreaks in the news lately. It usually doesnt make the news like rabies cases unless its at a dog shelter or daycare & has affected a mass amount of dogs. Which has happened. I can tell you its state law to have dogs vaccinated for bordetella if you are boarding or sending to dog daycare or any training. They also highly recommend it if your dog goes to dog parks. First thing dog places ask for down here is proof of bordetella vaccine or titters. You cant get thru the doors without it. Almost more focused on it more so than rabies. I have a friend that does dog rescues & theyve had dogs with bordetella before.

[Jennefer]

The vet didn't say anything about white tears. His explanation was the lacrimal ducts connect with the nose. They see a few pet squirrels at UF but in general, they're the rare patient. His take sounds like a best guess now. Thank you for explaining.

Grayson is more alert when awake in general now, thank goodness, but he's lost an alarming amount of weight and still sleeps 99% of the time. His abscess is healing, his breathing is much better, and I don't feel anymore like he could die at any moment, though I'm watching him very closely.

To answer an earlier question, I'm NOT sleeping much :/

Glad to hear Grayson is more alert. You however, make sure your getting your sleep....esp if your having surgery in a week. You dont want to go in exhausted & depleted. Schedule out their meds, let them rest & you rest when they rest! Like my husband tells me....let those babies have some alone time, they dont need you hovering all day (which i do...i get much of nothing done when im all over them). But seriously, you need to be in good shape in order to take care of them, so make yourself a priority as well. you have our support! Hang in there.

[Mel1959]

Is there a test for bortadella?

[Coffeeculturegvl]

So far, friends have offered
Augmentin and Cephalexin if either of those will help.
I can also get single capsules of antibiotic at my local Feed and Seed. I think it's amoxicillin. I'll have to ask.

[Coffeeculturegvl]

Miney's nostrils were a bit more clogged up this am, but not as bad as I predicted. She is pretty mucus-y and raw around one nostril and the small black areas she still has (didnt want to rub too much unnecessarily) DO have a bit of a "hamburgery" texture. She tolerates the wiping and suctioning well, thank goodness.
Grayson isn't much better than yesterday's "better." He was totally clogged and mouth breathing this morning but wasn't as difficult to clear his nose to move air.

Am I looking at the real possibility of bordatella and perhaps death despite treatment?

And is it that transmissible I should start Nugget on AB immediately, or is squirrel bordatella a virus and just has to run it's course?

Sorry for all the questions.

[Coffeeculturegvl]

Are azithromycin tablets still stable and effective 5-6months AFTER expiration? A friend has 250mg tablets expired Jan this year.

[Jennefer]

Is there a test for bortadella?

My dog rescue friend is saying there is no test. They go off symptoms, if its a bad case they do chest xray & bloodwork. They can do a culture but treat in meantime b/c it takes awhile to grow. They use doxycycline & baytril like redwuff said her guy took.

Im not sure abt your antibiotic questions...which is why i didnt answer them...hopefully someone that knows will answer soon. Didnt want u to think i was ignoring them.

[cava]

I have Doxy. Someone tell her what she needs exactly and I'll help out.