I thought I replied to this last night but maybe it didn't go through. That's great advice thank you. I heard that some rehabbers will treat for coccidia as part of routine protocol. Do you think I should go ahead and try to give him another dose of the baycox? This morning he seems to be acting like his usual self again, so I'm wondering if the lethargy was diet related (maybe too much fruit, or just too much in general) however his stools are still loose. I'm adding probiotics to two out of four of his daily formula feedings and I am about to go to the store to get some kaopectate to try so I'll give it till at least tomorrow to see if there's a change. But I'm curious how people feel about treating him for the coccidia anyways
I'm not a person who typically shoves meds into a squirrel out of precaution.
They are too delicate in my opinon, and unnecessary most of the time.
Before I tried any drugs on this little one, I would try the
BRAT diet.
(Partial) Brat Formula Mix
3 tablespoons (already) mixed formula 2-1
1/2 tsp baby rice powered cereal
1/2 tsp banana baby food.
I have had great results with BRAT.
Do this for a couple of days and see if this helps.
I've had good luck using about 2-3 drops of Pepto
Bismol, if the BRAT diet doesn't resolve the issue.
Oh I see now there's a second page! Thank you I will try it! I guess I'm stressing about the coccidia because he seems to be growing and gaining weight very slowly. I just don't want him to be at a disadvantage when he's released but I agree with you about administering unnecessary meds.
Nancy in New York (04-27-2017)
When one is rehabbing 10, 20, 30, I can understand their thoughts on treating as they come through the door as all it takes is one contagious to spread to them all and giving individual time to one waiting to see what symptoms may appear may not be feasible for them when dealing with so many. I personally am not one to use hard medications on my babies without knowing there is a specific need and will choose quarantine over medicating before I'd need to start any medication that may not be necessary. I just don't believe in doing it! Diarreha/loose bowels are pretty common place with these babies having to deal with their stress, new formula, humans, etc. However, if one has a severely compromised baby dehydrated, not gaining or losing grams you throw the book at them to get them over the hump because it becomes life threatening and that's a whole different scenario.
That's just my personal thought on the subject. How one rehabs is their own individual judgement. In saying that, I'm not one to jump on the Coccidia, Giardia, tapeworm or other parasite bandwagon just because I may be dealing with diarrhea or loose bowels.
I'm not suspecting or seeing that here but I'm not handling your squirrel either. If your going to treat for Coccidia you need to go a full course of the medication, your not going to see results with sporadic dosing.
As far as using kaopectate my method has been at least 3 doses, 6 hours apart, stimulate after feeding and carefully watch the bowel consistency. With KO the poo is black and one can tell if it's in or still in the system, when formed, solid enough to pick up although still "wet" I stop the KO and wait to see if (poo) improves or starts to regress with the KO leaving their system. If improving I stop KO and give extra hydration, if regressing I dose again. Have not had to do the sequence so far more then twice. One does have to be careful they don't go from diarrhea to constipation. The baby I mentioned I used the gas-x for was fussy at feeding, normally eager. I looked and could see it's stomach was not completely down from it's last feeding, that's where the gas-x came in and did it's job. I did not give it any more KO as baby needed to poop and boy did it and they were nicely formed. Again, through stimulation.
The partial Brat diet as mentioned by Nancy is also a very good alternative to try that many have had excellent results from including myself and it's all natural, no harsh chemicals. I usually suggest one gives it at least 3 days feedings to start seeing wanted results of nice formed poo's. Depending on the squirrel and it's severity it can happen sooner, sometimes takes a little longer.
Pepto Bismol is another antidiarrheal that many use /have used.
Step-N-Stone
State Licensed
Wildlife Master Rehabilitator
Russell how much KO did you use?
The book only doses Imodium
and I'm not sure if that dose would also apply to KO.
Thanks.
With the pepto, again, I don't see it in the WMB book but
I've heard depending on weight a couple of drops for younger
a couple more for older.
Recetly I had to dose and I used a couple of drops,
and it worked perfectly.
Admittedly I have dosed it by 0.0003 per body weightOriginally Posted by Nancy in New York;1215439[SIZE=3
Dr. Bricker doses it by 0.0002 per body weight.
My bad.
Step-N-Stone
State Licensed
Wildlife Master Rehabilitator
Nancy in New York (04-27-2017)
stepnstone (04-27-2017)
That's great advice I really appreciate it. I should have posted on here sooner, a lot of the information on the internet is outdated or unreliable. That makes sense about treating multiple squirrels. I just hated to think that he was suffering and I was withholding treatment, if that makes sense. I think my concerns about his weight also might have pushed me to give him too much food too soon, he might just be a runt because he seems proportionate, not like he's starving, but judging from other squirrels his age 120gs seems smaller than the average. I removed the fruits and veggies for now and added probiotics to every other feeding of formula. He woke up today and was acting his usual playful self which was a relief so I gave him a squirrel block between breakfast and lunch but that'll probably be it for solid food today. Gave him some kao this morning and about to again soon but I will definitely try some of the suggestions mentioned and I'll update later. Thanks again!
You're so right and I'm totally seeing that now. There's definitely an emotional burden keeping these guys, you feel so responsible for their fate that you want to do everything you can to help them, which sometimes might be too much. I wanted to help his development along, especially because they grow so quick and I was worried he wasn't keeping up, but he's still a baby. Patience is key, thanks for the reminder
Overfeeding and or feeding the wrong formula covers a huge majority of digestive and intestinal issues we see on this board.
An "average" weight is based on a healthy uncompromised squirrel, it serves as a guide to detect expected weight according to age.
I have raised runts that blew up to be brutes and petite babies that grew up to be petite adults. Regardless of size, healthy is the goal.
Step-N-Stone
State Licensed
Wildlife Master Rehabilitator
RuSquirrel (04-27-2017), Spanky (04-27-2017)
Just to check in, Rufio is acting his usual self again but he hasn't had a single poop today. He had 4 formula feedings today, a squirrel block this morning that he didn't quite finish andI only gave him two doses of the Kao since he hadn't pooped yet I thought that might be too much? You mentioned stimulating him but he hasn't let me stimulate him for close to two weeks now.. he gets really upset if I try to pick him up (he's ok with perching on my hand like a bird but he doesn't like when my hand is wrapped around him). I used to just wrap him up like a little burrito and he loved it but not anymore, and he hasn't really needed the help so I stopped although I try to help wipe his bum every once in a while which he protests then cowers. So not sure if stimulating is required but I'm not sure the best way to go about it without stressing him too much. I bought some gas x liquid gels, do you just drain the liquid from those? Sounded like the dosing measurements above were liquid. I just gave him some pedialyte, a little over 1ccs before he lost interest so I will wait until morning to give him the gas x if he doesn't go by then.
Do not use the liquid gels, they are concentrated and aimed for adults. I'm sorry I didn't specify but what you want is infants gas relief, it's a flavored liquid.
Anytime OTC meds are purchased for a squirrel you want infant or children's, never adult concentration.
If your little is going on it's own check his bedding for poops so you know what the consistency is. With taking the KO his would be black. I would not give anymore KO unless you can see by the poops if it's needed. As long as your little is not bloating and still eating normally there should be no need for giving a gas relief.
Step-N-Stone
State Licensed
Wildlife Master Rehabilitator
Mel1959 (04-28-2017)
There was one tiny little smear of poop on his blanket this morning. I can't find any other poop at all in his cage just pee. He doesn't seem bloated and he ate enthusiastically but he usually poops pretty often so I'm wondering if he's a little condtipated now. Should I just give him a little more time to work it out? I'll grab some infants gas x while I'm out just in case. I haven't given him any more kaopectate, just the two doses yesterday. I bought the adult kao though, maybe it was too concentrated
Without being able to monitor his poops through stimulation using the KO kind of bothers me.
I'd let the KO get through his system offer extra hydration as much as he will take and flush
this out, then if the loose bowels persist use the partial Brat diet with his formula. It's a safer
alternative since you can't stimulate and watch the poops. The last thing we want to do is go
the other way and back him up.
Step-N-Stone
State Licensed
Wildlife Master Rehabilitator
Mel1959 (04-30-2017)
I noticed he was hunched over like he was trying to push so i tried to stimulate him with a qtip and he held still long enough to remove a dried piece of poo that seemed to be blocking the exit then pooped three good sized turds, the first two were well formed and the third was a little loose so instead of giving him any more Kao I think I will switch to the brat diet for a few days. Thanks for all you help I will update if anything changes
Mel1959 (04-30-2017)
Just thought I'd update. I'm on day 3 of the brat diet and Rufio's poops are really watery. Not solid at all. Still giving him probiotics and trying to give him fluids but he's not interested in pedialyte right now but he drinks from his bottle in his cage occasionally. He's in good spirits but not as playful as usual. I guess I'll just continue on the brat diet and see if anything changes, I just feel bad for him
I think if you are still seeing watery poop with the BRAT diet after 3 days, you should probably redoes with kaopectate or Pepto Bismol. NINY recommended 2-3 drops of Pepto. Try coconut water for hydration.
I hope Rufio gets better soon.