Release Day Encouragement?

[gunpackingrandma]

It IS harder than the round-the-clock feedings, I agree. And I believe that the feelings and sentiments posted here across the board with just about everyone I think. So many people are saying yes that's the way I feel yes that's the way I feel so I think it may be a Universal emotion for us rehabbers. When my babies were still babies, I got a phone call about a squirrel nest coming down in my neighborhood so I rushed over with my incubator box only to find out that they were four 3 week old Flyers. I knew I couldn't take care of two different species at the same time. I was already dubious as to whether I could bring even more greyso in.. So I contacted a local rehabber who specializes in flyers and turned them over to her. I felt kind of sad, but also relieved. It is a lot of work when they're babies. And being a first-time rehabber, I was so uncertain and scared and did so much research because I didn't want to make any mistakes. Very stressful but so very rewarding.
I also made excuses as to why I couldn't move them onto the screen enclosure on the porch. I made lots and lots of excuses about not letting them go in the winter even though I'm in Florida. I just didn't see enough green sprigs of stuff to feel comfortable with that. I made excuses on whether to put them outside. I made excuses why we didn't have the time to take the enclosure down and put it back together outside. Excuses excuses excuses. So I completely understand where you're coming from. But your heart is probably telling you it needs to be done. So just do it. I think you'll feel a little bit better that you're one step closer to the goal of letting them run free. I also have three dogs, three cats, one child at home, and a husband, and a business to run. It was always something that took priority but my guilt level won out. I knew it had to be done and when I posted here it gave me the courage to do what I had put off for so long. But it's the right thing, because I know they're happier. One other thing, we also have a couple of owls in our neighborhood as well as Hawks. My husband told me that if you're outside with a flashlight, it will interfere with the owls ability to hunt. So you being out there may look strange to your neighbors, but it's good good thing for your Flyers. There are a lot of people on this board who have a lot more experience than I do, but I think we all share the same emotional upheaval when it comes time to release. From my experience, this is a wealth of information as well as support.
I don't know where you are in Florida, but if you're anywhere near Gainesville, I'd like to extend the offer to help you finish that RC cage. I'm pretty handy with tools. And again if anyone wants to get together and talk squirrel the invitation is wide open. You can never have too many friends anyway.

Two of my children still live in Gainesville after graduation. Would love to met and swap squirrel stories next time I'm in town. Should be back around football season!!! Die hard Gator fan...Lol!

[BCChins]

Good Luck at your DRS appointment.

I am wondering if sugar is better then vinegar.
So I would maybe buy some Dunkin Donut holes and ask the parents if the kids can have them. Then ask if you can please talk civilly and maybe come to an agreement.
Try to give them a quick overview of raising babies and maybe the kids can learn about them the next time you hand raise them.

I am not usually one to try to rationalize with stupid this is my first thought >>
But if you want to release them in your area this might be the only way.
I would also really consider the offer made to release them in a safe place.

[Mel1959]

[Mel1959]

Good Luck at your DRS appointment.

I am wondering if sugar is better then vinegar.
So I would maybe buy some Dunkin Donut holes and ask the parents if the kids can have them. Then ask if you can please talk civilly and maybe come to an agreement.
Try to give them a quick overview of raising babies and maybe the kids can learn about them the next time you hand raise them.

I am not usually one to try to rationalize with stupid this is my first thought >>
But if you want to release them in your area this might be the only way.
I would also really consider the offer made to release them in a safe place.

If you decide to talk to them you might point out that you didn't SEEK OUT these babies to raise. You did it because it was needed and the RIGHT thing to do. This is a lesson that has great value for their children. Selfless acts don't happen nearly often enough in our society.

[Coffeeculturegvl]

Two of my children still live in Gainesville after graduation. Would love to met and swap squirrel stories next time I'm in town. Should be back around football season!!! Die hard Gator fan...Lol!

Sounds like a plan!! Go Gators (and squirrels)!

[Snow White]

I am so impressed by your set up. You have definitely set the bar high. I bet they will have a hard time leaving it.
Good luck!

[Snicker Bar]

Just read this whole update...and remember the first heartbreaking chapter. Gave me goosebumps , but so happy all is going well. What amazing stories you ALL have; I'm completley convinced I better stick with helping permanently handicapped babies; I don't think I could be as strong as you folks, ever!! But glad people like you are there; for me to hand over the care of healthy candidates for release, when they come along

[Coffeeculturegvl]

Basic update:
A former employee of mine is anot acquaintance of my neighbors and offered to connect with them and see if she couldn't find out why they are being so antagonistic.
Bottom line, they misrepresented themselves to her and minimized or failed to mention our (positive) accommodations we've afforded them recently.

A friend came up with the idea of purchasing a natural, organic squirrel repellant FOR them as an offering for compromise. What a great idea!

But the problem is, it's not REALLY the squirrels which are the problem. They just don't like us for some reason, and saw an opportunity to antagonize us (me.)
And I realize now, I actually offered up the information inadvertently regarding squirrels fear of owls when he took issue with my double disco ball to scare them away the first night of their release, when 2 were without shelter. I had it on for the time it took to walk across the yard and ask my husband if he thought it was too obnoxious. It kind of was, which is why I didn't put up any argument at all turning it off.
Two days later, an impressively realistic owl shows up.
They aren't going to respond to sugar, I'm almost convinced. I will try the repellant idea anyway.
Does anyone have recommendations for brand/effectiveness/suitability around children and pets?
And will that work to keep them out of HIS yard alone, r will the deterrent scent bleed over into adjacent yards?

Constructive options are welcome. I fear I can't take too much longer delaying a re-release location decision.

[missPixy]

believe it or not I just went to a Negotiation for Executives seminar, and in difficult situations like this where there's really no more trust, one of the successful techniques is to enlist a third party to negotiate for you instead. This one tactic alone can greatly change the tone of the conversation.

your acquaintance might be able to start with them on a "clean slate" (especially if they do it over coffee, for example) and chat about what their true issues are. this is a way to identify how to come to a possible agreement, when you have a better understanding of what is bothering them and ways that bother might be soothed.

in planning for a negotiation, knowing as much about the other party~~ what they would love, what they would like, what they would live with, what they would never accept~~ these are all important details that would be great for your acquaintance to uncover (of course not asking them point blank in such a clinical way, but in a more conversational tone) so that you can prepare your own list of how to respond to each of these.

[Coffeeculturegvl]

Around 8 o'clock this evening while I'm working furiously on the squirrel enclosure building an anteroom so that they won't escape now that they've tasted freedom (and are actively trying to eacape) and trying to finish up as its getting dark, my neighbor had the audacity to come to the fence and ask me to stop. I said you've got to be kidding me after what you did to me the other day. You kind of forced my hand here anyway. I'm doing this because of what you did and said. He got really angry and said he was going to call the cops. We practically handed him our phones because we looked up the noise ordinance, what decibel levels were allowed, and at what times. We were not breaking noise ordinance. He got pretty upset that we knew about that but continued to b****. My husband told him that we didn't want to talk to him and he should get off of our fence. He kept at it and then he made a comment about our son being in jail and Michael lost it and told him that he was finished speaking with him, he needed to leave and get off of our fence again and informed him that he was starting to video record. Interestingly, he suddenly became concilatory but I was livid and let him know exactly how I felt. Again, I'm embarrassed because there I was crying again and upset but I told him I'd never been treated by a neighbor like that. I still couldn't understand why he wouldn't even enter into reasonable conversation and reach a mutually acceptable solution. But if he thought that I was going to stop working and accommodate his request again as I had every other time he asked me to do/not do something, he was sorely mistaken, ESPECIALLY considering what the task at hand was. Said I honestly wasnt inclined to do ANYTHING out of consideration because he couldn't extend the same courtesy in return. I told him all I wanted was a resolution to the matter but it seemed like he wasn't even considering that. And so this was the result of his actions. He was destroying what was otherwise a relatively peaceful relationship and just look how things are at this very moment. Said i didnt want that, but I also wasn't going to roll over and kowtow to his demands. At one point, before Michael started to videotape, I threw his own rationale back in his face because he told me the other day something like "well you chose to have squirrels and you have to deal with the consequences of letting them go." So when he tells me that the noise is keeping his child awake (it's only 8pm) and that he'd already TOLD me his room was right there I said "Well, you chose to have children so I guess you'll just have to accept the consequences. Now, isn't that as ridiculous as what you were saying to me? But I told you your owl was terrorizing my squirrels and you said Good! I WANT them to be afraid" (yes, I know, that was extreme and unhelpful)
He yelled f*** you. Not surprising. I admit, that wasn't my most shining moment. But that was the level of frustration that I felt. He needed to know how unreasonable he was being. He needed to hear it illustrated. But, despite my anger and telling him exactly what I thought, what I ultimately want was a positive outcome. Not one where he does what I want, or vice versa, but a solution where we're all ok with the outcome. So I switched gears and tried to squash the volatility by appealing again to him to end this negativity and just TALK to us. Said I would LOVE to be able to sit down and talk with them and us both feel safe releasing my squirrels again. He agreed to meet this weekend. He apologized for making me feel bad. He said he wasnt going to hurt my squirrels. He pointed out that he took the owl down. I admitted i hadnt noticed because Ive been mostly out of town, but thanked him for that.
I think I almost heard sincerity in his voice....and well, he DID take the owl down. That's a measureable gesture on his part. We'll see. He may have just been speaking for the camera. I hope that's not the case, and I'll give him the benefit of the doubt until this weekend.
He mentioned getting contacted by our mutual friend. Maybe the third party idea, which is what I was trying in fact, worked to an extent.
It wasn't resolution, but maybe just maybe, we're getting somewhere.

[Mel1959]

Oh, I really hope he comes around and you can have a civil conversation this weekend. . I can empathize with your frustration. I think most of us would have "lost it"....I know I would have. . This guy sounds like a piece of work. Removing the owl was certainly a step in the right direction. I'll be thinking about you this weekend and keep my fingers crossed.

[HRT4SQRLS]

Whoa .... I'm not sure I could handle this. This guy has some serious mental issues. I would worry about my own safety living next to a lose cannon like this. In my heart, I always want to take the 'high road' but in this case it sure would be hard. This is WAY more than squirrels. He wants to control you like a puppet.

I hope the meeting goes well but I have serious reservations about it. People like that scare me.

[BCChins]

I am hoping for a good out come for you all.
I would be very Leary of this dude. He sound's like a nut ball.

[Coffeeculturegvl]

Our mutual friend is messaging me after talking with the wife a bit. Seems she's both unaware the seriousness of the situation and how he's talking to me/us. How he's under a tremendous amount of unusual stress right now and how one of his kids has Sensory Processing Disorder. It brings some of his Daddy Bear behavior into focus. If I can just ease his mind in regards to the danger the squirrels pose to his kids, I might have a chance here.

Does anyone have relevant information (statistical would be best, but anything "objective" will probably help) they will provide that I can present to him tomorrow about how rehabs interact with humans post-release? I have minimized their exposure to anyone outside the family, am the primary food provider, am the only one who handles them or goes into their cage while they're awake. I've kept exposure to the dogs limited to seeing g them pass by on the way outdoors and keeping them in a separately fenced areally away from the RC. They tolerate human presence, obviously, and aren't spooked so easy like wild squirrels. That was unavoidable. But I can't imagine a 6 and 3year old would be able to grab one of them and get bit. Or have one of them jump on them. Same time tho, I'd like to be confident of what I tell him.

I forgot about a comment he made as we were wrapping up on a more congenial note last night.
He said "maybe during our conversation this weekend my wife could teach you a few things about rehabbing squirrels."
She's a vet, but she told me some weeks ago, when I approached her with a general animal health question, that she doesnt early know much about squirrels!!!

[redwuff]

I will be praying for a positive outcome from your meeting.

[Mel1959]

I'm definitely NOT the one to give experiences of released squirrels and how they don't interact with people once they're released, because mine do. it's my fault and luckily I don't have any nutty neighbors. I do have neighbors next door and across the street with little kids, though.

[awolf]

What type of squirrels do you typically care for?

[Coffeeculturegvl]

They are Eastern Greys. My first.

What type of squirrels do you typically care for?

[Snow White]

Oh my goodness! I just read the whole story. Sounds like you need lawyer repellent, not squirrel repellent. I would hate to have a neighbor like that. Having a special needs child does not excuse this behavior. He sounds like a bully. Now that you have stood up to him, maybe he will back down.
Is moving an option? If not, maybe he and his wife would agree to a meeting. Maybe you can get him to admit to the real issue and you can find some common grounds.
Good luck.

[Coffeeculturegvl]

In an ironic twist to this drama, my husband saved one of their turtles today who escaped and was headed down the road.
He returned it to their house and they were very appreciative.
Supposedly, we were going to meet this weekend. I thought sometime today.
They said nothing about talking. My husband didn't bring it up, either though.