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Thread: MBD Question

  1. #1
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    Default MBD Question

    I have been working at a wildlife clinic for a number of years. I have been given a squirrel to release and in the chart it was noted possible MBD. The squirrels back leg quivers and the squirrel when running does not use the leg very much. I asked the person in charge to examine and possibly not release the animal, but I was told that it will not get any better and if we hold onto the squirrel much longer we will have to over winter. I'm sorry I do not know alot about MBD and am trying to see if maybe I over winter and feed properly will I be able to release in the spring. I saw on Henry's healthy blocks they have a MBD kit that helps them. Would this be a good treatment or is it hopeless for the squirrel? How do I know for sure its MBD? I do not know the story of who fostered the squirrel and he is a spring or later, baby I think. Both back legs were wrapped with vet tape for a number of weeks and then placed outside for 6 days and given to me to release. He weighs 512 grams. I have seen no seizures, but I have not spent time with him until today when I went in my enclosure and watched him. Is this condition systemic? Please help!

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    Default Re: MBD Question

    Quote Originally Posted by slee View Post
    I have been working at a wildlife clinic for a number of years. I have been given a squirrel to release and in the chart it was noted possible MBD. The squirrels back leg quivers and the squirrel when running does not use the leg very much. I asked the person in charge to examine and possibly not release the animal, but I was told that it will not get any better and if we hold onto the squirrel much longer we will have to over winter. I'm sorry I do not know alot about MBD and am trying to see if maybe I over winter and feed properly will I be able to release in the spring. I saw on Henry's healthy blocks they have a MBD kit that helps them. Would this be a good treatment or is it hopeless for the squirrel? How do I know for sure its MBD? I do not know the story of who fostered the squirrel and he is a spring or later, baby I think. Both back legs were wrapped with vet tape for a number of weeks and then placed outside for 6 days and given to me to release. He weighs 512 grams. I have seen no seizures, but I have not spent time with him until today when I went in my enclosure and watched him. Is this condition systemic? Please help!
    If mbd it does not sound like he had proper treatment from the beginning and
    especially with being told to release him while he's still in a compromised condition.
    He'd just become prey, he wouldn't last a week!
    It is in his best interst to be over wintered, proper treating the mbd could very well improve mobility.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: MBD Question

    wow, I dont know what to say. Its great you are doing this but releasing him right now is not a good idea. If he has MBD it takes along time to recoop and then he should be monitored to make sure there are no long term effects. I dont understand why his leggs were wrapped, but if they were, how is his climbing ?? and if he is I would say he shouldnt because his bones may still be too weak.
    We will need more info on him, his age and his diet. Hopefully some one who knows alot more than will come on with some in put.
    so glad you have him and are asking questions .!!!!

    Simon's video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mzpwo0r35l0

    “Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened.”
    ― Anatole France

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    Default Re: MBD Question

    good, I was hoping stepstone was around, thank you.
    He knows........

    Simon's video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mzpwo0r35l0

    “Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened.”
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  5. #5
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    Default Re: MBD Question

    I really don't understand why his back legs were wrapped in vet tape,
    what did that hope to accomplish ??

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    Default Re: MBD Question

    slee, without knowing why this squirrel's legs were wrapped it's very hard to make a good diagnosis. Did they see his legs getting weak (possibly from MBD)_ and wrapped them for that reason? Were they injured, and they wrapped them to set bone or stabilize? Either way, I'll bet his leg quivers because the muscles are still weak from the wrapping, and from whatever caused them to BE wrapped. How does his back look? Any bumps or irregularities that would signify a fracture?

    I would definitely overwinter this guy. Sound nutrition -- especially the MBD kit and Henry's Healthy Blocks, will put him on the road to good health. He is absolutely "hawk lunch" if he goes out now, as stepnstone already said. We're here to answer any and all questions about diet for him -- start in the Nutrition Forum and we're right here with you!
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    Default Re: MBD Question

    Quote Originally Posted by island rehabber View Post
    slee, without knowing why this squirrel's legs were wrapped it's very hard to make a good diagnosis. Did they see his legs getting weak (possibly from MBD)_ and wrapped them for that reason? Were they injured, and they wrapped them to set bone or stabilize? Either way, I'll bet his leg quivers because the muscles are still weak from the wrapping, and from whatever caused them to BE wrapped. How does his back look? Any bumps or irregularities that would signify a fracture?

    I would definitely overwinter this guy. Sound nutrition -- especially the MBD kit and Henry's Healthy Blocks, will put him on the road to good health. He is absolutely "hawk lunch" if he goes out now, as stepnstone already said. We're here to answer any and all questions about diet for him -- start in the Nutrition Forum and we're right here with you!


    Do you actually have him or just thinking of taking this on?
    If your thinking about it, can do, then do it! Please!
    This boy needs individual help and as IR indicated,
    we'll be right here beside you and do everything to
    help you through it.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: MBD Question

    Here is the proper nutrition guide:

    http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/s...(Revised-2-13)

    Without a proper diet, MBD is exceedingly common. What has been his history in this regard?

    If it is MBD, the treatment kit is good, but for now, here is our standard protocol:

    http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/s...-Disease-(MBD)

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    Default Re: MBD Question

    I have the squirrel in one of my enclosures. I have fostered and released a lot of squirrels and have never seen MBD, I have heard of it and always feed properly. I have a print out from the sq brd of what to feed. I have taken one to the clinic where I work because you don't even want to know what they want to feed the squirrels, that is another subject. Over the years I have not always been happy with the clinic in how they do things for the animals. Not all foster moms do a good job of fostering, that is another subject also. I will try and look into his chart more and find out what I can. The legs were not broke, not sure why they were wrapped. Earlier in the chart it was noted MBD for front leg(s). We have so many animals at the clinic it is hard to know everything about every animal and I love squirrels. When I saw the squirrel and wanted someone to look at him and was told to release anyway and then today when I saw him having trouble getting around I knew I couldn't release him and yes, I said the same thing he will not survive long. I have another sq and I was to release both of them, but he is fine. I didn't want to separate them and release each alone, but I guess I will. I will look at his back and try to feel for anything not normal. He is very afraid and does run when I approach. I have henry's block and have already started giving him those and some calcium chews. I will house him alone so he can have his special food to himself. Just another horror story; a few years back I was given a sq with malocclusion to release, I was told her teeth would straighten out or that is how the xrays looked anyway and if she kept them short by chewing, yeah right. I stay at this clinic because I want to help the animals, but yet I get burnt out from the heart ache and bad things the clinic does. I buy food every week to take for the animals and buy mazuri rodent block because the vet will not buy it as often as she should, she wants to feed expired rodent chow. Thank you for your help and support and I will let you know more when and if I can find out more.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: MBD Question

    Thanks for helping out all these guys! Sounds like they really need it. That place could learn a thing or two about proper compassion from you!

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    Default Re: MBD Question

    He everyone, I went to the clinic and went through the sqs chart and here is what I found out. He came to us early august at 100g, not sure if fostered out by chart, was placed in outside enclosure at 369g. 10-17-13 Ankles and 2 toes were fx, almost severed off (I call that broke that fx). I bet he was caught in the door as someone was shutting the door, this has happened before but it was the head and the sq was was ok with a few days rest inside. Possible MBD - front leg - radius and ulna abnormally contorted. On baytril and clav, this was dcont 11-10, placed outside again 11-19 and was given to me to release 11-26. I have examined his back and there are no bumps or anything that feels abnormal. He eats on all fours, does not sit up and hold food like most sqs. He holds the food on the surface he is eating on. He likes the tums from the syringe, takes it well. He moves around very clumsy and is afraid, he hasn't tried to bite me and I'm glad. He eats 2 henry blocks a day and proper food. Not eating alot. I have ordered calcium from henry's. Since he is 4 months old, do you really think he has a chance of improving and being released? Please someone with alot of experience with MBD please give me a %, I would be grateful.

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    Default Re: MBD Question

    Also, what should the highest dose of calcium be, so I don't over do it? Some days I am only to give a dose 2x a day. I have a tums in the water bowl and in the water sipper bottle.

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    Default Re: MBD Question

    Improvement can be as individual as the squirrel itself,
    it's a hard call to make if not impossible.
    Only time really has that answer...

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    Default Re: MBD Question

    You have reviewed the MBD protocol, right? You really should follow it as exactly as you can. It's really imperative that the calcium be given throughout the day to keep blood levels up. One or two big doses isn't anywhere near as beneficial as smaller consistent doses adding up to the amounts described in the protocol.

    If he isn't releasable, can he have a forever home? Btw, it takes months to fully recover, and they seem more susceptible to relapse.

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    Default Re: MBD Question

    Yes, I have read the protocol, I printed it, but I work and I am not home all day to give it all day. I read that you can give too much calcium and cause problems. One sentence says give 600-800 mg then on down it says give 500 mg per day. I want to help this squirrel and I feel the clinic should do more than put a band aid on things and then toss these animals out the door and/or give them to someone like me who simply can not release an animal that isn't ready. This very stressful for me, I'm sorry, but it is. I am to be out of town for weeks in a few weeks and I do not know what to do.

  16. #16
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    Default Re: MBD Question

    What specific questions do you have?

    Can you add calcium to their water bottle so that they can get it while you're away? Can you sprinkle it on their food that that consume through the day?

    You can OD calcium, but it's kind of hard. Underdoing it at this point is more of a concern.

  17. #17
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    Default Re: MBD Question

    A tums has been added to both the water dish and the water sipper bottle. I change the water daily cause I'm not sure what the tums will do to the water if it sits and I put another tums in the fresh water. I have ordered powdered calcium from henry's, should be here maybe tomorrow. So when I crush one tums and give the whole thing that is ok? That's what I mean is that too much in one dose? The store only had 500 mg tums but when you read the ingredients it's only 400 mg. If you have a bottle look on it, I bet all mg levels are that way. I'm scared for my 2 sqs and have added a tums in their water bowls. What is a good mg amount for them? They are healthy and get proper nutrition and henrys blocks daily. I've looked for the recipe to make my own blocks but have not found it yet. I'm sorry I stressed.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: MBD Question

    Quote Originally Posted by slee View Post
    A tums has been added to both the water dish and the water sipper bottle. I change the water daily cause I'm not sure what the tums will do to the water if it sits and I put another tums in the fresh water. I have ordered powdered calcium from henry's, should be here maybe tomorrow. So when I crush one tums and give the whole thing that is ok? That's what I mean is that too much in one dose? The store only had 500 mg tums but when you read the ingredients it's only 400 mg. If you have a bottle look on it, I bet all mg levels are that way. I'm scared for my 2 sqs and have added a tums in their water bowls. What is a good mg amount for them? They are healthy and get proper nutrition and henrys blocks daily. I've looked for the recipe to make my own blocks but have not found it yet. I'm sorry I stressed.

    I make home made HHB's but I have tweaked
    it to fit my needs. But if you call or email
    Leigh at Henry's she will send you the recipe
    for making your own and she is a wealth of
    good nutrition info. Leigh is in my opinion
    an angel to our squirrels.

    Please take the compromised ones and if you deem
    them nr homes can be found for them.

    Your a true squirrel hero

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    Default Re: MBD Question

    Hello everyone, please help, I feel so helpless in caring for this squirrel I have. I believe he is having seizures now. When I give him baytril he hates the smell and taste and I think being stressed over this it causes him to seizure. I just hold him until he is done. He likes the tums I am still giving him. His penis is still messed up from the squirrel that was housed with him was sucking on like they seem to do sometimes. All this times and it just will not heal. His foot bottom of the foot he drags and doesn't have much use with will not heal either. I bathe him since he pees on himself. The penis will look like its getting better but then the next day looks bad. Same with the foot, will look as though healing over but I think he drags off the clotting and I will see blood on the cage bottom. Not alot but enough I know what is happening. What else could I use besides baytril that will help him? I use vetericyn on the wounds and he just stays the same. My husband feels he should be put down. I want to help him. I feel so bad for him, he's alone, in a small cage 3x3x3, inside no sunshine except from what comes through window and that is not enough. Its too cold to go outside. What can I do???? Thank you.

  20. #20
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    Default Re: MBD Question

    I think it's been a month since we heard about this guy? What's he on ABs for? Have yo been giving him Tums all this while? He could be OD'd on calcium? What's his diet like daily?

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