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I have a pet squirrel she is around 10 months old and my daughter went to leave the house yesterday and caught her paw in the door it is very swollen and she is not using it only to balance herself or to eat something. It is evident that its only the fingers. What can I do to help her?
I'd confine her in a smaller cage for several weeks, to limit movement and help the healing process. Broken legs can be fixed with surgery put those paws and fingers are too small. Any bracing will be chewed off.
As long as she is eating, I'd not provide any pain medication. The pain will help your pet to stay off the paw. Painkillers will make them use the paw more frequently and the healing process will take longer or the broken bones may not grow together at all. Humans know that they have to be careful with a broken bone, even when they don't feel any pain, animals don't know that. Pain has a function.
There is a chance that the paw will heal with some limitations, for example reduced range of motion or joint stiffness, resulting in some issues when it comes to climbing and running. If the end result is noticeable, I'd not risk releasing your squirrel down the road. Those limitations lower their survival chances in the wild a good amount.
Pain management is detrimental to healing, reducing the inflammation reduces the swelling which causes the pain.Quote:
Originally Posted by stihl_dirty
Infant Ibuprofen (liquid) is a nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory that can be safely given. We will need a weight to dose
as all medications for squirrels are dosed by body weight.
Hi Stihl_Dirty:Quote:
Originally Posted by stihl_dirty
An x-ray study may help but this is not the easiest thing to have done on a Saturday night; or at any time for that matter! This is a crushing type of injury mechanism. If you are quite certain that it is only the fingers that are involved and no bones are visible and no wounds exist; hopefully the injury does not include a broken bone although many of the finger fractures can do quite well without immobilization. Your Squirrel is already treating her injury to the extent a Squirrel can and that is by not using the injured extremity!
To help with your Squirrel's certain discomfort and also to possibly help decrease some of the swelling; I would suggest beginning the use Over-the-Counter liquid Ibuprofen ASAP. There are a couple of formulations available. I would suggest the Infants Ibuprofen which has 50 milligrams of Ibuprofen in every 1.25 milliliters of the suspension. This medication in this particular formulation is available everywhere! The liquid in the container should be shaken well before drawing some up in a 1 cc syringe (without a needle!). For dosing of the Infants Ibuprofen Suspension It will be necessary to have a current, accurate weight of your Squirrel; preferably in Grams. It would also be best for your Squirrel to have eaten something before dosing with the Ibuprofen. What is your Squirrel's name? If you are agreeable to trying the Ibuprofen, post your Squirrel's weight and one of the Admins or others who are authorized to provide dosing instructions on The Squirrel Board will send those instructions to you via a Private Message as dosing is not done on the "Open Board." Please keep us updated on how things are going with your Little One!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel
Sorry Step; It looks like you had already posted while I was typing with my usual speed of one word every 30 seconds! Also McCarthy posted while I was slow-typing! Just a comment in response to McCarthy's post. There would be this concern IF Ibuprofen or really any pain medication would actually eliminate pain. Almost without exception except possibly for very minimal injuries, Ibuprofen will only help decrease pain intensity, NOT eliminate it. Also, Ibuprofen, as mentioned, has an antiinflammatory benefit as well and may help decrease swelling with in itself will help decrease your Squirrels discomfort and any decrease in swelling will potentially help decrease pain! I would recommend treating with the goal of relieving some of the pain!
Regards,
StS
I have more of a question than anything else to contribute but I've always been told to use Metacam to reduce swelling and it does reduce pain somewhat.
Is this not to be used in an injury 🤷
Just curious thank you 👍
Quote:
Originally Posted by stepnstone
The general idea on this board to give "every" injured or ill squirrel pain medication is wrong. I talked to 2 vets just recently, because I was taking care of a wild squirrel with the EXACT same issue of a broken paw.
I first followed the typical suggestion on this board to give infant ibuprofen, with the result that the squirrel became more active due to less pain and reduced swelling. This was a setback because on the very next day we had to start over. The paw starting to flop around again, after being used to climb and walk on it. This was also the case after lowering the dose.
I linked a video below where you can see the squirrel after the swelling was gone due to providing infant ibuprofen 2 days before. Even after getting half the amount of ibuprofen he started using that paw even though it provided zero stability to be used. Only when I stopped using ibuprofen he became careful again (as to be seen in the video), stopped using it, and we saw a healing process. 4 weeks later and it was healed. He is long released and still around.
Animals will start using an injured limb again when you lower the pain level and when joints become flexible again by reducing the swelling. The swelling has a purpose as well: it immobilized the injured joint(s). This is the equivalent of bracing, but a brace will not work in this case, so it is even more important to leave the natural reaction of swelling in place.
Both pain medication and reducing swelling is a treatment done for humans, because we understand that we can't use our injured or broken limb until it is healed. An animal goes ONLY by the pain level and flexibility of the joints surround the injury, and it will misunderstand lower pain as a healed injury. It will start using the paw, and the healing process will take longer, and the risk for complication will increase.
There is no pain medication in nature for that exact reason.
This is not a case of pain management for a chronic disease, the pain, the inflammation and the swelling are normal responses to an injury that HELP to heal in an animal. Suppressing them goes against this established natural reaction.
"Inflammation is necessary for life and is the first step in the healing or repair process that helps the body fight off bacteria, pathogens and their toxins, and repair damaged tissue."
https://www.allaboutfeed.net/animal-...aged%20tissue.
"..pain warns us of potential danger to tissue harm or to the presence of injury. This insult can be within or outside the nervous system, physical or chemical, visible or not. Although the characteristics of pain may differ, the role is still the same; pain is the body’s alert system."
https://www.dovepress.com/painful-truth-the-need-to-re-center-chronic-pain-on-the-functional-rol-peer-reviewed-fulltext-article-JPR#:~:text=Simply%2C%20pain%20warns%20us%20of,is% 20the%20body's%20alert%20system.
https://vimeo.com/718512135
And on a second note, it comes at no surprise that, in the US, every symptom needs to be treated with medication. I spent my first 3 decades in another country, and I'd like to compare the stark contrast in quality of life, health care, medication, lifespan expectancy.
US
- unhealthy lifestyles throughout the board, ranging from eating processed food, sitting on our butts all day long to mental issues from living a life online
- little concept of prevention, huge emphasis of treating symptoms instead of focusing on healing (pain medication over healing process)
- huge pharmaceutical complex that made everybody believe that medication is the proper path, for profit, and everybody bought into this bad concept
- many are in the process of taking over a dozen pills every day with increasing age, with side effects only increasing the need for more meds
= average life expectancy 77 years
San Marino
- healthy lifestyle, no processed foods, spending most of the day in the outdoors
- symptoms are used as an indication to adjust lifestyle, its not being subdued
- no pharmaceutical complex
- nobody takes a dozen pills a day
= average life expectancy 87 years
You do the math.
I can go into the quality of life chapter as well. Your average US elderly in the 70s visits a doctor probably every month if not more, and is dealing with several health issues and resulting limitations. I invite you guys to plan your next vacation in San Marino. You will find your average 70 and 80 year old free of health issues, still working in the fields, not taking any medication.
We do have a choice if we want to go the pharmaceutical way with our own health, but when we take care of animals, they have no choice. Maybe it is time to reconsider when it makes sense to treat with pain medication, and when not.
Hi CC:Quote:
Originally Posted by Charley Chuckles
Metacam is a Veterinary brand name for the generic Non-steroidal Antiinflammatory Drug (NSAID), Meloxicam. NSAIDs can help with pain relief and decrease swelling. There are risks for using NSAIDs and there are differences between the NSAIDs in the amount they each interference with two enzymes, cyclooxygenae-1 (COX-1) and cyclooxygenase-2 (COX-2) that are associated with their mode of action. There are serious concerns about using NSAIDs including GI Bleeding, kidney problems, cardiovascular problems and others. If used, ideally NSAIDs should be for the shortest reasonable period of time; maybe 2-3 days for treatment of acute pain from injury as an example. Meloxicam because it favors the interference with COX-2 more than Ibuprofen does, may be a better choice for many acute pain issues because it is probably less likely to cause gut problems. It also however has a longer 1/2-life (the time it takes for blood level to decrease by 50%) than Ibuprofen which is a potential down-side. That being said, the common dosing interval of every 4 hours for Ibuprofen probably negates its theoretical advantage of a shorter 1/2-life. I do NOT dose Ibuprofen every 4 hours as suggested by several Guides. I use it every 6-8 hours and I NEVER use NSAIDs for more than 3 days (basically only for acute pain). I would also recommend that if NSAIDs are going to be utilized; that the lowest therapeutic dose be given. Risks increase with higher dosing amounts and the frequency of individual dosings. By the way, Meloxicam has a disadvantage not associated with the drug itself and that that it is only available by prescription while Infant Ibuprofen is available almost everywhere you can find Over-the-Counter (OTC) medication!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel
Not a problem StS, I'm a slow type myself, happens with me all the time...Quote:
Originally Posted by SamtheSquirrel2018
As for the other... I've been a licensed wildlife rehabilatator for many years, I have to take many hours of classes every year and have studied through many accredited veterinarians.
I share my opinion through that educational knowledge which I stand by and I won't entertain a difference of opinion for a means of conflict.
Heartland Veterinary Clinic
Quote: "Toxic Medications
Never give your pet:
- Tylenol
- Aspirin
- Ibuprofen
No one wants to see their furry friend suffering from illness or pain. Though your inclination may be to treat them with medication, keep in mind that medicines designed for adults and even children can be extremely toxic to your pet."
Brian Arneson, DVM
Veterinarian
Heather Beach, DVM
Veterinarian
Martha Hunt-Estrada, DVM
Veterinarian
Julia Hecking, DVM
Veterinarian
Source:
https://www.heartlandvetclinic.com/r...es/pet-toxins/
Hello Everyone:Quote:
Originally Posted by McCarthy
1) I just want to make it very clear that Ibuprofen is NOT toxic to Squirrels and has been used extensively over many years for treating pain in Squirrels! There are potential adverse effects from virtually any medication and that is certainly true with using any of the NSAIDs (this is the family of medication that Ibuprofen belongs in). It is essential that there be an accurate recent weight obtained on the Squirrel so that an appropriate dose can be calculated. Accurate dosing using accurate and safe dosing intervals (the time between dosing) must be followed at all times! It is best to restrict NSAID use to a relatively short period of time and a reasonable would be a maximum of 3 days. Also, I would suggest restricting use of Ibuprofen (or any NSAID) to treating acute pain only (such as the pain associated with a new injury), NOT chronic (relatively long term) pain;
Meloxicam (a Veterinary brand is Metacam, a Human Medicne brand is Mobic) has also been used quite extensively with Squirrels and is a very good option for NSAID use but it is available only by prescription.
2) Tylenol (Acetaminophen) has also been used with Squirrels and in their closely related brethren, the Rat. That being said, I would NOT recommend using Acetaminophen with Squirrels because dosing is very critical and Acetaminophen in higher doses can cause severe damage to the liver and we really don't know what would be an excessive dose of acetaminophen with Squirrels ["science" hasn't yet killed Squirrels to find out, only Rats])!
3) Aspirin has also been used in rodents and is cited as acceptable for use with rodents in The Exotic Animal Formulary 5th Edition and also on the Rat Guide BUT its use specifically with Squirrels is very limited and not well documented and one of its effects (which is used to an advantage by Vets and Physicians for certain disorders) is to interfere with platelet (platelets are specialized blood cells that help with blood clotting) function which can make bleeding more likely especially if surgery is being considered. As the analgesic qualities (pain relieving benefits) of aspirin offer no advantages over Ibuprofen or Meloxicam and in light of aspirin's effect on platelets; I would NOT recommend use of aspirin in Squirrels.
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel
The linked page in question also lists mushrooms, walnuts, grapes, raisins, walnuts and avocado as toxic... FWIW.
You should take the squirrel to a veterinary hospital to check and put a cast on the leg because it is very dangerous if left for a long time. tetris unblocked krunker
Leg? What do you think how long a grey will need to chew off any form of a cast? A cast may work on a baby squirrel but what was the last time you saw a cast on an adult grey?Quote:
Originally Posted by danielusa0106
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spanky
The claim of "ibuprofen toxicosis" in small animals goes back to this study, done by the Kansas State University-Veterinary Medical Teaching Hospital (KSU-VMTH), published by the American Veterinary Medical Association.
https://avmajournals.avma.org/view/j...0.216.1426.xml
And lists these references:
References
1. Brown SA. Basic anatomy, physiology, and husbandry. In:
Hillyer EV, Quesenbury KE, eds. Ferrets, rabbits, and rodents.
Philadelphia: WB Saunders Co, 1997;12.
2. Winek CL. Drug and chemical blood level data. Atlanta:
Fischer Scientific, 1989.
3. Godshalk CP, Roush JK, Fingland RB, et al. Gastric perfora-
tion associated with administration of ibuprofen in a dog. J Am Vet
Med Assoc 1992;201:1734–1736.
4. Jackson TW, Costin C, Link K, et al. Correlation of serum
ibuprofen concentration with clinical signs of toxicity in three
canine exposures. Vet Hum Toxicol 1991;33:486–488.
5. Poortinga EW, Hungerford LL. A case-control study of acute
ibuprofen toxicity in dogs. Prev Vet Med 1998;35:115–124.
6. Tempowski JH. Ibuprofen poisoning in dogs. Vet Rec 1989;
125:513.
7. Hall AH, Smolinske SC, Stover B, et al. Ibuprofen overdose
in adults. J Toxicol Clin Toxicol 1992;30:23–37.
8. Halpern SM, Fitzpatrick R, Volans GN. Ibuprofen toxicity. A
review of adverse reactions and overdose. Toxicol Rev 1993;12:
107–128.
9. Mattana J, Perinbasekar S, Brod-Miller C. Near-fatal but
reversible acute renal failure after massive ibuprofen ingestion. Am J
Med Sci 1997;313:117–119.
10. Perry SJ, Streete PJ, Volans GN. Ibuprofen overdose: the
first two years of over-the-counter sales. Hum Toxicol 1987;6:
173–178.
11. Royer GL, Seckman CE, Welshman IR. Safety profile: fifteen
years of clinical experience with ibuprofen. Am J Med 1984;77:
25–34.
12. Vale JA, Meredith TJ. Acute poisoning due to non-steroidal
anti-inflammatory drugs. Med Toxicol 1986;1:12–31.
13. Boothe DM. Controlling inflammation with nonsteroidal
anti-inflammatory drugs. Vet Med 1989;84:875–883.
14. Kore A. Toxicology of nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory
drugs. Vet Clin North Am Small Anim Pract 1990;20:419–430.
15. Marasco WA, Gikas PW, Azziz-Baumgartner R, et al.
Ibuprofen-associated renal dysfunction. Arch Intern Med 1987;147:
2107–2115.
16. Rubin SI. Nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs,
prostaglandins, and the kidney. J Am Vet Med Assoc 1986;188:
1065–1068.
17. Jones RD, Baynes RE, Nimitz CT. Nonsteroidal anti-inflam-
matory drug toxicosis in dogs and cats: 240 cases (1989–1990). J Am
Vet Med Assoc 1992;201:475–477.
18. Lipid-derived autacoids: eicosanoids and platelet-activating
factor. In: Gilman AG, Rall TW, Nies AS, et al, eds. Goodman and
Gilman’s the pharmacological basis of therapeutics. New York:
McGraw-Hill Book Co, 1990;611
Quote:
Originally Posted by McCarthy
The link is to a case where a Ferret ("Acute ibuprofen toxicosis in a ferret", one that was allowed to free roam their homeowners house unsupervised, ingested an overdose amount of Ibuprofen. No doubt that Ibuprofen is toxic if too much is ingested and it can be fatal.
This is the kind of topic and subject that would be excellent to explore in its own dedicated thread rather than one intended to help folks with immediate issues... this is a case where I am sure folks will agree to disagree.
Thanks McCarthy.Quote:
Originally Posted by McCarthy
This is a article is based upon a single Case Study from a Ferret. From a quality of evidence standpoint, a single Case Study can be interesting and can assist others with possible differential diagnoses and treatments and certainly alert others to potential associated issues but it is essentially commentary by the author(s) and most, if not all conclusions are based upon association and not established causation as we would have with radomized "blinded" studies with a statistically significant number of "participants." Further, "toxicosis" is not the same as establishing a substance as a poison (being toxic)! Toxicity (potential for being poison) is often a potential of medications we commonly administer to animals and people alike with great benefits and little risk but when taken in excessive doses or more frequently than established protocols recommend, they can cause serious adverse effects or even death (become toxic). Also, the word "toxicosis" does NOT refer specifically to the substance that is considered toxic but to the signs, symptom, and pathologic changes in the "patient" associated with having taken either a known "poison" or is considered harmful regardless or a substance that can be harmful when recommended dosing, dosing intervals, dosing duration (or other factors) are not followed.
Ibuprofen is very effective for helping with a Squirrel's acute pain on a relatively short-term basis. It does have risks as does most everything. Also, as I pointed out; while I am an advocate for at least considering Ibuprofen for providing some relief for a Squirrel suffering from acute pain; from a personal practice standpoint, I certainly do not use it indiscriminately (for every case) and I am not in support of using it every 4 hours as is commonly done. When I dose Ibuprofen, I dose it every 6-8 hours and after the Squirrel has some food intake for no more than 3 days. Again, Ibuprofen is NOT inherently "toxic" to Squirrels but if dosed in excess, used too frequently or for too long a period; the potential for harm increases. Again, my opinions!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel