Help! Rockie has a lump on his stomach.

[babedizzle]

I just discovered a quarter-sized lump on Rockie's stomach. He's acting fine and eating well but I know this can't be normal ... I really hope it's nothing serious. The problem is, he won't sit still long enough for me to get a good picture, so here's the best I could do (ignore the poor quality, this picture was taken with my Dad's ancient digital camera).

http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee141/iheartbabysquirrels/MVC-011F.jpg

What is it? =(

[hazel]

It looks like a hernia. Umbilical hernias are the most common, but his sits a bit more towards the upper abdomen, or it could be the angle on the picture.

How old is Rockie?
Can you handle him?
Are you releasing or keeping him?

[babedizzle]

Rockie is about 9-10 weeks old.
I plan on finding him a rehabber because it's too late in the season to release him, as the other squirrels have gathered most of the fallen acorns and the weather is getting cold.
What do I do about this if it is a hernia?

[TexanSquirrel]

Could it be a warble (a larval bug under the skin)? Whatever you do, do not squeeze it! If the bug 'pops' it would be bad for him. If it is a warble, the bug will come out on its own and he will be okay. Until then, fingers off!

[Mars]

I was abe to lighten it up a bit. Hope this helps. My concern would be to elimanate the possiblity of a bot fly first. Is there a breathing hole in about the middle?

[hazel]

If this were a warble, you'd see an obvious hole on the lump. The photo doesn't show that.

If you don't see any sign of a new or old wound in that area and if the lump doesn't feel extra warm to the touch, it's more likely to be a hernia than an abcess.

Surgery is the only way to repair a hernia. I'm guessing that Ohio isn't a squirrel friendly state? Do you have a squirrel friendly vet?

We often see hernias in dogs. Often they're repaired, sometimes they're left alone. The theoretical danger with a hernia is that enough abdominal contents could push through the hole causing enough pressure on the contents (usually intestines) that their blood supply is compromised. That is a very serious situation, however it is uncommon for that to happen. Most dogs who ''live with'' hernias are just fine, in fact I've never seen a problem.

Do you personally know a rehabber? The reason I ask is that I sent a litter of raccoons to a rehabber once(I was overloaded). Some of them had minor umbilical hernias. She took them to her vet, who advised euthanasia and that's exactly what she did! I don't agree with that decision at all (basic hernia surgery is about as easy as surgery can get) but the point here is that if you send him to a rehabber, you have to be careful about who it is and what their plan is.

Sometimes you can manually push the contents back into the abdomen, if he'll hold still for that.

[anneke]

It does look alot like the umbilical hernia a cat of mine had when he was a kitten. I am assuming squirrels have umbilical cords when they are in utero, yes? With my kitten, if he lay on his back, the things completely flattened.

Anneke and the darling Lilly

[babedizzle]

I looked at pictures of warbles and I didn't think it could be one of those, unless of course they look less disgusting in the beginning stages.

There's no hole in the center ... it's just a perfectly round bump as of right now.

I'm aware that Ohio isn't a squirrel friendly state, thus I have not been able to locate a vet that cares for wildlife, nor have I found a rehabber. The only rehabbers listed for Ohio are speciliazed in endangered raptors and waterfowl. There is a wildlife rehabilitation center but their website states specifically that they do not accept wildlife that has been someone's pet. Another of my concerns is that I've had Rockie for months, so I don't think he would respond to anyone else caring for him, as he won't even let my Dad put his hand in the cage to feed him without putting up a fight.

[Gabe]

It seems as though it is in the rib cage.
Wouldn't an umbilical hernia be lower on the abdomen?
Is it soft? Can you touch it and press on it?
Is it hard?
I've seen umbilical hernias in raccoons and they are about this size. I would think a hernia on a squirrel would be the size of a bean. This seems awfully large.
What do you guys think?

[jules]

What do you guys think?

I have to agree with Hazel. As soon as I saw the pic, the first thing that came to my mind was a hernia. They can differ in size and if part of the nearest organ, i.e stomach, bowels are protruding, it can appear larger.

Of course I may be wrong. Im not so clued up about Warbles and Bot flies!:dono

Jules. :Love_Icon

[hazel]

The size depends on how large the tear in the abdominal wall is, combined with the volume of abdominal contents that are protruding.
It appears to be high in the upper abdomen.
I'll show the photo to a vet today.

[jules]

There are 3 types of hernia:

1, Hiatus - High abdominal

2, umbilical - middle abdominal

3, inguinal - lower abdominal.

Jules. :Love_Icon

[FLUFFYTAILNUT]

Oh my goodness..I hope its nothing..and cen be treated/ fixed with out too much pain..:peace

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

I was reading over babedizzle's posts about Rockie and see that he had a pretty deep cut that was superglued when you first got him. Where was that cut? If it was on his belly this could be an abcess, couldn't it?

[babedizzle]

His scar from the cut is in a different place than this lump, so that can't be the cause of it.

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

But the scar is on his belly?

[babedizzle]

Yeah it is on his belly, just in a different spot.

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

I am thinking it could be an abcess then. What does everyone else think, is it possible? Abcesses don't always form right over the old wound.

[4skwerlz]

I am thinking it could be an abcess then. What does everyone else think, is it possible? Abcesses don't always form right over the old wound.

You're right, SR&BT. Babedazzle, I think we need to see a better pic. At least with better light and focus.

[jules]

Babedazzle, SR&BT and 4Skwerlz are right!

There is a possibility that an old wound site can form a collection and, via a fistula, drain into the surrounding areas.
If this is the correct diagnosis, it will need to be drained. Only a professional should do this!
Either way, I would suggest taking him to the vet or rehabber to get it checked out!

jules. :Love_Icon

[babedizzle]

A rehabber told me to poke the bump with a needle. She said if puss comes out, it's an abcess and if blood comes out, it's a hernia. However, neither blood nor pus came out when I did this. I poked the area twice to be sure and nothing came out.

I wish the rehabber would take Rockie but when I spoke to her last night she told me I need to put him in an outdoor cage within the next week or so. How she thinks I will be able to do this in the city limits with no license, I'm not sure but I'm going to try calling her again and asking her to take him.

[jules]

A rehabber told me to poke the bump with a needle. She said if puss comes out, it's an abcess and if blood comes out, it's a hernia. However, neither blood nor pus came out when I did this. I poked the area twice to be sure and nothing came out.

I wish the rehabber would take Rockie but when I spoke to her last night she told me I need to put him in an outdoor cage within the next week or so. How she thinks I will be able to do this in the city limits with no license, I'm not sure but I'm going to try calling her again and asking her to take him.

Was the needle you used sterilized? It's just that an unclean needle could introduce bacteria into the lump!
It would depend on how far you put the needle in as to whether it would bleed or release pus. I would NOT try this again!
Don't worry, you were only doing what you were told!:thumbsup
He needs to be seen by a professional squirrel friendly vet...I realise this is difficult, but if you can phone round, you might find one.
He is not ready to be released in this condition...it needs to be sorted first!

Jules. :Love_Icon

[susanw]

A rehabber told me to poke the bump with a needle. She said if puss comes out, it's an abcess and if blood comes out, it's a hernia. However, neither blood nor pus came out when I did this. I poked the area twice to be sure and nothing came out.

I wish the rehabber would take Rockie but when I spoke to her last night she told me I need to put him in an outdoor cage within the next week or so. How she thinks I will be able to do this in the city limits with no license, I'm not sure but I'm going to try calling her again and asking her to take him.


Sounds like your squirrel needs a vet.

[babedizzle]

I did sterilize the needle in alcohol before poking him.
If this rehabber decides to take him, I'm sure she can get him to a vet but Ohio is not a squirrel friendly state, so no vet is going to allow someone who isn't licensed to bring him in. I have tried calling around to area vets and none of them will so much as talk to me about the squirrel, let alone schedule an office visit.

[4skwerlz]

I did sterilize the needle in alcohol before poking him.
If this rehabber decides to take him, I'm sure she can get him to a vet but Ohio is not a squirrel friendly state, so no vet is going to allow someone who isn't licensed to bring him in. I have tried calling around to area vets and none of them will so much as talk to me about the squirrel, let alone schedule an office visit.

Babe, can we get a better pic? We might be able to figure out what's going on.....

[Gabe]

How does the lump feel? Hard? Soft?
Can you wiggle it around or is it stationary?
Is it growing?
Any redness under the skin?
Does the fur over the bump seem thin like it is falling out?
Does he ever itch that area?

[4skwerlz]

How does the lump feel? Hard? Soft?
Can you wiggle it around or is it stationary?
Is it growing?
Any redness under the skin?
Does the fur over the bump seem thin like it is falling out?
Does he ever itch that area?


Good points, Gabe.

A few more:
Does the bump move WITH the skin, or does the skin move over it freely?
Do you feel any heat?
Does he react in pain if you press it?

[TexanSquirrel]

Well? Well? Well?

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

Babedizzle, I wouldn't count out vet help, even though you aren't legal. When I took Little Spot in for his surgery to have his leg removed, I told them I was a rehabber and all, but they never asked to see my permit or anything. My regular vet that signed to be my vet for my permit would ask to see my permit (he did just to get some antibiotics), but there are some out there that don't really care. Just don't start off by telling them your whole story, just say you have a squirrel with a lump on his stomach that needs looked at. If they ask if you are a rehabber then tell them no, but otherwise, just don't mention it. Not sure if that is what you are doing already or not.

[LynninIN]

A rehabber told me to poke the bump with a needle. She said if puss comes out, it's an abcess and if blood comes out, it's a hernia.
:eek: If it's a hernia the needle can puncture the intestines. I know you were just following instructions and trying to help Rockie. The :eek: was for the advise.

There are better methods to determine which the lump is. Gabe & 4skwerlz both had very good suggestions. Another would be to put your hand on the lump and feel if there is movement (especially after eating). If it's a hernia you will feel movement under your hand as the contractions (peristalsis) happen in the intestines. An abscess will not move. If you know anyone with a stethoscope you can hear the intestines if the lump is a hernia. Also, try feeling around the upper and lower border of the lump. If it's a hernia, you may be able to feel a small tear an abscess will not have this.

[Amber Squirl]

I screamed when I read that someone who supposedly is a rehaber suggested that they stick this lump with a needle. I don't think that this person is very knowledgeable as a rehaber. And I have dealt with lots of bot flies... this is not a bot fly.
Can't some of you supposed rehabers here call around and find a helpful rehaber or vet? Don't you people have connections? Isn't that part of what this place is suppose to be about?

[susanw]

What do you mean supposed rehabber's? We have already determined it is not a bot fly! I have given advice as to what I would do, which is take it to a vet. I live in Florida, how would I know of someone in Ohio?

[Gabe]

Calm down everyone. Amber Squirl is only reading part of the story here. I have already pm'd her in a nice way to let her know that we are working hard behind the scenes through pm's to get some help for Rockie. It is just not all that apparent in the thread especially to a new person that has no idea how much goes on in pm's here on the board.:)

[Mountain Mama]

Calm down everyone. Amber Squirl is only reading part of the story here. I have already pm'd her in a nice way to let her know that we are working hard behind the scenes through pm's to get some help for Rockie. It is just not all that apparent in the thread especially to a new person that has no idea how much goes on in pm's here on the board.:)

GABE: HOSTAGE NEGOTIATOR. :D

[squirrelybop]

WoW..poor little guy. He just needs to see a vet asap. I don't think you will find a rehabber to take him at this point, because they are not going to like that he wasn't given to a licensed rehabber in the first place. So, I would just call around to a vet that does exotics. Explain your situation anonomously, and see if someone will help you. You will be charged of course, but if he is a pet, you shouldn't mind. I would just be concerned they would try to have you fined or something like that. Good luck.....I hope he is okay..and I wouldn't poke it anymore!!

[squirrelybop]

I screamed when I read that someone who supposedly is a rehaber suggested that they stick this lump with a needle. I don't think that this person is very knowledgeable as a rehaber. And I have dealt with lots of bot flies... this is not a bot fly.
Can't some of you supposed rehabers here call around and find a helpful rehaber or vet? Don't you people have connections? Isn't that part of what this place is suppose to be about?
Most of us are not willing to take an animal that has already been raised just because it has a medical condition. I'm sure you realize this already. The little guy is important I would recommend calling a vet that specializes in exotics. It doesn't hurt to try!

[squirrelybop]

Babedizzle, I wouldn't count out vet help, even though you aren't legal. When I took Little Spot in for his surgery to have his leg removed, I told them I was a rehabber and all, but they never asked to see my permit or anything. My regular vet that signed to be my vet for my permit would ask to see my permit (he did just to get some antibiotics), but there are some out there that don't really care. Just don't start off by telling them your whole story, just say you have a squirrel with a lump on his stomach that needs looked at. If they ask if you are a rehabber then tell them no, but otherwise, just don't mention it. Not sure if that is what you are doing already or not.
I totally agree with you here!!!:thumbsup

[babedizzle]

I am at school right now but when I go home later this afternoon I will feel the lump and have answers to all of your questions.

This situation is growing increasingly difficult for me to deal with. The rehabber I've been speaking to tells me the complete opposite of what everyone on TSB says. Last night she told me that his lump is probably "just a hernia" and "no vet will treat it." She told me she's bringing me an outdoor cage to put Rockie in, and she says he should be released by next week, regardless of the lump.

I know for a fact that none of the area vets are willing to see Rockie without seeing my permit first, but one thing is certain, he needs to be released soon. I'm worried he's going to cause himself brain trauma the way he bounces from top to bottom in the cage. I can tell he truly isn't happy and wants to be set free.

If anyone knows of any other rehabbers in Ohio, please send me the number. If I don't hear of one by the end of this week, I'm going to go ahead and put Rockie in the outdoor cage. I can't keep a wild animal over the winter and no one is willing to help me, so there's not much else I can do.

[babedizzle]

We may have some hope ... squirrelsrule&bunniestoo has agreed to possibly meet me at a vet in her area who can treat Rockie's bump. If he is calm for her, she can keep and release him after the procedure (assuming he has to have surgery), but if he is crazy without me, I'll have to continue to care for him until he heals and is ready for release.

I will update later this afternoon with more info about his lump, and I'll try to get a picture, too.

[pamela lee]

Sounds like great plan. Thank you SR&BT. I'll be praying for Rockie.:grouphug

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

I still have to call the vet to make sure she treats squirrels, but I think she will. I know she will at least look at it. She is the vet that operated on Little Spot (my cottontail with the deformed leg that needed to be removed). Ordinarily, I would take Rockie and keep him for the winter, but if he is going to be agressive without Babedizzle (squirrels are one person animals and that is most likely going to be the case) then I can't take him home because I still have a hard time bending from my back surgery in August, so chasing a squirrel around to give him meds. twice a day would NOT be a good idea.

I did offer to take both Rockie and his sister (Babedizzle's fiance's brother has Rockie's sister) because his sister would calm him down, but Babedizzle is unable to convince her fiance's brother to give her up. He wants to keep her as a pet :shakehead .

Just pleas don't release Rockie with that lump!

[anneke]

You all are doing such a fabulous job for Rockie. I hope the vets feels it is something he could reasonably live with and you can move forward with release plans.

[Gabe]

Hey Babdizzle don't go away! We are still waiting for the answers to the questions that I have asked twice now. Take a minute and give Rockie a good looking over and hopefully a clear photo also. That will help us so much in knowing what steps to move forward with.

[squirrelybop]

Firstly, where in Ohio are you?

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

Are you there babedizzle? We need the answers to those questions.

[babedizzle]

I'm sorry it has taken me this long to respond to your questions, I am very busy with work and school, and my fiance and I are in the process of taking out a mortgage loan to purchase our first home.

The lump is soft, not hard and when I gently push on it, it squishes inward.
He isn't in any pain when I push on it.
There is no balding/redness around the area and he doesn't itch it.
It's not growing.

I went to the store to get batteries for my digital camera so I will be able to take at least one high quality picture of the lump. I may have to wait until he has just woken up from a nap, because that is when he is the most calm. Right now he is all over the place in his cage and he won't sit still long enough for the picture to take without any blur.

squirrelybop: I am in NE Ohio. More specifically, Columbiana County.

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

I have given babedizzle the names and numbers of all the liscensed rehabbers in her county and the surrounding counties. None are willing to take Rockie now that she has had him so long. The only one on the list that I may not have given her is Lake Erie Nature center. That one isn't too close, but is probably closer than I am and they may take him. They don't take in any babies on milk, but do take in older babies.

Babedizzle and I are working out a plan to get Rockie to the vets. She is going to meet me there and we will get Rockie the help he needs. Since I think the squishiness and movement inwards means a hernia (right?), I will take Rockie home with me after surgery and overwinter him. I won't be able to take him if he is too wild without babedizzle though because I can't bend well and can't be chasing him around to give him meds., in which case, babedizzle will be taking him home with her and then releasing him after he recovers. I will be calling the vets probably Monday to make sure she will treat a squirrel with a hernia. I am almost positive she will.

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

Thanks GB! Yes, I sure hope everything works out. I am just hoping he is a good boy and nice and calm. Rockie won't be going to the vets until after I get back from my wildlife conference, so November 12th or later. Are any of the other rehabbers on right now to confirm that it is a hernia because I am noy sure.

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

Babedizzle and I have finally devised a plan! She is going to drop Rockie off at my house on November 12th (after my wildlife conference) and his surgery is scheduled for November 15th. The vet that operated on Little Spot wouldn't see him and my vet wouldn't see him, but I found a good vet that deals with wildlife not too far from my house that was willing to see and operate on Rockie. So, everything is all set up and Rockie is going to get the help he needs. Then, after surgery, I am planning to overwinter him. I can't take care of him if he is crazy without Babedizzle, though, so if that is the case, I will have to give Rockie back to her after surgery. Either way, though, Rockie is going to get the help he needs.

[pamela lee]

That is awesomely great news. Way to go guys.

[hazel]

:thumbsup5 That's great news!

I've shown the photos to the vets I work with and we're quite sure that it's a hernia.

One challenge after surgery will be how to keep him from biting and scratching at the incision.

[island rehabber]

Great work, SR&B2! So glad Rockie is getting the help he needs thanks to you! :thumbsup :) I can move this thread to Non-Life threatening now -- yay!

[TexanSquirrel]

:wott :wott

[squirrelfriend]

:thumbsup :thumbsup :thumbsup :thumbsup :thumbsup

[Dancingsquirrel]

That is great news!! :thankyou

[anneke]

Thanks GB! Yes, I sure hope everything works out. I am just hoping he is a good boy and nice and calm. Rockie won't be going to the vets until after I get back from my wildlife conference, so November 12th or later. Are any of the other rehabbers on right now to confirm that it is a hernia because I am noy sure.


Yaaaaaaaaaaaay!!!!:crazy

Can't wait to hear how he does.

[susanw]

Way to go SR&B2!:thumbsup Lots of good wishes for Rockie and Babedizzle!:)

[MsOakley]

I think there may be a better chance then you realize of getting Rockie to accept a new human as his guardian . I just took in 2 squirrels, both about 12 weeks, from separate homes. Both had caring individuals that found them as babies, but didn't have good release situations. I think they did a good job given their lack of experience. It took Tia, the female, a few days to befriend me. She was aggressive at first. Scooter, the male, is so mellow he acted like we were old buddies immediately. I eventually put them together in a release cage (after several days of side-by-side individual cages) and they now play all day and sleep in the same nest box. It's a love story. Anyway, I didn't mean to hijack this thread but I wanted to give babedizzle and SR&B2 some encouragement regarding older squirrels accepting changes. Best of luck.

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

Thanks Ms. Oakley. I hope you are right. It was actually your thread that got me worried about Rockie not taking to me very well. I saw how you were having trouble dealing with a new squirrel raised by someone else and thought how in the world will I manage when I can't bend or move very fast. Then I saw your little tyke came to accept you as his new mommy. I can handle a few days of Rockie not being a happy camper if he will eventually calm down. I am hoping he will even get along with my four fox squirrels. I am not sure since they are different species and everyone is older, but I am hopeful. I would hate to see Rockie have to spend the whole winter by himself. Whatever happens though, at least he will get them medical help he needs. I am just so glad I was able to find a vet to see him. There are very few in my area that are even allowed to operate on wildlife and they are all so busy with their domestic patients that they don't always have time for a wild patient.