Advice needed for sick squirrel

[supersquirrelgirl]

3 - 4 year old fox squirrel who's been coming to our backyard has severely swollen left shoulder.
It almost looks like mini golf ball under her skin. She's been like this for the past 6 weeks. Apparently it is sore and she tries not to use her left front leg as much. She can't run like other squirrels so she avoids them and comes to our backyard super early in the morning or late in the evening for food.
Is there anything we can do for this squirrel?


https://youtube.com/shorts/h1yFEOmLyy4?feature=share

[CritterMom]

She is just beautiful - and so gentle when she takes the food! Poor baby.

It was a little difficult to see in the video. You said it looked like a golf ball under the skin. Did it start smallish and then keep getting bigger? If that is the case, it is likely a big abscess - perhaps from a wound from another squirrel. They will get bigger and bigger until they hopefully burst on their own and drain. Based on what you have seen, does that sound right?

It could of course be a shoulder dislocation which would be a grimmer thing. Absent a way to capture and have her assessed by a vet, keeping a close eye on what exactly is happening with the lump and most important, try to just stuff her with good, healthy food when she comes by, (and make sure you have a clean water source, too) which then fills her belly so she just wants to go home and sleep where she will be safe from predators.

[olorin19]

Is there any reason to suspect that she is a nursing mama? I have watched the video quite a few times, and see no evidence of that, but it is hard to see.

The reason I ask is that if she is not nursing, is capturing her and letting her rest and recuperate in a release cage an option worth considering?

Also, if capturing is not an option and it does turn out to be an abscess, it is worth noting that giving antibiotics via pecan works quite well. And in the case of your friendly squirrel, giving her the pecans looks like it would be easy enough.

https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?64219-Wild-with-injured-front-paw

[supersquirrelgirl]

Thanks for your advice.
She's not nursing, but I don't think I can capture her.
Is antibiotic something I can purchase without prescription by vet?




Is there any reason to suspect that she is a nursing mama? I have watched the video quite a few times, and see no evidence of that, but it is hard to see.

The reason I ask is that if she is not nursing, is capturing her and letting her rest and recuperate in a release cage an option worth considering?

Also, if capturing is not an option and it does turn out to be an abscess, it is worth noting that giving antibiotics via pecan works quite well. And in the case of your friendly squirrel, giving her the pecans looks like it would be easy enough.

https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?64219-Wild-with-injured-front-paw

[supersquirrelgirl]

Thanks for your response. I went back and looked through my photos of her and see exactly when I saw her swollen shoulder. It turns out it was almost 6 months ago. Initially, it was small lump and it didn't seem to affect her mobility. It got bigger (like the one in video) and one point, I saw indentation in the middle and looked a little flatter. We originally thought it may be bot fly when we saw this, but after a while it started to get bigger again and stayed at current size. Now it is affecting her mobility like she can't run fast enough when she needs to.
She is extremely smart and was boss in the area. As she doesn't think she can win the chase, she seems to avoid other squirrels.



She is just beautiful - and so gentle when she takes the food! Poor baby.

It was a little difficult to see in the video. You said it looked like a golf ball under the skin. Did it start smallish and then keep getting bigger? If that is the case, it is likely a big abscess - perhaps from a wound from another squirrel. They will get bigger and bigger until they hopefully burst on their own and drain. Based on what you have seen, does that sound right?

It could of course be a shoulder dislocation which would be a grimmer thing. Absent a way to capture and have her assessed by a vet, keeping a close eye on what exactly is happening with the lump and most important, try to just stuff her with good, healthy food when she comes by, (and make sure you have a clean water source, too) which then fills her belly so she just wants to go home and sleep where she will be safe from predators.

[Mel1959]

Setting up a havahart trap might allow you to catch her, especially if she’s coming when other squirrels aren’t around. It might be worth a shot.

[olorin19]

Thanks for your advice.
She's not nursing, but I don't think I can capture her.
Is antibiotic something I can purchase without prescription by vet?

You would need a prescription for antibiotics, unless you are able to use leftover human meds.

If this is determined to be an abscess, then there are experts here who can help you with the dosage, etc.

[supersquirrelgirl]

You would need a prescription for antibiotics, unless you are able to use leftover human meds.

If this is determined to be an abscess, then there are experts here who can help you with the dosage, etc.


We have amoxicillin 500mg capsules. I believe inside capsules are in powder form.
Will you be able to tell me how much and how I should give these antibiotic to her?
She eats walnuts, half shelled walnuts from my hands without any problem. I've been feeding her for the past 3 years and she seems to trust me enough.

[CritterMom]

We have amoxicillin 500mg capsules. I believe inside capsules are in powder form.
Will you be able to tell me how much and how I should give these antibiotic to her?
She eats walnuts, half shelled walnuts from my hands without any problem. I've been feeding her for the past 3 years and she seems to trust me enough.

Is there ANY chance that this is amoxicillin clavulanate, not plain amoxicillin?

[supersquirrelgirl]

Is there ANY chance that this is amoxicillin clavulanate, not plain amoxicillin?


I believe this is plain amoxicillin.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Hello Again,

Was able to get 2 human meds:
(1) Augmentin tablet (Amox-Clav / 500mg - 125mg)
(2) CiproFloxacin HCL tablet (500mg).

Its my understanding these are same as Clavamox and Baytril (Enrofloxacin) for animal use.

Wild Squirrel still comes everyday travelling about 150 meters from her tree home. Observation tells me this is not a dislocated shoulder as she runs fast across the road and climbs the fences here. As mentioned previously, its probably an abscess.

Using meds above, can anyone help me with dosage info ?? She is large squirrel so I estimate about 1 Kg (2 pounds).

[Tashahaven]

Hi SSG! I hope someone can help you dose antibiotics. Poor darling. She is sooo sweet and gentle when she comes to you. She clearly trusts you 🙂🤗

Thank you for caring about and looking after her.

PS - I’m originally from Pleasanton 👋 So neat to see people on TSB from every part of the country & world. How amazing. Squirrel ❤️🔄🌎

[supersquirrelgirl]

Hi Tashahavan,

Thank you! So far, no response for antibiotic dose. Been checking back frequently for any response.

Mo (the female squirrel) comes everyday for a snack of walnuts and sunflower seeds. I sense she is getting weaker and more on alert than before. Honestly, not 100% sure what is causing the round lump on her shoulder.

325507325508

[Spanky]

Augmentin dosing sent via PM...

[supersquirrelgirl]

Thank you Spanky.

AB mixed and ready for 1st dose in the morning (Friday). Ms. Mo only comes in morning. I'll post updates.

I did reduce her weight to 0.8Kg (~1.75lbs).

[Spanky]

Yes, please keep us updated... glad you were bale to make the adjustments based on best and current estimate of weight.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Update for Day-3:

Being a wild girl, no way a syringe will ever work. Meds being delivered by dripping slowly into a half-cut walnut-in-shell. I allow drops to dry a few hours. At feeding, she gets this shell first followed by the other half. Good thing is Augmentin does not have strong taste like Cipro.

Day-1 went good for feeding. On Day-2, she did not come and I was very concerned something happened. Since it was very hot here, waiting too long makes roadway very hot in sun so no way to cross over. Day-3 (today), she came early and with good energy. I was very relieved to see her. Fed her the walnut halfs along with a big plate of sunflower seeds (her favorite). Off she went into the high trees.

Since many other squirrels come too, I have to be very careful that only her gets the special walnut half. She is the boss of this area so many squirrels give her respect and guard her from being challenged (guards are old boyfriends).

One last thing, on hot days, we leave the house hose bib dripping - the squirrels use it like a drinking fountain! funny to watch.

Thats it for my update. Fingers crossed for her improvement.

[olorin19]

Meds being delivered by dripping slowly into a half-cut walnut-in-shell. I allow drops to dry a few hours. At feeding, she gets this shell first followed by the other half. Good thing is Augmentin does not have strong taste like Cipro.

With both wilds and releases, I have had good success using clavamox on half pecans. For some, dripping the clavamox onto a half pecan in shell has worked best, while others have preferred having it mixed with nut butter then smeared on the half pecan.

I first tried this with a wild named Mama Squirrel. This was in 2020, and she is still around 3.5 years later and is now at least 5.5 y.o.!

https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?64219-Wild-with-injured-front-paw

Anyways, since I did not know when she was going to turn up, I would make up two doses on half pecans first thing in the morning so that when she appeared I would be ready. I would keep them in the fridge, ready to go.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Thank you Olorin19 for the encouragement!

I read your 2020 thread with everyone's comments and thought ditto with our squirrel Mo here. I hope she can get many doses but time will tell. Her big lump essentially limits her left hand motion but she can still climb fences and trees as needed. Almost everyday, she crosses the neighborhood road to get here (her original home was on this side of road but she moved). We have a squirrel feeder box where she lifts the lid and lets it drop down making noise. She uses it like a doorbell when she comes. She only comes once a day so I'm mixing 1.5x dose in the walnut shell. Its working good but thinking of trying the mashing & mixing method suggested from reading your post.

All squirrels here are wild with many are related to Mo from her various litters and boyfriends. Houses here have wooden fences and the squirrels use them like streets to get to our backyard. Many lay around and perch in the trees. Really fun to watch them!

More updates later. Thank you again!

[supersquirrelgirl]

Day-5 Update

A No-Show on Day-4 so missed her AB. It was a really hot sunny day so only chance to cross road was in morning. Unfortunately morning time is when landscapers come to the house where she lives spooking her not to come down. Many other squirrels came here but all gone by 10am....way too hot for them.

I'm happy to report she came today (day-5 Tuesday) and ate big including the AB half-shell. Whenever she leaves, we give her a whole walnut to take home. Again, I'm relieved she came after missing yesterday. This is our first experience giving AB to squirrel so its stressful when she is a no-show and hoping nothing has gone wrong.

Any thoughts on the AB working for her pattern of days 1-0-1-0-1-? Been doing 1.5x amount once per day. Reading other post for fox squirrels, I'm thinking she must weigh more than 0.8Kg; possibly more like 1Kg as my previous estimate. No way to put her on scale. I'm nervous to overdose her as there is no way to help if something goes wrong. She lives in neighbor's tree.

Regarding her lump, no significant change. Her mobility is good when needed but still walks with left hand limp.

[olorin19]

If she is across the street, you might want to try going to her if there is a place to sit and wait.

If she is hungry and feels safe with you, she may well come to you.

There are quite a few wilds that are used to me feeding them in my yard who will run in my direction if they see me when I am out on a walk. A few weeks ago, I was several blocks away (maybe 250 yards in a straight line) when a squirrel stopped on the sidewalk about 50 yards away. It obviously recognized me, as it then hopped up on a fence post to wait. Good thing I always have pecans in my pocket!

[supersquirrelgirl]

Hi Olorin19,

Good idea but across the street is neighbor's front yard & driveway. (they are not squirrel friendly and have big house dog)

Our neighborhood has many houses and green zones with big redwood trees. There is a wood fence that goes directly from our house to a nearby green zone with many big trees. Many squirrels use this fence run as "main street" to our house. We walk through this green zone and many squirrels come running as they recognize us. (and of course we have walnuts) Mo squirrel grew up there before moving across the street. (her family and boyfriends live there still)

Its a long story but our relationship with Mo started when her grandparents moved into our house attic for the winter (right above master bedroom). We let them stay the winter when we found out they had a family. First experience with squirrels for us. Come spring time, they moved out into nearby trees. After several months, only the kids stayed around and we started to feed them since they laid all around the backyard (get really hot & dry here). Years past with only 2 female kids sticking around; Ms Vee and Skimpy. More years past, Skimpy moved into the green zone and Vee brought her baby to us......We met Ms Mo.

Picture of Mo from last week. (Smiling girl!)

[supersquirrelgirl]

Day-7 Update:

She came yesterday (day-6) and totally consumed her walnut, licking it completely until she was convinced it was gone. I mashed up the walnuts and mixed in the AB into a paste and filled the half-shell. (Thank you for posting that tip on TSB!) Very encouraged as she came for 2 days in a row (day pattern 1-0-1-0-1-1).

However day-7 (today) was another no-show. Its stressful to keep checking all morning out the window that she is not road-kill. Luckily nothing on the road and now its dark. I hope she comes tomorrow morning.

Last week before giving AB, she came everyday. I wonder if taking AB is causing some issue where she can't make it ??

Any comments on efficacy of the AB taking 1.5x dose on day pattern 1-0-1-0-1-1-0 ?? (only 4 doses in 7 days) I'm getting discouraged as the AB mix will be thrown-out is a few days. I have more AB tablets to make a new batch if needed.

[Tashahaven]

I’m not qualified to adequately answer your question. However…even though it’s not necessarily ideal, that she has missed a couple doses I still believe the AB are able to help.

(Think about humans…most people skip doses, or don’t finish a complete round of AB when we take them. It isn’t the best example, because it is part of the reason so many people build up AB resistance. But most of the time they are still quite effective)

Im not sure how long you were initially intending to dose the AB. But if possible I would continue doing as you are doing, and tack on the missed days to the end of the regime. So if originally it was to be a 10 day course of AB and she has missed 3, extend it out to 13 days.

I could be wrong, and more knowledgeable members will hopefully chime in and correct me if so.

How is she looking when you last saw her? That abscess is huge, it MUST be almost ready to open up and drain! Poor dear. I know they aren’t typically painful, but they are still super uncomfortable, especially as it is impairing her mobility.

Thank you for the updates, and for helping Ms. MO! (Btw Is MO short for anything?)

🐿️🥰🥰🐿️

[Spanky]

I'd continue to dose the antibiotic as regularly as possible. Has any noticeable change in the abscess occur?

Treating abscesses with antibiotics is only minimally effective since they have a hard time penetrating into abscesses, which is why draining them when possible is always the best course. Draining in itself can be the "fix" in itself, but certainly adding antibiotics provides another level of reassurance.

If there is not a noticeable change... decreasing in size and best case bursting of the abscess... I'd recommend switching, or even stacking (adding another), antibiotic. I'd go with Bactrim or Doxycycline if I could.

[supersquirrelgirl]

I’m not qualified to adequately answer your question. However…even though it’s not necessarily ideal, that she has missed a couple doses I still believe the AB are able to help.

(Think about humans…most people skip doses, or don’t finish a complete round of AB when we take them. It isn’t the best example, because it is part of the reason so many people build up AB resistance. But most of the time they are still quite effective)

Im not sure how long you were initially intending to dose the AB. But if possible I would continue doing as you are doing, and tack on the missed days to the end of the regime. So if originally it was to be a 10 day course of AB and she has missed 3, extend it out to 13 days.

I could be wrong, and more knowledgeable members will hopefully chime in and correct me if so.

How is she looking when you last saw her? That abscess is huge, it MUST be almost ready to open up and drain! Poor dear. I know they aren’t typically painful, but they are still super uncomfortable, especially as it is impairing her mobility.

Thank you for the updates, and for helping Ms. MO! (Btw Is MO short for anything?)

🐿️🥰🥰🐿️

Hi Tashahaven,

Thank you. If this is truly an abscess, it is big and make her look lopsided on left shoulder. Doesn't appear to be painful but really limits her left arm movement. Her walking is slowing down as expected with a limp. However, she still climbs and runs fast with care (especially going across road).

When she was young, hair on her head looked like a mohican haircut.......right down the middle! Mo is nickname.

[supersquirrelgirl]

I'd continue to dose the antibiotic as regularly as possible. Has any noticeable change in the abscess occur?

Treating abscesses with antibiotics is only minimally effective since they have a hard time penetrating into abscesses, which is why draining them when possible is always the best course. Draining in itself can be the "fix" in itself, but certainly adding antibiotics provides another level of reassurance.

If there is not a noticeable change... decreasing in size and best case bursting of the abscess... I'd recommend switching, or even stacking (adding another), antibiotic. I'd go with Bactrim or Doxycycline if I could.

Hi Spanky, we are taking pictures each time she comes and comparing them - so far, no real difference in size. Only been 4 AB doses in 7 days probably not critical mass yet for some difference. A few more doses should be the decision point.

Agree draining is best but that means capturing her and find a Vet to help. Finding a Vet for a fox squirrel in CA will be near impossible (they are invasive species here). I think capturing her would be the traumatic end to our relationship. Many thoughts have crossed my mind as her health/life is priority. I'm still hoping for AB effect or even the abscess opens.

Access to doxy or Bactrim could be a problem. Will check today on access. I go a few more days on current AB hoping for some improvement. For sure, will keep you in the loop. Thank you!

FYI - Its now 10:45am Friday and no sign of her yet. Its trash day so many big trucks driving all around the road.

[olorin19]

If this is truly an abscess, it is big and make her look lopsided on left shoulder.

Abscesses can be quite large.

Harry had a large one on the side and it was almost three weeks from when I first noticed it to when it popped. The first photo and second photo were taken 8 days apart, and then the last photo (where it popped) was another 7 days after that. And besides this 15 day interval, the abscess was already visible for a few days before the first photo.

And none of these photos really capture just how HUGE the abscess was.

[Tashahaven]

Hi SSG! Thanks for the continued updates!

As everyone has said, abscesses are rarely much of a reason for concern, unless there are other potential complications. But Ms Mo should be fine once that stubborn thing finally decides to open up and start healing!

I am slightly concerned though, because if I remember correctly you said this thing first appeared 6 MONTHS ago? If this is an accurate timeline, it seems extraordinarily long for just an abscess. I hope others correct me if I’m way off. But if it has truly been such a long time, I’m wondering if there may be something else potentially going on?

If it is still the general consensus that it is truly an abscess that somehow has persisted for half of a year, then disregard what I say next lol.

But If there is any reason to worry that it may be something more than an abscess, where an exam/different treatment will be effective, I may be able to help you. If you are able to safely trap her, and provide an enclosure and care for her, I can probably help coordinate an exam, and/or the assistance of local rehabbers in the East Bay. I used to do a lot of wildlife rescue and rehab growing up out there, and have a lot of potential resources i can reach out to for help.

This may not be needed, but the length of the injury, and how it’s effecting her mobility worries me some. (I might be being an alarmist). Most of the time if a squirrel knows they need help, they may be a bit angry or irritated, and scared at first, but once helped/healed and released healthy again, I’ve never seen one “hold a grudge”, ie be “the end of your relationship”. If you ever do decide this is something you want to possibly explore, please let me know. I would be happy to help if I can. But I would have to search through old notebooks, computer etc. since my phone number has long since changed, and I’m mostly removed from social media. But I can definitely track down needed info, and I spent many years working intimately with these folks who better not have forgotten me yet! Haha. 💕

[supersquirrelgirl]

Hi SSG! Thanks for the continued updates!

As everyone has said, abscesses are rarely much of a reason for concern, unless there are other potential complications. But Ms Mo should be fine once that stubborn thing finally decides to open up and start healing!

I am slightly concerned though, because if I remember correctly you said this thing first appeared 6 MONTHS ago? If this is an accurate timeline, it seems extraordinarily long for just an abscess. I hope others correct me if I’m way off. But if it has truly been such a long time, I’m wondering if there may be something else potentially going on?

If it is still the general consensus that it is truly an abscess that somehow has persisted for half of a year, then disregard what I say next lol.

But If there is any reason to worry that it may be something more than an abscess, where an exam/different treatment will be effective, I may be able to help you. If you are able to safely trap her, and provide an enclosure and care for her, I can probably help coordinate an exam, and/or the assistance of local rehabbers in the East Bay. I used to do a lot of wildlife rescue and rehab growing up out there, and have a lot of potential resources i can reach out to for help.

This may not be needed, but the length of the injury, and how it’s effecting her mobility worries me some. (I might be being an alarmist). Most of the time if a squirrel knows they need help, they may be a bit angry or irritated, and scared at first, but once helped/healed and released healthy again, I’ve never seen one “hold a grudge”, ie be “the end of your relationship”. If you ever do decide this is something you want to possibly explore, please let me know. I would be happy to help if I can. But I would have to search through old notebooks, computer etc. since my phone number has long since changed, and I’m mostly removed from social media. But I can definitely track down needed info, and I spent many years working intimately with these folks who better not have forgotten me yet! Haha. 💕

Thank you again. You are correct - it was October time frame we notice Mo's shoulder. We kept eye on it but no action taken back then. We were out of town for many months but when we came back, Mo still had her bump. Its only been since finding TSB in May/2023, that got us serious with how to help her. Many internet readings suggest that bumps are bot-flies or abscess that will resolve themselves. We have 10~15 squirrels coming around daily for many years, but Mo is a special one. Lets give it more time on AB to see if any significant changes. My gut tell me she is too smart to be captured. She is just too nervous of anything.

[Tashahaven]

Hopefully you won’t need to catch her, and I’m 100% on board with giving more time for sure. However keep in mind unless or until it actually starts draining, AB will have a difficult time penetrating into the abscess (if it is one). No need to rush, no pressure at all. Especially since rehabbers have their hands full plus 100,000 at the moment with fall baby season.

I do hope it either resolves or we can get you in communication with some help before the hardship of winter sets on. THANKFULLY though, California winters aren’t that bad. But we still don’t want her to be at a disadvantage when food sources are more scarce and competition for them is more brutal. Keep updating, and keep in touch, and let me know if I can help. 🥰

Also, when winter weather kicks in and resources dwindle some, a disadvantaged squirrel, however Super smart, probably won’t be “smart enough”, when it comes to biological self preservation and survival aka FOOD :)

I hope Ms MO (hawk) shows up soon today! 💕

[supersquirrelgirl]

Day-8 (Friday 11th)

First, thank you all for support and comments. We are new to this level of squirrel care.

Ms. Mo came around 12noon and ate her AB nut along with many other nuts. I'm relieved she came. When she comes, she doesn't waste time. She eats quickly and then runs either down fence into woods or across the road to home. We are very watchful for cars on the road as she crosses (like a school traffic guard).

We compared pictures over the last few months and looks like the lump is now drooping a little more down onto left arm. We started to notice her eating walnut pieces only with right hand. Although she does use both hands on the AB nut and sunflower seeds. Her running has a little bit more up/down bounce then before. She is very smart and know her limitations. She takes no risk and is always on alert. We live close to a high ridge where many hawks come down and fly around here (hunting). Lots of nature and many animals here (fox, coyote, hawks, dogs, cats - tough for a squirrel).

Pictures from today: (hope they post vertical this time)

325581
325582

[Spanky]

Do you believe it looks larger than a week ago.. the pics from 8/3? Today's pics are closer up and a different angle so I can't really be too certain.

It looks like an abscess but in my experience abscesses tend to be more symmetrical, but it could be less symmetrical because of it's location. Hopefully more knowledgeable folks will weigh in...

[supersquirrelgirl]

Do you believe it looks larger than a week ago.. the pics from 8/3? Today's pics are closer up and a different angle so I can't really be too certain.

It looks like an abscess but in my experience abscesses tend to be more symmetrical, but it could be less symmetrical because of it's location. Hopefully more knowledgeable folks will weigh in...

Hi Spanky, I originally thought so too but I did picture scaling and superimposing from 1 month ago. My conclusing is its about the same in size and shape. When she moves left hand up, it pushes out bottom of lump. I'm starting to really keep close eye on lump now.

What I did notice is the red spot at bottom of the lump. Maybe scratching now with left back leg ??

Here is picture from July-9th: (not scale exactly.) Same picture but first one is zoomed in. Don't know how to delete the bottom picture.,,,sorry

325584

[supersquirrelgirl]

Day-10 Update (Sunday)

Ms Mo is no-show on day-9 (Sat) and day-10 (Sun) so missed 2 days of AB. Maybe she run away with boyfriend for the weekend.

It was a very hot weekend so if she doesn't cross road by 12noon, its way to hot in direct sun. Across the street is her new territory of a few months now. Her old territory here in the woods has an on-going power struggle between an old-timer female (Cutie) and much younger female (Suzie) who is more aggressive. Suzie comes here alot and is very sweet but is not making too many friends. I think she is now expecting. Mo's old boyfriends growl at her alot.

I still have the AB nut from 2 days which has been in frig so I hope she comes to get it tomorrow. Original AB mix is 10 old so time to dump. Need to make a new AB mix if Mo comes tomorrow. Expecting a 90~100 degree day tomorrow.

Picture of Suzie ready to rumble......

325623

[supersquirrelgirl]

Hello Again, its Day-12 (August-15th)

Mo squirrel was no-show yesterday but did come today at 8am before road gets too hot. She came with another squirrel who is her child (young and really good looking!). Its 95 degrees now with no squirrels out anywhere. She got the 6th AB walnut. Its time to make a new AB mix for the next 2 weeks. Should I continue AB treatment ??

We went back through our photos and came across one that shows a small bump in the same location on July/2022. Pictures posted above are from July & August 2023. Clearly the bump is bigger. Picture from today (8/15) shows two bumps which is different. Bumps look more round and stacked vertically. Not sure if AB are causing this change or not. (she is eating the AB walnut in the picture) Her energy and mobility is still good as she climbs the fences and trees along with fast running speed.

Hope she comes tomorrow.

325636

325637

[supersquirrelgirl]

Abscesses can be quite large.

Harry had a large one on the side and it was almost three weeks from when I first noticed it to when it popped. The first photo and second photo were taken 8 days apart, and then the last photo (where it popped) was another 7 days after that. And besides this 15 day interval, the abscess was already visible for a few days before the first photo.

And none of these photos really capture just how HUGE the abscess was.

Hi Olorin19, when Harry's abscess popped, what did you do for recovery ??

[olorin19]

Hi Olorin19, when Harry's abscess popped, what did you do for recovery ??

In Harry's case, I did not realize it was an abscess until it popped. I had thought it might be a bot.

https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?66556-Bot-fly

I did not do anything for Harry after it popped. With a release that I was able to handle, I would have checked it out, maybe applied something topical, etc.

But Harry was not a typical release. He had gotten extremely aggressive with my during the final months of being overwintered, and had attacked me after release, so there trying to handle him was not really an option.

https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?66210-Protective-gear

https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?66460-Fearful-Aggressive-newly-released-squirrel-attacked-me!

[olorin19]

Looking at your 2022 and 2023 pictures makes me wonder whether there is something else going on, like a fatty cyst, lipoma, etc.

I have a hard time imagining an abscess persisting for so long, and the lump seems to be in the same place.

[supersquirrelgirl]

In Harry's case, I did not realize it was an abscess until it popped. I had thought it might be a bot.

https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?66556-Bot-fly

I did not do anything for Harry after it popped. With a release that I was able to handle, I would have checked it out, maybe applied something topical, etc.

But Harry was not a typical release. He had gotten extremely aggressive with my during the final months of being overwintered, and had attacked me after release, so there trying to handle him was not really an option.

https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?66210-Protective-gear

https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?66460-Fearful-Aggressive-newly-released-squirrel-attacked-me!

Same concern I have for Mo; she is wild and a big girl with sharp claws and big teeth. A missed grab attempt might really injure myself. With so many wild squirrels coming through here, a live-trap would be the wrong squirrel.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Looking at your 2022 and 2023 pictures makes me wonder whether there is something else going on, like a fatty cyst, lipoma, etc.

I have a hard time imagining an abscess persisting for so long, and the lump seems to be in the same place.

After reading about abscesses, I'm starting to think her bump is something else too. Really hoping AB would help but have been told that it needs an I & D procedure to clear it. Either way, she needs a Vet to help.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Same concern I have for Mo; she is wild and a big girl with sharp claws and big teeth. A missed grab attempt might really injure myself. With so many wild squirrels coming through here, a live-trap would be the wrong squirrel.

Hi Olorin19,

After reading a few posts on Harry, the Yard Gang, and the paintball helmet, there is no way I'm jumping Mo in the backyard with a towel or something. I'll be swiss cheese! I did laugh alot reading but honestly, its serious business when a squirrel panics!

[Tashahaven]

I typed this earlier, but forgot to hit send. So I’m not sure what if anything may have been said in the meantime :)

I have been PMing with SSG the past week discussing potential options for care. The couple goes out of town for a few months starting at the end of this month. Hopefully MO will be ok until they return, and by then we can help get her some help.

The hope is (in my mind) it’s a lipoma. While they can be uncomfortable, they aren’t dangerous, unless or until it begins hindering mobility and range of motion, or with where this one is located, potentially affecting breathing functions.

It appears to be consistent with a lipoma based on the non symmetrical shape, and length of time it has been gaining in size, while not seeming to cause her pain. If it is a lipoma, they will get bigger when she gains weight (going into winter, or while pregnant) but unfortunately not decrease in size when she loses weight. Which is why they typically will require surgical intervention once they reach a certain size. They CAN return down the road, but most won’t as long as the margins are clear when it’s excised.

[Tashahaven]

No joke is right! They are tiny creatures with IMPRESSIVE strength and power! They have between 7,000 - 20,000 pounds per square inch of bite force in their jaw.

I know you are worried about potentially trapping a different squirrel while attempting to catch MO, but with her being disadvantaged right now (and/or possibly pregnant as well) she already tries to avoid territorial/food disputes with other squirrels by coming early morning or at dusk. So as long as you are only placing it out at the times she routinely comes now, the chances are much less. You should make sure all arrangements have been made, and plans are in place BEFORE considering catching her. Arranging for the vet or wildlife center to do the procedure, as well as having a safe environment set up for her to recover afterward, if you will be providing the care, along with food and other requirements.

If it is indeed a lipoma, it cannot be “drained” with a needle, they will need to make an incision large enough to actually scoop out the accumulated fat deposits. Which means stitches, and possibly an e collar or other means of protecting it from her scratching it open.

If the procedure is done in winter, chances are her current nest will be taken over by another squirrel once she is no longer around to defend it. So you might need to care for her until there is enough foliage on the trees for her to be able to build a new nest. Or you might be able to provide her with a safe nest box to make her own.

What do others think?

[Shellysfriend]

325649Around my house catching squirrels is easy, catching the right squirrel is not. I modified a live trap and removed the automatic trigger and use a piece of heavy wire or rod tied to a string that holds the door mechanism open. Instead of them stepping on the plate I decided when to pull the rod out. Since you’re able to watch for her your odds are really good. Set the trap right by where you feed loaded with nuts. They’ll figure it out, even the cautious ones. I would use a larger trap not the traditional squirrel trap, more raccoon sized. Less risk of tail damage.

[supersquirrelgirl]

I typed this earlier, but forgot to hit send. So I’m not sure what if anything may have been said in the meantime :)

I have been PMing with SSG the past week discussing potential options for care. The couple goes out of town for a few months starting at the end of this month. Hopefully MO will be ok until they return, and by then we can help get her some help.

The hope is (in my mind) it’s a lipoma. While they can be uncomfortable, they aren’t dangerous, unless or until it begins hindering mobility and range of motion, or with where this one is located, potentially affecting breathing functions.

It appears to be consistent with a lipoma based on the non symmetrical shape, and length of time it has been gaining in size, while not seeming to cause her pain. If it is a lipoma, they will get bigger when she gains weight (going into winter, or while pregnant) but unfortunately not decrease in size when she loses weight. Which is why they typically will require surgical intervention once they reach a certain size. They CAN return down the road, but most won’t as long as the margins are clear when it’s excised.

Been reading up on lipoma but one symptom doesn't fit; the lump is not soft, its rather hard which is why we first thought this might be a dislocated shoulder. It quite firm with no give.

Honestly, I feel the road crossing is the most dangerous right now. The other night when Mo and kid were crossing road, the kid hesitated and ran back to curb. Seconds later a car drove around and kid ran right into the front wheel hubcap. Luckily kid bounced off back to curb and quickly climb a tree. I just about had a heart attack. Kid is okay but shaken up.

When we leave town, the squirrel food box is not left out. All the squirrels seem to understand no box, no food, and stop coming around. After we come home, it takes about a week before the word is out and they come back. There is always one scout squirrel who looks around.

325650

[supersquirrelgirl]

No joke is right! They are tiny creatures with IMPRESSIVE strength and power! They have between 7,000 - 20,000 pounds per square inch of bite force in their jaw.

I know you are worried about potentially trapping a different squirrel while attempting to catch MO, but with her being disadvantaged right now (and/or possibly pregnant as well) she already tries to avoid territorial/food disputes with other squirrels by coming early morning or at dusk. So as long as you are only placing it out at the times she routinely comes now, the chances are much less. You should make sure all arrangements have been made, and plans are in place BEFORE considering catching her. Arranging for the vet or wildlife center to do the procedure, as well as having a safe environment set up for her to recover afterward, if you will be providing the care, along with food and other requirements.

If it is indeed a lipoma, it cannot be “drained” with a needle, they will need to make an incision large enough to actually scoop out the accumulated fat deposits. Which means stitches, and possibly an e collar or other means of protecting it from her scratching it open.

If the procedure is done in winter, chances are her current nest will be taken over by another squirrel once she is no longer around to defend it. So you might need to care for her until there is enough foliage on the trees for her to be able to build a new nest. Or you might be able to provide her with a safe nest box to make her own.

What do others think?

Ms. MO has recently been coming at all different hours and coming with her kids, boyfriends, and others so it now hard to single her out for the trap. Mo's only problem is with Suzie, the aggressive new comer. BTW, Suzie is pregnant not Mo.

I plan to continue AB for for one more week. She came yesterday morning before the heat and today early evening after the heat. (its 97 degrees today). All squirrels here follow that pattern. I spay water on the patio in late afternoon to cool it down. Mo has only had 7 doses since August-4th. She stop coming everyday.

[supersquirrelgirl]

325649Around my house catching squirrels is easy, catching the right squirrel is not. I modified a live trap and removed the automatic trigger and use a piece of heavy wire or rod tied to a string that holds the door mechanism open. Instead of them stepping on the plate I decided when to pull the rod out. Since you’re able to watch for her your odds are really good. Set the trap right by where you feed loaded with nuts. They’ll figure it out, even the cautious ones. I would use a larger trap not the traditional squirrel trap, more raccoon sized. Less risk of tail damage.

Thank you for the idea! We have a minor problem...........For many years, the squirrels (including Mo) come to the food box and just open and slam close the top like a door bell. Then they stand at the back door waiting for it to open. We leave the sliding screendoor open and just close glass door. The screendoor is a dark solar screen so no way to see in. The squirrels do not like hearing people without seeing them.

Some days, no squirrels come and other days seems like the whole neighborhood is here. Some get along and others do not.

[Tashahaven]

YIKES! That MUST have been heart stopping SCARY!

Im glad he is okay!

It’s very difficult to attempt to “diagnose” and/or determine WHAT it is over the internet/with photos.

Have you been able to handle her at all? Palpitate and touch, Ms MOs mass? Its location makes it kind of tricky to determine what it is, with confidence.

If you have been able to touch, feel, push, investigate this mass. Please provide as many details as you can. Texture, firmness, reaction/pain, can you kinda push it around as a whole under the skin? Does it truly feel like it is 2 separate masses, like you thought it might be a few posts back?

Even though a Lipoma IS a collection/deposit of accumulated fat cells. (Like I said in our PMs ((but haven’t detailed on the open board yet)) “RE: Lipomas” think about cellulite on humans. As each pocket of fat grows, the area appears chunky, non symmetrical.) Now consider her “growth”… as a continued collection of these irregular sized, fat cells.

In the early stages of a Lipoma it is a relatively “squishy” mass. As it continues to develop, it becomes more constricted, and therefore firm. As her weight fluctuates/time passes, and it gets larger. The “Sac” (I am not a medical professional by any means. And it’s 1am my time & I am POOPED lol. But trying here!) containing this “fat tumor”, stretches, and tries to accommodate it. However the skin only has so much elasticity. So it will pull taught the surrounding tissues, therefore, seeming more hard/firm.

I continue to focus on it being a Lipoma. Because I feel that would ultimately give her the highest chances of survival.

If it’s not. It could be a tumor/cancer/lymphoma, which is a whole different set of circumstances, and challenges. Cancerous (or even benign) tumors, are typically much “harder”, like feeling a golf ball beneath the skin, as opposed to a very full, “tight” water balloon.

Hope that makes sense. As I said. I’m pooped. I apologize if I’m speaking gibberish!

when I had a Lipoma on the back of my shoulder: It started as a small squishy lump, which I hardly noticed. Over the course of a year, year 1/2 I went from 95lbs, to about 165lbs. The mass grew steadily/consistently along with my weight gain. When I dropped 60 lbs in a matter of months, the ugly alien on my shoulder remained, but was now extremely prominent, noticeable, irregularly shaped, UGLY, and no longer “squishy”, but quite “taught, rigid” somewhere between a tennis ball, and a rubber “bouncy ball”. I called it my purse holder. It was large enough (baseball size) and rigid/tight enough, that it would hold my purse up for me on my shoulder. It kept my straps from falling down. Eventually it was more of a hinderance, limited my arm range of motion, impacted my self esteem, and my bra straps irritated it. So I had it removed. Local anesthetic, 1 1/2” incision, but what they pulled out will haunt my nightmares forevermore! Haha

not sure if it will provide any insights, or clarifications, but hopefully so.

With the help of the wonderful people on TSB, and the wealth of knowledge here, I feel we can definitely come up with a doable plan, and brainstorm solutions to help Ms MO.

💕💕🙏🏻🙏🏻💕💕🙏🏻🙏🏻💕💕🙏🏻🙏🏻

[supersquirrelgirl]

I'd continue to dose the antibiotic as regularly as possible. Has any noticeable change in the abscess occur?

Treating abscesses with antibiotics is only minimally effective since they have a hard time penetrating into abscesses, which is why draining them when possible is always the best course. Draining in itself can be the "fix" in itself, but certainly adding antibiotics provides another level of reassurance.

If there is not a noticeable change... decreasing in size and best case bursting of the abscess... I'd recommend switching, or even stacking (adding another), antibiotic. I'd go with Bactrim or Doxycycline if I could.

Hi Spanky, found some Bactrim and Doxy AB.

1) Bactrim DS 800-160 mg tablet
2) Doxycycline 250 mg tablet

Still giving Mo squirrel amox-clav when she comes. Last dose was yesteday at 5pm PDT from a new mix. Hoping to see her today but landscapers comes in 2-3 hours so probably a no-show today. Her AB walnut is made already.

Swtich AB or stacking ?? Need dose info for stacking. Thank you

[Tashahaven]

I really hope StS, Mel, CM & Spanky weigh in on what they believe this mass MIGHT be, based on photos/length of time. And whether a second stacked AB is the recommended course of treatment.

I worry about adding additional ABs (unless the peeps above, agree it will help) simply because it can wreak havoc on good bacteria in the gut, or potentially lead to a level of resistance, when needed in the future. Especially if she isn’t consistently able to get her current daily dose.

I wish there was a way to tag people on TSB lol.

[supersquirrelgirl]

I really hope StS, Mel, CM & Spanky weigh in on what they believe this mass MIGHT be, based on photos/length of time. And whether a second stacked AB is the recommended course of treatment.

I worry about adding additional ABs (unless the peeps above, agree it will help) simply because it can wreak havoc on good bacteria in the gut, or potentially lead to a level of resistance, when needed in the future. Especially if she isn’t consistently able to get her current daily dose.

I wish there was a way to tag people on TSB lol.

Agree, stand-by for directions.

No Mo as of 4:30p PDT and Landscapers just left (squirrels hate that load blower sound). Its still hot outside but sun is lower so road now has some shade. But road traffic increases. Mo might be in woods and come down main street fence on way home.

[Spanky]

1) Bactrim DS 800-160 mg tablet

Dosing sent by PM for bactrim.

You can give both the Augmentin and Bactrim today if the op presents, but with the more recent revelations that the lump may have developed over the course of months, not days or weeks, leaves me less optimistic this is an abscess. Give the Bactrim a try and see if it has any positive impact; I think the Bactrim is a better choice since missing doses with doxyclycine would be less ideal than bactrim (of course, ideal is daily dosing at a minimum).

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

Hello Supersquirrelgirl:
I have been at work most of the day and still there but I have tried to get back to Ms Mo's thread when I have a moment to catch up. It sounds as if MM has had this lump associated with her left arm just below the shoulder for 6 months, give or take and that there is a bit of skin redness also associated with this lump. I don't see any mention of drainage but if so, please describe the drainage as to color and thickness (does it appear bloody, clear or opaque and pus-like or other)? As has been mentioned in MM's thread, there has been some tossing about of what in medicine is called a differential diagnosis. This is where a Veterinarian or physician would list possibilities for what could be going on and ideally put that list in the form in order of likelihood (put the most likely at the the top of the list and least likely toward the bottom). This sounds easy enough but there must knowledge of the possibilities as a start, along with ideally, knowing some history (which we know very little if anything beyond the time-frame) such as injury or whatever and again, ideally, being able to actually examine this mass by palpation (feeling it) or with imaging studies such as an ultrasound (which would be very simple if MM could be caught, sedated by an experienced Vet and an ultrasound examination be performed by the Vet. This would indicated whether or not the mass was hollow which would suggest an abscess or another fluid containing problem or if the mass was solid which would then suggest a among many possibilities; a tumor of some sort Malignant or benign), a hematoma (a collection of blood in the skin which can occur from an injury and often takes months to resolve as the blood must be resorbed) or again, many others. This may be a fracture with blood around the fracture site causing the mass. I would certainly recommend if I had my druthers about this; capturing Ms Mo and having her examined by an experienced Squirrel friendly Vet. Also, as you may have recognized, I am a proponent of liberal use of ultrasonography for things like this as it is simple to perform, is often definitive at least to whether the mass is hollow, solid. Sedation id usually necessary for this and usually necessary to perform a careful, thorough examination. Veterinarians often will sedate animals with a relatively light does of an inhaled anesthetic.

I appears that Ms Mo is taking Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate as an antibiotic with the thought that this is an abscess (and it may be!) and I do recognize how difficult it can be to give a wild Squirrel medication of any sort. Also, as Spanky pointed out, antibiotics do not penetrate into an abscess very well. Spontaneous drainage of abscesses frequently occur in nature and this would be wonderful if this was indeed an abscess. Often, abscesses must be drained using a relatively simple surgical procedure called an Incision and Drainage (I&D). Going back tot he particular antibiotics the Ms Mo is taking and and her actual adherence to the dosing plan, it is my opinion that they will not be effective this way even if you give a higher does as I believe has been suggested. Penicillins (Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate is in the penicillin family of antibiotics) kill NOT by hitting the bacteria with a high does but by giving enough of the antibiotic to reach a therapeutic level in the infected area and then continuing this over time. This is what is called time-dependent killing and skipped doses or the possibility of not getting the full does will invariably result in suboptimal or non-existent therapeutic effect! Ordinarily, Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate would be a good antibiotic to try. SMZ-TMP as well but this too, is time-dependent. It may be that is Cipro was available, this could be utilized as the Fluoroquinolones (cipro and Baytril [Vet use]) have characteristic of time-dependent killing and also Concentration-dependent killing. Using the Cipro at the "high end" of its therapeutic range may be better than the once daily with missed doses of the Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate or you could even try both Cipro (if available of course) and continue the Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate.

Edit: Also, I just noticed that you had Doxycycline available and like the fluoproquinolones, Doxycycline usually exhibits time-dependent killing at lower doses but concentration-dependent killing at higher doses! This may also be an option under the circumstances and I would suggest using this antibiotic at it higher recommended dosing either with the Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate (my first choice) or in place of it.

I realize that I have just written a book and possibly none of this will be helpful but I do wish the best for Ms Mo and for you, Supersquirrelgirl! Thanks for caring so much for this little Squirrel!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[supersquirrelgirl]

Dosing sent by PM for bactrim.

You can give both the Augmentin and Bactrim today if the op presents, but with the more recent revelations that the lump may have developed over the course of months, not days or weeks, leaves me less optimistic this is an abscess. Give the Bactrim a try and see if it has any positive impact; I think the Bactrim is a better choice since missing doses with doxyclycine would be less ideal than bactrim (of course, ideal is daily dosing at a minimum).


Hi Spanky and All;

Stacked AB (Augmentin & Bactrim) ready in walnut but no MO today. I hope she comes in morning but its trash day so big trucks running around roads. Reading on abscess along with all the comments here, are leading me to think this is something different. At this point, all I can do is give stacked AB's for the next week and monitor the result. I'll keep posting updates but getting a little discouraged for many reasons out of my control.

As noted in above posts, we are traveling overseas in about a week for volunteer rabbit care in Japan and will be back in October. Mo as well as many other squirrels will miss us but they have many other sources of food. I just hope the AB help her but if not, its more serious and we need to rethink how to help her when we get back. Everyone on TSB has been great and I wish we found you a year ago. Thank you so much for all the help and advice. We have learned alot and hope to pay-it-forward.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Hello Supersquirrelgirl:
I have been at work most of the day and still there but I have tried to get back to Ms Mo's thread when I have a moment to catch up. It sounds as if MM has had this lump associated with her left arm just below the shoulder for 6 months, give or take and that there is a bit of skin redness also associated with this lump. I don't see any mention of drainage but if so, please describe the drainage as to color and thickness (does it appear bloody, clear or opaque and pus-like or other)? As has been mentioned in MM's thread, there has been some tossing about of what in medicine is called a differential diagnosis. This is where a Veterinarian or physician would list possibilities for what could be going on and ideally put that list in the form in order of likelihood (put the most likely at the the top of the list and least likely toward the bottom). This sounds easy enough but there must knowledge of the possibilities as a start, along with ideally, knowing some history (which we know very little if anything beyond the time-frame) such as injury or whatever and again, ideally, being able to actually examine this mass by palpation (feeling it) or with imaging studies such as an ultrasound (which would be very simple if MM could be caught, sedated by an experienced Vet and an ultrasound examination be performed by the Vet. This would indicated whether or not the mass was hollow which would suggest an abscess or another fluid containing problem or if the mass was solid which would then suggest a among many possibilities; a tumor of some sort Malignant or benign), a hematoma (a collection of blood in the skin which can occur from an injury and often takes months to resolve as the blood must be resorbed) or again, many others. This may be a fracture with blood around the fracture site causing the mass. I would certainly recommend if I had my druthers about this; capturing Ms Mo and having her examined by an experienced Squirrel friendly Vet. Also, as you may have recognized, I am a proponent of liberal use of ultrasonography for things like this as it is simple to perform, is often definitive at least to whether the mass is hollow, solid. Sedation id usually necessary for this and usually necessary to perform a careful, thorough examination. Veterinarians often will sedate animals with a relatively light does of an inhaled anesthetic.

I appears that Ms Mo is taking Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate as an antibiotic with the thought that this is an abscess (and it may be!) and I do recognize how difficult it can be to give a wild Squirrel medication of any sort. Also, as Spanky pointed out, antibiotics do not penetrate into an abscess very well. Spontaneous drainage of abscesses frequently occur in nature and this would be wonderful if this was indeed an abscess. Often, abscesses must be drained using a relatively simple surgical procedure called an Incision and Drainage (I&D). Going back tot he particular antibiotics the Ms Mo is taking and and her actual adherence to the dosing plan, it is my opinion that they will not be effective this way even if you give a higher does as I believe has been suggested. Penicillins (Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate is in the penicillin family of antibiotics) kill NOT by hitting the bacteria with a high does but by giving enough of the antibiotic to reach a therapeutic level in the infected area and then continuing this over time. This is what is called time-dependent killing and skipped doses or the possibility of not getting the full does will invariably result in suboptimal or non-existent therapeutic effect! Ordinarily, Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate would be a good antibiotic to try. SMZ-TMP as well but this too, is time-dependent. It may be that is Cipro was available, this could be utilized as the Fluoroquinolones (cipro and Baytril [Vet use]) have characteristic of time-dependent killing and also Concentration-dependent killing. Using the Cipro at the "high end" of its therapeutic range may be better than the once daily with missed doses of the Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate or you could even try both Cipro (if available of course) and continue the Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate.

Edit: Also, I just noticed that you had Doxycycline available and like the fluoproquinolones, Doxycycline usually exhibits time-dependent killing at lower doses but concentration-dependent killing at higher doses! This may also be an option under the circumstances and I would suggest using this antibiotic at it higher recommended dosing either with the Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate (my first choice) or in place of it.

I realize that I have just written a book and possibly none of this will be helpful but I do wish the best for Ms Mo and for you, Supersquirrelgirl! Thanks for caring so much for this little Squirrel!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

Hello SamtheSquirrel,

Beyond words to thank you for taking time at work this late to respond. I was writing my post as we crossed.

The lump on Ms Mo has been there for about 1 year as we checked many photos back to July/2022. It was small and completely missed. In last 6 months, it has grown and clearly cannot be missed. It certainly looks more complex now than ever. Its clear that she needs Vet care and imaging to pinpoint the real issue to resolve this. I have discussed with local Vets with no luck due to CA laws. My only hope is a Wildlife Center nearby that will take her in October and provide Vet and Rehab care. Trapping her is going to be a challenge and I'm too afraid to just jump her with a towel/blanket. As I just posted, we leave town in 1 week so this action will have to wait until we return.

Honestly, I wish there was some way to sedate her here and take to a Vet for diagnosis to plan next step. A magic pill to put her asleep where we could help her. Lately she comes randomly based on many factors in the neighborhood and hot weather.

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

Edit: Also, I just noticed that you had Doxycycline available and like the fluoproquinolones, Doxycycline usually exhibits time-dependent killing at lower doses but concentration-dependent killing at higher doses! This may also be an option under the circumstances and I would suggest using this antibiotic at it higher recommended dosing either with the Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate (my first choice) or in place of it.
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel


Hello SamtheSquirrel,

Beyond words to thank you for taking time at work this late to respond. I was writing my post as we crossed.

The lump on Ms Mo has been there for about 1 year as we checked many photos back to July/2022. It was small and completely missed. In last 6 months, it has grown and clearly cannot be missed. It certainly looks more complex now than ever. Its clear that she needs Vet care and imaging to pinpoint the real issue to resolve this. I have discussed with local Vets with no luck due to CA laws. My only hope is a Wildlife Center nearby that will take her in October and provide Vet and Rehab care. Trapping her is going to be a challenge and I'm too afraid to just jump her with a towel/blanket. As I just posted, we leave town in 1 week so this action will have to wait until we return.

Honestly, I wish there was some way to sedate her here and take to a Vet for diagnosis to plan next step. A magic pill to put her asleep where we could help her. Lately she comes randomly based on many factors in the neighborhood and hot weather.

Hello again SSG:
Maybe consider using the Doxycycline (at one of it's higher but accepted therapeutic ranges) as an option for antibiotic treatment for the presumptive abscess. Under the circumstances which are that MO is not showing up regularly for her current antibiotic schedule and is not being dosed often enough to make an antibiotic that kills in a time-dependent manner such as Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate likely to be effective! The Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate kills bacteria based upon the time that the drug concentration is kept at or above minimums rather than concentration dependent which would be more likely to be effective if drug levels are not able to be kept consistently in the therapeutic range. Doxycycline in higher therapeutic ranges tends to exhibit concentration-dependent characteristics of bacteria killing while in relatively lower doses, it too is time-dependent.
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[supersquirrelgirl]

Hello again SSG:
Maybe consider using the Doxycycline (at one of it's higher but accepted therapeutic ranges) as an option for antibiotic treatment for the presumptive abscess. Under the circumstances which are that MO is not showing up regularly for her current antibiotic schedule and is not being dosed often enough to make an antibiotic that kills in a time-dependent manner such as Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate likely to be effective! The Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate kills bacteria based upon the time that the drug concentration is kept at or above minimums rather than concentration dependent which would be more likely to be effective if drug levels are not able to be kept consistently in the therapeutic range. Doxycycline in higher therapeutic ranges tends to exhibit concentration-dependent characteristics of bacteria killing while in relatively lower doses, it too is time-dependent.
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

Hi SamtheSquirrel,

Unfortunately I checked the Doxycycline tablet code and its Cipro 250mg NOT doxy. My post above is wrong. I only have Bactrim as noted. I have no access to Doxycycline.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Friday Aug-18th Update:

Good Morning, I have some significant updates today.

Mo squirrel and her boy (many months old) came at 7:45am. Gave Mo the walnut with AB Clavamox & Bactrim mix in. Unlike all the previous times, she ate about 1/3 and dropped it but ate raw walnuts and sunflower seeds. I think Bactrim must have yukky taste. Future feedings, I'm going to prepare 2 walnut shells with each AB and give the Clavamox nut first.

Something changed on her lump. (See picture) Looks like she chewed the bottom part and it appears to be raw and wet. I try to touch it, hoping to apply some pressure, but she moved away. Not really sure what to make of this. I did notice she was using the left hand much more while eating and them walking on it as she left. I felt hopeful seeing this.

Frankly, I'm surprised that after months with the big lump, she decided to chew on it. I compared pictures and it looks like the lower part of lump is gone. Could it be draining ? I'm guarded in my thinking but definitely something has changed. Could the AB caused her to take action ??

325655

[Tashahaven]

It could be one of two scenarios:

1. (fingers crossed) If it is an abscess, maybe it started draining?

2. She licked/chewed at what she can reach. Surprised she hadn’t done so sooner tbh. In looking closer at the photos, I don’t believe it’s actually any smaller, I believe it just seems that way because it is wet, and the appearance is altered as a result. If you look at the damp fur, you can still see the outline of the lower part of the mass, it just doesn’t appear as prominent because the hair isn’t sticking up.

Keep observing and take photos when you can. I HOPE it might be draining. If so, this has been the longest I’ve ever seen an abscess persist! Craziness!

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

Friday Aug-18th Update:

Good Morning, I have some significant updates today.

Mo squirrel and her boy (many months old) came at 7:45am. Gave Mo the walnut with AB Clavamox & Bactrim mix in. Unlike all the previous times, she ate about 1/3 and dropped it but ate raw walnuts and sunflower seeds. I think Bactrim must have yukky taste. Future feedings, I'm going to prepare 2 walnut shells with each AB and give the Clavamox nut first.

Something changed on her lump. (See picture) Looks like she chewed the bottom part and it appears to be raw and wet. I try to touch it, hoping to apply some pressure, but she moved away. Not really sure what to make of this. I did notice she was using the left hand much more while eating and them walking on it as she left. I felt hopeful seeing this.

Frankly, I'm surprised that after months with the big lump, she decided to chew on it. I compared pictures and it looks like the lower part of lump is gone. Could it be draining ? I'm guarded in my thinking but definitely something has changed. Could the AB caused her to take action ??

Hello again SSG:
It may be that Mo has chewed on the mass. I wouldn't know how to explain why taking the antibiotics could somehow entice Mo into chewing on the mass but who knows...
On your photos from August 11th, it appears that there is a small area on the lower portion of the skin overlying the mass that has some loss of fur and the skin is visible there. This may be a sign that Mo had begun to chew on this before today. Also, as happens sometimes with an abscess in the skin when the overlying skin gets stretched or simply begins to "thin out," the fur over this area is lost.

I'm with Tasha in that if this truly is an abscess and it has started to drain, either spontaneously or with a little help from Mo's incisors; this would tend to be a good thing! Do you notice any actual drainage seeping from the area with the mass? Thanks for the updates! Please tell Mo that I said hello!

Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[supersquirrelgirl]

It could be one of two scenarios:

1. (fingers crossed) If it is an abscess, maybe it started draining?

2. She licked/chewed at what she can reach. Surprised she hadn’t done so sooner tbh. In looking closer at the photos, I don’t believe it’s actually any smaller, I believe it just seems that way because it is wet, and the appearance is altered as a result. If you look at the damp fur, you can still see the outline of the lower part of the mass, it just doesn’t appear as prominent because the hair isn’t sticking up.

Keep observing and take photos when you can. I HOPE it might be draining. If so, this has been the longest I’ve ever seen an abscess persist! Craziness!

Thank you. Not sure what to think. I did notice that she is missing fur & skin between wrist and elbow. It looked pretty raw in there. I messed-up and combined both AB into 1 nut. Guessing she only got partial AB since nut was 1/2 gone. Not good.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Hello again SSG:
It may be that Mo has chewed on the mass. I wouldn't know how to explain why taking the antibiotics could somehow entice Mo into chewing on the mass but who knows...
On your photos from August 11th, it appears that there is a small area on the lower portion of the skin overlying the mass that has some loss of fur and the skin is visible there. This may be a sign that Mo had begun to chew on this before today. Also, as happens sometimes with an abscess in the skin when the overlying skin gets stretched or simply begins to "thin out," the fur over this area is lost.

I'm with Tasha in that if this truly is an abscess and it has started to drain, either spontaneously or with a little help from Mo's incisors; this would tend to be a good thing! Do you notice any actual drainage seeping from the area with the mass? Thanks for the updates! Please tell Mo that I said hello!

Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

Hi SamtheSquirrel, I try to touch the lump but she's not have it......she quickly move away. Honestly, its hard tell what made the wetness. Since she comes from across the street through people lawns, the sprinklers could could have wet the grass on her way over. I will check mine if they ran. What I did notice is the redness in the chewed area. Maybe blood or raw skin ?? I did not see anything draining like white goo or puss. That's why I wanted to push the lump.

Mo loves you too and certainly she loves Tashahaven! Its awesome to meet her kids.......they look just like her!......the 4th generation here. Many liters over the years.

[Tashahaven]

AWE I think it is soo special she brings her babies to visit you! How amazing it must me to witness. She clearly LOVES and TRUSTS you greatly! What a sweetheart!

This was the biggest thing to break my heart with my recent baby, I ALWAYS imagined being able to keep an eye on her, see her daily, AND meet her kids! I’m sad I’ll never experience that with her, but she is loving a happy life in the trees, and I’m grateful I get some updates from the folks who took and released her a few months ago. (And she’s probably prego now, about to have her first litter or possibly did this week)

Mo adores you. That is soo special! She KNOWS how much you care and love her. God bless her! 🥰🥰💕💕🙏🏻🙏🏻

[supersquirrelgirl]

AWE I think it is soo special she brings her babies to visit you! How amazing it must me to witness. She clearly LOVES and TRUSTS you greatly! What a sweetheart!

This was the biggest thing to break my heart with my recent baby, I ALWAYS imagined being able to keep an eye on her, see her daily, AND meet her kids! I’m sad I’ll never experience that with her, but she is loving a happy life in the trees, and I’m grateful I get some updates from the folks who took and released her a few months ago. (And she’s probably prego now, about to have her first litter or possibly did this week)

Mo adores you. That is soo special! She KNOWS how much you care and love her. God bless her! ����������������

Thank you so much! Don't be sad, your efforts have change history for your baby and soon to be family. Without you, it would not be possible. I believe in fate, you will get the chance again! We have many joys and sadness with Ms Mo and her kids. At this moment, I believe its Mo's daughter who is nursing and comes here sometimes. Again, looks just like her. For the nearby green space woods, Ms. Mo (very golden tummy) and Ms. Cutie (very white tummy) are the local Godmothers with kids everywhere.

Around here is mostly fox squirrels but there is 2 grey squirrel moms and their young families. They are much smaller and very careful around people.

[Tashahaven]

I have been thinking a lot about your situation and trying to come up with ways to possibly catch her, without using a trap.

I wonder if you were to set up a small release cage in a far corner of your yard, with a nest box, and provided food, water and nesting materials for her, if she MIGHT decide to make it a home, if it were somewhat protected/hidden, and in an area with shade? It’s a long shot, but might be worth a try? If she is feeling at a disadvantage in her current condition, this would provide her a safe secure reprieve with readily accessible food/water/comfort. Then you can close it up at night after she goes to sleep.

That’s all I could come up with, other than using a live trap…

[supersquirrelgirl]

I have been thinking a lot about your situation and trying to come up with ways to possibly catch her, without using a trap.

I wonder if you were to set up a small release cage in a far corner of your yard, with a nest box, and provided food, water and nesting materials for her, if she MIGHT decide to make it a home, if it were somewhat protected/hidden, and in an area with shade? It’s a long shot, but might be worth a try? If she is feeling at a disadvantage in her current condition, this would provide her a safe secure reprieve with readily accessible food/water/comfort. Then you can close it up at night after she goes to sleep.

That’s all I could come up with, other than using a live trap…

Thank you for thinking about Mo. I was hoping she come this morning but not yet. (1pm now) Maybe later ? She has been a no-show for the last 2 Saturdays.

In our neighborhood, its against HOA rules to have animal cages of any kind. Nearby neighbors would certainly report it. Honestly, there a high chance other squirrels would just eat the food, relax during the day, and use it like a 2nd home. Right now, there are about 4 squirrels laying around in backyard and on fence. Many more will pass thru in the coming hours.

When Mo was here yesterday, she really seemed upbeat and good mobility. I think she was happier. Lets see today if she comes.

[supersquirrelgirl]

August 20th Update:

Ms Mo was a no-show yesterday but did come today in the morning. I made 2 AB nuts this time and she powered them down one after another (I was surprised on nut #2 with Bactrim). She had much more energy and was jumpng around the grass and running up & down the fence. After eating her 2 AB nuts, she jumped back on the fence, ran & hopped on the tree banch that goes to neighbor's roof. Across the roof she goes into the green space woods. Normally, she gets a whole walnut and runs across the street to home. Not today, she was climbing good and rushed to the woods. Boyfriend time ??

Her left hand mobility was the best I've seen in months. Her walking was on all fours and seemed more natural. She seemed too excited to stick around which made it hard to get photos. The picture below is extracted from the only video shot while here.

I'm not sure what to think. Looking closely, I believe the lump is much smaller on the bottom which give her more use of the arm. I believe that's where she chewed it a few days ago. The lump upper part appears the same. Honestly, she came through here so fast there was no time to study her.

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[SamtheSquirrel2018]

August 20th Update:

Ms Mo was a no-show yesterday but did come today in the morning. I made 2 AB nuts this time and she powered them down one after another (I was surprised on nut #2 with Bactrim). She had much more energy and was jumpng around the grass and running up & down the fence. After eating her 2 AB nuts, she jumped back on the fence, ran & hopped on the tree banch that goes to neighbor's roof. Across the roof she goes into the green space woods. Normally, she gets a whole walnut and runs across the street to home. Not today, she was climbing good and rushed to the woods. Boyfriend time ??

Her left hand mobility was the best I've seen in months. Her walking was on all fours and seemed more natural. She seemed too excited to stick around which made it hard to get photos. The picture below is extracted from the only video shot while here.

I'm not sure what to think. Looking closely, I believe the lump is much smaller on the bottom which give her more use of the arm. I believe that's where she chewed it a few days ago. The lump upper part appears the same. Honestly, she came through here so fast there was no time to study her.

Great news! Maybe this was an abscess all along and Ms Mo finally performed her own I&D!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[supersquirrelgirl]

Great news! Maybe this was an abscess all along and Ms Mo finally performed her own I&D!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

Thank you SamtheSquirrel !! its now Dr Mo.

BTW, I reread your posted comments on TD-antibiotics vs CD-antibiotics along with various internet medical studies. Very interesting for the CD-AB and makes me wonder if switching to cipro would be a benefit. Mo is basically getting every other day on average of TD-AB (amox-clav & bactrim). I'm only in town this coming week. I have all the meds here so switching is easy. Cipro taste bad so need to consider how to mask it in walnuts or pecans.

Any thoughts ?? (Spanky ??)

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

Thank you SamtheSquirrel !! its now Dr Mo.

BTW, I reread your posted comments on TD-antibiotics vs CD-antibiotics along with various internet medical studies. Very interesting for the CD-AB and makes me wonder if switching to cipro would be a benefit. Mo is basically getting every other day on average of TD-AB (amox-clav & bactrim). I'm only in town this coming week. I have all the meds here so switching is easy. Cipro taste bad so need to consider how to mask it in walnuts or pecans.

Any thoughts ?? (Spanky ??)

Hi SSG:
It may be worth adding Cipro or simply changing to Cipro for its more concentration dependent characteristics. Ordinarily, neither Cipro nor Enrofloxacin (Baytril is the brand and it is the Veterinary fluoroquinolone very similar to Cipro) is dosed once per day. Of course, neither is Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate which has Time Dependent characteristics. If you were considering this for Doctor Mo, I would suggest using a usual accepted dosing protocol that would be ordinarily be dosed twice daily (although you will know that Dr. Mo will only get it once a day). Also, there are potential serious complications with Fluoroquinolones and we definitely would not want Dr. Mo to have a tendon rupture!

I have seen mentioned, high dose once a day therapy with Cipro for "rodents" and one of our commonly used references mentions this very protocol BUT they inadvertently misquoted the primary reference that they used to justify this recommendation and it is crucial to recognize that the original once daily high dose regimen was recommended for only two rodent species, neither of which were Rats or Squirrels! It may be best to now leave things as they are since it appears that Dr. Mo has treated herself although this may not really be the case. Is there any active drainage and is the mass noticeably decreased in size? I know this was all jumbled together but I am back at work and with limited time; but I did want give you my comments.
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[supersquirrelgirl]

Hi SSG:
It may be worth adding Cipro or simply changing to Cipro for its more concentration dependent characteristics. Ordinarily, neither Cipro nor Enrofloxacin (Baytril is the brand and it is the Veterinary fluoroquinolone very similar to Cipro) is dosed once per day. Of course, neither is Amoxicillin plus Clavulanate which has Time Dependent characteristics. If you were considering this for Doctor Mo, I would suggest using a usual accepted dosing protocol that would be ordinarily be dosed twice daily (although you will know that Dr. Mo will only get it once a day). Also, there are potential serious complications with Fluoroquinolones and we definitely would not want Dr. Mo to have a tendon rupture!

I have seen mentioned, high dose once a day therapy with Cipro for "rodents" and one of our commonly used references mentions this very protocol BUT they inadvertently misquoted the primary reference that they used to justify this recommendation and it is crucial to recognize that the original once daily high dose regimen was recommended for only two rodent species, neither of which were Rats or Squirrels! It may be best to now leave things as they are since it appears that Dr. Mo has treated herself although this may not really be the case. Is there any active drainage and is the mass noticeably decreased in size? I know this was all jumbled together but I am back at work and with limited time; but I did want give you my comments.
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

Hi SamtheSquirrel, Thank you again for the time and thoughtful response. My opinion is not stacking cipro on top of current AB's. Since Mo only gets one dose per day and is not under direct supervision, anything could happen without being able to help her. I already made her AB nuts for tomorrow so I will stay the current plan another day. Delaying a day also gives Spanky a chance to chime-in (I know he is real busy).

Today's visit was so quick, I could not get a good look at her lump. She acted like ants in her pants and want to eat fast and run to the woods. I was surprised by her energy! The one significant improvement I noticed was the improved mobility of left arm/hand and her normal walking, not the limping as before.

The pros of changing to cipro is the post AB effect which might help the unreliable schedule of her. However, I doubt its long enough to bridge 36~48 hours. Also, using high dosage might be risky without supervision.

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

Hi SamtheSquirrel, Thank you again for the time and thoughtful response. My opinion is not stacking cipro on top of current AB's. Since Mo only gets one dose per day and is not under direct supervision, anything could happen without being able to help her. I already made her AB nuts for tomorrow so I will stay the current plan another day. Delaying a day also gives Spanky a chance to chime-in (I know he is real busy).

Today's visit was so quick, I could not get a good look at her lump. She acted like ants in her pants and want to eat fast and run to the woods. I was surprised by her energy! The one significant improvement I noticed was the improved mobility of left arm/hand and her normal walking, not the limping as before.

The pros of changing to cipro is the post AB effect which might help the unreliable schedule of her. However, I doubt its long enough to bridge 36~48 hours. Also, using high dosage might be risky without supervision.

Yes, I would not recommend using a high dose that has not been validated on related rodents such as Rats or preferable on Squirrels themselves! You are absolutely correct about the Post-Antibiotic Effect! This is most often associated with antibiotics that exhibit Concentration-Dependent killing characteristics but there are exceptions to this. Thanks again for your concern for Mo!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[supersquirrelgirl]

August-21 Update:

Mo came this morning at 7:47am with only one thing on her mind; Patrol her old territory in the woods! (I think a continuation from yesterday) She only came here for a brief check-in & good morning wave. No interest in either AB walnuts. Again her energy was high and strong running around. She jump on the fence and chased a few other squirrels down main street fence towards the woods, jumping into trees and back on the fence to continue the chase. Just like the old Mo. I believe she is exerting herself again as the boss in her previous territory. I guess she is feeling much better and confident in her ability.

After many chases up & down main street fence, she returned here to our back fence and started chasing another squirrel. Both squirrels lost their footing and fell on each side of the fence. Mo fell about 6 feet on our side. As soon as she hit the ground, she jumped back on the fence alone, moved down the fence about 10 feet and laid down. I approached with the AB nut but she refused and worked her way back to the woods.

What to make of all this ?? Last 2 days has been exciting to watch Mo return to her old self. She clearly has much more mobility with her left arm. We had more time today to look at the lump and where she chewed. I think it looks smaller with round symmetry on the upper part. From straight-on-view (across shoulders), lump does look smaller and less bulging than before. It continues to be wet and clear but no evidence of puss draining. Again stumped by what this is.

Pictures from today:

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325711

[CritterMom]

It looks to me as though she either chewed or scratched it open and it is FINALLY draining. Just the reduction of pressure from all of that nastiness starting to
drain would make her feel MUCH better. This is good news!

[supersquirrelgirl]

It looks to me as though she either chewed or scratched it open and it is FINALLY draining. Just the reduction of pressure from all of that nastiness starting to
drain would make her feel MUCH better. This is good news!

Thank you! YES, she been working on it a few days now. As SamtheSquirrel said, its a self done I&D procedure. In joking, I called her Dr Mo. Amazing what this guys do to survive in the wild. Seen alot as they come around here for help.

[CritterMom]

OMG, that pus and exudate has been in there for MONTHS. Be very glad you weren't within sniffing distance when that thing went! :eek:yuck

[olorin19]

While my guess would be that Mo used her teeth, I wonder if squirrels ever pop open an abscess using a claw?

It seems like their claws would be plenty sharp enough as well as long enough: When overwintering squirrels, I wear two pairs of sweatpants and still get some slight punctures on my legs from being used as a climbing gym.

[supersquirrelgirl]

While my guess would be that Mo used her teeth, I wonder if squirrels ever pop open an abscess using a claw?

It seems like their claws would be plenty sharp enough as well as long enough: When overwintering squirrels, I wear two pairs of sweatpants and still get some slight punctures on my legs from being used as a climbing gym.

Honestly don't know, my best guess is she chewed it. I haven't seen pus anywhere (or smelled it) but its wet all over....Hmmm

[Tashahaven]

Whatever the cause, it seems she is feeling better! Which is amazing! Glad she is starting to behave like her old self!

You go
Doctor Mo! 😜

[supersquirrelgirl]

Whatever the cause, it seems she is feeling better! Which is amazing! Glad she is starting to behave like her old self!

You go
Doctor Mo! 😜

Agree. I'm pretty relieved. I owe TSB and many members here for this positive outcome. She been all over the woods today making sure all know who is boss. The other big Mom (Cutie) is best friends. Unfortunately for Ms Suzie, they can rumble now. Suzie has been very low key lately.

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

Agree. I'm pretty relieved. I owe TSB and many members here for this positive outcome. She been all over the woods today making sure all know who is boss. The other big Mom (Cutie) is best friends. Unfortunately for Ms Suzie, they can rumble now. Suzie has been very low key lately.

Good job SSG! Thanks for your concern about and love for Ms (Dr) Mo! I'm glad she is doing well!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[supersquirrelgirl]

Good job SSG! Thanks for your concern about and love for Ms (Dr) Mo! I'm glad she is doing well!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

Thank you. I plan to give her AB's all week if she will eat them. It's my turn (and Mo) to pay it forward to help the next squirrel.

SSG

[supersquirrelgirl]

Update for Aug-23 AM:

So much for giving AB this week. Mo has rejected my walnuts for the last 2 days (Mon & Tue). Basically, she grabs and smells, then drops it. I think she is on to me and telling me No More. Today (Wed), I going to try something new. I made first walnut with no AB to see if she takes it. Then I have a 2nd walnut with AB (clavamox only) to see if she will eat. If this fails, I'm thinking the AB treatment is done and she on her own. Dr Mo is still at work biting the lump. Hope to post new picture later today if she comes. I believe the lump is smaller but honestly, its changing everyday as she works on it.

Her old behavior is back and she is patrolling her old territory in the woods. Chasing many new younger squirrels to let them know who's the boss. She still comes here with kids then runs off to woods. I think she might be fixing up the old nest in the woods or making a new one. In many ways, she is a Squirrel on Fire catching up on lost time. Quick looks at her kids, it hard to tell if that's Mo or not. They are all so golden tummy. The other big family is all white tummy.

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

Update for Aug-23 AM:

So much for giving AB this week. Mo has rejected my walnuts for the last 2 days (Mon & Tue). Basically, she grabs and smells, then drops it. I think she is on to me and telling me No More. Today (Wed), I going to try something new. I made first walnut with no AB to see if she takes it. Then I have a 2nd walnut with AB (clavamox only) to see if she will eat. If this fails, I'm thinking the AB treatment is done and she on her own. Dr Mo is still at work biting the lump. Hope to post new picture later today if she comes. I believe the lump is smaller but honestly, its changing everyday as she works on it.

Her old behavior is back and she is patrolling her old territory in the woods. Chasing many new younger squirrels to let them know who's the boss. She still comes here with kids then runs off to woods. I think she might be fixing up the old nest in the woods or making a new one. In many ways, she is a Squirrel on Fire catching up on lost time. Quick looks at her kids, it hard to tell if that's Mo or not. They are all so golden tummy. The other big family is all white tummy.

Hi SSG:
Thanks for the update on Mo! I'm so glad she is doing better!
I am not sure that we can definitively say that Mo's mass was an abscess but it does sound like it was and that Dr. Mo now is ensuring it drains. IF this really is an abscess, IF Mo has opened this enough to facilitate complete or nearly complete drainage, IF any remaining pus does not get sealed again within the original sac (Mo's continuing to manipulate this region may help prevent this from occurring) and IF there is no significant infection in the skin (cellulitis) surrounding the original mass (pus pocket); my walnut sized brain (yes it is growing! It's gone from pecan size to walnut size in less than a year!) offers the opinion that things will go ok with Mo and she really won't need the antibiotics anyway. Further, with the fact that Clavamox exhibits time-dependent killing and she has had some daily dosing but most has been far less than that and not on regular basis which is also necessary for time-dependent killing because the concentration of the drug must be kept over a period of time at the minimum therapeutic level or better; I am doubtful that she really benefited much if any from the antibiotics. Further, the optimal treatment for most abscesses other than possibly those that are very small is drainage and it appears that Dr. Mo performed the I&D that was apparently needed!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[supersquirrelgirl]

Hi SSG:
Thanks for the update on Mo! I'm so glad she is doing better!
I am not sure that we can definitively say that Mo's mass was an abscess but it does sound like it was and that Dr. Mo now is ensuring it drains. IF this really is an abscess, IF Mo has opened this enough to facilitate complete or nearly complete drainage, IF any remaining pus does not get sealed again within the original sac (Mo's continuing to manipulate this region may help prevent this from occurring) and IF there is no significant infection in the skin (cellulitis) surrounding the original mass (pus pocket); my walnut sized brain (yes it is growing! It's gone from pecan size to walnut size in less than a year!) offers the opinion that things will go ok with Mo and she really won't need the antibiotics anyway. Further, with the fact that Clavamox exhibits time-dependent killing and she has had some daily dosing but most has been far less than that and not on regular basis which is also necessary for time-dependent killing because the concentration of the drug must be kept over a period of time at the minimum therapeutic level or better; I am doubtful that she really benefited much if any from the antibiotics. Further, the optimal treatment for most abscesses other than possibly those that are very small is drainage and it appears that Dr. Mo performed the I&D that was apparently needed!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

Thank you SamtheSquirrel! No Mo taday so thats 3 days in a row with no AB. I hope this lump resolves but I'm guarded as it still has a contour and not flat. Maybe it will take time but the possibility exist there is still a pus sac in upper region. Its now in Mo's hand for the next 6 weeks. I think she will continue to work on it so it can drain enough. Maybe AB's when we get back. I just hope see does move back across the road to the woods as crosiing road is the biggest danger.

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

Thank you SamtheSquirrel! No Mo taday so thats 3 days in a row with no AB. I hope this lump resolves but I'm guarded as it still has a contour and not flat. Maybe it will take time but the possibility exist there is still a pus sac in upper region. Its now in Mo's hand for the next 6 weeks. I think she will continue to work on it so it can drain enough. Maybe AB's when we get back. I just hope see does move back across the road to the woods as crosiing road is the biggest danger.

Hi SSG:
Right now things really seem quite improved. Most concerning at the moment for me is Mo's daily or let's say frequent treks across the road! I too hope she will move back across the street! I wish you a great experience in Japan with your rabbit care endeavor! Those rabbits are very lucky to have you! Please stay in touch! Thank you once again for the love you bestow upon little Mo!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[supersquirrelgirl]

Aug-24th Update:

Mo did not come yesterday (23th -Weds) but was the first one here this morning at 7:30am. She was very happy to see us and I could tell her feelings were upbeat. She did eat the plain walnut but dropped the AB walnut after a bite or two. Really think she on to me so no more AB walnuts.

Comparing pictures today with 2 weeks ago, show an amazing reduction for the lump size. Whatever the lump was, it significantly smaller today. I give her a C- for surgery skills - that area looks rough & raw and I hope it heals quickly.

3 pictures (8/11 before I&D, today, and a zoom out of the arm/lump area):

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325744

325745

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

Aug-24th Update:

Mo did not come yesterday (23th -Weds) but was the first one here this morning at 7:30am. She was very happy to see us and I could tell her feelings were upbeat. She did eat the plain walnut but dropped the AB walnut after a bite or two. Really think she on to me so no more AB walnuts.

Comparing pictures today with 2 weeks ago, show an amazing reduction for the lump size. Whatever the lump was, it significantly smaller today. I give her a C- for surgery skills - that area looks rough & raw and I hope it heals quickly.

3 pictures (8/11 before I&D, today, and a zoom out of the arm/lump area):

Thanks for the update SSG! I'm so happy for little Mo! If we are going to be grading Mo; I'm going to give her a D- for waiting so long but an A+ for effectively getting things done when she finally decided to act and the extra credit (+) is for being NO wimp as she performed her I&D without anesthesia!

Again, have a fun and meaningful trip to Japan, SSG!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[supersquirrelgirl]

Thanks for the update SSG! I'm so happy for little Mo! If we are going to be grading Mo; I'm going to give her a D- for waiting so long but an A+ for effectively getting things done when she finally decided to act and the extra credit (+) is for being NO wimp as she performed her I&D without anesthesia!

Again, have a fun and meaningful trip to Japan, SSG!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

Not sure what took her so long to start chewing but my gut tells me it somehow related to starting AB ?? Something boosted her confidence to go for it. While giving her AB for the past few weeks, I've kept trying to touch the lump but she pulls away. Maybe she reads that as some kind of trigger ?? Whatever it was, it worked!

Love your comments and sense of humor. Very fun to read it. Thank you.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Aug-26 Update:

Last update for Mo before we travel - she looks good.

I want to thank everyone on TSB who support Mo for her recovery. Not sure if her lump is 100% gone but its definitely smaller. Hope it continues to shrink over the next month but we'll see when we get back. Big news we discovered yesterday is Mo is a Grandmother again.

SSG

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[supersquirrelgirl]

Hello Again,

Returned home a few days ago. The scout squirrel has discovered us home and spread the word. Local wilds coming by more and more everyday including Ms Mo.

Update for Mo: She came 2 days ago looking happy we are home. Unfortunately, her shoulder lump is back and about the same size as before taking AB. Her left hand mobility is again limited; history repeating. Mo did not come yesterday (Friday) but did come early this morning. I noticed her walking better and then saw her left shoulder had another I&D procedure by herself like before. Not sure what to think - 6 weeks ago, lump was almost flat but now its back to same size ?? Really a tumor or more like an infection abscess ?? Now thinking of what to do next.

SSG

[supersquirrelgirl]

Advice Needed,

Mo's lump has returned but was chewed-off again (her I&D) resulting in smaller lump with an open wound (looks very rough). I'm considering restarting Clavamox AB as originally done. I also have cipro but worry the bitter taste would be a no-go. For past 2 days, I have been giving her walnut half-shells with no AB. Luckily, she has been coming everyday.

Any suggestions ??

Question: For those giving their squirrel cipro AB orally, how did you hide the bitter taste ??

Thank you, SSG.

[CritterMom]

First, the Clavamox is a MUCH better choice for an abscess than Cipro or Baytril is, so taste doesn't really matter here.

In general, I find grenadine to be about the best easily available thing to use to help the nasty taste of meds. Real grenadine is a reduced syrup made from pomegranate. It is what makes a Cosmopolitan drink pink. Most of what you can get in the stores is synthetic and uses artificial flavors - and it works JUST FINE.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Thank you CM.

Prepared Clavamox this morning and mixed-up half-walnut shell with a drop of honey on top. Waited all day for Mo but a no-show. She been coming daily for the last week but a no-show today. Hmmm, must be on to me again ? Let's see what tomorrow bring. Honestly her no-show makes me check the road that she crosses while holding my breath.

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

Thank you CM.

Prepared Clavamox this morning and mixed-up half-walnut shell with a drop of honey on top. Waited all day for Mo but a no-show. She been coming daily for the last week but a no-show today. Hmmm, must be on to me again ? Let's see what tomorrow bring. Honestly her no-show makes me check the road that she crosses while holding my breath.

Thanks for caring so much for little Mo, SSG! I just noticed that Mo's "lump" has returned. This could still be an abscess related to the initial "lump" that sounds like an abscess as well! Ideally, when the patient herself does not do the surgery and it performed in a controlled setting; an abscess is drained by making an incision into the abscess itself and then what can be drained is drained out and then usually, a hemostat or similar instrument is passed into the abscess and used to break up any remaining walled off parts of the original abscess and then the entire opened pocket in the skin is irrigated to wash out any remaining bit of infected material and loose dead cellular material and whatever else doesn't belong in a clean wound! These are common practices when performing an I&D and if this isn't done; one of the intact "pus pockets" can likely increase in size and/or reinfect the tissues that surrounded the original abscess. I suspect this is what has happened. I hope that Mo returns for her antibiotics! I too worry about the road crossing and keep crossing my fingers!
Thanks again for your love of Mo! We love her too!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[supersquirrelgirl]

Hi SamtheSquirrel,

Thank you for the I&D details. I had a heart2heart talk with Mo 2 days ago about letting me take her to a Vet or Rehab Ctr for a proper clean-out of her lump (this is after I noticed she chewed it again). Her not coming yesterday was in protest of my idea. From her visit today, it looks like she continues to chew it to open more of the skin.

On her visit today, she took the AB walnut to the roof corner and took a few bites then through it down to the ground. It didn't go well. She ran down the fence and climbed her favorite tree to perch. Maybe the drops of honey were a bad idea. I made 2 more half walnuts with half the AB dose in each, hoping she will return later. Today is almost 90 degrees so she's up high catching the breeze. As of 2:30pm, no return. Probably tomorrow ??

My observation is the lump has reduced significantly again with her chewing but its ugly looking. She's running/jumping quite well and chasing other squirrels. I'm hoping for daily AB doses but now that she is so lively, it might repeat last time with missing visits. Many squirrels including Mo are getting in the winter mode stashing and burying food everywhere.

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

Hi SamtheSquirrel,

Thank you for the I&D details. I had a heart2heart talk with Mo 2 days ago about letting me take her to a Vet or Rehab Ctr for a proper clean-out of her lump (this is after I noticed she chewed it again). Her not coming yesterday was in protest of my idea. From her visit today, it looks like she continues to chew it to open more of the skin.

I believe that your honesty with Mo was the best policy! I once lied to a Squirrel and told him that we were going to a Nut Bar and it would be my treat but I was really taking him to the Vet! I have never been forgiven!

Oftentimes, an abscess is also best packed with a gauze strip to hold it open and allow it to drain and the packing may need to be changed a couple of times (or more) before it is finally removed. The final removal is obviously a necessity but it also constitutes part of the treatment because its removal strips off any remaining "crud" (that's a medical term to be sure!) inside the abscess and then a pressure dressing is applied which will help hold the roof of the original pus pocket against the floor of the pocket and allow it to heal. This is in most cases, very difficult with a Squirrel and I just don't pack those as rule. Dressings in themselves are difficult to make secure. I have tried various means including an E-collar and going by experience with the ones I have done and those that are done in the wild that I have observed such as Mo's, most of these drained abscesses seem to do very well!

I am hopeful that this time Dr. Mo will have success!

Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[supersquirrelgirl]

Thanks again SamtheSquirrel.

No success with AB nuts. Mo came last evening around 6pm and rejected both AB walnuts. She took a couple sniffs and dropped them. I gave a 3rd half-shell (no AB) and she gladly ate it. She is on to me and now sniffs each nut. There must be some smell to clavamox that she detects. Initially she gladly ate the AB nuts but now she just not have it. I made AB liquid and nuts exactly the same way. Need to find another way to give AB.

SSG

[supersquirrelgirl]

Some sad news to share.

Ms Mo longtime boyfriend (Freddy) was hit by a car and killed crossing the road about an hour ago. I believe he was over at Mo territory and coming back across to the woods area.

Looking out the window, my heart stopped seeing a dead squirrel on the road. My first thoughts was its Mo. I crushed as Freddy was a very friendly squirrel and important part of the wildlife family here.

RIP Freddy!

[CritterMom]

I am so sorry. People simply don't pay attention when they drive. I am so sorry you lost Freddy.

Have you tried the Nutella with the antibiotics yet? It is very strong tasting AND smelling and may just help with Mo.

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

Thanks again SamtheSquirrel.

No success with AB nuts. Mo came last evening around 6pm and rejected both AB walnuts. She took a couple sniffs and dropped them. I gave a 3rd half-shell (no AB) and she gladly ate it. She is on to me and now sniffs each nut. There must be some smell to clavamox that she detects. Initially she gladly ate the AB nuts but now she just not have it. I made AB liquid and nuts exactly the same way. Need to find another way to give AB.

SSG

Hi SSG:
I had forgotten about your recent trip to Japan and wanted to ask about how things went there!

What is the form the Clavamox you are using (suspension already mixed with water, the original powder for suspension or crushed tablets)?

Also, do you have or might you have access to any other antibiotics? As we discussed before, Clavamox exhibits time-dependent killing which means that the level of the antibiotic must remain in the therapeutic range over a period of time in order for it to work. With very irregular dosing, this becomes an issue! The medications like Cipro (fluoroquinolones) usually exhibit more concentration-dependent killing especially at higher doses which means that a therapeutic dose given "hit or miss" as it sems Mo is getting her antibiotics may be more likely to be effective than with an antibiotic that exhibits time-dependent killing!

Another option I have used for administering medications to a Squirrel besides placing it within a nut is placing it within a grape. I don't usually feed Squirrels grapes except as occasional treats (always with the skin removed) but I have not had a Squirrel who didn't like them. I always remove the skin because of the potential for getting the skin caught in the throat. I use green or red grapes and avoid concord grapes as they have a very high oxalate content but it really will not make any difference in that regard as you are only using them for a short while. I just cut a little "incision" in the Grape, dig out a bit of the grape itself and put the medication inside the grape with an eyedropper.

Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

While I was typing my post, you posted the notice of Freddy's tragic incident. I am so sorry, SSG! RIP little Freddy! Please give Mo a hug for me!
Regards,
StS

[supersquirrelgirl]

I am so sorry. People simply don't pay attention when they drive. I am so sorry you lost Freddy.

Have you tried the Nutella with the antibiotics yet? It is very strong tasting AND smelling and may just help with Mo.

Hi CM,

Thank you always for your comments.

Honestly, it's not driver's fault for lack of attention. Road is a main one in the neighborhood and has a sharp right turn where its hard to see around the curve. Its just bad luck regardless how careful drivers and squirrels are crossing the road. As the saying goes, speed kills as some drivers go a little too fast around the turn. Still hurts regardless of reason. I was close to Freddy.

I'll look into Nutella. I tried regular peanut butter before with no luck.

Thank you!

[supersquirrelgirl]

While I was typing my post, you posted the notice of Freddy's tragic incident. I am so sorry, SSG! RIP little Freddy! Please give Mo a hug for me!
Regards,
StS

Hi SamtheSquirrel,

Thank you! Mo did not come today. Not sure she knows about Freddy is gone. Things happened so fast, not sure any other squirrels know Freddy is gone. Surely tomorrow, she will be looking for him. Hope she comes to hang out. Hugs all around. As we know, the road is dangerous.

SSG

[supersquirrelgirl]

Hi SSG:
I had forgotten about your recent trip to Japan and wanted to ask about how things went there!

What is the form the Clavamox you are using (suspension already mixed with water, the original powder for suspension or crushed tablets)?

Also, do you have or might you have access to any other antibiotics? As we discussed before, Clavamox exhibits time-dependent killing which means that the level of the antibiotic must remain in the therapeutic range over a period of time in order for it to work. With very irregular dosing, this becomes an issue! The medications like Cipro (fluoroquinolones) usually exhibit more concentration-dependent killing especially at higher doses which means that a therapeutic dose given "hit or miss" as it sems Mo is getting her antibiotics may be more likely to be effective than with an antibiotic that exhibits time-dependent killing!

Another option I have used for administering medications to a Squirrel besides placing it within a nut is placing it within a grape. I don't usually feed Squirrels grapes except as occasional treats (always with the skin removed) but I have not had a Squirrel who didn't like them. I always remove the skin because of the potential for getting the skin caught in the throat. I use green or red grapes and avoid concord grapes as they have a very high oxalate content but it really will not make any difference in that regard as you are only using them for a short while. I just cut a little "incision" in the Grape, dig out a bit of the grape itself and put the medication inside the grape with an eyedropper.

Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

Hi SamtheSquirrel,

Thanks for asking about Japan; Overall it went good with some serious incident toward the end. We left Okunoshima (Rabbit Island), Japan early in protest. If you are on Instagram, you can read about it @junkohiking under Matsuzaka rabbit. Its gone viral but I'm not sure any change will come.

For Augmentin (clavamox), using a 500mg-125mg tablet in 10mL water solution and dosed accordingly for single a 1.5x amount since Mo only comes once a day. If you need details, PM me.

I have cipro and bactrim tablets on hand and can get other AB if needed. Remember clearly TD and CD discussion from you. At this point, Mo is checking all nuts I give her and on-guard after our honest talk. I will give her some time for today's news to be processed. (same for me!)

Sorry to say, we tried plain grapes way back as a treat but Mo doesn't like them. We struck out. Nuts only.

Thank you, SSG

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

Thanks SSG! I'll check back tomorrow. Again, I'm so sorry for the loss of little Freddy. I hope Mo is doing ok and I hope you were able to give her that hug from me!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

How is Mo doing and how are you doing, SSG?

As far as antibiotics, probably Cipro would be more likely to be of benefit than the Clavamox (if indeed, any oral antibiotic will actually be of benefit for what seems to be an abscess) but only because of the differences in their bacterial killing characteristics with Clavamox being time-dependent and Cipro being concentration-dependent.

I don't do Instagram or really any of the social media stuff but I wish I could view your Japan experience. Sorry it did not turn out completely as expected!

Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[supersquirrelgirl]

How is Mo doing and how are you doing, SSG?

As far as antibiotics, probably Cipro would be more likely to be of benefit than the Clavamox (if indeed, any oral antibiotic will actually be of benefit for what seems to be an abscess) but only because of the differences in their bacterial killing characteristics with Clavamox being time-dependent and Cipro being concentration-dependent.

I don't do Instagram or really any of the social media stuff but I wish I could view your Japan experience. Sorry it did not turn out completely as expected!

Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

Hi SamtheSquirrel,

Thanks for the kind words!

Mo stop by a few times over the weekend and went to the woods barking from the trees (maybe calling for Freddy ??). Everyone is doing better as we know the risk of the road. I didn't recognize MO at first when she came a few days ago. She really looks good with lump being very small and walking great. It really surprised me.

Bought green grapes to test but none of the squirrels here ate them. Lots of sniffing but no biting.

Here is direct link to Instagram posts for Matsuzaka Rabbit Death:

Part#1 https://www.instagram.com/p/Cxy0rPzPLqG/?utm_source=ig_web_button_share_sheet&img_index=1

Part#2 https://www.instagram.com/p/Cxy1O2DvQwp/?utm_source=ig_web_button_share_sheet&img_index=1

Thanks for the advice on Cipro as that would be my AB choice if I can hide the taste. Will be trying nutella as CritterMom suggested.

SSG

[supersquirrelgirl]

SamtheSquirrel,

Here is Instagram Viewer with direct link: https://www.picuki.com/profile/junkohiking

You can translate Japanese into English on the posting. The above 2 posts are in both English and Japanese. (sometimes translation is not perfect)

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

SamtheSquirrel,

Here is Instagram Viewer with direct link: https://www.picuki.com/profile/junkohiking

You can translate Japanese into English on the posting. The above 2 posts are in both English and Japanese. (sometimes translation is not perfect)

Thank you so much SSG! The Rabbit situation there seem dire to say the least. Is this the way all wildlife is treated or is there something about Rabbits that brings out meanness?!? I'm so sorry for your Rabbit friend Matsuzaka-san! How tragic! Was this probably you last trip there or will you try again?

Please keep us updated on Mo! It sounds as if maybe Dr. Mo has performed further surgery! I'm glad she is appearing better!

I wish the City Council where you live would designate Mo's path across the road a "Squirrel Crossing" and require vehicles to slow down and stop and yield to crossing Squirrels!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[supersquirrelgirl]

Thank you so much SSG! The Rabbit situation there seem dire to say the least. Is this the way all wildlife is treated or is there something about Rabbits that brings out meanness?!? I'm so sorry for your Rabbit friend Matsuzaka-san! How tragic! Was this probably you last trip there or will you try again?

Please keep us updated on Mo! It sounds as if maybe Dr. Mo has performed further surgery! I'm glad she is appearing better!

I wish the City Council where you live would designate Mo's path across the road a "Squirrel Crossing" and require vehicles to slow down and stop and yield to crossing Squirrels!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

Hi SamtheSquirrel,

Situation is totally unbalance where people are 10~20 times more than the number of rabbits, and thus creates an environment where common sense gets overridden by the strong desire to feed a rabbit, ie, children begin chasing and pursuing any/all rabbits. Add to the mix, chaos from no following rules and no rangers to enforce them, you have a complete out-of-control open-range rabbit park where anything goes (not a petting zoo!). Imagine Yellowstone Park with no rules and no rangers.

Many rabbits have been injured by this chaos and they have no access to medical care, so many die within days or weeks. Okunoshima is a Japan National Park where no animals can leave for medical care and no animals are allowed in. Animal protection is absolutely needed else it leads to cruelty and abuse. Many rabbits have died over the years due to this problem. We are completely mixed about going back without some significant change. Our work saves rabbits lives but the chaos causes 3X to die from injury and abuse.

Enough about Okunoshima and the rabbits. I don't want to hijack this thread as its all about Ms Mo. Thank you for caring. Ditto to all that read this and the Instagram posts. FYI, wife is Junko and I'm Michael in the posts.

Ms. Mo is doing much better than expected. Yes - she did another I&D surgery herself and it doesn't look too bad. The lump is smaller as it must be draining or just chewed off. Probably a couple weeks for the skin/fur to heel over. I want to start AB again but Mo is inspecting all walnuts I give here. Waiting all day to test the nutella nut. Mo didn't come today but I saw her moving her nut stash to across the road. She made about 6 trips back and forth on the road as I hold my breath. I went out to act as a traffic guard. No sure what prompted her to move nuts across the street but I suspect its her rival (Suzie) who is watching her bury nuts and then robbing them later. Squirrels are really funny to watch!

No way for Squirrel Crossing signs as many neighbors think squirrels are rodents and always getting into their attics. To each their own. Throughout the day, there is always squirrels hanging around here and sleeping on the fence. No one has complained yet.

SSG

[supersquirrelgirl]

Quick Update for today (10/25):

To CritterMom: Gave Nutella to Mo and she refused to eat it. Mo is checking every nut I give her so this was not surprising. All other wilds grab the walnut and licked it forever! (I thought Nutella was more peanut taste but was wrong, its more like chocolate spread.)

Ms Mo continues to move her stash nuts across the road all day yesterday. She took a break and came over to see us. While eating here, Ms Suzie came and Mo was growling. Quickly gave Suzie a walnut so she would leave. Then she came back and got too close to Mo again. At that moment, the rumble started with lots of squealing and tumbling. Mo got the best of it with Suzie running off. Saw both later with no injuries. It all happened so fast! Nice to see Mo at her best and ready to rumble. Suzie is much younger but testing the boundaries. Love them both!

SSG

[supersquirrelgirl]

10/27 Update:

326184

Mo worked on her shoulder/arm all yesterday. Looks good but raw. Would love to spray with Betadine or rub some ointment but she will not allow any of that. She's doing her own thing. No luck with any AB nuts so deciding to stop trying. I'll just monitor her for a while. Hope it heals good this time.

SSG

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

10/27 Update:

326184

Mo worked on her shoulder/arm all yesterday. Looks good but raw. Would love to spray with Betadine or rub some ointment but she will not allow any of that. She's doing her own thing. No luck with any AB nuts so deciding to stop trying. I'll just monitor her for a while. Hope it heals good this time.

SSG

Thanks SSG!
Hi Mo!

Regards,
StS

[olorin19]

10/27 Update:

326184

Mo worked on her shoulder/arm all yesterday. Looks good but raw. Would love to spray with Betadine or rub some ointment but she will not allow any of that. She's doing her own thing. No luck with any AB nuts so deciding to stop trying. I'll just monitor her for a while. Hope it heals good this time.

SSG

While color is hard to judge from a photo, this looks quite good to me - not all angry and inflamed. It reminds me of how skin looks if you have a scab and manage to wait until it falls off on its own.

[supersquirrelgirl]

11/2 Surprising Update Today:

Ms Mo did not come yesterday and believe I know why.......

She came today and when I sat next to her, it was very clear she continued her arm/shoulder surgery job! For the first time, I saw white-yellow pus dripping down just above her chew marks in the picture above. (sorry - I didn't get time to grab iphone for a picture.) She stayed about 20 minutes and I could see the pus dripping more onto her fur. (I tried to touch but she looked at me saying WTH!)

I feel this as a good sign and it makes me motivated to find a some way to restart AB treatments. (no grapes, no nutella, no honey, so picky)

SSG

[supersquirrelgirl]

11/9 Update - Lump has returned

Over the last few days, Mo has visited for walnuts and sunflower seeds but is being careful not to run into Suzie (aggressive but younger female). Getting a good look at Mo today, her arm/shoulder lump appears to have returned to about 1/2 size as before. I was hoping the pus draining last week would help more but lump is back. Her left arm has less mobility so best not to rumble with Suzie (I can tell its coming soon.)

After each snack, Mo signals she's ready to go and gets a whole walnut to take home across the street. But today after she left and I watch her cross the street safely, she returned in 10 minutes. I was stunned it was her when I looked out the door but she wanted another whole walnut to take home. Again, holding my breath, she crossed the street safely....Whew!

SSG

326281

326282

[supersquirrelgirl]

11/21 Uodate:

Dr Mo is back at work. Although her lump is not as big as before, she has chewed and/or punctured it again. It looks good but I know she is working on it. She wants nothing to do with any AB nuts so that's not happening. I'm still thinking of someway.

I've met Mo a few times across the street at the curb and she runs to me to get another whole walnut. Important to carry an extra walnut at all times. She looks very surprised its me at the curb!

SSG

[tomcics]

Mo is a real beauty, love the photos. I have had a number of squirrels with similar looking skin injuries/issues and they tend to get better on their own. It can be a real challenge to treat them but it's always worth trying.

[Diggie's Friend]

You could try a homeopathic remedy found effective to open the abscess to drain it. 8x (Gunpowder) homeopathic remedy has antibiotic properties. There is a stronger formulation (30C) which as noted is at the lower end of the higher doses used by wildlife rehabbers for stubborn infections. Having this as part of the arsenal to counter ill health conditions in squirrels can lend significant support towards healing and restoration.

These links are for reference on homeopathic remedy use in wildlife.

https://www.ewildagain.org/homeopathic-first-aid-tips-wildlife

https://www.ewildagain.org/wildlife-homeopathy-is-different

[supersquirrelgirl]

Mo is a real beauty, love the photos. I have had a number of squirrels with similar looking skin injuries/issues and they tend to get better on their own. It can be a real challenge to treat them but it's always worth trying.

Hi Tomcics,

Mo says thanks for the complement. She is 3rd generation of the squirrel family we let stay in the attic over the winter many years ago. Her momma was really cute and big. Mo's kids are all around here and look just like her. Hard to tell at times who is who. Mo's shoulder bump started about a year ago got really big over last summer. I believe its an abscess not tumor. Gave her antibiotics in walnuts but she didn't come everyday. Since then Mo (now Dr Mo) has done her own incision/draining several times but it seems to grow back. She looks good now but its not totally gone yet. Hoping it resolves on its own soon.

SSG

[supersquirrelgirl]

You could try a homeopathic remedy found effective to open the abscess to drain it. 8x (Gunpowder) homeopathic remedy has antibiotic properties. There is a stronger formulation (30C) which as noted is at the lower end of the higher doses used by wildlife rehabbers for stubborn infections. Having this as part of the arsenal to counter ill health conditions in squirrels can lend significant support towards healing and restoration.

These links are for reference on homeopathic remedy use in wildlife.

https://www.ewildagain.org/homeopathic-first-aid-tips-wildlife

https://www.ewildagain.org/wildlife-homeopathy-is-different

Thank you DF. I will review the information.

I started Mo on AB (clavamox) back in the summer but since she did not come everyday, it was not total effective. Was going to switch to Cipro AB but Mo rejected all my nuts and became very suspicious. I tried adding honey and nutella but no luck. Mo has done her own incision by chewing and/or poking by claws for draining. Unfortunately, it heals up before it completely drains. I tried to touch once and she looked at me with WTH are you doing ?? She looks good now so lets see how it goes.

SSG

[Diggie's Friend]

The only thing you need to do with homeopathic remedies is not to give it at the same time as dosing with anti-biotics, leaving 3-4 hours between the treatments. Placing just a droplet of the dissolved homeopathic pill on a small piece of organic walnut works well to get it to the wild squirrel you want to dose.

[supersquirrelgirl]

The only thing you need to do with homeopathic remedies is not to give it at the same time as dosing with anti-biotics, leaving 3-4 hours between the treatments. Placing just a droplet of the dissolved homeopathic pill on a small piece of organic walnut works well to get it to the wild squirrel you want to dose.

Hi DF,

Made a few attempts with antibiotics (AB) masking the taste under various cover. Nothing worked. Squirrel stopped taking all my nuts and started screening all food I gave her. At first, I did clavamox AB nuts that worked since it tastes like vanilla. Second was bactrim AB but total rejection. Last try was cipro AB (horrible taste) but a clear no-go. At this point all AB are no-go.

Read both reference links you provided and understand the general point. I really need to reread a few times to fully comprehend the treatment. I certainly like the one droplet since that easy to hide. I'm not a Vet so need to be 100% sure I will not harm the squirrel in any way.

Thank you for exposing me to this idea!

SSG

[Diggie's Friend]

I'll send you a PM

[Diggie's Friend]

I inquired about the use of Homeopathic remedies with our then vet many yeas ago, who assured me that HR are safe, as well as no issue to use with AB, just not to dose at the same time of day as the AB.

Homeopathic remedies which are, 'Nano particles', which work differently in the boy than do meds. In Casey's ("wild again") wildlife rehabber webpages, she gives an overview of a severe case with infection and abscess in a squirrel, that AB first used, failed to resolve The attending veterinarian then recommended consulting with a homeopathic veterinarian on what Homeopathic Remedies they recommend in this severe case for the squirrel. Homeopathic Remedy (200C), "Gunpowder' given improved the condition with the first dose; and with the second dose not given the same day, made further progress in support of healing, ultimately saved the squirrel's life.

Veterinary Homeopathy article: See case heading: "A squirrel's stubborn abscess" https://hpathy.com/veterinary-homeopathy/gunpowder-little-known-remedy-packs-a-wallop-against-wounds/

(30C) HR, "gunpowder" is used for smaller wildlife, to open and drain abscesses in less severe life threatening cases. This H-remedy also was long time back (Civil War) to have an, 'antibiotic like effect' against infection.

https://www.amazon.com/Gunpowder-30C-30c-pellets-Boiron/dp/B0006PKN1U

This remedy is best dosed 3 times a day. That said, this may not be able to supportable in a wild squirrel. Having used 30C homeopathic, 'gunpowder' once a day for a wild squirrel with a large stubborn abscess, which prior over a week's time was not show to have drained well; I saw the abscess open and drain in 48 hours; and this not just the once, but each time this H-remedy was given as needed.

[supersquirrelgirl]

I'll send you a PM

Got it. Thank you!

[supersquirrelgirl]

Mo came today after missing a few days due to road work and landscapers around her area. Honestly, I did not recognize her at first. She looked great and ran/jumped around like high energy squirrel. I think she's on the hunt to rumble with rival Suzie again. I'm very pleased on her condition. (I just hate the road crossing!)

For now, I'm going to standby and monitor her condition as she seems to have it under control. (Dr Mo has done many incisions & drain procedures over the last few months. I give her a B+ now.)

SSG

[supersquirrelgirl]

If she is across the street, you might want to try going to her if there is a place to sit and wait.

If she is hungry and feels safe with you, she may well come to you.

There are quite a few wilds that are used to me feeding them in my yard who will run in my direction if they see me when I am out on a walk. A few weeks ago, I was several blocks away (maybe 250 yards in a straight line) when a squirrel stopped on the sidewalk about 50 yards away. It obviously recognized me, as it then hopped up on a fence post to wait. Good thing I always have pecans in my pocket!

Hi Olorin19,

I remember you suggesting to go to Mo across the street to feed her. Well I'm happy to tell you it finally worked. I followed her home across the street and waited at the curb. She came back and I was able to give her several whole walnuts. Mo would take each nut back to her stash hiding place and come back for another. She repeated it many times. I could see in her eyes a total excitement that it was really me at the curb with walnuts.

Wanted to thank you for the encouragement!

SSG

[olorin19]

Hi Olorin19,

I remember you suggesting to go to Mo across the street to feed her. Well I'm happy to tell you it finally worked. I followed her home across the street and waited at the curb. She came back and I was able to give her several whole walnuts. Mo would take each nut back to her stash hiding place and come back for another. She repeated it many times. I could see in her eyes a total excitement that it was really me at the curb with walnuts.

Wanted to thank you for the encouragement!

SSG

Great news!

There is something amazing about the relationship that can develop between a person and a wild squirrel. Some wild squirrels have that ability to develop trust with us to a much greater extent than others.

I have been feeding the squirrels in my back yard for twenty years, and it never ceases to amaze me how when I go outside there are squirrels that run right up to me, others than stay where they are at a distance, and others than climb up on something. So depending upon the squirrel, I am a friend, a possible threat, or something in between.

I have been feeding a wild named Mama Squirrel for five years now. She is very easy to recognize because she lost her middle finger on the right front paw almost four years ago from a serious injury. And what saved her is that she had developed enough trust during the preceding year that even badly injured she was able to come to me to get clavamox via pecan often enough to recover -

https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?64219-Wild-with-injured-front-paw

[supersquirrelgirl]

Great news!

There is something amazing about the relationship that can develop between a person and a wild squirrel. Some wild squirrels have that ability to develop trust with us to a much greater extent than others.

I have been feeding the squirrels in my back yard for twenty years, and it never ceases to amaze me how when I go outside there are squirrels that run right up to me, others than stay where they are at a distance, and others than climb up on something. So depending upon the squirrel, I am a friend, a possible threat, or something in between.

I have been feeding a wild named Mama Squirrel for five years now. She is very easy to recognize because she lost her middle finger on the right front paw almost four years ago from a serious injury. And what saved her is that she had developed enough trust during the preceding year that even badly injured she was able to come to me to get clavamox via pecan often enough to recover -

https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?64219-Wild-with-injured-front-paw

Hi Olorin,

Read your Mama thread start to finish. What a great success story. You (and wife) really save Moma's hand giving AB and the dedication to her. Mama trust you much more after giving her nuts for weeks when her hand/fingers hurt....its a bonding moment. Mama story reminds me so much of Ms Mo here. We have helped so many wild foxes over the years. Many still come back and sit right next to us and chatter. Not sure what they are saying but it sounds friendly.

In Mo's case, I gave 1.5x dose because she only came once per day. Unfortunately, she did not come everyday so not sure how effective the AB was. In the end, Mo chewed or punctured her abscess herself (Dr Mo). She looks great today and comes over daily even though she moved across the road.

SSG

[supersquirrelgirl]

Update for Ms Mo for April/2024

We are back home now from traveling 3 months. One of the first squirrels to come see us was Ms. Mo. She was tapping on the back door window. She looks so happy to see us and we are too!

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Honestly, she looks great with very minor scarring on her left arm from doing multiple I & D procedures. (giving her a A+ now) She has put on some weight and walking, jumping, climbing like a confident squirrel again. I'm beyond happiness.

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Rewarding her with a whole walnut that she likes to spin for quality control then runs off to bury it across the road. I wish she would move back to the woods on this side of the busy road. On a recent walk in the woods, I found a neighbor who attached three big owl decoys to their fence. No wonder the squirrels are relocating away.

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To Everyone on TSB who has given advice and comments in this thread, I sincerely Thank You and Appreciate it so much. In my opinion, Ms (Dr) Mo is alive and recovered 99% based on your help. She's approaching 6 years old soon so not bad for living in the wild with lots of challenges. She continues to cross the road and come see us daily (sometimes multiple times per day). She is no longer the boss of the woods and avoids conflict with others. She is the queen of her area across the road.

Thank you again to TSB,

Mr. SSG (Michael)

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

Update for Ms Mo for April/2024

We are back home now from traveling 3 months. One of the first squirrels to come see us was Ms. Mo. She was tapping on the back door window. She looks so happy to see us and we are too!

Honestly, she looks great with very minor scarring on her left arm from doing multiple I & D procedures. (giving her a A+ now) She has put on some weight and walking, jumping, climbing like a confident squirrel again. I'm beyond happiness.

Rewarding her with a whole walnut that she likes to spin for quality control then runs off to bury it across the road. I wish she would move back to the woods on this side of the busy road. On a recent walk in the woods, I found a neighbor who attached three big owl decoys to their fence. No wonder the squirrels are relocating away.


To Everyone on TSB who has given advice and comments in this thread, I sincerely Thank You and Appreciate it so much. In my opinion, Ms (Dr) Mo is alive and recovered 99% based on your help. She's approaching 6 years old soon so not bad for living in the wild with lots of challenges. She continues to cross the road and come see us daily (sometimes multiple times per day). She is no longer the boss of the woods and avoids conflict with others. She is the queen of her area across the road.

Thank you again to TSB,

Mr. SSG (Michael)

Thank you so much for the update on Dr. Mo, Mr (?) SSG! I hope Mrs SSG is OK! Mo looks tremendous! I just wish that she would confine her territory to yours and avoid that road she crosses to get to y'all! Please stay in touch on TSB!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[TomahawkFlyers]

That second photo. What a beautiful smile on a handsome kid. That's no illusion - that's one happy squirrel, clearly elated that you are back and with him again!

Jamie

[Charley Chuckles]

🙌🥳

[supersquirrelgirl]

Hi Sam,

Both Ms SSG and Mr SSG (me) are doing great. Ms SSG is busy with Okunoshima (Rabbit Island) mission. I have been the main person on TSB postings since she is busy with rabbit stuff. (Its still her account.)

Thank you for nice words on Mo. I'm thrilled beyond words! For sure staying on TSB but we do travel alot so some blackouts.

Mr. SSG


Thank you so much for the update on Dr. Mo, Mr (?) SSG! I hope Mrs SSG is OK! Mo looks tremendous! I just wish that she would confine her territory to yours and avoid that road she crosses to get to y'all! Please stay in touch on TSB!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[supersquirrelgirl]

Hi TF,

Thank you! Sure is a happy girl. She is 3rd generation from our attic family many years ago.

Hope your mouse rescue is going well.

Mr. SSG



That second photo. What a beautiful smile on a handsome kid. That's no illusion - that's one happy squirrel, clearly elated that you are back and with him again!

Jamie

[TomahawkFlyers]

Hi SSG,

mouse is now a rip-roaring medium-sized mouse. He moved into his three level condo last night and has been exploring ever since. He's shy of humans, us included. He eats like a horse and is getting a fine diet.

and we have something in common. Our Tomahawk Flyers journey started with a colony of 18 in the attic 3 1/2 years ago. The kids have flourished ever since (in the trees and in their purpose-made indoor habitat ever since. Small world!

Jamie


Hi TF,

Thank you! Sure is a happy girl. She is 3rd generation from our attic family many years ago.

Hope your mouse rescue is going well.

Mr. SSG

[supersquirrelgirl]

Hi SSG,

mouse is now a rip-roaring medium-sized mouse. He moved into his three level condo last night and has been exploring ever since. He's shy of humans, us included. He eats like a horse and is getting a fine diet.

and we have something in common. Our Tomahawk Flyers journey started with a colony of 18 in the attic 3 1/2 years ago. The kids have flourished ever since (in the trees and in their purpose-made indoor habitat ever since. Small world!

Jamie

Hi TF, good work on the mouse rescue!!

Small world indeed. Here's a picture when we finally pushed out the squirrel family from the attic in April/2014. (We let them all stay through the cold winter months.)

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There was 4 squirrels - the squirrel on the top leading the exit to the roof is Ms. Mo grandmother. One of the 3 squirrels on the column wall is Mo mother (Ms Vee). Mo was born about 4 years ago. We now have several 4th gen litter squirrels from Mo here. I'm sure the neighbors don't appreciate our squirrel friendly yard. Oh well - what can I say!

Mr SSG

[TomahawkFlyers]

"I'm sure the neighbors don't appreciate our squirrel friendly yard. Oh well - what can I say!"

It was squirrel country before all the houses went up. The least we can do is be kind to them. As for the neighbors, surely they do stuff that makes you less than the happiest camper in the world. Live and let live. If that doesn't work, take up drums and play sunrise concerts for them. That counts as giving, you know.

Jamie

[supersquirrelgirl]

New Update on Ms. Mo for 4/24/2024:

Mo has been coming almost everyday when there's less squirrel traffic in backyard. We still give her a whole walnut when she leaves to go across the street. Yesterday, she took her nut to bushes on this side of street and immediately came back. She was circling me to get attention, so I got up to follow her. She went up the fence, across neighbors front yard, and into the side of the woods. She stopped about every 10 feet to make sure I was following her. We ended up next to the bushes where she buried the nut. Mo jumped onto the redwood tree next to the bushes and then was looking down from the branches. Well to my surprise, there was a new nest about 5 feet away from her. She ran up the branch and disappeared. I hope into that nest ?? It suddenly clicked with me - Mo is showing me her new summer home! (might still be in progress ??) Time will tell if she is moving.

Today when she came, I noticed a raw spot on her left upper arm where it looks chewed. Could she be doing another I & D job ?? Its not big and no bump but it was raw. I'm considering to restart her on Augmentin AB for 7 days. That was the only AB she ate last time (tastes like vanilla). I have other AB but they were rejected. I have dosing info here.

Any concerns ??

Mr.SSG

[CritterMom]

LOL! I can just see her - it sounds like she did everything to get you to follow her short of putting on a Lassie suit!

Does this mean she doesn't cross the busy road anymore?

Augmentin is a good choice for her if she will take it.

[supersquirrelgirl]

LOL! I can just see her - it sounds like she did everything to get you to follow her short of putting on a Lassie suit!

Does this mean she doesn't cross the busy road anymore?

Augmentin is a good choice for her if she will take it.

Yes. But today, she is still crossed the road. Not sure of the move date. My fingers crossed.

Dose #1 just made and hope she takes it tomorrow.

[olorin19]

I am intrigued by the idea of Mo showing you where she lived.

I have released many squirrels into my backyard after time in a release cage. After release, I leave the release cages there with nest boxes inside and cage door open. Most squirrels released in late spring after being overwintered have slept in their nest box for a few months, headed to the trees once it gets too warm, then returned to their nest box once it gets cold again. Most continue to return to their nest box every winter.

What I have seen hundreds of times is these same squirrels (who know me, know I know where they sleep, and enjoy getting breakfast in bed) reverting to instinct some evenings and trying to slip back into their nest box without being observed. While they are mostly happy to bed down with me right there, sometimes that squirrel instinct takes over and they feel to need to be undetected.

So Mo showing you her new nest is really quite the compliment!

[supersquirrelgirl]

I am intrigued by the idea of Mo showing you where she lived.

I have released many squirrels into my backyard after time in a release cage. After release, I leave the release cages there with nest boxes inside and cage door open. Most squirrels released in late spring after being overwintered have slept in their nest box for a few months, headed to the trees once it gets too warm, then returned to their nest box once it gets cold again. Most continue to return to their nest box every winter.

What I have seen hundreds of times is these same squirrels (who know me, know I know where they sleep, and enjoy getting breakfast in bed) reverting to instinct some evenings and trying to slip back into their nest box without being observed. While they are mostly happy to bed down with me right there, sometimes that squirrel instinct takes over and they feel to need to be undetected.

So Mo showing you her new nest is really quite the compliment!

Hi Olorin,

Thank you! I've known Mo all her life. Her mom (Ms.Vee) brought her to meet us when she was very young. That was almost 6 years ago. Mo has lived most of her life in the public green-zone woods about 1000 feet away. She came almost every day laying around and enjoy a good life. She has brought many young from her litters over the years. She was boss of the woods and had many close males (boyfriends ??) that were her right-hand muscle. She is a big squirrel like her mom.

When Mo got sick (very big shoulder/arm abscess), she lost the ability to rule the woods and move across the road in new territory (a neighbor's backyard). As I mentioned before, I would stand on the curb and she would run down to get a whole nut from me. On days she does not come, I would leave a nut on the ground by a big tree next to the curb. In addition to the curb, Mo runs across the road to our backyard. We have spent hours sitting with her, feeding nuts, and massaging her head. (She absolutely loves Ms.SSG!)

Mo trust is based on years of engagement with us and certainly the help we gave her when she was hurting. I believe when a wild animal overcomes their fear and builds trust, they will allow you into their world and a friendship is born. Mo is very close to us. When Mo led me into the woods the other day, I really didn't understand what was going on. It clicked when she stopped and climbed the tree where I saw a new nest. Her message was clear to me then! Her new summer home.

I felt so honored by her actions and trust to show me her new home. I saw her over there burying some nuts but really didn't expect her building a new nest. I just hope she moves soon and stop crossing the road. Time will tell.

Mr.SSG

[olorin19]

Thanks SSG

I've been on this thread for quite awhile, so feel like I almost know Mo!

I just went back to the start and my first post on this thread was actually post #3 on the day you first posted.

I subscribed to the thread at the time, and always enjoy hearing good news about Mo.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Thanks SSG

I've been on this thread for quite awhile, so feel like I almost know Mo!

I just went back to the start and my first post on this thread was actually post #3 on the day you first posted.

I subscribed to the thread at the time, and always enjoy hearing good news about Mo.

You are one of the very early TSB Members to join in. Back then we were newbie on TSB and just reaching for any help.

Ms.SSG did post #1 ~ 10, then Mr.SSG took over at post #11. You can see the big date gap between #10 and #11. You have posted many times as others did. My TSB experience had a profound impact on me and that's what kept me here today.

Mr.SSG

[olorin19]

You are one of the very early TSB Members to join in. Back then we were newbie on TSB and just reaching for any help.

Ms.SSG did post #1 ~ 10, then Mr.SSG took over at post #11. You can see the big date gap between #10 and #11. You have posted many times as others did. My TSB experience had a profound impact on me and that's what kept me here today.

Mr.SSG

Ah! That makes sense - and hello MrSSG!

TSB has been incredibly helpful for me over the years, both the main Admin experts as well as many of the experienced folks out there.

Time permitting, I try to pay it forward by chiming in when it seems like something from my own experiences might be helpful.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Disappointing Update

Gave Mo the first AB nut (half-shell) on Thursday but within seconds, some noise spooked her to jump on the roof. I'm not positive she ate it. She did come back a few hours later but since the first dose was 1.5X, I only gave regular nuts & seeds.

I did get a good look at her arm and the small red spot has doubled in size and there's a small bump around the shoulder. Not at all what I expected. I believe she is still chewing on her arm again.

I prepared dose #2 for Friday and waited all day - Mo was a no-show. I walked around but couldn't find her.

On Saturday (today), Mo did come so I handed out the second AB nut. She did a couple of sniffs and walked away. I quickly made a fresh AB nut without any Nutella and tried again. Couple of sniffs and totally rejected again. Very disppointed. She is on to me and knows something was difference. As a test, I gave her another half-shell with no AB. Yep, she grabbed it and ran to the fence. After she finished, gave a whole walnut and she went back across the road (still lives there). Guess I need another plan on giving AB nuts.

[olorin19]

What antibiotic are you using?

[supersquirrelgirl]

What antibiotic are you using?

Augmentin 500/125mg tablet (same as first time)

[supersquirrelgirl]

How to out smart Ms. Mo ??

I made tomorrow's AB nuts using pecans in the walnut half-shell. Pecans smell more than walnuts. She is so picky and now very suspicious of my nuts. Mo rejects Nutella, peanut butter, honey, and grapes. WTH - everyone else loves them!

I gave the dropped AB nut from today to another squirrel and sure enough it was eaten; no problem!

[olorin19]

I have given clavamox to various squirrels and have always used whole pecans, cracked open into halves still in shell. (Vice grips, by the way, are brilliant for cracking open nuts without crushing the nut.)

Some squirrels have done best with clavamox applied right to the pecan then given some time to dry a bit.

Others have done better with the clavamox mixed into a bit of almond butter or sunflower seed butter then applied to the pecan.

With a wild where you do not know when they might appear, I make up the daily dose in the morning then leave it in the refrigerator so I can quickly grab it when needed.

[supersquirrelgirl]

I have given clavamox to various squirrels and have always used whole pecans, cracked open into halves still in shell. (Vice grips, by the way, are brilliant for cracking open nuts without crushing the nut.)

Some squirrels have done best with clavamox applied right to the pecan then given some time to dry a bit.

Others have done better with the clavamox mixed into a bit of almond butter or sunflower seed butter then applied to the pecan.

With a wild where you do not know when they might appear, I make up the daily dose in the morning then leave it in the refrigerator so I can quickly grab it when needed.

Thank You Olorin. You have always been very helpful. A better update today.

Big breakfast bonanza today with 12 foxes and 2 very bold greys. Lots of growling and pushing to get the best food plate. Mo comes strolling in and sits right next to me. Immediately, her big muscle male (Mustache) comes right next to her. Gave my plan-b AB pecan filled walnut shell to Mo. After a few sniffs, she ran off with it. Yes, Yes!! Gave Mustache a nut to keep him there. Then 5 minutes later, Mo returned to continue eating. Honestly, I didn't see her come back but she tapped my hand a few times to get my attention. She wanted a walnut to take home (across the road).

[supersquirrelgirl]

Another good day - Mo took the AB nut and ran away to eat on the fence. I watch her power ir down and lick the walnut shell, then drop it. Yep, found the shell and confirmed its all gone. (I put a red X on back of shell to make it easy to find.) Pecans seem to be working. Just made tomorrow's nut and put it in the frig. Hope tomorrow is good as that is dose #3 (1/day).

[supersquirrelgirl]

Ms. Mo had her AB nut for 8 days in a row at 2X dose 1X per day. I'm thrilled to finally have success. Hoping for one more tomorrow (Monday) as that's the 10-day mark for liquid suspension to expire. She's looking good and full of energy.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Ms. Mo continues to come daily in the morning during the breakfast bonanza. She keeps a little distance from crowd and was chased the other day as she was running home with a whole walnut. Only the older folks know who Mo is and give her respect. The new generation is too young to know Mo since she has moved across the road in new territory and not the boss of the woods anymore. It's very interesting to watch the interaction between the older folks and the new generation.

Yesterday I spent time sitting next to Mo where she let me look closely at her left arm (no touching!). I can see a small bump but its overshadowed by where Mo continues to chew it. The bump is easy to miss from different angles. I'm worried again as it just doesn't clear up. I made a cipro solution a few days back using grenadine instead of water but it was so bitter, I didn't try to give her (I tried it - yuk!). I'm only here a few more days so any restarting AB nuts will have to wait until June/end. I've noticed that some of the old friends from the woods have also relocated across the road. Lots of dog walking in the woods these days.

Thank you to everyone who has followed Ms Mo story. It will go dark until we return home. Honestly, I'm not sure who is happier after our trips away to see each other. Anything can happen crossing the road. All I can say is see you when we get home.

Mr.SSG

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

Thank you to everyone who has followed Ms Mo story. It will go dark until we return home. Honestly, I'm not sure who is happier after our trips away to see each other. Anything can happen crossing the road. All I can say is see you when we get home.

Mr.SSG

You and MsSSG have a great treat trip and we will await your return!

I would like to suggest that you petition the City Council to officially designate Ms Mo's route as a Squirrel Crossing Zone and have the local police enforce this 24 hours a day!
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Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

I have no idea how i typed in "treat" but it's there now, i can't edit it. Maybe it was meant for the Rabbits! Please give them a treat in behalf of your friends on TSB!
Regards,
StS

[supersquirrelgirl]

I have no idea how i typed in "treat" but it's there now, i can't edit it. Maybe it was meant for the Rabbits! Please give them a treat in behalf of your friends on TSB!
Regards,
StS

Thank you Sam! Love your road sign. Maybe I can enlarge it and put right below the 25 MPH speed sign ??

Treats all around - I make apple and strawberry puree that hides the meds (even works for cipro). They love it!

Mr.SSG

[Charley Chuckles]

HERE YA GO AMAZON 👍
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[supersquirrelgirl]

Thank you CC.

Doubt I'll get approval from the City Traffic Dept to post sign. Been working with them for past 2 months trying to get speed bumps or something to slow down drivers. The road has a long straight section into a sharp right curve. Speed limit is 25mph but some drivers are going double that into the curve. My house is on the curve so many times hear screeching tires! Ms Mo crosses this road right before the curve. There have been a couple of close calls.

[Charley Chuckles]

Guess you could put it in your yard but might not be seen, throw a rake out in front of the cars 🤫🤭

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

It might also help to put this cardboard Police Car beside the sign!
StS

https://www.amazon.com/SS11084-Police-Cardboard-Standup-Standee/dp/B0CDQQCGMT/ref=pd_ci_mcx_mh_mcx_views_0?pd_rd_w=5J4tB&content-id=amzn1.sym.8b590b55-908d-4829-9f90-4c8752768e8b%3Aamzn1.symc.40e6a10e-cbc4-4fa5-81e3-4435ff64d03b&pf_rd_p=8b590b55-908d-4829-9f90-4c8752768e8b&pf_rd_r=12ZCAANVK76EGABE3RVJ&pd_rd_wg=520Pk&pd_rd_r=7c7b8449-07fa-4be3-bcb3-b263b3e0dcb8&pd_rd_i=B0CDQQCGMT

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[supersquirrelgirl]

Hi CC,

I actually stood in the road many times as cars were coming toward me at high speed (not just cars, also delivery trucks). Almost been run-over 2 times and as some drivers pass, I get the middle finger! I wanted to put a big "Slow Down" sign in middle of the road but local police dept said NO. It might cause accident as a road hazard and I would be liable.

Hi Sam,

I'm after the city police dept to actually park on the curve and give speedy tickets. They declined to park an officer but did commit to putting a radar speed indicator temporarily. Adding speed humps (wider than speed bumps) would be a much longer process and needs justification. Maybe I should dress-up like a cop and stand out there ??

[Charley Chuckles]

It might also help to put this cardboard Police Car beside the sign!
StS

https://www.amazon.com/SS11084-Police-Cardboard-Standup-Standee/dp/B0CDQQCGMT/ref=pd_ci_mcx_mh_mcx_views_0?pd_rd_w=5J4tB&content-id=amzn1.sym.8b590b55-908d-4829-9f90-4c8752768e8b%3Aamzn1.symc.40e6a10e-cbc4-4fa5-81e3-4435ff64d03b&pf_rd_p=8b590b55-908d-4829-9f90-4c8752768e8b&pf_rd_r=12ZCAANVK76EGABE3RVJ&pd_rd_wg=520Pk&pd_rd_r=7c7b8449-07fa-4be3-bcb3-b263b3e0dcb8&pd_rd_i=B0CDQQCGMT

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🤣

[Charley Chuckles]

Ok now this means BUSINESS 😎

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[supersquirrelgirl]

Hi CC,

You are spot on!!! Can you buy those on Amazon ??

Ms Mo and the Wild gang along myself NEED to take down the road speeders ASAP!

Already 2 losses on the road in last few years. Mr.Freddy (Mo's BF) recently and Sam (one of my best squirrel friends)

[SamtheSquirrel2018]

Hi CC,

You are spot on!!! Can you buy those on Amazon ??

Ms Mo and the Wild gang along myself NEED to take down the road speeders ASAP!

Already 2 losses on the road in last few years. Mr.Freddy (Mo's BF) recently and Sam (one of my best squirrel friends)

Hi MrSSG:
I sure wish Ms Mo would simply move across the street and live in your yard (well, it can't hurt to hope)! A Squirrel's startle and defense responses associated with traffic are instinctual and often quite counterintuitive and lead to disasters! I've been worried about Ms Mo since I first heard about her treks across the road! Please be careful, Ms Mo!
Regards,
SamtheSquirrel

[Charley Chuckles]

Hi CC,

You are spot on!!! Can you buy those on Amazon ??

Ms Mo and the Wild gang along myself NEED to take down the road speeders ASAP!

Already 2 losses on the road in last few years. Mr.Freddy (Mo's BF) recently and Sam (one of my best squirrel friends)

The slow squirrel crossing is from Amazon 👍

[supersquirrelgirl]

Breaking News......

My neighbor has started a very big outdoors project that will cut down trees, rip-up the lawn, and replace the complete fence. I can see dirt, concrete mix, and lots of redwood lumber delivered on their driveway. Trucks and workers all over the place. This will seriously impact my squirrel yard when they teardown the fence in back and our common side. Their back fence serves as main street for squirrels coming from the woods. Certainly, the noise and commotion will keep squirrels away.

Ms Mo just came and grab her whole walnut. Then ran towards the neighbor's front yard on her way to side of the woods. She stopped dead in her tracks and immediate turn and headed for the road. I watched as she crossed the road safely. Other yard squirrels are barking out the alert and jumping for the trees. I'm curious how today and tomorrow turn out.

Actually, timing is good since we leave town on Wed 5/15 morning for 1.5 months. We don't leave the food box out and the backdoor screen is closed. Its a clear signal to squirrels that no one is home and no breakfast bonanza. (food box is their doorbell by opening/closing the lid to make slamming noise)

Mr.SSG

[supersquirrelgirl]

Time for an Update:

We returned home on June 27th afternoon; Construction project next door in full swing with lots of noise. No squirrels coming around. Then on early morning Friday 6/28 comes the scout squirrel looking around. To his surprise, the food box was out and the backdoor open. Such excitement in his eyes! A couple of walnut pieces and he was on his way.

Next day, Saturday, comes a squirrel gang of regulars that are jumping for joy that the food box is back out. It was really good to see them again but as the construction started, they all scattered. The new fence was almost completed and squirrels had their "mainstreet" back to travel from the woods.

On Sunday, guess who shows up bright and early....its Ms Mo! We were totally excited to see her. I was so relieved. She looked good and so excited to see us. Almost like she was dancing around the patio. She ate nuts and seeds for a while then signaled it was time to go. Gave her the whole walnut and off she went, crossing the road and into the trees over there. Mo's bump is still there but smaller and it looks like she continues to chew on it. Maybe another round of AB is needed ??

Today (Tuesday), more regulars are coming around with a few new folks. They are coming early in the morning before the workers next door get started. Temperatures this week will be into the 100's so none will come in the evening. I'll post more on Ms Mo later with some pictures. For now, I'm so happy to see her.

Mr.SSG

[CritterMom]

Oh, that is wonderful! Isn't it funny how fast the word gets around - and they don't even have the internet!

[supersquirrelgirl]

Hi CM, its amazing how fast. Always seems to be a scout squirrel checking.

See picture - capture on backdoor camera looking into house.

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[supersquirrelgirl]

I felt Ms Mo's love tonight.......

Mo came over around 5pm in the 100 degree heat with one purpose - to get a walnut to eat later when it cools. I had 3 walnuts in my hand and gave her one. She puts in her mouth and climbed the fence to go home. She waits and waits and waits without climbing down. I opened the gate, went around to meet her and then she climbs down on the lawn. We walked together across the lawn then across the road (side by side). I stopped at the curb on the other side (its not my property). Mo quickly runs and hides the nut and come back in 10 seconds. She wants the 2nd nut in my hand. She puts it in her mouth and goes to hides it. Back in 10 seconds for the 3rd nut. Finally off she goes with the 3rd nut as I continued to wait at the curb. She did not come back. Tomorrow will be hotter than today so I suspect she will not be coming over tomorrow. She just wanted the nuts for tomorrow. She really made my day!

Mr.SSG

PS - this picture above is not Mo.

[TubeDriver]

:serene



I felt Ms Mo's love tonight.......

Mo came over around 5pm in the 100 degree heat with one purpose - to get a walnut to eat later when it cools. I had 3 walnuts in my hand and gave her one. She puts in her mouth and climbed the fence to go home. She waits and waits and waits without climbing down. I opened the gate, went around to meet her and then she climbs down on the lawn. We walked together across the lawn then across the road (side by side). I stopped at the curb on the other side (its not my property). Mo quickly runs and hides the nut and come back in 10 seconds. She wants the 2nd nut in my hand. She puts it in her mouth and goes to hides it. Back in 10 seconds for the 3rd nut. Finally off she goes with the 3rd nut as I continued to wait at the curb. She did not come back. Tomorrow will be hotter than today so I suspect she will not be coming over tomorrow. She just wanted the nuts for tomorrow. She really made my day!

Mr.SSG

PS - this picture above is not Mo.

[olorin19]

I felt Ms Mo's love tonight.......

Mo came over around 5pm in the 100 degree heat with one purpose - to get a walnut to eat later when it cools. I had 3 walnuts in my hand and gave her one. She puts in her mouth and climbed the fence to go home. She waits and waits and waits without climbing down. I opened the gate, went around to meet her and then she climbs down on the lawn. We walked together across the lawn then across the road (side by side). I stopped at the curb on the other side (its not my property). Mo quickly runs and hides the nut and come back in 10 seconds. She wants the 2nd nut in my hand. She puts it in her mouth and goes to hides it. Back in 10 seconds for the 3rd nut. Finally off she goes with the 3rd nut as I continued to wait at the curb. She did not come back. Tomorrow will be hotter than today so I suspect she will not be coming over tomorrow. She just wanted the nuts for tomorrow. She really made my day!

Mr.SSG

PS - this picture above is not Mo.

I like to imagine somewhere on the internet there is THB, where squirrels share stories about how they have patiently managed to train us

[olorin19]

Maybe another round of AB is needed ??


Mr.SSG

Given how long this has persisted, I am wondering whether a different AB might be tried? Or whether to just let it be?

I am no AB expert, but I did have a squirrel Dustin back in 2016 where twice he had a full course of clavamox that seemed to work at first, only for the abscess to come right back. It finally took clindamycin to get the job done.

Note that I am NOT suggesting clindamycin here, but wondering if an expert might have a suggestion.

ABs always come at a cost to the microbiome.

[supersquirrelgirl]

I like to imagine somewhere on the internet there is THB, where squirrels share stories about how they have patiently managed to train us

Ok, I admit......Ms Mo has me wrapped around her finger! Actually, all the yard squirrels control me.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Given how long this has persisted, I am wondering whether a different AB might be tried? Or whether to just let it be?

I am no AB expert, but I did have a squirrel Dustin back in 2016 where twice he had a full course of clavamox that seemed to work at first, only for the abscess to come right back. It finally took clindamycin to get the job done.

Note that I am NOT suggesting clindamycin here, but wondering if an expert might have a suggestion.

ABs always come at a cost to the microbiome.

Hi Olorin,

Thought you were on vacation ??

Past AB dosing was amox-clav with first attempt missing dose days when Mo didn't come. Second time was much better with consistant 7 days dosing and I believe it did have positive results. However, Mo was doing her own I & D by chewing every couple of days. At one point, the bump was gone but with a scar that needed to heal over. Then later I saw it growing slowly again. Bump doesn't look too bad today. The second AB attempt was tried with Cipro and various tricks to mask the taste. Nothing worked. Probably do amox-clav again if their is a 3rd dose. I'm open for suugestions.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Good Update for Today:

Since we have been home a little over a week, more and more regular yard squirrels are coming each day. Still missing Suzie and the grey squirrel gang. Daily temps have been 100 degrees almost everyday. Brutally hot!

Ms. Mo has been missing for a few days so I have been putting 2 walnuts across the road daily. Not 100% sure Mo is the one getting them but both nuts are gone within hours of putting them down. After 11am, the road surface is too hot to cross. Mo came a few times last week around 5pm. I started getting worried as she has not come in recent days.

Good news - Ms Mo came here around 2:30 pm today and stay about 30 minutes eating and drinking water. I'm relieved she is okay in this heat. I could look at her shoulder/arm really good and to my surprise there is no bump at all. Looks really good. I wonder if her missing a few days was Dr. Mo at work but I could not see any evidence of that. See the pictures.

327471

327472

[supersquirrelgirl]

Been a while for an update.....

Ms Mo has been coming every day or sometimes skipped a day. Shoulder looks good with no chewing or scar. With the neighbor construction which we just found out it has many more months, Mo tries to come very early in morning. We try to get and be ready by 6am for her. She never moved back across the street due to the neighbor's construction. She still crosses the road.
When other females are here, there is a rumble with lots of squeaks, Mo usually wins. Since we been back, there's no sign of Suzie but her brother comes almost every day. He acts just like her; very forward and wants to come in the house and do a self-serve of the nut box. We stop filling the outside box with seeds as the squirrels just bang the lid as a doorbell. (One of the small greys fell in the box and wiggled until it tip over.)

I think Ms Mo may have a boyfriend but I'm not 100% sure. When she comes, there is always a male who comes right behind her. Mo gets a whole walnut to take home and now he waits for his nut before heading home.

[island rehabber]

Love this update. How much fun is that, to be able to follow these squirrels in their daily doings? I feel very fortunate to have my remote release sites but threads like yours make me wish I had a backyard so I could follow up on everyone and watch them enjoy their squirrely lives.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Love this update. How much fun is that, to be able to follow these squirrels in their daily doings? I feel very fortunate to have my remote release sites but threads like yours make me wish I had a backyard so I could follow up on everyone and watch them enjoy their squirrely lives.

Thank you IR. Its been about a 10 year experience with Mo when her grandmother moved into our attic in late fall. We let her stay there until late spring since she had babies. One baby was Mo's mother (Vee) and another auntie (Skimpy). 3rd baby did not hang around. Several years later, Ms Vee brought her baby Mo to the backyard. Mo has been around for 6 years.

We are lucky that our backyard fence forms a T intersection where the center leg goes directly to the woods with many big redwood trees. We call this fence section Main Street since it goes to the woods. Many squirrels run up and down Main Street all day to get to our backyard. During summer months, I leave hose bib dripping and squirrels use it like a drinking fountain.

Mr.SSG

[olorin19]

Love this update. How much fun is that, to be able to follow these squirrels in their daily doings? I feel very fortunate to have my remote release sites but threads like yours make me wish I had a backyard so I could follow up on everyone and watch them enjoy their squirrely lives.

Backyard release has always been amazing, but the fun has really increased since I began working from home every day in March 2020.

I used to leave work early in December to make sure I got back in time to feed my squirrels (both indoors and outdoors) before they bedded down for the night.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Backyard release has always been amazing, but the fun has really increased since I began working from home every day in March 2020.

I used to leave work early in December to make sure I got back in time to feed my squirrels (both indoors and outdoors) before they bedded down for the night.

Hi Olorin,

Always good to hear from you! Glad you're home in the day as that's the action time. When its not a hot day here, its feeding in morning and then play time all afternoon. The gang run all around the yard, on the roof, and many times at backdoor window looking in. Really fun! By dusk time, the place clears out. Its amazing how the map out the area and know the trail home. They must have a GPS in the brain! Sometimes they get loud when everyone jumps for the trees or roof to start barking out the alert. We have hawks around here that fly through like fighter jets and then circle around. Frankly, I'm not sure the neighbors appreciate our backyard squirrel haven. but WTH, its nature!

Mr.SSG

[olorin19]

Hi Olorin,

Always good to hear from you! Glad you're home in the day as that's the action time. When its not a hot day here, its feeding in morning and then play time all afternoon. The gang run all around the yard, on the roof, and many times at backdoor window looking in. Really fun! By dusk time, the place clears out. Its amazing how the map out the area and know the trail home. They must have a GPS in the brain! Sometimes they get loud when everyone jumps for the trees or roof to start barking out the alert. We have hawks around here that fly through like fighter jets and then circle around. Frankly, I'm not sure the neighbors appreciate our backyard squirrel haven. but WTH, its nature!

Mr.SSG

We live in a ranch house with a mostly glass sun room on the back, a glass porch in front, a huge window in living room, and another huge window right next to where I sit for work in my office / squirrel room.

Translation: All my squirrel buddies can find me any time. I had to stop feeding them at my office window (aka the drive thru) as otherwise it was hard to get any work done.

[supersquirrelgirl]

Time for an Update:

Contruction continues over the fence in neighbor's yard with jack-hammers and small Bobcat loaders (its quite noisy).

Squirrels continue to come early to beat the workers and the noise! Daylight is delaying later now so breakfast opens close to 7:00am. Ms. Mo is usually first to arrive and stands at the backdoor window, tapping to get attention. (she's a big girl so very easy to see her!) Over the last few weeks, another younger female who looks like little Mo has been coming and the real Mo doesn't seem to mind. Maybe close relation ?? Any other females are chased away immediately.

In the last few days, Ms. Mo is coming only to get whole walnuts, no interest to eat, just walnut grab-n-go. Today, she came 8 times for walnuts. She must sense we are getting ready to travel so its stock-up time ??. (maybe see the suitcases are out ??) Ms. Mo still lives across the road and sometimes I act as the crossing guard for her to get home safely.

In general, backyard has less squirrels coming than before the construction started. Some days, we only get 1 or 2 in the morning. There is one small grey squirrel that likes to come around 5~6 pm.

Mr.SSG

[supersquirrelgirl]

Quick Update:

We're back home and guess who is the first to check in - Ms Mo. She looks really good. I guess all the walnuts she buried before we left helped. She still lives across the road but her nut stash is on this side. Construction work continues next door with all kinds of loud noises so other squirrels come early.

I'll write more later and post some pictures too. I'm just thrilled that Mo is still alive. Almost 7 years old.

Mr.SSG

[supersquirrelgirl]

Update for 12-24-2024

Sorry for no updates or pictures as promised above.

Just back in town a few days ago and Ms Mo has come running. I think she is watching the garage door from across the street. She comes several times per day to get a whole walnut and bury it nearby. Her squirrel gang comes everyday and gets a nut too.

Been a little hectic around here so not much posting on TSB on-going. Again, this year we leave for Japan skiing on Dec-31st so another backout period coming soon. I just love Ms Mo.

Mr.SSG

[olorin19]

Do you have any friends nearby who like squirrels?

We feed 15-20 yard squirrels, which include some former releases and their descendants. When we go away, we have various people that step in to spread sunflower seeds on the ground and keep water dishes full.

If you have somebody with you a few times when Ms. Mo came by for a walnut, perhaps they might be able to feed her when you were away. Even if she did not come right up to them, Ms Mo might approach close enough that your friend could toss her a walnut.

A few years ago, we went away for a week and had my daughter (who is very used to squirrels) and son-in-law (who had no prior experience) house sit. They would sit out on the porch for morning coffee and feed the various squirrels that came by. Squirrels are very quick to adapt.

[supersquirrelgirl]

No friends who tolerate squirrels. We have been handing out walnuts excessively for days so they can stash them. Mo and friends have been around for years and knows the drill. Water and food is available around the yards but its just not the prefered walnuts they like. Only real risk is crossing the road to get here. When we are gone, that will stop until the scout squirrel broadcasts we are back.