Vomiting

[Silverline]

Hey everyone,
It's been a long time and I hope that you are all well.

My little one (Trooper-Marie) has suddenly gotten sick (6 year old Eastern Grey). I noticed that her face was a bit wet when I got home from work, I took her out of her room and let her wander around for a bit and gave her a piece of banana, a few almonds, and some fresh water. A few moments after she drank, she started vomiting for a few minutes. It was mostly water and the banana. Seemed a tad slimy. I could tell that something was off as she was having a hard time jumping or moving. She is still active, running, climbing, eating, drinking, and pooping, though her balance is off a bit.

I Just got her into her smaller cage with fresh bedding, towels, and a bowl of water. She drank and ate a bit more after that episode and seems to be keeping it down. Shes tucked herself up and is now currently sleeping.

Her diet hasn't really changed over the last 6 years, though I'm wondering if she could have eaten something that spoiled that she hid. I'm wondering if her calcium levels are off. She hasn't been on blocks in quite a few years.

She has been getting a bit skinnier since last summer, but she hasn't been eating a lot of fatty foods or nuts as much. She's also become a bit picky on foods.

I'm just about to go pickup some fresh avocado, grapes, mushrooms, and beans, all her favorites.

I'm hoping that this could is just a stomach bug or something. I'm quite worried and stressed out. I've been her vet ever since we moved to Canada. I have no where that I can take her.
I'm going to rule out blockage as she is defecating. I sill have Clavaseptin, but I believe they are expired (07/01/18). I heard that they are good for longer if kept in a dark place which they have been. I just don't know if it's worth the risk.

Please help...

[RockyPops]

Thank you so much for loving your baby girl!

I can't advise you but I'm sure you know that several on here can. So...

KEEP CHECKING BACK OFTEN!

I sure hope she gets better!

[Silverline]

Update:
A couple of hours ago I gave her a strawberry, apple slice, avocado slice, broccoli, and a mushroom. She ate the apple and avocado first. After she ate those, she was very determined to jump on my shoulder and was looking distressed. She then started dry heaving for a few moments. a tiny amount of avocado came up, but not like her first episodes where she puked up everything everywhere.
After that spell, she climbed off of me and ran around the room for a few moments. She still looked a bit distressed, but when I got her back in her cage she proceeded to eat the rest of her food, drank water, and has kept everything down so far.
She seems to have a very big appetite (Though I'm not spoiling her too much right now). She has been sleeping most of the evening, but she also seems to want to be active when she wakes up. When I bring her something or open her cage, she immediately wants out so I let her climb on me for a few moments for cuddles. She's clearly not happy but loves the cuddles and it calms her down. Her balance is off still, though I think it's because her stomach is still bothering her and she was weak from the episodes.
She is pooping but I haven't noticed any pee yet, though that's harder to spot.
I put her to bed for the night in the family room where my family can help me keep an eye on her in the morning.
During those events, I was recording her (eating, dry heaving, eating again, then sleeping). If these would help, I can upload them.

I'm hoping that she will feel better in the morning after a good night sleep, but I'm still very concerned for her hydration, pain, and overall health.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated. (I'm hoping that Nancy, SammysMom, SquirrelGirl, or anyone else that's helped her in the past are still around. It's been so long since I've been on here last.)

[Winston]

I'll be following this closely as I care fore a 6 year old male that is vomiting also. So many experts say that squirrels don't vomit but I have seen it and read about it.
I do have a suggestion for monitoring your girl's urine. Put down some fresh white paper in her cage. I use blank newsprint. You can also put white sheets, pillow cases or towels in her sleeping area. This will help you see what she's doing. Inspect, change, and wash them often.

Good luck

[CritterMom]

The old timers are all still here. I remember your baby.

This has only been going on for one day, right? It does sound as though she may have eaten something bad. You really do need to police her stashes on a regular (daily) basis so this doesn't occur again. would offer her fluids - you can even add a bit of sugar or honey to it to make it taste better and induce her to drink. Hopefully sleeping will help her out.

She really should be eating blocks - and I know you know that. Are you giving her any sort of additional calcium to counter her not eating them?

[Silverline]

The old timers are all still here. I remember your baby.

This has only been going on for one day, right? It does sound as though she may have eaten something bad. You really do need to police her stashes on a regular (daily) basis so this doesn't occur again. would offer her fluids - you can even add a bit of sugar or honey to it to make it taste better and induce her to drink. Hopefully sleeping will help her out.

She really should be eating blocks - and I know you know that. Are you giving her any sort of additional calcium to counter her not eating them?

Hello CritterMom. Great to talk to you again. Hope all is well.

Yes, this has only been 1 day so far, and now this morning. She has been on a consistent diet of fruits, veggies, and nuts. I took her off the blocks because she would never eat them.

Update for this morning:
I gave her a small mushroom and an apple slice. She proceeded to vomit while she was eating, she then proceeded to eat the rest of it right after. She's also been drinking her water, and she is peeing and pooping.
She is still weak and has a hard time keeping balance through her back legs, though I still believe it's because her tummy is quite upset. She is back in her bed now sleeping and doesn't really want to move all too much, though I did wake her up and she was groggy.

I've taken some more videos that I will upload momentarily. I'm hoping this will pass soon. She's had an indecent like this a few years ago (2015 or 16).
I really hope this was just something that she ate and will naturally recover.

[Silverline]

This is her this morning
https://youtu.be/wtaxQ8I8mcw
https://youtu.be/NRVMs15pTzY

[RockyPops]

I'm no expert!

But it looks like she has a couple of issues going on.

Her wonky legs looks like MBD. She probably needs back on her blocks and calcium administered now. And/or joint pain from aging maybe. And maybe pain med.

She looks like she's having trouble chewing her food. Have you checked her teeth? That could be causing the vomiting. Kinda looks like she's choking on her food that isn't chewed up good.

Someone else will chime in but the MBD treatment wouldn't hurt anything to go ahead with.

[Silverline]

I'm no expert!

But it looks like she has a couple of issues going on.

Her wonky legs looks like MBD. She probably needs back on her blocks and calcium administered now. And/or joint pain from aging maybe. And maybe pain med.

She looks like she's having trouble chewing her food. Have you checked her teeth? That could be causing the vomiting. Kinda looks like she's choking on her food that isn't chewed up good.

Someone else will chime in but the MBD treatment wouldn't hurt anything to go ahead with.

I agree, I think she needs to get Calcium of some sort in her. however I don't have the recipe to make her blocks any more, or what ingredients where used. I live in Canada now so I need to resort to making them myself, or something equivalent. It's very difficult to make her eat the blocks, the official ones, or home made.

I don't know if it would be MDB though, as the vomiting and the weakness all came on suddenly at once, unless MDB has vomiting as a symptom. But I'm not an expert either and I'm definitely not opposed to calcium treatments.

She's not having any difficulties chewing and her teeth are fine. She was also not choking, they were for sure heaves. After she was heaving she had some regurgitated food in her mouth. She was more smacking her lips and trying to get what ever she regurgitated out of her mouth. She drank water after that and continued eating the rest of her food just fine, which she has managed to keep down thus far.

Thanks for your insight insight though. MDB is on my radar.

[RockyPops]

If you could get some tums (unflavored if possible) and scrape powder off onto an avocado or wet pecan halve that would be a start. Until someone can give advice.

Can you get the HHB Picky Bites or Wild Bites. See if she would eat them.

When I said check teeth I meant her molars (I guess) that she grinds with not her front teeth. You probably know this but I'm just throwing stuff out.

Someone else will chime in.

[Silverline]

I just tried feeding her avocado again, she keeps heaving up what ever I'm feeding her. Not all of it though. She had a big pee just now too.
She's very weak and starting to shake.
This is now an emergency.
I have no where to take her. Where is everyone on here? I really need some solid medical advice.
Please!

[CritterMom]

You aren't giving her access to the skin or pit of the avocado, are you?

If I were you I would start treating for MBD now, since you cannot start yesterday. Tums is good. Eggshells are made from calcium carbonate. To make eggshell calcium, dump the contents out of several eggs, and boil the shells for 5 minutes. Then shake off the water and place them on a sheet in a 200 degree oven for 20 minutes or so until the shells are bone dry. Grind as finely as you are capable. 1/2 tsp + about 1000mg of calcium.

[Silverline]

You aren't giving her access to the skin or pit of the avocado, are you?

If I were you I would start treating for MBD now, since you cannot start yesterday. Tums is good. Eggshells are made from calcium carbonate. To make eggshell calcium, dump the contents out of several eggs, and boil the shells for 5 minutes. Then shake off the water and place them on a sheet in a 200 degree oven for 20 minutes or so until the shells are bone dry. Grind as finely as you are capable. 1/2 tsp + about 1000mg of calcium.

Thank you I will try this. How many eggs are recommended? would there be any type of calcium supplement in a store that I could use as an alternative?
And yes, No pits or skins.

[Silverline]

Thank you I will try this. How many eggs are recommended? would there be any type of calcium supplement in a store that I could use as an alternative?
And yes, No pits or skins.

Also, should I mash this up in with an avocado in a bowl? or what would be the best way to get this into her system?

Thanks.

[CritterMom]

It doesn't matter how many eggs. The daily dose of the calcium (spread out through the day) will be about a rounded 1/4 teaspoon, and you can sprinkle it or mix it with ANYTHING she likes. One single egg would last you DAYS.

Any calcium supplement without vitamin D added is fine. But 99% have vitamin D in them as they are people, not squirrels. This is why we recommend Tums. It is calcium carbonate and some flavoring and the stuff they use so it will stick together in a pill. No vit D.

[Silverline]

It doesn't matter how many eggs. The daily dose of the calcium (spread out through the day) will be about a rounded 1/4 teaspoon, and you can sprinkle it or mix it with ANYTHING she likes. One single egg would last you DAYS.

Any calcium supplement without vitamin D added is fine. But 99% have vitamin D in them as they are people, not squirrels. This is why we recommend Tums. It is calcium carbonate and some flavoring and the stuff they use so it will stick together in a pill. No vit D.

I got the eggs in the oven now and I'm about to head to the store to get tums. Does it matter if it's flavored? Would the dose of tums be the same as the eggs?

[Diggie's Friend]

Hi.

There is also a possible issue from feeding whole nuts in the shell, for in the shell they can harbor fungus that produces alfa-toxins that damage the liver which also are known to lead to the development of cancer. Better that you know then than not about this issue. Too prevent and counter this issue, it is vital to support with Milk Thistle Seed extract, and Pycnogenol, as both have been found to support the liver by preventing and treating alfa-toxin exposure.

https://www.amazon.com/Oregons-Wild-Harvest-Thistle-Supplement/dp/B00J9MKEUG

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00CLYNA14/ref=dp_cerb_1

Increasing Calcium daily in the diet of your 6-year-old Fox squirrel, is also merited; for since as rodents age their kidneys retain more and more phosphorus, and absorb less and less calcium. This causes the actual (Ca:P) ratio of the diet in the body to lower which takes its toll on the kidneys and the bones also. With any block you feed this will be the case. HHB has the best ratio of (Ca:P), yet even with this ratio at 6 years of age the (Ca:P) ratio it once supported at 2 years of age in the body has gotten closer.

Calcium citrate has been found in rats to lend support and longevity to the function of the kidneys (calcium carbonate was not found to lend support to the same).

I can send you an approx. measure to better support the metabolic and bone health of your grey squirrel for Calcium Citrate.

https://purebulk.com/products/calcium-citrate-usa


Mini measuring spoons for use with the above minerals and for foods also daily.

https://www.amazon.com/GUSENG-Stainless-Measuring-Durable-Accessories/dp/B07WCT4LP5/ref=sr_1_10?keywords=mini+measuring+teaspoons&qid=1584040833&s=home-garden&sr=1-10

[Diggie's Friend]

I also recommend this source of soil based pre-probiotics which lends significant support to both digestion and reduction of calcium lowering anti nutrients in the diet.

https://www.amazon.com/Vitality-Science-Pet-Flora-Gastrointestinal/dp/B005PJN2HO/ref=sr_1_2?keywords=Pet+flora+vitality+science&qid=1584042051&s=hpc&sr=1-2-catcorr

All these sources have been included in a research based diet for gray squirrels cared for in captivity, with excellent results.You can send me a PM and I will send you the info for the measures for the calcium citrate to add to the yogurt. This way, your squirrel can still get the calcium and magnesium in the diet they need to balance the diet when not eating the block.

[CritterMom]

I got the eggs in the oven now and I'm about to head to the store to get tums. Does it matter if it's flavored? Would the dose of tums be the same as the eggs?

Actually, the taste can help. Avoid peppermint - go for one of the fruit flavors. And get the tablets, not gummies or any of the other new whiz bang types! When you get it, turn the bottle and read the back label. It will tell you how much elemental calcium is in each pill. Aim to get 500mg PER day into her for the first few days of treatment. You want to spread it out through the day, not give it all at once.

Here is a link to our MBD protocol: https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?17680-Emergency-Treatment-for-MBD-(Updated-3-31-09)

[Diggie's Friend]

In using the MBD treatment, since your squirrel is older, Calcium citrate will lend protection to your squirrels kidneys in this situation.

[CritterMom]

Also, pick up some infant ibuprophen. The hunched up behavior may be from pain. Let's take care of that. Will need her weight to dose for you.

[Silverline]

Actually, the taste can help. Avoid peppermint - go for one of the fruit flavors. And get the tablets, not gummies or any of the other new whiz bang types! When you get it, turn the bottle and read the back label. It will tell you how much elemental calcium is in each pill. Aim to get 500mg PER day into her for the first few days of treatment. You want to spread it out through the day, not give it all at once.

Here is a link to our MBD protocol: https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?17680-Emergency-Treatment-for-MBD-(Updated-3-31-09)

I got the Extra strength 750mg assorted fruit Tums. I mashed up one tablet into a tiny bit of water and mixed with a small piece of mashed banana. She ate a couple mouth fulls, but then wouldn't take any more. I also took put some tums solution on an apple slice that she took a few bites of. So I would say that she has had about 4 to 5 mouth fulls of some tums solution, as shes also licked a bunch off my finger. She also ate the rest of her strawberry from earlier and had some water. She was wandering around a bit and did some running as well, but shes still clearly weak. She hasn't thrown up yet. So perhaps that's a good sign. She's also not shaking anymore.

I just got the egg shells into powder form and I'm thinking of mashing some into her avocado for later. I don't want to force too much food on her, as I'm scared to make her vomit again. She just got tucked up in her bed again and will let her sleep some more.

Another thing of concern, is that she's lost a bit of weight somewhat quickly. I can feel her bones a lot more that usual. Is weight loss a part of MDB? I'm really hoping that it's nothing more severe like cancer. I never gave it a serious thought, as she's been her happy and super active self ever since yesterday.

As for the Tums, the solution that I've made (One pill, couple drops of water) made A LOT, even more when I mixed it with some banana. Would the eggshells be more concentrated and ultimately be better? The tums solution would be a lot to force on her, even spread out through out the day, let alone being able to keep all of it down.

Thank you so much for your help.

[Silverline]

While posting I didn't see the videos. Your squirrel doesn't appear to weight what you have related they do, but is on the thinner side.

No matter, including the mineral forms and nutraceutical extracts to address a possible alfatoxin ingestion and support a more supportive Calcium to Phosphorus ratio.

In using the MBD treatment, since your squirrel is older, Calcium citrate will lend protection to your squirrels kidneys in this situation.

NOW also carries a source of Calcium citrate powder that you may find on the shelf locally. Same elemental dosage, not though the same by measure.

This is what it looks like: https://www.amazon.com/NOW-Foods-Calcium-Citrate-Powder/dp/B0006ZF9NC/ref=sr_1_6?keywords=calcium+citrate+powder+now&qid=1584043339&sr=8-6

Thanks for all your insight, I will look at these products online. At this moment though, I'm looking for what I can pick up from a store today. I've picked up some tums, but the yogurt and probiotics is something that I can pickup later today.
There was a recipe somewhere on this forum long ago with how to make the Healthy Blocks at home. I will need to off that vs ordering from the States. Anything from Amazon is fine to order, but not the Henry's.

Also, yes she is on the thin side. She has lost a bit of weight recently. I didn't mention what she weighs because I don't know yet since her weight loss. I need to find a scale somewhere.

Thank you very much for the links. I will look into them once I have her more stabilized today. Also, thanks for the Yogurt and Probiotics tips. I will grab those ASAP.

[CritterMom]

I got the Extra strength 750mg assorted fruit Tums. I mashed up one tablet into a tiny bit of water and mixed with a small piece of mashed banana. She ate a couple mouth fulls, but then wouldn't take any more. I also took put some tums solution on an apple slice that she took a few bites of. So I would say that she has had about 4 to 5 mouth fulls of some tums solution, as shes also licked a bunch off my finger. She also ate the rest of her strawberry from earlier and had some water. She was wandering around a bit and did some running as well, but shes still clearly weak. She hasn't thrown up yet. So perhaps that's a good sign. She's also not shaking anymore.

I just got the egg shells into powder form and I'm thinking of mashing some into her avocado for later. I don't want to force too much food on her, as I'm scared to make her vomit again. She just got tucked up in her bed again and will let her sleep some more.

Another thing of concern, is that she's lost a bit of weight somewhat quickly. I can feel her bones a lot more that usual. Is weight loss a part of MDB? I'm really hoping that it's nothing more severe like cancer. I never gave it a serious thought, as she's been her happy and super active self ever since yesterday.

As for the Tums, the solution that I've made (One pill, couple drops of water) made A LOT, even more when I mixed it with some banana. Would the eggshells be more concentrated and ultimately be better? The tums solution would be a lot to force on her, even spread out through out the day, let alone being able to keep all of it down.

Thank you so much for your help.

Yes, the eggshell is more concentrated because it is ONLY calcium - the binders and flavorings add volume, too. Make sure you grind the heck out of it - you are trying to make powder. You can sprinkle it dry on things, too - you don't HAVE to add water. It has the benefit of almost no flavor at all, too, so it can be hidden in things.

It is obviously not possible for us to diagnose something like cancer - all we can really do is address what we are able and hope. If she has been without blocks for some time, I KNOW she has MBD to some degree. So you go after that and hope it is all that is going on. MBD HURTS. That will kill the appetite quickly. She wouldn't show that to you until it got so bad she couldn't hide it though. That is why I suggested the infant ibuprophen. It does a dandy job, too, and most squirrels like it.

[Silverline]

Yes, the eggshell is more concentrated because it is ONLY calcium - the binders and flavorings add volume, too. Make sure you grind the heck out of it - you are trying to make powder. You can sprinkle it dry on things, too - you don't HAVE to add water. It has the benefit of almost no flavor at all, too, so it can be hidden in things.

It is obviously not possible for us to diagnose something like cancer - all we can really do is address what we are able and hope. If she has been without blocks for some time, I KNOW she has MBD to some degree. So you go after that and hope it is all that is going on. MBD HURTS. That will kill the appetite quickly. She wouldn't show that to you until it got so bad she couldn't hide it though. That is why I suggested the infant ibuprophen. It does a dandy job, too, and most squirrels like it.

Thank you so much. I will start getting the eggshells into her right away. I'll see if she'll eat more right now.
I do have ibuprofen on hand, but I don't know her weight. My old scale broke and have yet to replace it. I'll see if I can pick one up at Walmart or somewhere today.

[CritterMom]

Thank you so much. I will start getting the eggshells into her right away. I'll see if she'll eat more right now.
I do have ibuprofen on hand, but I don't know her weight. My old scale broke and have yet to replace it. I'll see if I can pick one up at Walmart or somewhere today.

Lets get a small dose in her now. What is the strength of the ibuprophen you have - is it INFANT or CHILDRENS?

[Diggie's Friend]

If you have a mortar and pestle, it would make grinding the boiled dried egg shells into powder easier.

If not, then place the boiled dried egg shells on a sheet of computer paper and fold it over; then used a hammer to pulverize them. Empty powdered eggshell into small bowl.

Use the same measure noted in the MBD treatment protocol for the pulverized boiled dried eggshells. Once partial dose of (100 mg.) is measured, add it to a smaller feed bowl; add couple of drops of orange juice and (1/2 Tsp.) of whole fat yogurt.

This trio provides calcium, citrate, probiotics, and protein.

I would get the whole fat yogurt seeing your squirrel is very underweight. If your squirrel refuses to eat it you will have to force feed it.

If so, then dilute the mixture with purified water and pull it up into a non needle syringe to deliver it just inside the lip right behind the incisors as at 45 degree angle, repeatedly pushing a little into the mouth at a time allowing your squirrel to swallow it.

Feeding egg is also doable; feed cooked (poached soft yolk, not liquid) and (fully cooked white) to yolk in a (2:1) ratio. (1/4) fed twice daily.

[Silverline]

If you have a mortar and pestle, it makes grinding the boiled dried egg shells into powder easier.

If not place the boiled dried egg shells on a sheet of computer paper and fold it over, then used a hammer to pulverize them. Empty powdered eggshell into small bowl. Once partial dose of 100 mg. is measured, add a couple of drops of orange juice to it and then add that to whole fat yogurt diluted with purified water to make a slurry mixture to give 5 times over each day.

This trio provides citrate, probiotics, and protein. I would get the whole fat yogurt seeing your squirrel is very underweight. If your squirrel refuses to eat it you will have to force feed it.

To give by non needle syringe should your squirrel refuses it in a small feeding bowl, place the tip just inside the lip right behind the incisors as at 45 degree angle and push a little into the mouth at a time repeatedly allowing the squirrel to swallow it.

Use the same measure noted in the MBD treatment protocol for the pulverized boiled dried eggshells.

Feeding egg is also doable; feed cooked (poached not fried) white to yolk in a (2:1) ratio. (1/4) fed twice daily.

Thanks for the info. I will go get some yogurt now. Do squirrels prefer one flavor more over another? She can be picky with fruit flavored stuff. Perhaps vanilla?
I do believe I have the eggshells in power form, but I'll try taking a hammer to it as well for the extra effect.

I mashed some eggshells up in a small piece of avocado just now and she ate most of it. She's been keeping things down so far. She's only puked once early this morning (In the videos). So I guess that's a good sign.
I think she's had about 150-200mg so far today. Should I wait till later tonight before bed to give her the rest?

She's back in her bed now, so I'll let her sleep. I'll grab the yogurt and a scale here shortly.

[CritterMom]

Yes. Let her sleep for a bit. If I could force her to do what I wanted (fat chance!), it would be to get up, have food and calcium and some pain meds, then go back to sleep until the next meal/dosage, and so on. If it IS MBD, every bit of energy needs to go toward stopping the progress and then to rebuilding bone mass, not squirreling around. It will be easier for her since she is an older gal and they slow up a bit and develop an abiding love for their snug little nests anyway.

You saw my temp dosage for the infant ibuprophen, didn't you?

[Silverline]

Yes. Let her sleep for a bit. If I could force her to do what I wanted (fat chance!), it would be to get up, have food and calcium and some pain meds, then go back to sleep until the next meal/dosage, and so on. If it IS MBD, every bit of energy needs to go toward stopping the progress and then to rebuilding bone mass, not squirreling around. It will be easier for her since she is an older gal and they slow up a bit and develop an abiding love for their snug little nests anyway.

You saw my temp dosage for the infant ibuprophen, didn't you?

I'm actually about to go buy some. The ibuprophen that I had is long expired. I'll make sure that I get the infant type.

Though she is keeping things down now, I'm still concerned about her vomiting. Is this a symptom of MDB, or could there be some other underlying issue that I should also be treating? Though I think the tums might have helped, as she is keeping things down. But I am still worried that there is something else going on.

[Silverline]

Also, when getting yogurt, I understand I should get the whole fat. Should it be dairy, greek, or goat? I'm pretty sure dairy is out, but I'm not to sure what the rules would be in this case.

[Silverline]

Update:
I was able to get in touch with a 24 hour emergency vet hospital who still had her info on file from back when she was imported in 2014. Though they are 24 hours, they only have the small animal /exotic pet vets who would be more experienced on shift in the mornings and early afternoons. So I've booked an appointment for tomorrow at 8:30AM with one. They said that I can bring her in at anytime though, especially if she gets worse or stops eating and drinking.

Since she's keeping her food down and has improved slightly since this morning, I'd like to get your thoughts. Should I wait until the morning to get her in to see an appropriate vet, or get her in now to see a general vet?

I'm just on my way to pick up some pain meds. I'll feed her again in a few hours with her remaining eggshell dose. She's sleeping right now and I don't want to wake her, except for her pain med dose.

Thank you all so much for your help.

[Diggie's Friend]

The only thing I can add, is that taking a weak squirrel to the vet is very stressful for them, and too stressful sadly for some. If she has MBD, with you are doing what can on your end; and if a liver issue, only MTS extract (Wild harvest liquid extract Sprouts may carry) and Pycnogenol 30 mg. I would look online to see who may carry that locally) has been found to counter toxins from fungus, and likely they won't have either on hand, even so available at stores

If it is another issue, as long as she is improving, less gagging, no temperature, less tired, and continues to eat ok, you may want to consider whether it is better to wait till she shows more signs of regaining her strength? It's your call.

As for the weight loss, from the look of her body, and the amount you posted, she's lost about 300 grams.


Since she likes banana, she will likely accept the, "Banilla" version from "Stonyfield: Whole milk with Probiotic creamy organic yogurt.

Sprouts Markets carry this brand. Not sure if they have the smaller cups or not.


https://www.stonyfield.com/products/yogurt/smooth-creamy/whole-milk-banilla-32oz

With the plain you can add a bit of organic orange juice.

https://www.stonyfield.com/products/yogurt/smooth-creamy/whole-milk-plain-32oz


Yogurt can be frozen in smaller portions, then thawed to feed. This is best to make smaller batches to freeze to use daily.

With a few of these baby food silicone freezer trays, it makes doing this fairly easy to support!

https://www.amazon.com/Eyourhappy-Baby-Silicone-Freezer-Watertight/dp/B01HVLCXGE/ref=sr_1_15?keywords=baby+food+trays+silicone&qid=1584056311&sr=8-15

[CritterMom]

About the vomiting... I don't know why but I can easily see why low blood calcium might affect this. Calcium doesn't only build bones - it is also responsible for muscle contraction. Cattle develop this sometime when pregnant - farners call it "milk fever" and it makes them unable to birth their calves because the muscle contractions needed to expel the calf just aren't there. If she is having some difficulty swallowing it would be like having a pill stuck in your throat, causing gagging and then THAT causes regurgitation. My now departed boy Mister P had trouble eating thin, soft lettuces like spring mixes. They would apparently get stuck to his palate and not go down and it used to terrify him (and me) when it happened. So I only fed him tough greens like kale and romaine center ribs. But I honestly cannot say for sure.

She had a bad day today. I tend to think that resting until tomorrow if she continues to not vomit tonight - and so you can see a vet that knows something about exotics - is the best bet. If she backslides, you may want to go earlier. I am very glad you are getting her in there.

[Silverline]

I'm just at the store now. Is dairy yogurt ok? What about children's advil, or infant advil? Also what about Pedialyte?

[CritterMom]

Dairy yogurt is fine. Go for vanilla if you can.

INFANT ibuprophen.

You can certainly try one of the flavored pedialytes - she may like it and take more fluids because of that. Don't give it to her for more than 2 days though - lots of sodium - good for replacing electrolytes but once they have been replaced, it is salt and is about as good for them as it is for us (not).

[Silverline]

Dairy yogurt is fine. Go for vanilla if you can.

INFANT ibuprophen.

You can certainly try one of the flavored pedialytes - she may like it and take more fluids because of that. Don't give it to her for more than 2 days though - lots of sodium - good for replacing electrolytes but once they have been replaced, it is salt and is about as good for them as it is for us (not).

I was able to only get Infant Motrin liquid 40mg/1ml (Came with a syringe). The store I went too only had this available, that or the Children's Advil. I can return it and go somewhere else if needed.

[CritterMom]

Nope. What you have is fine. Do you have a weight for her yet?

[Silverline]

Nope. What you have is fine. Do you have a weight for her yet?

No, I wasn't able to find a scale for her yet. Hoping that I can get that info from the vet tomorrow, if I can't find one in time.

[RockyPops]

Crittermom, from moms description of her baby being bony feeling and the video's I'd say she probably would weight 14 to 16 oz. May could low dose pain meds accordingly.

[Silverline]

Update:
I just gave her a couple teaspoons of pedialite with eggshells, some whole fat yogurt with some eggshells, small slice of apple, avocado, and strawberry. She ate and drank everything fine and seemed to love it. So far, shes keeping things down.

She is still very weak, like no body strength and poor balance. But she was up and running a bit as she escaped me when I was feeding her. She curled up to go back to sleep. Since shes eating and drinking, and is still somewhat active, i'll let her sleep through the night and bring her to the vet in the morning for her appointment.

If there is a small amount of the Motrin that I can dose her, please let me know and I'll get it in her asap.

Thanks

[CritterMom]

Sorry. Use what I recommended - I was pretty accurate. .12cc every 4 hours as needed.

[Silverline]

Sorry. Use what I recommended - I was pretty accurate. .12cc every 4 hours as needed.

Will do.
Thank you.

[Silverline]

She's in the emergency room now. She had a seizure this morning as I was getting her into her transport cage.
That was the scariest thing that I've ever been through with her.
She's alert now and I'm waiting for them to finish with her.
I have no idea what the hell happened too her. She was just fine a couple days ago. This is so stressful.
Please send her love.
I really hope that she pulls through. :(

[CritterMom]

I am so sorry - I have been watching for updates all day. Seizures are pretty common with MBD...

[Silverline]

They gave her calcium and vitamin booster shots, sub fluids, antibiotics, and a special formula to feed her at home. She's coming home with me. I just have to wait for the blood work and x-ray results to come in.
She is not happy right now. :(

[Nancy in New York]

I'm praying for our little beauty....Trooper Marie, and for you. 313861:Love_Icon

[Silverline]

She's back at home resting now.
She is on med's now that I have to administer daily. Including calcium meds. All meds are liquid based that I can mix with food or use a syringe.
She's more alert now, but is definitely resting. The vet advised against pain meds at this point. He doesn't think that she is in physical pain, just more sick feeling than anything. He advised that if she gets worse or that she is looking like she is in pain, that he would prescribe a good pain med. He also said that if she gets worse, like open mouth breathing to then take her back right away.

He went over the X-rays and didn't find anything out of the ordinary, so that is a major relief. The blood work is going to take about 24-48 hours to come back. So I guess it's the waiting game now. Knowing that she has had a bunch of shots and is now on meds, I'm a little more relaxed. I thought that I wouldn't be coming back home with her today. Very stressful and very expensive day. I think I too need a rest for a bit.

I'll be updating on her condition periodically.

Thank you all for your support.

[CritterMom]

Aw, poor baby - and poor you.

Don't give meds in food. You need to make sure she gets ALL of it, so meds should be shot into her mouth with a syringe. If you dip the tip of the syringe in syrup or honey or even a little table sugar, she may be a little more receptive.

[Silverline]

Aw, poor baby - and poor you.

Don't give meds in food. You need to make sure she gets ALL of it, so meds should be shot into her mouth with a syringe. If you dip the tip of the syringe in syrup or honey or even a little table sugar, she may be a little more receptive.

Thanks for the info. I will definitely try that as she has quite a few meds to take. It's almost dosing time for her, this should be fun. I'm wondering how I'm going to get 2ML of her calcium in her tomorrow. This was so much easier when she was a baby lol.

The meds that the vet gave me are; Famotidine (Gastric protectant), Enrofloxacin (antibiotic), and Calcium Glubionate. They also gave me a special formula called Emraid IC Omnivore. This reminds me of her baby formula. I have to mix 3 parts powder to 2 parts water. She eats a tiny amount before she doesn't want it anymore. I think she doesn't like the taste. I mixed a bit up with a tiny bit of mashed avocado, and she ate it right up.

She is still very weak and tired. She has her eyes half closed when shes eating and curls right up and sleeps right after, though she does seem more alert now and was determined to come out of her transport cage at one point. I've decided to keep her in this tiny cage for the day and I'm going to over night her in it as well, just so that she doesn't injure herself or move around too much. Once I start noticing her get more energy and that she's not wanting to be sleeping all the time, I'll move her into her mid sized cage again. Hoping that this is a good strategy. I'm really hoping that her blood work comes in tomorrow.

[RockyPops]

Sounds like you have a good plan. If she starts feeling better and getting more active she could injure her fragile bones. No big jumps or high climbing for a while.

[Silverline]

She seems to have a lot more energy now. I've transported her into a one level bunny cage where she has more room. She's taken all her meds and ate a big breakfast. Upon moving her into her bunny cage, I took out her bedding from her tiny transport cage. I didn't notice any poop. This cage was very tiny and she was confined to it all night.
I'm noticing that she does have a stool lodged in her bum. I'm wondering if this is causing a backup. Would this come out naturally now that she's not so confined anymore, or is there something I should do about it?
Any thoughts?

[CritterMom]

See if you can get it out. Normally they get blocked from diarrhea - it pastes over the area and dries like cement. I would apply a little bit of oil to the area (you can use cooking oil - you are just looking for lube) and try to work it out of there. If it is hard and sticking out a bit you may be able to grab with tweezers. If on closer look you see that it IS pasted over with dried diarrhea, you will need to soak it with water to get it out of there - a cotton ball soaked in warm water and just held against the area for a while will soften it so you can get it out.

[Silverline]

See if you can get it out. Normally they get blocked from diarrhea - it pastes over the area and dries like cement. I would apply a little bit of oil to the area (you can use cooking oil - you are just looking for lube) and try to work it out of there. If it is hard and sticking out a bit you may be able to grab with tweezers. If on closer look you see that it IS pasted over with dried diarrhea, you will need to soak it with water to get it out of there - a cotton ball soaked in warm water and just held against the area for a while will soften it so you can get it out.

Ok, I will try this.
It doesn't look like diarrhea, but a large normal stool. Though, I haven't had a great look (I'm nervous to handle her). There was also no evidence of diarrhea on any of her bedding, So I'm really hoping that it's not. The vet said that if she gets diarrhea to bring her back into the ER. :/

[CritterMom]

Ok, I will try this.
It doesn't look like diarrhea, but a large normal stool. Though, I haven't had a great look (I'm nervous to handle her). There was also no evidence of diarrhea on any of her bedding, So I'm really hoping that it's not. The vet said that if she gets diarrhea to bring her back into the ER. :/

You would know if she had diarrhea, believe me. They hate what it feels like so they butt scoot all over, leaving brown stripes behind! She wasn't eating too much for a couple days so it may just be one that is sort of dried in place. You might even be able to rub it out of there with a cotton ball.

[Silverline]

You would know if she had diarrhea, believe me. They hate what it feels like so they butt scoot all over, leaving brown stripes behind! She wasn't eating too much for a couple days so it may just be one that is sort of dried in place. You might even be able to rub it out of there with a cotton ball.

She has been eating lots the last couple of days, her appetite has been really good, that's kind of why I'm kind of concerned that she might be backed up. I can tell that she is still kind of bothered with her lower end.
I just tried to dab some oil over her bum. I tried to do the tweezer thing. She's not having any of that. She started running and jumping away from me, where I had to chase her down. That spent her energy. I'll try the cotton ball thing when she goes back to sleep and try that. Otherwise, I don't know how i'd do this.
It's definitely a very hard solid stool. No diarrhea.
I know Avocado's are oily, she's been eating lots of those. Would increasing some oils more in her diet help? Should I maybe call the ER and see if the meds would cause this?

[CritterMom]

She has been eating lots the last couple of days, her appetite has been really good, that's kind of why I'm kind of concerned that she might be backed up. I can tell that she is still kind of bothered with her lower end.
I just tried to dab some oil over her bum. I tried to do the tweezer thing. She's not having any of that. She started running and jumping away from me, where I had to chase her down. That spent her energy. I'll try the cotton ball thing when she goes back to sleep and try that. Otherwise, I don't know how i'd do this.
It's definitely a very hard solid stool. No diarrhea.
I know Avocado's are oily, she's been eating lots of those. Would increasing some oils more in her diet help? Should I maybe call the ER and see if the meds would cause this?

You can ask them. The meds aren't nearly as likely to do this as the food they have you giving her. Honestly, increasing her water intake will help with poops more than oil.

They don't like having their little poopers messed with. Wiping my boy down after he had the runs got me the worst bite he ever dealt out.

[Silverline]

You can ask them. The meds aren't nearly as likely to do this as the food they have you giving her. Honestly, increasing her water intake will help with poops more than oil.

They don't like having their little poopers messed with. Wiping my boy down after he had the runs got me the worst bite he ever dealt out.

I've just phoned the vet, they said that I can bring her in and they would remove it if I wanted. They said that I can also just wait a bit and see, though if she loses her appetite or stops drinking then to definitely bring her back in.
I think that i'll wait for a bit. I'd rather not have her go through that trip again, especially that we are currently in a snow storm. She drank a ton of water early this morning. I'm thinking that I will take her off the pedialite as well. She's been on it for just under two days now.

[Silverline]

Well she's pooping again :D
It looks like she is getting a large amount of energy back and she has an enormous appetite. Right now she's getting her formula of 9ML a day mixed in with a small piece of mashed avocado, along with a small piece of strawberry, a small slice of apple, and some of the whole fat yogurt. I'm wondering if it would be ok to start feeding her some of her regular veggies (Broccoli, cauliflower, tomato, mushoorm, carrot) again while on the formula. If so, should I do small amounts, or let her eat as much as she wants (within reason)? The ER didn't really mention anything about feeding her, just so long as she gets the formula in her.

Thanks for all the help. I'm much more hopeful than I was yesterday. What a ride.

313890313889

[CritterMom]

Oh, that is so good to hear. I wonder if she just got herself dehydrated for some reason? If she was feeling crappy from low calcium, it can be too much work to go to the bottle or dish. and dehydration can take them down fast. Hmm.

You HAVE to get her on some sort of blocks. I know that the shipping costs from the US are terrible. It is a shame - Henry's has introduced a new hazelnut block that they all love. My FLYER likes them and they don't like ANYTHING healthy, the rotten little jerks! These are pretty good blocks - I found these at a Canadian site: https://www.chinchilla.ca/detail.php?ProductID=HT201410

For her to like them, they will probably need to be gussied up a bit with some yummy stuff. Many people use them as the basis of do it yourself blocks. I would also order some of this: https://ca.iherb.com/pr/Now-Foods-Calcium-Carbonate-Powder-12-oz-340-g/480 also from a Canadian company. I would be happy to help you craft a recipe that she just may be willing to eat if you wish.

Don't let her run around too much. They hide their illness until it is so acute they simply can't anymore. She isn't 100% yet but it sure sounds like she is headed that way! :w00t

[Silverline]

Oh, that is so good to hear. I wonder if she just got herself dehydrated for some reason? If she was feeling crappy from low calcium, it can be too much work to go to the bottle or dish. and dehydration can take them down fast. Hmm.

You HAVE to get her on some sort of blocks. I know that the shipping costs from the US are terrible. It is a shame - Henry's has introduced a new hazelnut block that they all love. My FLYER likes them and they don't like ANYTHING healthy, the rotten little jerks! These are pretty good blocks - I found these at a Canadian site: https://www.chinchilla.ca/detail.php?ProductID=HT201410

For her to like them, they will probably need to be gussied up a bit with some yummy stuff. Many people use them as the basis of do it yourself blocks. I would also order some of this: https://ca.iherb.com/pr/Now-Foods-Calcium-Carbonate-Powder-12-oz-340-g/480 also from a Canadian company. I would be happy to help you craft a recipe that she just may be willing to eat if you wish.

Don't let her run around too much. They hide their illness until it is so acute they simply can't anymore. She isn't 100% yet but it sure sounds like she is headed that way! :w00t

The vet did say she was a bit dehydrated, even though she was drinking pedialite for a day. But I think those fluids he gave her yesterday helped a lot. Last night she also drank a lot of water, she was drinking for almost a full minute before she stopped. All great signs! :)

Thank you so much! I will get these ordered right away. I'll go for the hazelnut, if she likes that, then I'll see if we can find a recipe for it somewhere!

Ya shes been hopping and running a bit in her cage while we were making dinner. She just wanted out of her cage and to be around me. The house is quite again, so she's settled down and will probably sleep more. I'm going to put her back into her transport cage and have her in my room with me tonight when I go to bed.

What are your thoughts on feeding her the veggies? Also, would it be ok to give her an almond here and there?

[CritterMom]

The vet did say she was a bit dehydrated, even though she was drinking pedialite for a day. But I think those fluids he gave her yesterday helped a lot. Last night she also drank a lot of water, she was drinking for almost a full minute before she stopped. All great signs! :)

Thank you so much! I will get these ordered right away. I'll go for the hazelnut, if she likes that, then I'll see if we can find a recipe for it somewhere!

Ya shes been hopping and running a bit in her cage while we were making dinner. She wants out of her cage and to be around me. The house is quite again, so she's settled down and will probably sleep more. I'm going to put her back into her transport cage and have her in my room with me tonight when I go to bed.

What are your thoughts on feeding her the veggies? Also, would it be ok to give her an almond here and there?

The Hazelnut blocks are from Henrys: https://www.henryspets.com/hazelnut-blocks-food-for-squirrels-flyers-rats-and-mice/ But they are from the US and so the shipping is high. You might send an email or even call the number on the site and speak to Leigh, the owner (she is a TSB member). If there is a way to ship it to you any cheaper, she will know it.

I don't see any reason she can't have her veggies. Keep the nuts to a minimum - I either buy slivers or cut them into little pieces so it feels like more. Hold them down to one or two a week until you get her on a block food that will continue to support her calcium levels.

[Silverline]

The Hazelnut blocks are from Henrys: https://www.henryspets.com/hazelnut-blocks-food-for-squirrels-flyers-rats-and-mice/ But they are from the US and so the shipping is high. You might send an email or even call the number on the site and speak to Leigh, the owner (she is a TSB member). If there is a way to ship it to you any cheaper, she will know it.

I don't see any reason she can't have her veggies. Keep the nuts to a minimum - I either buy slivers or cut them into little pieces so it feels like more. Hold them down to one or two a week until you get her on a block food that will continue to support her calcium levels.

That's fine. I don't mind buying them to try out. Hazelnuts are her favorite. I'll reach out to her though, and see if there is another avenue. I'll also order some stuff from the Canadian links as well. I'd like to have a good supply on hand while I trial between them :)

That sounds good. I'll wait to give her any nuts at all at least until she's off her meds then. Better to be on the safe side. :)

[Silverline]

Just an update on Trooper. She seems to be getting a lot of her energy back. Though still weak and recovering. She's being vocal again is curious and jumps out of bed at every movement in the house. She still has quite the appetite, so the meds seem to be agreeing with her. No issues on peeing or pooping.
I'm still waiting for the blood results. They were supposed to be in today. I'll phone them in the morning to find out. Otherwise no news is good news I guess.
Trooper does seem to be recovering, so I'm more at ease.
I'll keep posting updates.

[Diggie's Friend]

Baked Butternut squash has a positive Ca:P ratio. If Butternut isn't available get Acorn Squash.

Winter squash is an excellent source of fiber baked, making digestion easier and supporting healthy bowel function and stool elimination.

Scoop out the baked squash flesh and store it in small portions of about (1 1/2 Tsp.) to split fed daily, (3/4 Tsp.) AM & PM each.

Silicone baby food trays make this easy to support on a daily basis by storing the portions in the freezer so that they are ready to thaw in the fridge and feed the next morning. Using the small end of a melon baller to remove the squash once cooled makes the task much easier.

https://www.amazon.com/Eyourhappy-Baby-Silicone-Freezer-Watertight/dp/B01HVLCXGE/ref=sr_1_45?keywords=baby+food+trays+silicone&qid=1584347270&sr=8-45

[Silverline]

Her blood work came back. The doctor had to discuss this with an exotics expert, hence why it took a little longer to come back.
Here was his findings sent to my email:
______________________
I discussed the bloodwork with an exotic specialist.
Bloodwork results:
-the protein was lower than normal; this can be seen with liver disease and gastrointestinal disease (eg. infection,
cancer)
-one of the liver enzymes was higher than normal; this can be seen with infection, cancers, etc.
-the calcium was lower than normal; this could be dietary or low due to the decreased protein.

I am recommending the following:
1)Continue with the enrofloxacxin (antibiotic) for the 14 days
2)Recheck in 10-14 days for recheck bloodwork (sooner if not doing well)
3)Decrease the calcium to 1.3mL- if seizures come back then go back to the original dose for 14 days
4)Mix 4 mL of corn oil with 1 mL of flax oil; give 0.1ml by mouth once a day for 14 days, then 5 days a week thereafter
(get from any grocery store). this increases the fatty acids.
5)Continue with famotidine as directed
6)Continue syringe feeding the ominvore supplementary feeding
7)Add in milk thistle liver supplement (get from calgary north animal hospital) for 60 days
8)Add in Vetri DMG liquid liver supplement (get from amazon.ca): Give 0.1mL by mouth once a day for 60 days

I will be back on the weekend if you have any additional questions.
I hope that Trooper is doing better.
_______________

Trooper is doing much better still. She is starting to put on weight too. So, I'm really hoping that it's not cancer. I'm hoping that if it was due to an infection then these antibiotics do the trick. Or, since they have said that her calcium was low, and from everything this forum has taught me about what low calcium does to squirrels, I'm hoping that all the other findings stated above are in fact due to the low calcium levels. If so, then I'm confident that this can all be reversed and nothing more sinister is in the works.

Her blocks have been ordered, and her diet has been massively altered. She doesn't like her regular veggies anymore and I think she would just hide those from me and not eat them. I throw a bit of waste out when I raid her cage (She lives in a whole caged off room in my house). This could have been a big contributing factor to a poor diet. She used to love what I've been feeding her, until around last summer when she started becoming picky. Now she's been getting more verity and has been eating everything I've been throwing at her (She will hardly touch broccoli, cauliflower, or carrots anymore, though if they are cooked then it's a different story). Once she's recovered, she's getting a separate feeding cage so I can closely monitor her intake and limit the amount of mess that she leaves for me to clean all the time.

From my understanding, usually if an animal has cancer and rapidly declines, they don't usually bounce back with out aggressive medications, therapy, surgery, or never at all. Trooper has bounced back quite a bit and has been gaining a good amount of weight. She's had no more vomiting, bathroom issues, or seizures since the ER visit, her balance and strength seem to be stabilizing as well.
Does anyone have any experience with Cancer in squirrels or in animals in general? I'm still worried for this outcome and waiting 14 days to find out is going to be challenging.

Thank you all <3

[Diggie's Friend]

As I shared prior, there was a possibility of this condition being caused by an impact from the ingestion or inhalation of alfatoxin producing Aspergillus fungus from nuts, as the spore are in the soil and in the air also. This is why these two sources are included daily in my squirrel research diet.

Pcynogenol and Milk Thistle seed extract for both these sources have been found to counter the effects-damage from mycotoxins, and alfatoxins in the liver of rats.

Please get the Milk Thistle Seed Elixer from Oregon Wild Harvest (liquid best choice to support this source being well absorbed).

Also, Pcynogenol 30 mg. capsule from Healthy Origins, which I would increase my initial recommendation to at least 1/2 capsule, with 1/4 capsule included in yogurt feed AM and PM daily into yogurt also.

[Diggie's Friend]

Be sure to ask your vet how much by mg. of MTS daily; this source can be adjusted to support a close to exact dosage.

You will need to use an needle syringe (not the dropper included with the liquid elixer) to place the prescribed amount of drops into the food.

With a liver condition the form of calcium your vet has prescribed is the best one for liver condition, not the others.

Ask your vet whether it is ok to feed the whole fat, or would the low fat yogurt be better with this liver condition.

Stonyfield brand probiotic "Banilla", or "Vanilla", or plain with organic vanilla extract added.

The good news is that even with damage to the liver it is one organ that regenerates itself in time.

Organic Chia oil is a better choice than these other denatured oils that are hard on the liver. Foods Alive (filter oil through teabag strainer.

[CritterMom]

Cancer is a very scary word. I do agree with you, though - you don't see a lot of bounce back from cancer without treatment.

When the blocks come in, give them to her first thing in the morning and NOTHING ELSE until she has eaten them. My guys just loves the Henry's hazelnut blocks - he usually goes for them before what would normally be his other favorite things, so hopefully Trooper will agree. The nice thing about the Henry's blocks is that once you have replenished her calcium levels, they will keep them there. They are designed specifically to do that. Once her diet gets back on track, you will hopefully see a "new" Trooper Marie!

[Silverline]

As I shared prior, there was a possibility of this condition being caused by an impact from the ingestion or inhalation of alfatoxin producing Aspergillus fungus from nuts, as the spore are in the soil and in the air also. This is why these two sources are included daily in my squirrel research diet.

Pcynogenol and Milk Thistle seed extract for both these sources have been found to counter the effects-damage from mycotoxins, and alfatoxins in the liver of rats.

Please get the Milk Thistle Seed Elixer from Oregon Wild Harvest (liquid best choice to support this source being well absorbed).

Also, Pcynogenol 30 mg. capsule from Healthy Origins, which I would increase my initial recommendation to at least 1/2 capsule, with 1/4 capsule included in yogurt feed AM and PM daily into yogurt also.

Thanks for this info! I have the Milk Thistle medicine from the vet. I picked this up this morning with dosing instructions, It's a liquid with a marked syringe from the vet (Very small amount). I'm about to order the other recommendations that the vet sent out now. For the Pcynogenol, is this something that I should run past the vet first? I'm just worried that all this might be a bit much on her as she will be on two liver supplements already.

Also, you have mentioned that these toxins are found in shelled nuts. She only usually gets on occasion the unsalted mixed nuts that come in a tub at Costco. The only times she gets shelled ones are around Christmas time (these tubs last about a week or two, as I end up eating the rest), or the occasional peanuts (She doesn't really like peanuts all too much). Is it possible for these toxins to appear in the Costco tubs? I eat those quite a lot lol.

I'm glad to hear that this condition can be revered. I'll keep these toxins in mind going forward, before your original post, I've never heard of this before. I'll be limiting her nut intake quite substantially going forward. I'm just hoping that this hasn't lead to cancer already. (Again, she seems to be recovering and the X-rays came back fine with no signs of tumors, so that's hopeful I guess).

[Silverline]

Cancer is a very scary word. I do agree with you, though - you don't see a lot of bounce back from cancer without treatment.

When the blocks come in, give them to her first thing in the morning and NOTHING ELSE until she has eaten them. My guys just loves the Henry's hazelnut blocks - he usually goes for them before what would normally be his other favorite things, so hopefully Trooper will agree. The nice thing about the Henry's blocks is that once you have replenished her calcium levels, they will keep them there. They are designed specifically to do that. Once her diet gets back on track, you will hopefully see a "new" Trooper Marie!

That is reassuring, the tec at the vet kinda said the same thing that they don't usually bounce back if it was cancer.

I've ordered the hazelnut verity. I'm really hoping that she likes them.

[Diggie's Friend]

Sorry I ran out of time; cooking the vegetables by blanching (short- term boiling) baby leafy greens 90 sec. is the best choice for making them easy on the digestive tract and supporting the optimum availablity of nutrients that they contain also, as this supports both their predigestion, elimination of worms and worm eggs and bad bacteria they may carry, and allow lowers the calcium lowering anti nutrients that otherwise lower the amount of calcium available from these sources to the body.

Kale is the best one of the lost, also Baby Bok Choy.

Boil cauliflower, Broccoli (mini portions of florets only not feeding the stalks), carrots, green peas, from 15 to 20 minutes to where they are soft.

[Silverline]

One more question. The vet sent me a link to the Vetri-DMG supplement on Amazon, however the item is unavailable. I found another link that looks like the exact same product, though the front label is slightly different. They both have the same ingredients. I'm pretty sure that they are the same thing, but I don't want to take any risks.
Could someone help me verify?
It's going to take a couple weeks for any of these to arrive. The vet is also away until Saturday

Out of stock (Vet recommendation)
https://www.amazon.ca/Vetri-Science-Laboratories-Vetri-DMG-Liquid-Birds/dp/B009SD7HRO/ref=sr_1_2?keywords=vetri+dmg&I

in stock (Similar)
https://www.amazon.ca/Vetri-Science-Dmg-Liquid-30Ml-100mg/dp/B00008DFDO/ref=sr_1_fkmr1_1?keywords=Vetri-Science+Laboratories+Vetri-DMG+Liquid+for+Dogs%2C+Cats%2C+and+Birds%2C+28+ml.&qid=1584489659&sr=8-1-fkmr1

Thanks.

[Diggie's Friend]

Do the mixed nuts include Brazil nuts perhaps; they are dark brown angular large nuts with ridges?

This nut should not be included in the diet for tree squirrels as it contains a very high amount of selenium that can easily result in selenium toxicity in rodents.

Pcynogenol has been studied over 50 years in over 100 studies, many of which were done in rats. PYC is well tolerated at higher levels in rats than even in humans. It has been found to help to prevent loss of bone density in rats. It is highly anti inflammatory, and a source extracted from the cambium layer of pine which makes it part of the wild diet model of tree squirrels. It also has been found to prevent damage to the liver from toxins. (see files included in post)

The suggestion of corn oil is not advisable for it damages the function of the liver. In addition most oil is GMO and denatured by the process that uses hexane (toxin) to extract it. Flaxseed oil, one of two oils that have a positive ratio of ALA Omega 3 to Omega 6 ratio, is highly, 'goitrogenic' compounds that reduce the absorption of iodine to the parathyroid gland, the gland that is responsible for production a hormone that triggers the production of Calciferol hormone known as Vit. D3 (not an actual vitamin) by the kidneys which is keenly responsible for supporting the absorption of calcium from digested food in the intestines.

Chia oil (food grade -not a carrier oil that should not used orally) has a higher ratio of Omega 3 to 6 ratio than Flaxseed, high in ALA, but is not goitrogenic. It has been found to have benefits to the liver.

For this source, use a fine wire strainer to remove the floating film left from the cold pressing process, of which no toxic chemicals are used as they are in most seed oil sources, even organic ones.

https://www.amazon.com/Foods-Alive-Artisan-Cold-Pressed-Organic/dp/B007788AZA

Both of these health improving extracts from organic sources have been included in the squirrel research diet (research because it is based upon actual research into the sources included in the diet as to their health benefits). The gray squirrel that has been on this diet is now 11, active, having a good weight and activity level. A number of members have given this source to their older squirrels have found that their level of activity has increased, and is the picture of health.


I have not been a fan of sources that contain negative additives, especially with a liver problem.

Thorne B- Complex Pet formula on Amazon.com lends excellent support to an ailing liver; B complex vitamins are recommended as needful to support and heal an ailing liver.

[Diggie's Friend]

Read this:

http://www.janethull.com/newsletter/0606/the_forbidden_vitamin_b15.php

I think this is a better healthier way to get this amino acid B 15 not available from the US.

'Pangamic Acid, is found in Pumpkin and sunflower seeds, the former of which is a healthy whole food high in zinc and methonine, and highest of all nuts and seeds in magnesium!

With Pumpkin seed oil a high source of 'Pangamic Acid', it makes good sense to include this source in the diet.

The oil of organic produced USA (not a source from 'glow in the dark land' Europe) of pumpkin seed oil, is an excellent pure raw non-denatured source of amino acids that includes methionine, Pangamic Acid.

The goal for supporting more Omega 3 than Omega 6 still should be supported, which is why I have supported to include at least a (2:1) ratio of naturally high sources of Omega 3 and Omega 6 Fatty acids in the diet of tree squirrels to support liver and cardiovascular health.

It is also a high source of zinc and magnesium, the highest in magnesium of any seed or nut by nearly double of that i Almonds. Magnesium is key to inhibiting seizures.

Include daily as a base amount 2 drops 1/32 Tsp. of Foods Alive Chia Oil, and 1/64 Tsp. of Oil Seed company of Oregon organic raw cold pressed, non-denatured Pumpkin Seed oil.

In increasing these amounts that would be recommended at this time, just double the measure of both with each increase. Smallest size first product on this page.

https://www.seedoilcompany.com/pumpkin-seed-oil.html

This same source I recommend, also included in the diet of an older gray squirrel (11 yo) for a number of years.

Also recommend Zinc Balance (Zinc mono methionine) from Jarrow available on Amazon.com

https://www.amazon.com/Jarrow-Formulas-Supports-Antioxidant-Protection/dp/B0001VKDDM

[Diggie's Friend]

I had a similar thing happen with a squirrel we had prior to the founding of TSB. We had been giving him more avocado to get him to eat, yet we strongly suspect the lady that was pet sitting him gave him avocado with the skin on. When the squirrel began to get better and stopped gagging, then wanting to eat, I gave him a chunk of avocado; sadly, the next day he began gagging again, and in a week we lost him.

If an avocado isn't organic don'f feed it for it may have been sprayed with an insecticide. Also a concern if it is hard when you feed it, as that means it has a higher amount of tannins, which irritate the stomach. Even when ripe the thin layer of the flesh in contact with the skin and seed also contain this same compound at higher levels than the rest of the flesh of this fruit.

Even of grown organic, too much of a good thing isn't good. Now that she is eating better, do not overfeed the avocado as to give more than (1/2 Tsp.)

With a reasonable concern to not overfeed nuts, by comparison avocado has a (4.3 :1) [P:Ca] ratio which is higher than all three of these nuts: Hazelnuts is (2.54 :1), English walnuts (3.5 :1), and pecans (3.95 :1)

A small measure of one of these 3 kinds of nuts of not more than (1/2 Tsp.) of nuts, and the extra calcium you are giving presently, is fine. Just don't feed avocado on the same days you feed nuts.

Be sure to feed the nuts last, that is later in the day. When you get the block lower the nuts to 1/4 Tsp. daily till your squirrel accepts the block as to eat most of the portion given daily.