need help

[maggiemayk]

my 11 yr old found a baby squirrel last night. his nose was bleeding and his eyes are not open nor his ears. the bleeding stopped and the sores are drying up today. but when i feed him from the bottle the milk comes out of his nose a little. what is this from?
also how long til his eyes open and ears?
when do i introduce food?
will he turn mean on us when it happens?
he seems to want to sleep a lot and i have to make him eat... is it possible the fall damaged his brain? he moves a lot and did finally latch the bottle this morning but it came out of his n ose a little along with some blood.
please help my daughter wants to keep him and i am not sure about this. i am in the army and the kids are in school all day. so can he survive with a schedule such as ours?
thank you,
maggie

[maggiemayk]

well it is hartz kitty formula and a bottle. i will use the syringe if it will help. he is just like a baby when he sleeps on his side and scooches under the towel.
i have him on a towel with a heating pad under it. in a medium plastic box.
the formula from nose has been once this morning.
he is very active and moves a lot but since he can not see he just moves and stops and goes back to sleep.
i think he has been alone for a few days. and he started to be hungry so moved and fell from the nest. he seems to have scratches on paws and nose.
he is very comfy in his bed and finally warm to the touch. he was also sneezing last night either because of the blood in his nose or the fact that he was alone and cold.
maggie

[Critter_Queen]

Hi Maggie, Welcome to TSB!:wave123

Thanks for taking the time to help this little one.

First, make sure you have lots of t-shirts in the box with the baby to snuggle into...no towels, though...they can get caught up in the loose loops. Also, put the heating pad under one half of the box, so if he wants to get off the heat, he can.

When you hold his nose up to your ear, do you hear any "clicking" or "popping" sounds that happen when he takes each breath? It's important to note if it's a sound associated with his breathing in and out. If you hear this sound, he needs a rehabber right away! It means he has a respiratory infection and will die if not treated with antibiotics ASAP. The infection could be from inhaling blood, or formula, or just from being cold and alone for a while.

The correct formula to use is Esbilac puppy milk replacer. You'll want to get this right away. Powdered or pre-mixed, doesn't matter. YOu can get it at pet stores and vet's offices. You'll want to transition him from the kitten milk to the Esbilac gradually.

The first thing we need to assess is the breathing. The next is to assess his hydration level. When you pinch up the skin on his back, does it stay tented or does it release again right away? How long does it take to go back to normal (count the seconds)...this will tell us if you need to put him on pedialyte instead of the formula for now.

:grouphug we're here to help. :)

[Critter_Queen]

Also, you can buy the PetAg 2 oz bottle at most pet stores and it comes with several nipples. The regular replacement nipple works well for me.

You want to use a 1cc syringe with the nipple attached if at all possible. You can get the syringe at a pharmacy. :thumbsup

[thundersquirrel]

you've done a great job so far maggie!

there are a few basics to keep in mind-

the baby should always be warm to the touch, but not hot. as said before, heat should always be an option for the baby.

once the baby is stable (well hydrated and on the correct diet of powdered esbilac puppy formula) i would suggest you find a rehabber to take care of him. kids aren't the best option for squirrels. i know it's hard as a parent to deny your child such a cool experience, but this squirrel sounds like any more complications would be the end of it. most rehabbers will be willing to let you visit the squirrel, or even release it back where you live.

how's the little tyke doing?

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

Thank you sooooooooooo much for saving this little baby! I think the best thing for the little tyke would be to get to a rehabber ASAP. The rehabber will be able to give it antibiotics it needs if it is clicking as well as provide it with the correct formula and foods as the little guy grows up. I am not sure where in PA you are, but we have a very good rehabber on the board from PA that may be nearby. If you give your little tyke to a rehabber he will have the chance to grow up with other squirrels and live a life in the trees just as he was meant to.

[rippie-n-lilgirlsmom]

This is the closest one so far she is actualy about 2 hrs away.
Cumberland County
Kathy Purcell

Boiling Springs Animal Hospital
550 Park Dr.,
Boiling Springs, PA 17007

717-258-4575

Thanks Lynn I am looking for more!

[rippie-n-lilgirlsmom]

I just did a mapquest search and the rehabber posted above is 9 minutes/5miles from her town!!:thumbsup

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

Here is a link to some PA rehabbers, hopefully you can find one nearby on the list:

http://wildliferehabber.com/modules/xoopsmembers/index.php

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

Just hit PA in the Sate tab and enter and they will pop up.

[maggiemayk]

thank you for your info. his breathing is fine and it is puppy formula i was giving him sorry for the mixup. i actually read it on this site when i found him and i called the vet...kathy purcell and she called right back she is very nice. she said i was doing the right stuff but if i needed to i could bring him to her.
i am using the syringe feeder as he seems to be very young.
he is staying warm to the touch and i have been keeping the heating pad half of the box. i have been stimulating him to pee with a cool cottonball and he poops on his own i notice hard and dk brn. i got him to take more formula this evening than he has been taking. my neighbors noticed that his breathing is normal now compared to when we found him.
thank you for all the info and i am taking care of him and will keep a close eye on his breathing and everything. i already have the info if things get bad to where i can take him.
i guess the mothering instinct goes beyond human kids cause i seemed to know what to do except what i should feed him til i found your site and it was the first one so i ran right to the store and got his formula he would need.
i am hoping to keep him til it is safe to let him go and free him at carlisle barracks since it is safer on there. and my neighbor hates squirrels so she catches them and takes them far away to release them.
oh i already do love him he is so small and defenseless and i think of letting him go and i worry about his safety.
tomorrow i will try to get a pic and upload it so we can determine a close age. he has no teeth and very soft thin fur. eyes and ears are sealed still. and he is very unstable when he moves and his head is still unsteady. if that helps any. but a pic will be up tomorrow.
thank you everyone.
maggie

[thundersquirrel]

from your description, he sounds between three and four weeks old. because he's so young, his muscles aren't strong, that's why he shakes a bit when he moves. it's perfectly normal to be a little shaky.

i'm glad his breathing is fine- just keep an eye on it, ok? if i were you, i'd listen to his chest daily, and if you hear any with-breath clicking, he'll probably need an antibiotic.

his poop sounds good for now. remember that poop is often the easiest way to judge a baby's average health.

don't worry about releasing him; when that time comes, he'll be ready, and you'll recognize the change in him. the process we use makes squirrels VERY ready to be outdoors! until then, stick with the board, and remember that NO question is stupid unless you don't ask it!

(seriously....many of us, including myself, don't have much to live for outside the board, lol :D )

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

Glad there is no clicking. Definetely keep a close eye on his breathing. You should use a 1 cc syringe for feeding instead of the bottle, that will reduce the risk of him aspirating. Just go slow with the milk, do it drop by drop. Aspirating is one of the number one killers of baby squirrels!

[Critter_Queen]

thank you for all the info and i am taking care of him and will keep a close eye on his breathing and everything. i already have the info if things get bad to where i can take him.

i am hoping to keep him til it is safe to let him go and free him at carlisle barracks since it is safer on there.

maggie

First, let me say I'm glad it doesn't sound like he's clicking.


However, I feel I must say something about the above statements you make.

1- Do you know what you are doing (keeping this squirrel to raise) is ILLEGAL in your state? That's why PA licenses wildlife rehabilitators, because they KNOW that wildlife is not in the best hands unless they are trained.

2- Do you know how irritating it is to be the rehabber called "when things get bad"? I get so many calls from people with the best intentions who have tried to raise the squirrel on their own and now things are dire...and most of the time those squirrels die. Hard and fast truth. Personally I want to PUNCH people that do this. If you love the squirrel GIVE IT TO SOMEONE QUALIFIED to care for it! DON'T WAIT UNTIL "THINGS GET BAD!" Good gravy. Would you want your child treated by an unlicensed doctor?! And if you did, would you wait until "things get bad" to find a good one!? Hell no!

If you absolutely refuse to take this baby to a rehabber (because I think it's very young, probably 2-3 weeks old) you WILL be responsible if it dies. Think about that for awhile. How much do you love this baby? Enough to think of ITS best available option for care? Or just enough to satisfy your "maternal instincts"?

You don't say what size syringe you're feeding with. You don't say how often you feed, or how much. You don't say how much he weighs. Babies this young don't "poop on their own" even though you will find pellets in the bedding, you still need to stimulate that along with the peeing.

Are you aware that you need to be getting up to feed him at LEAST once a night until his eyes open?

Sorry, I'm just up to here with "finders" that wait to call me until "things get bad" when they have a rehabber AVAIABLE within WALKING distance. :shakehead

[thundersquirrel]

CQ, i understand that you're upset (i'm a rehabber too, ya know) but i think you're being a little too harsh.

it sounds to me like she has spoken with a rehabber who has found her fit enough to raise and release this little guy.

maggie, is that true?

[Critter_Queen]

Personally I want to PUNCH people that do this.

I tried to edit this statement but was too late...I mean to say that I want to punch them, but I adore them for wanting to help but HATE IT that they wait until it's too late to do the right thing.

Don't want anyone thinking I really wanna punch someone... :peace

[Critter_Queen]

It's my understanding she's spoken with a vet, not a rehabber.

[Critter_Queen]

i think you're being a little too harsh.

Maybe a little. But my heart HURTS from/for all the frozen babes in my freezer right now from well-intentioned people. :Love_Icon

[Critter_Queen]

Ok, once again I'm guilty of skimming. (damit!)

I see that Rippie listed this gal as a rehabber...I was reading maggie's post and it reads that she called a "vet...[lady's name]" and I took that to mean she spoke with a vet.

My apologies. :bowdown

May I ask why she didn't ask you to bring it in when you told her it was this young and had been bleeding through the nose? I couldn't IMAGINE telling someone to keep it in a case like that...

[maggiemayk]

i want to thank everyone and say to CQ that i think you need a life!!
at one time you were a beginning rehabber yourself. so get a grip and do not be such a b..tch
i by far am not the dumbest person and i think i know a bit more than the average person. i am a soldier, been to war and saw a lot. i can nurse a baby squirrel and know what death is and that i would rather a person die than an innocent animal that we humans are taking all their space and then refuse to live side by side instead we exterminate them.
so chill CQ. i feed him 2 to 3 hours. only a drop or 2 at a time cause he is so small and frail. i constantly wake through the night to be sure he is covered and warm. i keep his little backside clean after each bathroom time.
what i believe the rehabber/vet meant to me was that if something changes in the babies condition to bring him to her. not necessarily bad in the fact the baby would die. he would have died had we left him on the sidewalk as the wildlife person i called said to do.
i think i am done here i will visit other squirrel sites and CQ if you are this way to everyone that at least tries to help the wildlife that gets hurt then stay to yourself cause you are not the goddess of wildlife and anything more than someone who also helps the animals who can not help themselves. you just have a little more experience under your belt.

[Pam]

Please don't leave TSB, maggiemayk. There are a lot of nice people on here to help you. Critter_Queen has had a rough time lately. She seems to get the sick squirrels after someone else has failed to take proper care of them. Don't get me wrong though, I am not making an excuse for her harsh words. You have every right to feel the way you do, but I hope you give the rest of us another chance.

[4skwerlz]

Respectfully, I just have to say that although Critter Queen was a bit harsh with her words, her heart has always been in the right place, and we all know it. Maggiemayk, you came for help, not criticism, and that was TSB's mistake. But I also think that as a new member of TSB, Maggie you don't realize how important Critter Queen is to TSB and most of all to the squirrels. You say "get a life," well, saving the lives of animals IS her life, and for that she deserves our respect and love.

I'm not very good at playing "mediator" here, but I really do sympathise with both sides. On the one hand, Critter Queen sees so many of our beloved squirrels dying in the hands of inexperienced first-timers and it's heartbreaking and frustrating. (Also, she probably hasn't had a decent night's sleep in weeks.) On the other hand, CQ, let's face it, there aren't enough experienced rehabbers to take care of all the squirrels, and we do need to train up new people when we can. Sadly, these newbies will make mistakes and babies will die.

Bottom line is, Maggie I'm sorry you had a tough time. TSB is normally VERY loving and supportive of EVERYONE and if you stick around you will see this. However, don't mess with Critter Queen either; she's my hero.

[scoobysnack]

Bottom line is, Maggie I'm sorry you had a tough time. TSB is normally VERY loving and supportive of EVERYONE and if you stick around you will see this. However, don't mess with Critter Queen either; she's my hero.

I have found nothing but support on TSB. Critter Queen has been a huge help to me and knows I'm not a rehabber or least I think she does :D

I know how frustrating it can be to give the same information over and over and see the results of ignored advice. I have an ex riding student right now at risk because her own mother refuses to listen to me about what is appropriate pony flesh for a green but talented very young rider. The child isn't really my student any longer, but it still makes me nuts to see her getting dumped regularly. Sooo I admit... the other day... my advice sounded much more like scolding than my usual "making the best of it supportive" approach.

Sleepless nights and a bad moment can make one come across harsh.

Chalk it up to a miscommunication and please let's not resort to name calling. The folks here are so nice and willing to share their knowledgable advice. I'd hate to see the sharing of information stop.

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

Please don't leave Maggie! CQ only wants what is best for the squirrel. You have no idea how hard it is being a rehabber and getting babies in that have been essentially killed by their finders and then dropped off to the rehabber when the finder sees they are going downhill. I got 2 baby squirrels earlier this year that were fed a couple drops of enfamil in the morning and a couple drops of enfamil in the evening for 2 days before the person called me. They only called because they knew something was going wrong. Both babies ended up dying and who had to watch them through their final fight and then their death: ME! Not the person that did that to them. The one fought it off for 5 days before dying. I was up sub Qing her and feeding her drop by drop and eventually tubing her as a last ditch effort and then she died. Broke my heart. That kind of thing is just not fair. Those squirrels would have been just fine had I gotten them sooner. CQ has experienced MANY similar situations lately and that is why it got her going so much. She didn't want to scare you away, she was just pleaing with you to take them to a rehabber for their own good. If the have aspirated, they could get sick and if you keep them they will die if they do get pneumonia and she is just asking you to take them in to the rehabber before they start to show signs so they stand a chance because after they click their chances are much much lower. Sorry to rant and rave, I just couldn't agree with CQ more! She didn't mean to sound like you are incompetent or anything, just she knows as do all of us other rehabbers who have dedicated our lives to caring for these fragile babies, that the babies stand a very good chance of surviving with a rehabber because that is our lives! I had surgery so don't have anything right now, but usually I would have up to 17 babies and a full time job to pretty much get money to care for them, so it wildlife rehab IS MY LIFE TOO!

[rippie-n-lilgirlsmom]

Ok, once again I'm guilty of skimming. (damit!)

I see that Rippie listed this gal as a rehabber...I was reading maggie's post and it reads that she called a "vet...[lady's name]" and I took that to mean she spoke with a vet.


CQ the vet was listed under rehabbers for Pa.
If you will look under rehabbers in Pa for her county you will see that.
FYI I pm'd her my cell#

[Mrs. Jack]

Okay but I think it's time to let it go. CQ owned up and apologized, we all have our moments. And Maggiemayk sounds like a strong person who could get past this. After all, everyone in this thread has a very strong thing in common: they care about the well being of the squirrel.

[Squerly]

Okay but I think it's time to let it go. CQ owned up and apologized, we all have our moments. Are you kidding? CQ doesn't mess up very often so if we don't capitalize on this we may not get another chance... :D

[scoobysnack]

I've been dying to use this icon since I saw it. This is the perfect time. Picking on CQ anymore about this will be like :deadhorse

Gosh that cracks me up especially when the one guy BITES the dead horse:rotfl