Lethargic baby

[HalokaKana]

Hi everyone. Ive got 4 babies right now. I'm unsure of age but they are just starting to open their eyes. One of them has become very lethargic since yesterday. I thought maybe she was just tired but now I'm getting worried. She is 54 g and I feed her 5% body weight of formula. The formula is 2 parts powdered esbilac (the probiotic one with the dog on the label) and 1part powdered ensure. The mix is 1 part powder formula mix to 2 parts water. I feed them every 3-4 hours usually. The other 3 are doing fine. The only thing I've recently changed is adding probiotics to their formula bc of loose poops. The lethargic squirrels poops are soft but better than they were before probiotics.
She is eating but not the whole 2.5ccs anymore and she isn't as ravenous as the others.
Please let me know if you need more info. Any ideas?

[stepnstone]

Hi everyone. Ive got 4 babies right now. I'm unsure of age but they are just starting to open their eyes. One of them has become very lethargic since yesterday. I thought maybe she was just tired but now I'm getting worried. She is 54 g and I feed her 5% body weight of formula. The formula is 2 parts powdered esbilac (the probiotic one with the dog on the label) and 1part powdered ensure. The mix is 1 part powder formula mix to 2 parts water. I feed them every 3-4 hours usually. The other 3 are doing fine. The only thing I've recently changed is adding probiotics to their formula bc of loose poops. The lethargic squirrels poops are soft but better than they were before probiotics.
She is eating but not the whole 2.5ccs anymore and she isn't as ravenous as the others.
Please let me know if you need more info. Any ideas?

Is this one of the babies you were treating for aspiration pneumonia?
Can you post this one's picture?
Are you hydrating her?
Did you get the proper formula? Sounds like your still feeding the mix you were left with.
Ensure is a nutritional supplement and meal replacement. If you got/have the proper formula, there is no need for Ensure being in it.
You had five babies, four were doing fine. Now you have four, three are doing fine.
Do you see the pattern here?

[HalokaKana]

Yes you're right :(
So just use straight esbilac powder with 2 parts powder 1 part water?
She feels hudrated, I did the punch test. She is not one of the pneumonia babies and does not have any clicking in her breaths. This is a pic after feeding.
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[HalokaKana]

Yes you're right :(
So just use straight esbilac powder with 2 parts powder 1 part water?
She feels hudrated, I did the punch test. She is not one of the pneumonia babies and does not have any clicking in her breaths. This is a pic after feeding.
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Sorry, typos, I did a pinch test on her and she looks hydrated.

[Nancy in New York]

Yes you're right :(
So just use straight esbilac powder with 2 parts powder 1 part water?
She feels hudrated, I did the punch test. She is not one of the pneumonia babies and does not have any clicking in her breaths. This is a pic after feeding.
307753

NO, one part powdered esbilac formula to 2 parts water.
How were you fixing the esbilac powder before?
No ensure.

[HalokaKana]

NO, one part powdered esbilac formula to 2 parts water.
How were you fixing the esbilac powder before?

So sorry that's what I meant. Always 1powder, 2 water.

[HalokaKana]

So sorry that's what I meant. Always 1powder, 2 water.

I will go buy some esbilac right now and just use that.

[stepnstone]

I would do baby's next couple feedings with just hydration to flush it's system.
Then start on the proper formula, no additives!
I would also flush the systems of the other two before they wind up the same way.
I would defiantly get them all on the correct formula.

[HalokaKana]

I would do baby's next couple feedings with just hydration to flush it's system.
Then start on the proper formula, no additives!
I would also flush the systems of the other two before they wind up the same way.
I would defiantly get them all on the correct formula.

OK will do! How often should I feed them water?

[Nancy in New York]

OK will do! How often should I feed them water?

Do just water for the next 2 feedings, you can add just a touch/TINY of honey for flavor.
After that, then start the esbilac formula, ok?

[HalokaKana]

Do just water for the next 2 feedings, you can add just a touch/TINY of honey for flavor.
After that, then start the esbilac formula, ok?

Yes ma'am! Thank you again ❤️

[Nancy in New York]

Yes ma'am! Thank you again ❤️

Anytime, we're here to help.:Love_Icon

[Nancy in New York]

Just one other thing.
You said that they are just about to open their eyes,
which would make them ~5 weeks old.
54 grams is very light for a 5 week old squirrel.
Also the picture doesn't look like they weigh that little.
Can you reweigh them again?
If you have 5 quarters, weigh them too in grams.
I just want to make sure your scale is working properly.

[HalokaKana]

Just one other thing.
You said that they are just about to open their eyes,
which would make them ~5 weeks old.
54 grams is very light for a 5 week old squirrel.
Also the picture doesn't look like they weigh that little.
Can you reweigh them again?
If you have 5 quarters, weigh them too in grams.
I just want to make sure your scale is working properly.


I just weighed 5 quarters and it says 28g. Is that correct?

[HalokaKana]

Just one other thing.
You said that they are just about to open their eyes,
which would make them ~5 weeks old.
54 grams is very light for a 5 week old squirrel.
Also the picture doesn't look like they weigh that little.
Can you reweigh them again?
If you have 5 quarters, weigh them too in grams.
I just want to make sure your scale is working properly.


Ah you're right, maybe bc she was moving. I just reweighed her and it's 67. Is that better?
The others are 70, 60, and the runt who is 48 (I have such a soft spot for him❤️)

[Nancy in New York]

I just weighed 5 quarters and it says 28g. Is that correct?

Yes that's correct.

[Nancy in New York]

Ah you're right, maybe bc she was moving. I just reweighed her and it's 67. Is that better?
The others are 70, 60, and the runt who is 48 (I have such a soft spot for him❤️)

This still seems really light for these babies.
Do you weigh them daily?
At this age, they should be gaining roughly 4-6 grams daily.
Please tell me again how much are you feeding,
and how often.
Are you using a 1 ml syringe?
Sorry you didn't get an answer from others.
I went off the board last night, and just got back on,
and stepnstone was feeling under the weather. :(

Edit: My time will be very limited today, so I hope that others
will help get to the bottom of this too.

[island rehabber]

This still seems really light for these babies.
Do you weigh them daily?
At this age, they should be gaining roughly 4-6 grams daily.
Please tell me again how much are you feeding,
and how often.
Are you using a 1 ml syringe?
Sorry you didn't get an answer from others.
I went off the board last night, and just got back on,
and stepnstone was feeling under the weather. :(

Edit: My time will be very limited today, so I hope that others
will help get to the bottom of this too.

I'll be here after 11am for most of the day.....we do need to remember that these are deep South squirrel babies, so they are much smaller than what we're used to up North. The baby looks to be a healthy weight, but I know what Nancy in NY means. At that age, ours typically weigh about 80-100g, don't they?

[Nancy in New York]

The baby looks to be a healthy weight, but I know what Nancy in NY means. At that age, ours typically weigh about 80-100g, don't they?

Thanks Maura!:blowkiss

Well to answer your question about the weight. I remember you bringing me an eyes closed baby
weighing 197 grams. I remember writing in your thread, I didn't know if you brought him here for me
to babysit, or to release! :rolf

[Mel1959]

I went back over my records to check weights upon arrival. All the babies I’ve gotten had eyes opened so I assumed them to be 5-6 weeks old. The weights ranged from 49gr. to mid 50’s. I hope this helps.

[island rehabber]

I went back over my records to check weights upon arrival. All the babies I’ve gotten had eyes opened so I assumed them to be 5-6 weeks old. The weights ranged from 49gr. to mid 50’s. I hope this helps.

yup. Itsy bitsy southern beebees! I have had some, in contrast, who have reached 200g before eyes opened!!

[island rehabber]

Thanks Maura!:blowkiss

Well to answer your question about the weight. I remember you bringing me an eyes closed baby
weighing 197 grams. I remember writing in your thread, I didn't know if you brought him here for me
to babysit, or to release! :rolf

:rotfl Like I said.....

[HalokaKana]

Hey everyone thanks for the responses!

I did the water feeding last night for two feeding and then fed straight esbilac (1pt powder, 2pts water ��). Their poops are already looking better which is great. Also the lethargic squirrel in question, her name is Yellow, she still seems lethargic but she was a bit better about eating this morning. The other squirrels are so squirmy when I try to get them to pee/poop, but she just lays there. Also I've noticed when I go to check on them, she has crawled on top of the blankets away from their nesting spot and I find her pretty cold. I'm not sure if this means something? Thought I'd mention it. I don't like that I find her cool to the touch and I'm not sure how to make her stay in the nest. They are on a heating pad in case anyone is wondering.

[HalokaKana]

This still seems really light for these babies.
Do you weigh them daily?
At this age, they should be gaining roughly 4-6 grams daily.
Please tell me again how much are you feeding,
and how often.
Are you using a 1 ml syringe?
Sorry you didn't get an answer from others.
I went off the board last night, and just got back on,
and stepnstone was feeling under the weather. :(

Edit: My time will be very limited today, so I hope that others
will help get to the bottom of this too.

To answer your feeding question, I do 5% body weight about every 3-4 hrs.

[Nancy in New York]

Hey everyone thanks for the responses!

I did the water feeding last night for two feeding and then fed straight esbilac (1pt powder, 2pts water ��). Their poops are already looking better which is great. Also the lethargic squirrel in question, her name is Yellow, she still seems lethargic but she was a bit better about eating this morning. The other squirrels are so squirmy when I try to get them to pee/poop, but she just lays there. Also I've noticed when I go to check on them, she has crawled on top of the blankets away from their nesting spot and I find her pretty cold. I'm not sure if this means something? Thought I'd mention it. I don't like that I find her cool to the touch and I'm not sure how to make her stay in the nest. They are on a heating pad in case anyone is wondering.

Her crawling off the heat is not a good sign. Every time one of mine has done that I put them
right back on. Sometimes that helps but I think they know something is wrong with them,
and many times when they do this, they end up passing.
Keep putting her on the heat source. The pad is
under their "container" correct? What type of container are they currently in.

[HalokaKana]

Her crawling off the heat is not a good sign. Every time one of mine has done that I put them
right back on. Sometimes that helps but I think they know something is wrong with them,
and many times when they do this, they end up passing.
Keep putting her on the heat source. The pad is
under their "container" correct? What type of container are they currently in.

Oh no :(
Yes it's under the container. They are in a plastic tub with felt blankets in the tub. They burrow into the blankets.

[Mel1959]

Oh no :(
Yes it's under the container. They are in a plastic tub with felt blankets in the tub. They burrow into the blankets.

When you hold Yellow to your ear you don’t hear any clicking, right? How much water did all of them take, but specifically her, at the two feedings?

I am a little confused reading back over your thread. You said you were feeding the proper Esbilac (powdered) mixed with Ensure. Then you were told not to mix it with Ensure but to mix one part Esbilac to two parts water and your next response was that you were going out to get some Esbilac.? Was the original Esbilac old? Had it been stored in the freezer? It’s best to keep it in the freezer for long term storage and refrigerator while actively using it.

As Nancy said, it’s not a good sign when they crawl off the heat. You could try carrying it in your bra (assuming your female) next to your skin where it can hear your heartbeat. It may help, but at least Yellow will stay warm.

I hope this little one turns around. :hug:Love_Icon

Edit: Reread again and there is mention of pneumonia but no mention of antibiotics. Maybe I missed it, but are you treating them with antibiotics? If so, which antibiotic and did someone on here dose for you?

[Nancy in New York]

Ah you're right, maybe bc she was moving. I just reweighed her and it's 67. Is that better?
The others are 70, 60, and the runt who is 48 (I have such a soft spot for him❤️)

I know I keep writing one more thing, but................
If your little one actually weighs 67 grams she needs to be eating more.
BUT never force a squirrel to take more.
If they seem squirmy try stimulating
because sometimes they need to pee while eating. After that try again with
the formula. BUT never force feed.
You were feeding for a 54 gram squirrel.
Make sure you get an accurate weight on the squirrel. This is vital
to know how much to feed.
Are you using a 1 cc syringe?

When is the rehabber taking these little ones back.
I'm sure you'll miss them.

See if this helps you.

https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-hR5J5cq/1/6d577129/X2/i-hR5J5cq-X2.jpg

[HalokaKana]

When you hold Yellow to your ear you don’t hear any clicking, right? How much water did all of them take, but specifically her, at the two feedings?

I am a little confused reading back over your thread. You said you were feeding the proper Esbilac (powdered) mixed with Ensure. Then you were told not to mix it with Ensure but to mix one part Esbilac to two parts water and your next response was that you were going out to get some Esbilac.? Was the original Esbilac old? Had it been stored in the freezer? It’s best to keep it in the freezer for long term storage and refrigerator while actively using it.

As Nancy said, it’s not a good sign when they crawl off the heat. You could try carrying it in your bra (assuming your female) next to your skin where it can hear your heartbeat. It may help, but at least Yellow will stay warm.

I hope this little one turns around. :hug:Love_Icon

Edit: Reread again and there is mention of pneumonia but no mention of antibiotics. Maybe I missed it, but are you treating them with antibiotics? If so, which antibiotic and did someone on here dose for you?
Sorry for the confusion lol.. Nancy and stepnstone guided me trhu a pneumonia issue with 2 of the other babies (not yellow) the other day. I am squirrel sitting for another rehabber who gave me a premixed bag of powder which was esbilac and ensure, that's where all the reference to ensure was from.
I threw that out and bought a new can of powdered esbilac which is what I am feeding now--no additives.

The babies who had pneumonia the other night are on abs and they are not clicking anymore so it seems to be working. They have 2 more days on abs.

Yellow took in about 2ccs of water each feeding ast night. She would refuse any more.

And yes I use a 1cc syringes now. I was using one that was too big before which was the cause of the pneumonia. It has helped tremendously to switch to the smaller one.

Now that I have their correct weights I have upped their food.

[Mel1959]

:great

[HalokaKana]

:great

Sorry Mel i always forget to answer parts of questions. Yes the ab dosage was given to me by Nancy and stepnstone. They're on cipro, just a drop which was like.01cc.

[HalokaKana]

Just an update.. Yellow seems to be doing much better. She's a lot more alert and is drinking her formula happily. Also, all squirrels poops are a lot better.
Every time I've checked her today she has been in the nest instead of crawling out. I think things are looking up. :Love_Icon:Love_Icon

[Nancy in New York]

Just an update.. Yellow seems to be doing much better. She's a lot more alert and is drinking her formula happily. Also, all squirrels poops are a lot better.
Every time I've checked her today she has been in the nest instead of crawling out. I think things are looking up. :Love_Icon:Love_Icon

I'm so glad that she's doing better.
Keep up the great work!:w00t

[HalokaKana]

I just want to clarify this while I'm here, please.
Feed them 5-7% body weight in formula. Is feeding every 3-4 hrs correct or should I be doing it more often or less often? Should I be feeding water by itself ever, like in between feedings?

I want to make sure I'm doing everything to the best of my ability!

[Mel1959]

Yes, every 3-4 hrs for formula. You have to observe them and their pee and poop output to determine if they need water in between feedings. You should see a steady weight gain, poop and pee should be consistent, and they should be anxious to eat. The babies will tell you when they’re ready for a little extra formula. Any increases must be very gradual always watching for loose stool. This is why I keep a written record so I KNOW exactly how much each ate at the previous feeding and how their poop and pee was.

It probably isn’t a bad idea to offer some water between a feeding or two. Don’t substitute the water for a feeding, they need the nutrition. Make sure their bellies don’t bloat. You want the previous feeding to have moved through their system almost completely before feeding again.

You’re doing great :great:great. Keep us updated on Yellow and attach some pictures. We :Love_Icon pictures.

Are these babies going to a rehabber or are you going to continue to care for them? There are supplies like O-ring syringes and miracle nipples that make feeding little ones much, much easier. If these guys are staying with you I think you should purchase these supplies. You can buy them online at Henry’s Healthy Pets.

[HalokaKana]

Yes, every 3-4 hrs for formula. You have to observe them and their pee and poop output to determine if they need water in between feedings. You should see a steady weight gain, poop and pee should be consistent, and they should be anxious to eat. The babies will tell you when they’re ready for a little extra formula. Any increases must be very gradual always watching for loose stool. This is why I keep a written record so I KNOW exactly how much each ate at the previous feeding and how their poop and pee was.

It probably isn’t a bad idea to offer some water between a feeding or two. Don’t substitute the water for a feeding, they need the nutrition. Make sure their bellies don’t bloat. You want the previous feeding to have moved through their system almost completely before feeding again.

You’re doing great :great:great. Keep us updated on Yellow and attach some pictures. We :Love_Icon pictures.

Are these babies going to a rehabber or are you going to continue to care for them? There are supplies like O-ring syringes and miracle nipples that make feeding little ones much, much easier. If these guys are staying with you I think you should purchase these supplies. You can buy them online at Henry’s Healthy Pets.

Thank you for the info! I was actually originally just squirrel sitting for my friend who is a rehabber bc she knows I have experience (but it's been a while since I've had babies hence the questions). Anyway she is back but I actually asked if I could keep them longer bc I just love them :Love_Icon I have to go out of town on the 28th though so they will be going back then. I might ask to squirrel sit again when I'm back though :grin2
Anyhoo, since she does this a lot she gave me all the syringes and nipples and all that stuff so I'm set for a while :)

Here are some pics of them all. I'll try to get one of just yellow tomorrow! I think she is the 3rd from left in this pic:grin2
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[Mel1959]

I can see a difference in the fur on the one that is third from the right...not left If this is her she still looked dehydrated to me. Her fur looks coarser or something. Hopefully others will chime in with what they think.

I’m glad you have the proper supples. :grin2

[HalokaKana]

I can see a difference in the fur on the one that is third from the right...not left If this is her she still looked dehydrated to me. Her fur looks coarser or something. Hopefully others will chime in with what they think.

I’m glad you have the proper supples. :grin2

I think the one you mean is named Red. Yellow is 3rd from left I think. Anyway yes Red looks different from the rest, almost scraggly. A friend said he looked like a little monkey. I'm not sure what the deal is. None of them look dehydrated to me when I hold them. He does have a hard time keeping his mouth on the nipple tho. Always turning his head side to side I have to hold his head in place just to get it to stay. Not sure if that means anything significant? I thought he was just spastic lol.

Any ideas welcome!

Here's a pic of Red where my friend said he looks like a monkey.
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[Nancy in New York]

I think the one you mean is named Red. Yellow is 3rd from left I think. Anyway yes Red looks different from the rest, almost scraggly. A friend said he looked like a little monkey. I'm not sure what the deal is. None of them look dehydrated to me when I hold them. He does have a hard time keeping his mouth on the nipple tho. Always turning his head side to side I have to hold his head in place just to get it to stay. Not sure if that means anything significant? I thought he was just spastic lol.

Any ideas welcome!

Here's a pic of Red where my friend said he looks like a monkey.
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Oh he's so tiny and adorable!
One thing you may want to try if he's having a hard time with
the nipple is try stimulating him first to see if he has to pee.
Many times when they don't accept the nipple OR they stop
eating when they've just started it means they have to potty.

Stimulate them, and then try again. If they've already eaten
and refuse, they may be full.

Another thing you can try with Red is removing the nipple.
If you do that, and he starts eating better, just remember to
go REALLY slow, we don't want to aspirate him.:Love_Icon

[HalokaKana]

Yellow wanted me to come and tell everyone thank you! She is back to her little sassy vocal self, squeaking away.
Everyone just had a warm water bath that's why her face looks a Lil wet.
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[Nancy in New York]

She's precious.:Love_Icon So glad that she is feeling better.
Why did they all have baths?

[HalokaKana]

She's precious.:Love_Icon So glad that she is feeling better.
Why did they all have baths?

They seem to get dirty after a few days. I assumed it's bc they pee/poop in their beds sometimes so I just put them in a warm bath to wash it off every now and then. Is that OK to do? I judt use water, no soap or anything

[Rocky1]

They seem to get dirty after a few days. I assumed it's bc they pee/poop in their beds sometimes so I just put them in a warm bath to wash it off every now and then. Is that OK to do? I judt use water, no soap or anything

Very good question. Yes, and it might be wise to use blue Dawn dish detergent as soap (the original Dawn) which is what I believe most people use on squirrels, if possible. To properly qualify this, I'm not entirely sure that the type of soap matters, but it might, so I thought I'd pass along that information.

And to my understanding, it might be very important, very important, to keep water away from the nose and mouth. Squirrels are extremely sensitive to inhaled water which often causes terrible cases of pneumonia. If you accidentally get water in that area and then hear clicking or rattling, make sure to let us know. If it were me, I would not get water anywhere near the head.

All that being said, I welcome any of the actual rehabbers to correct any of this information. If they do, I might learn something new as well. I'm not a rehabber but just a long time member.

[HalokaKana]

Oh yeah, I only ever put them in up to their chest, never their head. Warm water seems to do the job, so I don't really need soap. But if doing a warm water bath is bad for some reason someone let me know :)

[HalokaKana]

Hi everyone, just wanted to post an update that everyone is doing very well! They are getting wild! Also they're starting to eat solid foods!
They've got their rodent blocks and I am going to get them a variety of veggies today yayy:Love_Icon
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