babies having spasms and seizures

[threelilkids]

Hi, I have 2 squirrels that are 6 and a half weeks. A week ago a friend fed them when I went out of town. One of the babies jumped out of the box and fell to the floor. I came back to get them and was told what happened. The one that jumped was having spasms, but eating well. Two days latter the baby that didn't jump started having seizures, while the jumper still had spasms. then both babies became lethargic had diarrhea and showed little interest in food. I took them to my vet and he put them on antibiotics and diarrhea meds. I also added baby rice cereal and baby banana food to their formula. The non jumper started having back to back seizures so bad she could not eat, so back to the vet we went. He gave both babies fluids under the skin. I asked him if I could give gabapentin sense he had nothing for seizures for squirrels. He said it wouldn't hurt but just a little, so I gave the meds he gave and a small dose of gabapentin. the jumper stopped having spasms and the one having back to back seizures stopped but is now having spasms, so tonight I gave another dose of gabapentin. They are still very lethargic and not wanting to eat I had to go to a syringe feeding without a nipple on it but most of the food comes out of the mouth, they no longer suck but they do swallow some and they still have diarrhea. The jumper is named Piglet although she no longer lives up to her name and she is 90g, and is a white squirrel. The other baby is Squeaker because she squeaks a lot at me and she is 85g, she is silver. They are only eating (Squeaker) 3cc and (Piglet) 6cc every 4 hours. (the vet said they were very unusual colors)They use to both eat 6cc, sucking good out of the nipple syringe. Now I have to put very small amounts in the mouth and they swallow the amount but a lot comes out as they swallow. My heart is breaking for them I ask your help in getting my little ones back on track and looking chipper again. Thanks any info is appreciated, Mary

[stepnstone]

Hi, I have 2 squirrels that are 6 and a half weeks. A week ago a friend fed them when I went out of town. One of the babies jumped out of the box and fell to the floor. I came back to get them and was told what happened. The one that jumped was having spasms, but eating well. Two days latter the baby that didn't jump started having seizures, while the jumper still had spasms. then both babies became lethargic had diarrhea and showed little interest in food. I took them to my vet and he put them on antibiotics and diarrhea meds. I also added baby rice cereal and baby banana food to their formula. The non jumper started having back to back seizures so bad she could not eat, so back to the vet we went. He gave both babies fluids under the skin. I asked him if I could give gabapentin sense he had nothing for seizures for squirrels. He said it wouldn't hurt but just a little, so I gave the meds he gave and a small dose of gabapentin. the jumper stopped having spasms and the one having back to back seizures stopped but is now having spasms, so tonight I gave another dose of gabapentin. They are still very lethargic and not wanting to eat I had to go to a syringe feeding without a nipple on it but most of the food comes out of the mouth, they no longer suck but they do swallow some and they still have diarrhea. The jumper is named Piglet although she no longer lives up to her name and she is 90g, and is a white squirrel. The other baby is Squeaker because she squeaks a lot at me and she is 85g, she is silver. They are only eating (Squeaker) 3cc and (Piglet) 6cc every 4 hours. (the vet said they were very unusual colors)They use to both eat 6cc, sucking good out of the nipple syringe. Now I have to put very small amounts in the mouth and they swallow the amount but a lot comes out as they swallow. My heart is breaking for them I ask your help in getting my little ones back on track and looking chipper again. Thanks any info is appreciated, Mary

Prednisone is the go to medication for controlling seizures. I can understand if the one that fell hit it's head and that's caused seizure activity but for both to be having seizures tells me there is something else going on that's affecting both.
First off, when either is having a seizure you need to rub some molasses on their gums to raise their blood sugar level as seizures lower their blood sugar. Low blood sugar can cause grand mal/tonic clonic seizures since it can cause chemical imbalances in the brain which puts to question IS their blood sugar levels off and why?
What is their diet? / What is the formula you feed? What (all) meds did the vet give for them?

[threelilkids]

I did give them Karo in the mouth for low blood sugar it made no different. I agree something is going on, but what I don't know. the vet said the diet is good. You will not like what I use but at this point I am ready to try what ever you recommend. I mix evaporated milk with water 50/50, karo syrup and a egg yolk. This is what I have fed for 20 years. learn this formula in vet school. I have been rehabbing squirrels and other wildlife for 20 years, but this is the first time I have help one out from day 1. the mother of these babies was a squirrel I saved and released 2 years ago. She had these babies in my bird house. She also did this last year, but moved them to a tree in the yard when we took the house down for storage. but this time she moved them from one house to another, when we took the house down we found the babies but by then mom was not around and didn't come take them back. The one that jumped is just limp it scares me but she is alive and hanging in there, they both also have bad diarrhea and all this came about 5 days ago, from doing great to this never saw this before. Any other time I would think they would die in the few minutes but they are trying to live. I need help to bring them back. thanks for input, Mary

[island rehabber]

I agree with stepnstone that something else is going on. Head trauma and hypoglycemia (low blood sugar) are the two key causes of seizures in squirrels. Extreme dehydration is another. Are you sure your "sitter" was feeding these babies on a regular basis? Did they have access to water? :dono

[threelilkids]

Vet put them on antibiotic's, Clavamox 125/dextrose twice a day, according to weight. Mary

[threelilkids]

The friend said they were fine until one jumped from the case I had them in, two days before I picked them back up and they went down hill from there. It looks and sounds like they got into something but she said they didn't. Mary

[island rehabber]

Clav is good stuff. In the meantime be really viligant about keeping them hydrated. :)

[threelilkids]

I do know she used a different syringe, because she said she was use to feeding another way from my way, I was just happy they were getting fed, but my syringe was 3cc and hers was 1cc maybe she didn't feed enough, I just want to help them now what should I do for dehydration other than my vet putting fluid under the skin yesterday cause they are back to needing more fluid today.

[threelilkids]

They are still dehydrated what should I do for this? I can always get more fluids from my vet to put under the skin.

[threelilkids]

For now the spasms and seizures have stopped but they are limp and dehydrated.

[cava]

I mix evaporated milk with water 50/50, karo syrup and a egg yolk. This is what I have fed for 20 years. learn this formula in vet school.

You may not have had trouble with this formula in the past, but a baby eating this from day one is likely to have nutritional deficits that no amount of drugs is going to fix. I would get them started on a gentle Goat's Milk formula recipe and then on to Esbilac or Fox Valley Squirrel formila 20/50 ONCE THEY ARE HYDRATED and doing better. This day and age, there are really great easy to use powdered formulas that we know help them thrive.

Goat's Milk Recipe:

3 parts Goat's milk (fresh, powdered or condensed. Powdered and condensed must be made into full milk prior to using)
1 part heavy whipping cream (not half and half)
1 part full fat vanilla yogurt (yobaby comes in 6 up packs so it's easy not to waste. )

[cava]

Seizures, weakness, ataxia, tremors and poor coordination can all be caused by electrolyte imbalances and poor nutrition.

[threelilkids]

They are better this morning they even sucked a little. I will change their formula today. My vet is giving me more Clav and I'm getting fluids to go under the skin. They still have diarrhea. I will keep ya'll updated and thank ya'll so much for your input. Ya'll are great:blowkiss

[stepnstone]

I did give them Karo in the mouth for low blood sugar it made no different. I agree something is going on, but what I don't know. the vet said the diet is good. You will not like what I use but at this point I am ready to try what ever you recommend. I mix evaporated milk with water 50/50, karo syrup and a egg yolk. This is what I have fed for 20 years. learn this formula in vet school. I have been rehabbing squirrels and other wildlife for 20 years,


Your correct, I don't like what you have been using and I wouldn't give two cents of credibility to any vet school, veterinarian, or 20 years of misinformation resulting from the experience that would declare this so called formula ok to be fed to squirrels.
All need to educate themselves and their practice on the nutritional requirements of wildlife, especially that of a squirrel!
There are no "blanket formulas" for wildlife, different species have their own nutritional requirements.
You may have kept some alive on it but for a squirrel their nutritional requirements were certinally not being met and their long term health is being compromised by it's use.

I'm glad your open to try what will be recommended and sincerely hope you do for the sake of the babies now in your care and for those in the future.

[cava]

They are better this morning they even sucked a little. I will change their formula today. My vet is giving me more Clav and I'm getting fluids to go under the skin. They still have diarrhea. I will keep ya'll updated and thank ya'll so much for your input. Ya'll are great:blowkiss

You're giving a lot of antibiotics, are you also providing a probiotic to help with gut flora that the antibiotic is killing? They will be able to digest better if they have a healthy digestive tract.

You can buy probiotic capsules at the store and sprinkle one out and mix the amount of a capital "O" (very small) with a couple of drops of water, suck it up into a syringe and give it two hours after you give your antibiotic (or two hours before, but not at the same time as the antibiotic). This will aid the digestive tract and may reduce the severity of diarrhea which can be a side effect of antibiotic use.

[threelilkids]

I have been giving yogurt, for probiotics, thanks to all for your help. Here is a update on my babies. They are now eating the right amount of food for their weight, also they are sitting up and getting more alert as the day went by. Piglet, the one that jumped at my friends house picked her head up for the first time in days. Most people say when all else fells take to the vet, well when I went to my vet to get fluids in case I need them he told me DO NOT CHANGE THEIR FOOD, it will upset their stomach and you will have to start over or kill them because they are in bad shape. I saw them the people on the site did not. I went to vet school and was taught to save lives, go to the vet to get help and meds, well vets also taught the class to be a rehabilitator, I was a rehabilitator for years, well I trust my vet and I have been feeding the food for years my babies had something wrong with them and they are alive and getting better each minute, sitting up and walking. I did Not change their diet yes I took a chance but I do stand by my choice YES it was hard to do because I wanted to give them everything to save them, SO SORRY If anyone is mad at my choice, I still thank everyone for your help but I did not take a non qualified persons advise over a qualified persons, he is a vet and my babies are alive and doing great isn't that the goal here. THANKS again, Mary

[threelilkids]

Also I take them outside for a few hours each day, EVERY LIVING THING NEEDS SUN LIGHT.

[cava]

I'm so very sorry to hear that. It sounds like these babies will be at the mercy human egos and not the tried and true evidence based experience of hundreds of hands on rehabbers with years of experience. Please, please keep reading the posts here. Hopefully you'll be convinced what you're feeding is not the best and babies go through diet changes on a regular basis after coming here and finding better alternatives than the thing that got them sick and dying. Good luck, babies.

Also, people here are qualified. I was a vet tech for 15 years, am a former nurse and have done rehab for years. You don't have to be a vet to be qualified to successfully raise babies (healthy or compromised).

[Spanky]

Be sure not to leave them in direct sunlight. Squirrels can overheat quickly.

[island rehabber]

Also, people here are qualified. I was a vet tech for 15 years, am a former nurse and have done rehab for years. You don't have to be a vet to be qualified to successfully raise babies (healthy or compromised).

:goodpost I have successfully raised and released over 260 squirrels over the past 14 years. I dare suggest that this qualifies me at least for knowing what to feed them, immediately and consistently, so that they thrive and grow and get out to the trees. I resent the suggestion that a dog & cat veterinarian knows anything about wildlife compared to rehabilitators who are in the trenches day after day, finding out what works and sticking with it even though it's not written down in any vet manuals.

Just my two cents. Good luck with these babies, anyway. May they thrive and be released. :great

[threelilkids]

Be sure not to leave them in direct sunlight. Squirrels can overheat quickly.

No I would never do that, they don't have to be in the sun just outside in the shade to get the benefit from the sun.

[threelilkids]

I'm so very sorry to hear that. It sounds like these babies will be at the mercy human egos and not the tried and true evidence based experience of hundreds of hands on rehabbers with years of experience. Please, please keep reading the posts here. Hopefully you'll be convinced what you're feeding is not the best and babies go through diet changes on a regular basis after coming here and finding better alternatives than the thing that got them sick and dying. Good luck, babies.

Also, people here are qualified. I was a vet tech for 15 years, am a former nurse and have done rehab for years. You don't have to be a vet to be qualified to successfully raise babies (healthy or compromised).

Sorry but I did get upset about how ya'll started talking to me about vets and my schooling. Let me try to fix this MISSUNDERSTANDING I will change the food just not in one day I don't think it will help in doing that I do think it needs to be don't slow and after they are staple like they are now. If it was the wrong food to feed than I don't think they would have gotten better. I like the idea of a better food but if you want someone to try it your way ya'll need to go about talking to people in a better manner. Upsetting someone or being rude is not the way to do it. If the vet is nice doing this for free and you are upsetting in other ways who do you think we will listen to. I know ya'll can get things right but PLEASE do it smoother for the ones that need to understand or they will not and the babies will die. Mine will not because I take the meds from the vet an not rush the food change from ya'll. It was a choice I made please don't condemn me for it I would not disrespect any of you in that way for your knowledge is power, free, and in great need.

[cava]

Sorry but I did get upset about how ya'll started talking to me about vets and my schooling. Let me try to fix this MISSUNDERSTANDING I will change the food just not in one day I don't think it will help in doing that I do think it needs to be don't slow and after they are staple like they are now. If it was the wrong food to feed than I don't think they would have gotten better. I like the idea of a better food but if you want someone to try it your way ya'll need to go about talking to people in a better manner. Upsetting someone or being rude is not the way to do it. If the vet is nice doing this for free and you are upsetting in other ways who do you think we will listen to. I know ya'll can get things right but PLEASE do it smoother for the ones that need to understand or they will not and the babies will die. Mine will not because I take the meds from the vet an not rush the food change from ya'll. It was a choice I made please don't condemn me for it I would not disrespect any of you in that way for your knowledge is power, free, and in great need.

I certainly hope you don't think I was being rude in my post. Everything I said was for the sake of the babies and not in anger. I am irritated with the vet who won't listen to any way but his own. There are other vets who gladly listen to the experiences of rehabbers and collaborate with them. Sometimes people come here, ask for help, don't take it and then ask why did their babies die. I am trying to avoid that scenario and educate, that's all.

I'm glad you're going to make the diet change.

[threelilkids]

Thank you

[threelilkids]

I certainly hope you don't think I was being rude in my post. Everything I said was for the sake of the babies and not in anger. I am irritated with the vet who won't listen to any way but his own. There are other vets who gladly listen to the experiences of rehabbers and collaborate with them. Sometimes people come here, ask for help, don't take it and then ask why did their babies die. I am trying to avoid that scenario and educate, that's all.

I'm glad you're going to make the diet change.

Change already started

[DanC]

Wow, I'm no expert here but I'm a very quick learner and pretty savoy.

Cleans out their systems with 2 or 3 feedings of pedialyte before switching to new formula.

You should follow these experts advice here and go with the powdered probiotic puppy formula. You can get it on amazon pretty cheap if your a prime user (you can do a free trial prime). It's the best for squirrels, as far as I have observed here.
Just as long as you mix and use it right. Mix it with distilled water (never city tap or well water) let it sit for 4 hours in the fridge before your first feeding.
Mix an amount to last you 3 or 4 days and store it in the fridge.
After 4 days discard any left over formula and mix new batch. When feeding time comes, start with a diluted solution first 2 feedings and gradually go to full strength.
Fill your nipple syringes and warm them in a cup/bowl of warm tap water.
Never use the microwave. Discard any non eaten food after each feeding. Give them distilled water to drink as well.

Feeding in this way should help clear up the diarrhea. I'm pretty sure you will see a change in behavior as well. Good luck, I really hope you take this advice serious, these little baby's really need it!
:hug :Love_Icon
P.S.
Stay away from the veterinarian, especially with wild animals unless they have some kind of parasite or broken bones.
305114

[island rehabber]

:goodpost DanC, you do learn fast and you did great except for one line:

Mix it with distilled water (never city tap or well water)

:nono never used distilled water!

Distilled water lacks the minerals and electrolytes necessary to balance the system, and can be extremely harmful. Use bottled spring water or tap water IF your tap water is good, like here in NYC. Well water is fine too...if you don't trust it, boil it first. But never, ever use distilled.

Carry on helping -- you're doing great! :dance

[DanC]

Thanks, I been using purified bottled water for Jack. I was just reading in the squirrel care site to use distilled water. I never drink well water myself, even if it's good. I don't like the taste of the minerals (I know they can be good). LoL Think I'll switch to spring water. :blowkiss
P.S. Please switch my post from distilled water to spring water to clear confusion. There is 2 spots.

[DanC]

I mean to say this. If your on city water let it sit over nite so the chlorine will dissipate (before any mixing). If your on well water make sure its tested to be good (or boil it). You can use spring water too.:grin2

[island rehabber]

DanC, on what site did you read to use distilled water? I swear I need to invent an electronic Bullsh*t-seeking missile to use throughout the internet!! :madd