Rocky's behavior changed in one night - trying to understand what's up

[candaceflanagan]

I found Rocky when he was just a few days old, about 1" -1-1/4" pink, somewhat also sunburned and very dehydrated as he was in the hot Florida Sun on my seawall for apparently a while. No fur at all, eyes shut black and tight and ears still under some translucent skin. I picked him up and could see slight breath..no doctors around, no one called back from local rehab. This was August 29th before hurricane Irma came. So, I previously nursed baby kittens and figured I would do the same. I researched what to feed this baby "Pedialyte" drops one at a time every hour. I did this throughout the day all day long for three days, but didn't do it at night. He became lively and I was encouraged and found that I could feed him puppy milk and fed him. He thrived and grew beautifully and is very loving. At five weeks old he opened his eyes. Couldn't get response from wild life locally for over ten weeks. I later heard that were overwhelmed from several storms. He is turning 6 months next week. I feed him a variety of vegetables (fresh and raw) every day and he has an assortment of nuts to choose from as well throughout the day. He lives in a bright airy room where I can let him loose to play when I'm with him. He also has a big sunny window where I can place his cage for him to feel the sun and breeze and still have some shade in his cage. We have playtime two hours a day broken up and we chase each other through his mazes and around the room. Quite adorable and fun. Now I have been training him on a leash so he can get outside. He seems to enjoy this quite a bit, although the outside is still scary to him but he does sit calmly with me on the ground or on my shoulder when we walk. Today, when I went to greet him good morning, he was a different aggressive personality. I have never seen this in him. I have read that they can turn like a switch at about six months old. I'm not sure what got into him, but it is very different. When he went to bed last night he was fine. Is there any experience with this change in behavior? He seems to be more normal right now, playful etc., but it was almost like he didn't recognize me. He also is talking a lot this morning, kind of a chatter. I am very careful to feed him balanced meals, calcium, fresh water, but would like more specific info on about how much food a 6 month old male should eat and about how many nuts on average a day...I do feed him way more veggies than nuts. Just want to know if this could be because of food, because of changes in daily routine such as leash training, his age, or what. Help in understanding is greatly appreciate. This is only one day, but it is still concerning. He is still talking a lot this morning. Thank you.

[CritterMom]

Two things: First, does he have ANY nuts stashed anywhere? His cage, his room, YOUR room? If so, get rid of them (try to do it when he is somewhere else) immediately. Protecting nuts from being cruelly stolen by the very person who gave them to him is a CLASSIC squirrel crazy-trigger. The suddenness of this makes me think he may be doing this.

2nd...I call it "testosterone poisoning" and have gone through it twice. I think their little systems drop a huge load of hormones on them when they start reaching what I suppose would be called puberty and they just lose their little minds for a few months. If the baby is fine and is being released eventually you just need to protect yourself with clothing and gloves until he goes into the release cage outdoors. If he is non releasable due to some health issue and NEEDS to be socialized and happy with people, you need to add a layer of clothes and continue working hands on with him while protecting yourself and it will come to an end. I have no idea how the girls do through this period but the boys can be VERY trying.

[cava]

Hi and welcome.

Let's start with diet. He should be eating a rodent block as the base of his diet. This will provide him with the nutrition he needs. It can be supplemented with fresh food (veggies and outdoor vegetation) for variety and enrichment. Nuts should be given sparingly and only as a treat. No more than one a day. Many people give fewer than that and seeds should be avoided altogether. They are both very high in phosphorus and rob the body of calcium. This can lead to a fatal disease called MBD or Metabolic Bone Disease.

Rodent blocks can be Mazuri, Harlan Teklad (Envigo), Kaytee, and there are others. Some in stores, others online. People have varying opinions about which is best. There is also a site called Henry's Healthy Pets which sells all natural, fresh baked blocks which are designed to supplement and provide nutrition when used with a balanced diet. Here is a link to the Squirrel healthy diet pyramid. Read every word, lots of great stuff in there. https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?44440-Healthy-Diet-for-Pet-Squirrels

As far as his behavior if he is next to a window and it is open he may be involved with the going's on outside. If he is hearing other squirrels alarm or if there is a predator that you cannot see or hear but that he catches wind of, he will react.

What are your long term plans for him?

[candaceflanagan]

Two things: First, does he have ANY nuts stashed anywhere? His cage, his room, YOUR room? If so, get rid of them (try to do it when he is somewhere else) immediately. Protecting nuts from being cruelly stolen by the very person who gave them to him is a CLASSIC squirrel crazy-trigger. The suddenness of this makes me think he may be doing this.

2nd...I call it "testosterone poisoning" and have gone through it twice. I think their little systems drop a huge load of hormones on them when they start reaching what I suppose would be called puberty and they just lose their little minds for a few months. If the baby is fine and is being released eventually you just need to protect yourself with clothing and gloves until he goes into the release cage outdoors. If he is non releasable due to some health issue and NEEDS to be socialized and happy with people, you need to add a layer of clothes and continue working hands on with him while protecting yourself and it will come to an end. I have no idea how the girls do through this period but the boys can be VERY trying.


I found Rocky when he was just a few days old, about 1" -1-1/4" pink, somewhat also sunburned and very dehydrated as he was in the hot Florida Sun on my seawall for apparently a while. No fur at all, eyes shut black and tight and ears still under some translucent skin. I picked him up and could see slight breath..no doctors around, no one called back from local rehab. This was August 29th before hurricane Irma came. So, I previously nursed baby kittens and figured I would do the same. I researched what to feed this baby "Pedialyte" drops one at a time every hour. I did this throughout the day all day long for three days, but didn't do it at night. He became lively and I was encouraged and found that I could feed him puppy milk and fed him. He thrived and grew beautifully and is very loving. At five weeks old he opened his eyes. Couldn't get response from wild life locally for over ten weeks. I later heard that were overwhelmed from several storms. He is turning 6 months next week. I feed him a variety of vegetables (fresh and raw) every day and he has an assortment of nuts to choose from as well throughout the day. He lives in a bright airy room where I can let him loose to play when I'm with him. He also has a big sunny window where I can place his cage for him to feel the sun and breeze and still have some shade in his cage. We have playtime two hours a day broken up and we chase each other through his mazes and around the room. Quite adorable and fun. Now I have been training him on a leash so he can get outside. He seems to enjoy this quite a bit, although the outside is still scary to him but he does sit calmly with me on the ground or on my shoulder when we walk. Today, when I went to greet him good morning, he was a different aggressive personality. I have never seen this in him. I have read that they can turn like a switch at about six months old. I'm not sure what got into him, but it is very different. When he went to bed last night he was fine. Is there any experience with this change in behavior? He seems to be more normal right now, playful etc., but it was almost like he didn't recognize me. He also is talking a lot this morning, kind of a chatter. I am very careful to feed him balanced meals, calcium, fresh water, but would like more specific info on about how much food a 6 month old male should eat and about how many nuts on average a day...I do feed him way more veggies than nuts. Just want to know if this could be because of food, because of changes in daily routine such as leash training, his age, or what. Help in understanding is greatly appreciate. This is only one day, but it is still concerning. He is still talking a lot this morning. Thank you.

Thank you for your response, I hope I am replying correctly to these. Yes, he does hide his nuts and I try never to touch those that he has placed about because I thought I read once before, leave these alone. He has them in my chair, in boxes, in his maze I made and he has a live (safe for squirrel) tree in his room that he digs into and buries nuts. But, I will give it a clean up when he is in the patio cage, so he doesn't see. I do clean his cage twice a day, I leave all his nuts in there alone that he leaves. Reading the responses now, I have been giving him too many. Far less than the veggies, but really too many. So, I will check around later for any hidden nuts. Since this has not changed over the past six months, I don't know that I think this is the trigger, however - but it may agitate him further. I do think that testosterone is the trigger, he has physically noticeably changed very recently, so I do think he is having a testosterone growth spurt. Also, I have purchased Henry's before, he didn't like them. I tried to start him on it when he was weaning from milk...he nibbles a little biscuits I bought at any pet store ...he isn't much for these...but perhaps less nuts and Henry's again, will be a good thing to try.

[candaceflanagan]

Hi and welcome.

Let's start with diet. He should be eating a rodent block as the base of his diet. This will provide him with the nutrition he needs. It can be supplemented with fresh food (veggies and outdoor vegetation) for variety and enrichment. Nuts should be given sparingly and only as a treat. No more than one a day. Many people give fewer than that and seeds should be avoided altogether. They are both very high in phosphorus and rob the body of calcium. This can lead to a fatal disease called MBD or Metabolic Bone Disease.

Rodent blocks can be Mazuri, Harlan Teklad (Envigo), Kaytee, and there are others. Some in stores, others online. People have varying opinions about which is best. There is also a site called Henry's Healthy Pets which sells all natural, fresh baked blocks which are designed to supplement and provide nutrition when used with a balanced diet. Here is a link to the Squirrel healthy diet pyramid. Read every word, lots of great stuff in there. https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?44440-Healthy-Diet-for-Pet-Squirrels

As far as his behavior if he is next to a window and it is open he may be involved with the going's on outside. If he is hearing other squirrels alarm or if there is a predator that you cannot see or hear but that he catches wind of, he will react.

What are your long term plans for him?

I will review the Healthy-Diet for Pet Squirrels in detail. He is only next to the window for a couple of hours a day, but yes, he can see things much nature outside, including the water and trees and lovely sunshine. He did get agitated one day when someone across the canal was working so I just rolled his cage back. When I am out of the house, I never leave the window open and most often roll the cage to the other side of the room, just because of this. I do monitor him regularly...but I will keep a close eye on activity around the house.

As far as my plans for him, I was just planning on taking care of him as his forever home. II have contacted a UF Exotic animal vet that I will be taking him too to see how he is doing overall. Thank you for all your assistance and great advice.

[CritterMom]

Thank you for your response, I hope I am replying correctly to these. Yes, he does hide his nuts and I try never to touch those that he has placed about because I thought I read once before, leave these alone. He has them in my chair, in boxes, in his maze I made and he has a live (safe for squirrel) tree in his room that he digs into and buries nuts. But, I will give it a clean up when he is in the patio cage, so he doesn't see. I do clean his cage twice a day, I leave all his nuts in there alone that he leaves. Reading the responses now, I have been giving him too many. Far less than the veggies, but really too many. So, I will check around later for any hidden nuts. Since this has not changed over the past six months, I don't know that I think this is the trigger, however - but it may agitate him further. I do think that testosterone is the trigger, he has physically noticeably changed very recently, so I do think he is having a testosterone growth spurt. Also, I have purchased Henry's before, he didn't like them. I tried to start him on it when he was weaning from milk...he nibbles a little biscuits I bought at any pet store ...he isn't much for these...but perhaps less nuts and Henry's again, will be a good thing to try.

Honestly. Lose the stashed nuts. I have a male squirrel who will be 9 at his next birthday, and he loves to snuggle with me. Our play place is my room and we spend a fair amount of time in there together. I hide goodies in various places for him to find, we cuddle, he bumbles around and looks out the windows. I WOULD GIVE HIM A HAND GRENADE BEFORE I ALLOWED HIM AND A NUT IN THE SHELL IN MY ROOM TOGETHER!!! He turns into a maniac - hides the nut under the bed and then climbs up on the bed and attacks me to get me away from it - I have had him drive me from the room before! If I throw his little butt out, retrieve the nut and put it someplace safe (in a concrete vault buried in the bedrock behind the house) and bring him back in the room and he is fine! He checks, finds out it is gone and his sweet switch flips again.

Get rid of every single stashed nut. He shouldn't be getting enough to stash - he should want to greedily eat every one as soon as he gets it because they are TREATS.

[HRT4SQRLS]

:laugh2 Crit, your replies kill me.

[Mel1959]

:rotfl:yeahthat:yeahthat


On a serious note. What you are describing is the same behavior I have been experiencing with my female, who is about 11 months old. We also live in Fl and she has a cage next to a large window which is open. A couple of days in a row she started alarming first thing in the morning. When I went in to talk to her she was agitated, her tale was flicking, she was alarming and she was aggressive, but not terribly so. This was when she bit me for the first time. The behavior was intermittent throughout the day, but there was enough of it that I was scared to interact with her in my normal way which is very similar to how you interact with your boy, chasing and hand wrestling. My girl has no stashed nuts because she becomes a jerk when she does, so I knew it wasn’t that. After thinking about when it started, I realized that I had left her window open a couple of nights in a row. My neighbors at the house next door have a dog that they allow out in the morning to wander and do it’s “business” in everybody else’s yard. :frustratedx:frustratedx. I believe the dog was wandering near her window and she could smell and hear him and it completely spooked her while she was sleeping or shortly after she awoke.

I don’t think that was the only issue. I think the mating scents are in the air. I didn’t notice any physical signs of her being in estrus, though. She did build a second nest on top of her cage. I guess she decided her winter nest under the blanket was too hot for summer. :rotfl

Anyway, the behavior has stopped since I have been closing her window again at night and a little time has passed.

[island rehabber]

:laugh2 Crit, your replies kill me.

IK,R? :rofl4\

BTW, it's not just the boys. My sweet, mellow, slightly neuro Owena is a total raving BEEYOTCH two or three times a year. You haven't lived until you've had a whirling dervish of a neuro squirrel hurling herself against the cage at you to punish you for presenting her with a beautiful bowl of breakfast! And although Owena is blind in one eye and gets seizures sometimes, there is Nothing. Whatsoever. Wrong. with her TEETH. :shark1

[CritterMom]

IK,R? :rofl4\

BTW, it's not just the boys. My sweet, mellow, slightly neuro Owena is a total raving BEEYOTCH two or three times a year. You haven't lived until you've had a whirling dervish of a neuro squirrel hurling herself against the cage at you to punish you for presenting her with a beautiful bowl of breakfast! And although Owena is blind in one eye and gets seizures sometimes, there is Nothing. Whatsoever. Wrong. with her TEETH. :shark1

Um, P weighs right around 2 pounds and that is a lot of squirrel when it is CRAY CRAY!

[island rehabber]

Um, P weighs right around 2 pounds and that is a lot of squirrel when it is CRAY CRAY!

:eek :eek that's right -- your Maine squirrels are the size of beavers!!

[Michellef]

Hi there, I see you live in Florida so do I, and you found your boy the same time I found mine. I am going to the vet today with him for the first time. His testicles cane in 2 weeks ago and they turned dark this past week. He is always aggressive with nuts. He is nipping fingers on anyone but me and my fiancee.
So I can't let him out with company.
Well I'll let you know what the vet say.

Michelle

[candaceflanagan]

Hi there, I see you live in Florida so do I, and you found your boy the same time I found mine. I am going to the vet today with him for the first time. His testicles cane in 2 weeks ago and they turned dark this past week. He is always aggressive with nuts. He is nipping fingers on anyone but me and my fiancee.
So I can't let him out with company.
Well I'll let you know what the vet say.

Michelle

Thank you for your response. I know my boy had some issue going on with Testosterone because I could physically see some huge changes in his testes, color and size...they looked like they could pop. Now they have returned to where they were before and so has his disposition... I did see a few small changes the day or two before...His pounce was more aggressive, etc...but he was still sweet but crazy about his nuts and defensive/aggressive. Now he is just a sweet little love again. I am going to see a vet myself and am very interested to learn what yours says too. He had become aggressive with nuts, so I started not feeding any nuts until he went back to his cage for the evening when I would give him one large pecan in a shell. His disposition has been fabulous...sweet as pie and even have him walking on a leash with no problem.. PS I made my leash, much better than what I could buy. Please keep me posted on your little guy...

[candaceflanagan]

[QUOTE=CritterMom;1254245]Two things: First, does he have ANY nuts stashed anywhere? His cage, his room, YOUR room? If so, get rid of them (try to do it when he is somewhere else) immediately. Protecting nuts from being cruelly stolen by the very person who gave them to him is a CLASSIC squirrel crazy-trigger. The suddenness of this makes me think he may be doing this.

2nd...I call it "testosterone poisoning" and have gone through it twice. I think their little systems drop a huge load of hormones on them when they start reaching what I suppose would be called puberty and they just lose their little minds for a few months. If the baby is fine and is being released eventually you just need to protect yourself with clothing and gloves until he goes into the release cage outdoors. If he is non releasable due to some health issue and NEEDS to be socialized and happy with people, you need to add a layer of clothes and continue working hands on with him while protecting yourself and it will come to an end. I have no idea how the girls do through this period but the boys can be VERY trying.[/QUOT

TY again and Rocky is doing so much better now...back to his sweet little self.

[Michellef]

I took my 7 month old boy to a vet. He said there is no guarantee that neutering will calm them down. He said if he becomes aggressive with me than I should do it. I have no problems but I can't let him out with other people. He also said not to let him out with anyone because if he scratched or bit someone they could turn me in and he would be euthanized and checked for rabies.
Not worth losing him.
He said neutering a squirrel is more complicated than cats or dogs si its more expensive. $479.00
I like his balls their cute anyway 🐿

[candaceflanagan]

Honestly. Lose the stashed nuts. I have a male squirrel who will be 9 at his next birthday, and he loves to snuggle with me. Our play place is my room and we spend a fair amount of time in there together. I hide goodies in various places for him to find, we cuddle, he bumbles around and looks out the windows. I WOULD GIVE HIM A HAND GRENADE BEFORE I ALLOWED HIM AND A NUT IN THE SHELL IN MY ROOM TOGETHER!!! He turns into a maniac - hides the nut under the bed and then climbs up on the bed and attacks me to get me away from it - I have had him drive me from the room before! If I throw his little butt out, retrieve the nut and put it someplace safe (in a concrete vault buried in the bedrock behind the house) and bring him back in the room and he is fine! He checks, finds out it is gone and his sweet switch flips again.

Get rid of every single stashed nut. He shouldn't be getting enough to stash - he should want to greedily eat every one as soon as he gets it because they are TREATS.

Totally agree and thank you. This is very much like Rocky's daily (not abnormal aggressive behavior I experienced in my first post) he is normally sweet as a baby bunny until he found a nut...then he pushes me with his little hand and makes a ummmm noise and hid it. Any other food is fine. So now, as you and others shared, he gets one nut in a shell between 3:30 and 5 pm in his cage, which I hand directly to him when he climbs back in the cage on his own. This has made all our play time a great time for both of us. We play at least 1.5 hours to 2 hours (broken up about 30 - 45 minutes each. We add a little outside on the leash time as well almost every day as weather in Florida permits. i learn so much from this little guy! The rest of his diet has always very good when compared to the food pyramid, but there was still a bit more I learned I could do, which I have done. Thanks to everyone.

[Mel1959]

I took my 7 month old boy to a vet. He said there is no guarantee that neutering will calm them down. He said if he becomes aggressive with me than I should do it. I have no problems but I can't let him out with other people. He also said not to let him out with anyone because if he scratched or bit someone they could turn me in and he would be euthanized and checked for rabies.
Not worth losing him.
He said neutering a squirrel is more complicated than cats or dogs si its more expensive. $479.00
I like his balls their cute anyway 🐿

I just wanted to mention that both you and the other poster, candaceflanagan are located in Florida. If you need a super competent, super qualified and super squirrel knowledgeable vet for neutering or any other health issues, please reach out and make the drive to Port Orange, FL. Dr. Alicia Emerson has neutered and spayed many squirrels and I’m pretty sure the cost wouldn’t be $479.00. Her practice is Ravenwood Vet Clinic 386-788-1550.

[muggsy'sgm]

"I took my 7 month old boy to a vet. He said there is no guarantee that neutering will calm them down. He said if he becomes aggressive with me than I should do it. I have no problems but I can't let him out with other people. He also said not to let him out with anyone because if he scratched or bit someone they could turn me in and he would be euthanized and checked for rabies.
Not worth losing him.
He said neutering a squirrel is more complicated than cats or dogs si its more expensive. $479.00"

Hmmmm...My vet recommended neutering, too, and I'm in the Panhandle of Florida. It was no where near $479! Muggsy, an NR grey, also had tail amputation, iv antibiotics and pain meds, and exploratory abdominal surgery...and it was NO WHERE near that price.

No one has warned me about Muggsy being taken if someone is scratched or bitten...and I've had to go get antibiotics (precautionary) and a tetanus shot due to be being bitten.

I agree with Mel1959...maybe go to a vet suggested here on TSB...if need be. Also, maybe look into CBD oil or flour. It is legal to purchase in Florida, and calms OCD or neurological issues...may work on aggression...depending on what the root cause is. Just my dos cents.

[cava]

No one has warned me about Muggsy being taken if someone is scratched or bitten...and I've had to go get antibiotics (precautionary) and a tetanus shot due to be being bitten.



Around here if you go to the ER or a doc with an animal bite they are required by law to report it to the health dept who then makes you quarantine for 10 days (companion animal with no proof of vaccinations) or euthanize wild animal and send for rabies testing, regardless of what type of animal or reason for bite. (mostly why I'm not a vet tech anymore. sick of being required to euthanize healthy animals) They think if they got close enough to a human they MUST be sick and wild animals aren't allowed in a house of a non licensed rehabber. Rehabbers have to quarantine and HD rechecks animal in 10 days. It's terrible and that's why nobody is ever allowed to be in a position where my squirrels can bite or scratch them. My parents have to stand in the hallway and watch them in their cage 10 feet away, and that's only happened once. Otherwise, nobody ever sees them.

[Rocky1]

Around here if you go to the ER or a doc with an animal bite they are required by law to report it to the health dept who then makes you quarantine for 10 days (companion animal with no proof of vaccinations) or euthanize wild animal and send for rabies testing, regardless of what type of animal or reason for bite. (mostly why I'm not a vet tech anymore. sick of being required to euthanize healthy animals) They think if they got close enough to a human they MUST be sick and wild animals aren't allowed in a house of a non licensed rehabber. Rehabbers have to quarantine and HD rechecks animal in 10 days. It's terrible and that's why nobody is ever allowed to be in a position where my squirrels can bite or scratch them. My parents have to stand in the hallway and watch them in their cage 10 feet away, and that's only happened once. Otherwise, nobody ever sees them.

Gosh, I can't stand that law. In short, I second this. And I'm in Massachusetts.

[Michellef]

Candaceflanagen what city are you in?