One squirrel smaller than siblings.

[ElleShine]

Hello all!

I am currently keeping four 5 month old squirrels over the winter. They are all siblings, two boys and two girls, and will be released in the spring. One of the females, Violet, has always had the most personality out of all of them. She's always been the bravest, most curious, and smartest.

From the time they were about a month old, Violet was almost twice the size of the rest of them. I jokingly used to say she was actually a groundhog. Now, however, the tables have turned. She is now way smaller than her siblings. The other three, at 5 months, look to almost be the size of adult squirrels, but Violet doesn't. Her tail isn't as bushy, and her fur appears to be more coarse than the others'.

I fed them all Fox Valley 20/50 formula, and Violet was the first to self-wean. She lost interest in formula about three weeks before her brothers and sister. Currently, the each receive one Henry's blocks a day, and along with Oxbow Essentials rat food (which they love). Throughout the day they also have a variety of the vegetables listed in the "Healthy Diet for Pet Squirrels" chart on the Henry's homepage. I only give them a treat (such as a grape or piece of banana) once a day, if at all. They happily eat the Oxbow more than anything else.

Violet is also always trying to get out of the cage, more so than any of the others. Even after being out for a couple of hours, she immediately starts pacing once back in the cage.

My concern is the fact that she doesn't seem to be growing nearly as fast as the rest of them, which is strange because at one point she was twice their size. The boys can be quite aggressive around the food bowl, but I make sure I provide plenty of food for all of them while I'm at work. Is it normal for one to be smaller than siblings, or is it something I should be concerned with?

Thanks!
-Ellen

[TubeDriver]

Can you post up a photo of violet with some of her siblings? Small squirels or larger squirrels are not uncommon but starting off much larger and then falling behind is unusual.

[ElleShine]

Hello again everyone, I apologize for taking so long to post pictures. I had a very hard time getting pictures that accurately showed the size difference between Violet and her siblings, to the point where I almost gave up.

I'm not HUGELY concerned there's an issue, but still have enough anxiety to follow up. The largest male, Max, can be aggressive around the food at times (which is why I have four separate dishes in their cage) but otherwise they all seem to get along. When I come home from work, they are all pig-piled together on top of the cat tree in their cage.

However, because Violet is skinnier and smaller than the others, I am concerned that she's not getting enough to eat. I've been working long hours and haven't had a ton of time to just observe them all in the enclosure. I let them out for about an hour a day to run around, and while they're out, Violet is often exploring on her own while the other three wrestle. Pearl, the other female, is the same size as the boys. Is it possible that only Violet is being bullied, and not the other female?

The smaller male, Marcus, is very sweet to Violet, and often grooms her. I'm posting some pictures below. The squirrel at the top of the Christmas tree is Max. Pearl and Marcus are exactly the same size. The squirrel on the windowsill is Violet.

297884
297885297886297887

[cava]

Her body condition doesn't look good. She looks like she's wasting, which is when they lose body fat, then muscle. She also looks a dehydrated.

If this were happening with one of my four, I'd put her in her own cage and try to get down to whether or not she is eating, what her activity level is, etc.

If it's simply a matter of her being docile, bullied, slower, etc than the other, bigger ones she should flourish. You may have to spend time one on one playing and encouraging her. It does sound like she needs special attention.

What exactly are you feeding these guys?

Also, if needed, do you have access to a vet?

Finally, have you checked her teeth and mouth? Eating starts there so it's a good place to start.

[ElleShine]

Yes! We have access to a vet. They all get Oxbow Essentials Adult Rat Food. Also, a variety of fresh vegetables such as broccoli, different kinds of lettuce, brussel sprouts, occasionally carrots and grapes for treats. Also I occasionally give them almonds for treats as well. Everything I give them I look up on the "Healthy Diet for Pet Squirrels" page.

Currently, all four are housed in a very large cage my boyfriend built. They have tons of room to play and climb. I have the ferret cage they were previously housed in. It is smaller, and I feel guilty putting her back into a smaller cage, but will. If need be I can always buy a larger one online.

[cava]

Maybe you could just buy an extra level for it and make it taller??

Last year I had two (much younger) and felt bad but had to separate the girl from the boy because he was just too much for her and she was behind developmentally. Eventually she caught up and they were put back together. Yours are older but if you keep them in the same room, cages side by side, even and still let them play together I think they'd be able to get back together once you straighten her out.

Or she may just need the respite and one on one with you for a while.

Also, if you keep her in her own cage and need to take her in (an exam would be a good idea anyway) you will be able to answer Violet specific questions because you'll be able to monitor just her and know exactly what she's doing.

[LR]

In order for the Henry's blocks to give Violet the full daily amount of nutrition (vitamins and minerals) she needs to be given two blocks a day. Maybe instead of putting it in her food bowl, since you have a boy who is food aggressive, you could hand feed her the block just to be sure she is getting all of it.

[stepnstone]

Separate her from the aggression. She needs nourishment and to lower her anxiety.
She'll be much better off being single not having to constantly be dealing with rampant
testosterone levels.

[SammysMom]

I have had one in a group who I seperated for meals until I knew they were eating and then let him go back in w ith his siblings for bedtime or even naptime too.

[ElleShine]

Thank you so much everybody! I'll post more after some keen observation.

[Diggie's Friend]

I highly recommend you include Pet Flora by Safer Medical of MT. 1/64 Tsp daily. It supports digestion and keeps the bad bacteria to a minimum in the gut. The gut contains over 80 % of the immune system of the body. Add this to baked squash.

https://www.amazon.com/Pet-Flora-Spectrum-Prebiotic-Probiotic/dp/B073G9K4XV/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?s=hpc&ie=UTF8&qid=1515900576&sr=1-1-spons&keywords=Pet+flora+120+capsules&psc=1&smid=A2XUOVLOF1KYDU

Find an organic squash and cut it up in sections to bake well about 1 1/2 hours; be sure to check it though for your oven may cook it faster, or slower than mine. Remove the baked squash from the skin into a bowl. Then using large end of a melon scoop baller, fill the scoop up to the rim, not make a ball of it, and place it flat into a freezer bag placed on a paper plate. Use as many bags as is needed to place the portions into, with a paper plate below so that the portions don't get all squished up. Once done, close each bag with a straw left in to suck the air out of each of them, then close, and place each bag into the freezer on a paper plate till they are frozen, the you can remove the plates. Then you'll have portions you can use to feed her and the rest easily.

Butternut squash, that is common source of squash, has a positive Calcium to phosphorus ratio, besides being a good source of protein, lower in sugar than sweet potato, and high in beta-carotene, along with vitamins for when baked it retains its water soluble vitamins.
In addition add organic chia oil to her diet by putting it on her foods or a rodent block to get her to eat it, 1/16 Tsp. equal to four drops daily.

https://www.amazon.com/Foods-Alive-Artisan-Cold-Pressed-Organic/dp/B007788AZA/ref=sr_1_1_s_it?s=hpc&ie=UTF8&qid=1515900682&sr=1-1&keywords=foods+alive+chia+oil

Organic pumpkin seed oil from Oregon, not the foreign sources.

https://www.amazon.com/Pumpkin-Seed-Oil-Grown-Oregon/dp/B00Z8BRCDO

It contains many nutrients.

Also try low fat yogurt, add some ground English walnut or pecan to it. You can add the oils also to the yogurt, or spread the drops around to other foods. Green Valley yogurt plain is a good choice just incase she has an issue with lactose intolerant, this source is lactose free, as is their Kefir product.

https://www.amazon.com/Green-Valley-Organic-Lactose-Yogurt/dp/B00OX71FQE

I hope you can find this locally.

[stepnstone]

I have had one in a group who I seperated for meals until I knew they were eating and then let him go back in w ith his siblings for bedtime or even naptime too.

I have two I have to do this with by closing off the floors between them so they eat separately and
four in a 3 level I feed on top and bottom floor so everyone can get a chance to eat because Mr. Bully
with the food aggression can't be on both floors at the same time. Only one out of the three won't back
down from his bullying. Other then that they get along.

Not all can "get along" as they mature. Food aggression can really be detrimental to the health of the
one being bullied and continued bullying can be just as detrimental to the timid one's overall development.
I had a pair, female started out bigger then boy, both had beautiful shiny black fur, boy intimidated female
and with food aggression. He got bigger full thick fur, she seemed to stop growing, overly timid, scared, and
her fur looked flat. I separated them!
For the first 2-3 days she ate like you were going to take it away from her! It wasn't long she flourished, overgrew
the male and was calmer. Even after release she never enters the yard at the same corner he does and she never
eats at the same feeder he does.

[ElleShine]

So I've been watching my four all day. The aggressor is pearl, the larger female. She's been really territorial over all of the food dishes. She occasionally goes after the boys, but most of her aggression is towards Violet. The boys seem ok with Violet.

My question is should I remove Pearl from the large cage? Since I've taken Violet out Pearl has been fine. I feel so guilty putting Violet into the small cage by herself.

[cava]

I think if you take out Pearl you're punishing her and if you take out Violet you're rescuing her. I just don't know what to tell ya.

Plus, there's no telling if one of the boys will step up and be a butthead in Pearl's absence. I think I would put Violet in her own cage. Give her better toys if you feel guilty. She should have all the food she wants for a while, with NO competition.

I know others have experience with a bully sibling. I look forward to what they advise.

Glad you figured it out, though!

[Mel1959]

:yeahthat:yeahthat. Don’t look at it as though you are punishing Violet. Instead think of it as though you’re rescuing her.

Try moving Violet to the cage by herself and see how she does. You can spoil her with lots of healthy foods that she doesn’t have to worry about anyone taking from her. :grin2. Who knows she might really like having her own space. If you feel she needs more room then buy the add on cage for the ferret nation cage.

Keep us posted as to how she does.

[lilidukes]

Separate Violet for sure!
Often the bully inside turns out to be the
biggest sissy after going to the release cage.

[Mel1959]

How’s Violet doing? Did you separate her from the others?

[ElleShine]

Yes she's been by herself for the past week. She seems like she even put on a small amount of weight!

I still let all four of them out to play together, and I've noticed that the other three are really mean to her. They chase and attack her every chance they get... It's more than just regular "playing". The other three get along fine. I don't understand why she's been ostracized and it breaks my heart.

Violet used to always attempt to play with her siblings, but I've now noticed she's scared of them. It breaks my heart.

[Chickenlegs]

She has you. Make sure she knows she has the biggest best squirrel in her corner! Squirrels can be evil to the weak. With your help she’ll be queen of the yard! Does she have any issues that might make her a target? More pictures pleeeeeze!

[ElleShine]

Aside from being small, Violet doesn't seem to have any other limitations. However, I still find myself nervous about releasing her, even though I know she'd love it in the wild. She's very active and playful... very adventurous. Is there anything specific I should be looking out for?

Pictures:
298161 Violet


298162 Violet again

298163 Maximus on my leg and Pearl in the background

[cava]

She looks like she put on weight. Am I seeing that right? Go Violet!!

She has a bit of time. I think if she is a good weight she can be released. If the others are being meanies, release them first, then give her a softer release by herself. I mean, if you fear putting her in a cage with them outside. Plus, she'd have more one on one and "getting fat" time before going out there.

Is it at all possible to put one of the tamer boys with her, like during play time so she can get a release buddy?

[TubeDriver]

:goodpost


Violet looks MUCH better physically now. Let her keep on gaining weight and getting bigger! Trying to allow her some one on one play time with one of the other males may not be a bad idea but separate them if any bullying starts.

[ElleShine]

That's a great idea. Marcus is passive and sweet. He's the only one who allows me to hold him and pet him. And she definitely put on weight! Despite all this, she's always been a very happy squirrel, which is good. Thank you to everyone for responding!

[TubeDriver]

Not sure this is a good idea but what about pairing up sweet Marcus with Violet in the same cage? If that worked, you would have two pairs instead of a threesome and a singleton? I think having pairs is always better than a singleton since they can interact and develop social squirrel skills.

There are some risks though. If Marcus started bullying Violet (or even vice versa) than you might have difficulty reintroducing Marcus back with his other sibs. Than you would have a pair and two singletons.

Hopefully some rehabbers here with more experience will comment on this idea. Good/bad idea?