11 year old female losing weight and acting lethargic

[Curliesmom2017]

I have an 11 year old female gray squirrel. We've had her since she was 4 weeks old. A few weeks ago we noticed that she's lost weight. She's now down to about 440gms. She was over 500gms earlier this year. She was eating and drinking normal just skinny. She's 11 so She's lost muscle mass which is probably why She's so light. She's always been small. Tonight she's acting out of sorts. She's squeaking at us like she's hurting. I know she's older. She gets calcium so it's not mbd and she was up this morning eating. Now she won't eat. I know I can give her ultram for pain. At 440gm how much would I give her of a 50mg tab? And any thoughts of what might be going on?

[Nancy in New York]

I have an 11 year old female gray squirrel. We've had her since she was 4 weeks old. A few weeks ago we noticed that she's lost weight. She's now down to about 440gms. She was over 500gms earlier this year. She was eating and drinking normal just skinny. She's 11 so She's lost muscle mass which is probably why She's so light. She's always been small. Tonight she's acting out of sorts. She's squeaking at us like she's hurting. I know she's older. She gets calcium so it's not mbd and she was up this morning eating. Now she won't eat. I know I can give her ultram for pain. At 440gm how much would I give her of a 50mg tab? And any thoughts of what might be going on?

Can you list exactly what she eats,
or what she did eat, as I see now that you're saying
she won't eat.
I will dose the ultram through a pm.
Do you have a heating pad that you can safely put under
her without the risk of her biting the cord? If so, I would set
it at low, she's probably achy.
They have these chew proof heating pads at Amazon.
They're fantastic.
https://www.amazon.com/Manufacturing-Animal-Heated-9-Inch-12-Inch/dp/B000NVC7DO/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1509359452&sr=8-1&keywords=chew+proof+heating+pad

Edit: Dosing sent, sorry forgot to write that earlier.

[Curliesmom2017]

Can you list exactly what she eats,
or what she did eat, as I see now that you're saying
she won't eat.
I will dose the ultram through a pm.
Do you have a heating pad that you can safely put under
her without the risk of her biting the cord? If so, I would set
it at low, she's probably achy.
They have these chew proof heating pads at Amazon.
They're fantastic.
https://www.amazon.com/Manufacturing-Animal-Heated-9-Inch-12-Inch/dp/B000NVC7DO/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1509359452&sr=8-1&keywords=chew+proof+heating+pad

She's a very picky squirrel. I can tell you what she will eat. She likes avocado, sweet potato, any green veggie. We usually just go back and forth between it all. She will eat something one day and refuse it the next. We do give nuts at night. Seeds. Pecans from the tree outside. Apples, nectarines, acorns rarely, she loves pistachios. I dust her nuts with calcium. Shes not a big eater. Shes always been small. She was a runt. We think she fell out of her window. She has a room all to herself. She's always had neurological problems. When she fell out of her nest, she fell 80 feet as a four week old. She's now 11 years old.
I think she's not wanting food because she hit her face. She had eaten yesterday morning. She just usually eats before bed but was squeaking at me when I tried to give her a pecan. Today she's more alert and more herself. We are giving fluids every few hours. I think she's going to be ok. She can no longer get to her window. For now. We are going to put a better ledge. Thank you for the help. I'll keep you posted on her progress.

[Nancy in New York]

OK at 11 years old, I am not going to lecture you on her diet.
Here's a chart that lists foods and nuts according to the amount of calcium to phosphorous ratios.
We strive for a ratio of 2:1 (calcium to phosphorous)
https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?15397-Food-Data-Chart-Update-Calcium-to-Phosphorus-Ratios

The one thing we strongly recommend as a STAPLE is rodent block.
I always use HHB's. You feed them 2 daily along with healthy veggies.
I get the picky blocks for picky eaters.
It's flat rate shipping regardless if you get 40 bags or 1.
https://www.henryspets.com/squirrel-diet/


But there are some others that are also good, however, you have to feed
many more to get the benefits of 2 of the HHB's.

Here are some other acceptible blocks along with the HHB's.
https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=292516&stc=1https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=292517&stc=1https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=292520&stc=1https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-xvhk49f/0/f750bda6/O/i-xvhk49f.jpg

[Curliesmom2017]

OK at 11 years old, I am not going to lecture you on her diet.
Here's a chart that lists foods and nuts according to the amount of calcium to phosphorous ratios.
We strive for a ratio of 2:1 (calcium to phosphorous)
https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?15397-Food-Data-Chart-Update-Calcium-to-Phosphorus-Ratios

The one thing we strongly recommend as a STAPLE is rodent block.
I always use HHB's. You feed them 2 daily along with healthy veggies.
I get the picky blocks for picky eaters.
It's flat rate shipping regardless if you get 40 bags or 1.
https://www.henryspets.com/squirrel-diet/


But there are some others that are also good, however, you have to feed
many more to get the benefits of 2 of the HHB's.

Here are some other acceptible blocks along with the HHB's.
https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=292516&stc=1https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=292517&stc=1https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=292520&stc=1https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-xvhk49f/0/f750bda6/O/i-xvhk49f.jpg

We 've tried hhb's before even the picky ones and she's supremely picky. She won't touch them. It's been awhile since we tried them so I'll order a bag and give it another go. I know her diets not perfect but we do what we can. A friend of mine on here said once that she'd never met a pickier squirrel. My 6 year old boy will eat anything you give him but not Curlie. In 11 years we've tried everything. Anytime I have babies I always order hhb's and they eat them. It's so weird. Anyway, we started the Motrin and let het sleep. It's more and more likely she fell. Her nose is super sore and it's looking swollen. Which is why she was squeaking at me and not eating. With pain meds on board she should be able to eat. If not, I have formula I can give her. Thank you for the help. I'll keep you updated.

[LR]

Have you been able to check the inside of her mouth?

[Curliesmom2017]

Have you been able to check the inside of her mouth?

Yeah. We checked her mouth. No blood or holes. No bruising. We think she hit her face when she fell. No broken legs or ribs. Only place that's painful is on top of her face.shes moving around more. She has drunk water on her own last night right after I found her. That's how I found her. She was at her water bowl. She must be fallen just minutes before I went to check on her. She's a sleeper and only gets up twice a day. She's been like that for years.

[LR]

I'm glad to hear she is up and around. Maybe the ultram is helping some. A good knock on the nose/forehead would knock any animal for a loop!

[Curliesmom2017]

I'm glad to hear she is up and around. Maybe the ultram is helping some. A good knock on the nose/forehead would knock any animal for a loop!

We went with the infant Motrin instead. She was sleeping earlier and had ate an almond. She's still staying in her nest but is way more alert when we woke her. Also got some formula in her. If she could kill with her eyes I'd be a goner.

[Diggie's Friend]

I had an eleven year old like this, she was picky too.

Did she ever go into heat, or never show any signs of doing so?

If she had heats, did she have one or two a year?

Did she have a white discharge beginning mid way through her heat that got thicker towards the end?

Is she getting any D3 at all in her food? If not "Superior Source baby D3 of 200 IU tabs" is a good source that can be REDUCED by crushing the tab and dividing it into 6 separate portions, using just one portion 1/6 of a tab, to add into yogurt or her squash which equals 33 IU D3. This source is very easily absorbed.

At this age squirrels can go into menopause, and yes, it happens suddenly, not like in humans. Our girl, spayed at 7 for medical reasons (long story), put her into menopause, which after two years she had develop presenting in degenerative disc disease. Two years later it reached her back teeth and perhaps jaw. The vet that did the diagnosis pointed out the thick druel that clung to the corners of her mouth, explaining it is a sign of back teeth involvement from MBD. I wasn't told to do an MBD protocol.

Here is the treatment for MBD; perhaps this may perk up your girl, or make her more comfortable. I get you don't want to stress her by forcing this into her as she is so weak and elderly. Try putting the calcium into organic yogurt to see if she will take it on her own first by adding one or more of the sources I note here below to make this source more appealing to her.

https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?17680-Emergency-Treatment-for-MBD-(Updated-3-31-09)

I recommend Green Valley plain LF yogurt or their organic vanilla Kefir. I would recommend whole fat, yet if she hasn't been eating well for awhile the whole fat may be hard for her to digest.

Try adding organic pumpkin seed oil from Oil seed company of Oregon, source ordered online at Amazon.com This adds a yummy nutty taste to the yogurt. Also add a drop 1/64 Tsp. of organic dark molasses Brer Rabbit brand, our wilds went crazy for this source. If you don't have this, you can also add just a drop of organic maple sugar to the yogurt. Off it to her on a plastic spoon to lick it up, or by putting a bit on the tip of your to slide in behind her front teeth to get her going on it.

Should she have a seisure, give her right afterwards putting it on her tongue; as this will help to normalize her blood sugar.

Offer her soft foods at the same time you offer feed the yogurt. Organic baked Butternut squash; it is very good nutritionally speaking. Also organic boiled green peas. Our squirrels really liked these, they would eat the inside and leave the soft shell exterior, so don't think she has rejected it if you see leftover empty shells.

If she accept the yogurt perhaps she may accept you grinding up a block to put in it. 2014 Harlan Teklad rodent diet is one that has a close ratio of Calcium to magnesium, that is also supportive of remineralization of bones. You will still need to crush the block to add it to the yogurt; so just make sure she will eat that before ordering it online.

I would be glad to help as I can, I have other sources that support calcium health and good appetite also. Just send me a PM, I'm home most of the time. Diggie's Friend

[Curliesmom2017]

I had an eleven year old like this, she was picky too.

Did she ever go into heat, or never show any signs of doing so?

If she had heats, did she have one or two a year?

Did she have a white discharge beginning mid way through her heat that got thicker towards the end?

Is she getting any D3 at all in her food? If not "Superior Source baby D3 of 200 IU tabs" is a good source that can be REDUCED by crushing the tab and dividing it into 6 separate portions, using just one portion 1/6 of a tab, to add into yogurt or her squash which equals 33 IU D3. This source is very easily absorbed.

At this age squirrels can go into menopause, and yes, it happens suddenly, not like in humans. Our girl, spayed at 7 for medical reasons (long story), put her into menopause, which after two years she had develop presenting in degenerative disc disease. Two years later it reached her back teeth and perhaps jaw. The vet that did the diagnosis pointed out the thick druel that clung to the corners of her mouth, explaining it is a sign of back teeth involvement from MBD. I wasn't told to do an MBD protocol.

Here is the treatment for MBD; perhaps this may perk up your girl, or make her more comfortable. I get you don't want to stress her by forcing this into her as she is so weak and elderly. Try putting the calcium into organic yogurt to see if she will take it on her own first by adding one or more of the sources I note here below to make this source more appealing to her.

https://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?17680-Emergency-Treatment-for-MBD-(Updated-3-31-09)

I recommend Green Valley plain LF yogurt or their organic vanilla Kefir. I would recommend whole fat, yet if she hasn't been eating well for awhile the whole fat may be hard for her to digest.

Try adding organic pumpkin seed oil from Oil seed company of Oregon, source ordered online at Amazon.com This adds a yummy nutty taste to the yogurt. Also add a drop 1/64 Tsp. of organic dark molasses Brer Rabbit brand, our wilds went crazy for this source. If you don't have this, you can also add just a drop of organic maple sugar to the yogurt. Off it to her on a plastic spoon to lick it up, or by putting a bit on the tip of your to slide in behind her front teeth to get her going on it.

Should she have a seisure, give her right afterwards putting it on her tongue; as this will help to normalize her blood sugar.

Offer her soft foods at the same time you offer feed the yogurt. Organic baked Butternut squash; it is very good nutritionally speaking. Also organic boiled green peas. Our squirrels really liked these, they would eat the inside and leave the soft shell exterior, so don't think she has rejected it if you see leftover empty shells.

If she accept the yogurt perhaps she may accept you grinding up a block to put in it. 2014 Harlan Teklad rodent diet is one that has a close ratio of Calcium to magnesium, that is also supportive of remineralization of bones. You will still need to crush the block to add it to the yogurt; so just make sure she will eat that before ordering it online.

I would be glad to help as I can, I have other sources that support calcium health and good appetite also. Just send me a PM, I'm home most of the time. Diggie's Friend

We've tried yogurt before. She won't touch it. She ate three sunflower seeds this morning. ( I read that seeds are bad.) No more seeds. Getting pine nuts instead. She yawned this morning which means her face isn't hurting as bad. She's drinking water again. Going to mash up avocado because she will eat that. She doesn't love it but it's something she will eat small amounts of. We've tried everything over the years and she's so picky. She will eat some stuff but most she just looks at and won't touch. She seems to be holding her weight even tho she's not eating much. She ate a little overnight. She's super alert today and moving around. She got out of her nest by herself. Needed help getting back in but it's a start.

[Curliesmom2017]

Thank you all for the help. Curlies doing good and is getting better every minute. I can't believe she hit her head.

[Mel1959]

We've tried yogurt before. She won't touch it. She ate three sunflower seeds this morning. ( I read that seeds are bad.) No more seeds. Getting pine nuts instead. She yawned this morning which means her face isn't hurting as bad. She's drinking water again. Going to mash up avocado because she will eat that. She doesn't love it but it's something she will eat small amounts of. We've tried everything over the years and she's so picky. She will eat some stuff but most she just looks at and won't touch. She seems to be holding her weight even tho she's not eating much. She ate a little overnight. She's super alert today and moving around. She got out of her nest by herself. Needed help getting back in but it's a start.

Please DONT give her any pine nuts. They are THE WORST for calcium to phosphorus ratio. If she didn’t have metabolic bone disease before these would certainly give it to her, considering she’s not eating much.

It may just take a little time for her mouth to feel better if she’s not eating as a result of an injury. I’m sure the ibuprofen helps with any pain.

Have you ever given her boo balls made with ground block and baby food or just mixing baby food with some ground block and making it into a gruel that she could lap up? Many folks on here have to do this for squirrels that are missing teeth or won’t eat basic veggies.

Nuts should only be given as treats, but almonds are the “healthiest” (I use that term loosely) of all nuts.

[Curliesmom2017]

Please DONT give her any pine nuts. They are THE WORST for calcium to phosphorus ratio. If she didn’t have metabolic bone disease before these would certainly give it to her, considering she’s not eating much.

It may just take a little time for her mouth to feel better if she’s not eating as a result of an injury. I’m sure the ibuprofen helps with any pain.

Have you ever given her boo balls made with ground block and baby food or just mixing baby food with some ground block and making it into a gruel that she could lap up? Many folks on here have to do this for squirrels that are missing teeth or won’t eat basic veggies.

Nuts should only be given as treats, but almonds are the “healthiest” (I use that term loosely) of all nuts.

Okay. I won't get pine nuts. I thought they were safe because they're from pine trees?? She's still acting like her mouth hurts but she nibbled on a pecan from our tree outside. She's not touching much. But she's showing interest. I'll probably try some boo balls. She's tried them before and turned her nose up but maybe while she's hungry she'll try. Thanks. I'm trying. She is drinking water so that's something. And she ate an almond last night. She may have eaten more. We put nuts in there with her. She's been sleeping comfortably. From what we can tell she hit her face between her nose and her right eye. So it jarred her but didn't break anything. She's not needing the Motrin so that's good. She's no longer squeaking if you touch that spot.

[Rexie]

how is curley

[Curliesmom2017]

how is curley

We are doing good. She's almost back to normal. I'm giving her ultraboost everyday at least once. She will take about 8 ccs and then she gets angry at me. She will eat cucumber and sweet potato and corn. We are giving hhb's the picky ones bit she's not up to that yet. I'm going to make boo balls in a few days to see if she will take that. My 6 yr old boy is pretty much eating what we give him including the picky blocks. They seem to really like cucumber. Thanks for asking. :serene

[Curliesmom2017]

[QUOTE=Curliesmom2017;1246381]We are doing good. She's almost back to normal. I'm giving her ultraboost everyday at least once. She will take about 8 ccs and then she gets angry at me. She will eat cucumber and sweet potato and corn. We are giving hhb's the picky ones bit she's not up to that yet. I'm going to make boo balls in a few days to see if she will take that. My 6 yr old boy is pretty much eating what we give him including the picky blocks. They seem to really like cucumber. Thanks for asking. :serene[/QUOTE

Curlie

[CritterMom]

[QUOTE=Curliesmom2017;1246381]We are doing good. She's almost back to normal. I'm giving her ultraboost everyday at least once. She will take about 8 ccs and then she gets angry at me. She will eat cucumber and sweet potato and corn. We are giving hhb's the picky ones bit she's not up to that yet. I'm going to make boo balls in a few days to see if she will take that. My 6 yr old boy is pretty much eating what we give him including the picky blocks. They seem to really like cucumber. Thanks for asking. :serene[/QUOTE

Curlie

Oh good. Go easy on the corn. It is extremely unbalanced in the wrong direction calcium-wise, much like the pine nuts are.

[Curliesmom2017]

[QUOTE=Curliesmom2017;1246382]

Oh good. Go easy on the corn. It is extremely unbalanced in the wrong direction calcium-wise, much like the pine nuts are.

Today she wasn't doing as good. She's pretty much refusing regular food. So I've decided to feed her formula and ultra boost 3 or 4 times a day. She's just older and not feeling good. This evening she looked better. Trying to get her to stabilize her weight. Gave her some infant Motrin to see if that would help. She's a little painful but it's not mbd just age. Cried my eyes out and had a nightmare when I took a nap. :sadness we shall see what the morning brings.

[cava]

This is the worst part of having a furry friend, the times when they are sick or hurting and we can't make it go away. I'm rooting for her.:hug

[LR]

I hope she is feeling better today. Did you try making the boo balls yet? I have extra block HT2016 and powdered calcium if you need it. I also have chia seed oil, Ruby will eat anything I put it on.

This may be just a few hard days for her...

[Diggie's Friend]

chia seed oil, Ruby will eat anything I put it on.

Chia oil is high in Omega 3, having a postitive ratio to the amount of Omega 6 it contains. It is also non-goitrogenic (unlike flax seed), so it supports bone health.

[Diggie's Friend]

Recommend adding Organic Protein whey powder, that contains amino acids. Add an eighth portion of a serving noted as (20grams) 2500 grams, to Organic Plain Low fat yogurt, 1 to 2 Tsp. yogurt a day, splittng it into at least two portions if not three to feed during the day. Make sure the powder is fully mixed in with no clumps, for organic whey has no instantizing additives. Add some water to the mix to make it thin enough to give by non needle feeding syringe if you need to, taking care to feed it slowly to prevent aspiration into the lungs.

It has a good taste. Also include a measure of probiotics in this mix. Also sufficient Calcium powder into the mix, which I assume you have been giving also?

https://www.amazon.com/Organic-Whey-Protein-Powder-12/dp/B00407XYAW