Troubles gaining weight

[Squirrel]

I came into possession of a 4-week old (judging by photos) gray squirrel last Monday.

He is fed every 3 - 3 1/2 hours and averages anywhere between 2-3cc's per feeding.
He was extremely emaciated when I got him, so we've been increasing his intake
slowly over the course of the week. He's improved greatly from where he was and now
seems to have gone stagnant in his weight gain.

Food mix:
1 table-spoon Esbilac puppy formula ( powder )
2 table-spoons water ( from tap- water here if fed by a natural spring )
1cc Heavy Whipping Cream ( 3.5 Sat. Fats and 5g Fat )

Esbilac puppy formula is the kind with prebiotics and probiotics added in.
First 5 ingredients: Vegetable oil, casein, dried whey protein concentrate, cream, dried skim milk.

Formula is stirred and heated in the syringe using a bowl of hot water
or the heating pad he sleeps on. I've read micro-waving it can mess with the proteins
in the formula or something like that. We have not had an issue with diarrhea, loose stools, etc.
His poops come out well formed and the color they're suppose to be. Which is why we've
kept him on Esbilac-- I also haven't had luck getting Fox Valley.

I stimulate after every feeding and usually get a poop every, to every other feeding. He pees
every time I stimulate. The pee is usually clear, but sometimes has a slight tinge to it.

OTHER RELEVANT INFO:
He was taken a vet yesterday for a ticking noise which I know usually signals an upper respiratory.
He was prescribed baytril and the ticking has since subsided. He gets .2ccs twice a day. He weighed
41 grams.

The vet told me to:
- Feed as much as he wants ( which caused bloating the last time We did it, which is why we've gone slow )
- Remove heavy whipping cream due to sugar content (cream has less than 1gram of carbs and 0 sugar)
- Didn't think he was ill until I insisted about the ticking sound.
- Had no idea what fox valley was or why I chose a puppy formula with specific ingredients



Is there something I am missing or not doing that is preventing this baby from putting on some real weight?
His last Formula feeding was at 10am. He ate 2.5cc's.

I replaced his 1pm feeding with watered down pedialyte, as a lot of what I read suggest he may just be dehydrated.
If that is the case, how do I keep him hydrated enough between meals that he actually puts on weight? I was giving him
a few ccs of water in between his feedings, but that didn't seem to be doing anything, so I added in a small amount of
pedialyte.

Will upload photos in a moment. Thanks in advance!

[Squirrel]

Here are some photos, if I loaded them up right.

[ALittleNutty]

Sounds like you are moving in the right direction. I may have missed it but do you have a weight on the baby so we can make sure he's getting the right amount per feeding. I have a feeling that at 4 weeks he's not taking in as much as he should.

The Fox Valley has to be ordered online. You can get it at http://www.henryspets.com/ . Since shipping is flat I would add a bag of Healthy Blocks since it won't be long before you should start introducing these. I love using Ultraboost to add to the formula to help with weight gain.

Edited: Just saw the pics and that baby is way too skinny.

[Squirrel]

Sounds like you are moving in the right direction. I may have missed it but do you have a weight on the baby so we can make sure he's getting the right amount per feeding. I have a feeling that at 4 weeks he's not taking in as much as he should.

The Fox Valley has to be ordered online. You can get it at http://www.henryspets.com/ . Since shipping is flat I would add a bag of Healthy Blocks since it won't be long before you should start introducing these. I love using Ultraboost to add to the formula to help with weight gain.

Edited: Just saw the pics and that baby is way too skinny.


I've tried ordering the Fox valley online. I'm not sure whether it my location or internet, but the orders just go poof when I hit submit.
I'll try the website you've provided too and pray to the internet gods it goes through this time. I live in a brand new neighborhood in
the middle of nowhere. There are, literally, six of us out here on different acreages.

And I know he is way too skinny. He has put on a tiny bit of weight since yesterday, but nothing significant-- not like he should be.
I was hoping for some advice or something on fixing this.

[ALittleNutty]

Do you have a weight for him?

I can offer some help but I need to know weight. I've got to go feed my two so I'll be back in just a bit.

[Squirrel]

Do you have a weight for him?


He hovers between 41/43 grams.

[ALittleNutty]

Ok, you are right on at 3cc's per feeding for his weight. He can have slightly more each time as long as he doesn't bloat(hard belly). A full belly still has a little give like a balloon. I would feed every 3 hours.

What's your feeding schedule like? What time of day are you starting and what time is his last feeding at night?

If you can get an order through I would go ahead and get the Ultraboost from Henry's. It's what I add for all my pinkies and it really helps them gain.

[Sara in NW MS]

When you order the FV formula and blocks order a bag of Ultra Boost. You can add a little to the formula and that will help him gain weight.

Have you been weighing him since you got him? I mean, has he not gained at all or are you just guessing he hasn't? Sorry if you have been weighing him since day one, sometimes we have to assume babies haven't been weighed because most people don't have a scale.

I've always heard the esbilac is the best formula to have these little ones on. I know a lot of us mix FV and esbilac 50/50 but I usually do that when they get a little older.

I hope you can get some weight on him, he sure is cute.

[Mommaluvy]

Ok, you are right on at 3cc's per feeding for his weight. He can have slightly more each time as long as he doesn't bloat(hard belly). A full belly still has a little give like a balloon. I would feed every 3 hours.

What's your feeding schedule like? What time of day are you starting and what time is his last feeding at night?

If you can get an order through I would go ahead and get the Ultraboost from Henry's. It's what I add for all my pinkies and it really helps them gain.

Ditto. Although the formula with the heavy cream is ok too.
I however have not had luck adding ultra boost or HC to mine as it always caused diahrea for my pinks. Maybe it's a geographic thing . Could certainly try it and see.

Also weigh him daily before the first feeding.

If he took the hydration fluid I would not skip his meal. Just give it an hour to settle in his belly and then offer. He should be hydrated by now. But extra water never hurts. I would use maybe diluted formula at this point or a smidge of sugar water as he does not need the extra salts in pedialyte.

It's my experience most vets do not have a clue about squirrels or squirrel nutrition. But the baytril was spot on. Glad you insisted.

[Squirrel]

Ok, you are right on at 3cc's per feeding for his weight. He can have slightly more each time as long as he doesn't bloat(hard belly). A full belly still has a little give like a balloon. I would feed every 3 hours.

What's your feeding schedule like? What time of day are you starting and what time is his last feeding at night?

If you can get an order through I would go ahead and get the Ultraboost from Henry's. It's what I add for all my pinkies and it really helps them gain.


I do currently feed every 3 hours.
Should I give him more time between feedings if he still has a prominent milk belly, or go ahead with his feeding anyway?

He average 2.5ccs, but the last few times he was able to take just shy of 3ccs without any bloating. We struggled with bloating earlier in the
week, which is why I have been careful about increasing the amount he gets.

His first feeding of the day is at 8AM and his last is usually at 12PM, which is my usual day schedule. I do offer a feeding once a night at 3/4AM, due to how skinny he is.

He gets his Baytril at 7:30AM in the morning and his second dose at 7:30PM for his respiratory infection.

[Mommaluvy]

Also.. In hindsight you said he was extremely emaciated when you got him.. How did you work him up to ful strength formula?

Are the pictures from before or after ?

[Squirrel]

When you order the FV formula and blocks order a bag of Ultra Boost. You can add a little to the formula and that will help him gain weight.

Have you been weighing him since you got him? I mean, has he not gained at all or are you just guessing he hasn't? Sorry if you have been weighing him since day one, sometimes we have to assume babies haven't been weighed because most people don't have a scale.

I've always heard the esbilac is the best formula to have these little ones on. I know a lot of us mix FV and esbilac 50/50 but I usually do that when they get a little older.

I hope you can get some weight on him, he sure is cute.

Mostly guessing.
He looks, visibly, more fleshed out than when I got him. He was as wide as my pinky finger
and now he is a bit more broad than it. Yesterday was the first official weigh I've gotten of him
BUT I get my scale tomorrow, so I'll be able to weigh him to better track the ups and downs.

[Mommaluvy]

I do currently feed every 3 hours.
Should I give him more time between feedings if he still has a prominent milk belly, or go ahead with his feeding anyway?

He average 2.5ccs, but the last few times he was able to take just shy of 3ccs without any bloating. We struggled with bloating earlier in the
week, which is why I have been careful about increasing the amount he gets.

His first feeding of the day is at 8AM and his last is usually at 12PM, which is my usual day schedule. I do offer a feeding once a night at 3/4AM, due to how skinny he is.

He gets his Baytril at 7:30AM in the morning and his second dose at 7:30PM for his respiratory infection.

If he is having trouble digesting I would start offering dilute formula. I get a jar and pull up .75 of milky formula and then get that jar of water and pull up .25 of water. I would try that every 3 hours and that should get his milk line moving. For 3 cc you would repeat that 3 times.

How are his poops? Color? Consistency?

[DarkLies212]

I didn't see this while skimming the thread, but if you're still having ordering problems, you can call Henry's and place your order over the phone. Leigh is SUPER nice there :hug

[Mommaluvy]

Just noted a thing in your original post .. And I see you already answere the poop question.


Formula is stirred and heated in the syringe using a bowl of hot water
or the heating pad he sleeps on. I've read micro-waving it can mess with the proteins
in the formula or something like that. We have not had an issue with diarrhea, loose stools, etc.
His poops come out well formed and the color they're suppose to be.

Cool formula can cause bloat and slow digestion. The formula should be mixed at least 4 hours ahead of time to allow for proper dissolution .

What I do is boil water in a coffee mug. I use a coffer tea water boiler. Then I pour the formula for the feeding into small glass jar.. Jelly jar.. Baby food jar something like that. Then I float that formula jar in the bowl / mug of hot water. Now since I rehab and I do this all the time I then sit that on a coffer mug warmer that keeps that water hot.

I have heard of people heating it in the syringe but they usual have syringe caps on to keep the formula from leeching into the hot water.

The heating pad is not going to make the formula hot enough. They like it around 100'

[Squirrel]

Also.. In hindsight you said he was extremely emaciated when you got him.. How did you work him up to ful strength formula?

Are the pictures from before or after ?

We ran him through re-hydration for about a day. I was told by other rehabbers (before I found this website) to start switching him
over to formula by mixing it with the pedialyte a little bit at a time, but he reacted badly to that, very quickly.

I backed off the feedings and did warm belly-rub baths until his bloating subsided and then worked with just very diluted formula up
from there. He has been on full strength formula since and then I started adding in the Heavy Whipping Cream .1 cc at a time.

He has been on the mix stated above for 2 1/2 days.

The pictures are of AFTER I got him. Believe it or not, he looks like a brand new squirrel from where he was before. I kept waking up thinking
he'd be passed away, but he keeps trucking.

As for his poops, they're usually light brown-- not yellow. Maybe a dark gold color. I'm including a picture of color that closest matches
what his look like.

They aren't watery or soft, generally well formed. He doesn't have any trouble passing them when I stimulate him after eating.

I'll heat his formula up a little more than usual this next feeding and see if that is my issue for his slow digestion.

[Mommaluvy]

And I would stay with the esbilac. It's my understanding TSB no longer recommends the use of FV for pinkies or eyes closed 32/40.

If you order the FV get the 20/50. But esbilac does just fine.

[ALittleNutty]

Schedule sounds good. If his milk line is still prominent at 3 hours you can stretch it out to 3.5. It's okay if you can still see a sliver of it. Diluting the formula a bit is okay if he's having trouble digesting it. You are feeding right at 6.5-7% which is recommended but not an absolute rule. As long as he doesn't bloat or get runny stools he can have more, just go up 1 or 2 tenths at a time.

There is a big difference between a full belly and bloat. Full usually expands side to side but bloat is usually rounded on the front like a beer gut. Full has a little give to it but bloat feels hard and tight.

I agree many vets don't really know a lot about squirrel care but it's good you got the AB's for him.

As for the cream, I only use it with the homemade goat's milk formula and just for a few days until I can get Esbilac in if I just happen to be out. The little girl I had didn't gain a single gram on that but after starting her on Esbilac with UB she's gained 2g every day. After eyes are open I do transition the 50/50 mixture of Esbilac and FV 20/50. I've done both independently and I see better gains using the 50/50.

[Mommaluvy]

We ran him through re-hydration for about a day. I was told by other rehabbers (before I found this website) to start switching him
over to formula by mixing it with the pedialyte a little bit at a time, but he reacted badly to that, very quickly.

I backed off the feedings and did warm belly-rub baths until his bloating subsided and then worked with just very diluted formula up
from there. He has been on full strength formula since and then I started adding in the Heavy Whipping Cream .1 cc at a time.

He has been on the mix stated above for 2 1/2 days.

The pictures are of AFTER I got him. Believe it or not, he looks like a brand new squirrel from where he was before. I kept waking up thinking
he'd be passed away, but he keeps trucking.

As for his poops, they're usually light brown-- not yellow. Maybe a dark gold color. I'm including a picture of color that closest matches
what his look like.

They aren't watery or soft, generally well formed. He doesn't have any trouble passing them when I stimulate him after eating.

I'll heat his formula up a little more than usual this next feeding and see if that is my issue for his slow digestion.

Sounds good.
Yes that's almost the right way.. To mix it with pedialyte is very outdated advice. Most rehabbers now a days just use plain water when building up to full strength . If he was bloating THAT could have been the cause. There is a reaction between the pedialyte and the formula. I actually did that with my first squirrel . In his cause it did not cause bloat but in the next squirrel it did. Then I got training :)

Sounds like you pulled the pedialyte out and just used dilute formula. Good thinking. And I hope the warmer formula fixes it. I would hate to keep any calories from this guy but there is a saying " better underfed than dead" . Meaning sometimes it just takes longer for super thin squirrels to gain and adjust to the formula cause they were so so skinny..,

[ALittleNutty]

And I would stay with the esbilac. It's my understanding TSB no longer recommends the use of FV for pinkies or eyes closed 32/40.

If you order the FV get the 20/50. But esbilac does just fine.

You are so right. I still use FV 32/40 for my adult flyers and it is extremely hard to dissolve. I would never use it on pinkies again.

[ALittleNutty]

One thing I forgot to ask earlier is what are you using to feed him? Hopefully a 1cc o-ring syringe. They don't stick as bad as others. For babies this age I love the miracle nipples. Expensive but worth it since the squirrels don't seem to bite through them as easily after they get teeth. He would need the regular size. My second choice is the silicone mothering nipples.

[Mommaluvy]

You are so right. I still use FV 32/40 for my adult flyers and it is extremely hard to dissolve. I would never use it on pinkies again.

I lost three pinks this year on that.. I thought the problem had been resolved and it was not. I was able to save the fourth by switching formulas just in time.

[Squirrel]

One thing I forgot to ask earlier is what are you using to feed him? Hopefully a 1cc o-ring syringe. They don't stick as bad as others. For babies this age I love the miracle nipples. Expensive but worth it since the squirrels don't seem to bite through them as easily after they get teeth. He would need the regular size. My second choice is the silicone mothering nipples.



I have a whole bundle of the 1cc o-ring syringes
Then I have 3cc syringes, but I don't use those if I can avoid it since they do start sticking quickly.

[ALittleNutty]

I lost three pinks this year on that.. I thought the problem had been resolved and it was not. I was able to save the fourth by switching formulas just in time.

I am so sorry! Yeah I think several thought they had corrected it. I guess since I was still using it on the flyers I was able to tell it had not changed. After I mix it up and let it sit it forms a thick skin on top with blue spots which told me it still wasn't like it used to be so I didn't not even consider using it when I got 2 pinkies this spring.

[ALittleNutty]

I have a whole bundle of the 1cc o-ring syringes
Then I have 3cc syringes, but I don't use those if I can avoid it since they do start sticking quickly.

Good deal! A sticky syringe is the worst and can easily cause aspiration. As he gets bigger you will find you have to hold the plunger back to keep him from sucking it down so fast. :grin2

[Squirrel]

Just curious: Are all baby squirrels so ticklish? I swear I can't even brush his chin free of formula without him thumping that little paw.

[ALittleNutty]

Just curious: Are all baby squirrels so ticklish? I swear I can't even brush his chin free of formula without him thumping that little paw.

Oh yes! :laugh2 At first they really are. Squirmy too! Sometimes it's like trying to hold a greased pig. When they get a little more used to being handled they are so adorable when they let you stroke them and they fall sound asleep in your arms or on your chest. Nothing sweeter!

[Squirrel]

First off I would like to say THANK YOU for all the advice given so far. I am hoping you won't
mind me troubling you a bit more.

Baby boys stools have gone a little soft and turned yellow. There are two reasons I am thinking
this could be, but I'm not sure:

Reason 1:
I have started to remove the Heavy Whipping Cream from the milk in preparation of getting the
Fox Valley Ultraboost within the next two days. Maybe I have done it too fast, in which case his
belly is upset by the change? And if that is the case, do I just add the cream back in and start
over?

Reason 2:
One eye has opened and he has put on a bit of weight-- he is still underweight, mind you, but
not as severely as he was before and every day he looks a bit less emaciated. I was suppose
to get my scale wednesday, but it got postponed to the weekend. I'm wondering if maybe his
feedings are grouped together too closely now..


I just don't want this stool to turn into diarrhea.

[Daisey007]

I guess I simply don't understand the feeding instructions... I have just never had the problems with feeding that I read about here. :dono I've never had an issue with a baby gaining weight, or failing to thrive. So, I looked at 'some' (some) of the instructions posted, and I wonder why various things are done. I see things being added to a formula and then being abruptly removed later... I have to say that is not at all the way I feed 'healthy' babies. I find a good formula, and I start them off it and that's what they will consume until I start transitioning on to rodent blocks/chow (not to be confused with HHB's) with fruits and vegetables, and the only thing I change is volume. Changing a formula around has a tendency to cause diarrhea, and doing it repeatedly is asking for problems. I'd just like to remind people that everyone has an opinion... and if a person jumps around trying to follow all opinions then the babies are going to suffer. Also, with the exception of transitioning onto new formula from mothers milk, I disagree with heavily restricting intake. Of course, we don't want to cause bloat, so I don't advise extreme feedings but if a baby is not gaining weight - you increase their intake of their already 'nutrient rich' formula, not add a lot of excess fat and sugar... neither of which is good for them. And yes, I know what they say about opinions... this IS my opinion. :grouphug

[ALittleNutty]

First off I would like to say THANK YOU for all the advice given so far. I am hoping you won't
mind me troubling you a bit more.

Baby boys stools have gone a little soft and turned yellow. There are two reasons I am thinking
this could be, but I'm not sure:

Reason 1:
I have started to remove the Heavy Whipping Cream from the milk in preparation of getting the
Fox Valley Ultraboost within the next two days. Maybe I have done it too fast, in which case his
belly is upset by the change? And if that is the case, do I just add the cream back in and start
over?

Reason 2:
One eye has opened and he has put on a bit of weight-- he is still underweight, mind you, but
not as severely as he was before and every day he looks a bit less emaciated. I was suppose
to get my scale wednesday, but it got postponed to the weekend. I'm wondering if maybe his
feedings are grouped together too closely now..


I just don't want this stool to turn into diarrhea.

Usually paler and looser stools is a sign of overfeeding. I don't think removing the whipping cream is the cause.

How much is he taking each feeding? I know you don't have your scale yet so we can't go by weight.

[ALittleNutty]

I guess I simply don't understand the feeding instructions... I have just never had the problems with feeding that I read about here. :dono I've never had an issue with a baby gaining weight, or failing to thrive. So, I looked at 'some' (some) of the instructions posted, and I wonder why various things are done. I see things being added to a formula and then being abruptly removed later... I have to say that is not at all the way I feed 'healthy' babies. I find a good formula, and I start them off it and that's what they will consume until I start transitioning on to rodent blocks/chow (not to be confused with HHB's) with fruits and vegetables, and the only thing I change is volume. Changing a formula around has a tendency to cause diarrhea, and doing it repeatedly is asking for problems. I'd just like to remind people that everyone has an opinion... and if a person jumps around trying to follow all opinions then the babies are going to suffer. Also, with the exception of transitioning onto new formula from mothers milk, I disagree with heavily restricting intake. Of course, we don't want to cause bloat, so I don't advise extreme feedings but if a baby is not gaining weight - you increase their intake of their already 'nutrient rich' formula, not add a lot of excess fat and sugar... neither of which is good for them. And yes, I know what they say about opinions... this IS my opinion. :grouphug


My standard protocol is to rehydrate with homemade solution. Then start them on Esbilac and adding Ultraboost for emaciated pinkies. On the rare occasions that I am caught without Esbilac I will start them on the GM formula and transition slowly over to the Esbilac. I start out at the 5% and work up from there slowly. I'll let mine eat as much as they want as long as they don't bloat or get loose stools. I see very consistent gains using this method. I will offer formula until they flat out refuse it even after they start on blocks and veggies. I agree adding this and that and too many changes is just asking for digestive issues. The healthier they go out into the world the better chance they have.

[Squirrel]

Usually paler and looser stools is a sign of overfeeding. I don't think removing the whipping cream is the cause.

How much is he taking each feeding? I know you don't have your scale yet so we can't go by weight.



He averages 2.5 ccs and occasionally 3ccs. His last feeding, which was at 1pm, he took 2.3 ccs.

I haven't made any significant changes to his food or routine, other than heating the formula up a
bit than usual (as was suggested by a member) and giving him an extra 30 minutes if his belly is
still very round with milk.

I'm only removing the heavy whipping cream, so I can add the ultra-boost in its place, which was
also suggested to me. Otherwise his feeding routine and everything else has stayed the same. This
baby is still emaciated, which is why I am choosing the UB over the cream.

Although his last poop was a very long one, which I read could be a sign of an intestinal bug?

[ALittleNutty]

It's not a sign of a bug. It's just a little softer than it should be. We just don't want watery poop.

[Squirrel]

It's not a sign of a bug. It's just a little softer than it should be. We just don't want watery poop.

Alright, cool. His poops are usually pretty regular in appearance and consistency. This one wasn't watery or pasty and it was -slightly- less yellow
than his two previous poops, it was just LONG. Seemed like a lot of poop for such a tiny butt.

I was going to extend feeding times to 3.5/4 hours on average and see if that didn't correct the issue.

His upper incisors have started to grow out (I can see them when I open his mouth) and he has one eye almost completely open.
When would you suggest introducing solids, given his rough start on gaining weight? I've gotten a lot of contradictory info out there.

Some say as soon as eyes open, others say not before 7 weeks..

[ALittleNutty]

Alright, cool. His poops are usually pretty regular in appearance and consistency. This one wasn't watery or pasty and it was -slightly- less yellow
than his two previous poops, it was just LONG. Seemed like a lot of poop for such a tiny butt.

I was going to extend feeding times to 3.5/4 hours on average and see if that didn't correct the issue.

His upper incisors have started to grow out (I can see them when I open his mouth) and he has one eye almost completely open.
When would you suggest introducing solids, given his rough start on gaining weight? I've gotten a lot of contradictory info out there.

Some say as soon as eyes open, others say not before 7 weeks..

I'd move to 4 hours at his age and you can go ahead and start introducing blocks. Most of us start with the ones' from Henry's Healthy Pets. At first he will shred them, hide them, pee on them and pretty much waste them so I recommend cutting them into 4 pieces at first. Once he is consistently eating his blocks then you can start introducing veggies. I like to start with dark leafy greens and then start adding other veggies.

You can click on the link and there is another link to print the PDF file.

http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?44440-Healthy-Diet-for-Pet-Squirrels