HELP!!!!!!!!

[Mybabypeanut]

Peanut is my baby. She is a seizure baby. Yesterday i gave her a treat of 2 nuts instead of one and today she shows MBD signs very strongly. Her diet is esbilac formula 20 ml, henrys blocks one per day, veggies and fruit but she is picky and 1 nut per day. she takes pheno daily. I was told she didnt need cal or vit d due to her diet.....obviously thats not so. She is wobbly when she walks and wants to sleep now. I gave her 100iu of vit d and a whole tums in her formulas. I got most of it in her. What can I do now? Vet will be here monday.

[HRT4SQRLS]

I doubt this is MBD. It might be a side effect of the phenobarbitol.
MBD is from low calcium or a high phosphorus diet. One extra nut will NOT cause MBD overnight. 20 cc of formula and a Henry's block gives Peanut all the calcium she needs.

I would be very careful giving VitD. It is used as a rodenticide.

[Mybabypeanut]

I don't understand the classic MBD symtoms with her diet. If its pheno how long will it affect her like this. Shes been on it for months.

Ive given her 10 ml formula, 1/2 block, 1 tums and 200 ui of D. I have no improvement at all.

thank you

[CritterMom]

PLEASE stop giving all of the vitamin D!!

The amount of D needed to metabolize calcium is very, very small and there is more than enough in the Henry's blocks alone, even if you are adding additional calcium to treat for MBD. Vitamin D in larger amounts is used as a rodenticide - that is, something to KILL rodents. Do not give her any more, and as long as she is eating the HHBs you don't EVER need to give her any additional.

Can you give us some more history on her? If you have a thread on the board already with that info, just link to it.

[CritterMom]

OK, I found some of your threads.

Can you increase the amount of the Henry's blocks you give her to two a day - if that means she eats less veggies that is OK.

What specific symptoms are you seeing now? The wobbliness could be weakness from a seizure. You do know about giving her a pop of sugar of some kind after a seizure, right? It can be molasses, pancake syrup, corn syrup, even table sugar mashed up in a drop or two of water until it is just barely liquid. All you need to do is get a couple drops in her mouth - she doesn't even have to swallow it as it will absorb through the mucous membranes in the mouth. The blood sugar boost will help her recover from the seizure more quickly.

[Mybabypeanut]

OK, I found some of your threads.

Can you increase the amount of the Henry's blocks you give her to two a day - if that means she eats less veggies that is OK.

What specific symptoms are you seeing now? The wobbliness could be weakness from a seizure. You do know about giving her a pop of sugar of some kind after a seizure, right? It can be molasses, pancake syrup, corn syrup, even table sugar mashed up in a drop or two of water until it is just barely liquid. All you need to do is get a couple drops in her mouth - she doesn't even have to swallow it as it will absorb through the mucous membranes in the mouth. The blood sugar boost will help her recover from the seizure more quickly.

Yes, I can increase to 2 blocks a day. I have the vet coming Monday due to all this and Im getting her teeth trimmed too. I don' think they are terribly, out of control long but bottoms are about 3/4 inch with top normal. I think its disturbing her eating since in the last week more of the block seems to go in the floor then in her mouth. Therefore, i have been syringe feeding her crushed block mixed with esbilac formula.

She is on phenobarb for last 3 months. First 15 then 20 because at 15 she still had zeizure. In the beginning the seizures were mild but they increased in intensity till we had no choice but pheno. We increased about 3 weeks ago and now this. Could this be hypoglycemia. I ask this because I may have been doing something stupid. I know molasses has calcium and helps with seizures so we added a small amount to her formula. She gets molasses...small amount...at every formula feeding. Could that be the problem? Can I reverse it quickly by taking the molasses away. IMG I cannot believe I am just now thinking of this. On the D I have only given 2 drops (100 iu)in 3 months because I fear it building up in system. I know these symtoms now are not vit D related because I didnt give till after she became wobbly. Now she gets up, stretches real big, trys to bathe and falls over, tries to walk and is very wobbly. She is very tired all the time. I was concerned about the amount of potty time she had but last night she deposited a lot of poop. It was very normal in size, color, density. Last night I gave her a small amount of coconut oil from natural store. Its a dense type oil that melts in your hand and smells like Hawaii. I put a little on her skin also because where we scratch her behind her ears the hair is half the length of other areas. I read if it was due to a fungus, ect the coconut oil could help. I have noticed her shaking her head a bit more then in the past and also using her back paw to scratch around her mouth it seems. Thats another reason why I want the vet to trim teeth. I am hyper vigilant when it comes to her. She is seen by the vet monthly for whatever she may need. Sometimes two times a month. She is my baby. She picked me to save her and I love and adore her more then anything in life. Oh, I also mashed avocado with some formula and tried feeding to her but she must be the one squirrel that despises avocado....Ive tried it before. I have not been as good as Im going to be about her light. The UVA/UVB light. I put her under it tonight for about an hour with her face and head covered. Am I missing anything? Can you recommend anything? Will you tell me...am I losing her? thank u so much.

[SugarHill]

i doubt the molasses would cause this...it might not hurt to do just formula without the molasses for the next 24 hours or so, to see if it helps?
We are sending many prayers your way :Love_Icon

[CritterMom]

It does have a lot of iron and selenium. I doubt it is causing problems, but if you want to add a little sweetness to make her like the formula more, you can try a little honey. If she eats her formula well, you likely aren't looking at a hypoglycemia issue - that is normally brought on by not enough food.

I still tend to think this may be seizure related more than food or MBD related. She may need to have her meds adjusted again.

There is sometimes a link between seizure activity and blood levels of magnesium. It seems that some people - and animals too - either don't metabolize magnesium properly or perhaps they just burn through it faster than usual, and when their magnesium intake is increased, their seizure activity decreases. The HHBs have the proper amount of magnesium for a NORMAL squirrel but that might not be enoough for Peanut. I don't know how much reading you have done here at TSB, but Stosh and RamaMama in Costa Rica have a seizure squirrel named JD and additional magnesium has brought the number of seizures he has WAY down and now he normally only has issues if he is frightened by something. It is a pretty benign thing to try. You would need to find plain magnesium - it is sold by itself as a supplement - and we could help you dilute the pills and dose. Basically you would start with a small dose and slowly increase it until you find the dose that helps. It likely would never replace the pheno but it might allow you to decrease the dose if it works. If you are interested, just google "magnesium for seizures" and you will find lots of information.

My squirrel doesn't like avocado either!

[Mybabypeanut]

It does have a lot of iron and selenium. I doubt it is causing problems, but if you want to add a little sweetness to make her like the formula more, you can try a little honey. If she eats her formula well, you likely aren't looking at a hypoglycemia issue - that is normally brought on by not enough food.

I still tend to think this may be seizure related more than food or MBD related. She may need to have her meds adjusted again.

There is sometimes a link between seizure activity and blood levels of magnesium. It seems that some people - and animals too - either don't metabolize magnesium properly or perhaps they just burn through it faster than usual, and when their magnesium intake is increased, their seizure activity decreases. The HHBs have the proper amount of magnesium for a NORMAL squirrel but that might not be enoough for Peanut. I don't know how much reading you have done here at TSB, but Stosh and RamaMama in Costa Rica have a seizure squirrel named JD and additional magnesium has brought the number of seizures he has WAY down and now he normally only has issues if he is frightened by something. It is a pretty benign thing to try. You would need to find plain magnesium - it is sold by itself as a supplement - and we could help you dilute the pills and dose. Basically you would start with a small dose and slowly increase it until you find the dose that helps. It likely would never replace the pheno but it might allow you to decrease the dose if it works. If you are interested, just google "magnesium for seizures" and you will find lots of information.

My squirrel doesn't like avocado either!

Thank goodness the molasses isn't the issue. I would never forgive myself if I harmed her in any way. I'm still removing it from her formula though. She has still not improved. Lethargy/sleeping 24 hours unless I wake her. Its hard to wake her up. She has slept all day today. She eats/drinks her meals every time I offer it but husband says I'm over feeding her. I disagree...when she is done eating she turns her head or pulls away. The last time I checked she was still not able to bathe herself without falling over, back area and legs still not working right, even sitting she starts to lean over and fall. I haven't checked her walking in 4-5 hours because is stresses her out. She isn't seizing and hasn't for almost a month. I am going to cut back on the pheno starting tonight. Maybe its built up in her system? Like Vit D does. I have not noticed any pooping today but last night she had a poop fest. She usually goes all day long though. Is her system shutting down? Am I losing her?

Yes please tell me about the magnesium. I will do anything, take her anywhere to get better.

thank you

[Mybabypeanut]

Could this be hypo/hyper glycemia or diabetes?

[Mel1959]

My squirrel, Joey, had an issue about a week ago that sounded similar, in that he all of a sudden woke up one morning and his rear legs were uncoordinated and he toppled over when trying to clean himself. I wasn't sure what to attribute it to, I had been giving some additional vitamin d. After speaking with a squirrel knowledgeable vet she said that vitamin d is not readily absorbed by these little guys so she didn't suspect that was a problem. My little guy had taken a fall of a very short distance that could have been responsible for his uncoordination or it could have been a seizure. I gave sugar water, cut out all additional vitamin d and continued feeding Henry's formula and after a few days he recovered. He also had some congestion and the vet put him on Baytril, I don't know if that played a role or not. I should mention that my little guy, Joey, is a dwarf squirrel and I have no confirmed knowledge that he has ever had a seizure, I just know all of a sudden one morning he couldn't use his rear legs correctly and I had been administering extra calcium with vitamin d prior to his uncoordination. I hope your little Peanut recovers quickly. I know exactly how helpless you feel and how you are questioning everything you could have done that might have caused this. I did the same thing. My prayers are with you and Peanut, I hope she gets better soon.

[SammysMom]

I do NOT know that vitamin D played a part in either case, but just to be clear about vitamin D. It is fat soluble so it doesn't flush out of the system like other vitamins can. It stores in the body fat and can build up over time to levels that are not good for rodents.
Prayers for speedy recovery!:grouphug

[Mybabypeanut]

I do NOT know that vitamin D played a part in either case, but just to be clear about vitamin D. It is fat soluble so it doesn't flush out of the system like other vitamins can. It stores in the body fat and can build up over time to levels that are not good for rodents.
Prayers for speedy recovery!:grouphug

Ive only given her 200iu in 3 months so I dont think thats the issue here. I woke her at 8am and she drank a little formula. She is still falling over, seems down in back legs. I will give the extra calcium today and put her under the lamp as much as possible. I want to strart taking outside in a cage completly protected to get natural vitamin D. I read somewhere it takes 80,000 iu to cause death of rodent but I still fear giving it to her even at just 100iu doses. I didnt give her pheno dose last night and Im going to wait till 11am and give her 1/2 a dose. I dont know if pheno builds up or not. She was eating a block every day and is still on esbilac formula. I chose not to wean her off because of the vitamins in it. She so seems like she is suffering from MBD but her diet has been full of calcium and vitamin D in the formula and henry blocks. Im praying sun helps. Its such a scary road we are on. She is still very lethargic and is shaking her head and scratching around mouth area. Her teath are not 3/4in long but Im getting them trimmed Monday anyhow. A few weeks ago the vet gave her Vitamin B shot and she zipped around for 2 days almost nonstop and now this. What does anyone think of the Vit B given by vet? What can I do to get her better?

[Mybabypeanut]

My squirrel, Joey, had an issue about a week ago that sounded similar, in that he all of a sudden woke up one morning and his rear legs were uncoordinated and he toppled over when trying to clean himself. I wasn't sure what to attribute it to, I had been giving some additional vitamin d. After speaking with a squirrel knowledgeable vet she said that vitamin d is not readily absorbed by these little guys so she didn't suspect that was a problem. My little guy had taken a fall of a very short distance that could have been responsible for his uncoordination or it could have been a seizure. I gave sugar water, cut out all additional vitamin d and continued feeding Henry's formula and after a few days he recovered. He also had some congestion and the vet put him on Baytril, I don't know if that played a role or not. I should mention that my little guy, Joey, is a dwarf squirrel and I have no confirmed knowledge that he has ever had a seizure, I just know all of a sudden one morning he couldn't use his rear legs correctly and I had been administering extra calcium with vitamin d prior to his uncoordination. I hope your little Peanut recovers quickly. I know exactly how helpless you feel and how you are questioning everything you could have done that might have caused this. I did the same thing. My prayers are with you and Peanut, I hope she gets better soon.




I am praying she will snap out of this. Im starting the morning of day 2 but I think the day before she was starting to have the wobbly issues. I will sure take any advice. thank you

[pixiepoo]

Hi again! I'm not sure if you got my reply to your PM but I really don't think this is diet related since she is getting so much formula. The large quantity of formula will, however, cause her to eat less of the other foods you give her, such as blocks and healthy veggies. If she has always had seizures, she may continue to have problems as you don't really know the extent of her head injury or the exact cause of the seizures. The pheno will certainly cause her to sleep more, as will the weather.

I'm not sure about her hair loss but it could be related to diet or maybe fleas/mites. Hopefully your vet can take a better look at it tomorrow :)

Good luck

[Mybabypeanut]

Hi again! I'm not sure if you got my reply to your PM but I really don't think this is diet related since she is getting so much formula. The large quantity of formula will, however, cause her to eat less of the other foods you give her, such as blocks and healthy veggies. If she has always had seizures, she may continue to have problems as you don't really know the extent of her head injury or the exact cause of the seizures. The pheno will certainly cause her to sleep more, as will the weather.

I'm not sure about her hair loss but it could be related to diet or maybe fleas/mites. Hopefully your vet can take a better look at it tomorrow :)

Good luck

I have answered the PMs that Ive gotten but I dont think Im getting them all. I know that her diet is perfect to not develop MBD HOWEVER I did some research on phenobarbital and it is know for depleting calcium AND vit D and vit K. I am supplimenting her calcium again and I did give her 200 iu of vitamin D. Thats all the extra D she has gotten in 3 months. It took a day but yesterday she got up and the wobbly was gone. She stayed up a few hours ate a little block and formula and went back to bed.

Today she is herself. She is eating like she hasn't had a meal in a month. She ate her AM block and a egg yolk and drank her formula and nibbled around on her fruits and veggies. She loves apples and ate some of that today and yesterday. I think I may get her some apple sauce with calcium in it. I have taken away nuts all together. She gets some in her Henry blocks. I don't want her to have anything that depletes calcium.

I'm still looking for anyone's ideas. She is a seizure baby, takes 15 peho twice a day, supplemental calcium, lots of good veggies, fruits, Henry block that I'm trying to up to twice a day. She gets vit D in her cream in the formula and I try to find foods she will eat with Vit D and Vit K. And sunlight. Im buying a small pen she can go outside with me for an hour a day. Anybody have any other ideas?