Teeth AGAIN!!!

[SammysMom]

Last winter we spent hauling Twitch back and forth to the vet for teeth to be trimmed. It looks like this winter we will spend doing the same with Stubbie and Ruthie (aka Ruth Buzzie because she buzzes like a hive full of happy bees every time she sees me). These are worse than Twitch's teeth... :sad
Prayers for them would be appreciated. It looks like one of Ruthie's teeth splintered when cut. This is what the vet's email said...
"Both squirrels have overgrown incisors slanting to the right on the uppers, left on the lowers. The first two photos (sideways) are the squirrel in the small carrier, the other 2 are the squirrel in the larger cage. I trimmed them both back, but I agree that we should try to do it once every 1-2 weeks until they correct."
This is a real improvement over his outlook on Twitch's teeth. He didn't think her teeth would ever improve and was so happily surprised when I was able to encourage him with all of the TSB successes in this area. He just did what I asked him to do and now that precious girl is in the trees living the life of a squirrel because he was willing to try. TSB is teaching him things that he never knew and I thank you for that.
Here are the pics from today. First are Stubbie and then Ruthie...

[Spanky]

Sending prayers for Stubbie and Ruthie! :hug

[California Squirrel Lover]

Yes, sending prayers they will improve and correct in time. I'm impressed the vet was willing and interested in learning with Twitch, and with what you and TSB had to teach. I like that. :grin3 :thumbsup :grouphug

[SammysMom]

I have been ever so pleased with his willingness to try new things. HRT is the reason that Peggy is still alive and has all four legs intact. My vet was willing to try the med combo and dosing that she suggested and then made a point of telling me that he was so glad to learn something new to care for squirrels. I really love this vet and our terrific members who share their experiences and make better care possible!:Love_Icon
Yes, sending prayers they will improve and correct in time. I'm impressed the vet was willing and interested in learning with Twitch, and with what you and TSB had to teach. I like that. :grin3 :thumbsup :grouphug

[DarkLies212]

Healing vibes their way!! :Love_Icon

[stosh2010]

What does your vet use to sedate your squirrels???
---I do not have the luxury of a caring vet---
BUT..I have to trim the DUDE's teeth again....
and I DREAD IT.

[Nancy in New York]

I have been ever so pleased with his willingness to try new things. HRT is the reason that Peggy is still alive and has all four legs intact. My vet was willing to try the med combo and dosing that she suggested and then made a point of telling me that he was so glad to learn something new to care for squirrels. I really love this vet and our terrific members who share their experiences and make better care possible!:Love_Icon

Amen to this Gayle.
Sending tons of prayers that these little ones get their teeth nice and straight
so they can see feel the grass on their feet come spring.
WOW, every week or two for trimmings. That's a lot of trips! :hug

[SammysMom]

Actually not sure, Stosh... Maybe iso? I have done it without anything and it is something I DREAD! the bigger they are the more difficult it is too and I know you have giants! Sleepy squirrels can be easier to manipulate, but clipping has to be quick and firm or they aren't cooperative for long. I think two people is key and an element of surprise can work...once...:shakehead
Although Ken just commented that the surprise is likely the fact that afterwards you'll need stitches...:tap
What does your vet use to sedate your squirrels???
---I do not have the luxury of a caring vet---
BUT..I have to trim the DUDE's teeth again....
and I DREAD IT.

[Trooper]

Hi All: from reading the website http://wildpro.twycrosszoo.org/S/00Man/MammalHusbandryTechniques/UKMHusbIndTech/Handle_M_Squirrels.htm for Catching and Handling Squirrels on the Wildlife Management catching and Transport from the United Kindom, they state the following for sedation:

General Anaesthesia and Sedation:

Suggested protocols for sedation and general anaesthesia include:

1-As with other small mammals, general anaesthesia may be induced in an anaesthetic chamber.
2-Mask induction of general anaesthesia may also be used, but this can lead to handling stress.
3-Isoflurane is the anaesthetic agent of choice.
4-Halothane may be used as an alternative to isoflurane.
5-Maintain on isoflurane inhalation anaesthesia with oxygen (no nitrous oxide), delivered via a face mask e.g. made from a plastic syringe barrel.
6-Use a low-resistance circuit such as a T-piece.
7-Allowing some leakage from the face mask further reduces resistance;
8-Some form of active scavenging should be used to reduce atmospheric pollution.
9-Avoid excessively high flow rates of oxygen, as this increases heat loss and the risk of hypothermia.
10-Consider fluid therapy during general anaesthesia of small mammals to replace water losses; subcutaneous fluids would be appropriate.
11-Action should be taken to reduce heat loss of small mammals during general anaesthesia, to reduce the risk of hypothermia e.g. keep on a heated pad during general anaesthesia and recovery.
12-The length of starvation prior to induction of general anaesthesia should be appropriate for the species in question and the likelihood of regurgitation. Clinical judgement should be used as to the pros and cons of starvation in an emergency situation. Starvation may not be appropriate for small species with a high metabolic rate which must eat frequently to survive.

I thought this is good info to have as well as the site link above.

Good luck!

Trooper's dad,

[SammysMom]

I went back to look at Twitch's teeth before and after...

[Nancy in New York]

I went back to look at Twitch's teeth before and after...

WOW huge difference Gayle!

[SammysMom]

Yes, her bottom teeth always looked longer than i thought they should, but they maintained perfectly for months.

[kcassidy]

Awwwwww, sending healing thoughts for your fuzzers. Thankfully they found you AND your awesome vet. I agree with Ken, BTW :)

[Chickenlegs]

Awwww--sweet babies. Tooth straightening prayers. I think my vet uses Isofleurene (and I'm sure that's not how it's spelled) It's not a "hard" anesthesia. Somebody years ago made his own tank. Don't know any more about it but wouldn't it be a godsend to be able to sedate a little guy for just a minute or so to snip teeth and then put them back in their comfy home with a nut to recover. I did hear the vet say once it's carcinogenic but apparently not so much it can't be used as sedation. Dunno.

Ohohoh--internet is a wonderful thing: and of COURSE I spelled it wrong!
Isoflurane is an inhalation anesthetic. The MAC (minimum alveolar concentration) in man is as follows:

Age 100% Oxygen 70% N2O
26 ± 4 1.28 0.56
44 ± 7 1.15 0.50
64 ± 5 1.05 0.37

Induction of and recovery from Isoflurane anesthesia are rapid. Isoflurane has a mild pungency, which limits the rate of induction, although excessive salivation or tracheobronchial secretions do not appear to be stimulated. Pharyngeal and laryngeal reflexes are readily obtunded. The level of anesthesia may be changed rapidly with Isoflurane. Isoflurane is a profound respiratory depressant. RESPIRATION MUST BE MONITORED CLOSELY AND SUPPORTED WHEN NECESSARY. As anesthetic dose is increased, tidal volume decreases and respiratory rate is unchanged. This depression is partially reversed by surgical stimulation, even at deeper levels of anesthesia. Isoflurane evokes a sigh response reminiscent of that seen with diethyl ether and enflurane, although the frequency is less than with enflurane.

Blood pressure decreases with induction of anesthesia but returns toward normal with surgical stimulation. Progressive increases in depth of anesthesia produce corresponding decreases in blood pressure. Nitrous oxide diminishes the inspiratory concentration of Isoflurane required to reach a desired level of anesthesia and may reduce the arterial hypotension seen with Isoflurane alone. Heart rhythm is remarkably stable. With controlled ventilation and normal PaCO2, cardiac
output is maintained despite increasing depth of anesthesia, primarily through an increase in heart rate, which compensates for a reduction in stroke volume. The hypercapnia, which attends spontaneous ventilation during Isoflurane anesthesia further increases heart rate and raises cardiac output above awake levels. Isoflurane does not sensitize the myocardium to exogenously administered epinephrine in the dog. Limited data indicate that subcutaneous injection of 0.25 mg of epinephrine (50 mL of 1:200,000 solution) does not produce an increase in ventricular arrhythmias in patients anesthetized with Isoflurane.

Muscle relaxation is often adequate for intra-abdominal operations at normal levels of anesthesia. Complete muscle paralysis can be attained with small doses of muscle relaxants. ALL COMMONLY USED MUSCLE RELAXANTS ARE MARKEDLY POTENTIATED WITH Isoflurane, THE EFFECT BEING MOST PROFOUND WITH THE NONDEPOLARIZING TYPE. Neostigmine reverses the effect of nondepolarizing muscle relaxants in the presence of Isoflurane. All commonly used muscle relaxants are compatible with Isoflurane.

Isoflurane can produce coronary vasodilation at the arteriolar level in selected animal models1,2; the drug is probably also a coronary dilator in humans. Isoflurane, like some other coronary arteriolar dilators, has been shown to divert blood from collateral dependent myocardium to normally perfused areas in an animal model (“coronary steal”)3. Clinical studies to date evaluating myocardial ischemia, infarction and death as outcome parameters have not established that the coronary arteriolar dilation property of Isoflurane is associated with coronary steal or myocardial ischemia in patients with coronary artery disease4,5,6,7.

Pharmacokinetics
Isoflurane undergoes minimal biotransformation in man. In the postanesthesia period, only 0.17% of the Isoflurane taken up can be recovered as urinary metabolites.

[SammysMom]

Today's visit was great news! Dr. G feels that he actually sees improvement in both Stubbie and Ruthie's teeth! He and I both saw them starting to meet. Thank-you for the TSB prayers, I know that they are helping! :Love_Icon

[Nancy in New York]

Today's visit was great news! Dr. G feels that he actually sees improvement in both Stubbie and Ruthie's teeth! He and I both saw them starting to meet. Thank-you for the TSB prayers, I know that they are helping! :Love_Icon


WOW Gayle this is fantastic news, and so soon too!
Very hopeful on this one!!!!!!!!!:blowkiss

[island rehabber]

:clap:dance:bliss

[kcassidy]

HHHHHHHHHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOORRRRRRRRRRRRRRAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY :bliss :alright.gif

[SammysMom]

Ruthie 11-24 before clipping and 12-10 before her 3rd clipping...

[SammysMom]

Stubbie 11-24 before and Stubbie 12-10 before
The teeth are far from perfect, but they seem to be meeting more than they were. We have all winter for this to work and it did take Twitch MONTHS to get to where she was wearing them herself.

[SammysMom]

Haven't gotten the pics yet and will post as soon as I get the email from my vet, but I had to post this news. Today was our regular teeth trimming day and the best news EVER for Ruthie...they didn't need to be trimmed! They are wearing evenly on their own! She has been showing signs of having a regular bite by chewing her wooden shelves regularly, but I never dreamed it would be so good they didn't need any trimming at all! Thank-you God!!!
Now we can concentrate our prayers on my sweet Stubby... Poor guy still has a dreadful bite...:shakehead Hopefully his teeth will improve with more time...:Love_IconStub:Love_Icon

[Nancy in New York]

Haven't gotten the pics yet and will post as soon as I get the email from my vet, but I had to post this news. Today was our regular teeth trimming day and the best news EVER for Ruthie...they didn't need to be trimmed! They are wearing evenly on their own! She has been showing signs of having a regular bite by chewing her wooden shelves regularly, but I never dreamed it would be so good they didn't need any trimming at all! Thank-you God!!!
Now we can concentrate our prayers on my sweet Stubby... Poor guy still has a dreadful bite...:shakehead Hopefully his teeth will improve with more time...:Love_IconStub:Love_Icon

Great update for Ruthie! :w00t
Come on little Stubbie you can do it too!
I KNOW how you worry so about these two. :shakehead
At least Ruthie is on the right road, and hopefully Stubbie
isn't far behind. :hug

[KarmaKay]

That's great news! Prayers for stubby! :blowkiss pics please ;).

[SammysMom]

Today Stubbie went to have his teeth clipped and for the first time, Dr. G felt there was a lot of improvement! :w00t Also, they didn't even have to anesthetize him today! They just nipped off the ends and he was done...
Thank-you to all who are keeping sweet Stubs in their prayers because they are working! :Love_Icon
When we got home from the vet, I had to clean Stubbie and his gang's cage so I let them free roam the rehab building for the first time. They were shocked as hell to get the reaction they got from the naughty seven...:rofl4 Here are a few pic of a couple of them while they were exploring the area.

[Nancy in New York]

Such a great report on Stubbie ............I'm just thrilled!!!!!!!!!!:w00t :fireworks

Look at those little faces :Love_Icon:Love_Icon looking around with NO bars in their view.
Was it hard getting them rounded back up?

[SammysMom]

It wasn't too hard. Stubbie spent his time climbing as high as he could and jumping to the top of my head. Quite exciting for ME...:rofl4 One of them got on Satan's cage, he scared them and the enormous gray hid on the fleece on the back of his cage until I rescued him from the squirrel who is literally 1/4 of his size...:grin3

[Rhapsody]

Prayers and Healing Vibes being sent your way...... (((hugs)))

[Chickenlegs]

Soooooooooo maybe Satan wasn't such a bad name afterall! :grin3

[TubeDriver]

Great update! All your hard work is paying off with these two fuzzbutts.:clap

[kcassidy]

Yes the prayers and well wishes are helpful, but you need to pat yourself on the back for the good care and love you've given Stubbie. You are the reason his toofus' are doing better.

Way to go Gayle and stop torturing Satan ;)

[SammysMom]

Yes the prayers and well wishes are helpful, but you need to pat yourself on the back for the good care and love you've given Stubbie. You are the reason his toofus' are doing better.

Way to go Gayle and stop torturing Satan ;)

How'd you know I call Stubbie my "toofus dufus"? :grin3 He has come so far! He was one of the pinkies who just didn't grow and half his tail fell off. He was a little buck tooth goober from the start. Now, he is a big beautiful boy and his teeth are getting better. I am so happy when I look at him. So many times I didn't think he was going to make it. I remember bringing him and one of his crew to see Dr. G because his poor little bottom was swollen and he was having so many issues that I was afraid I was missing something. I think Dr. G thought I was crazy to think that these two babies would make it. They were a hot mess! Now, they are so beautiful and healthy that I just can't believe they were those "failure to thrive" babies. I lost too many pinkies last year, but I do feel like those who survived were a bit miraculous. I am so glad that I have learned here to never give up on them. Stubbie is the poster child for that!

As for me torturing Satan...:rofl4 You must be kidding! He is torturing ME! :tap

[SammysMom]

Here's Stubbie and one of his pals in September... Look at those teeth!!!

[Nutso]

Hi, My baby has to have her teeth trimmed every other week. Is there something the vet is doing besides teeth maintenance/trimming to help the teeth straighten for your babies? They look so much better over time. I'm guessing it is just the maintenance that helps, but want to make sure I'm not missing something that I should be doing with my baby to help eliminate this tooth trimming. I do it myself and am quite successful, but if there is something I can do to eliminate it, I'm there! Thanks so much for your time. Nutso's teeth are straight, but eventually would grow into the roof of her mouth if I didn't help her. You mentions successes here on the board, but I can't locate one to see what people are doing to help them. Thanks so much! And, I"m so happy your little fuzzers' teeth are looking better.

[SammysMom]

Hi Desiree! All we are doing is keeping the teeth short and providing a lot of chewing opportunities. It encourages the teeth to wear when they can chew regularly in some cases. It does NOT always work...some have to be trimmed forever. Here in CT, non-releasables are not ever okay so we work hard to make them releasable. Try to keep them short and encourage chewing branches and antlers, etc. Prayers for a healthy squirrel!:Love_Icon

[Nancy in New York]

Here's Stubbie and one of his pals in September... Look at those teeth!!!

I remember these! :Love_Icon
I also remember you had a visitor from Yale, and
she was looking at Stubbie trying to determine if he
was a squirrel or a beaver.
Well.............that's what you told me. :grin2 :poke
He is PRECIOUS Gayle!
Love the picture with Subbie and his buddy!:Love_Icon:Love_Icon

[Nutso]

Hi Desiree! All we are doing is keeping the teeth short and providing a lot of chewing opportunities. It encourages the teeth to wear when they can chew regularly in some cases. It does NOT always work...some have to be trimmed forever. Here in CT, non-releasables are not ever okay so we work hard to make them releasable. Try to keep them short and encourage chewing branches and antlers, etc. Prayers for a healthy squirrel!:Love_Icon

Thank you for your response. Nutso is doing great, but I do have to trim her teeth every other week. Clearly, she is getting enough calcium! I'll keep up the dedication, but I don't think we'll get to stop trimming. I give her everything I can think of to help her trim those little teeth on her own. She hates teeth trims, but so far so good. Thanks again for your time.

[SammysMom]

I know that there are many who are not as lucky as those I have had success with... Nutso is VERY fortunate to have you!