A few more questions

[HalokaKana]

Sorry for the second post in a day, but I'm so new at this, I need all the help i can get :)
So I have a few random questions:

1. 5 week(ish) old baby..her last feeding was at 2:30 pm. My mom said she ate like a champ and even crawled out of her nest when she came in to get her. I tried feeding her at 5:30pm..she look a few suckles but then stopped and seemed more interested in running all over me like a tree. I guess her activity level is good and she seems quite strong compared to when I found her. So I put her back in her box and pet her for a bit. Then I came back at 6:30 to try again--same thing.
Usually at 4 hours she is ravenous so I'm wondering--what's the deal? I'm just worried about her becoming dehydrated. How often should I retry?

2. When I was putting her back after the attempted 5:30 feeding, and I was petting her, she was biting on me. She has tried suckling on my hand before, but never biting. It hurt but didn't break skin. So I tried not to let her mouth around me and she just wanted to bite on the blanket and the plushie toy I put in her box. What's this about? Is there a need for them to chew? It didn't even look to me like she had teeth, but I felt em! And if she does need to chew, what would you recommend me giving her?

3. I am feeding her the "Just Born" brand of puppy milk powder. I bought it before reading everything about FV. I herd Esbilac was bad, but am wondering if anyone has tried Just Born? It's similar to Esbilac ingredients-wise, but less fat so I have been adding heavy whipping cream. I've tried ordering FV and calling them today but no response. If Just Born is not recommended, can you recommend something better until I get FV?

4. I read that adding yogurt to formula was good, because my formula doesn't have probiotics in it. I could not find plain full fat yogurt at my store. Everything is low or nonfat. Any suggestions here?

Lots of questions, I know! I'm just trying to do my best. Thanks in advance :)

[HRT4SQRLS]

OK.. a lot of questions here. :tilt
At 5 weeks old she can go 4-5 hours between feedings. Three hours is too soon so she might not be hungry yet. I wouldn't let her climb all over me when it's feeding time. If necessary, I would wrap her in fleece and offer the formula. Yes, sometimes these little boogers will bite with those tiny teeth. Just try to keep your fingers out of her mouth. They usually will bite/nibble when they are anxiously seeking out the nipple. It would be rare for them to aggressively go after you at 5 weeks.

You could offer her some hydration fluid. They usually love it. The last few weeks I have had several that would willingly drink the hydration fluid but they were a pain to get on formula. Keep trying.

IF the appetite doesn't return in a few hours AND she gets lethargic that signals a problem. I would listen to her chest for clicking. If you hear even the slightest clicking, it is indicative of aspiration pneumonia and she would need antibiotics.

They do like to chew. Get some oak twigs and give them to her. Get a branch that has a finger size diameter. Cut 3 inch sections. Wash it in hot water.

Order the FoxValley from Henry's Healthy Pets. That's the easy way. :tilt Ordering it direct from FoxValley Nutrition is a pain. Call back, credit card verification, yada yada... :peace

You can add yogurt to the formula. Stoneyfield YoBaby yogurt for babies is the only one I have found that is full fat. Look in the children's yogurt section.

[Spanky]

:thankyou for helping this baby!

Edit: removing my long post to defer to H4S advice!!!!

[HRT4SQRLS]

Edit: removing my long post to defer to H4S advice!!!!
No No No... Spanky you've raised more babies that I ever will.:hug

[Spanky]

Lots of my information was very similar to H4S, but I warned the Just Born formula will lead to diarrhea and dehydration. I suggested they get the Esbilac, since any suspected issues with Esbilac are in squirrels younger than 4 weeks. Also, the Esbilac is more readily available at Tractor Supply Stores and such. I'll add that I believe using combined FV 20/50 and Esbilac (half n half) is optimal.

It would be good if we could see a picture of the bay as well (because they are so cute and also since sometimes we can see if they are dehydrated!).

[HalokaKana]

Thank you all for your speedy replies!! we both really appreciate it :) I did realize 3 hrs might be too early, but when I tried again at 4 hours and she still wasn't interested I was baffled.
Something I realized I left out was that: For the past 2 days we have been using a puppy syringe (can't remember the cc/ml amount but probably around 10?) I have read the 1 cc syringes are better so I bought her one today. I was trying it for the first time when she rejected it--could that be why?

Either way, I tried again at 8:30 which was 6 hours since her last big feeding..I tried with the original puppy syringe and she ate like a champ again :dance
and she went right to sleep after :Love_Icon

So all is good in that area.

I will buy some Esbilac powder tomorrow if that's what yall think will be better than Just Born. Do I need to add whipping cream to Esbilac?

Thanks for the info on ordering FV and the yogurt suggestions!
I will post more photos as soon as she wakes up ;)

[HalokaKana]

Here are some pictures of the babe :)

263886

263887

263888

[stepnstone]

The older Esbilac recipe was a problem, the new Esbilac with the pre and pro biotics is the new recipe that many of us are successfully using.
The problem with the internet is many sites, (unlike TSB) do not keep up with change or new product information and unfortunately damaging
information will remain to be accessed time and time again.

FYI... Unsure if your aware, formula needs to be cleaned off baby after feeding as it can cause "milk burn" and baby will lose fur in that area.

[HalokaKana]

thanks stepnstone! I didn't even think about looking at the dates of sites but that makes a lot of sense..and I have been running into dead ends over quite a few topics--some agree with A, others agree with B and never the two shall meet lol. That's why I love it here..real time answers from pros and experienced.

P.S. I do clean her off after every feeding :) I read about milk burn the first day I got her. The first pic was during feeding and she just stopped for a second and rested, holding my finger lol. I thought it was really cute and had my phone right there so I just snapped a shot. ;)
But that is a good tip for others who might not know!

[kcassidy]

You are doing a great job :)

Esbilac - it used to be bad, but they fixed it. BUT... you want to make sure the can you buy has a blue ribbon around the top part of the canister and it should say Pre & Pro biotics. I would also go to www.squirrelsandmore.com and purchase the following rehab supplies.

Miracle Nipple - http://www.squirrelsandmore.com/rehab-supplies/nipples-and-feeding-bottles/the-miracle-nipple.html - We have all found the babies do much better with this nipple, so maybe some of your resistance is the plastic syringe.

I use 3cc/ml and 5cc/ml syringes until they are older, then I switch to 10cc/ml.

Fox Valley 20/50 this is the formula for 4weeks and older. In the beginning of the switch I mix Esbilac & FV 50/50 and then over a week I transition to 20/50 only.

You can get Esbilac here as well, but I've found it is cheapest on Amazon.com with my Prime free shipping.

Finally I would get the Formula Mixer Bottler, it really helps the formula to be blended together well. Most of us mix up formula for a 24 hour period and we also recommend that you mix it up about 4 hours before the first feeding. If you don't the formula stays a little clumpy. Make it with warm water, not boiling hot.
http://www.squirrelsandmore.com/rehab-supplies/nipples-and-feeding-bottles/formula-mixer-bottle.html

Besides some branches, I also keep an Antler in with them, they need that as well and it is what they use out in the wild for calcium and to trim their teeth.

I would go 5 or 6 hours between feedings, bet she eats then ;) If she is getting too much formula her poop will get lighter in color or whitish, that means too much formula.

I love letting my babies play on me, but where I release there are no people, so your handling really depends on where they will end up living out in the wild. You don't want them jumping on strange people cuz that will get the squirrels killed really fast :(

Yes they nibble on you, some do it too hard and I don't allow it, others are very gentle and I do. They love to clean under your fingernails, btw :D

Stick around here and you'll get all the help you need, you can't ask enough questions, we want nothing but the best for these babies, so ask away.

[stepnstone]

You are doing a great job :)

Esbilac - it used to be bad, but they fixed it. BUT... you want to make sure the can you buy has a blue ribbon around the top part of the canister and it should say Pre & Pro biotics.
The can on right is what to look for or make sure "Dried Whey Protein Concentrate"
is the 3rd subject listed in ingredients. :thumbsup

http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=263904&stc=1
http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=263905&stc=1



Stick around here and you'll get all the help you need, you can't ask enough questions, we want nothing but the best for these babies, so ask away.
:yeahthat

[HalokaKana]

I ordered the FV 32/40 because I read on the boards here that it's better to just keep them on that. Is that not okay now?

Also, I went to the store to buy Esbilac but they only have the big tubs that I can't really afford now..after buying Just Born and now FV, plus nipples and other things. This baby was an unexpected surprise and I'm doing my best with what I have money-wise.

I really don't know what to do at this point until the FV comes in..should I:

-continue on Just Born

-buy the smaller, cheaper cans of pre-mixed Esbilac (since I can't afford a tub)

-put her on temporary goat's milk mixture (goat's milk, whipping cream, yogurt)

[Rocky1]

Hi OP,

Since you said in the first post that you are new to this, I wanted to make sure that you saw this thread, http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?51708-4skwerlz-Baby-Squirrel-Care It's the basics on raising a baby squirrel. I found that thread and the link in it to be very helpful.

[stepnstone]

I ordered the FV 32/40 because I read on the boards here that it's better to just keep them on that. Is that not okay now?

Also, I went to the store to buy Esbilac but they only have the big tubs that I can't really afford now..after buying Just Born and now FV, plus nipples and other things. This baby was an unexpected surprise and I'm doing my best with what I have money-wise.

I really don't know what to do at this point until the FV comes in..should I:

-continue on Just Born

-buy the smaller, cheaper cans of pre-mixed Esbilac (since I can't afford a tub)

-put her on temporary goat's milk mixture (goat's milk, whipping cream, yogurt)

I hate being the bearer of bad news but the FV should have been the 20/50, there has been problems with the 32/40.
Maybe you have time to change order if you call whom ever you ordered it from.

The pre-mixed Esbilac is cheaper for a reason, no good for squirrels and gives them diarrhea.

I personally would use the Goats milk before the Just born.

[TubeDriver]

I hate being the bearer of bad news but the FV should have been the 20/50, there has been problems with the 32/40.
Maybe you have time to change order if you call whom ever you ordered it from.

The pre-mixed Esbilac is cheaper for a reason, no good for squirrels and gives them diarrhea.

I personally would use the Goats milk before the Just born.

:goodpost This guy knows what works!





G

[HalokaKana]

Aw man I wonder why others said to stick with the 32/40 on the Esbilac sticky post?
Thanks for the info..I'll try to change the order..I ordered it from Henry's--does anyone have experience trying to change an order on there?

I will switch to the goat's milk, thanks! Is it okay to use that for the 3-4 days it takes FV to come in? I know it's a temporary solution, but I'm not sure how temporary.

Thanks everyone for the help, I'm just really trying to make the right decisions here and seems like I just keep making the wrong ones lol.:peace1

[HalokaKana]

Oh yay, I called Henry's and the lady was extremely nice and said she will send out the correct formula tomorrow and I can return the incorrect one :) One success! haha

[HRT4SQRLS]

The goat milk will be fine for 3-4 days ... even fine for a week but not long term as it is deficient in nutrients for long term.

Edit.. I also said replacing it won't be a problem and BAM already done. :)

[HRT4SQRLS]

You might have been reading a post about flying squirrels because they DO stay on the FV 32/40 because they have higher protein requirements because they are omnivores. (Meat and plant eaters)

Grey squirrels switch to the 20/50 around 4-5 weeks but to be honest most people with grey squirrels don't use the 32/40 any longer due to problems.

[HalokaKana]

I see I see :)
Thanks for the tip about ordering from Henry's, they are awesome. The lady on the phone asked what I was feeding now, and I told her the whole story. She said "Oh great, it sounds like you've got a good plan. You must've found the Squirrel Board" :dance haha I said I did indeed.

I just fed the baby the goat's milk formula and afterward she started making a new noise. I wish I had gotten to my phone in time to tape it but she stopped once I did. It was one tiny, soft squeak..about ever 3-5 seconds..for about a minute. I thought maybe burps?? I know it's probably hard to diagnose without a recording but just curious if anyone may know.

I had to shake up the goats milk before making the formula but I did let it sit for an hour. Maybe there were still air bubbles?

*Thank you all for helping me so much, I really appreciate it more than you know*

[HRT4SQRLS]

Was the goat milk fresh in the dairy section or canned? The reason I asked is because the canned goat milk is concentrated and must be diluted (per the can instructions) before using.

The fresh goat milk doesn't last long before it spoils. It will probably last until the FV comes in but if you want to you can take a portion now and freeze it and thaw when needed in case the FV is delayed.

[HalokaKana]

I just got the carton in the refrigerated section at WalMart. It is Meyenberg brand.

We have a Whole Foods I could try if you suggest another/better brand.

[HRT4SQRLS]

Meyerberg is perfect! :thumbsup

[Soccerspit]

the Miracle Nipple and the O-ring syringe from Henry's is beyond awesome! I will be keeping some on hand for future use, it makes things so much easier and it took a little bit for mine to take to it, but eventually she did. I am no longer as concerned about her aspirating because things flow a lot easier. Also as her teeth started coming in she liked to bite the cheap nipples from the pet store but with these they are much heartier and not as easy to chew through. So happy you are learning so much and the wisdom of everyone is so comforting to read and learn myself!! I look forward to continued education through everyone and people like you who are asking the questions!!

[kcassidy]

Also, in case someone else reads this down the road, we do NOT ever want to use the pre mixed Esbilac in a can. It has different ingredients and the Squee's don't do well on it at all.

Glad you've got your formula's all sorted.

If the noise sounds like this, don't be worried, she was just practicing her alarm call.

https://www.facebook.com/kim.cassidy.397/videos/vb.644551896/10153538969806897/?type=3&theater