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View Full Version : Pet project... really ?



Camille
08-17-2015, 06:00 PM
Hi everyone

I am writting this because I believe that we put a lot of emphasis on feeding proper formula but yet we don't put enough on all the other issues related to raising baby squirrels: things like committment, cost (hundreds of $ for a single squirrel, food, cage, heating pad, syringes, nipples, fresh veggies, fruits and the list goes on), equipment, medecine, lack of sleep and being practically housebound (especially when pinkies and/or if the babies are ill), no access to vets, ill effects for the babies resulting from a lack of adequate care. Most of all I want to stress that this is not a pet project one can just show off to friends and family.

There are lots of good hearted people who wish no harm to our littles critters but who, yet, sstill take on this task as if it is some kind of project to try. Some kind of experiment. While the ultimate goal is to help the baby many people undertake the task with too much naiveté for lack of information.

Case and point... Meet Charlie, male grey, came to me on august 2nd weighing 52g. He was about 2 weeks old. Charming little bugger, was a little dehydrated and wasn't stimulated properly by the person who found him. As of today at 141g (15 days later and now approximativly 4 weeks old) Charlie is being fed Esbilac with heavy wipping cream and is doing wonderfully ! No eyes open yet.

Meet my 2nd baby squirrel that came to my house last thursday (august 13th) brought in by a nice couple who said they'd tried everything for the past 4 weeks. They said they had lots of challenges with this baby (diarrhea, intolerance etc). In the end they said she could only tolerate goat's milk 2% with nothing else added. They admitted it was hard on them and the round-the-clock feedings didn't always work out for them and they would sometimes skip feedings They also mentionned that they had a hard time finding info and equipment to care for this baby squirrel. They tried, and were full of good intentions but knew very little. When they met Charlie, the surprise and pain was all over their faces. I didn't have to say anything.

Here she is. Meet Peanut. She's a female black squirrel, 4+ weeks old (maybe even a little older than Charlie, the couple said they had her since July 18th. She came from a litter of 5, their nest fell while someone was cutting the tree. One died from its head injury, and 3 died of malnutrition (the lady admitted it was her first time and that she didn't really know what to do). And now this little girl managed to survive at a merger ... 54g Yup...speechless huh !

I am switching her slowly but surely to a better formula but some damage has already been done. It's been 96 hours later and she is 78g. She learnt how to suck, didn't know how, as she was feed with a 10cc syringe and she kept her mouth open the size of a dime to only swallow 1/2 of what she was fed. Poop is now normal and so is the pee !!! Yesterday a surprise was waiting for me, one eye open !!! Today 2 eyes and she was walking in the plastic container and went to relieve herself on her own. Her skin still has flakes but its a major improvement from when she arrived. She had thick crusty scabs coming off her skin. I don't know if its because of dehydration, malnutrition, or scalded by heat ! I put in a humidifier in the container and kept her skin hydrate with lotion. Her fur is only now starting to grow !!!

I think it would be of great benefit to TSB if these pictures were posted in some permanent way - maybe as a sticky? - and recommended as one of the 1sst reads when new people sign up on TSB. They say a picture iw worth a thousand words and these pics are shocking enough that maybe it will hit people across the head and make them realize ... "Hey! I don't want this to happen to mine" and prompt them not to wait before seeking the help of someone more experienced. Maybe it could help people realise that time is not on their side if they lack experience and you cannot just improvise yourself rehabber at the drop of a hat.

That being said I am no rehabber myself, but I taught myself a lot, and I researched. I am also in a medical field. I am very committed but I reached out for help at the very 1st concern. Now, I surrounded myself by and I am being supported by a great team of experienced rehabbers who come to my house for update visits, give me good advice and keep teaching me sooo much. Even with all this support I still find it challenging. I will not mention their names here as a way to respect their identity but if they wish to comment... by all means ....

Please, I don't want this to be a judgement post, I want it to be a an educational post! For newcomers and good hearted people to realize that proper formula is one thing but experience is another and yes, I do agree we all started somewhere!!! I just mean to say, if one wants to start, then make sure you start on the right foot and move onto the right road.

:Peace

Camille

262076262077

island rehabber
08-17-2015, 07:00 PM
I agree with you completely, Camille. Although I am more cynical than you, maybe: I don't believe that people who want to "try raising a baby squirrel" will be convinced NOT to, simply because they read our posts here. People, especially Americans these days, have a lot more self-confidence and self-esteem than they sometimes actually deserve, know what I mean? "Everyone's a winner! Yay! Get a trophy for just showing up!" :shakehead Well, that thinking is disastrous when it comes to wildlife rehab. Knowing that you DON'T know everything is a true sign of intelligence....

Your stories remind me of a little 6-wk old girl named Olympia, a grey, who came to me years ago. At the time there was a fun commercial featuring a guy in a Jeep surrounded by wildlife -- raccoon, fox, deer. Olympia's finder appeared in an open Jeep, on a chilly day, with poor tiny Olympia on the seat next to him without a box or a rag to cover her. He happily told me he was 'living that great commercial on the way here!" He had found her four days before, put her in a bird cage and gave her seeds. Bird seeds, and a little bowl of water. She was 6 weeks old and needed only formula, but he didn't want to be bothered with that, so she starved. And starved. And probably wondered why her mamma was no longer there to feed her. By the time I saw her she was a skeleton.
His wife called me after he left and seemed to need to do True Confessions. "I know we screwed up," she said. "I knew she was a baby and probably needed some kind of milk. She was so chubby and beautiful last Friday and now.....I feel as if we ruined this perfectly good little squirrel." "You did," I said. "Welll.....wellll it was my husband's little pet project, you know, and I didn't want to discourage him!" she whined. I took a deep breath and spit her words back to her: "YOU knew she was a baby! YOU have the ovaries, not him! It was up to you to do the right thing!" She hung up. Yeah, that was a sexist statement I made but dammit it's the truth.

Their little pet project struggled for a few hours and died in my hands. I will never, ever forget Olympia or the brazen stupidity of some people.
Sorry....long winded as usual. :sadness

Camille
08-17-2015, 07:11 PM
Really really sorry to hear that, she wasn't given enough chance/time to be with you !!!

I do believe that when people will see the result of the "proper way" (left side) and wrong way/reason (right side) it might in fact strike a % of people in deciding or not to raise it. Even if its only 10% of people that realize... hey i don't this to happen !!!!!

Anything can happen to this little one at any day or any time from now on but I pray and hope that she will be a success story. I am giving her my ALL !


If someone knows how to rotate the pictures it might be easier to see the différence in size, fur, hydration.....please do as I am unable to ????

Thanks

Nancy in New York
08-17-2015, 07:35 PM
If someone knows how to rotate the pictures it might be easier to see the différence in size, fur, hydration.....please do as I am unable to ????

Thanks

Here you go. :)
Good luck with both these little ones. :hug
They're adorable!
https://nmognoni.smugmug.com/photos/i-TDkNcMm/0/L/i-TDkNcMm-L.jpg (https://nmognoni.smugmug.com/Backyard-wilflife/n-kzhsL/i-TDkNcMm/A)

https://nmognoni.smugmug.com/photos/i-cV5m8QW/0/L/i-cV5m8QW-L.jpg (https://nmognoni.smugmug.com/Backyard-wilflife/n-kzhsL/i-cV5m8QW/A)

Camille
08-17-2015, 08:40 PM
awww so much better....THANK YOU ! (re: pictures) :serene

Why do you guys think she lost her skin like that ? Is the fur going to grow in those pink spots ? I am thinking chemical... insect repellant ! ? My reasonning is why only at the base of her body and not all over or here and there.... it seems to me to be on resting points (knees, elbows, base of tail) She had a bit of flakes on her head, ears and bottom back but nothing like those restiing points which leads me to believe that. Sweat mix with chemical for a prolong period of time as of the head, ears and bottom back where only stroked.... She even has necrosis of the tail (partially) at the 1 inch before the tail end, it cuves in (dent) and has a scab. I don't think she will lose it as you can see half of what is left is still hanging. Maybe I am wrong.

I never had to deal with a sick squirrel, my first time :(

I still do not understand how she managed to survive !!! Friday (24 hours after I received her) and after giving her the max of hydration and some "food" my son saw her in the palm of my hand for the first time and said to me : Mom I hope you realize that thing is dying... It's going to die no matter what you do. That's how sick she looked :( She wasn't emancipated but she was severly dehydrated and malnurished, her skin was soo dry... leather only thick and harsh and I don't think her intestines where even full of digestive waste.

Scooterzmom
08-17-2015, 09:49 PM
Hi Camille :)

I still cannot believe the difference, each time I see that pic. :eek If anybody can save this baby, I know that you can.

I've had the pleasure of trying to help Camille with this little one and Camille has performed some kind of miracle so far. This baby's progress is nothing short of amazing.

The questions we have of course is about her skin - which Camille has mentioned - and that side is definitely improving but we cannot be entirely sure to what point it will in the end. What remains to be seen is whether or not this baby end up with bald spots since we see shows pink patches of skin with no hair (as Camille said) at the pressurepoints while the rest of her seems to gradually be growing some.

Now I said questions because we wonder if maybe the poor little girl could be suffering from failure to thrive. At this point it's very hard to tell since she was so badly dehydrated and malnourished that for just being rehydrated and now getting good nutrition she's gained what seems a lot of weight but she has not grown much so far. Personally I told Camille I think she will catch up (at least some) although she may never get to be very big; could be there was too much damage inflicted before she was surrendered, the possibility that it was caught too late does remain, but I think only time will tell when it comes to that. I believe it is way too soon to know whether she will be releasable or not.

A baby that badly damaged can end up with all kinds of problems later on and that is why (especially with our kinds of winter here) she will not be released this fall. I think in her particular case a fall release would be much, much too risky.

Anyone with experience with a baby like this is welcome to offer us some opinions and advice. I have been helping Camille, who has done everything just perfectly and even better than expected (with her medical background she's quite the squirrel nurse I tell ya :grin3) but this is a case unlike any I have had before and I would not want to give her the wrong advice as we go on.

I know this poor little thing is still far from out of the woods but nobody is going to give up on her - least of all Camille, I know that; she's the one with all the headaches and lack of sleep, she's doing the rehabbing by ow but I'd like to be able to continue offering her support and advice when she has concerns.

Camille
08-17-2015, 10:29 PM
Merci Michelyne 💞

Anyone please let me know of your expérience and advice. I surely need it especially this little one.

I will post more pics of her progress and I'm telling you: she's on the right way 👏

She's way ahead of el porko Charlie !!! Who is younger and bigger and had it "easy" compared to her. But you wouldn't of said that 3 -4 days ago. 360* degree !!! Today I had a change of mind. She rules !!!!

Could not of done this alone. I winged it because of extreme activity in our area here lately with baby squirrels and Michelyne being so busy but she does not rest without before checking in with me and giving me advice and suggestions. She visits like a doctor would on a house call at a drop of a dime. THANK YOU MIMI !!!!💝

If any thing good comes out of this it is greatfully because of Michelyne!!! I call her my mentor and my ambulating bible lol.

Let me know of any of your concerns and advice. It is greatly needed

Nite nite guys xx

Camille
08-18-2015, 11:47 AM
I was also asking myself this question about her condition. Would a calcium supplement/treatment at this point be benificial ? As she did not receive the adequat amount of milk/nutrition for the first 4 weeks of life ?

If so what would be the dosage ? And your opinion about doing so or not ?

Thank you in advance

Camille
08-18-2015, 12:49 PM
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Sara in NW MS
08-18-2015, 01:00 PM
I can't believe the size difference in those two. It's amazing she survived this ordeal with those idiots. Sorry, not usually the one to call people I don't know names... but this sort of stuff really gets my blood boiling.

Thank you for saving her life, she is looking so much better already!!! I just love her pics, the black squirrels are so beautiful to me.

Camille
08-18-2015, 01:05 PM
and she is older !!! it is so strange/weird but cute at the same time seing her so small: eyes open, getting up walking around and going pee :)

Iko
08-18-2015, 03:09 PM
and she is older !!! it is so strange/weird but cute at the same time seing her so small: eyes open, getting up walking around and going pee :)


Her hair will grow back but maybe a different color. I had two babies terribly malnourished and their skin was flaky....one more so than the other. She has silver/gray patches in those spots and the rest of her is a darker color. As far as size, they were way behind the learning curve so I have kept them longer before release and I can say they are finally catching up in size and maturity.

These babies are the ones that truly need patience, nurturing and love.

Thanks for the updates.

Camille
08-18-2015, 05:30 PM
Her hair will grow back but maybe a different color. I had two babies terribly malnourished and their skin was flaky....one more so than the other.

Disregard the picture of the grey baby on a multi-color blanket that is Charlie when I first got him and I tried to edit my post and delete that picture but was unsucessful... looks like I am a TSB website loser hahaha

What I meant to say was her skin is flaky now but she sheded her skin like a snake would. It was think crusty scabs that peeled off. You can see the pink part is like a burn victim. You have the brown normal skin and then patches/rounds of pink skin. That is where she lost a coat of skin. She still has not much fur. I should ask Michelyne if she has pictures of her skin coming off.

I'm going to have to ask Michelyne to come and see her again to see if she thinks she grew and if her fur is better. I don't see much change as I am with her every 3 hours. Of course I can tell she gained weight and her skin is better, I put baby lotion on from time to time but not too often as you want her skin to produce the natural oil it needs. The fur on her tail is growing also, that I noticed :)

I find développement wize she is where she should be for about 5 + weeks old. But her size ohhhhh a mini mini baby squirrel, I kiss her all the time and she licks my lips.... awwwwwww so sweet.

Thank you for your reply, its encouraging to know that yours made it and mine might too :) !!!

Scooterzmom
08-19-2015, 09:53 PM
Little Miss Mini is still progressing in giant leaps. Wow! She's not only cute now but adorable. We can see that her fur is growing in, that her muscle tone is improving too and her personality is coming through now. Those are all good signs. Great signs I say.

As for the growth lengthwise, that will probably take more time than others but I think that regardless of her size she's on her way to becoming a very healthy baby. That is what matters most. If she needs more time to get bigger, then so be it. We'll handle things one by one.

Super job Camille.! :bowdown

Personally I don't think we're dealing with a failure to thrive baby - she would not be gaining weight as she does, would not be looking as healthy etc... I think it is just that she was so far behind she needs more time to catch up. I would still appreciate some opinions on that, just to be sure. Anyway she's doing great, Camille, so keep up the good work! :thumbsup

Be seeing you and the fur kids tomorrow ;)