EMERGENCY HELP NEEDED FAST!

[dragonwcc]

Emergency! I gave them both hydration solution 4 hours ago about 5cc each now I'm trying to give 3:1 formula and the smaller one is just laying there breathing heavy tried to feed it and its just dripping out of its mouth gave it maybe 1 cc of hydration fluid instead of formula and it drank a few drops please help

[Nancy in New York]

Emergency! I gave them both hydration solution 4 hours ago about 5cc each now I'm trying to give 3:1 formula and the smaller one is just laying there breathing heavy tried to feed it and its just dripping out of its mouth gave it maybe 1 cc of hydration fluid instead of formula and it drank a few drops please help

Is there any chance that this little one aspirated?
Did you ever see formula coming out of his nose.
What size syringes are you using, and are you using a nipple?
Do you have any antibiotics there? Cipro or Baytril are the choice for
pneumonia. Do you hear any clicking when he breathes?

[dragonwcc]

I hear no sound when he is breathing no nipple I just barely let the liquid drip from the end of the syringe while they are sucking on it I do not remember any liquids coming out its nose all I have is clyndamicyn antibiotic

[Nancy in New York]

Is he cool to the touch.
Is he gapping, breathing with mouth opened?
Do you stimulate them?
Are you giving formula and hydration?
Forgive me if I am asking the questions you have already
answered. What kind of container do you have them in?
Do you have a heating pad outside under half of the container?

[farm mom]

How much do these babies weigh? Do their stomachs seem tight?

[dragonwcc]

Yes they have heat under a corner of the cage they are in kinda a wire chicken cage all metal not sure if cool to touch I am currently at work and having to relay to my father who is at home with them I get off in an hour so I will know first hand I am currently doing hydration every 4 hours and formula at 11am 3 pm and 7 pm

[Nancy in New York]

Yes they have heat under a corner of the cage they are in kinda a wire chicken cage all metal not sure if cool to touch I am currently at work and having to relay to my father who is at home with them I get off in an hour so I will know first hand I am currently doing hydration every 4 hours and formula at 11am 3 pm and 7 pm

Chicken wire is NOT suitable.
This little one could have sustained a fall.
I am NOT yelling at you, I am not sugar coating.
They need help!
IF your father is doing this, are you sure that neither
has apirated?
Can you post a photo of what you have them in?

[dragonwcc]

My dad just text me...he is gone not breathing nor moving

[SammysMom]

We really do need to get you to a rehabber.
Godspeed little one...:Love_Icon:Love_Icon:Love_Icon

[island rehabber]

We really do need to get you to a rehabber.
Godspeed little one...:Love_Icon:Love_Icon:Love_Icon

YES, please -- we have someone about 20 minutes away!

[dragonwcc]

I have fed them every time since Sunday night...the lively one is acting fine never did I see anything come out eithers nose

[dragonwcc]

I can post a photo as soon as get home of the cage

[dragonwcc]

Little brother is resting under the ground under the oak tree they came out of...this hurts worse than losing the cat i grew up with.... had him for 8 days...Sissy is doing fine, currently going stir crazy in the cage

[TubeDriver]

Gods Speed little one. :(

These little ones are so tricky, it is as much art and intuition as it is experience and knowledge to keep them alive. I treat my adult wilds but I am afraid to have little babies, they are so fragile and things can turn bad so VERY fast. If you have a rehabber nearby, please consider getting some help. You would not want whatever happened to this little one to happen to his sibling.

[LaurelLynn]

YES, please -- we have someone about 20 minutes away!

I would accept this offer immediately ... you've done an amazing job being attentive and doing everything you can but sometimes they start crashing so quickly they need immediate emergency care like IV fluids and antibiotics that you wouldn't have access to :sadness

And the difference between a rehabber stabilizing them in the next hour vs after you get home and can post pics can be a life or death difference

You really have done great with trying so hard :grouphug

[dragonwcc]

254120
here is the cage we have her in

[dragonwcc]

my cell phone number is 706-264-3891, please have the nearby reabber contact me

[Nancy in New York]

my cell phone number is 706-264-3891, please have the nearby reabber contact me

I have not heard back from her. I will put out another notice and email.
Are you willing to give this baby up or do you just want someone to talk you
through the process?

[dragonwcc]

i wanted a home visit to see if my cage, food, water supplies are what i need, and what the rehabber thought of Sissy, and if they were good, i was going to keep, and if they werent i was going to let them rehab, if someone could call me though so that i can answer any questions about what all i have that would be fine aswell

[SammysMom]

What is that in the bottom of the cage? This baby is still quite young and needs more cuddly stuff to be comfortable. Their mom's keep them in a cozy cocoon. That cage is really not suitable for him. Where are you exactly so we can find a close person to help?

[RobinTN]

Sissy has a lot of recovery ahead from the damage the kitten milk replacer did. My honest opinion is that she needs more steady, around the clock care than you can give and still keep your job.

Also Sissy needs to be around others squirrels as she's growing up, so she can learn how to be a squirrel.

Sometimes the best way to love them is to let them go so they can grow into the life they deserve in the trees.

[Nancy in New York]

Just some random photos of my cage for my Tuft babies. I have about 7,000 pictures but just chose these to show you a rough idea.

http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/photos/i-Vd39RqS/0/M/i-Vd39RqS-M.jpg (http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/Other/Tuft-Babies-June-2014/n-qt4t4/i-Vd39RqS/A)

http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/photos/i-Cx5Crfq/0/M/i-Cx5Crfq-M.jpg (http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/Other/Tuft-Babies-June-2014/n-qt4t4/i-Cx5Crfq/A)

http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/photos/i-bxC9DsV/0/M/i-bxC9DsV-M.jpg (http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/Other/Tuft-Babies-June-2014/n-qt4t4/i-bxC9DsV/A)

http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/photos/i-J8xxvv3/0/M/i-J8xxvv3-M.jpg (http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/Other/Tuft-Babies-June-2014/n-qt4t4/i-J8xxvv3/A)

http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/photos/i-FNGfQzW/0/M/i-FNGfQzW-M.jpg (http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/Other/Tuft-Babies-June-2014/n-qt4t4/i-FNGfQzW/A)

http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/photos/i-3n6cJdV/0/M/i-3n6cJdV-M.jpg (http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/Other/Tuft-Babies-June-2014/n-qt4t4/i-3n6cJdV/A)

http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/photos/i-TwFn9JH/0/M/i-TwFn9JH-M.jpg (http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/Other/Tuft-Babies-June-2014/n-qt4t4/i-TwFn9JH/A)

http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/photos/i-2RgB8zJ/0/M/i-2RgB8zJ-M.jpg (http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/Other/Tuft-Babies-June-2014/n-qt4t4/i-2RgB8zJ/A)

http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/photos/i-SqLjHSF/0/M/i-SqLjHSF-M.jpg (http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/Other/Tuft-Babies-June-2014/n-qt4t4/i-SqLjHSF/A)

http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/Tuft-Beauties-2015/i-9kxFZkq/0/M/i-jF4rwSR-M-M.jpg (http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/Tuft-Beauties-2015/i-9kxFZkq/A)

http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/Tuft-Beauties-2015/i-NF44fff/0/M/i-BPDtrCk-M-M.jpg (http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/Tuft-Beauties-2015/i-NF44fff/A)

http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/Tuft-Beauties-2015/i-qktcsjz/0/M/i-PDCDCPj-M-M.jpg (http://nmognoni.smugmug.com/Tuft-Beauties-2015/i-qktcsjz/A)

[TubeDriver]

If you have an old hoodie that could be donated, that would make a nice place for a little squirrel to curl up in!

Just stay away from towels as they can get their nails caught up in the cotton loops and it can break fingers?

[dragonwcc]

i live in northwest georgia, it is pine shavings in the bottom of the cage with old t-shirts in the nesting box i can get some fleece for the cage

[TubeDriver]

The old t-shirts will work fine, maybe add a few more. There is some thought that Pine and Cedar shavings actually irritate the airways of rodents including squirrels. I would remove the Pine shavings and put down a bunch of shirts, fleece down on the cage bottom.




i live in northwest georgia, it is pine shavings in the bottom of the cage with old t-shirts in the nesting box i can get some fleece for the cage

[island rehabber]

Just some random photos of my cage for my Tuft babies. I have about 7,000 pictures but just chose these to show you a rough idea.


:attention

[SammysMom]

We have a VERY trusted member who will come and get him for you if you will let him. He is a couple of hours away, but is still willing to drive to help your baby. We are still looking for someone closer to you, but this is an example of the lengths that TSB will go to help.
Please open your heart to what is best for your baby. They really do need other squirrels and experienced people. We all know that the very hardest thing we ever have to do is to say goodbye to them. However, saying goodbye when they go off to a rehabber is far better than saying goodbye when we have to lay them to rest.

[dragonwcc]

254140
254141
thanks for the hoodie idea

[dragonwcc]

yes tell them i am willing to let her go

[Spanky]

The small chicken wire cage will not be suitable for your squirrel long term and until he is ready for release. They also require a very large "release cage" out of doors (4 X 6 X 8 kind of size) to prepare them for life in the trees. Please trust us that squirrels do not make good pets, especially healthy squirrels.

I know the TSB admins are trying to locate members that are closer to you that can help and I really hope they are able to find a very experienced person closer to NW Georgia. In absence of that, I offered the other day to help and my offer is still open. I am too far away to come for any sort of assessment but I am willing to make the drive if you are okay with my taking the remaining little fellow and doing all I can to release a healthy, happy squirrel into the tree tops. I will post updates and pictures to TSB so you can follow his progress... and I have many releases that I still see every single day and even watch them raise babies of their own!

"NW Georgia" could be anywhere from 1.5 to 4 hours away from me (Toccoa area). You can PM me your more specific location if you don't want to post on the thread. I will PM my number.

[TubeDriver]

Thank you! Sometimes the hardest thing is letting them go but getting this baby to an experienced rehabber will give her the best chance of growing up healthy and being released to the wild where she belongs. You played a role in initially saving her and she will always owe you that! :thumbsup

In the meantime before a rehabber can get her, add a hoodie and some more tee shirts so she will be comfortable.



yes tell them i am willing to let her go

[SammysMom]

Thank-you Dragon... You do love her... :grouphug:Love_Icon:grouphug

[Nancy in New York]

yes tell them i am willing to let her go

Now you are exactly what we need on this board.
So often we get the members who love their squirrels to death, and
cannot part with them...........the majority of them are in "All Squirrels Go to Heaven" thread.
I will send you a "starter" kit with syringes, nipples, fleece and some other goodies.

Hold onto it, because once you have found a squirrel, they will find you again.
You will get your chance at rehabbing because YOU are exactly what is needed to make
an excellent candidate.
Thank you for giving Sissy the best possible chance. :hug

[dragonwcc]

thank you all for being so very supportive, Spanky is heading to here to get sissy, i hate to lose them both, but i want sissy to have a fighting chance to make it :grouphug

[TubeDriver]

:grouphug


thank you all for being so very supportive, Spanky is heading to here to get sissy, i hate to lose them both, but i want sissy to have a fighting chance to make it :grouphug

[SammysMom]

Thank-you so much Dragon...This is the ultimate gift you can give to Sissy. :grouphug:Love_IconDragon & Sissy:Love_Icon:grouphug

[island rehabber]

Good work, Dragon! You know you are doing the very best possible thing for little Sissy. :thumbsup

[Annabelle's papa]

yes tell them i am willing to let her go

:) Bless Your Heart dragonwcc, Spanky is Great and only a couple of hours away, I live about the same distance from both of Ya'll. With my limited technical experience with Squirrel's, especially young one's or Baby's, I'm glad to know there is a fellow member that could take one or some if it were necessary. And Spanky mentioned posting lot's of Photo's and updates on the Board so you can follow the Lil' Ones progress, you could even participate in the release when the time comes.:dance (Hope I'm not overstepping Spanky.) :grin2

:) Now that you have experienced "Squirrel Magic", you could further your rescue/rehabilitation knowledge by reading up everything you can and preparing yourself for the "next" Squirrel's that come your way. (And there will be more, because you have become attuned to them.) :tinfoil Most important, beside's your dedication to Sissy, you have found a Wonderful and Knowledgeable site to reference any time of the day or night, after all you are a member of The Squirrel Board .

[dragonwcc]

sissy refuses the new cage will only go to sleep in my hands
254152

[Nancy in New York]

sissy refuses the new cage will only go to sleep in my hands
254152

So precious, thank you for sharing this photo. :hug:Love_Icon

[TubeDriver]

Dragon - stick around! :) You can see and learn so much here on the TSB! Anyone who cares about squirrels is welcome and will fit right in around here!:thumbsup

[dragonwcc]

Spanky now has Sissy and is heading to her new home! its hard to see her go but i am happy she is now in experienced and capable hands, cant wait to see her in her new home! :grouphug

[TubeDriver]

:):thumbsup


Spanky now has Sissy and is heading to her new home! its hard to see her go but i am happy she is now in experienced and capable hands, cant wait to see her in her new home! :grouphug

[dragonwcc]

oh yes, ill be sticking around!

[SammysMom]

We are so glad to have you here among us. You really did do a wonderful thing today...
Charlie is on his way home with Sissy and he will give her a very good chance. You are her hero...:Love_Icon:Love_Icon:Love_Icon

[Shewhosweptforest]

Now you are exactly what we need on this board.
So often we get the members who love their squirrels to death, and
cannot part with them...........the majority of them are in "All Squirrels Go to Heaven" thread.
I will send you a "starter" kit with syringes, nipples, fleece and some other goodies.

Hold onto it, because once you have found a squirrel, they will find you again.
You will get your chance at rehabbing because YOU are exactly what is needed to make
an excellent candidate.
Thank you for giving Sissy the best possible chance. :hug

:goodpost :clap Such a generous offer :Love_Icon
Oh dragon :hug I know this was hard:Love_Icon Nancy is so right.....there will be other babies....there always are. Now that you're on our radar, we have another person we can send a baby in need to. :bowdown as others have said Sissy now has a fighting chance to grow up and thrive, this would have never happened without you. You are her angel:Love_Icon I'm so sorry you lost her brother. We never know what trauma they've been through when we get them, and sometimes we can't help :dono I do know the kitten milk does compromise them, unfortunately, vets and other rehabbers continue to recommend it with dire results. You did a wonderful job:hug And both these babies would be gone if not for you efforts:Love_Icon

[dragonwcc]

thank you Shewhosweptforest for you kind words, im praying that sissy makes it all the way, and as for the kit, just pm me and ill send you my address

[Nancy in New York]

oh yes, ill be sticking around!
:grin2
Well I think I can safely say, you have friends for life. :hug
Read the board every chance you get. Ask questions. Start a new thread
as a running journal if you want advice. We are ALL here to help, just ask and
we will be here for you!
Thank you again for everything you have done.
To part with a beloved animal you saved from death, is admirable beyond words. :bowdown :hug

[kcassidy]

Wow good job Dragon, thank you for letting her go. I know they captured your heart, so you are hooked :) If you hang around here you will learn a lot and then you can start getting kids to raise and RELEASE ;)

I'm sure you can keep up with her on TSB, cuz Spanky will share pix. We all LOVE pix, the more the better, speaking of which, Nancy those are absolutely adorable photos of squees loving on squees. My heart imploded looking at those :)

[Spanky]

Sissy and I are home now. She did great on the way home, she slept all the way home except when I fed her about 8:45PM. Peed well, poop was yellowish... tinge of green maybe? When I got home she had some green poo in her cozy pocket but also had some runny brown poo. It did not smell good and when I took her out she was leaking a little watery poo... she seemed very excited and it seemed to make the leaking worse? I have never dealt with this rainbow of poo over just a few hours??!?!?

I spoke to dragon and she was getting formula 3 times a day and hydration every 4 hours ATC. I think her excitement may be she is extremely hungry (next feeding will be at 12:45AM)... and maybe, hopefully maybe the runs are from the sugar water? I switched her to plain water and when she stopped taking it after 1 CC, I put just a bit of honey and she took another 5cc.

[SammysMom]

I am so glad she is there with you Spanky! Thank you to Dragon and you for getting her the help she needs. The lightly sweetened water is a good idea. Flush the crap out and see what happens after a while of that.

[Spanky]

I am so glad she is there with you Spanky! Thank you to Dragon and you for getting her the help she needs. The lightly sweetened water is a good idea. Flush the crap out and see what happens after a while of that.

Ok, but just to confirm I plan on feeding Esbilac every 4 hours and the water every four (so every 2 hours she'll get something) for a while... I believe she needs nutrients. Just wanted to make sure you did not mean flush with just some water for now...

[island rehabber]

Spanky be on the alert for signs of coccidia: bubbling, runny poop that won't quit and a foul odor. You'll need Baycox to treat it.....coccidia lives in little mammal bodies but doesn't express its nasty self unless the little bodies are stressed. In this case, the stress of being abandoned and rescued is enough to bring it on in a baby squirrel.

[Nancy in New York]

I am thrilled that she made it home fine.
Yeah, that is a lot of different poops for sure.
I agree with SM about the hydration. Hopefully this will
clear up shortly.
Are you feeding the same formula that Dragon was feeding?
Perhaps this is also from her KMR switch to the Esbilac.
Their tummies are sensitive so it could be there was no
gradual transition to the good stuff. That will definitely cause
diarrhea.
IF you have some probiotics there, that should help her as well.
I like the capsules that you can pull apart and put just a tiny bit in
the formula.....about 1/5 the size of an eraser top. I use CVS's own brand, they
taste a little bit sweet with a hint of vanilla.

[Spanky]

Dragon and his family were wonderful and they were very said to see her go.. and I don't blame them. It is so hard but I know they want what is best for Sissy. Were going to make sure they can follow Sissy's progress, maybe even let nephew cousin and the family do some "face time" with Sissy on a webcam!

[Spanky]

I am thrilled that she made it home fine.
Yeah, that is a lot of different poops for sure.
I agree with SM about the hydration. Hopefully this will
clear up shortly.
Are you feeding the same formula that Dragon was feeding?
Perhaps this is also from her KMR switch to the Esbilac.
Their tummies are sensitive so it could be there was no
gradual transition to the good stuff. That will definitely cause
diarrhea.
IF you have some probiotics there, that should help her as well.

She was KMR until Saturday then switch to Esbilac which I am continuing. Yes, could be the KMR but it has been a few days now?

[Nancy in New York]

Dragon and his family were wonderful and they were very said to see her go.. and I don't blame them. It is so hard but I know they want what is best for Sissy. Were going to make sure they can follow Sissy's progress, maybe even let nephew cousin and the family do some "face time" with Sissy on a webcam!

Well that sounds perfect!
What a wonderful thing both you gentlemen did for this
little treasure! Thank you both for thinking of Sissy first. :grouphug

[dragonwcc]

we are really looking forward to seeing her! and thanks so much for driving so far for Sissy, she is not far from our thoughts!:Love_Icon

[Spanky]

Spanky be on the alert for signs of coccidia: bubbling, runny poop that won't quit and a foul odor. You'll need Baycox to treat it.....coccidia lives in little mammal bodies but doesn't express its nasty self unless the little bodies are stressed. In this case, the stress of being abandoned and rescued is enough to bring it on in a baby squirrel.

Yeah, this is my fear but while there was a foul stench it was watery. The watery gives me hope that maybe its just the sugar.. or maybe still the transition from KMR?

[Spanky]

IIF you have some probiotics there, that should help her as well.

I do have probiotic caps... I am glad you mentioned this. I was considering adding some yogurt to her Esbilac but this is a better idea than messing with her formula if she still have not adjusted to the diet change. I will go the probiotic route... :thumbsup

[SammysMom]

One big combo of all that! Please PM me your address and I am going to send you some supplies. I have Baycox and some other things that it is good to have on hand.:Love_Icon

[Spanky]

The 31 flavors continue... we are now peanut butter mousse? :dono

At least this is not watery diarrhea... we'll see what surprises 3Am will have...

[Nancy in New York]

Good Morning, how is Miss Sissy this morning?
How is papa? :)

[Spanky]

Sissy is doing good, very ravenous when its feeding time. I could only get 1.5ML of hydration in at 3AM. This morning there were some well formed dry poos in her bin. But there was a very small amount of white-ish, mucous-like gunk in her cozy pocket. I was concerned she was pooing undigested formula and her cozy pocket would be a mess of this gunk, but there was only that small amount (1/2 the size of a pea?). I will be able to keep a better eye on her during the day today and maybe figure it out with more certainty.

She did pee in her cozy pocket despite peeing when I stimulated her. So pee does not seem to be any problem. :thumbsup

If we could just get the poo situation straightened around now.....

[Nancy in New York]

Did that whitish substance have a odor to it?
Did you feel it to see if it felt gritty?
Where are the photos of this little Angel? :grin2 I just asked the same
thing in Sidekick's newly moved thread!
Thank you again for this remarkable gesture of helping out this
baby and driving across Georgia, at the drop of a hat.
You are truly a gift to squirrels. :grouphug

[Spanky]

Did that whitish substance have a odor to it?

I would call it "sour" but that cozy pocket is already a mess in need of a wash.. but she loves it!


Did you feel it to see if it felt gritty?[/B][/I]

No, I did not feel it but will if it shows itself again. It was on the inside up towards the opening; when I rolled down the pocket there it was... I cleaned it up before exploring further really fearing there was going to be a mess at the bottom with Sissy. When I eventually turned it inside out there was just some pee in there. The poops where not in the pocket, so she seems to be leaving the pocket at least to poop.


Where are the photos of this little Angel? :grin2 I just asked the same thing in Sidekick's newly moved thread![/B][/I]

I will try to get pics later today... going to be a busy busy day...

[RobinTN]

I've never seen it mentioned so now I'm curious, but do/can squirrels vomit or 'spit up'?

[Nancy in New York]

I wonder if it could be a tiny bit of vomit?
Well, at least you are aware of it, and I KNOW you
will be looking for anything abnormal, and keep an eagle
eye on that little darling.
Did your son go with you when you picked Sissy up?

[SammysMom]

Good morning! I am so glad to see that things are firming up!:grin3
I do wonder if the whitish stuff might have been a bit of spit-up rather than poo. Formula changes and all the activity might have upset her tummy. We definitely don't want to see vomit, but just keep an eye on her. The fact that there was formed stool is really terrific!
You are really a hero of TSB...:grouphug:Love_Icon:grouphug

[Nancy in New York]

I've never seen it mentioned so now I'm curious, but do/can squirrels vomit or 'spit up'?

Hmmmmmmmmmmm I have heard that they can't actually vomit,
though we have seen on the board where squirrels will "vomit" if they have eaten something that doesn't agree with them.
I have also seen where they will have a "spit up burp" type motion, almost like something is stuck in their throat.
But is it actual vomit, or more of a gagging reflex...............that I'm really not sure of. I hope someone else weighs in on this.
Great question.

[SammysMom]

I have had 2 who ate too fast or too much and a little bit came back up. It totally freaked me out because they are not supposed to vomit, but I almost think it hadn't really gotten to the destination before it came back up.

[Spanky]

It is also my understanding that squirrels cannot vomit. This was not like a full on vomit feast though.. I think Gayle has it nailed.. little girl is ravenous when she eats and wants to eat too much. She got 7.3ML (102GM last night), so I went over the 7% a tinge. And she would have eaten 20ML I am sure had I let her... a few minutes later she was asleep and forgot about eating more food. I think maybe it never got all the way to her stomach. Like I said not a lot of matter.

Not to thread jack but a story about vomiting... KT saved a squirrel from a Lowe's a few years back. A couple of the workers were "kicking it" towards the door trying to "release" it. When she confronted them they told her the squirrel was sick and vomiting and pointed to a liquid mess on the floor. She took control, started barking orders at the two workers to stop, get her a box and a rag or something to pick up the little one. They quickly fell into line, did her bidding and on her way out the door with "Peggy" a cashier stopped her and thanked her for intervening. The cashier mentioned she was frightened for a family in the garden part of the store, up in the rafters so KT gave her our number. We never got the call, but the cashier later told us the squirrel family eventually evacuated their nest and as far as she knew all were well. Peggy spent a few days in observation and was released to the trees.... I believe I still see her occasionally.

KT is my hero! :serene

Edit: She even had the wherewithal to get the items she had gone to Lowe's to pick up to begin with!

[RobinTN]

Not to thread jack but a story about vomiting... KT saved a squirrel from a Lowe's a few years back. A couple of the workers were "kicking it" towards the door trying to "release" it. When she confronted them they told her the squirrel was sick and vomiting and pointed to a liquid mess on the floor. She took control, started barking orders at the two workers to stop, get her a box and a rag or something to pick up the little one. They quickly fell into line, did her bidding and on her way out the door with "Peggy" a cashier stopped her and thanked her for intervening. The cashier mentioned she was frightened for a family in the garden part of the store, up in the rafters so KT gave her our number. We never got the call, but the cashier later told us the squirrel family eventually evacuated their nest and as far as she knew all were well. Peggy spent a few days in observation and was released to the trees.... I believe I still see her occasionally.

KT is my hero! :serene

Edit: She even had the wherewithal to get the items she had gone to Lowe's to pick up to begin with!

She's Peggy's hero for sure! I love it when people stand up against bullies, esp when their victims don't have a voice of their own:nono

[kcassidy]

It is also my understanding that squirrels cannot vomit. This was not like a full on vomit feast though.. I think Gayle has it nailed.. little girl is ravenous when she eats and wants to eat too much. She got 7.3ML (102GM last night), so I went over the 7% a tinge. And she would have eaten 20ML I am sure had I let her... a few minutes later she was asleep and forgot about eating more food. I think maybe it never got all the way to her stomach. Like I said not a lot of matter.

I was told this too, but actually I've seen them puke with my own two eyes and it was done with flair and gusto :) I had a piglet squirrel and when she was given to me by a finder (who kept her for weeks) she went bonkers eating FV and some fruit and veggies, 20 minutes later she was hacking and puking. It lasted for about 15 minutes, of puking laying stretched out, then more puking. She is still around today, so it didn't kill her :D

I have seen them do the gagging thing too, but this was definitely puke and it was partially digested avocado, foamy formula and some lettuce :D

As for the Lowe's story, you wouldn't want to see what I would have done... or maybe you would have. I wouldn't have left it with just words, believe me. I HATE most people.

[dragonwcc]

so happy to hear sissy is doing well :serene

[TubeDriver]

Squirrels can not vomit in the way that we can (a specific set of muscular contractions that is designed to eliminate stomach contents). They can have food/liquids fill up they throats and rush out, they can gag a bit and they do seem to be able to sometimes gag up stomach contents. But this is not the way their physiology is designed so it means something is really wrong.


All the stress, the multiple formula changes over a short period of time will likely cause some issues. I would just take things as gradually as possible, work on getting her really hydrated and hope this clear up of the next 2 days or so. I would have Baycox on hand, just in case.

[Spanky]

Squirrels can not vomit in the way that we can (a specific set of muscular contractions that is designed to eliminate stomach contents). They can have food/liquids fill up they throats and rush out, they can gag a bit and they do seem to be able to sometimes gag up stomach contents. But this is not the way their physiology is designed so it means something is really wrong..

With the Lowe's incident, KT was sure that whatever was on the floor did not come from the squirrel's stomach. It was "several cups" of fluid (she is a great cook!).


All the stress, the multiple formula changes over a short period of time will likely cause some issues. I would just take things as gradually as possible, work on getting her really hydrated and hope this clear up of the next 2 days or so. I would have Baycox on hand, just in case.

Certainly Sissy has had her share of stress the past few days. I think, though, there has been only 1 formula change... maybe I need to re-reread the original thread... from KMR to Esbilac (which she is on now). But I am uncertain if the changeover was completed before I got her as I know Dragon was hydrating, hydrating, hydrating.

[TubeDriver]

I might have misread. Sounds like you are doing everything great, hope the runny poops stop soon!



With the Lowe's incident, KT was sure that whatever was on the floor did not come from the squirrel's stomach. It was "several cups" of fluid (she is a great cook!).



Certainly Sissy has had her share of stress the past few days. I think, though, there has been only 1 formula change... maybe I need to re-reread the original thread... from KMR to Esbilac (which she is on now). But I am uncertain if the changeover was completed before I got her as I know Dragon was hydrating, hydrating, hydrating.

[Spanky]

Here is her latest poo. This is not what I suspected previously was vomit. The presumed gagged up was more white... looked like gacked up formula. This is not gritty. He little bottom is swollen but not red. The tan fleece on top is her cozy pocket turned inside out. She will need a bath soon... for now, baby wipes. No more pocket until it is clean and her poops are as poops should be!
254211

And here is a picture of her this morning... I snapped a few but none were really good.. this was the best one. I will post more later.
254212

She dragged her bottom across my poker table (well, the poker table has padding on it and they can't catch their nails on the "speed cloth") and the towel (which was over her bin) was handy since she was not staying on the paper towel. I will have fleece on top of the table next!!! :yuck

(Now I will just wait, watch and read your feedback).

[Nancy in New York]

Akkkkkk thanks for the photos.
I will post more later.............but she is ADORABLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[island rehabber]

She is TOTALLY adorable! Still spiky, so we must assume that although she's been hydrated for days she is losing fluids through diarrhea? Also, could you post a pic of her head-on? There appears to be a bump or swelling on top of her head but it could be the angle of this shot.

[Spanky]

I did investigate that black spec on her ear.. whatever It was it is gone now (and not hopping around in her bin!).

254221

How about some watermelon for Sissy?

[island rehabber]

Give that baby ANYTHING she wants! :Love_Icon:Love_Icon:Love_Icon :grin2

[SammysMom]

Oh that FACE!!! :grouphug:Love_Icon:grouphug

[Nancy in New York]

I did investigate that black spec on her ear.. whatever It was it is gone now (and not hopping around in her bin!).

254221

How about some watermelon for Sissy?

I KNOW we are not suppose to copy pictures, but this is TOO cute not to keep it going. :Love_Icon:Love_Icon:Love_Icon :klunk

[pjjere]

Just wanted to weigh in on squirrel vomit. When we released Nutkin last spring she appeared to vomit 3 times. It actually looked like her stomach/chest was contracting and what looked like whitish foam came out. It was really hot on release day and of course she ate everything in sight, dirt, bark, mushrooms, etc. After vomiting she let me approach her and drank water (yes I was carrying a large cup of water around in case she got thirsty, i wanted her to have one easy day). She also seemed to bounce back right away and had no long term ill effects. Anyway we need lots of pics of these adorable babies!

[Kristi S]

This poor little sweetie has been through a lot! Coccidia is a worry, as is electrolyte loss. I'd hate to stress her more by switching foods again, but I wonder if she could have a temporary lactose intolerance if she's not digesting the formula well, and easing onto probiotic yogurt might help? I don't know, I probably shouldn't muddy the waters with yet more ideas.

It seems that many of the online stories about rodents and vomiting are principally based on a single study. I've been reading this study in the original form, and there are a few potential problems with it, as I see it. Only 3 emetics (things that induce vomiting in other species) were looked at, and some of the statistics were done by combining results of all the rodents tested (of 6 species) for comparison with 3 species that do show vomiting, but since there was considerable variation within both groups, among species, this might not be justified statistically; it was necessary because of small sample sizes. The study also assumes that the brain structures that are associated with vomiting in emetic species are the same as those in rodents.

On the other hand, there appears to be other experiential and experimental data suggesting rats, at least, don't vomit, and this study was apparently designed to figure out why that might be the case rather than demonstrate that is it the case across all rodent species.

While it does offer some evidence for the lack of vomiting in squirrels, my feeling is that it's not enough for certainty. Such is the way of science: multiple studies are often necessary to reach solid conclusions. The brilliance of science is that nothing is ever "proved," leaving the door always open to learning (though many things have been so well established that they might as well be treated as certain).

Many rodents will self-treat when they swallow something toxic by eating soil containing clay, which binds to the toxins and makes them inert. Eating soil may also be in response to specific nutrient deficits.

Anyway, I'm on the fence about squirrels and vomiting. Some of the stories here certainly do sound like vomiting, but it's hard to tell.

There is also a difference between vomiting, which is a coordinated reflex involving many muscles, and regurgitation, which is more passive.

(Sorry for my rambling! Most of you must realize by now I'm a total science nerd.)

[Spanky]

The vomiting was a seemingly one time event and not a chronic issue for Sissy.

[kcassidy]

My squirrel only did it that one time too. There is no way it could have been regurgitation(I think), it was too much food. She was hunched over and contracting as well and making a retching sound. I was so worried, I called either Sammysmom or IR, I don't remember which and they said it should be okay, she was just puking.

So no scientific data, I would call this an empirical, one subject study :)

[Kristi S]

My squirrel only did it that one time too. There is no way it could have been regurgitation(I think), it was too much food. She was hunched over and contracting as well and making a retching sound. I was so worried, I called either Sammysmom or IR, I don't remember which and they said it should be okay, she was just puking.

So no scientific data, I would call this an empirical, one subject study :)

Works for me! Can't believe all scientific studies, especially after the media gets their hands on 'em!

[Spanky]

She is TOTALLY adorable! Still spiky, so we must assume that although she's been hydrated for days she is losing fluids through diarrhea? Also, could you post a pic of her head-on? There appears to be a bump or swelling on top of her head but it could be the angle of this shot.

Maybe it is her left ear that raised possible concerns about swelling. She does not have much of a left ear. The head on picture shows her asymmetrical ears pretty well... :klunk

[dragonwcc]

both of the babies had one ear longer than the other when i got them from the yard, my sweet baby looks so cute!

[Nancy in New York]

Maybe it is her left ear that raised possible concerns about swelling. She does not have much of a left ear. The head on picture shows her asymmetrical ears pretty well... :klunk

Oh I saw that left ear and thought it was just back more, like she couldn't decide if she were happy or mad. :grin2

[RobinTN]

Sissy really is a cutie pie:Love_Icon

Dragon, Thank You for letting Spanky help her. I think you can see she's in wonderful hands:serene
Now that the squirrels know you're a friend another one will find you sooner or later, and with everything you've learned with this experience you'll be much better prepared to help. We hope you stick around, not only to keep up with Sissy, but to learn even more. :grouphug

[Spanky]

both of the babies had one ear longer than the other when i got them from the yard, my sweet baby looks so cute!

Your baby is very cute, and extremely assertive!

There are still concerns with her hydration and runny poops. She is making progress, ever so slowly. It is never as fast as we'd like. She has not even been here an entire day and it feels like a week!

It was a very selfless thing letting her go and I know you and your family only wanted to help her whatever that required. I want you to know I am doing everything I can to help her! :thumbsup

[SammysMom]

Dragon and Spanky...you are both heroes for that little sweetheart...:grouphug:Love_Icon:grouphug

[dragonwcc]

Your baby is very cute, and extremely assertive!

There are still concerns with her hydration and runny poops. She is making progress, ever so slowly. It is never as fast as we'd like. She has not even been here an entire day and it feels like a week!

It was a very selfless thing letting her go and I know you and your family only wanted to help her whatever that required. I want you to know I am doing everything I can to help her! :thumbsup

:grouphug

[Annabelle's papa]

My squirrel only did it that one time too. There is no way it could have been regurgitation(I think), it was too much food. She was hunched over and contracting as well and making a retching sound. I was so worried, I called either Sammysmom or IR, I don't remember which and they said it should be okay, she was just puking.

So no scientific data, I would call this an empirical, one subject study :)

:) We all Know about Bovine cud chewing, but how about this "Horses Don't Toss Their Cookies Either", physically Impossible because of an esophageal valve "Flap", similar to the one we Humans have that works to keep stomach acid down.:great

:eek I would bet that Giraffes can't regurgitate either, however I put off researching this issue until a later date.:grin2

[Spanky]

The short history of Sissy weight:

03/24 11PM - 102GM
03/25 07AM - 103GM
03/25 05PM - 105GM
03/26 07AM - 115GM

All weights have been before feeding. She gets pottied every feeding and hydration but despite this when I wake her / disturb her before feeding she almost always poops some more (so I started pottying before weighing also).

She is taking 7ML of Esbilac every 4 hours ATC/6 times daily. Hydration in between every feeding (so again every 4 hours ATC). She started with only 3ML hydration for the first 4 sessions (16 hours) then I upped this to 6ML.

Her poops are no longer a different color or texture every few hours and are pretty much still like pics in post #79. And she is still spikey like that . :shakehead

Maybe I need to cut back in her formula intake.. maybe she needs more than 2 hours to move the formula out of her stomach to be ready for the hydration? Or dilute the Esbilac 3:1 for now?

Or maybe I should stay the course?

I was considering SQ if she did not hydrate by this afternoon.

Am I just being impatient.. this IS my first rodeo with a baby that was given KMR (for almost a week?). I am concerned that she just does not seem to be responding to the hydration even though she is getting so much fluid (~24ML in the last 16 hours). Maybe that is only a lot in my experience... and not so much considering Sissy's state.

She is very active at feeding times and occasionally in between. Maybe I am just frustrated and needed to vent some. :frustrated

Maybe I just need to right this all out to think through it... visual learner in chair.

Maybe all of the above?

Thanks

[TubeDriver]

Are you hydrating with just plain water at this point?

Is she peeing regularly? Is the pee clear or dark? Smelly?

[island rehabber]

When I have a persistently dehydrated baby because of diarrhea, I will sometimes give them a drop of Kaopectate just to give the bowels a 'rest' for a few hours. Kaopectate will not cure what is causing the runs but it will stop them long enough for the rest of the body to hydrate. Can't hurt. Just be aware that Kao causes blackish-grey poops so don't get scared. :grin2

[SammysMom]

There are ABs including Baycox on the way, but I sort of don't think it is coccidia. I think the poor girl has just had an awful lot of changes in diet and needs a bit of time to settle her tummy. Kaopectate might be just the thing!
Good morning little Sissy! :Love_Icon Let's hope today is a better day for :poop

[Spanky]

Are you hydrating with just plain water at this point?

Is she peeing regularly? Is the pee clear or dark? Smelly?

Just a bit of honey in the hydration. She takes twice the amount with the honey.

Pees regularly, clear and faint squirrel urine smell.

[SammysMom]

IF her pee is clear. That gain in weight says, to me anyway, that she is getting hydrated. Maybe go to 6cc per feeding and see if that firms up her poop? I would keep hydrating, but not with pedialyte. Water with as little sugar in it as she will tolerate as sugar can cause loose stool.
You're way ahead of me! Great job!

[Nancy in New York]

You can try some baby rice cereal,
mix it up like you would for a baby with her formula, warm it,
AND add baby bananas. Make it loose enough to go through a syringe
without the nipple.

Is she easy to handle, and loves her cuddles? She looks like she could
be a real strong willed sweetie.

:hug

[kcassidy]

:) We all Know about Bovine cud chewing, but how about this "Horses Don't Toss Their Cookies Either", physically Impossible because of an esophageal valve "Flap", similar to the one we Humans have that works to keep stomach acid down.:great

:eek I would bet that Giraffes can't regurgitate either, however I put off researching this issue until a later date.:grin2

Yup very true, hence why we horse owners fear colic so much.

[pappy1264]

How about FV dia-stat?

[Nancy in New York]

How about FV dia-stat?

Good thinking Mary. That stuff works great!

[TubeDriver]

Regular clear pee is GREAT sign! SM is right, I would just use plain water. If you are concerned after a lot of watery poo, give a tiny bit of pedialyte but I would mainly use pure water!



IF her pee is clear. That gain in weight says, to me anyway, that she is getting hydrated. Maybe go to 6cc per feeding and see if that firms up her poop? I would keep hydrating, but not with pedialyte. Water with as little sugar in it as she will tolerate as sugar can cause loose stool.
You're way ahead of me! Great job!

[Spanky]

How about FV dia-stat?

:facepalm

I have a new bag, in the freezer, never been opened. Got it just in case (and forgot about it!). I guess I have been lucky, or just too new... dehydrated babies have been text book: Warm, hydrate and feed. If they got loose stools, it was very temporary thing. Never had one with the runs like she that first night.

Her latest poo was moving from Dijon mustard towards more like toothpaste consistency.

[Spanky]

Is she easy to handle, and loves her cuddles? She looks like she could be a real strong willed sweetie

:laugh2
Sidekick is easier to handle than Sissy when it comes time for feeding/hydrating. She will not let me hold her, she stands on my hand or the table. She squirms and breaks loose half a dozen times when she is being pottied.

I learned a trick this morning though... during the day at the poker table, I can turn her towards the windows. She gets memorized by the wilds outside and forgets about me for a while.... and pees all over! I think she is already deciding which she will torment and which she will tolerate!

She does love to cuddle.. and by cuddle I mean she loves to get comfortable on me with her head tucked here or there... or the cutest curled up in a ball. But she is absolutely intolerant of the hoomin pillow moving around at all! Gave up holding her while working on computer.

[Duckman]

I haven't been on much the last week, but saw this and wanted to add that if she needs to get her flora back in line, in the bowels, use Acidophilis. Safe and will help stabilize the bowels enough to help with the runs. It is safe, so you don't have to worry about using it.

[stepnstone]

[FONT=Book Antiqua][B]
You can try some baby rice cereal,
mix it up like you would for a baby with her formula, warm it,
AND add baby bananas. Make it loose enough to go through a syringe
without the nipple.


When Baylee had the (RUNS) I tried the hydration, the dia-stat, and she was given anti-biotics. Two at different trys. One at 10 days the other at 4 before I threw up my hands and stopped everything. Nothing was making even the slightest change! What worked (thank you Nancy) was the partial Brat, powered rice cereal with jarred baby bananas in 3-1 esbilac. It turned her around over night, perfect poops after 48 hours.
I also suggested this to another member going through this having no results with anything else and they too had the same results as I. I made it fresh each feeding with 3 tablespoons 3-1 esbilac, 1/2 level teaspoon of each rice and bananas. I did feed with the nipple attached.
[I]EDIT!!
I made it fresh each time but did let it refrigerate at the least 3 hours before warming and feeding.

[Spanky]

When Baylee had the (RUNS) I tried the hydration, the dia-stat, and she was given anti-biotics. Two at different trys. One at 10 days the other at 4 before I threw up my hands and stopped everything. Nothing was making even the slightest change! What worked (thank you Nancy) was the partial Brat, powered rice cereal with jarred baby bananas in 3-1 esbilac. It turned her around over night, perfect poops after 48 hours.
I also suggested this to another member going through this having no results with anything else and they too had the same results as I. I made it fresh each feeding with 3 tablespoons 3-1 esbilac, 1/2 level teaspoon of each rice and bananas. I did feed with the nipple attached.
EDIT!!
I made it fresh each time but did let it refrigerate at the least 3 hours before warming and feeding.

Thank you for the recipe.... I have a granddaughter so we have rice cereal. I have Apple/Strawberry/Banana baby food for Sidekick... but I am gathering plain banana is important to the brew?

[stepnstone]

Thank you for the recipe.... I have a granddaughter so we have rice cereal. I have Apple/Strawberry/Banana baby food for Sidekick... but I am gathering plain banana is important to the brew?
Although apple is part of the complete Brat diet I would just use the plain banana. Also... keep your baby at 5% feed. With Baylee I also extended her feeding times.
Edit (again) Sorry lack of sleep....
Before I started the Brat, I gave 2 feedings of homemade hydration, wanted to flush first.

[Spanky]

Sissy Day 2 Pics...

254305

254306

[Spanky]

How about FV dia-stat?

If I go with the Dia Stat would I give only the Dia Stat? Or alternate the Dia Stat with Hydration or Esbilac? Labeling covers all 3 options...

(I will get banana baby food too.)

[TubeDriver]

Klunk! :klunk



Sissy Day 2 Pics...

254305

254306

[kcassidy]

She is adorable, way to go Spanky.

[SammysMom]

She looks SO much better!!! Look at how smooth her coat is getting. You are really doing a fantastic job with her, Spanky. When I used Diastat, I replaced a couple of feedings with it. Is her stool getting any firmer at all?

[island rehabber]

omigod -- SO much better! Less like a little buffalo, and more like a little squirrel....that's what we want to see!

[dragonwcc]

cute as ever!!!:Love_Icon:Love_Icon:Love_Icon

[Spanky]

She looks SO much better!!! Look at how smooth her coat is getting. You are really doing a fantastic job with her, Spanky. When I used Diastat, I replaced a couple of feedings with it. Is her stool getting any firmer at all?

We have graduated from Dijon mustard to *almost* toothpaste...

I am still hydrating between feedings and substituted 1 formula feeding with Dia Stat. Pulled back a bit on the volume from to about 6ML.

That's the good news. :thumbsup

Working on a new post...

[Nancy in New York]

We have graduated from Dijon mustard to *almost* toothpaste...

I am still hydrating between feedings and substituted 1 formula feeding with Dia Stat. Pulled back a bit on the volume from to about 6ML.

That's the good news. :thumbsup

Working on a new post...

Wait is this a cliff hanger post...........Don't come on tomorrow and say that you lost internet! :poke:):poke

[SammysMom]

Wait is this a cliff hanger post...........Don't come on tomorrow and say that you lost internet! :poke:):poke

:rofl4

[TubeDriver]

:poke

:grin2

[Spanky]

Sorry, I did not mean to leave you hanging in that way... here are a couple videos of Sissy tonight:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nf-FD71iouA&feature=youtu.be

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TqFxW-lAAkc&feature=youtu.be

I have been focused on her diarrhea and hydration, no that I believe we are on the right track....

Edit: Updated links...

[SammysMom]

She looks terrific! How's the "toothpaste" situation? :dono

[Nancy in New York]

Sorry, I did not mean to leave you hanging in that way... here are a couple videos of Sissy tonight:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nf-FD71iouA&feature=youtu.be

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TqFxW-lAAkc&feature=youtu.be

I have been focused on her diarrhea and hydration, no that I believe we are on the right track....

Edit: Updated links...

Oh Charlie, does she have a problem with her back left leg?
It appeared in the second video that she was dragging it a little, and it
turns out to the left somewhat.

[dragonwcc]

those videos are so cute, thats my little girl!:Love_Icon:Love_Icon:w00t

[Spanky]

Oh Charlie, does she have a problem with her left leg? It appeared in the second video that she was dragging it a little, and it turns out to the left somewhat.

Dag nabit! I was so hopeful after Gayle's post (it's nothing you did Gayle, it is easy to miss in the short video). Sometimes I don't want to see what I my eyes are showing me. So I don't prejudice the post with "do you see ????".

Yes, I have been noticing an issue with her back end, especially the left. But I knew that I had to focus on the other immediate issues first.. and I don't even know if there is anything to do but hope a healthy diet and her natural healing powers will recover/recuperate/heal her.

Let me know if there is ANYTHING that I can do for her... :sniff

Edit: I will try to get better video of this issue over the next few days.

[Nancy in New York]

Dag nabit! I was so hopeful after Gayle's post (it's nothing you did Gayle, it is easy to miss in the short video). Sometimes I don't want to see what I my eyes are showing me. So I don't prejudice the post with "do you see ????".

Yes, I have been noticing an issue with her back end, especially the left. But I knew that I had to focus on the other immediate issues first.. and I don't even know if there is anything to do but hope a healthy diet and her natural healing powers will recover/recuperate/heal her.

Let me know if there is ANYTHING that I can do for her... :sniff

I think you are really smart not mentioning a problem when you first post. Let people comment, and then ask if they see something. Really good thinking Charlie.
Just ask my husband, I typically notice every little thing, it's a curse. :shakehead
This very well may be diet related. We have seen so many little squirrels recoup with diet alone.
Let me find a post that was made not that long ago.
You will be shocked when you see how this little one bounced back. I will look for it now. :hug

[Spanky]

Just ask my husband, I typically notice every little thing, it's a curse. :shakehead

I noticed this quite a while ago but have been pushing it to the back focusing on the hydration and loose stools. My first test was with KT, who had not seen her except maybe with me holding Sissy and it took her about 1/2 second (literally) to say "Oh... poor thing, she is dragging her legs."

[TubeDriver]

Nancy has eagle eyes! Misses nothing!:thumbsup

Sissy looks a little frail, hopefully this will heal/correct itself quickly as she gets stronger.



I think you are really smart not mentioning a problem when you first post. Let people comment, and then ask if they see something. Really good thinking Charlie.
Just ask my husband, I typically notice every little thing, it's a curse. :shakehead
This very well may be diet related. We have seen so many little squirrels recoup with diet alone.
Let me find a post that was made not that long ago.
You will be shocked when you see how this little one bounced back. I will look for it now. :hug

[Nancy in New York]

I noticed this quite a while ago but have been pushing it to the back focusing on the hydration and loose stools. My first test was with KT, who had not seen her except maybe with me holding Sissy and it took her about 1/2 second (literally) to say "Oh... poor thing, she is dragging her legs."

Yeah Spanky I hate to tell you, KT and I must be cut from the same cloth. :shakehead
Because I KNOW that you and Rich are! :)

[Nancy in New York]

Spanky when you get a chance, go to this post #104 and look at this little one.
This girl just came back on the board to announce that her little squirrel was released.
SO............there is always hope with great nutrition.

http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?47435-Need-medicine-dose-FAST!!!/page6

[Spanky]

Spanky when you get a chance, go to this post #104 and look at this little one.
This girl just came back on the board to announce that her little squirrel was released.
SO............there is always hope with great nutrition.

http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?47435-Need-medicine-dose-FAST!!!/page6

If that sweet Sandy can recover from her challenges, I know Sissy can too!

Speaking of great nutrition I need to order Sissy some HHB Growth formula. I will do that now (Sidekick finished the picky bites I had on hand and is being picky about the adult blocks I ordered for him :shakehead so I will order him some more picky... ).

Edit: Growth Formula is Hi-Protein formula now?

[SammysMom]

Oh yeah...there is no going back from picky blocks...:nono
I ran out of blocks a few days ago and mine are staging a protest...:shakehead
All I had was a bag of growth blocks. They are NOT impressed!:tap

[Nancy in New York]

If that sweet Sandy can recover from her challenges, I know Sissy can too!

Speaking of great nutrition I need to order Sissy some HHB Growth formula. I will do that now (Sidekick finished the picky bites I had on hand and is being picky about the adult blocks I ordered for him :shakehead so I will order him some more picky... ).

Edit: Growth Formula is Hi-Protein formula now?


Isn't little Sandy amazing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Now that sure can put a huge
smile on your face!
The only blocks I ever get are the wild bites and the picky ones.
Not sure if the growth formula are hi protein now. :dono

[SammysMom]

Yep, Growth = High protein
The babies do great with them, but once they try the picky blocks it's all over! :nono

[SammysMom]

I do see the little bit of oddity in her gait. Pendleton couldn't even stand up on his own. I say she will be just perfect before you know it. God Spanky...she is so beautiful...:Love_Icon:Love_Icon:Love_Icon
Thank-you, Dragon, for trusting Spanky...he will have her right as rain before you know it!:Love_Icon

[dragonwcc]

I do see the little bit of oddity in her gait. Pendleton couldn't even stand up on his own. I say she will be just perfect before you know it. God Spanky...she is so beautiful...:Love_Icon:Love_Icon:Love_Icon
Thank-you, Dragon, for trusting Spanky...he will have her right as rain before you know it!:Love_Icon

I know it! i cant wait!

[Nancy in New York]

Dragon, do you know if she ever caught her leg in the cage or anything?
Was she always like this that you can recall?

Aren't you thrilled to see your little girl? Gosh, she sure is CUTE! :Love_Icon

[dragonwcc]

not to take away from Sissy at all but i wanted to give you guys an update on me and my family, once i get my package from nancy, im going to buy some proper cages, tons of fleece, and other cuddling items and be super prepared,and more esbalic as i gave my can to spanky to go with my baby girl, i am also going to make a flyer to give to the local vet that i went to that told me to give it kitten milk( i am not upset with them, the woman has helped my family ALOT the past few years i think she just has some really bad information, i know she has a huge heart for all animals) i am going to include my phone number on the flyer, along with WARM-Hydrate-Feed(the proper formula)along with some other info, i also plan on getting alot better scale to weigh aswell. i also want to say i have never met such a group of dedicated people in my life, you have all touched me in a deep way, to see how you people can LOVE such tiny little babies is beyond words. to see that Spanky was willing to drive 3 hours, one way, for one baby just amazed me and my family, we are deeply deeply so grateful, i know we only had sweet Little Brother and Sissy for 8 days, but they touched us in a way that is hard to describe. i guess you can say we are hooked! after pouring hours over this board(there is SOOO MUCH to take in) and seeing so many sweet babies being saved we as a family are willing to help out in any way we are able.

Ken Chapman and Family

[dragonwcc]

Dragon, do you know if she ever caught her leg in the cage or anything?
Was she always like this that you can recall?

Aren't you thrilled to see your little girl? Gosh, she sure is CUTE! :Love_Icon

i do not remember her foot seeming to twist like that, but i did not have a larg area for her to run like that table Spanky has, she was either going stir crazy in her cage and climbing all over (i did not ever witness her foot get stuck in anything) or climbing on me or my sister(she never fell off of us) or sleeping

and yes, she is the sweeeeeeetest little thing i have ever met! it thrills me every pic and video! (more more more pix and videos!):grin3

[SammysMom]

Ken, these are words that make all that we do here on TSB worth every moment and every mile worth it. Spanky was the epitome of what we all strive to be for these little innocent ones when he drove all that way. However, YOU were a hero in this scenario too. You knew that Sissy needed more than what you were equipped to give because you just didn't have all of the tools. You are now talking about filling your toolbox with what you need as well as reading and participating in the threads here. You will be used as an example of what people who find a baby need to do. You can help us to ensure that they know that much joy can come from watching them grow even from afar. God bless you for writing these very touching words. You made the hardest choice and you did it with love. Thank-you!:Love_Icon:Love_Icon:Love_Icon

[TubeDriver]

:w00t:thumbsup



not to take away from Sissy at all but i wanted to give you guys an update on me and my family, once i get my package from nancy, im going to buy some proper cages, tons of fleece, and other cuddling items and be super prepared,and more esbalic as i gave my can to spanky to go with my baby girl, i am also going to make a flyer to give to the local vet that i went to that told me to give it kitten milk( i am not upset with them, the woman has helped my family ALOT the past few years i think she just has some really bad information, i know she has a huge heart for all animals) i am going to include my phone number on the flyer, along with WARM-Hydrate-Feed(the proper formula)along with some other info, i also plan on getting alot better scale to weigh aswell. i also want to say i have never met such a group of dedicated people in my life, you have all touched me in a deep way, to see how you people can LOVE such tiny little babies is beyond words. to see that Spanky was willing to drive 3 hours, one way, for one baby just amazed me and my family, we are deeply deeply so grateful, i know we only had sweet Little Brother and Sissy for 8 days, but they touched us in a way that is hard to describe. i guess you can say we are hooked! after pouring hours over this board(there is SOOO MUCH to take in) and seeing so many sweet babies being saved we as a family are willing to help out in any way we are able.

Ken Chapman and Family

[Spanky]

Sissy's poops are returning to the runny side this morning (started overnight), so that is a step back. She weighs 112, which is down a little from 115 yesterday.

Dia-Stat
She has had 2 feedings of Dia-Stat since yesterday afternoon which I alternated with her formula and continued hydration in between. The FV site reads: "DIA-STAT is advised to be used as a complete meal for 2 feedings". This was not on the label of the bag I have, so I went with their site assuming it represents the most recent guidelines. So far there results are opposite of what I want, but I realize this is anecdotal and more time is needed to see results from the Dia-Stat. So my fingers and toes are crossed.

(Though the site (and bag) also reads not to feed Dia-Stat as sole source of nutrients for more than one day. I assume this means when you are combining Dia-Stat with hydration before you've started any sort of formula. This little one needs nutrients and she is active.)

So I figure her Dia-Stat therapy has ended and we are wait to see the results. Let me know if I have this protocol wrong or how you have used Dia-Stat successfully.

I have cut back her Esbilac by 1ML (to ~6ML) starting 11:30AM yesterday and she continues to get hydration in between. So the Dia Stat and the cut back may have contributed to the recent slight weight decrease. Her weight has increased only 7 grams since Tuesday at 11PMish. I had been counting the hydration improving and the weight gain as "wins". We need more "wins" today... Sissy and I have already talked about this morning and we have both committed to do our parts to end the day with a great big "Yee-Haw" in the win column.

I do intend on switching the hydration to plain water (it had included just a bit of honey as she is much more willing to readily take more (6ML) versus plain water (3 - 4ML)). So plain water hydration starting this morning but no decrease in volume even if it takes an hour to get it all in her... I don't know there was enough honey/sugar to matter, but I need to figure out how to get her over the "hump" and get to a happy poop.

If we don't get the results we need from Dia-Stat and I need to start considering BRAT brew. That being said, SnS said he flushed with hydration for 2 feedings beforehand to flush. Would I want to flush Sissy? I know I don't want to flush the Dia Stat and allow it time to do its magic (I hope)... so if I go with BRAT brew (let's say this weekend if we are not right as rain) would I really want to take 8 hours to flush (2 feedings) before giving the BRAT brew? I'd be flushing Esbilac and we know its good stuff even if she is not handling it well. If anything its the KMR that has her system messed up, not to discount the lack of enough nutrients, but the KMR was stopped 5 days ago. Just trying to think ahead and be prepared.

[island rehabber]

Spanky, just because I want to complicate things (not really :grin2), her runny poops are not mustard-yellowish or bubbly, are they? Or stinky? I want to be sure we're not dealing with coccidia here. It is present in all babies' bodies and will express itself when the baby has been under stress. Often, baby squirrels will be active and hungry and happy as if nothing is going on, but meanwhile those coccidia poops keep runnng...and running....:yuck

[Spanky]

Spanky, just because I want to complicate things (not really :grin2), her runny poops are not mustard-yellowish or bubbly, are they? Or stinky? I want to be sure we're not dealing with coccidia here. It is present in all babies' bodies and will express itself when the baby has been under stress. Often, baby squirrels will be active and hungry and happy as if nothing is going on, but meanwhile those coccidia poops keep runnng...and running....:yuck

Poop pics are in post #79 on page 4 of this thread:

http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?49716-EMERGENCY-HELP-NEEDED-FAST!/page4

I will post updated poop pics when we have new "models" to photograph, but post #79 tells the story. The "firm" semi-formed model is what I have been calling the "Dijon mustard". While this AM's model was runny is was not like our model wearing the white towel but more like the model in green.

They may be yellower today, but not as dark as mustard. That could also be the camera?

I will search for a pic of coccidian poops so I can understand "bubbly" better. If you can point me to one it may save me some search time. The aforementioned "vomit" was bubbly, but white and I am still convinced that was a gacked up via her oral orifice.

It is "stinky" but I need help defining coccidian "stinky". It does not smell poopy or like "rot". While the stench is strong, its more sour. Like undigested formula; think of a baby (human) vomiting her bottle formula.

Edit: If coccidian poops look like what poops (pun intended) up on a Google search for "coccidian poops", then NO :yuck, this is not what Sissy is manufacturing.

[Spanky]

not to take away from Sissy at all but i wanted to give you guys an update on me and my family, once i get my package from nancy, im going to buy some proper cages, tons of fleece, and other cuddling items and be super prepared,and more esbalic as i gave my can to spanky to go with my baby girl, i am also going to make a flyer to give to the local vet that i went to that told me to give it kitten milk( i am not upset with them, the woman has helped my family ALOT the past few years i think she just has some really bad information, i know she has a huge heart for all animals) i am going to include my phone number on the flyer, along with WARM-Hydrate-Feed(the proper formula)along with some other info, i also plan on getting alot better scale to weigh aswell. i also want to say i have never met such a group of dedicated people in my life, you have all touched me in a deep way, to see how you people can LOVE such tiny little babies is beyond words. to see that Spanky was willing to drive 3 hours, one way, for one baby just amazed me and my family, we are deeply deeply so grateful, i know we only had sweet Little Brother and Sissy for 8 days, but they touched us in a way that is hard to describe. i guess you can say we are hooked! after pouring hours over this board(there is SOOO MUCH to take in) and seeing so many sweet babies being saved we as a family are willing to help out in any way we are able.

Ken Chapman and Family

Ken - I am honored to have been given the opportunity to help with Sissy. We are by no means out of the woods, but I have real hope she'll be free in the trees one day soon. It is more do to your spunky little fighter than anything. I am so glad you are learning and preparing, and Nancy is so sweet to get you some starter supplies. While taking care of babies is hard, and caring for sick ones like Sissy even harder, the hardest part is simply the time required. I am very lucky to work from home and so have the ability to take a few minutes every two hours for Sissy (of course that means it requires a 12 - 14 hour day to accomplish my 8 hours of productivity... but it is so worth it). And getting up every 2 hours over night with Sissy to get her through this tough spot. Even for squirrel lovers that don't have that flexibility of time, they can save more squirrels than imaginable but simply doing the right things those first few critical hours: This is the single most important moment and will determine how well everything that follows will go. Whether is it knowing how to reunite with mom or simply making sure they are WARM before giving them anything; giving them the right hydration and formulas or getting them out of the road when they still may have a fighting chance before they are hit again.

You and your family's compassion for Sissy is so apparent. We too often hear on TSB (and in person) that people are torn with intervening and helping a baby that they clearly can see desperately needs help and the dreaded "let nature take its course" cop out. In situations like Sissy's where mom was run over by a car, I always ask where in "nature" does a Ford fit? Or a Chevy running over a squirrel (/opossum/raccoon/???)? Then I ask why they think that is nature but it was not nature that brought the baby to you (as the finder) to help her?

[Spanky]

Sissy and I have already talked about this morning and we have both committed to do our parts to end the day with a great big "Yee-Haw" in the win column.

Sissy has officially graduated to STP (Sticky Toothpaste Poop). I take that was a "V" on our way to a "VV" (W), its the Yee in our Haw!

[Annabelle's papa]

:serene

[dragonwcc]

How is my little girl tonight?:poke

[Spanky]

Sorry Dragon, very busy and eventful day... I will make a quick post. Hopefully this pic will hold you over until I can get an update posted.

[island rehabber]

look at the smooth, well-hydrated coat on that baby girl! She looks excellent Spanky!

[SammysMom]

She looks wonderful! Better every post!!! :Love_Icon

[Spanky]

How is my little girl tonight?:poke

We are getting decently formed, dark poops! I am not quite ready to post the dancing poop but we are getting close. Her little butt is swollen still. :sniff

Since her 4PM feeding she has been very feisty and playful. So with every feeding and every hydration she has wanted to play for 30 - 60 minutes. So every 2 hours I am spending more than an hour with her. Leaves me not much time for other things!

She is a Houdini as Dragon already posted and made an escape out onto the table where I found her at 4PM. Later she had some red in her poop which alarmed me for a while until I figured out her Squaddy left a piece of watermelon on the table in a dish, on top of the Esbilac... I know all these details because I figured this all out from a video I had taken (thank goodness) and sighed relief when I realized her poop had red watermelon in it! So when she made her escape she helped herself to some melon.

Squaddy will make sure Sissy will not be having any more unescorted out of cage time! :nono

The new picture shows Sissy and her new best play-friend. I have some vids I need to go through, edit and post. Wore out the battery on my camera, so more vids on phone. Not sure how much will be "good". She wrestled with the stuffie for hours all together tonight it seems... She is definitely feeling much better. And restless. My hands are all scratched up and she nearly bit through my skin a few times! :ouch

I think Sissy will be graduating to her big girl cage tomorrow. The bin has seemed to shrink around her in a few short hours. I would do it tonight but I want to observe her through the day in her new cage before she overnights downstairs. Sidekick will be getting a roomy (just so no one is alarmed: Separate cages, same room!). Maybe I can see about that camera too. :thumbsup

It was a great day for Sissy with a great big "W" in our win column. Everyone give me a "Yee-Haw"!!!!

Edit: I forgot something VERY IMPORTANT: I think her back end is already improving! I hardly notice her dragging those legs any longer.

PS I am exhausted.. 40 minutes until next formula feeding then I get to sleep for maybe 90 minutes!!!!

[SammysMom]

YeeHaw for sure!!!:Love_Icon:Love_Icon:Love_Icon

[dragonwcc]

look at that sweeeeeet baby!!:bliss Spanky you are wonder worker!!:wahoo

[Annabelle's papa]

look at that sweeeeeet baby!!:bliss Spanky you are wonder worker!!:wahoo

:) Morning Dragon, I'll get up some links, acquiring Rehab Certification in Georgia appears from what I've researched, to be cut and dry. :great The DNR site offers a few manuals for study, and the Certification test is a mere 50.00. It would certainly be beneficial for us to legitimize what we are doing for these Lil' Ones. :thumbsup

[dragonwcc]

:) Morning Dragon, I'll get up some links, acquiring Rehab Certification in Georgia appears from what I've researched, to be cut and dry. :great The DNR site offers a few manuals for study, and the Certification test is a mere 50.00. It would certainly be beneficial for us to legitimize what we are doing for these Lil' Ones. :thumbsup

thanks annabelle that sounds good to me!

[Annabelle's papa]

:) I promise to get all of the links up by morning.:thumbsup

[Spanky]

After some delay and much anticipation, may I present Sissy poop dance!

:poop :poop :poop :poop brought to you by :banana :banana

254450

I really need to wear my glasses when I am focusing the camera! But we all get the idea!

Edit: I did give her some "BRAT Brew" last night.

[TubeDriver]

:bliss

POOP!

:w00t

:grin2

[SammysMom]

:fireworks:poop:poop:poop:fireworks

[Nancy in New York]

254451254452254453254455254456

[Annabelle's papa]

:thumbsup:poop:thumbsup

[dragonwcc]

:serene

[Annabelle's papa]

:)Hi Dragon, according to their website www.gadnrle.org/node/32 the following page www.gadnrle.org/node/39 has the listed requirements toward becoming Certified; Scoring 80% or better on the 100 question test, and of course allowing inspection of your facilities. There are two specific manuals required for study, "Principles of Wildlife Rehabilitation: The Essential Guide for Novice and Experienced Rehabilitatator's" You will have to call their main number in Social Circle to order this book, (770)-761-3044.

The second required manual is, "Minimum Standards of Wildlife Rehabilitation", and you can order it through this site; www.theiwrc.org/Shop/collection/catalog/page/2 And there are several other Manuals suggested by members of the Board including, "Wild Mammal Babies, The First 48 Hours And Beyond-2nd edition" and this manual can be ordered through: www.squirrelsandmore.com

Many States require working under a Licensed Rehabber for a set period of time, and I'm not sure about Georgia, however these questions can be answered for you at the (770)-761-3044 office number. And your just in time, the certification period runs from April 1 - March 31, each year.

:great I had to organize this information for my Son down in Effingham County, because He is interested in establishing a Rescue for His Church's Youth Group.

[dragonwcc]

got to see my first streaming live Sissy today! she looks so much better, and even sweeter! if thats possible:Love_Icon:Love_Icon:Love_Icon

[Spanky]

It would be impossible for me to explain how great Sissy is doing today. She is climbing, walking and running so well I am sure that the issues she was having dragging her feet will not be anything permanent.

Next phase is to help that little girl make up for lost growing time! She really likes watching the wilds on the deck, but in her new room she still has a view but not nearly as many windows. Sissy and I counted 14 squirrels at one point today... all curious about the baby watching them watch her.

I need to find some time to post more updates, but it was a busy day today. Hopefully tomorrow!

[SammysMom]

Now this is a happy update... Sissy is such a fantastic story of love from so many places...:grouphug:Love_Icon:grouphug

[dragonwcc]

:serene

[Nancy in New York]

I understand we want to leave this in the Emergency section so everyone including non-members can follow along, but now that Sissy has won her battle with the disastrous results from giving KMR (help pass the word to all the vets in your area to NOT suggest KMR for squirrel finders! :nono ) we need a new title for her thread. I just cringe every time we a new post pops up under the “Life Threatening” forum… just a “thing” I have!

How about “Sissy’s Success and Journey to the Treetops”… if that is too long we can use simply “Sissy’s Successes”, “Sissy Updates”…. Or “Superstar Sissy”… oh I could do this for an hour!

And I think her day one photo (Sissy @ Spanky's) is an appropriate one to start the next chapter... the happy chapter chronicling Sissy's journey to the treetops...

254583

OK Spanky how shall we do this? Move the whole thread and put which title?
AND where would you want this Success stories or Nursery.
Just let me know and we will get that done ASAP.
OR you could start a new thread wherever you like and always link back to this one
if members want to read the whole story.
Whatever you want, we will make it work!
I LOVE that photo! :Love_Icon

[Nancy in New York]

For anyone wanting to continue to read Sissy's story,
a new thread has been created showing her journey to the treetops.

http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?49794-Sissy’s-Success-and-Journey-to-the-Treetops

The forum to follow that will be the Success Stories Forum.
Stay Tuned. :bliss