HELP DIARRHEA WON'T GO AWAY

[shmmore]

I am a rehabber and have 3 squirrels. Two are brother and sister around 9 weeks old and the other one is around 7 weeks old. The two older squirrels have had diarrhea that WILL not go away. The boy has it off and on and the girl has had it constantly for over 2 weeks. The girl is looking like she has lost a little bit of weight but does not seem to be dehydrated. I am not giving them many pecans or letting them over eat. I give them ammodium? At every feeding and it literally won't stop. BTW the unrelated young squirrel does not have diarrhea at all. What can I do?

[farrelli]

Are they on any antibiotics? Have you had a fecal done? Does it stink or is green?

[SammysMom]

Can you tell us exactly what you are feeding every day?

[farrelli]

Btw, don't remember AMdm being given but a couple drops of Kaopectate is relatively common.

You might do a search on diarrhea because we have several active threads on it with a variety of diarrhea types. It's been a very bad season for it.

[stepnstone]

Can you tell us exactly what you are feeding every day?

:yeahthat Definitely where I would start especially seeing we're talking 7 & 9 week olds and reading this...


I am not giving them many pecans or letting them over eat.

[Mommaluvy]

Also if you weigh them on a gram scale ( kitchen scale ) a weight.. or being able to track it is very helpful.

Weight?
Formula?
how often they feed?
Rough idea of what solids they are eating?

Poop texture? Smell? Color?

Do you have vet access? a

Things you can do.. Hydrate with plain water or just a smidge of sugar ( maple syrup, Molasses , plain sugar ) In between feedings. This is VERY important esp if its non stop diarrhea .

Also Put them back on heat if they are not still on it since they are sickly. You don't want them to be expending calories trying to keep warm esp if you think one has lost weight.

Two weeks is a long time to be sick..if you have vet access ... now is the time.

What is their behavior like? Normal but with the runs? lethargic?

Have you tried Pumpkin?

Have you tried either or both Reducing the amount fed per feeding and or increasing the hours between feedings?

I know its annoying to come on and ask and be hit with amillion questions but sometimes its really in the details.

[nuttysquirrels]

Constant diapoo's for their ages,,, I would def get a fecal test done.

[shmmore]

Their poop is yellow. I can't smell so I have no idea how bad the smell is.

I am feeding them what the other rehabber came up with and has never had any problems. It's 1 cup scalded vitamin d milk, a vitamin e capsule, 4 tbsp heavy whipping cream, baby banana, and 4 tbsp Dannon all natural yogurt. I feed then now 3 times a day and I don't even them over eat. They also have cheerios and rodent blocks available in their cage.

I have tried everything and it just won't stop. The youngest squirrel doesn't have diarrhea at all and is in the same cage with them. I change their bedding every day. Could it be coccidia if two have it but not the third?

Also I forgot to mention their behavior. They seem like normal baby squirrels! They climb around on their cage and make noises to each other. They don't seem like they feel bad at all

[Mommaluvy]

Their poop is yellow. I can't smell so I have no idea how bad the smell is.

I am feeding them what the other rehabber came up with and has never had any problems in years. It's 1 cup scalded vitamin d milk, a vitamin e capsule, 4 tbsp heavy whipping cream, baby banana, and 4 tbsp Danson all natural yogurt. I feed then now 3 times a day and I don't even them over eat. They also have cheerios and rodent blocks available in their cage.

I have tried everything and it just won't stop. The youngest squirrel doesn't have diarrhea at all and is in the same cage with them. I change their bedding every day. Could it be coccidia if two have it but not the third?

YES IT COULD be coccidia.. but..( see below) . I had 6 squirrels together and 4 got different diarrhea. Two never contracted it. Only one of those two that never got sick got treated. The other moved up into the big squirrels cage. Its the stress of the individual squirrel that sets it off.

Ok.. I know you have never had a problem with it before.. but it COULD be the scalded milk.

He needs to be on Esbilac or Fox valley. OR some Goats milk home made forumla.

[Mommaluvy]

http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?29552-Scalded-cow-s-milk

Here is a good thread about it. I have never asked why it was bad for the squirrel.. and the reason why is because I know it can be bad for children.

Scalded and SKINNED milk ( boiling it to the point a skin forms.. then you remove the skin and feed to the child )

This I have actually used once or twice when my children got Second Summer. Its considered an old wives tale.. but some of my kid s and my nephew even got it. It was with my nephew I saw it used and it cured what doctors could not even after he had been hospitalized for chronic Diarrhea.

Would I use it again? Probably. And even when I used it and saw my Mississippi Granny ( who was born in 1898) use it on my nephew it was never used more than one or two times.

Someone told me it was dangerous and so I finally researched it. The process condenses the milk and raises the sodium content or something.

So I would go to a wal mart or a grocery store and get goats milk or Esbilac with probiotics and move him off the boiled/scalded or Skinned milk asap. http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=888&dat=19710707&id=yu9RAAAAIBAJ&sjid=2nUDAAAAIBAJ&pg=7069,1001727

I dunno if I would even transition at this point.

I think I can safely say that boiled cows milk is a definite nono. I am not saying this because I own stock, or because I am a no it all. I am not :) But in my old rehab life.. we never used cow milk.. and I can not find any sane websites that recommend scalded. Some squirrels may survive on that.. but most don't do very well.

Someone correct me if I am wrong.

[Nancy in New York]

Interesting read about the woman who pushes her scalded milk recipe.

This is just part of it.


greyhalo, I am running out the door but if you put "Clarissa" into the Search bar up along the top of this frame, you will see all the threads in which she and her HORRIBLE "diets" are discussed here on TSB. For the most part, her advice is crap. There are always a few elements of truth in any lie, but most of what she says is ruinous to squirrels.....MANY of us here have tried to save squirrels who were so badly damaged by two weeks on her scalded milk mess that they died. Usually it starts with diarrhea (which she will try to mask with other useless 'remedies) and then emaciation because the squirrels cannot process much needed nutrition from the cow's milk. We are all so familiar with her garbage that we get a little crazy when even her name is mentioned. Go see for yourself.....

Never feed the babies any kind of cow’s milk or soymilk. These milks are quick killers for wildlife. Please DON’T use homemade formulas that can be found on the Internet. These are totally inappropriate for squirrels and the long-term effects can be deadly for them. These homemade formulas are stated as being the best when in reality they are the worst. Please do not follow them.
Christina Clark, CT Wldlife Rehabilitator for 25+ years...owner of www.squirrelsandmore.com (http://www.squirrelsandmore.com)






http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?13729-Clarissa-Summers-squirrel-care-info&highlight=clarissa

[Mommaluvy]

I assume that with such a high sodium content in the boiled milk that it would have the same effect as feeding the pedialye on the kidneys.

[SammysMom]

Seriously, if you want them to improve, you have got to change to a formula that is better. There is nothing more to be said about it. Scalded milk may accidentally keep a few squirrels alive, but I assure you that they are not healthy on the inside even if they don't show it on the outside. Please give these little ones a chance and get them the proper food.

[farrelli]

Switch to this:

243850

[shmmore]

I am getting a fecal done on them in the morning and hopefully that will declare what's wrong. But with the scalded milk, this one rehabber in the group uses only that formula and she has never had any problems at all so I don't know. I just got my rehab license and this is my first set of squirrels. I have read that milk is bad for them, but I've also read so is Esbilac.

[farrelli]

Esbilac used to be great, got reformulated and was horrible, then got reformulated again (probiotics on the label) and is now great again.

Cow milk is horrible. It's very difficult to digest, for any animal, save cows. It's full of huge molecules and lactose is nearly impossible to digest. In fact, only humans who come from cultures with a cultural history of dairy farming have selected for the gene which can break cow milk down. If you go to an Asian market, for example, you won't find dairy. They don't have that history and so can't digest it. Sqs definitely don't have that history. Heating helps break it down a bit, but it's still quite bad. The fact that this rehabber rolls the dice on this speaks volumes.

[astra]

this one rehabber in the group uses only that formula and she has never had any problems at all

i'll just say for the sake of the babies that unless one has been by her side every waking minute of her rehabbing one cannot know whether she has never had a problem or not.

Experienced rehabbers ALWAYS run into problems because no two babies are alike, and there are always babies who are compromised, have food sensitivities and so on and so forth.
So, even experienced rehabbers admit when they have difficulties and work through them, which includes ditching bad formulas and accepting better formulas.

If someone says that she "has never had a problem at all" - that's not true, sorry to say. It can't be because it is simply can't be.

And again, unless one has been by her side and observed each and every rehabbed baby, one cannot vouchsafe that she has never had a problem at all.

Good rehabbers always admit when there are problems precisely so as to figure out what caused it so that they could avoid it in the future.

Hope the fecal is informative.

Will just say that even if this fecal exam reveals some parasites (say, coccidia or something) - this, too, could easily be caused by the wrong formula.
The reason lies in the simple fact that ALL mammals (I can say about mammals as I don't know that much about birds and insects and reptiles),
so ALL mammals have some bad microorganisms living inside of them.
For example, in humans one of the most common "parasites" sort of lives in skin and due to all sorts of sensitivities, genetic predispositions, auto immune responses and so on those parasites flair up/multiply and result in acne.

Usually, wild squirrels are born with a certain "normal" amount of, say, coccidia parasites. These remain dormant when the squirrel is healthy and strong.
However, when a squirrel's immune system gets compromised as a result of bad nutrition, for example, those parasites begin to multiply and overtake the squirrel's system. (another example in squirrels - mange mites that begin to overcome a squirrel when the squirrel is compromised).

So, even if this fecal exam reveals coccidia or something like that as a cause of the diarrhea - it is very likely that it resulted from this poor little one's system being shocked by the awful formula of cow's milk and whatever else was in there.

Besides looking at the formula even the ingredients raise questions:
1. why vit. d milk? the vit. D in milk is meant for a huge human body, not for a little squirrel.
So, the amount of vit. d a tiny baby squirrel is getting from this cup of milk is totally wrong

2. what's the purpose of banana for a small baby?
Usually, mammalian babies are not meant to be fed any solids at this stage (and banana is a solid, and a non-native solid at that).
Babies should be fed proper formula/milk replacement only because their tiny GIT is not ready for any type of solids, especially, something like a banana.

3. vit. e capsule? - are there specific measurements/dosage of just how vit. e a little squirrel needs?
in humans too much vit. e leads to serious health problems.

4. and why cow's milk?
if it has to be milk, why not goat's milk?

And like farrelli said, unless a species has a genetic history of consuming and digesting cow's milk, using said milk is not good.

Hope the little one gets better.
But time is also of essence - these little ones cannot go malnourished for too long.
Besides, diarrhea not only dehydrates, but also causes electrolyte and all sorts of other "chemical" imbalances that can be fatal for a tiny compromised baby.
The longer it lasts, the fewer chances of recovery remain.

So, the sooner you can get the right formula into him, the better.

People here really know what they are doing.

:grouphug

[Wonkawillie]

This scalded milk formula will slowly kill the babies
Please use the valuable advice of these great people here. They have years of success rehabbing.

[shmmore]

I took them this morning and they don't have coccidia but they did have a intestinal infection. He gave me albon. I will probably be switching over to the esbilac. Like I said, this is my first set of babies and had no idea until I came here that the scalded milk was so bad for them.

But about the esbilac, how long will it last?

[island rehabber]

I took them this morning and they don't have coccidia but they did have a intestinal infection. He gave me albon. I will probably be switching over to the esbilac. Like I said, this is my first set of babies and had no idea until I came here that the scalded milk was so bad for them.

But about the esbilac, how long will it last?

I do not understand why Albon would be given for an infection...the drugs for that are usually Baytril, SMZ-TMP or Clavamox. Albon was the go-to drug for coccidia years ago but has become quite ineffective. At any rate I hope it helps.....:dono

As for the Esbilac, how long it lasts depends upon how much you buy. The can pictured in farrelli's post will easily last you 3 weeks or more if you're only feeding one or two babies. I keep mine in the freezer and just pour out one or two scoops at a time to make the formula I will need for the day.

[shmmore]

Okay thank you guys so much. The Esbilac should last a while then because I have 3 squirrels, and two are down to 2 feedings and eating mostly solids.