Adult squirrels dying in park with same symtoms

[lburney]

I have seen 3 squirrels die within 4 days in a park and these are just the ones I've 'seen' when walking my dog in one section of that park. There almost certainly are more deaths than I am seeing. All 3 were extremely weak, especially in the hind quarters. They were dead by the time I returned 5 hours later. I first noticed each of them -1 today, 1 yesturday and one 3 days ago, laying on their sides in the grass and as I got closer, each would weakly and dizzily move while dragging hind quarters that seemed just barely operable. This is in Lincoln Park in Chicago where I've fed and watched the squirrels for 6 years. This is the first time I've seen multiple squirrels dying with the same symptoms. Does anyone have any ideas as to what this could be or where I should be reporting it? Thank you.

[Somebody's Mother]

i think you would call the parks dept first and probably department of natural resources.
sounds like either mbd, but i don't know of it being an epidemic type illness. or maybe they had been poisoned in some way.
someone here will surely look to see if there is a rehabber in the area that could possibly come take a look at the situation.

[Somebody's Mother]

http://www.tc.umn.edu/~devo0028/contactA.htm#il


this is a link for illinois rehabbers. scroll down and you will find the ones within your area.

[Apple Corps]

I have seen 3 squirrels die within 4 days in a park and these are just the ones I've 'seen' when walking my dog in one section of that park. There almost certainly are more deaths than I am seeing. All 3 were extremely weak, especially in the hind quarters. They were dead by the time I returned 5 hours later. I first noticed each of them -1 today, 1 yesturday and one 3 days ago, laying on their sides in the grass and as I got closer, each would weakly and dizzily move while dragging hind quarters that seemed just barely operable. This is in Lincoln Park in Chicago where I've fed and watched the squirrels for 6 years. This is the first time I've seen multiple squirrels dying with the same symptoms. Does anyone have any ideas as to what this could be or where I should be reporting it? Thank you.

iburney - can you take one of the creatures in a plastic bag to a vet? A diagnosis is key. Also - I'll check out rehabbers on the sticky and post back.

Well - Somebody's Mother beat me to it - find the nearest and see if you can take one of these little fuzzers (alive or dead) to one of the professionals on the list. It would relly help if you could pick up one or two that are still alive (heavy gloves on - cardboard box or cat carrier - off to the vet.

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

Poisoning definetely seems like a possibility since you have found more than one affected. Here is a website for a wildlife center in Elburn. Is that near you? http://www.foxvalleywildlife.org/contact_us/. You can try giving them a call. They may not be opened until morning but I would definetely call if it is nearby and see if they know anything about the squirrel problem in the park. They may be able to send someone out to check it out.
Did the squirrels have any bumps on them, or seem injured in any way? Any open wounds?

[rippie-n-lilgirlsmom]

What kind of a horrible monster would do such a thing to tiny innocent squirrels!!:( :Cry :Cry Call the local tv news team and get it on the news!!

[lburney]

There were no bumps or visible injuries on any of them. I have tried calling vets in Chicago in the past for injured wildlife and have never found one that would treat wildlife - maybe there is a state law that prevents them from doing so in their clinics? Anyway, I will call the Fox Valley rehab center tommorrw to see what they suggest.

[Gabe]

If the rehab center is unable to help you ask them for the name of the State's Wildlife Pathologist. I know ours would be very interested in helping out. Hopefully yours will too.

[Somebody's Mother]

thank you again for caring. :thankyou

[lburney]

Great suggestion - I will do that. I do not think the park district would help - they seem to have less than zero interest in the wildlife in the park. Their current concern is how to keep the canadian geese out of the park!

[Gabe]

One more thought, double bag the dead squirrels and refrigerate them.

DO NOT FREEZE THEM. They will be unable to do a good toxicology on frozen tissue.

[Alaskan Squirrel Cam]

It sure sounds like poisoning to me...

bob

http://www.thesquirrelcam.com

[GhosTS]

Sorry to hear bout this.I think its poisoning too.

[TexanSquirrel]

:( That's really sad.

[Mrs. Jack]

The geese issue may provide some answers. Try and find out what they are doing in your parks to "dissuade" the geese. They will spray digestive irritants on the grass in parks to make them less hospitable to geese, never mind what effect it can have on them or other critters.

I am so tired of people being irate over migrating geese. OF COURSE they're going to parks, where else are they supposed to go when we've destroyed every place else? And then people feed them so duhhh of course they stay and of course they poop and then people go all apesh*t about it. (sorry for the rant). Seriously look into what is going on with the geese. dollars to donuts either officials or some stupid idiot is trying to do something and it's hurting the squirrels.

[Buddy'sMom]

Great suggestion - I will do that. I do not think the park district would help - they seem to have less than zero interest in the wildlife in the park. Their current concern is how to keep the canadian geese out of the park!
How awful about the squirrels! But, how good of you to want to take the time to find do something! :thumbsup

You're probably right that the Park District may not be interested in helping. HOWEVER, if you ask what pesticides, etc. have been applied in the park recently, they are required by law to give you that information. I'm thinking it's too early for insect-type pesticides to have been applied in Chigaco. However, rodenticides may well be used year-round and it's possible they could be applied in a way that squirrels may have access and are being poisoned. Anticoagulant-type rodenticides cause the animal to become progressivley weaker and lethargic, so this is a possible fit to what you have seen. It wouldn't directly affect use of the back limbs, but severe weakness could give the same impression, I suppose.

If you follow-up with the Park District, ask very specifically about rodenticides AND any other pesticides, herbicides or any other chemicals sprayed or applied in any way in the park. Rodenticides are typically pellets/grains that can be in bait stations or loose. Ask what the application schedule has been in the past month or so. And where in the park it was used. If you get names of any products used, I can find out more about them. And this would be helpful information to have if you can find anyone to do tox testing -- it's a help if they know what they are looking for.

However, it's also possible that something like this was used in/around any of the buildings along the park (I used to live in Chicago -- LOVED Lincoln Park!!). The squirrels could have gotten into something nearby and then went home to the park and are dying there. So not necessarily caused by something actually in the park and the Park District may say they haven't used anything. [And, of course, it's also possible that it's not something caused by pesticides, but something else altogether.]

[Buddy'sMom]

Didn't see Mrs. Jack's post until I had finished. But ... duh, yeah! Good point, Mrs. Jack! That provides another avenue to keep insisting on information, or different ways to ask, if they don't immediately respond. Sometimes it's just knowing how to ask the question so you get the right information. City employees tend to have a fairly narrow focus. "Pesticides" is pretty general, but if you only ask about that, people may not make the connection with stuff they put out for the geese.

So ask specifically: pesticides? rodenticides? herbicides? stuff to make the geese go away? stuff to prevent the geese from reproducing? any other chemical, regardless of intent or purpose?

[island rehabber]

Iburney, definitely see what you can get out of the city officials regarding substances they've put down for whatever reason. Rat poison can cause the symptoms you described. This is all very timely because something happened today that I was going to post here anyway: NRBF and I went for a quick ride to a Westcheser County waterfront part -- a very famous one which used to have lots of squirrels. I say "used to" because all we saw in the oak tree-filled grove was one little squirrel. Dead. He was a perfectly healthy little male juvenile -- maybe a fall 2006 baby -- with a beautiful coat and not a mark on him. No blood, no broken bones, but dead in the middle of the lawn. WTF??? Westchester county has a big Canada Goose "problem", too, for the same reason Mrs Jack suggested, habitat loss. I wonder if this park is spraying something as well......:soapbox

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

I thought the reason people go to parks was to see wildlife? Why kill all the wildlife, that doesn't make any sense. I don't see what the problem is with geese, sure they poop a lot, but just rinse your shoes when you get home, it comes right off. I hope you are able to get to the bottom of this lburney.

[Buddy'sMom]

IR, do you have time to check into what may have been applied in the Westchester park (I know, in your "spare" time, lol)? Also, in case you go back there, NY is the ONE state that is actually tracking wildlife mortality associated with anticoagulants and possibly could be helpful (although there is a necropsy/residue testing backlog, and also the problem here might be what they use for geese and not part of the anticoagulant issue at all). (NY State Dept. of Conservation is the tracking agency)

STILL, since both these parks have dead squirrels AND a Canada goose problem, that would be a useful avenue of inquiry.

[Momma Squirrel]

Thank you so much for being concerned and wanting to find out and take action as to what is going on. I too am like everyone else, where else are you suppose to go to enjoy the wildlife of all kinds but the PUBLIC parks. Humans are getting out of control :soapbox In 20 years kids won't even know what half the animals in the world are because they have all been destroyed by STUPID humans for their all mighty high rises and parking garages and oh yeah don't forget the Mall and Strip Malls that have to pop up for a year or two and they go out of business and sit empty :soapbox

OK sorry for the rant but damn it it makes me mad. :soapbox

[Mrs. Jack]

One compound that's been spread on grasses in parks and golf courses is methyl anthranilate, which is a natural compound found in grapes, that I guess burns the geese' stomachs. I don't know how this would effect other critters, but I do know that all over the U.S it's become war against these geese, in '06 the U.S. fish and wildlife service made it legal to hunt them w/o a permit for health officials and farmers. And made a ten day period of shooting them, those that don't get shot are dying from lead poisoning along with other birds from ingesting the lead shot left from hunter's rifle shots.

I really do think the geese issue is related to these squirrel deaths. :soapbox

[eviejenn]

You might also want to call Animal Control as well. Be sure to mention that you've noticed the dead/dying squirrels while walking your dog and that you are concerned about the possibility of disease and/or poison. If you approach the squirrels as a threat to the health & safety of domestic animals you'll probably get more of a response. TONS of people walk their dogs in Lincoln Park and there are kids everywhere, so Animal Control really should look into the situation.

[Buddy'sMom]

One compound that's been spread on grasses in parks and golf courses is methyl anthranilate, which is a natural compound found in grapes, that I guess burns the geese' stomachs. I don't know how this would effect other critters, ...........

Follow-up on methyl anthranilate:
The active ingredient is classified by FDA as GRAS (generally regarded as safe) for food use. It is not a poison per se. It is intended as a repellent so "resident Canada geese" don't want to eat there. Canada geese are considered "residents" if nesting in March (and the succeeding few months)[the definition is actually more complicated :shakehead ], so the timing could be a possible fit if they want to start harrassing the geese ASAP.

It's applied by spraying on turf, plants -- once dry, I'm not sure even a small mammal could ingest enough to be toxic (that is, there aren't pellets that can be ingested in quantity). And whatever repels geese may also be unpleasant for squirrels. However, the product label says to keep humans, pets away until dry. It's possible there are more toxic effects if a substantial quantity is ingested as liquid -- or if a small critter actually gets sprayed.

It is possible to find out what would happen in such cases, but it would take much more digging, so I won't go any further until we find out whether this product was recently used in Chicago or Westchester. My initial sense is this particular product would be unlikely to be the cause of what Iburney and IR have observed. [But this was a good start -- let me know if there are any other specific product leads and I'll check them out.]

[Apple Corps]

You might also want to call Animal Control as well. Be sure to mention that you've noticed the dead/dying squirrels while walking your dog and that you are concerned about the possibility of disease and/or poison. If you approach the squirrels as a threat to the health & safety of domestic animals you'll probably get more of a response. TONS of people walk their dogs in Lincoln Park and there are kids everywhere, so Animal Control really should look into the situation.

HUGE CAUTION with your suggestion: The animal control nazis could take that to the extreme and decide there is a serious illness in the squirrel population and they must all be exterminated. Sadly - this may not be as absurd as it initially sounds.

[acorniv]

The geese issue may provide some answers. Try and find out what they are doing in your parks to "dissuade" the geese. They will spray digestive irritants on the grass in parks to make them less hospitable to geese, never mind what effect it can have on them or other critters.

I am so tired of people being irate over migrating geese. OF COURSE they're going to parks, where else are they supposed to go when we've destroyed every place else? And then people feed them so duhhh of course they stay and of course they poop and then people go all apesh*t about it. (sorry for the rant). Seriously look into what is going on with the geese. dollars to donuts either officials or some stupid idiot is trying to do something and it's hurting the squirrels.

I had no idea people had a problem with migrating geese! We get a lot ( heard a flock today) and are always glad to see them. When they go north, they all - ever single flock - make a sharp right turn right over my house - kind of cool knowing your house is a marker to geese!

Many years ago, I used to take my son to a park in Berkeley. There were a number of ducks - many of which were rehabbed and had permanent injuries. Some idiot in the parks department decided they were a nuisance and got rid of them. They insisted they'd found a better place for them. The community had FITS! They wanted their ducks back. The parks department had to admit they'd killed them. Oooops. You can bet there were some firings and after that the park became a gauranteed sancutary for rehabbed fowl. The public made sure of it!

So... if you get to the bottom of this and there is foul play against fowl at the root of it, can you get a campaign going to stop the abuse of the geese? After all, what do they harm?

Laurel

[acorniv]

I'm really appreciating this thread. My kids volunteer at our humane society thrift shop, and we had a lady come in last week and ask if anyone could help her. She has seen 3 dead hawks in one week. Very unusual. She was concerned both for the birds and for the public health ramifications, if the brids were sick. They showed no sign of disease. When she went back to try to collect them, two had been poked at by neighbor kids, and the third was missing.

She phoned the butcher the baker and the candlestick maker and no one showed the least bit of concern. The CDC is right here, and we're always told to phone them for this or that, but they didn't care. nobody cared. We exchanged phone numbers so we cold contact each other if either of us hears of more, as she lives about a mile from me. We've never heard of a state wildife pathologist - good idea to contact them.

Hmmmmm. My son is looking for a community service project for his Eagle rank (boy scout's highest level). Setting up a system so people could report such things in a way that would benefit the wildlife might be an excellent one. I wonder if it would be managable, even for one state?

[squirrelfriend]

HUGE CAUTION with your suggestion: The animal control nazis could take that to the extreme and decide there is a serious illness in the squirrel population and they must all be exterminated. Sadly - this may not be as absurd as it initially sounds.

This is something that I am afraid of. I don't want to report it because I think that they wil go and kill off all of my little friends there. Instead I go several times a week to check on them all. If I see one that is ill I catch it and take it home.

As for Geese, there are tons at Marie Curtis Park but I haven't heard of them being detered from going there. I have heard of many accounts of People in Florida having a problem with their migration there.

About 10 years ago or so I was home in L.A. I remember my mom being mad because she had heard that the city was going to spray the trees for some tree disease or insect problem. She knew what the results would be. Sure enough on my walk to work I started seeing lots of dead birds. I think I saw 4 dead crows on my walk one day + a variety of other birds. An abundance of dead crows is very unusual.

[Gabe]

Back to Buddy's Mom and Mrs. Jack's idea of the grape spray. It is used in our local apple orchards and smells just like Welch's when it is applied. It is suppossedly harmless, and deters the birds from eating the apples because it has a sour taste.

[island rehabber]

About 10 years ago or so I was home in L.A. I remember my mom being mad because she had heard that the city was going to spray the trees for some tree disease or insect problem. She knew what the results would be. Sure enough on my walk to work I started seeing lots of dead birds. I think I saw 4 dead crows on my walk one day + a variety of other birds. An abundance of dead crows is very unusual.
Just to further complicate matters, an abundance of dead crows is also a sure-fire indication of West Nile Virus in a given area. If it had been detected in LA at that time, the spray your mom may have been concerned about was probably malathion -- used to spray mosquitos who carry WNV. Malathion can be quite deadly to other species -- not sure about its effect on squirrels.

[Mrs. Jack]

acorniv, google 'canadian geese' and you'll find "issues" in many states.. here they've rounded up and euthanized huge flocks of geese from several parks over the past few years, they call it "waterfowl management" also they go on egg hunts and coat them with vegetable oil so they won't hatch. In some states they're approving putting out birth control pills hidden in bait. They get the public approval by terrorism speaking of property destruction and saying that you can get e. coli from the droppings. Now there have been some real goose issues- they have flown into planes near airports and that is a problem, but the park they cleared them from in the town next to mine is no where near an airport and right on the slough so I'm sure the geese were relieved to have a place to stop, that is until people started saying EWW poop!

It's highly possible that there is no official involvement with the squirrels deaths lburney and IR have come across.. someone could be feeding them poisoned something.. there are way too many sickos out there :(

[atlantasquirrelgirl]

A friend from Chicago is working in my office this week and I showed this thread to her. She inquired, and had the following to share:

Here is a response from Susan Fargo of the North Pond Conservation Council providing the name and number of the CPD North Lakefront Manager.

The woman who reported this should call him as well as the Lincoln Park Conservancy at 773-883-7275 and they could make some calls as well.

She will need to tell them where and when in the park she saw this.

The Flint Creek Wildlife Sanctuary in Barrington (phone 847-602-0628, www.flintcreekwildlife.org) could try and treat the squirrels if she could get them there. They have someone downtown at Northerly Island during the migration season so maybe she could take the squirrels there. She should call and ask them.

[Buddy'sMom]

That's very helpful, atlantasquirrelgirl! :thankyou -- I hope he comes back and follows up on this -- doesn't seem to have been here since the first day.

[acorniv]

acorniv, google 'canadian geese' and you'll find "issues" in many states.. here they've rounded up and euthanized huge flocks of geese from several parks over the past few years, they call it "waterfowl management" also they go on egg hunts and coat them with vegetable oil so they won't hatch. In some states they're approving putting out birth control pills hidden in bait. They get the public approval by terrorism speaking of property destruction and saying that you can get e. coli from the droppings. Now there have been some real goose issues- they have flown into planes near airports and that is a problem, but the park they cleared them from in the town next to mine is no where near an airport and right on the slough so I'm sure the geese were relieved to have a place to stop, that is until people started saying EWW poop!
:(

That really stinks. Humans are so ignorant. All that high nitrogen poop is what they go and pay top dollar for and put right back on their lawn. It slays me how willing we are to vote in laws and presidents based on rumors, instead of checking into the facts our selves. And doing it in public parks! Outrageous.

Laurel

[acorniv]

A friend from Chicago is working in my office this week and I showed this thread to her. She inquired, and had the following to share:

Here is a response from Susan Fargo of the North Pond Conservation Council providing the name and number of the CPD North Lakefront Manager.

The woman who reported this should call him as well as the Lincoln Park Conservancy at 773-883-7275 and they could make some calls as well.

She will need to tell them where and when in the park she saw this.

The Flint Creek Wildlife Sanctuary in Barrington (phone 847-602-0628, www.flintcreekwildlife.org) could try and treat the squirrels if she could get them there. They have someone downtown at Northerly Island during the migration season so maybe she could take the squirrels there. She should call and ask them.

Wow, you're good! Got resources for Atlanta? That is where I am and I'd like to follow up on this dead hawk thing.

Laurel

[atlantasquirrelgirl]

I can't take credit, my friend from Chicago did the research. I just hope that the info is used.

In Atlanta, try the Chattahoochee Nature Center 770-992-2055. They have very close ties to the few resources that are available at the GA DNR.

[pamela lee]

I don't understand what peoples problem with geese are. We have a 1 acre pond in our front yard and every time the geese fly over I pretty much beg them to stop and stay for awhile. But no such luck. I was at the feed store yesterday and there was a lady there asking about poisons she could put out to kill all the squirrels around her house!!:frustratedx She actually had the nerve to ask me if I had any suggestions. So I told (in not so nice words) that she was talking to the wrong girl, and that she needed to leave them be or agree to allow me to trap and relocate them to my farm(you can never have to many squirrels). She informed me that I wouldn't understand until I had one trying to make a nest in the roof of my house. Pretty sure I'd just invite them right in, they would't have to work to hard. I was even there looking for a squirrel feeder. She said she didn't need any help taking care of it and under her breath as she left I heard her say " well I'll just shoot them". It's redneck, whitetrash like that,that makes me dislike were I live sometimes!!

[Somebody's Mother]

we have alot of the same type mentality here in south carolina. my neighbor lady hates the squirrels because they are chewing on her windowsills. i told her to get them covered in vinyl or aluminum. that way she doesn't have squirrel bitemarks and she never has to scrape or paint them.:D

[Buddy'sMom]

Just an explanatory note about the geese -- there are geese ... and then there are geese.......

"Migratory Canada Geese" are still protected. These are the ones that fly south to/though the US in the fall and fly back north in the spring.

"Resident Canada Geese" are the increasing numbers that have decided they like it here and no longer return to Canada. They can be dangerous near airports. In massive numbers many now find them unpleasant in other areas, like golf courses and public lakes and parks. [Not debating or defending this, just reporting :hidechair ]. Anyway, the regulations for "managing" the resident population define it as follows: "Resident Canada geese means Canada geese that nest within the lower 48 States in the months of March, April, May, or June, or reside within the lower 48 States in the months of April, May, June, July, or August."

Though they are the same type of goose, these are different populations.

[squirrelfriend]

Island Rehabber,

The dead crow incident was long before I heard of West nile Virus. They weren't spraying for that it was either a tree disease or insect one. not mosquitoes. I'll have to write her and ask her what it was again.

[acorniv]

I can't take credit, my friend from Chicago did the research. I just hope that the info is used.

In Atlanta, try the Chattahoochee Nature Center 770-992-2055. They have very close ties to the few resources that are available at the GA DNR.

Have you dealt with them directly? It's been a couple of years and things change, but I've had a bad experience with them and so has my vet. They completely blew off the woman who found the hawks, just a couple of weeks ago, so I suspect they have not changed.

The DNR are clients of my dh's and so is the Ga Raptor Center (probably part of the DNR?), which is - is it Macon or near Savannah? I can reach both of them through him, but my understanding is that the woman tried the DNR and got no where.

I recently met a woman who has had a solitary peregrine falcon living in the eaves of her house for a year and a half. She believes it was released from an Atlanta Falcon's game and is now isolated from his kind, so has no way to find a mate. I've seen what I believe are a mated pair of perigrine's on the roof next to Atlanta Ballet - I think it is the roof ot the American Patriotism museum The street that runs behind them is such that you drive right past the roof, and i have seen them quite close, but wasn't sure of the markings. It's been a year or so, and I can't remember exactly what they looked like now. Oh - and a block from the Gwinnett Place Mall there is a field that is just loaded with birds that I never see anywhre else. When my son was going thrigh his My Side of the Mountain phase he used to go nuts seeing all the raptors there.

[StringTheory]

I have seen 3 squirrels die within 4 days in a park and these are just the ones I've 'seen' when walking my dog in one section of that park. There almost certainly are more deaths than I am seeing. All 3 were extremely weak, especially in the hind quarters. ....This is in Lincoln Park in Chicago where I've fed and watched the squirrels for 6 years.

I've just registered, so I just saw your post. Were you able to resolve
this?

The symptoms described fit the typical profile of rodenticide. Poisons
are usually anticoagulants such as Brodifacoum or Bromadiolone. They
are slow acting, so the animal will bleed internally over several days.
They usually end up too weak to climb, or they fall. You will indeed
notice the deaths in a 'cluster' as you describe. Many wildlife deaths
attributed to other causes are actually the end result of anticoagulant
poisoning.

This usually occurs due to deployment by exterminators who are not
following regulations, or simply do not care about collateral death of
wildlife. Careless exterminators 'broadcast' bait packets, which means
they walk through the area throwing packets above ground. Even
when poison is pushed into rat burrows, the rats very often push it
back out where it is eaten by squirrels, birds, etc. Another poster
was correct: To mobilize the public, you normally have to say the
words 'Dog', 'Cat' or 'Red-Tailed Hawk.'

I believe you were advised correctly to contact the State Wildlife
Pathologist. They will have resources to do the analysis if you can
preserve a couple of the bodies. Without the analysis, there will be
no way to verify the cause, but if you can do this, there is a good
chance that the problem can be addressed. You can save the
lives of a lot of animals in the future.

[Buddy'sMom]

:Welcome StringTheory and thanks for the info. It was sounding like possible rodenticide to some of us as well, but as you indicate, a little hard to verify without further information. Unfortunately, Iburney has not come back. Hopefully s/he is gathering info and just busy. Iburney? Are you still out there? We would love any followup info you might be able to post!

fyi, StringTheory, you might be interested in looking at http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4110 ("Squirrels, Pesticides and the EPA" in the General Squirrel DiscussionsForum, page 2) -- the EPA is seeking public comment on a proposal for restricting certain rodenticide uses and we have been exploring how we want to send comments. [and we need to get back to that pretty soon!! this is a good reminder. :) ]