Rear Leg Injury

[BigNibbler]

My wild friend Sweetie, is showing trouble with her LEFT FOOT or LEG.
She lifts it when walking most of the time, and avoids jumping.
This is a recent development.

Her visits are fewer than normal to avoid confrontations with others.
This morning, I tried to examine her.
Her foot feels warm, not hot, just normal. It felt dry when she was on my bare forearm. She is not spanning her fingers on that foot, the way she does normally. All the fingers are totally touching.

At first I thought maybe they got crushed. But no, I can spread them and feel them - they are fine individually. I was feeling her thigh and lower leg, no open wounds, no missing fur, nothing strange or odd, that I can feel.

I did not want to be too forceful with her, and stress her too much.
She totally trusts me and its the one place she is not worried.
She always turns her back on me, so she can know who else might be approaching. Its a holiday weekend, my vet recently retired, and I am in between vets,

I thought it was a sprained tendon or joint, but its not getting better.
Her recent ( fourth ) litter are 11 weeks old. Her molting just nearly complete.

She ALSO has a slightly oozing scab formed on her right shoulder, that is opposite the left foot injured. For one week, her shoulders were not covered with fur, and not sure if its an insect bite, scrape, or bot fly, I am watching it very closely, but I think if not a bot fly it will heal fine.

Worried about the leg. I mentioned the scab only cause someone might feel there is a correlation, don't know what it could be.

Next visit to me, I will try to get her to stretch up high on her rear legs so that I can feel her bones better and see how they move. Its like she cannot fully extend her leg. Any suggestions?

[farrelli]

I'm sorry no one's gotten back to you. This is an excellent situation because she trusts you so much, but bad in that she has young and can't be captured quite yet. Moreover, many antibiotics pass though breast milk, but I would assume that her babies are weaned or nearly weaned and are of an age where the side effects would not be too risky. Hopefully someone else will chime in, but I think that unless she's showing sever pain or can no longer feed or otherwise take care of herself, you just have to do what you're doing. Is there any way that you can tell when her babies leave?

[BigNibbler]

Farrelli,
Thanks for responding.
She has finished weening the babies.
The babies come in to me, in fact one has just spent 30 minutes with me.
I have a camera on their nest boxes, and can tell what is happening.
I know that Sweetie usually runs the whole shop here.
But in the past few days she has not had that inclination.

Her prior litter, now four, would always have to wait for her to allow them to come to me. Now Sweetie is pretty much staying in her box.

She is not coming out enough for water, as usually she takes many long drinks here. She is not drinking as much. Yesterday she did not come in except in the morning.

[SammysMom]

So sorry your friend is not feeling well! Where in NY are you? Maybe we can find you some help.

[farrelli]

How old is she? If she has four year olds, that means that she's at least five, which would put her at or even past her outdoor life expectancy. She's probably very at risk to infection, predators, etc. I would watch her very, very closely and try to give her the best nutrition possible. Once her babies are of age, if she's in bad shape, I would consider bringing her in. Can you do that? But for right now, I would feed her really well (have you tried rodent block - you may have to doctor it up to taste good, or order Henry's Wild Bites (http://www.henryspets.com/products/Wild-Bites.html)) and get her some antibiotics in case she got nipped by a cat and her condition is due to infection. Do you have any antibiotics on hand? Baytril is commonly prescribed for animals, and a very similar AB called Cipro is widely prescribed to people, so your friends may have it. Do you have anything ? We can tell you how to dose it?

[BigNibbler]

Update: She came out of her nest And is trying to guard the boundary between her and her cousin in the adjacent property. She lost a skirmish where she tried to tear after them Usually its no contest, here they turned her around and made her retreat! Then she tried to come up the ramp to me, but all her offspring, were active at the time and chased her away too!

She is keeping her weight off her left leg. She can use it to scratch.
But keeps bringing it forward much as possible. Pivoting at the heel to raise her hand off the ground. Maybe there is a problem with the underside, if she can come in, I will try to examine her its just that with others around she is very impatient.

[farrelli]

Any chance you could get some video?

[BigNibbler]

She has two litters a year. starting in her second year.
She eats real well.
She and all her little ones do in fact eat rodent blocks.
I dust them with calcium ultrafine D3 powder.
And I also give them HHBs

I will try to post some video. But it has to be of just the right moment, when she is moving and showing her leg.

She acts like we would if we had a sharp stone in our shoe.
That is why I felt the underside of her foot, but real hard to see it in a wild visitor. She knows all my positions. Lying down under her is not one she knows, it would kind of freak her out. This is not a pet. its a wild squirrel. I really do not know how she would be indoors. She is so amazingly gentle with me, She makes sure never to bite me, even if she has to lick between my fingers gently to find a small fragment. But if I block off the window, she immediately freaks out.

I could easily trap her, but want to make sure I have a good vet.
And that is not easy!
Not a vet to euthanize her, or leave her, or leave her abandoned in a cage all weekend!

I do have a class I rehab license, BTW.

Antibiotics? The shoulder looks good. The foot is the problem right now.

[Nancy in New York]

island rehabber knows of several vets I believe. Dr. Pilny comes to mind, and he's in Manhattan.

[BigNibbler]

Thank you Nancy!

[BigNibbler]

Update with VIDEO link:
She had to wait till the end of the day to visit me.
By then she had another scrape.
Now she has a bite on her right side under her arm, that I had not seen before! That does not show in the video.

She definitely needs AB !
She was 650 grams recently.
In the video you can see the hair grew back in just two days on her shoulders, BUT there is an open wound, its not deep but oozing.

I hope I can get ABs tomorrow.
But what about the LEG ?
She was fine on Wednesday.
What does that leg injury like like to those with experience ?
She does not pull back when I explore and feel her bones with my hand.
Only thing that might get a reaction is right by the ankle, but not sure, due to a noise just then.
Maybe she has a broken foot ?
She does not spread her toes.
I can spread them, but she does not, on that foot.

http://www.smugmug.com/gallery/29640008_5qXBDH

There are two files one is 5 MB/sec the other is 15 MB/sec
I raised sharpness very high so fur looks very rough, but you can see the wound.

[Nancy in New York]

Did you notice the wound and the leg at the same time?
Not sure if they are related. You said the wound you have seen for a week? Sorry I just skimmed the thread.
I did see the video. Again, not sure you will get a great answer.
I have seen wild squirrels have falls that result in problems either with their hips or legs....but without an x ray, who knows where her problem is.
Squirrels heal really fast, let's just hope that's the case with her.
Does she have a problem climbing trees. My concern is can she get away fast enough if she needs to?:dono

[BigNibbler]

No Nancy, she may not get away as fast as she should. She has dominated the territory and has ruled over 15 or more squirrels here.
Now they know she is compromised. They are all behaving differently.

And No, the side wound, is new, just today.
She only had the top nip before today.

The side wound is mid body, higher up to her arm, not by her lower half

She had trouble getting into and out of her nest box today.

because she needs specifically her left foot to push off the branch into her box. The right one dangles in the air usually.

Usually when i have handled injured squirrels with leg problems, there is either a visible surface break, or a leg fracture you can feel, or get a response from.
Here nothing!

I think maybe its the foot.

[Nancy in New York]

Yes I see what you mean with the foot, she actually looks very flat footed when she first comes in.
IF you are thinking of a vet....just make sure that you have everything ready to go as trapping could be very stressful for her.
BUT then again, she must know that she is compromised, and that too is stressful on her. UGH, these little ones are giving us grey hairs.
Do you have any antibiotics?
Not sure what is going on with the wound on her back, but it's good to have something on hand.

[BigNibbler]

I need AB.
Baytril.
My vet retired recently.
I thought I had found a new one, but - terrible idea.
Have some to call.
But could take a while...
Unless I call some doctor clients for a favor. but its a holiday weekend.
Have Pilny's card, but seems odd bringing a country squirrel to the big city.
Noise, stress...
and figure he is very busy.
That is why I was trying to avoid needless X ray.
If nothing is broken.

[Nancy in New York]

I need AB.
Baytril.
My vet retired recently.
I thought I had found a new one, but - terrible idea.
Have some to call.
But could take a while...
Unless I call some doctor clients for a favor. but its a holiday weekend.
Have Pilny's card, but seems odd bringing a country squirrel to the big city.
Noise, stress...
and figure he is very busy.
That is why I was trying to avoid needless X ray.
If nothing is broken.


I am going to alert Jackie to this thread. She will be on in the morning.
She most likely will be able to tell you what she thinks the problem is. She has seen more squirrels in her time, than I will ever see in my life.:D
I'm sending you a pm now.

[farrelli]

I would get her to a vet if you can. Did you contact IR to help find one? At the very least I would start antibiotics. If it were me, I'd catch her, take, her to a vet, and be prepared to bring her home and have a forever pet, or at the very least, take care of her for a while. She is well past her prime and at or passed the life expectancy for outdoor living. Nature is cruel and harsh. Seeing that she's already comfortable with the indoors and being handled, I think this would be a good solution for her, though there would probably be a period of adjusting. Do you have a big cage or room to put her? Food? You might consider getting Rescue Remedy (the full strength, human kind) to rub on her ears and feet to calm her down if you do capture her. The only hard part about this for me is that she has 12 week old babies. I think they usually start leaving at 13 weeks but can stay a lot longer. If you have to take her in, could you make sure that they are well taken care of? Do you have a lot of predators around as she is particularly compromised and her young are, well, young.

[BigNibbler]

Thanks Nancy, not sure you remembered, but I always appreciated your loving care of them and the few photos you posted. Sweetie is related you know. Sweetie is an older sibling ! So that is why I am a bit nervous - recalling how her mom died suddenly.

I put the wood up for Sweetie's gate to be better observed. She is not so used to it, and normally just comes across the sofa to my work station. Was a little nervous also cause that pillow was different due to the wood stick.

In the past, it takes a few days for something like that to work its way out, but this time it is actually getting worse! It was better this morning, better still yesterday.

I will try to be up at 5, and let her come in before the gang!

[BigNibbler]

I know squirrels here that are three years older than her.
In fact one is her Aunt, just had more little ones.

Lots of Cats here. More squirrels! Thanks to me !!!
I know what you are saying, but I do not think she will be happy indoors.
I do have an empty room, but its a lot more that is needed.
And where she lives, she is literally fifteen feet from my window in a wooden nest box. Problem is there are others in a nest box right next to her and around the side of the house too.


She has been a very very luck one till now. I hope I can help her. She really has always been sweet to me, but a terror to all her kind!

The little ones are fully functioning and coming in to me and eating well.







I would get her to a vet if you can. Did you contact IR to help find one? At the very least I would start antibiotics. If it were me, I'd catch her, take, her to a vet, and be prepared to bring her home and have a forever pet, or at the very least, take care of her for a while. She is well past her prime and at or passed the life expectancy for outdoor living. Nature is cruel and harsh. Seeing that she's already comfortable with the indoors and being handled, I think this would be a good solution for her, though there would probably be a period of adjusting. Do you have a big cage or room to put her? Food? You might consider getting Rescue Remedy (the full strength, human kind) to rub on her ears and feet to calm her down if you do capture her. The only hard part about this for me is that she has 12 week old babies. I think they usually start leaving at 13 weeks but can stay a lot longer. If you have to take her in, could you make sure that they are well taken care of? Do you have a lot of predators around as she is particularly compromised and her young are, well, young.

[BigNibbler]

Update: Better I think. She was up with the sun, and grooming. But seeing her big ones were by my window, she went back in to sleep a while. At 7:15 she came in. For 20 minutes - till I gave her a nut, to see how she would run out. Quite fast.. She is walking a bit better. For a moment she actually did span her toes a bit, not full wide but a bit more. Most of the time they were packed tight together. I felt all around her leg and foot. The only recoil I got was when I pressed the pad of her foot, up front just before the digits. Her wounds have closed much since last night. 12 hours ago.
Her side is closed. Small oozing bit at top of her back still.

Hope she looks better still later today.

[island rehabber]

hi MN...just catching up with your thread now. Wonderful news that she seems better. If you do end up having to trap her and bring her to a vet, let me suggest Long Island instead of Avian & Exotic (Pilny) -- Volunteers for Wildlife in Huntington has some excellent rehabbers and a vet or two on hand, and they work with Pilny on tough cases too. If you needed to, I would call my pals over there for you and make sure that they would release your girl back to you so she could return to her nice life outside your window. It would be way less stressful for her and WAY Less stressful on your wallet. (Trust me, I know....I was there last week.....:wallet).

[Monipenny]

Have you looked for a splinter or thorn or anything that could be stuck in the bottom of her foot?

[BigNibbler]

Thank you Maura! I am sure I will be calling your pals at some time.
Do they not normally return the squirrel to the rehabber who brought them in ?

I told Nancy that I was not keen on bringing a country squirrel into the city.

I have been trying hard to feel her foot.. But inspecting that area, is - need i say difficult on a wild squirrel. Even one as sweet as Sweetie is to me. I have had her on her back a few times in the past, when she was very relaxed and playful. Due to her open sore on her back, I would not think she would be too fond of the experience these days, I definitely do not feel anything on my bare skin, when she stands or walks on me, nor in my hands or when I feel her foot bottom with my finger. I will have her walk on my finger tips, later so that I can feel more precisely that spot. She did let me lift her foot up a few times but I am not confident I got a long and close enough study of it.

She tries to come when it is not busy here, squirrel busy I mean, and if I rile her, she could step out for a while, with the intent to come right back, and run into others intent on changing her mind on that! So I want her to eat well as she is not visiting as much due to her injuries.

[BigNibbler]

Update: Sweeties leg is a bit better. This morning I had her stretch high up to to get food and she extended both legs OK. Still she is not opening her toes, and she cannot grasp or grab with her toes. They are curled back, rather than forward. So she has no grip with that foot

Unfortunately, some of her juveniles have been emboldened by her reduced capacity and are blatantly and aggressively asserting themselves by making physical contact with her, rather than the just the normal posturing. Not her recent babies, the older ones.

If it does not improve in the next two days, I should take her to a vet. Maybe its a tendon or joint injury.

[TubeDriver]

Update: Sweeties leg is a bit better. This morning I had her stretch high up to to get food and she extended both legs OK. Still she is not opening her toes, and she cannot grasp or grab with her toes. They are curled back, rather than forward. So she has no grip with that foot

Unfortunately, some of her juveniles have been emboldened by her reduced capacity and are blatantly and aggressively asserting themselves by making physical contact with her, rather than the just the normal posturing. Not her recent babies, the older ones.

If it does not improve in the next two days, I should take her to a vet. Maybe its a tendon or joint injury.


Hopefully she will continue to improve over the next couple days.

[BigNibbler]

Update: She is much more confident and more like her usual self.
She is actively aggressive to the underlings!
Her weight on the foot is nearly normal, but her toes and nails are not yet.
She is starting to span her last toe, so hoping for continued improvement.
Wounds are better. Nearly fur covered, but swollen still.
She is eating and drinking better and coming in more often.

[Jackie in Tampa]

love progress...yippie