Whiskers breathing problem...

[Nemehoto]

I posted in the wrong forum I think...

http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?t=37374

Note: some of my listed things in the first post has changed...

She is still breathing rapidly, using her nose not her mouth... no panting as of yet... she is "clicking" but nothing like the video it is very soft...
She is getting lethargic... I took her out of the cage to try and make a video of her symptoms and she just sat on my shoulder ... she is usually off like a rocket...

I have a vet appointment at 2:45 with a vet I know nothing about but they do treat wildlife and exotic pets there...

Crosses fingers.

[Jackie in Tampa]

Let the vet know that cillans are not prefered..
baytril is perfect for aspiration pnuemonia..
good luck.
if you aren't using a heat source, I would add one..
also know a sq friendly vet in Aiken if you need another option.

[Nemehoto]

okay... I will request baytril... Aiken is a good 2 hours from here but it is another option thank you.

[Nemehoto]

OKay just got back from the vet...

Whiskers does indeed have pneumonia, but it is barely symptomatic. The soft clicking I was hearing the vet could not until the last couple minutes of the visit. He has prescribed Baytril twice a day for 10 days. He did offer to do the one time antibiotic shot but I was a bit worried about that so went with the baytril.

Biff was pitching a fit that he was separated from his sister and was chewing frantically at the bars of the cage so I took them both to the vet. He was the scaredy squirrel that refused to show his face at all during the visit.

Whiskers was reasonably calm although she really wanted NOTHING to do with that snake he had in his ears (stethoscope) but she did finally let him use it. She sat on my shoulder most of the visit and let him look at her teeth and nose and feel her belly etc without much more than grabbing onto my shirt.

Anyway we are home now, and Whiskers has had her first dose of Baytril and I am much calmer... it was well worth the $70 and the 3 hour trip to make sure my baby will be okay.

[CrazySquirrelLady]

Yay! So glad the vet was cool and the baby will be fine. I was scared to read this thread, and it turns out really good!

I been praying for Whiskers and am glad to see that the prayer power of TSB is getting heard! all will be well :multi

keep us posted!

[island rehabber]

That's great news about Whiskers, and wonderful that you found a vet who treats squirrels and does it right! (I am a firm believer in Baytril for pneumonia....hands down.)

Keep her nice and warm and as quiet as possible while the medicine does its thing....and I know you will be resting easier tonight! :thumbsup

[Nemehoto]

Dr Foy was great with her and she was (mostly) cooperative. I went to check on her and Biff is the one sulking and wouldn't come over for his stritchies until he finally got jealous of Whiskers getting all the lovin'. and joined in for his head rubs. Biff didn't like the vets office at all and hid under the covers the whole time except to show his tail now and then when the vet was curious about him.

Whiskers is still breathing fast, but I didn't hear the soft clicking but a few times, nothing continuous like before (I have poor hearing in the mid range but acute hearing in the upper and lower ranges so I hear things some people don't) So we caught it very early which is great.

Whiskers is sedate and calm, not lethargic and when I went to check on her she was sitting up and eating her green beans and then was begging me for a grape. Which I will give her later. (she's already had one at the vets office since we had to wait a while before seeing him)

She is eating and moving around more than she was late this morning and already begging to let out to play. I am going to keep her confined in the cage for a few days so she doesn't stress herself playing. (the child plays HARD usually and wears her brother out first.)

I am relieved and I expected it to get much worse before it started getting better. I have my fingers crossed since I am already seeing small improvements.

[Nemehoto]

Just gave Whiskers her second dose. She is clicking a bit but it isn't constant, No open mouth panting, she seems to be breathing okay even though it is rapid. She ate about half her normal formula meal then started eating some solid food (a little block section, and a piece of romaine, then I gave her 1/4 of a grape as a reward for taking her medicine. After she finished eating, she pffted at me as she crawled back in her pouch to go back to sleep.

She's a bit tired but her eyes are bright. She seems to be resting comfortably and enjoys a little rubbin' lovin' in her pouch and gives me armage and a nuzzle. She is a sucker for jaw rubs. She's eating okay, and isn't rejecting anything. I'm not worried about her half dose of formula. She does that now and then anyway. (sometimes they just don't want it or want less of it, they are weaning themselves since last week)

Just a little update...

[island rehabber]

When they have pneumonia, it makes it hard for them to breathe while also trying to suck from the syringe -- that's why they often don't take as much as usual, and that in itself is a sign that they might have pneumonia. It's way more dangerous in a tiny baby squirrel who ONLY takes formula, because then they don't want to eat at all....thankfully Whiskers can nibble on solid foods at her age. It's kind of like when you have a really bad head cold and you try to drink something at the same time....ugh. Don't stress too much about the formula amount. :)

[Jackie in Tampa]

:thumbsup thank you for doing everything to get her help!
Glad to hear your vet is willing to help!!
Baytril is the bomb!

Did the vet mention Convenia as the other option?
Convenia is a time release AB...
It is supposed to work for 14 days..
however I think Sq metabolism is much faster than domestics... I don't think it has the duration in sqs.
Convenia is also a cephalosporin, like penicillin.
These are not ideally prescribed due to the stress it puts on the immune system and the digestive tract...
In many situations the sq will already have diarrhea, adding a med that may also contribute to the symptoms can be fatal...however, I have used convenia as an Anti biotic treatment and had no problems with it, but diarrhea was not a prior issue in the case I was treating.
It is expensive...and I believe it lasts 5-7 days, just MY thoughts.
When the intestines are irritated, nutritional absorbtion can be interrupted..
I like baytril for sqs...:)

:worthless

[Nemehoto]

Yes he was highly suggesting Convenia... for the life of me could not remember the name until you mentioned it. I do know it is a one time shot. I've used it in our dogs and cats with great success, but I was worried about the high metabolism in squirrels and hadn't read about folks here suggesting it as a treatment. I figured I would request the tried and true Baytril which everyone suggests. Although I was very tempted to do it. Had I know Whiskers would argue about taking her meds I would have! :osnap

If she is still argumentative about it this evening I will put her in a burrito. I don't mind her being feisty, I would rather her argue than be sedate about it. Although she gets over having her "tail ruffled" when I let her go and she runs off across the room then jumps back on my shoulder for her treat.

Sad thing is confining her to the cage, I let her run around for about 5 minutes after eating and medicating then I put her back in the cage (she's used to about an hour to an hour and half of out of cage time after eating)
I've had to cut Biff's out of cage time down as well since Whiskers gets upset when her brother is playing and she can't. Well they can suffer for a couple of more days...

Update: This morning Whiskers is feeling good, her breath is still rapid but not like it was and I didn't hear any clicking early this morning (4 am-ish) nor during breakfast. She is active, bright eyed, and bushy tailed this morning. Not her usual "rocket" racing around the room but she did get a few minutes of playtime while I wrestled with her brother. (Biff likes wrestling with your fingers or a stuffed toy) I put her in after 5 minutes of play and left Biff out for another ten but she was getting upset so I put him in too... so the first thing she did was pounce on him. The cage prevents a lot of running around but it gives ample room for play just not at speed.

[Nemehoto]

okay here's some pics I took today during after dinner out of cage playtime (5 minutes) Whiskers and Biff at play.

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Bedpost climbing

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Cell phone stealing (yes they pulled it out of my pocket)

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Na na na na nah... can't get us here!

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Whiskers toy wrestling

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Biff toy wrestling

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Cell phone or stuffy? (Biff)

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Cell phone! (Biff)

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Team toy mauling

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If I pull hard enough I can get the camera! (whiskers pulling on the camera strap)

I have an antique 4 poster bed thick I have socks and old flannel shirts wrapped around the posts to protect them. Demin fabric over the head board and old robe tied to the toe board... a bit of squirrel proofing... I cover the bed in an old king sized flannel sheet to protect my bed from them throwing food and bedding from the cage and to catch formula dribbles (or spills) so yes it is a bit "messy" but I can still sleep at night without finding someone stash... well usually...

[Nemehoto]

needless to say from the pictures, Whiskers is feeling much better. Her respiration is still high but in stead of around 70 it is more like 45 or so. I have heard no clicking at all today and her appetite is good, shes had 8 cc's this morning of FV, 15 cc's at lunch and I am going to feed them again here shortly. She's recovering almost as fast as she got pneumonia in the first place.

I do let her out for 5-10 minutes after meals although I should keep her confined totally but she is chewing on the cage bars and dragging her mouth on them... better 10 minutes of excess energy burn that her bloodying her mouth up... That short time out of the cage is enough to keep her happy.

[Squirrelis]

Oh my those pics are adorable:Love_Icon beautiful squirrelys:D

[Jackie in Tampa]

cage chewing can be very serious..
what is the bar spacing?

they're precious btw..
I see that formula mess. hahha, know it all too well!

[Nemehoto]

The bar spacing is 3/4 of a inch (it is old ferret cage) I have enclosed a picture of it from a couple of weeks ago when Biff was having bed wetting and urine burn issues.

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My current cage: It is 24x30x36 I am in the process of making them a much larger cage. (I am planning on 6' high, 4 feet wide, 6 feet wide) with 1/2 inch hardware cloth to over winter them and be able to be put outside in as a pre-release cage. It's not done yet.

They don't cage chew often, only when separated. I should have mentioned that when she was cage chewing, it was because Biff was out and she wasn't. I have them both on mostly cage restriction while Whiskers is recovering, they get so hyper that during feeding I do let them out for about 5-10 minutes so they can get the edge off their energy (omg they have so much!) they do look through the bars and beg for treats but the chewing is a separation anxiety thing I'm pretty sure. They don't chew it at all that I have witnessed other than that.

Oh and if anyone is interested... Biff is no longer bed wetting, his sister has stopped sucking on him, his little manly hydraulics are healed up and his hair is almost regrown on his belly and legs, urine burn is all cleared up... and do you have ANY idea how hard it is to keep underwear on a squirrel?

[Jackie in Tampa]

:thumbsup
can't wait to see new cage..
and yes, I do know about crazy sq antics...

[Nemehoto]

Whiskers has had no symptoms of pneumonia for 2 days now. I started letting them out of the cage again yesterday for up to 30 minutes at a time. No heavy or rapid breathing from her (other than from her wild play) I've been monitoring both her and her brothers respiration to make sure there is no further difficulty.

I scared the bejebus out of her trying to give her the AB's on Wednesday (sniffle) and ended up manhandling her a little which she has never experienced and she bit the tar out of me. I tried putting the AB's on a pecan (I haven't fed them any nuts to this point) and OMG she purred while stuffing it in her face as fast as she could. since then... she has taken every drop of her meds without a single complaint, even licking the stickiness from her paws. doctored pecans :multi rock!

Anyhow since her fright on Wednesday she has been getting her AB's on pecans and I have had zero problems with her taking them. She has forgiven me for her scare. After she eats her pecan she comes over and rubs her face in my hair (then proceeds to try and pull it out for her nest building) and sits on my shoulder for a chin rub. She still gets a little spooked when I hold her but everyday is better. (Kicking myself for scaring her like that) So hopefully in another few days we should be back to where we were trust wise.