MORE BABIES IN TROUBLE - MONTREAL AREA

[Scooterzmom]

Iwonka just got a call re. a baby in bad shape. There were 2 babies (Scratch, male and Kiki, female) initially fed with kitten formula for some 4 days, then lately (for 10 days) were switched to puppy formula. Both were doing fine until this morning when Scratchy then began vomiting and developed diarrhea. Not a "stinky" kind though.

Finder (Vero - her username) saw a vet friend who prescribed Clavamox. Not sure why this was done as baby is not clicking. However, a few times today he baby did sneeze and some whitish secretion comes out of its nose... earlier today was a lot, now not so much; milk or secretion??? We don't know. Finder (Vero) says it looks more like milk thickened with mucus. Slight possibility baby aspirated.

Iwonka advised Pedialyte for 24 hours
This to rehydrate Scratchy who is very dehydrated, and I suggested a little at a time rather than lots all at once. Scratchy does want to drink, IS thirsty so I suggested to offer some 3 cc every 30 minutes instead of lots all at once; said to do that 3 times then by 4th time to let him drink all the Pedia he wants and wait 1 hour at least to next Pedia but no more than 2 hours. No way to get liquid Imodium at this hour... do not think advisable since it might plug the baby but mask more important symptoms.

Vero has Gastrolyte - says on it it's a treatment of GI probs and to rebalance eloctrolytes for babies, children and adults. That sounds like it's the same as Pedialyte except by another name. Instead of dextrose/sugar it contains an infinite (VERY tiny) amount of aspartame. Is that OK to administer to baby instead of the homemade Pedia?

Advice please!!!!!! What can we do? Kiki is doing fine, nice and plump and bouncy. Scratchy was fine too but from the start he remained very small the whole time, much smaller than his sister.

[Nancy in New York]

I just don't understand the vomitting and diarrhea if he has been on the puppy formula for 10 days. Wonder if there is something else going on. Does he eat any solids?
I too would do the hydration for 24 hours as advised by iwonka, but since I have no knowledge of Gastrolyte and it's safety, I would do the homemade pedialyte.

[Scooterzmom]

Iwonka just got a call re. a baby in bad shape. There were 2 babies (Scratch, male and Kiki, female) initially fed with kitten formula for some 4 days, then lately (for 10 days) were switched to puppy formula. Both were doing fine until this morning when Scratchy then began vomiting and developed diarrhea. Not a "stinky" kind though.

Finder (Vero - her username) saw a vet friend who prescribed Clavamox. Not sure why this was done as baby is not clicking. However, a few times today he baby did sneeze and some whitish secretion comes out of its nose... earlier today was a lot, now not so much; milk or secretion??? We don't know. Finder (Vero) says it looks more like milk thickened with mucus. Slight possibility baby aspirated.

Iwonka advised Pedialyte for 24 hours
This to rehydrate Scratchy who is very dehydrated, and I suggested a little at a time rather than lots all at once. Scratchy does want to drink, IS thirsty so I suggested to offer some 3 cc every 30 minutes instead of lots all at once; said to do that 3 times then by 4th time to let him drink all the Pedia he wants and wait 1 hour at least to next Pedia but no more than 2 hours. No way to get liquid Imodium at this hour... do not think advisable since it might plug the baby but mask more important symptoms.

Vero has Gastrolyte - says on it it's a treatment of GI probs and to rebalance eloctrolytes for babies, children and adults. That sounds like it's the same as Pedialyte except by another name. Instead of dextrose/sugar it contains an infinite (VERY tiny) amount of aspartame. Is that OK to administer to baby instead of the homemade Pedia?

Advice please!!!!!! What can we do? Kiki is doing fine, nice and plump and bouncy. Scratchy was fine too but from the start he remained very small the whole time, much smaller than his sister.

Forgot to say... Suggested to give Pedia to the little girl too to flush the puppy formula out of her system and transfer her to FV instead. Vero will go to Iwonka's tomorrow morning - will bring the babies along - to be checked out and to pick up FV.

[Scooterzmom]

I just don't understand the vomitting and diarrhea if he has been on the puppy formula for 10 days. Wonder if there is something else going on. Does he eat any solids?
I too would do the hydration for 24 hours as advised by iwonka, but since I have no knowledge of Gastrolyte and it's safety, I would do the homemade pedialyte.

Vero had said she had given nuts and died fruit but that the little boy did NOT eat any. Told her to remove that right away and not to feed dried fruit at any time anyway. I suppose it's possible he did eat some... would sound like this would be the logical culprit.

[Scooterzmom]

I just don't understand the vomitting and diarrhea if he has been on the puppy formula for 10 days. Wonder if there is something else going on. Does he eat any solids?
I too would do the hydration for 24 hours as advised by iwonka, but since I have no knowledge of Gastrolyte and it's safety, I would do the homemade pedialyte.

4skwerls just PM'd me about the Gastrolyte... aspartame it seems is toxic for squirrels, very nasty. I THOUGHT I had read that somewhere before so I'm glad somebody confirmed it. Because I was not sure in the first place I had told Vero not to take a chance until I could clear that out and asked her to stick to the home made formula instead.

She has, so no worry on that.

[Scooterzmom]

I just don't understand the vomitting and diarrhea if he has been on the puppy formula for 10 days. Wonder if there is something else going on. Does he eat any solids?
I too would do the hydration for 24 hours as advised by iwonka, but since I have no knowledge of Gastrolyte and it's safety, I would do the homemade pedialyte.

4skwerls just PM'd me about the Gastrolyte... aspartame it seems is toxic for squirrels, very nasty. I THOUGHT I had read that somewhere before so I'm glad somebody confirmed it. Because I was not sure in the first place I had told Vero not to take a chance until I could clear that out and asked her to stick to the home made formula instead.

She has, so no worry on that.

[Nancy in New York]

Vero had said she had given nuts and died fruit but that the little boy did NOT eat any. Told her to remove that right away and not to feed dried fruit at any time anyway. I suppose it's possible he did eat some... would sound like this would be the logical culprit.

It doesn't seem likely unless something was moldy.

[Scooterzmom]

It doesn't seem likely unless something was moldy.

My thoughts exactly. Spoke to Vero... she said he is sleeping now but that when he takes his pedia he seems more alert than he did earlier. He's drinking willingly, so I'm hoping that's a good sign. He's still not out of the woods by any means, so the prayers can't hurt :Love_Icon

[Nancy in New York]

My thoughts exactly. Spoke to Vero... she said he is sleeping now but that when he takes his pedia he seems more alert than he did earlier. He's drinking willingly, so I'm hoping that's a good sign. He's still not out of the woods by any means, so the prayers can't hurt :Love_Icon

Excellent news....and continue hydration.:)

[Scooterzmom]

Excellent news....and continue hydration.:)

Will do... we advised to push the Pedia all nite and tomorrow (24 hours). Don't want to take a chance and want all the nasties flushed out of his system. Suggested not to give the Clavamox however since baby does not click and we fear it may irritate the GI tract even more. When Iwonka sees the baby she'll be able to evaluate better whether there is a need for it or not, I'm sure.

[Scooterzmom]

Little Scratchy has taken a turn for the worse. He is now very very lethargic, does not want to drink - more like too weak to drink the Pedia and Vero has nothing to sub-q and nobody nearby to do it. Poor girl is in tears as it appears that her little one is fading fast. :(

I think we may have found the culprit as to the sudden illness. Finder's father cut some branches from outside and shredded them - made some wood shavings, like chips/dust - and they've been using this as bedding in their cage. There was a 3rd sibling - who died a few days ago - and Vero now realizes/recalls that that little one got sick 2 days after they had put the shavings in the cage.

I suspect toxins, from the wood/branches. PLEASE ANY ADVICE to help us with that????

Baby took 3cc's 3 times - every 30 minutes - and once 4cc's. They let him sleep for one hour and now were going to give more Pedia but found him in this very bad state. So I advised to rub syrup on the baby's mouth and gums... he tried to lick some of it and now is taking a few drops of sugared water. Finder tells me he has peed huge pees over the last two hours.

HELP, PLEASE.

[Scooterzmom]

Has anybody seen this??? Baby died last nite... That's 2 babies already gone from that mysterious illness...:( and now the 3rd one, the healthy one has diarrhea too.

ANY SUGGESTIONS???

[island rehabber]

Scooterzmom -- this sudden onset diarrhea could be a parasitic infection OR mycotoxin (mold) infection. Either way, antibiotics are called for. I would do a loading dose of Baytril if possible -- ASAP.

[Scooterzmom]

Scooterzmom -- this sudden onset diarrhea could be a parasitic infection OR mycotoxin (mold) infection. Either way, antibiotics are called for. I would do a loading dose of Baytril if possible -- ASAP.

:thankyou Don't have Baytril on hand at the moment, might be possible to get some; if not will Bactrim work as well?

How much is a loading dose and how do you calculate it?

I can't get hold of Iwonka - her phone line is down it seems :soapbox

[Nancy in New York]

Jackie had something very similar happen with her squirrels. She determined it was the wood chips that she put in their release cage. Let me contact her...I know that at least one of hers passed. Let me locate Jackie.

[Scooterzmom]

Jackie had something very similar happen with her squirrels. She determined it was the wood chips that she put in their release cage. Let me contact her...I know that at least one of hers passed. Let me locate Jackie.
:thankyou

[Scooterzmom]

Jackie had something very similar happen with her squirrels. She determined it was the wood chips that she put in their release cage. Let me contact her...I know that at least one of hers passed. Let me locate Jackie.

This poor girl had two of her pass already and now the 3rd one is starting diarrhea... she was crying her heart out last nite - feeling helpless as she watched her poor baby fade away. I was on the phone with her, feeling just as helpless and heartbroken for her.

R.I.P. little Scratchy. Go with your little sister, run free and without a care now. Your squamma will miss you and she'll always love you.

[Nancy in New York]

I'm sorry this is happening. People are busy with their babies and this is such a difficult time of the year....
very few people on to help.
And too many emergencies lately....:shakehead :shakehead :shakehead

You HAVE to post in the emergency section and keep bumping it, if anyone is on they will see that.
Do Not post in the rehab forum, just keep bumping your thread HERE until somebody responds.

[Scooterzmom]

I'm sorry this is happening. People are busy with their babies and this is such a difficult time of the year....
very few people on to help.
And too many emergencies lately....:shakehead :shakehead :shakehead

You HAVE to post in the emergency section and keep bumping it, if anyone is on they will see that.
Do Not post in the rehab forum, just keep bumping your thread HERE until somebody responds.


OK, thanks Nancy and sorry bout that. I know it's a crazy time of year *sigh By bumping what do you mean exactly? (I'm such a puter dufus :shakehead)

[Jackie in Tampa]

if the wood shavings are the culprit...anti fungal
metronidazole(flagyl)
dose is 50mg/kg

cephalexin (kexflex) MUST BE FRESH
25mg/kg

Amoxicillin 20 mg/kg

baytril 10mg/kg

bactrim will work..very slow AB, need something faster if possible, may need to stack abs..
start adding yogurt to their formula..
...start them on the bactrim if it's all you have ..
give a loading dose and it is twice a day ..
keep looking for meds..
dilute the formula
keep them warm.
I used a vaporizer, make a tent and cover the vaporizer and the entire cage.
:grouphug
sorry you lost the babies..
are you guys thinking esbilac or wood chips?

[Nancy in New York]

By bumping what do you mean exactly? (so sorry I'm such a puter dufus)

Not at all....If you make a post, that will put your thread to the top of the forum....even if you use :bump smiley or even type a . It will bump it to the top of the first page.
http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/index.php
Good I see that Jackie just posted....thank you Jackie :Love_Icon

[Scooterzmom]

Not at all....If you make a post, that will put your thread to the top of the forum....even if you use :bump smiley or even type a . It will bump it to the top of the first page.
Cool... thanks :)

[iwonka]

:thankyou :grouphug

She is on Bactrim and FV Electrolyte now.

It is better she not die :nono ... Veronica is already so devastated :Cry.. she feels guilty.
Such a nice young person :grouphug

And I'm "tired" of all those deads.. the most difficult part... :(

[iwonka]

if the wood shavings are the culprit...anti fungal
metronidazole(flagyl)
dose is 50mg/kg

cephalexin (kexflex) MUST BE FRESH
25mg/kg

Amoxicillin 20 mg/kg

baytril 10mg/kg

bactrim will work..very slow AB, need something faster if possible, may need to stack abs..
start adding yogurt to their formula..
...start them on the bactrim if it's all you have ..
give a loading dose and it is twice a day ..
keep looking for meds..
dilute the formula
keep them warm.
I used a vaporizer, make a tent and cover the vaporizer and the entire cage.
:grouphug
sorry you lost the babies..
are you guys thinking esbilac or wood chips?

wood chips.. the first baby died 2 days after.
Jackie.. which one is the best?.. Flagyl?
Veronique is going now to the Vet..

[iwonka]

Also what concentration?

Should we get the more broad-spectrum AB, since we are not totaly sure it is the mold?.. The Flagyl is the more anti-fungi, right?

[iwonka]

:bump:blah:bump

[island rehabber]

Baytril 22.7 mg/ml
Cephalexin 50 mg/ml
Bactrim 50 mg/ml

Yes, the flagyl is anti-fungal. I would give both....

[Scooterzmom]

Baytril 22.7 mg/ml
Cephalexin 50 mg/ml
Bactrim 50 mg/ml

Yes, the flagyl is anti-fungal. I would give both....




Should she feed weak FV (50/50) today or should she stay on Pedialyte today to flush her system and go to weak FV tomorrow? Is it because of concerns for the AB being hard on her tummy that Jackie suggested FV?

Please clarify.

[island rehabber]

I would stick with 3:1 FV. She needs calories for strength.

[Jackie in Tampa]

just some nutrition..dilute weak Fv with yogurt..
The meds are going to be hard on her weak body..
she's tired if it's hard to breath, needs hydration and energy
and yogurt because she is going to need it and it's good food.

[Scooterzmom]

just some nutrition..dilute weak Fv with yogurt..
The meds are going to be hard on her weak body..
she's tired if it's hard to breath, needs hydration and energy
and yogurt because she is going to need it and it's good food.

how much yogurt do you suggest? Sorry or all the questions, we just want to be sure of all the proportions since we never dealt with stacked AB's. Still learning here :hidechair

[Scooterzmom]

:bump

[skarabrae]

Good grief! Praying for the little guys...

Montreal is just swarming with babies! :shakehead

[Scooterzmom]

Good grief! Praying for the little guys...

Montreal is just swarming with babies! :shakehead

I don't know if swarming is even the word for it... that's 16 babies at Iwonka's currently, plus her 5 who over-wintered, plus all the ones she placed in foster care. Then all these babies will need to be released too... and that is a whole new set of logistics, of course :shakehead

[skarabrae]

Well, I wish I lived closer so I could help you guys out :grouphug

[vero]

Hi everybody. I would like to say THANK YOU for all your help.
It's wonderfull to see how people are engaged...
My little Kiki is now in a really good shape. :)
I'am so happy!!! It's now the beggining of a new life for her and for me.
I was really scared to lose her and now we enjoy every moment togeter.

Thanks again :)
xxx:Love_Icon
vero

[Scooterzmom]

Great news, Vero :) I'm sure everyone is as thrilled as I am to hear of Kiki's recovery.

And for you all, since Vero cannot post pics yet, here is that little treasure of hers :)

170881

[SammysMom]

Oh what a little doll baby!!!:Welcome

[iwonka]

:grouphug :Love_Icon :grouphug

Will and Kate are looking forward to meet Kiki! :wave123

:jump