4 week old on antibiotics and constipated

[Little Magician]

I noticed my little cutie breathing rapidly and making a faint clicking noise so I started her on ciprofloxacin. I gave her 4 doses spaced 12 hours apart but she has become severely constipated. I have skipped the last two doses. I know it is bad to skip doses with antibiotics but I am more concerned about her constipation than her mild sneezing and clicking at this point. I feel like the respiratory symptoms were probably nothing to worry about and now I have messed up her digestive tract and put her in worse shape.

I started her on the antibiotic Saturday at 1 AM an another dose Sat 1 PM. She was constipated Saturday and I put her on pedialyte and some yogurt and she passed a bunch of stool that night so I gave her another antibiotic dose Sun at 1 AM and Sun 1 PM. She was constipated again Sunday night. I did not give the Mon 1 AM or Mon 1 PM dose. The last time she passed stool was a very minute amount Mon 2 AM. It is now Mon 4 PM. I have given her a few drops of simethicone (baby gas relief med), yogurt, pumpkin, diluted apple juice, Pedialyte, and stimulated her with cotton dipped in warm water.

Nothing seems to be working! She does not seem to be feeling well. She still sneezes and breathes rapidly but these symptoms have not seemed to progress to anything worse; not worried about this. Any suggestions for constipation?? Please help. I am afraid to give her anything more than Pedialyte at this point.

She is about 4 weeks old and 77 grams.

[island rehabber]

LM, you've got it backwards. DO NOT worry as much abot the constipation as about the respiratory issues. She NEEDS the antibiotics -- constipation is not life-threatening but pneumonia IS. PLEASE put her back on the meds ASAP and offer her some extra hydration between feedings -- Pedialyte, SmartWater or homemade pedialyte. This will get things moving again. Odd that she is constipated because ABX normally cause diarrhea. But again, that is NOT the life-threatening issue; the pneumonia is.

[gs1]

does she have enough in her tummy to have poops?

maybe you can add a lot more water between feedings ..with a tiny amount of apple juice....

the one tip i'd like to offer but am not sure if she is too young is watermelon juice... just squeeze through cloth and strain into liquid....

also please keep stimulating.... maybe with a touch of oil so that she's not rubbed raw.....

i would have also like to have suggested the solution to bloat which is soaking them in warm water for 15 mins... with a very gentle massage... just to keep things moving.... but i'm very worried about the pneumonia and so ...am hesitant to soak her....

i am not an experienced squirrel person so i am only speculating...

do you have a trusted vet nearby ... i think that texas is semi-legal or lenient with squirrels....

are you anywhere near houston?

:grouphug

[Little Magician]

She pooped a tiny amount this afternoon. It feels like she still has alot of hard stool near her anus.

Her respiratory symptoms have not gotten worse. How much antibiotics would you all recommend? I was giving her 0.6 mg twice/day of ciprofloxacin. She weighs 77 grams. Maybe this was too much and it killed all the good bacteria in her digestive tract? I found a page about cipro for pets that said dosage could range from 5-15mg/kg. Maybe I should start her back on the lower range which would be about 0.4 mg?

What is a normal heart rate for a baby squirrel?
What does normal breathing look like when watching movement of her sides as she inhales/exhales?

[gs1]

i'm giving you a phone number... pming you....

it's mrs skul she will be awake at night ....

you need to talk to someone....

this reminds me of when tiny paws flyer got poop stuck around his anus and it all backed up in him.... he died....

it's not good ... maybe megacolon ... i really don't know... but there is a problem....

little bits of hard poop inside of him is no good....

ps; no enemas!!! bad idea....

you really should see a vet or a rehabber if there is one within driving distance... it's important....

[gs1]

i don't know what normal breathing is..if you have video it will be helpful.

i think the antibiotic time is 10 days ... and it's dangerous to play with the dosage too... once you've got the correct dosage ... you don't want to build supergerms in her.

cls.

do you know if you have the correct dosage? always a new thread with questions ...gets seen faster... and a specific title is necessary.

[Jackie in Tampa]

PM me with med strength and amount info, I will ck dosage...sometimes ABs can bind if over dosed...
that's all I can come up with as far as WHY hard stool,
like IR has mentioned, most times ABS cause mushy soft stools if anything...
WITH ALL ABs...I ALWAYS ALWAYS use yogurt as a gentle probotic.

[rygel1hardt]

From what I just read on Cipro one of the side effects is loose bowels, quite the opposite of what you are experiencing. What formula are you feeding her now and at what strength? What does she weight and how much formula is she eating and at what intervals? I realize that babies can have their own unique reactions to any med so If she were mine I would change meds. Stacey

[Little Magician]

After reading alot of threads on here, I realize now the problem may be the formula, not the AB. I was feeding Esbilac. My Fox Valley should be here today. I have her on the goat's milk recipe now. 3 cc every 3-4 hrs. Has anyone ever used a laxative or a stool softener for their squirrels?

[Nancy in New York]

After reading alot of threads on here, I realize now the problem may be the formula, not the AB. I was feeding Esbilac. My Fox Valley should be here today. I have her on the goat's milk recipe now. 3 cc every 3-4 hrs. Has anyone ever used a laxative or a stool softener for their squirrels?

No laxatives or stool softeners at this age, or ever as far as I know. I have used orange juice. Try giving her about .5 cc's and see if that will help.
How long has it been since she went, and can you get a picture of her belly and her anal area? I just want to see if it is like my little guy last year.:thumbsup

[island rehabber]

YES! Nancy's little baby had a terrible Esbilac issue before she got him.....:(

[Nancy in New York]

YES! Nancy's little baby had a terrible Esbilac issue before she got him.....:(

Yes, last year I was given a pinkie that was bloated and impacted and had been fed Esbilac.
I had to push on the side of the anus to get it out, and it was like cement. He would start to fill up again, as you can see in the posted pictures. I switched him over to FV immediately, after I got him stabilized. Within about 2-3 days he was just perfect!

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv95/nancym518/Esbilac%20Problem%20baby%202010/IMG_4872.jpg

This is what was extracted the first time
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv95/nancym518/Esbilac%20Problem%20baby%202010/IMG_4876.jpg

This was about 8 hours later, he was filling up again....and bloated.
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv95/nancym518/Esbilac%20Problem%20baby%202010/IMG_4875.jpg

I believe this photo was about 24 hours after the ones above....
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv95/nancym518/Esbilac%20Problem%20baby%202010/IMG_4960.jpg

[Nancy in New York]

Forgot to mention on the above post, that I also applied a small amount of peroxide to the anal area with a q tip prior to pushing to extract the "fecal" matter.

[Jackie in Tampa]

I am with NIN, I hate laxatives..
I got your PM...
are we all in agreement that ABs are needed...I am outta the loop lately, so not sure of all details...
I can send dosing info via PM service if it's decided it's best...
I will leave that up to the rehabbers here...:thumbsup
I am just a sq friend...:)
will ck back...:grouphug

[Jackie in Tampa]

:bump
anybody...any opinions?

[Little Magician]

She sneezes and her sides move rapidly as she breathes. This started late Friday. Symptoms have not gotten worse. Here is a timeline:

Tuesday: switched her from KMR to Esbilac. Diarrhea cleared up, produced solid stool at about every feeding. Seemed to do well with the change.
Friday: Rapid breathing
Sat: Clicking noise. 1 AM Sarted cipro 0.6 mg 2x/day. Stopped pooping. After 2 doses of cipro, gave pedialite instead of formula. She pooped alot that night, so I gave her the next dose of cipro Sun 1 AM.
Sun: Cipro at 1 PM. No pooping, stopped cipro. Last Esbilac feeding at 11 PM.
Mon: Pedialite, diluted apple juice, no formula. Some poop at 5:20 PM. 11 PM Goats Milk recipe.
Tue: 3 AM pedialite. small flea sized pellet of poop, but nothing big.
7 AM Goats milk

[rygel1hardt]

Can you post a picture of her belly? If she hasnt eaten much she may not have anything to poop and may just be bloated. Does her belly appear black like bruising? Stacey

[rygel1hardt]

I do agree meds are needed but I think a different med than the cipro. Stacey



:bump
anybody...any opinions?

[Jackie in Tampa]

yea, I am with stacey...let's see the belly...
also you have made several changes in diet in a rapid time...
that may be the culprit,,,that's the way it works in general...

the breathing...:thinking
did you see her aspirate?
do you think she may have?
what type bedding are you using?
could she be inhaling something?
fabric softners, fragrant stuff?
do you hear clicking?
with every breath? even when she is sleeping?
very distinct...not muffled mouth noises...

what dilution meds did you use?
hard to know if it's the right dose unless we know how it was diluted..{strength} although someone must have helped you dilute, so not stepping on toes..if one of TSB wise rehabbers!:)
Hope all is good and you are just nervous...
the littles can scare the pajeez outta ya...:grouphug
:bowdown

[Little Magician]

She pooped! Things are moving along now that she is off the Esbilac. Should I put her back on cipro? sneezes, very faint clicking when she breathes, lot of movement in her sides as she breathes. Thanks for everyone's help!

[Jackie in Tampa]

:wottwe love poops!!!!
:poke can we still see her...we love sq pics!!!:worthless

:poop :poop :poop :poop :poop :poop :poop :poop :poop :poop :poop :poop :poop :poop

[Little Magician]

I added 1/2 crushed 500 mg tablet to 40 cc water and gave her 2 drops (1 drop = 0.05 ml), so she was getting 0.1 ml.
(500 mg/2)/ 40 ml =6.25 mg/ml
6.25 mg/ml * 0.1 ml = 0.625 mg

Please correct me if I am wrong!
Now my question is how many mg/kg of body wt do you recommend? Do you consider age?
She is .077 kg

[gs1]

:shakehead note to self: 1st question to ask ...what formula are you feeding!!!! so mad at myself ... i just assumed it was fox valley.

nancy ...omg!!!!!!!!! he looks awful... that is the best illustration ever of why esbilac is so bad.....:(

i'm wondering if it's worse for pinkies than older squirrels... but that's a whole lots of threadjacking.... and then it's also supposed to be bad for just eyes open babies too.... have no idea how some people can say they've never seen issues with it ...too confusing.....:thinking

ps: nancy ....:wott for you and your little girl.....

and :wott for little magicians guy.....:poops


oh...reminds me of the recommendation to medical students..... 'when you hear hoofbeats think horses and zebras!!!'

[gs1]

I added 1/2 crushed 500 mg tablet to 40 cc water and gave her 2 drops (1 drop = 0.05 ml), so she was getting 0.1 ml.
(500 mg/2)/ 40 ml =6.25 mg/ml
6.25 mg/ml * 0.1 ml = 0.625 mg

Please correct me if I am wrong!

Now my question is how many mg/kg of body wt do you recommend? Do you consider age?

She is .077 kg


have no idea am hoping someone else will see this ... quickly.....:)

[Little Magician]

photos after feeding and poop.

[island rehabber]

:Love_Iconawwwwwwwwwwwww:Love_Icon
she looks fine. :D

[Little Magician]

Yes she did aspirate before the symptoms started. I use hypoallergenic detergent and keep her on cotton/polyester t-shirts, blanket squares. Could be an allergy. Alot of fires, smoke in air around here. The clicking is difficult to hear. I will try to post a video of her breathing later today. Thanks to all :)

[Jackie in Tampa]

:thinking
would that dilution be 6.25mg/ml
if so, I can Pm the dose I come up with...

[Jackie in Tampa]

I added 1/2 crushed 500 mg tablet to 40 cc water and gave her 2 drops (1 drop = 0.05 ml), so she was getting 0.1 ml.
(500 mg/2)/ 40 ml =6.25 mg/ml
6.25 mg/ml * 0.1 ml = 0.625 mg

Please correct me if I am wrong!
Now my question is how many mg/kg of body wt do you recommend? Do you consider age?
She is .077 kgtinfoil oopsss! just saw this..yes, that's right!
6.25mg/ml

[Jackie in Tampa]

PMing dose info:thumbsup
edit...I am not advising anything, I am doing the math.
The rehabbers and you are the judges if she needs it..
however..I would use a probotic within two hours either way of administering meds...
I like that sweet belly though...smoooches!

[Mrs Skul]

Call if I can Help! :D