Squirrels and Domestic Pets Warning

[lilidukes]

WARNING, WARNING, WARNING

Many of you have read about the devastation in our home earlier this week. If not you need to.
http://www.thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28698

Do you allow your pets (dogs/cats) to be in the same room as your squirrel(s)??? If so please rethink it. Ours were not. We truly believed our rehab kids were safe. 4 beautiful small lives were lost in a matter of minutes. Thank God they were the only ones in that room that day or I believe others might have been lost to. Please take this warning to heart very seriously. Our dogs moved furniture and toppled a very large, very heavy cage to do what they did.

3 of our young dogs are leaving us, we are keeping a 4lb Chihuahua mix and a big old dog who only eats and sleeps. Again our hearts are broken but a choice had to be made. I have no trust left in me with these dogs. I now fear they will full heartedly hunt my releases. My squirrels are first in my life. My loves, joy and passion.

I post this not looking for hugs and sympathy, what my purpose is to make each and every member and guest of TSB with a squirrel(s) in their homes to reevaluate where their squirrel(s) are kept in proximity to their pets.

I beg you not to think that this could never happen to you too.

Lisa & Kit

[scoobysnack]

:grouphug

Those of us who have been around animals all our lives have experienced losses such as these. I had a ferret sneak into and out of a bird cage and kill my beloved Quaker. I had a Budgie simply disappear. Not a feather to be found. To this day I have no idea what animal got him. I've even had dogs kill other dogs when I had a "pack" here long ago.

They are animals. Our domestics have some instinct but not enough unfortunately. In my opinion their instincts are incomplete and tend to be a bit "off".

I'm sorry you need to make a choice. I hope you can find wonderful homes for your dogs. Dogs in numbers tend to do things that single dogs don't. I'm down to two dogs here and only when both are gone will ONE be replaced.

Just so ya know though, I have a Dane and a Chihuahua. The Chi is FAR more driven to go after the rodents than my Dane. He's the one I worry about!

[island rehabber]

lilidukes, I commend and APPLAUD you for taking this brave stance and asserting what I personally have believed for years: Domestic pets and wildlife rehab DO NOT MIX, unless you have the luxury of a separate building or separate wing on your house and the two NEVER MEET. EVER.

What you witnessed in your home was a nightmare, but it was nature in her purest form acting as nature does. Deal with it people: dogs and cats kill squirrels. Terriers in particular REALLY kill squirrels because they were bred to kill rats, going back to the middle ages. Cats torture and kill for FUN. By rescuing two kittens last year, I have given myself untold stress and aggravation because I have a 1-bdrm condo and nowhere to truly segregate the squirrels. One cat is well-behaved; one is awful, and would kill if I let her. Trust me, I did not want ANY pets anymore, but here I am with them.

Again, thank you lilidukes, for taking a politically incorrect but absolutely TRUE stance on this serious issue. :bowdown

[stepnstone]

Sorry to hear it has come to this, I hope you will find good placements for the three.
I think we all need to understand that although one may alter the nature of an animal, one never eliminates it's true nature. They are what they are.
I hope time will heal your hearts... :grouphug

[CritterMom]

I cannot agree with you more. With parrots, I long ago instituted a hard and fast rule: no predators. Ever. If you visit me with your dog he will stay in the garage. I don't bend on this. A dog or cat will NEVER kill my babies because a dog or cat will never be able to get near my babies.

[island rehabber]

Rather than have this valuable thread lost in Off topic, I am also placing a copy at the Rainbow Bridge, as a STICKY.

[SquirrelsOfWestwood]

This is a very wise thread. I see many on here who have both dogs, cats, and squirrels living together.

I raised some pet mice for awhile and it was always a policy of mine to never own a cat when I had them. A cat would never stop trying to prey on them no matter how safe I kept the cages. Also, such small pets can smell a predator which would be a cause of great stress for them.

[MiriamS]

First, let me say that I am so incredibly sorry to SoccarMom and Lilidukes for what you've been through recently. :grouphug It sounds like a very traumatic experience and I can understand why you'd now have trouble looking at your dogs the same way, when you clearly loved all of the squirrels you dedicated yourselves to saving.

I'd like to raise an ethical question that might not be a hugely popular one. When people get dogs or cats, or any pet for that matter, it should be with the intention of providing a "forever home." It sounds like you went to great length to keep your pet dogs separated from your rehab squirrels but what happened...happened. It's part accident and part behavioral instinct that the dogs shouldn't be blamed for. Is it fair to banish the dogs, which I assume you also love, to a new home that they'll have to adjust to?

I do respect you for sharing what happened with TSB and I am at one with all of the other members that have provided sympathy and support to your gruesome loss of the squirrels. I love squirrels and anyone that dedicates their time to helping any squirrel.

My personal conflict is that I consider myself an advocate for all animals and I think it's a shame when any pet is exiled or "rehomed." Is there any way that a compromise can be made that would be healthy for all parties? NaturesGift mentioned that she keeps her rehab babies in a separate building. Perhaps you can get a shed for your squirrels and make sure the dogs are never off leash? Or maybe Soccarmom can take the dogs so Lilidukes can keep rehabbing squirrels?

In the end, the dogs deserve a home that provides them a safe, secure and loving environment. It might be best for everyone if they are rehomed but I would like to see some consideration given to maintain the responsibility you have towards your dogs.

[Fireweed]

First, let me say that I am so incredibly sorry to SoccarMom and Lilidukes for what you've been through recently. :grouphug It sounds like a very traumatic experience and I can understand why you'd now have trouble looking at your dogs the same way, when you clearly loved all of the squirrels you dedicated yourselves to saving.

I'd like to raise an ethical question that might not be a hugely popular one. When people get dogs or cats, or any pet for that matter, it should be with the intention of providing a "forever home." It sounds like you went to great length to keep your pet dogs separated from your rehab squirrels but what happened...happened. It's part accident and part behavioral instinct that the dogs shouldn't be blamed for. Is it fair to banish the dogs, which I assume you also love, to a new home that they'll have to adjust to?

I do respect you for sharing what happened with TSB and I am at one with all of the other members that have provided sympathy and support to your gruesome loss of the squirrels. I love squirrels and anyone that dedicates their time to helping any squirrel.

My personal conflict is that I consider myself an advocate for all animals and I think it's a shame when any pet is exiled or "rehomed." Is there any way that a compromise can be made that would be healthy for all parties? NaturesGift mentioned that she keeps her rehab babies in a separate building. Perhaps you can get a shed for your squirrels and make sure the dogs are never off leash? Or maybe Soccarmom can take the dogs so Lilidukes can keep rehabbing squirrels?

In the end, the dogs deserve a home that provides them a safe, secure and loving environment. It might be best for everyone if they are rehomed but I would like to see some consideration given to maintain the responsibility you have towards your dogs.
:goodpost

I'm saddened on so many levels by this tragedy. I feel bad for the humans, the squirrels AND the dogs. :grouphug :grouphug :grouphug

[lilidukes]

The rehoming of the dogs has been a very hard decision. But with that said My reason for this thread is not to discuss my dogs futures. I have NR's who will come first always. Kit and I share a house. She has bunnies, possies and kitties in her private part of our home. The kittens are being rehomed as well.

I want each and everyone of you with dogs and cat to take a good long hard look at where each animal resides in your home. Please

[4skwerlz]

Once again, a very brave and tough decision. Rather than continue with these dogs in your home and "hope" it doesn't happen again, you are making sure it does not.

Of course when we give a home to an animal, it's supposed to be forever. But few of us would keep an animal in our homes that kills or maims others, whether animals or people. The "promise" we give an animal when we take it in always has two sides; we promise to take care of them, but we expect them not to kill or maim us! It's unfair of course, because the animal is incapable of understanding the deal. But you see it all the time. A nice young couple has a nice shepherd dog they adore; then they have a baby; one day the dog growls at the baby; next day, the dog has a new home.

Seems like there was no way for you to keep all your promises: to the squirrels you rehab and to the dogs.
:grouphug

[crazysquirrels]

Clearly the dogs cannot be trusted. You have mad a choice and good for you. I am sure not an easy one but it should save lives in the future. Salute to you and the tough choice you had to make.

[island rehabber]

Again, I agree completely with lilidukes' wise decision, and the emotional strength and maturity it took to make it. :bowdown

[Sandylew]

This really scares me as I rescued 4 baby squirrels the morning after hurricane Irene, just about 10 days or so ago. They now have their eyes open and are eating quite well. They are however going thru the nursing the penis thing, which is how I came to find this website (searching for an answer). We have 2 dogs a Cavalier King Charles and a mini dasch. We also have a cat. The dogs are not allowed in the rear of the house but the cat pretty much comes and goes as she pleases. I have a basement but feel bad about putting the squirrels down there without sunlight.

Any suggestions would be appreciated!

Sandy

[SammysMom]

Could their cage go in a bedroom with the door closed? It really is important and will save their lives.

[astra]

are the squirrels 100% normal and healthy?.. because that means they will be released, right?... which also means that they will be at your house temporarily... ---> ;-) means whatever arrangements you will make will be temporarily (this way they won't be too overwhelming), and as a temporary arrangement, maybe, there could be a way to limit where the cat can and cannot go. Again, it will be only temporarily, while the squirrels are in the house.
Or, as Sammysmom said, the squirrels need to be placed in one (?bedroom?) room, the only room where the cat is not allowed.

In any events, the squirrels and dogs/cats should be separated. Not only because dogs and cats are predators and therefore are unpredictable, but also because squirrels should not get used to them.
Squirrels should have their natural instinctive fear of dogs and cats.
Fear means that they want to run for their lives when they see them, not ride on their backs or attack them or play with them.
If they see you interact with dogs and cats, they will pick that cue from you (since you are their MOm now and they learn everything from their Mom, follow her in her every footstep) and will think that dogs and cats are ok.

It's tough to keep them separated, but it is possible. There are quite a few people who have done it. Keep asking questions.:grouphug

[BrucetheSquirrel94]

WARNING, WARNING, WARNING

Many of you have read about the devastation in our home earlier this week. If not you need to.
http://www.thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28698

Do you allow your pets (dogs/cats) to be in the same room as your squirrel(s)??? If so please rethink it. Ours were not. We truly believed our rehab kids were safe. 4 beautiful small lives were lost in a matter of minutes. Thank God they were the only ones in that room that day or I believe others might have been lost to. Please take this warning to heart very seriously. Our dogs moved furniture and toppled a very large, very heavy cage to do what they did.

3 of our young dogs are leaving us, we are keeping a 4lb Chihuahua mix and a big old dog who only eats and sleeps. Again our hearts are broken but a choice had to be made. I have no trust left in me with these dogs. I now fear they will full heartedly hunt my releases. My squirrels are first in my life. My loves, joy and passion.

I post this not looking for hugs and sympathy, what my purpose is to make each and every member and guest of TSB with a squirrel(s) in their homes to reevaluate where their squirrel(s) are kept in proximity to their pets.

I beg you not to think that this could never happen to you too.

Lisa & Kit

luckily my dogs have been around pet squirrels since pups if i could only get them to sit still id get a pic of Bruce and my 3 Dachshunds in a pic together, im so sry 4 your lost tho :(

[virgo062]

Be careful....My dog had been around kittens in his life but for no other reason other than he is a dog he found a bed of 5 newborn feral kittens and killed 4 of the 5....Dogs are preditors and unpredictable:osnap

[island rehabber]

BUMP

[Margie]

Something similiar happened to the rehabber that was going to take Stormy Lee when she was little. Someone didn't close the back door properly and the dog got in and broke down the cage their rescued squirrel was in. The dog didn't get to the squirrel but the damage to the large cage caused his back to be broken. Stormy was supposed to go there to be released (if her teeth allowed it) with that squirrel the next week. I am so glad the woman got sick and didn't come get her. The scary thing about that disaster was the woman's husband was asleep in the room where the cage was and didn't hear anything and wake up until it was too late! She told me "What if it had been one of the kids?". So we ordered a cage and became squirrel parents,since the vet said not to let her outside. We have five cats and a dog in the house, but Stormy has her own room. She is in her cage during the night and early morning when I am asleep or when no one is home and allowed out to play in "her" room the rest of the time. The cats and dog are not allowed in there. If though by some terrible occurence something happened and she got killed by one of the cats, I would not get rid of my cats. They were here first and I love them dearly. One of my outside cats brought Stormy to me. She is alive today because of a cat. I could not condemn my cat for being a cat. It would be a terrible accident, but it would've had to be a human error that allowed it to happen.

[2ndHandRanchRescue]

yes bump bump bump.
Think would you put a lamb in a room with a lion?
A cat in a room with a mouse?
A wolf with a rabbit?
Dogs & cats need to be far away from squirrels for sure!!!!

Its like the story of the scorpion and the frog

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Scorpion_and_the_Frog

[Scooterzmom]

:bump

[Garden71]

yes bump bump bump.
Think would you put a lamb in a room with a lion?
A cat in a room with a mouse?
A wolf with a rabbit?
Dogs & cats need to be far away from squirrels for sure!!!!

Its like the story of the scorpion and the frog

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Scorpion_and_the_Frog


:goodpost

[stosh2010]

B-U-M-P..
PLEASE --Be CAUTIOUS...to a fault ...I lost a baby squirrel to a small...single , puncture wound from a friendly dog...
It does not take a brutal attack to end a squirrels chances at living.

[dixiedarlin]

when i am home my eyes are always on all of my animals and kids so i know what is going on. when i am not home, the dogs( 2 teacup chihuahuas) and the cat are locked up.

[DarkLies212]

:bump
It's been a long time since this thread was bumped. Even though it's a sticky, some newer members may not see it. I know this if the first time I've ever seen it and I'm not even sure how I came across it. Hoping this shows up in everyone's New Posts feed!

[island rehabber]

GOOD BUMP, for sure. Read, and beware. You cannot trust predators and prey together, nomatter how cute...or how old.....or how "well trained".

[Shewhosweptforest]

Exactly! I adore my German shepherd Breezy:Love_Icon but I would never allow her around my babies...I cringe when I see videos people post on youtube of their dogs "playing" with small wildlife....one false move and the little one pays the price :shakehead

[SammysMom]

I had to take a broken squirrel to the vet today to be euthanized thanks to a husky who found him in the yard and was "just playing with him".
Godspeed little one...:Love_Icon:Love_Icon:Love_Icon

[DarkLies212]

I had to take a broken squirrel to the vet today to be euthanized thanks to a husky who found him in the yard and was "just playing with him".
Godspeed little one...:Love_Icon:Love_Icon:Love_Icon

Run free little one :Love_Icon

[TubeDriver]

:(



I had to take a broken squirrel to the vet today to be euthanized thanks to a husky who found him in the yard and was "just playing with him".
Godspeed little one...:Love_Icon:Love_Icon:Love_Icon

[Nancy in New York]

I had to take a broken squirrel to the vet today to be euthanized thanks to a husky who found him in the yard and was "just playing with him".
Godspeed little one...:Love_Icon:Love_Icon:Love_Icon

:sadness
Rest in Peace
Precious Little One.265332

[Shewhosweptforest]

So sorry SammysMom :hug :Love_Icon sorry lil wild your life was cut way too short :sadness

[lukaslolamaus]

R.I.P. little one:Love_Icon:grouphug:sad

[kcassidy]

Noooooo I'm so sorry Sammy's Mom. It is so hard when our only role is to help them pass. I'm glad he had you.

Hugs.

[Groundhog]

Where is the paper clip so I can attach a picture?


WARNING, WARNING, WARNING

Many of you have read about the devastation in our home earlier this week. If not you need to.
http://www.thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28698

Do you allow your pets (dogs/cats) to be in the same room as your squirrel(s)??? If so please rethink it. Ours were not. We truly believed our rehab kids were safe. 4 beautiful small lives were lost in a matter of minutes. Thank God they were the only ones in that room that day or I believe others might have been lost to. Please take this warning to heart very seriously. Our dogs moved furniture and toppled a very large, very heavy cage to do what they did.

3 of our young dogs are leaving us, we are keeping a 4lb Chihuahua mix and a big old dog who only eats and sleeps. Again our hearts are broken but a choice had to be made. I have no trust left in me with these dogs. I now fear they will full heartedly hunt my releases. My squirrels are first in my life. My loves, joy and passion.

I post this not looking for hugs and sympathy, what my purpose is to make each and every member and guest of TSB with a squirrel(s) in their homes to reevaluate where their squirrel(s) are kept in proximity to their pets.

I beg you not to think that this could never happen to you too.

Lisa & Kit

[island rehabber]

Where is the paper clip so I can attach a picture?

Hello from City Island, Bronx neighbor. When you open the box to "Reply to Thread", the first row of icons on top of the box will have a paperclip to attach pix. However, it doesn't look much like a paperclip -- it looks like a gas pump :grin2

[Pop Alexandra]

It's never easy and fully avoidable, but we should do our best to avoid these situations.
_________________
Alexandra from W2C (https://w2c.ca/en/industries/live-animals)