Need help fast!!

[andy49510]

I have a baby squirrel. about (5-6 weeks old. His eyes just opened 2 days ago).My cat brought him to us and we've had him about a week now. just about 30 minutes ago he started breathing very heavily. We think he has Pneumonia. He's making the clicking noise and his mouth stays open and he can just barely breath out of it. Is there something I can do RIGHT now that can save him or is this possibly not life threatening right now?? I don't have any antibiotics. Someone please help me out here!

:(

[andy49510]

Also, if it helps.. his diet has been Esbilac puppy milk replacer and pedialyte.

[andy49510]

Bump.

Anything?

[lilidukes]

Do you have any antibiotics??

[Tara L]

omg - could you call your reg vet or do you have an emergency clinic near you? I'm not sure what your state rules are, some states don't allow (keeping wildlife-even temp) but it sounds like a real emergency. could he be choking? Just hold on one of the seniors will be here shortly.

[lilidukes]

Sorry, he needs a vet ASAP.

[andy49510]

No

[andy49510]

Sorry, he needs a vet ASAP.

I've called all the vets in my area and they either are closed, or don't know anything aout squirrels.

[scoobysnack]

He needs antibiotics immediately. Batril is the preferred. Do you have anything at all until someone can get you some batril?

[gs1]

:grouphug

he may have gotten fluids in his lungs...

where in kansas are you ...we might have rehabbers or some help nearby ....

could we just have the city ?

he needs to be kept warm....

[andy49510]

:grouphug

he may have gotten fluids in his lungs...

where in kansas are you ...we might have rehabbers or some help nearby ....

could we just have the city ?

he needs to be kept warm....

Wichita

[lilidukes]

He needs antibiotics immediately. Batril is the preferred. Do you have anything at all until someone can get you some batril?


:thumbsup Baytril or amoxicillian clavamox anything?

[lilidukes]

Do you know anyone with kids that might have AB's

[Nancy in New York]

OK so you are saying that there are no vets or anything that will help you. Now think of anybody with a baby or a person who has recently been on antibiotics...call whoever you can, and we can help you dose. Also see if they have animals that may have been on them...anything.

[andy49510]

I've been calling around my family and can't seem to find anyone with antibiotics :/

I'm going to keep searching around.

His breathing has calmed down a bit.

[NaturesGift]

Hi neighbor! Yes this is a life threating issue! And you need to get this baby to a rehabber!!! They will have antibiotics!

Here is a link I found!

http://www.kdwp.state.ks.us/news/content/download/12435/78994/file/2011%20Rehab.pdf

My aunt lives in Wichita lol

[andy49510]

Is there an over the counter antibiotic?

[Busysqrl]

My prayers are with you. I hope your little baby pulls through. It does sound like he needs antibiotics ASAP :grouphug :grouphug :grouphug

[island rehabber]

I agree with Natures Gift - you must get him to someone who has antibiotics, preferably baytril, because he is in the advanced stage of aspiration pneumonia. There are NO over the counter antibiotics in this country. Please -- call everyone you can on that list! Keep him very warm and don't stress him by forcing him to drink anything right now.

[gs1]

:grouphug your best chance and probably only chance for him is to call all those rehabbers that natures gift gave you and ask them if they'll accept a baby squirrel.... and ask too if they'll treat him ...

at this point i think you wanted to raise him yourself but if you can get him to a rehabber it's better for him...he'll be raised with other squirrels and learn from them how to be one....

he'll also know to keep away from cats and people ...which is safer for him ....

at the very least see if someone will work with you and give you baytril for him and then you can work with them to figure out what to do with him as he gets older....

squirrels can be so difficult that having rehabber friends is a godsend...:grouphug

[andy49510]

Sorry I haven't replied for a while, I've been driving around and making calls. Thank god I finally found a family member with amoxicillin. Is this alright to use?? Also, how much?

[NaturesGift]

I have never had luck with AMOX but if your not gonna get help its all you got.

What is the dosage> are they pills if so how many MG are they?

If liquid how how many Mg/Ml is it?

And how much does your baby weigh?

[andy49510]

our scale is acting a bit off and saying he only weighs one-eighth of an ounce which is way off. From my knowledge he's at a healthy weight for his age. He eats, (and potties) a lot and has grown tremendously since we've had him.
The AMOX is a capsule and is 500 mg.
I also read somewhere that yogurt will help fight harmful bacteria,is this true?
We're not sure if its pneumonia or not, but the poor guy is congested for sure.

[gs1]

andy pneumonia is really fast and deadly ... i've lost 2 to it in hours...actually less....

so if i was you ...the only advice i could give you ... i've been there... is to call those rehabbers and ask them if they'll help you ... if we had baytril anywhere near you you'd have it ...but you are at least 24 hours even using next day service...

you don't have time... i'm sorry....:grouphug

[gs1]

liquid in his lungs is pneumonia no matter how it got there.... that's the clicking that you hear... :grouphug

yes, plain no fruit ...vanilla full fat yogurt is used by some for good bacteria ... but i'm sorry i don't think you'll have much time to worry about that ....

i know i'm sounding harsh ...i'm sorry ...i've just been there... :grouphug

[andy49510]

We aren't even sure if its pneumonia for one.And all of the rehabbers we looked at are at least two hours away.

[andy49510]

He's already eased up on that 'clicking' just from being kept on his heating pad. It more or less sounds like a baby sneeze. There are no Rehabbers on the list that NaturesGift replied with that are near wichita.All of them are hours away, and in that case I dont think he'd make it without the heating bad.I just need the dosage for this amox.

[NaturesGift]

working on the dose.

so he is 1/8 of an ounce?

wow ok not the right weight as thats 3.5 grams... . OK just gonna dose for an average 5-6 week old baby. 100 grams?

[spykitten01]

andy pneumonia is really fast and deadly ... i've lost 2 to it in hours...actually less....

so if i was you ...the only advice i could give you ... i've been there... is to call those rehabbers and ask them if they'll help you ... if we had baytril anywhere near you you'd have it ...but you are at least 24 hours even using next day service...

you don't have time... i'm sorry....:grouphug
:goodpost :goodpost :goodpost


Perhaps call them and ask if they will meet you halfway? You cannot wait on this - even if the clicking has subsided for the moment, that baby is SICK - Squirrels typically don't begin to show signs of illness until they are on their way to death's door. Again, none of us are trying to be pushy or harsh - we're just trying to give you the help you need - the help your baby needs - and the help he needs is a rehabber with the proper supplies, or it is likely he wont make it. We may not always like the truth, but it is what it is.

[gs1]

i've asked someone else for dosage since i have no idea....

if he doesn't have pneumonia then he doesn't need amox... ... but we know he has something...

if ng doesn't even think that amox will help ... then i'm not sure why give it to him ...because first of all you don't want to give him worse problems...

please wait and see if a rehabber can come on to help you with dosage ... medication overdose can still poison him....

:grouphug

did you phone those numbers in case they have contacts... ? ...maybe they know someone in your area....

i've got nothing against you keeping the squirrel to release until he's older but we're all still learning and it's wonderful to have others that know something more than we do ....

[andy49510]

he's 4.5 fluid ounces

[NaturesGift]

500 mg.... cut the pill in half crush 1 half of it

add it to 5 ccs of water. Making it a raio of 50mg/ML

If its not crushable and is a capsule full of powder

add it to 10 ccs of water its the same ratio.

For 100 gram baby they need 0.04 ccs.

But seriously thats a guess at his weight!

[NaturesGift]

oh he wil need yogurt and extra hydration. all antibiodics make the body need more fluids. And Cillins are hard on the GI tract

[andy49510]

Thank you so much NaturesGift.We'll keep you posted on him.

[NaturesGift]

you need ot keep the made up meds in the fridge and they are no good after 2 weeks.

[andy49510]

we've given him the medicine,and it turns out he was constipated.After we got him to potty he got a little better.But is it safe to feed him?He's making the same whimper that he makes when he's hungry.I read on another thread that we shouldnt and that we should just keep him hydrated.

[spykitten01]

In the beginning it said you had been giving him Esbilac and Pedialyte - how often have you been giving him pedialyte? Also, what have you been using to feed him? Is there a heating pad with no auto shut-off beneath his cage/whatever he's being kept in?

[NaturesGift]

we've given him the medicine,and it turns out he was constipated.After we got him to potty he got a little better.But is it safe to feed him?He's making the same whimper that he makes when he's hungry.I read on another thread that we shouldnt and that we should just keep him hydrated.


constipated or bloated? when was his last BM?

is his tummy swollen and hard? if its bloat it can cause breathing issues.

[andy49510]

just a few minutes ago. His tummy is swollen a bit and it is very hard.

[andy49510]

NaturesGift,do you have a phone you can reach us on? I tried to p.m. it and i dont have the 'privilege' to the site said.

[NaturesGift]

you need to get some baby GAS X . also warm water baths help! with tummy massages

yes my phone # is 417-741-2353

[andy49510]

you need to get some baby GAS X . also warm water baths help! with tummy massages

yes my phone # is 417-741-2353



How much baby GAS X would we use and how often?

[pappy1264]

You can give him 2-3 drops, and try to do warm water massage. Be very careful his face/nose does not come in contact w/water. I agree, you should at least try to call the rehabbers, they may be willing to travel. He needs help and you may not be able to get him all he needs. These little ones go down hill so fast. Sending prayers.

And you say he is getting esbilac and pedialyte....you are not mixing them, are you?

[andy49510]

You can give him 2-3 drops, and try to do warm water massage. Be very careful his face/nose does not come in contact w/water. I agree, you should at least try to call the rehabbers, they may be willing to travel. He needs help and you may not be able to get him all he needs. These little ones go down hill so fast. Sending prayers.

And you say he is getting esbilac and pedialyte....you are not mixing them, are you?

Thanks for the reply. I've just been giving him one drop of it every 2 hours mixed with pedialyte. So how often should I give it to him? and we got the proper dosage of the antibiotic in him earlier. I think he might have aspiration pneumonia but his tummy is a little bloated. He's still doing the exact same thing as earlier although he has pottied. We called the list of rehabbers around here as well as vets.we didn't get any answer from the rehabbers and the vets won't take him in since it's illegal for them to take wildlife. Sorry if I made alot of mistakes. I've sitting by his cage watching him all night now and I'm really tired.

[andy49510]

You can give him 2-3 drops, and try to do warm water massage. Be very careful his face/nose does not come in contact w/water. I agree, you should at least try to call the rehabbers, they may be willing to travel. He needs help and you may not be able to get him all he needs. These little ones go down hill so fast. Sending prayers.

And you say he is getting esbilac and pedialyte....you are not mixing them, are you?


Also forgot to mention, no I have not been mixing them. thanks for the prayers. He's gotten lots!

[Best Life]

Thanks for the reply. I've just been giving him one drop of it every 2 hours mixed with pedialyte. So how often should I give it to him? and we got the proper dosage of the antibiotic in him earlier. I think he might have aspiration pneumonia but his tummy is a little bloated. He's still doing the exact same thing as earlier although he has pottied. We called the list of rehabbers around here as well as vets.we didn't get any answer from the rehabbers and the vets won't take him in since it's illegal for them to take wildlife. Sorry if I made alot of mistakes. I've sitting by his cage watching him all night now and I'm really tired.
Hi there! Been following your thread - hope the little one is hanging in there. When we know better, we do better, right? That's what you're doing now. CALL, CALL, CALL. It's very, very important to get a hands-on diagnosis for the little guy (does he have a name?), and critical that he gets the correct type of antibiotic.

Please don't give up calling Rehabbers and Vets. Rehabbers can get so overly-overwhelmed caring for so many critters, that it's very difficult to answer the phone, much less call you back as quickly as they would like to. Often times if a rehabber cannot help you immediately, they can give you more contacts to call, perhaps closer to your home, or at least the name of someone who can help you in the interim. Be sure to read the "stickies" about Emergency Care. The temporary heat packs like Rice Buddies and containers filled with warm water are Life Savers when it comes to getting your baby from point A to point B on a long drive. Many service stations have microwaves you can use to re-warm your "heat pack", and I haven't met a person yet in a restaurant or gas station that wasn't willing to let me use their microwave for that purpose.

Vets are in a really bad position if you are in an illegal state, but, again, Don't Give Up Trying to get help. A caring vet may be able to help you get into contact with a rehabber that they know of. "Friends of Friends" aka "Total Strangers Who Are Willing To Help" can end up being the difference between life and death for these little squirrels.

Have faith and KEEP TRYING to get ahold of someone. Help is out there, sometimes you have to be aggressive in trying to find it! Best of luck to you!!

[NaturesGift]

Just txted me baby is doing better!!

[island rehabber]

Thank God! :bowdown
(and whoever discovered antibiotics) :D

[Nancy in New York]

Thanks for the update...:thumbsup

[andy49510]

He's gotten a little better. I gave him his dosage of antibiotic this morning. He's still having a tough time breathing but he's drank some pedialyte and he's been going to the bathroom. He sounds very congested so I read around on here and decided to go buy a vaporizer and I've had it going right by his cage. He's had mucous coming from his nose a few times while using it and I've just been cleaning it off with a q-tip. This is cleaning him out and is a good thing, right? Would it be okay to give this little guy some yogurt and how much if so?

Also, before anyone asks, I called around the list of rehabbers in my area today and I can't get an answer so I'm just doing everything I can for him. I think he's going to be alright. It just keeps going up and down for him. First he looks alright then he's having a tough time breathing. Everytime I pick him up to get him a drink he climbs off the cloth and crawls up to my shoulder and just sits there. (which is starting to make things a little difficult. lol)

[Best Life]

So glad to hear you are making some progress! Got any pictures of the lil' tyke? or a name?

[andy49510]

So glad to hear you are making some progress! Got any pictures of the lil' tyke? or a name?http://img202.imageshack.us/i/458767.png/

This was taken a few days ago when his eyes just opened.
We named him diego! lol

[andy49510]

He's gotten a little better. I gave him his dosage of antibiotic this morning. He's still having a tough time breathing but he's drank some pedialyte and he's been going to the bathroom. He sounds very congested so I read around on here and decided to go buy a vaporizer and I've had it going right by his cage. He's had mucous coming from his nose a few times while using it and I've just been cleaning it off with a q-tip. This is cleaning him out and is a good thing, right? Would it be okay to give this little guy some yogurt and how much if so?

Also, before anyone asks, I called around the list of rehabbers in my area today and I can't get an answer so I'm just doing everything I can for him. I think he's going to be alright. It just keeps going up and down for him. First he looks alright then he's having a tough time breathing. Everytime I pick him up to get him a drink he climbs off the cloth and crawls up to my shoulder and just sits there. (which is starting to make things a little difficult. lol)

Anyone have any answers? I'm gonna stay up all night watching him again so I'll keep checking here.

[lilidukes]

Anyone have any answers? I'm gonna stay up all night watching him again so I'll keep checking here.

When you pick him up wrap him up like a little burrito, might make it easier to handle the worm:flash3

Just add a little yogurt into his formula

[Scooterzmom]

On wrapping him like a little burrito, here's a pic to give you an idea... 135296

Also, you might want to start him on FV or Goat's milk formula... you should not keep him on pedialyte more than 24 hours and he does need nutrition. Be very careful the way you hold the syringe... this photo's angle is not a good one to show the proper way... you have to make sure that the syringe is shooting upward (kinda like you'd aim for the ceiling with it I mean, never downward... you don't want to aspirate the little one).

Start the formula at only 1:4 strength when you begin (or at least no stronger than 1:2 strength, to give his little stomach a chance to get used to it)

[andy49510]

Exactly what i've been doing with the wrapping!

:thumbsup

Perfect.

He's been on pedialyte for over 24 hours now so I guess I'll have to mix up some Esbilac 4:1 (I was doing 2:1 before) and see how it goes although I'm very nervous about it. Maybe it'll make him feel better and give him some more strength though. How much do you recommend and how often?

[Mrs Skul]

:wave123 Hi Andy
I have a few questions for you. How long have you been giving the pedialyte? How big is the syringe you are using? ( should be a 1cc or 3cc.) Have you pulled his skin between his shoulders up and release. It should spring back quickly. If it stays there. That is what we call tenting. He will be dehydrated, and need fluieds. The quicker the skin goes back in place. The less dehydrated he is. How many times a day are you giving the Amoxicillion? :dono
Are you still using Esbilac? :dono You should mix Esbilac, Yogurt, and Heavy Whipping Cream to gather. The yogurt will replace the good bacteria that the Amoxicillion kills off. You need to use a Full Fat Vanilla. Stony Field makes YoBaby Organic. Dannon Has DannonLaCream, or DanODeanO for young children and babies. 2Xthe calcium. Now Don't buy yogurt that has Chunks of fruit. That is no good.:nono
2 TBS Water
1 TBS Esbilac Powder
1/2 tsp Yogurt
1TBS of Heavy Cream
Mix the water,Powder,and yogurt. (Mix well) Then add the Heavy Cream last. Mix slightly If you shake/mix to much it will turn into better.
Now Just until He is back on his feet. I would hold off on the Cream for now.
You are never suppose to mix pedialyte and Formula to gather! :nono pedialyte should never be given for more then 24 to 48 Hours! :nono
You also can use the bathroom as a steam room. Get it very very steamy, by turning the shower on HOT. Sit in the bathroom for 1 hr. Several times a day. That will be braking the mucous up out of his lungs. One thing you need to realize. This baby is Very Very SICK. He can DIE any time now. He is in the advance stages of Aspiration pneumonia. Only a few Good Rehabbers can pull them through this with the right medicine and the right food. Almost all Rehabbers have switched to FoxVally. Esbilac switched the ingredients around. This caused baby Squirrels sever Diarrhea and was KILLING them. :eek: If your little one pulls through. Please thank about ordering some FoxVally. Hear is a few cites you might find handy.
Visit the Henry's Healthy Pets website: http://henryspets.com
http://foxvalleynutrition.com/main/prod.asp
http://www.squirrelsandmore.com/
(877)717-7748
(860)749-1129
PS
Keep calling the Vets Office. Ask if there is a Rehabber around close that they use. Also If you have a dog, Call the Vet, you take dog to. Ask them if they can help you! The baby will get better , then crash. They do this repeatedly till they can't go on any more or get better.:grouphug Hang in there. You have a long road ahead of you. Good luck!:grouphug Kiss the little baby for me.:Love_Icon

[andy49510]

:wave123 Hi Andy
I have a few questions for you. How long have you been giving the pedialyte? How big is the syringe you are using? ( should be a 1cc or 3cc.) Have you pulled his skin between his shoulders up and release. It should spring back quickly. If it stays there. That is what we call tenting. He will be dehydrated, and need fluieds. The quicker the skin goes back in place. The less dehydrated he is. How many times a day are you giving the Amoxicillion? :dono
Are you still using Esbilac? :dono You should mix Esbilac, Yogurt, and Heavy Whipping Cream to gather. The yogurt will replace the good bacteria that the Amoxicillion kills off. You need to use a Full Fat Vanilla. Stony Field makes YoBaby Organic. Dannon Has DannonLaCream, or DanODeanO for young children and babies. 2Xthe calcium. Now Don't buy yogurt that has Chunks of fruit. That is no good.:nono
2 TBS Water
1 TBS Esbilac Powder
1/2 tsp Yogurt
1TBS of Heavy Cream
Mix the water,Powder,and yogurt. (Mix well) Then add the Heavy Cream last. Mix slightly If you shake/mix to much it will turn into better.
Now Just until He is back on his feet. I would hold off on the Cream for now.
You are never suppose to mix pedialyte and Formula to gather! :nono pedialyte should never be given for more then 24 to 48 Hours! :nono
You also can use the bathroom as a steam room. Get it very very steamy, by turning the shower on HOT. Sit in the bathroom for 1 hr. Several times a day. That will be braking the mucous up out of his lungs. One thing you need to realize. This baby is Very Very SICK. He can DIE any time now. He is in the advance stages of Aspiration pneumonia. Only a few Good Rehabbers can pull them through this with the right medicine and the right food. Almost all Rehabbers have switched to FoxVally. Esbilac switched the ingredients around. This caused baby Squirrels sever Diarrhea and was KILLING them. :eek: If your little one pulls through. Please thank about ordering some FoxVally. Hear is a few cites you might find handy.
Visit the Henry's Healthy Pets website: http://henryspets.com
http://foxvalleynutrition.com/main/prod.asp
http://www.squirrelsandmore.com/
(877)717-7748
(860)749-1129
PS
Keep calling the Vets Office. Ask if there is a Rehabber around close that they use. Also If you have a dog, Call the Vet, you take dog to. Ask them if they can help you! The baby will get better , then crash. They do this repeatedly till they can't go on any more or get better.:grouphug Hang in there. You have a long road ahead of you. Good luck!:grouphug Kiss the little baby for me.:Love_Icon

I'm using a larger syringe. I think it's 9 ML (1cc=1ml).

I've been giving him 1cc of amox per day. he doesn't take it in so well. Haven't mixed the formula and pedialyte. I have yogurt so I'll probably mix that up with Esbilac 1:4? Would that be alright? I want it to be thin because he's still having problems breathing. With that mixture, how much and how often? also how much pedialyte to make sure he's hydrated and how often?

I've been using the vaporizer multiple times a day and he's been sneezing and has had mucous coming out of his nostrils when I've used it so I think those are good signs.

[SammysMom]

I would be happy to have a bag of FV sent to you if it will help. Please let me know if you would like me to do that. I would just need your address to have it mailed to you.:grouphug

[Mrs Skul]

I would stop the pedialyte. Did you do the test? He should be getting enough fluid with the formula diluted. When adding the yogurt, it will be thin. Just like water. You always can mix up Molasses and water and give a little of that in between feedings. Now How often were you feeding be for he got sick and how much?:dono? You should feed every 3 to 4 hr. With out seeing the size of the baby It is hard to guss the age and wt. Could you try posting a picture of him again? The last time it did not come up. Now How did you come up with 1cc of Amoxicillion? :eek: That is to much antibiotic!!
NatuersGift posted 0.4 !!! A 1 cc syringe has all these little marks and numbers. You will count down from the top 0.4 of them.
If you get to the line with 0.5 that is to much. Now if you have a 3 cc syringe. You will draw the Antibiotic up to 0.4
(It will not be marked on the 3cc syringe. Just stop on the line just be for the 0.5.)
Now The syringe you are using to feed your baby is way to big. :thinking 9cc or 10cc syringe is something all of our seasoned Rehabbers Never Use on a small baby.:shakehead That is why he has aspirated. (You do know not to lay your baby on his back and feed!!:nono ) Always feed him laying on his belly. ( in that position.):D Go to the Wal-Mart pharmacy today. Ask for a 1 cc or a 3 cc syringe. Tell them you are feeding baby kittens that are a few days old. They should give you one, or sell you a few. If you look in the medical supply. You can get a baby syringe for medicine. I am thinking it was a 3 cc.
How is the little guy doing this morning?

[Jackie in Tampa]

:sanp3 I agree, that is too much ABs...
you NEED a 1cc syringe in order to measure the proper amount...
you are going to cause dehydration and constiupation and his liver is going to go thru hell processing that much amoxy...
wait 24 hours before giving anymore Anti biotics and give him plenty of plain tap water today...
get rid of the 9cc syinge...you do not need it for anything...too big..

:Love_Icon sounds like you are dedicated...good luck!
You are getting great help!

Hi Mrs Skul, glad you are back:wave123

[island rehabber]

I know Jackie will agree -- we do not EVER use anything larger than a 3cc syringe to feed squirrels of ANY age :nono. And most of the time we only use 1cc syringes.

[Pierre]

If he's been getting over 2x the dose of amox for some time [?], perhaps a rehabber can post how to correct the diarrhea that will surely follow.

Andy: diarrhea on top of his severe respiratory infection will really really be hard on the little guy [who has no reserves left] and very hard for him to survive.

My understanding is that the amount of bacteria in any yogurt is not near the amount that will be necessary to help reverse this. I know there are other probiotic products out there are have the necessary levels. Could someone advise for Andy?

Andy: Thank you for trying so hard for this one. :grouphug Please know, you must follow the advice from these rehabbers exactly or this little sweet soul will die.

[CritterMom]

Petco sells Bene-bac powder for small animals that is wonderful. Petco sells it - it is in the department with all of the hamster stuff - small envelopes, usually a hanging display - like $3.

[andy49510]

I have a smaller syringe too (i think it's 4 cc's) but it doesn't have lines on it for measuring. The 9cc was all i could find at walgreens the other day. Anyone have any ideas how much milk I should give him and how often?

[Pierre]

Petco sells Bene-bac powder for small animals that is wonderful. Petco sells it - it is in the department with all of the hamster stuff - small envelopes, usually a hanging display - like $3.

:thankyou

[Pierre]

I have a smaller syringe too (i think it's 4 cc's) but it doesn't have lines on it for measuring. The 9cc was all i could find at walgreens the other day. Anyone have any ideas how much milk I should give him and how often?

Go to the walgreen's PHARMACY dept [or any pharmacy dept] and ask for some 1ml [or 3ml] syringes. They have them and often will not even charge you for them [or they're pennies each]. Get as many as possible, as they get tight and stick over time. Say they're for a orphaned kitten or guinea pig [not squirrel].

Go get them now. You need to be able to measure and you need to not aspirate this baby anymore.

:grouphug :grouphug

[andy49510]

To whoever said that was too much amox, you're right. I read the dosage wrong. Thankfully, like I said earlier, he didn't like it and he was probably taking less than half of it down because there was still alot in the syringe left. I'll wait another 24 hours if I give him anymore.

[Pierre]

:grouphug :grouphug

Everyone here wants you to stay around and we are all so happy you are trying to help this baby. :Love_Icon His condition is very serious though, and quickly gathering the necessary items and the correct food and medicine can mean the difference between life and death. As been said, these little ones go down so quickly.

[andy49510]

:grouphug :grouphug

Everyone here wants you to stay around and we are all so happy you are trying to help this baby. :Love_Icon His condition is very serious though, and quickly gathering the necessary items and the correct food and medicine can mean the difference between life and death. As been said, these little ones go down so quickly.

Will do! I'm about to go now.

[andy49510]

Oops, replied to the wrong post. Anyways, i'm about to go to walgreens.

[andy49510]

I've been up all night and I'm tired looking. I can only imagine what they'll think when I ask for a syringe. lol

[Pierre]

Amoxicillin should be given two times a day. You cannot skip a dose because he might have had an incorrect amt before.

Questions:
How many times have you given him some so far, and when?

It is good perhaps that he didn't take all of his last dose, but taking the dose is VERY important.

[do you or any friends happen to have cipro? just a thought]

[Pierre]

Oops, replied to the wrong post. Anyways, i'm about to go to walgreens.

Excellent Andy!! :grouphug :grouphug :grouphug

You're the best. You're doing a great job and we know you have a big heart. :Love_Icon :Love_Icon :Love_Icon :thankyou

[Pierre]

I've been up all night and I'm tired looking. I can only imagine what they'll think when I ask for a syringe. lol

Funny! :D

I'm sorry you're pooped, it is grueling! But so worth it. :Love_Icon :Love_Icon

:thankyou

[andy49510]

She wouldn't give me one at walgreens. She told me I needed a prescription or proof I pick up my prescriptions there. Then she asked what it was for and I told her it was to feed a kitten. She just said sorry and there was nothing she could do. I went to dillon's and the lady at the pharmacy gladly gave me one, but it's another just like the one I've got.

[CritterMom]

She wouldn't give me one at walgreens. She told me I needed a prescription or proof I pick up my prescriptions there. Then she asked what it was for and I told her it was to feed a kitten. She just said sorry and there was nothing she could do. I went to dillon's and the lady at the pharmacy gladly gave me one, but it's another just like the one I've got.


Hon, make sure they know you need the SYRINGE ONLY - no needle. I got syringes from every drug store in the area when my boy was a baby. I told them that I was feeding a kitten that had been regected and that I needed a 1cc syringe only because the larger ones were causing the kitten to aspirate. I had them handing out syringes by the bagful and never asked for money even.

[andy49510]

Hon, make sure they know you need the SYRINGE ONLY - no needle. I got syringes from every drug store in the area when my boy was a baby. I told them that I was feeding a kitten that had been regected and that I needed a 1cc syringe only because the larger ones were causing the kitten to aspirate. I had them handing out syringes by the bagful and never asked for money even.

Okay. I think I'll go to a different and tell them that. I found a 3cc syringe that didn't have any lines for measurement. I just measured it out in the bigger one and poured it in the smaller one then made markings for the lines.

[andy49510]

I hate to ask again and again, but does anyone have an idea how much esbilac mixed 1:4 I should give him and how often?

How come there's no button to edit my posts? :dono

[Nancy in New York]

I hate to ask again and again, but does anyone have an idea how much esbilac mixed 1:4 I should give him and how often?

How come there's no button to edit my posts? :dono

I am going to post my email address, and if you could email me your name and address, I will send you some Fox Valley, and some 1 cc syringes.
I have no extra baytril, but perhaps somebody can send you that.
nmognoni@nycap.rr.com

[andy49510]

I am going to post my email address, and if you could email me your name and address, I will send you some Fox Valley, and some 1 cc syringes.
I have no extra baytril, but perhaps somebody can send you that.
nmognoni@nycap.rr.com

Email sent.
:thankyou

[Pierre]

I hate to ask again and again, but does anyone have an idea how much esbilac mixed 1:4 I should give him and how often?

How come there's no button to edit my posts? :dono

I'm not entirely sure about Esbilac [I think it's a little more frequent than the fox valley], except you should probably feed him about every 2-3 hours. They need nutrition often & throughout the day. Since he's sick, he really needs to eat too. A 4:1 ratio as you know, doesn't have a lot of nutrition in it. Please make sure you are feeding regularly. And if he's tolerating it for a few feedings you can increase the amount of formula to water ratio.

I think you said he's about 5 weeks old. Are his eyes open? He wouldn't need night feedings if he's old enough. Do you have any idea how much he weighs? If you [or any friend] has a gram scale for weighing food or such, you could get his weight.

That would help determine how much to give, but the frequency would still be the same.

[Nancy in New York]

Email sent.
:thankyou

Sorry, I didn't get this yet...:dono Just resend please...:D

[andy49510]

Sorry, I didn't get this yet...:dono Just resend please...:D

Re-sent

[andy49510]

Nancy, did my email make it through?

[andy49510]

I think he's doing better. A couple things I've noticed is he's been coughing and sneezing alot and a few minutes ago I got him up to give him some pedialyte and he had a huge burst of energy that I've never seen before. He was climbing up the sides of his cage and running and crawling all over me where as before he had very little energy. I was giving him 2 cc's of esbillac mixed 1:4 every 2-3 hours and he was doing just fine but he didn't want any this time. I'll just wait a little longer and try.

Here's the picture of him that I tried to post earlier but I put the HTML code and not the IMG code.

http://i52.tinypic.com/15x0lzo.png

[Nancy in New York]

Nancy, did my email make it through?

NO....I have no idea why that isn't working....let me give it again, and then just click it on and it should come to me. I even checked my "junk" email...:dono
Oh your little one is too cute....:Love_Icon :Love_Icon Is that a little fox squirrel?

nmognoni@nycap.rr.com

[andy49510]

NO....I have no idea why that isn't working....let me give it again, and then just click it on and it should come to me. I even checked my "junk" email...:dono
Oh your little one is too cute....:Love_Icon :Love_Icon Is that a little fox squirrel?

nmognoni@nycap.rr.com


Yup!

Maybe it's just yahoo having problems.. I just re-sent it with hotmail though so it should go through.

[Nancy in New York]

Yup!

Maybe it's just yahoo having problems.. I just re-sent it with hotmail though so it should go through.


Perfect, a package will go out tomorrow morning...:thumbsup

[Nancy in New York]

I'm not entirely sure about Esbilac , except you should probably feed him about every 2-3 hours. They need nutrition often & throughout the day. Since he's sick, he really needs to eat too. A 4:1 ratio as you know, doesn't have a lot of nutrition in it. Please make sure you are feeding regularly. And if he's tolerating it for a few feedings you can increase the amount of formula to water ratio.

I think you said he's about 5 weeks old. Are his eyes open? He wouldn't need night feedings if he's old enough. Do you have any idea how much he weighs? If you [or any friend] has a gram scale for weighing food or such, you could get his weight.

That would help determine how much to give, but the frequency would still be the same.


[I]Just wanted to make sure that you saw this post about the formula ratio to the water. Perhaps time to increase the formula to water ratio. He needs nutriton....:) Do you have a weight on him yet?

[andy49510]

Just wanted to make sure that you saw this post about the formula ratio to the water. Perhaps time to increase the formula to water ratio. He needs nutriton....:) Do you have a weight on him yet?

I can't find anything around the house to get an accurate reading of his weight. any ideas?

[spykitten01]

Andy - please stop giving pedialyte - you never want to use rehydration fluid for more than 24hrs, as the excess sodium is bad for these lil guys.

[andy49510]

Andy - please stop giving pedialyte - you never want to use rehydration fluid for more than 24hrs, as the excess sodium is bad for these lil guys.

Alright. Just thought it would help keep him hydrated.

[Nancy in New York]

I can't find anything around the house to get an accurate reading of his weight. any ideas?

Would it be possible to get a photo of him with you holding him and showing his belly, I can give you an estimate on his weight then...His eyes are still closed right?

edit: I just saw your first post about his eyes being opened...

[spykitten01]

Alright. Just thought it would help keep him hydrated.


He should be hydrated just fine by now, especially on the diluted formula. If you really feel he needs more hydration, you can give a little plain water or a water/yogurt mixture between feedings. But no more pedialyte please :)

[andy49510]

Nevermind. I finally got him to sit still and just weighed him with a kitchen scale. he was 4 and 1/8 fl oz.

[Nancy in New York]

Nevermind. I finally got him to sit still and just weighed him with a kitchen scale. he was 4 and 1/8 fl oz.

OK so I am going to call that 120 grams. He should be eating 5-7% of his body weight at each feeding so that would be approximately 6 to 8.4 cc's of formula per feeding.

[Pierre]

Andy,
Your little guy is adorable! :)

Did you send a pix of his belly to Nancy?
If he's ~5 weeks, and if he is lean in the belly he's probably ~80 grams. If his belly is round, he's probably ~100 grams. He needs to eat more than 2 mls of formula per feeding. He should be somewhere around 5 mls, give or take some depending on how much he wants.

How long have you been feeding the diluted formula? You should most likely up the amt of formula you're feeding too, to a 3:1 ratio. Remember he's sick and needs nutrients.

Does he go pee and poo regularly?

How are you dosing the amox? How many doses has he had so far? Remember, it has to be dosed 2 times a day so don't forget tonight's dose. [I'm hoping you got the smaller syringes today to be able to measure accurately.]

I'm off to bed soon, but others will help you. Since he's sick, he'll probably do better with a heat source.

:grouphug

[Pierre]

OK so I am going to call that 120 grams. He should be eating 5-7% of his body weight at each feeding so that would be approximately 6 to 8.4 cc's of formula per feeding.

:thankyou

[andy49510]

OK so I am going to call that 120 grams. He should be eating 5-7% of his body weight at each feeding so that would be approximately 6 to 8.4 cc's of formula per feeding.

And with that amount would it be okay to feed every 2 hours?

[andy49510]

Andy,
Your little guy is adorable! :)

Did you send a pix of his belly to Nancy?
If he's ~5 weeks, and if he is lean in the belly he's probably ~80 grams. If his belly is round, he's probably ~100 grams. He needs to eat more than 2 mls of formula per feeding. He should be somewhere around 5 mls, give or take some depending on how much he wants.

How long have you been feeding the diluted formula? You should most likely up the amt of formula you're feeding too, to a 3:1 ratio. Remember he's sick and needs nutrients.

Does he go pee and poo regularly?

How are you dosing the amox? How many doses has he had so far? Remember, it has to be dosed 2 times a day so don't forget tonight's dose. [I'm hoping you got the smaller syringes today to be able to measure accurately.]

I'm off to bed soon, but others will help you. Since he's sick, he'll probably do better with a heat source.

:grouphug

I've been feeding the formula since this morning and I'm not really sure what I should do with the AMOX because I've been getting different answers from everyone on it. last time I gave it to him was about this time yesterday. He's been going to the bathroom (both) just fine. and he's still on his heating pad.

[Pierre]

Try every about three hours.

How long on the 4:1 ratio? You've had him a week now?? I'm sure you need to up this.

[Pierre]

What has he been eating the past week if you just started Esbilac formula this morning?

What are your questions about amox? You cannot stop the antibiotics if he's been struggling to breathe [gasping, or gaping, with mucus coming out of his nose etc]. He'll not make it.

Did you get a small syringe?

[andy49510]

Try every about three hours.

How long on the 4:1 ratio? You've had him a week now?? I'm sure you need to up this.

1:4 since this morning. Before he was sick I was feeding him 1:2. and I've had him for 10 days now

[Pierre]

1:4 since this morning. Before he was sick I was feeding him 1:2. and I've had him for 10 days now

Was there some reason you went to 4:1 [since I assume he was fine with the full strength]?

[andy49510]

The syringe I'm using now is a 4cc and I measured it out and made marking for each cc because it didn't have the lines for measuring. it's the smallest I could get ahold of

[Pierre]

500 mg.... cut the pill in half crush 1 half of it

add it to 5 ccs of water. Making it a raio of 50mg/ML

If its not crushable and is a capsule full of powder

add it to 10 ccs of water its the same ratio.

For 100 gram baby they need 0.04 ccs.

But seriously thats a guess at his weight!

Here's the dose again for the amox. Did you mix it like this? 0.04 ccs is about 4 drops [if you didn't get a small enough syringe].

He has to have the antibiotic. Tonight and then 2x day.

Amox will get the typical bacteria in pneumonia but it can give diarrhea, so tomorrow you need to get the probiotics that CritterMom told you about, and/or until then, the full fat yogurt.

[andy49510]

Here's the dose again for the amox. Did you mix it like this? 0.04 ccs is about 4 drops [if you didn't get a small enough syringe].

He has to have the antibiotic. Tonight and then 2x day.

Amox will get the typical bacteria in pneumonia but it can give diarrhea, so tomorrow you need to get the probiotics that CritterMom told you about, and/or until then, the full fat yogurt.

Okay. Can I continue to mix the full fat yogurt with his formula?

[Pierre]

1:4 since this morning. Before he was sick I was feeding him 1:2. and I've had him for 10 days now

Up the strength but feed him very very slowly. Drop by drop and you must go back to the pharmacies and ask for 1ml [or 3 if nothing else] syringes - tell them without any needles. Tell them you are feeding an orphaned kitten, guinea pig or the like and only need the plastic syringe.

So tonight, up the formula strength and feed him very slowly and get the amox dose in.

[Pierre]

Okay. Can I continue to mix the full fat yogurt with his formula?

Yes please! Skul had a great post for you on page 2 or so with the best way to mix Esbilac. You can dilute that a bit to make it easier for him to drink if necessary. And aim for about 6 ccs. He needs the energy, but go slowly, really slowly.

:grouphug

[andy49510]

I found a dropper that measures 0.3 ml and 0.6 ml so I could just fill it at about a fourth of the way up between the two measurements an that would be almost perfect, right?

[andy49510]

I found a dropper that measures 0.3 ml and 0.6 ml so I could just fill it at about a fourth of the way up between the two measurements an that would be almost perfect, right?

I meant one fourth of the way past 0.3ml. I think you'll understand, but just to make sure.

[spykitten01]

I meant one fourth of the way past 0.3ml. I think you'll understand, but just to make sure.


Nooooo!!! The amount of amox he needs is 0.04cc/mls - that is a TENTH of that amount - very very small amount - my girls were on .03ccs of metro every day and it was barely anything. Amox also needs to be administered once every twelve hours (so twice a day) to be effective at all - otherwise it is useless. You need to give the doses to him as close to 12hrs apart as possible - if you have the doses too close together, or too far apart, they will not be nearly as effective and will not help clear a bad infection, which your baby has.

[Pierre]

No, you need 0.04 ml not 0.4 mls. Since you do not have a syringe near small enough go by drops. He'll need about 4 drops.

Remember to shake the crushed amox and water mixture you made up [as per Nature's Gift] and pull a little up in the syringe. Feed him 4 little drops of this. Make sure he gets it, but go slowly!! No choking.

[andy49510]

okay I'll just go by 4 small drops. 4 in the morning and 4 at night or do I split that in half and do 2 drops in the morning and 2 at night since I thought the dosage in naturesgift's post was referring to once a day.

[spykitten01]

okay I'll just go by 4 small drops. 4 in the morning and 4 at night or do I split that in half and do 2 drops in the morning and 2 at night since I thought the dosage in naturesgift's post was referring to once a day.


She calculated one dose, so that should be 0.04 (4 SMALL drops) 2x daily. Again - Try and get the doses as close to 12hrs apart as you possibly can. Try and time them for periods where you will be home for both dosages. If you get up at 7am, dose at 7am and 7pm - if you get up at 10am, same thing - doses at 10 and 10. Not sure if you have work/school or not - but time the doses so they work with your schedule and PLEASE - come hell or high water - do NOT miss a dose. This baby is still in grave danger, even though he seems to be improving - he still has a long way to go.

[spykitten01]

I'll double check the dosage tomorrow at work - I just started working for the vet that saw and treated my girls in August. She specialized in small mammals and exotics.

[Pierre]

I'm off to bed. Andy, please please get the antibiotics in him, and a good feeding tonight.

More people will be on to help. :grouphug

[spykitten01]

She calculated one dose, so that should be 0.04 (4 SMALL drops) 2x daily. Again - Try and get the doses as close to 12hrs apart as you possibly can. Try and time them for periods where you will be home for both dosages. If you get up at 7am, dose at 7am and 7pm - if you get up at 10am, same thing - doses at 10 and 10. Not sure if you have work/school or not - but time the doses so they work with your schedule and PLEASE - come hell or high water - do NOT miss a dose. This baby is still in grave danger, even though he seems to be improving - he still has a long way to go.


I just did my own calculations, and I believe it should be .018, or 0.02ccs per dose - Again, I will double check tomorrow - but if youre going to be dosing twice a day now as you should, I would do 2 drops tonight and tomorrow until I can double check with the vet. I work until midnight tomorrow, but Ill PM you my cell and you can text me tomorrow so I can text back as soon as I talk to the vet.

[spykitten01]

I guess I cant PM you :shakehead

[andy49510]

I guess I cant PM you :shakehead


I don't know why it won't let me PM or edit posts :thinking

I verified my account via email the day I created it.

[Nancy in New York]

I am getting the package out within the next hour, Fox Valley and small syringes and nipples.
Try calling a vets office and see if they have names of any rehabbers in your area that does squirrels. I fear this little one is going to need more help than we can offer if he doesn't get the right antibiotic....and please keep us posted.
Is there any member that has baytril that can overnight to Andy? I sent out the last of mine, and need to get more next week....:dono

[island rehabber]

andy I checked your account -- you SHOULD be able to receive PMs now...:dono

[Pierre]

Hi Andy,

How's the little guy doing this morning? I hope he's ok! :grouphug

Please let us know. :Love_Icon

[Gina]

:Welcome praying for your lil guy. Thank you so much for saving him and for doing everything you can to make sure he lives.:Love_Icon

[andy49510]

Nancy, thanks so much!

Sorry I haven't been on, I've had a very busy day.

He's doing great! he's breathing just fine and he's been more active and playful than I have ever seen him before. I take him out his cage to feed him and he just want to run and crawl all over me still. It would probably be a good idea to keep him on the amox for a couple more days though right?

[andy49510]

:Welcome praying for your lil guy. Thank you so much for saving him and for doing everything you can to make sure he lives.:Love_Icon
:thumbsup

[island rehabber]

wonderful news, Andy. he should stay on the amox for at least 7 days, possibly 10.

[andy49510]

wonderful news, Andy. he should stay on the amox for at least 7 days, possibly 10.


With the same dosage?

[Nancy in New York]

With the same dosage?

Yes the same dosage, which I believe is .04 cc's (which is about 4 drops) 2 times a day, at 12 hour intervals. I also sent a .5 cc syringe so you can easily measure that amount...:thumbsup
I am just so thrilled that he is acting better....keep up the great work!!!:grouphug :grouphug

[Scooterzmom]

Andy, it's important with antibiotics to follow the treatment regularly and ALL THE WAY thru... Doctors will explain to you that, yes, the bacteria may appear to be gone, for his lack of symptoms, but if you stop the antibiotics before the end of the suggested treatment, the bacteria may and will return and this time be more resistant to any further treatment. You wouldn't want that to happen.

Just make sure you provide something for his intestinal flora during the course of the treatment :)

I"m sooooo happy to hear he's starting to feel and look better. :jump

[Pierre]

Nancy, thanks so much!

Sorry I haven't been on, I've had a very busy day.

He's doing great! he's breathing just fine and he's been more active and playful than I have ever seen him before. I take him out his cage to feed him and he just want to run and crawl all over me still. It would probably be a good idea to keep him on the amox for a couple more days though right?

Wonderful wonderful news, Andy!! Keep up the good work! :thumbsup
You're doing a great job.
:grouphug :Love_Icon :grouphug

[Crabbyolebroad]

andy,

Please e-mail me at crabbyolebroad@yahoo.com or kclaeys@cox.net. I too, live in Wichita, on the west side, have a squirrel i am raising and this vet will see them. She is VERY good. I just came back on the board today and saw your post. Skittles had a respiratory issue too and they saved him. She is also going to neuter him for me. I also know of another vet, who is also on the west side that will see squirrels.