Asperating questions?

[Secret Squirrel]

I need some advise from the pros. :bowdown
I seem to flood the little guys at first until I get a feel for them. Each one is different. What works for one won't work for all!!!!
I keep having the formula come out of their nose, not alot but even a drop is too much in my book.:nurse Two out of five squirrels seem to be having trouble getting the suckle part right. ( or it could be me not getting the flow part right ) I feel it's me just trying too hard.
I have a ear syringe bulb that I tried to use tonight, but I don't think it helped very much. I hold the baby nose down and use a gentel downward motion which helps the fluid come out of the nose.
I have used the same technieque for puppies at birth to get the fluid from the nose and mouth and allows the puppy to breath.
Advise is needed so I can keep these babies get a good start on the world.:robot

[muffinsquirrel]

I use the 'slinging' technique on mine, when necessary. Also, keep a kleenex at hand to blot their noses with. You might try putting just a drop of formula on the cleft of their mouth, and letting them suck or lick it in, or try to get them to lap from a spoon.

Now this I have not tried, but intend to this year if necessary. Maybe some of the other rehabbers have tried it, and will post the pros and cons of it. I am going to take a piece of cloth, and twist it into a 'nipple' shape, dip it in formula and see if the baby will accept that. It would be easy to regulate the amount of formula he was getting at one time so that he wouldn't gulp it down so. You could keep putting formula on the piece of cloth without taking it out of the baby's mouth by using a syringe and dropping it on right where the cloth enters his mouth. You would just have to be careful to use a tightly woven cloth, and make sure there were no edges in the baby;s mouth, so that he couldn't get any strings. Hopefully, the baby would soon adjust to a more regular type feeding with a syringe and nipple. (Like I said, I have not tried this - but only because I did not think of it last year when I needed it - so I really don't know if it will work or not.) You might also try feeding him first, then the others, then feed him again after the rest were through, if you are worried that he might not be getting enough to eat.

Good luck with them,

muffinsquirrel

[island rehabber]

Rebecca, I would really encourage you to order 1cc syringes from Chris's Squirrels&more and ONLY feed your squirrel babies using them. You might also want to attach the catac nipples to the syringes especially if you're not too good at controlling the force with which you push the formula thru the syringe (everybody's different in their ability to do this :) You cannot control the flow properly using an ear or eye dropper. Rebecca it is NOT GOOD for any formula to ever come out of a baby's nose, and to watch a baby squirrel suffer from aspirational pneumonia is one of the most horrible experiences I have ever had in my life. They gasp and "click" for days, trying to get air, and most often they die. Please, PLEASE don't let this happen to one of your squirrel babies...it's so easy to get the small syringes and nipples online.

[Secret Squirrel]

Thanks Islander, :nurse

I should have explained what I use for feeding first. Eveything you suggested I am already using. I bought all my syringes from Chris's online store along with 2 types of nipples. Silcone and Catac, I prefer using the catac because it's so soft and the babys seem to like it better. The only problem I have with the catac is the fact they are holeless. At times the hole is too small and gets clogged easy, or it's too big and flow too fast.
I am using a 3cc but will switch to the 1cc and see if that helps slow down the feeding process.
Today will be 24 hours in my care and they are getting stronger and ajusting to feeding time....it's getting better they were so starved that it was a feeding frenzie! Thanks again.
Becca

[nutz4squirls]

Hi Rebecca, Did I send you the mini nipple? If so, use that on a 1cc syringe until they slow down on the aspirating. If I didn't send the mini than let me know and I'll get one right out to you. Also, maybe try using the silicone nipple for now if you don't have the mini nipple. The silicone has a really tiny hole in it and alot less chance of aspirating with that and use that on a 1cc. YOu need to also make sure your holding the plunger on the syringe in case they are sucking to hard. Chris

[island rehabber]

Sounds good, Rebecca! And sorry if I was a little emotional about this issue but I lost my first rehab baby --- a pinky who lived one month and never really thrived -- to aspirational pneumonia. I still feel awful about it, because first of all I blame myself and second of all she tried SO hard to live. Good luck with your little cuties :)

[Momma Squirrel]

Secret Squirrel, didn't know you had babies? when did you get them? How many and what kind?

[CliffordandDaisy'sDad]

I am using a 3cc but will switch to the 1cc and see if that helps slow down the feeding process.


Becca, that's the biggest problem. The 3cc's are so much 'fatter', every little squirt is a whole lot more than the 1cc's.
One thing I have finally figured out, I can't hold a syringe the way I thought I could. In order to have control over it, I have to hold it with the butt of the plunger against the heel of my hand, right at the base of my thumb. Then take three fingers, almost like holding a pen or pencil, and use all three fingers to control it.
I use disposable syringes and they tend to stick a little - so you push a little harder and squirt - too much. Holding it that way I have control.
Also I never squirt more after I see a little coming out the corner of their mouths. Stop, let them swallow that. Then a little more. Let them take the lead. Remember Momma is not pressurized.

[missalpo]

You can also take a knife and cut your syringes if you fingers are 2 short. Want hold as much milk but worth a shot. You don't have 2 cut the flusher just the outside section.

[tiffany&pepper]

Hi
somewhere on this sight some one had a question on asperation and I didn't have time to talk
any way when my babies act like little piglets I cut a hole in the -top side- of the nipple and marked it with permanent marker so I knew where the hole was and fed the baby with the hole facing down (towards thier belly)
this way the formula goes down not up.
I hope this helps
let me know
Sandi

[becky3b]

Mine is not asperating, but I have read everywhere now that I should be feeding my kit (Flash) puppy suppplement, but I called my vet and he said to feed him Kitty supplement. Am I harming my baby? Should I change him to different I have had im 10 days, his eyes and ears are still not open his sister was in real bad shape and didn't make it. They had been cut out of the top of the tree and she was bleeding from the mouth and nose. Please someone tell me what I need to do he seems to be doing great fur and he is growing very well.:nurse

[NatureGirl]

What kind of a squirrel is Flash, Becky?

[thundersquirrel]

everyone seems to have covered a lot, so i'll just add some pointers....

make sure the baby isn't already full. when their stomachs are empty, they'll eat like no tomorrow, but as their stomachs fill they slow down. make sure you slow down with them, and stop when their bellies feel like slightly deflated balloons.

i always aim to get a rythm going. usually babies don't actually stick to a beat, but if you watch their hands, they try to push on the syringe when they want more. that's what they do to their mothers' nipples; kind of a self-serve technique. so watch those little paws; they push, you give.

make sure they nipple is far enough into their mouths. don't be afraid of going too far in; i mean, don't shove it down there, but if it's not far enough in, it'll hit the hole that goes to their nostrils, and they'll aspirate. try pushing it a little further back next time.

hope it helps.
stay nutty :multi
thundersquirrel

[becky3b]

Flash is a little grey squirrel I believe. He is white on belly, grey and mix on back. I think he is about 4 1/2 weeks old. He had little hair when I found him 11 days ago.

[island rehabber]

hi Becky -- your vet is wrong about kitten formula. Puppy formula, specifically Esbilac or KMR, is the way to go with squirrels and has been proven over the years for thousands of orphaned squirrel babies. Remember that most vets are domestic animal vets only -- they do not receive much, if any, training in wildlife veterinary medicine. They WILL, unfortunately, give you wrong info about wildlife even though they mean well. (Anything for cats, I'm told, is way too high in protein for squirrels.)
If Flash (love the name!) is 4 weeks old, he should have his eyes open or will open them soon...his upper teeth will be breaking through also. He should get around 5 feedings per day of puppy formula, around 4 hours apart. Is he fur-covered now, even on his belly? If not, he's probably younger than 4 weeks and may need more frequent feedings. Hope this helps -- good luck with Flash. And please, no kitten formula!

[becky3b]

My vet has raised squirrels she says. She also has a wildlife tag on her office door, if this means anything. he is fully covered with hair except right at the bottom of his stomach. He seems to be doing fine his lowers are in a the top ones are trying to come in. when he eats I can see his eyes trying to blink. What is gonna happen when I change formula? He is growing really well.

[rehabber]

KMR is a kitten milk, it means Kitten Milk Replacer..most rehabbers use powdered Esbilac, but there is also Multi-Milk and Fox Valley makes a formula also. I have only used Esbliac so can't say anything about the others. If I have one that a little milk comes out of the nose I put their nose to my mouth and act like I am kissing. Pucker and suck slightly. That gets all the milk out of the nose tract.

[FosterMom]

I have found that 1 cc syringes work best.You may be able to go to your local veterinarian and get some from them if you tell them what you are going to use them for. Good luck with your babies!

[Henry]

Hi! I was told to feed my baby squirrel goats milk. Will that hurt him? I have had him for one week. His eyes are still closed, has hair, and crawls around. He is so cute! I had a squirrel before, years ago, and fed him goats milk and he grew up fine. Should I switch to puppy milk? I hate to change his diet when he is doing so well.

Henry's Mom
:thankyou

[island rehabber]

Rehabber, thanks for correcting me. I only use Esbilac but for some reason thought KMR also made a puppy formula but they don't. As you stated, Multi Milk and Fox Valley are the alternative puppy formulas. A senior moment, I guess! :thankyou

[rygel1hardt]

Pet Ag makes both Esbilac puppy formula and KMR kitten formula. I use Fox Valley and have for at least four years and have had no problems with it. The formula I get from Fox Valley is made specifically for squirrels and possums and the formula come in two stages. One formula for newborn squirrels up to three weeks and another for squirrels three weeks to weaning. My experience has been that is has a much higher exceptance rate having tried both it and esbilac on most of my babies. I have no experience with Multi milk.




Rehabber, thanks for correcting me. I only use Esbilac but for some reason thought KMR also made a puppy formula but they don't. As you stated, Multi Milk and Fox Valley are the alternative puppy formulas. A senior moment, I guess! :thankyou [/COLOR][/FONT][/QUOTE]

[island rehabber]

Have you had any problems with Fox Valley with regard to orders being shipped on time? I am on a few other boards and have heard that, at least in the past few months, people have had trouble getting their supplies. I also have read very good things about Fox Valley.

[BuckeyeSqrl]

Esbilac for dogs is best for squirrels until their bellies get fur. After than, you add 1 part multi-milk to 3 parts Esbilac until they're ready to wean.

I have had very good luck with the four paws nipples that Chris has (I just bought 100 from her). They fit on a 3cc syringe. Using the underhand technique with this nipple, it is fairly easy to establish a pattern and control the amount of formula going to the baby.

[rehabber]

I have heard that Fox Valley has a lot of sugar in it, is this correct. I have looked on the Esbilac label and don't see anything sweet listed.

[rygel1hardt]

I havent had any problems with Nick getting my order out to me and I have been using Fox Valley for about four years. I do order way ahead so I dont have to worry about running out. Im feeding a baby flyer on it now and she was refusing the esbilac(she was on esbilac when I got her so I was going to keep her on it) As soon as I offered her the fox valley formula she started eating like a little piggy and gaining some much needed weight. This has just been my experience with Fox valley and every squirrel is different so I keep two other kinds of formula on hand just in case I ever do have any problem. As to the sugar levels being higher in Fox Valley formula that is entirely possible and might account for the higher acceptance rate with my squirrels.




Have you had any problems with Fox Valley with regard to orders being shipped on time? I am on a few other boards and have heard that, at least in the past few months, people have had trouble getting their supplies. I also have read very good things about Fox Valley.

[BuckeyeSqrl]

Off topic. Here's a picture of the four sisters that I have. Their nest was destroyed and two of them fell two stories on the concrete and have fractured skulls. They are doing much better now and gaining weight. One opened her eyes today.

[CliffordandDaisy'sDad]

You just posted that to see if you could get a grown man to go.....

AWWWWWWWwwwwwww

didn't you? :thankyou

[BuckeyeSqrl]

No, I just wanted everyone to see my sweet babies. I love them so much and wanted to share the good vibes. We've had alot of sad things lately and I wanted to post a happy picture.

[CliffordandDaisy'sDad]

Well I'm still gushing over it, so I guess that qualifies as happy!

They are so cute! and that's certainly a happy picture. The one that opened her eyes looks like she's sucking her thumb.

[BuckeyeSqrl]

Yes, she does. She is amazing. She had to be tubed on Saturday because she refused to eat and was still bleeding from her nose. After the tubing, she did a complete 180 and is eating like there is no tomorrow. It is great to see that kind of turnaround. I have high hopes for a successful release this summer.

These animals are amazing and I treasure each and every one. How long have you been doing this?

[CliffordandDaisy'sDad]

Only this one time. I had to take a crash course when Clifford and Daisy's Mom was killed. We have very few squirrels where we live but a lot of great rehabbers and other animal people that I had on call 24/7. As far as raising baby animals, I grew up on a dairy farm so it was nothing totally new.

[BuckeyeSqrl]

Keep fighting the good fight for our misunderstood friends. Peace.

[Momma Squirrel]

Buckey Sqrl, that is a sad but great story. I am so thankful there are good people like yourelf to help all this little creatures. Even if things turn out bad in some stories their lives are much kinder in the end because of people like you and all the rest on the board that give their time, patience and love so freely. :thankyou Good luck with the little ones and please keep us posted. We are all pulling for them.

[Henry]

While you are sharing photos, I thought I would show my baby. He opened his eyes this past week, and loves running around. He crawled up my daughters pant leg the other day. I don't know how I will ever let him go!!

[Momma Squirrel]

Henry what a precious picture. It is very hard but there is alot of satisfaction to seeing them in the wild and learning about nature and knowing that you were part of it. If they are healthy that is the best place for them and believe me they will still hang around and BEG for food!! Keep us posted on his progress and his release.