HELP! I do not know what is wrong with my squirrel

[MoniqueClayton]

Hi my name is Monique, I have a squirrel that is around 2 months old and she is starting to act weird. She has been waking up in the middle of the night screaming until I calm her down and let her sleep with me. I just got home and picked her up and she starting making a weird noise and her whole body started shaking like she was having a seizure or a heart attack. She calmed down and then she did it again 10 minutes later but this time she was completely limp! I thought she was dead!! PLEASE HELP! I do not know what is wrong with her and I am very scared that something is wrong! :'(

[PBluejay2]

Please provide as much of the following information as you can. It will help us determine what might be the problem.

1. Complete list of symptoms, including when they began and how they progressed.
2. Age of squirrel and how long you have had it.
3. The squirrel’s diet (what you have been feeding it)
4. If the squirrel was in your care from infancy, what formula was it fed and what did you use to feed it?
5. What has it eaten or sampled in the last 24-48 hours (be as detailed as possible!)
6. Changes in environment: Again, be as detailed as possible. List any new toys, whether you’ve changed cages or laundry soap, sprayed insecticides or air fresheners, ANYTHING. Please try not to overlook any detail.

[MoniqueClayton]

1. Complete list of symptoms, including when they began and how they progressed.
2. Age of squirrel and how long you have had it.
3. The squirrel’s diet (what you have been feeding it)
4. If the squirrel was in your care from infancy, what formula was it fed and what did you use to feed it?
5. What has it eaten or sampled in the last 24-48 hours (be as detailed as possible!)
6. Changes in environment: Again, be as detailed as possible. List any new toys, whether you’ve changed cages or laundry soap, sprayed insecticides or air fresheners, ANYTHING. Please try not to overlook any detail.

She has been having nightmares or something like that where she screams which has happened 5 times in the last few weeks.

About 20 minutes ago i took her out of her cage when i got home and put her on my bed and her legs started shaking and she was making a grunt sound with her mouth open. I picked her up and she started shaking all over and then she stopped shaking and was completely limp like she was dead.

She is about 2 months old and I did not have her when she was new baby so I did not bottle feed her.

I have been feeding her gerbil food with sunflower seeds and other stuff.

I have had her since December and she was staying at my boyfriends house the first few weeks we had her and no she is at my house.

Yesterday I gave her a shelled walnut yesterday that she ate.

I read one of the posts that said if they have seizures they might MBD im not sure what that is but it said to get them tums crushed with water.. Should I do that?

[4skwerlz]

Do you have any calcium pills in the house, or Tums?

YES, crush it with water and give it her with a spoon or whatever.

DO IT NOW!

[MoniqueClayton]

I cant find any tums in my house can i give her rolaids? or should i run to the store and get tums?

[4skwerlz]

I cant find any tums in my house can i give her rolaids? or should i run to the store and get tums?

YES, use the Rolaids.

[MoniqueClayton]

my grandma has calcium chew 500 mg sugar free chocolate. can she have that? or should i just get tums?

[4skwerlz]

my grandma has calcium chew 500 mg sugar free chocolate. can she have that? or should i just get tums?

Use the rolaids.

DO IT NOW, okay?


If this is MBD, your squirrel could be minutes from death. DO IT NOW. Then come back!

[jdsmama07]

No chocolate chews! Just the rolaids for now and then go out and get 500 mg calcium pills (just calcium, nothing added). How is she doing now?

[4skwerlz]

No chocolate chews! Just the rolaids for now and then go out and get 500 mg calcium pills (just calcium, nothing added). How is she doing now?


Only go to the store for calcium if you can send someone else. You stay with the squirrel.

Rolaids has 550 mg calcium carbonate per pill.

Get one pill into her now.

No more delays; do it now. Then come back and post, okay?

[MoniqueClayton]

ok i will do it now

[MoniqueClayton]

i crushed the rolaid into a bowl with water and she is drinking it.. does she have to drink all of it?

[MoniqueClayton]

she only wants a little bit of it and i dont know how to make her drink more

[4skwerlz]

she only wants a little bit of it and i dont know how to make her drink more

Drop by drop.

If you can place the liquid on her tongue or inside her lips, she will have to swallow it.

Just keep going.

[CritterMom]

Grind up the rolaid and add just enough water to it to make sort of a thin paste so she doesn't have to drink so much fluid. Get it all into her mouth - she will absorb it through the inside of her mouth and tongue as well as swallowing it.

[Mountain Mama]

Do you have any Karo syrup? Put a few drops of that on her tongue as well. She is young and could be having seizures from hypoglycemia.

[CritterMom]

You can use an eyedropper, a syringe like you used to formula feed her, if you don't have those you can use your little finger to dip it up and push it into her mouth. Just please get it in there - time is of the essence.

[jdsmama07]

Don't make it too watery. It'll be hard to get it into her. If you don't have any of the syringe or eyedroppers at the moment get a q-tip (paper kind only), cut the cotton tip off and use the paper end to slowly get it into her mouth. Don't over force, you don't want to poke her in the mouth. This shouldn't be too hard to do if you made the calcium paste-like. Try to make it taste sweet, so that she will take it.
Has she seized anymore?

[MoniqueClayton]

She drank some of the tum and now doesnt want anymore. she is a bit stronger now and too squirmy to let me put something in her mouth

[4skwerlz]

Someone is sending you a phone number that you can call for more help. You will get a private message. Feel free to call the number; she is a rehabber.

Do not leave. Your squirrel needs a lot more help to get well.

[jdsmama07]

Try again in a bit, but make sure she gets all of it today. Also follow the emergency MBD treatment until you can get her to a vet. Many of the people on here are from FL, so I think they might be able to refer you. The great people on here will also tell you how to correct her diet, which is essential. Please keep us updated on her condition. Can you take a picture of her and post it as well?

[MiriamS]

Hi Monique, thanks for posting and asking for help. Do exactly what these experts tell you. They know what they're talking about. Good luck!

[CritterMom]

Monique, it is very important to get that entire rolaid into your squirrel. If she becomes impatient, give her a 5 minute rest, then continue. You can add a bit of sugar or pancake syrup to it to boost her blood sugar and make it taste better, but please get it all in.

[virgo062]

How's the baby? We are praying for you and the little one

[Jackie in Tampa]

Monique is on her way with the sq, going to leave her here for at least a few days hoping I can get her seizures under control.
Thanks team! I will keep you posted.

[SquirrelNut]

wonderful news, jackie!

[Nancy in New York]

Monique is on her way with the sq, going to leave her here for at least a few days hoping I can get her seizures under control.
Thanks team! I will keep you posted.
:bowdown :bowdown Yet again...our Jackie comes through!!!!!!!!

[4skwerlz]

Monique, your squirrel is in the best hands possible. Jackie is an expert at this and will nurse your squirrel with love and care. :thumbsup

We'll all be watching this thread for updates from Jackie.

[SquirrelNut]

jackie is a SAINT to the squirrels! i wish i had a jackie near me in california!

[jdsmama07]

That is absolutely wonderful! So glad you all live near each other. :Love_Icon

[island rehabber]

I missed this whole thing until now -- FANTASTIC work all of you!!! Jackie -- so glad she is with you at Sq Central, and Monique, bless you for getting her the help she needs!! :grouphug :thumbsup:grouphug

[Chickenlegs]

Every time I check in there's another act of love that is absolutely awe inspiring. Thank you Jackie. thank you EVERYBODY who gives so much to these little wonders.

[4skwerlz]

Monique and Izzy spent a long time at Squirrel Central today. Jackie says Izzy is around 12 weeks old, very cute and sweet, and otherwise in good shape. She does definitely have MBD. Monique is very comitted and caring, but simply got the wrong advice about diet for Izzy. She got great instructions from Jackie on how to care for Izzy's MBD. She will be getting Izzy back on formula, and will also be following the Healthy Diet (no more gerbil food).

Monique will come here if she has questions....and of course Jackie's only 30 minutes or a quick phone call away.

Excellent job, Monique, for realizing there was a problem and finding help. You did great today, and it was a smart idea about the Rolaids--we need to add that as an option for emergency MBD treatment, in addition to the Tums. :thankyou

[Nancy in New York]

Wonderful update...thank you! :grouphug

[jdsmama07]

That's great! Her little one is lucky to have a tentative mama, and of course the fact that Jackie's there. Good lucky with your little baby, I think she will be fine now.

[Lulu-Bean's Mommy]

WONDERFUL NEWS!!!!
Monique, if you haven't already, the nutrition forum is great for reference. I even printed out some of the diet info and it is taped to the wall next to my fridge. I refer to it DAILY.
Your baby is in great care, isn't it cute when she wants to sleep next to you, even under the circumstances? That was Lulu for a long time, it made for many sleepless nights, but now she likes her own "room"...too cool for mama, I guess.

Jackie: could you be any more of a saint?

[MoniqueClayton]

Hi guys! As you all know I went to Jackies house yesterday. She is Honestly a SAINT!!! She gave me everything I needed to get Izzy back to health. She gave me priceless tools and advice and Izzy is now on Jackies wonderful squirrel diet. Izzy has not had another seizure since and is acting more like her self. On another note.. she absolutely hates being hand fed, she screams the whole time and wiggles SO much and its very hard for me to keep her still and calm like Jackie did, any suggestions? She seems to have hiccups is that normal?

You guys are the best! My squirrel would not have made it without the squirrel board and all of its wonderful squirrel lovers!

Thanks again,
Monique

[4skwerlz]

Hi guys! As you all know I went to Jackies house yesterday. She is Honestly a SAINT!!! She gave me everything I needed to get Izzy back to health. She gave me priceless tools and advice and Izzy is now on Jackies wonderful squirrel diet. Izzy has not had another seizure since and is acting more like her self. On another note.. she absolutely hates being hand fed, she screams the whole time and wiggles SO much and its very hard for me to keep her still and calm like Jackie did, any suggestions? She seems to have hiccups is that normal?

You guys are the best! My squirrel would not have made it without the squirrel board and all of its wonderful squirrel lovers!

Thanks again,
Monique

Sweetie, NONE of us are as good at handling squirrels as Jackie, so don't feel bad. Jackie is a "squirrel whisperer"! You'll get the hang of it. It just takes a little time and experience....and courage!

We're all so very glad your baby is doing better.:grouphug

[Lulu-Bean's Mommy]

It's not in a squirrel's nature to be handled when fed, so don't feel bad.
Jackie's got the magic touch!

That being said, have you tried wrapping her up like a squirrel burrito? I take a towel and make a squirrel burrito out of Lulu when I need to trim her nails, like when she was a baby and needed to be hand-fed. Allow for Izzy to keep her front paws out so she can hold whatever it is you're feeding her with, but only enough so you still have control.
I hope that makes sense...

4S,:goodpost
I enjoy reading your posts. If they don't make me giggle, they always give me something to think about and to try.

[Ultra Peepi]

monique i am so glad izzy got the help needed in time. jackie and everyone here is just so wonderful and quick to help... nice job on the save!:thumbsup

[jdsmama07]

Hey hun, I don't know if anyone else suggested this yet, but I used to wrap my little girl loosely with a towel, just so her head would stick out. That way you have more control over her, and it keeps her from hurting herself. Just be patient and gentle, it's a big change for her.

[SquirrelNut]

Monique, this board is absolutely wonderful! The people here are fabulous! I am so glad everything worked out for you & Izzy! Without this board, my Nos would have perished. He also was suffering from MBD. He was more interested in his Cherrios & grapes vs. Monkey Biscuits & greens! He was a junk food squirrel! He basically had the same reaction as Izzy. I now have him on Henry's Healthy Blocks. He still has some grapes but is overall eating healthier. I wish he would eat more greens but that is a work in progress! One thing is for sure though, without this board he would NOT be alive! Keep in contact with them and good luck to you! Dana & Nos

[Jackie in Tampa]

:Love_Icon Izzy was adorable and so are you Monique...but we need pics of that precious little one!
...and remember, if you change your mind...I have Eve and she needs a sister to be released with:D ...just a thought!:peace
Were you able to share TSB with your friends that have the other baby sqs? hope so...and did you order the Fox Valley, that will definately get all these babiies back on track!
Anything you need, you have my number!
Keep up the great job with her!:bowdown
:Love_Icon she's precious and special!
give her kisses from her Auntie J:wave123
xoxoxox

[Jackie in Tampa]

izzy has been taking some fv and getting 100mg of calcium via tums water and had a HHB last night,she sleeps alot, but did play with monique yesterday...she woke this morning and drank lots of water and then vomited...:shakehead
any ideas peeps?
she was offered pecan half, which she nibbled and then hid, so not a vigorous appetite either today....
she really hasn't touched her veggies sprinkled with calcium, but they are pretty new to her and switching to a healthy diet takes time and patience, so this doesn't really surprise me...
but to over indulge in water and then throw it all up...?????

monique keep us posted as to her doings, thanks

:wave123 hello sweet izzy!:Love_Icon

[4skwerlz]

izzy has been taking some fv and getting 100mg of calcium via tums water and had a HHB last night,she sleeps alot, but did play with monique yesterday...she woke this morning and drank lots of water and then vomited...:shakehead
any ideas peeps?
she was offered pecan half, which she nibbled and then hid, so not a vigorous appetite either today....
she really hasn't touched her veggies sprinkled with calcium, but they are pretty new to her and switching to a healthy diet takes time and patience, so this doesn't really surprise me...
but to over indulge in water and then throw it all up...?????

monique keep us posted as to her doings, thanks

:wave123 hello sweet izzy!:Love_Icon

What did she eat, exactly, before she threw up?

[PBluejay2]

She seems to have hiccups is that normal?



Could this be significant/related?

[Jackie in Tampa]

What did she eat, exactly, before she threw up?
water only today, this am...

PBJ, when she was at my house, she did not have hiccups...:dono

[PBluejay2]

I ran this by a colleague who is much smarter than I, and this is the reply I received:


"I am wondering if this squirrel has had breathing problems (hiccups) often in the past. The fact that she cannot hold down much of anything makes me wonder if she has a diaphragmatic hernia. If the hernia is on the right side it affects organs but at a slower rate. If it is on the left side it can affect breathing. It can also cause the body to only consume small amounts. of anything.

Who knows, maybe this is why she was abandoned. Mothers seem to know when something isn't right. I guess what I'd like to know is has she ever thrown up before, how long has she had these "hiccups", and roughly how much does she consume at a single feeding?

Another question would be does her abdomen ever look distended or swollen after she eats? Does the breathing or hiccups get worse after she eats?"

[Jackie in Tampa]

I ran this by a colleague who is much smarter than I, and this is the reply I received:


"I am wondering if this squirrel has had breathing problems (hiccups) often in the past. The fact that she cannot hold down much of anything makes me wonder if she has a diaphragmatic hernia. If the hernia is on the right side it affects organs but at a slower rate. If it is on the left side it can affect breathing. It can also cause the body to only consume small amounts. of anything.

Who knows, maybe this is why she was abandoned. Mothers seem to know when something isn't right. I guess what I'd like to know is has she ever thrown up before, how long has she had these "hiccups", and roughly how much does she consume at a single feeding?

Another question would be does her abdomen ever look distended or swollen after she eats? Does the breathing or hiccups get worse after she eats?"there were three and they were born in captivity I was told...all three are on a gerbil diet since 5 weeks old...that alone is going to take awhile to get them back on track...and maybe the reason she is having problems...
i had this sq here for an hour or two and she seemed fine, she ate for me no problem, although i did somewhat have to force feed her, she didn't know what i was doing, no natural instinct at all.
I sent enough nipples/syringes for all three .
monique know the keepers of the other two.

i asked that she share TSB with them and she had a prearrangged date for today to visit them...so hoping they come to TSB also.
I sent monique home with fox vally literature and she will order, i did give her enough to get by with and perhaps she'll share with other keepers.

she had great fur and good weight, she appeared normal.
her eyes were big, but i think that is just her...

i asked that if she doesn't get better that she be bbrought back and left for a few days , to monitor and get her feeding habits better.
Monique thinks i handled her well, and is having diffeculty doing the same, tough little monkeys sometimes!

it has been a few hours since i spoke with her, so waiting for an update too.

[Jackie in Tampa]

forgot to say thanks pbj :thankyou

[4skwerlz]

Just wanted to mention that it's probably best not to give Tums (or vit/min mix) on an empty stomach, except in an emergency (seizing). Sounds like the "Tums + water" preceded the vomiting. What flavor of Tums is she using?

[Squirrely in Alabama]

monique i am so glad izzy got the help needed in time. jackie and everyone here is just so wonderful and quick to help... nice job on the save!:thumbsup
I am so glad that Jackie was able to help you. Jackie is an Angel!

[MoniqueClayton]

I am not sure if it was hiccups or not she did not make a hiccup sound, her stomach just kind of looked like she had the hiccups a day ago. The first two days she ate one hungry henry block but now she wont touch them or her greens. The only thing she seemed to touch was an orange slice. I am hand feeding her the fox valley formula and every time I feed her she seems to resist more and more and now she is scared of me because she thinks I am going to feed her. I tried feeding her the formula in a bowl and she runs when she smells it. She is eating the formula but is not a happy camper at all.. Her stomach does not seem to be swollen after I feed her and her breathing seems to be fine, well at least the same as it has always been with me. She has only thrown up one time and is active out of her cage but not as active as she used to be in her cage. Do you think she will ever get used to being hand fed her formula? - monique

[4skwerlz]

I am not sure if it was hiccups or not she did not make a hiccup sound, her stomach just kind of looked like she had the hiccups a day ago. The first two days she ate one hungry henry block but now she wont touch them or her greens. The only thing she seemed to touch was an orange slice. I am hand feeding her the fox valley formula and every time I feed her she seems to resist more and more and now she is scared of me because she thinks I am going to feed her. I tried feeding her the formula in a bowl and she runs when she smells it. She is eating the formula but is not a happy camper at all.. Her stomach does not seem to be swollen after I feed her and her breathing seems to be fine, well at least the same as it has always been with me. She has only thrown up one time and is active out of her cage but not as active as she used to be in her cage. Do you think she will ever get used to being hand fed her formula? - monique

The hardest thing about curing MBD is getting them to eat! 1. They are often not that hungry since MBD affects their appetite, and 2. They're used to eating the "wrong" foods and don't like change!

Try soaking the blocks in something yummy: applesauce, fruit baby food, avocado, heck, chocolate if that's what it takes. Right now, the important thing is to get that healthy stuff into her. Once she starts to get well, her appetite will improve and you can work on fine-tuning her diet.

If her appetite is so depressed that she truly won't eat ANYTHING, then if you can't force-feed by syringe (and it's hard to do if you're not experienced), then you might have to take her back to Jackie for a few days.

[MoniqueClayton]

i can force feed her with a syringe she just hates it and i dont want her to have a heart attack from the stress of me feeding her if thats even possible. im not so much worried about the force feeding formula as i am her lack of eating other foods like the HHB. She ate them before and now she turns away from it. I gave her a tiny piece of a pecan to see if she would eat it and she did so she does have some what of an appetite, i guess just not an appetite for the right foods.:thinking Hopefully she will just give in and eat the HHB. Apple sauce is not bad for her? i will see if she likes that stuff.. she is a stubborn little cookie.tinfoil

[MoniqueClayton]

o and another thing, i have a mineral lick and a salt lick that i switch between that is in her cage that she loves.. is that bad for her or is it ok?

[4skwerlz]

o and another thing, i have a mineral lick and a salt lick that i switch between that is in her cage that she loves.. is that bad for her or is it ok?

I'm not a huge fan of those, but with Izzy having MBD, maybe the mineral block is a good idea. I don't think the salt lick is necessary though. Does the mineral block also contain salt?

[MoniqueClayton]

ya i think that the mineral lick probably has salt in it. i will not give her that one anymore. So applesauce is ok to mix the HHB with?

[4skwerlz]

ya i think that the mineral lick probably has salt in it. i will not give her that one anymore. So applesauce is ok to mix the HHB with?

Like I said, anything you have to do to get her to eat them. You can even rub peanut butter on them.

Just no extra nuts right now, since they won't help her get well, and she will "fill up" on them.

For minerals, how about a few rocks from outside? Or a seashell? Washed first of course.

[CritterMom]

ya i think that the mineral lick probably has salt in it. i will not give her that one anymore. So applesauce is ok to mix the HHB with?


If you are going to cut one of them out, cut out the salt lick, not the mineral block.

[CritterMom]

Like I said, anything you have to do to get her to eat them. You can even rub peanut butter on them.

Just no extra nuts right now, since they won't help her get well, and she will "fill up" on them.

For minerals, how about a few rocks from outside? Or a seashell? Washed first of course.


You know, Mister P doesn't even recognise peanut butter as food...but he LOVES, LOVES. LOVES almond butter, which is probably a little better for him than peanut butter anyway. It is expensive, but having tasted some of Mister P's (shhhh, don't tell) I have to agree with him - WAY better than peanut butter! He will eat anything I smear it on.

[4skwerlz]

If you are going to cut one of them out, cut out the salt lick, not the mineral block.

CritterMom, my concern with the mineral block is that it has salt too, and knowing Izzy must be craving minerals because of her MBD, I'd hate for her to get too much salt at the same time.

That was my concern; do you think it makes sense?

[CritterMom]

CritterMom, my concern with the mineral block is that it has salt too, and knowing Izzy must be craving minerals because of her MBD, I'd hate for her to get too much salt at the same time.

That was my concern; do you think it makes sense?


Well, honestly, I would taste the mineral block, and if it has salt in it, I would remove both of them. If the mineral block doesn't have salt in it, it could stay and might do some good. Regardless, I would remove the "just salt" block.

[4skwerlz]

Well, honestly, I would taste the mineral block, and if it has salt in it, I would remove both of them. If the mineral block doesn't have salt in it, it could stay and might do some good. Regardless, I would remove the "just salt" block.

Yes, I asked her if the mineral block had salt and she said it did.

My concern with excess salt in an MBD squirrel is that if you increase the amount of one metabolite (salt) the cells will need more of other metabolites (like calcium) as well to balance it. In other words, eating a lot of salt could cause her to drop her blood calcium.

[PBluejay2]

I can't put my finger on it, but something's not sitting right with me about this one. I'm not at all thinking this baby does not have a calcium deficiency, but I'm wondering if something else might be going on.

Monique, a few questions:

1. Even though she doesn't seem to be eating much, is she pooing? If so, what are the shape and color of her poops? Do they seem well-formed? Do they come out rather "clean," or is there any mucous?

2. Is she peeing okay? If so, is her pee clear or almost clear? Yellowish? Dark yellow? Reddish?

3. I think you said she drank "lots" of water before she threw up. Do you remember what her vomit looked like? White? Foamy? Clear? Brown?

4. Do you know if the three were infants when found? If so, can you find out what they were fed before put on the gerbil food?

Here's what I think I know: (correct me where I'm wrong)

Background:
12 weeks old (Jackie’s estimate)
“born in captivity” ???
On gerbil diet since five weeks old ??? (No formula at five weeks? Something’s off here IMO)
Good fur and weight (Jackie)

Symptoms:
1. Screaming—during night before convulsions and when being fed
“waking up in the middle of the night screaming; happened 5 times in the last few weeks”.

2. The seizure activity began after being picked up.

“picked her up and she starting making a weird noise and her whole body started shaking; she did it again 10 minutes later but this time she was completely limp!”

“About 20 minutes ago i took her out of her cage when i got home and put her on my bed and her legs started shaking and she was making a grunt sound with her mouth open. I picked her up and she started shaking all over and then she stopped shaking and was completely limp like she was dead.”

3. Seized until unconscious
4. Does not like being held/squirms
5. Lack of appetite/rejects food/fights feeding
6. Sleeps a lot/lethargy
7. Drank lots of water and vomited
8. Her eyes were big
9. "Hiccups" or stomach contractions/convulsions (dry heaves?)

Rehabbers: Any input?

[MoniqueClayton]

I can't put my finger on it, but something's not sitting right with me about this one. I'm not at all thinking this baby does not have a calcium deficiency, but I'm wondering if something else might be going on.

Monique, a few questions:

1. Even though she doesn't seem to be eating much, is she pooing? If so, what are the shape and color of her poops? Do they seem well-formed? Do they come out rather "clean," or is there any mucous?

2. Is she peeing okay? If so, is her pee clear or almost clear? Yellowish? Dark yellow? Reddish?

3. I think you said she drank "lots" of water before she threw up. Do you remember what her vomit looked like? White? Foamy? Clear? Brown?

4. Do you know if the three were infants when found? If so, can you find out what they were fed before put on the gerbil food?

Here's what I think I know: (correct me where I'm wrong)

Background:
12 weeks old (Jackie’s estimate)
“born in captivity” ???
On gerbil diet since five weeks old ??? (No formula at five weeks? Something’s off here IMO)
Good fur and weight (Jackie)

Symptoms:
1. Screaming—during night before convulsions and when being fed
“waking up in the middle of the night screaming; happened 5 times in the last few weeks”.

2. The seizure activity began after being picked up.

“picked her up and she starting making a weird noise and her whole body started shaking; she did it again 10 minutes later but this time she was completely limp!”

“About 20 minutes ago i took her out of her cage when i got home and put her on my bed and her legs started shaking and she was making a grunt sound with her mouth open. I picked her up and she started shaking all over and then she stopped shaking and was completely limp like she was dead.”

3. Seized until unconscious
4. Does not like being held/squirms
5. Lack of appetite/rejects food/fights feeding
6. Sleeps a lot/lethargy
7. Drank lots of water and vomited
8. Her eyes were big
9. "Hiccups" or stomach contractions/convulsions (dry heaves?)

Rehabbers: Any input?

I am not 100% sure about her diet before I got her. I got about her 5 weeks ago. Her pee seems to be clear or close too it. She vomited in the morning a few days ago right when she woke up and the day before the she did not poop much at all. The day she threw up she pooped a lot and they were smaller than usual but well formed and now she poop is gooey and runny sort of like diarrhea. Her throw up was white with chunks and it looked like what she had ate which was her white formula and her HHB. Since she threw up she wont touch the HHB's anymore or anything else unless she thinks its a nut of some sort. So all she has really ate in the past day or two is her formula and a few nibbles of lettuce and an orange. She does love being held but since I have been force feeding her everyday she is a little bit more hesitant than usual. She was struggling a lot with me force feeding her the formula but last night and this morning she has not struggled as much, she did not bite or make all of those noises at me like she had been. She did not scream at me when I was feeding her like she screamed in her sleep. It was more of a squeal or a growl. She did try to squirm out of my hands when I stopped for a minute. I am not sure if she was having hiccups or not it she may have just been sniffing and looked like it. Her eyes are always big but that is just how she always is. When she had a seizure she was not unconscious she was just limp for a second. She is very active today, but the say she threw up she just wanted to sleep all day and not be touched. She still does not want to eat her foods unless its a nut, I think she may just be acting stubborn because she wants her junk food. She has not had a nightmare since the day before she had her seizure. She is definitely acting more like her old self besides the not eating part but like I said before, she does have an appetite just not for her healthy foods but for her nuts (McDonalds foods).

[Jackie in Tampa]

monique...you are doing great!
keep pushing the formula, sorry that she won't drink out of a bowl,
but she cannot be given a choice, she must have her veggies with calcium sprinkles and as much fv as you can get into her!
I am glad she is settling down and getting better for you!
Try putting peanut butter on her HHBs or honey or Nutella, Almond butter, anything that she likes!
mash them up and into something like apple sauce!
Keep us posted!
hugs

[4skwerlz]

Just to let you know, I just replied to Monique's PM with some more ideas on getting Izzy to eat the HHBs.

Could the vomiting just have been from all the unfamiliar foods? Also, initially, calcium can cause a bit of constipation.

I think that if Izzy is acting like she feels better generally, that's a good sign.

Monique, if at any time Izzy starts to feel worse again, you know who to call...

You're doing a wonderful job with her. :thumbsup Nothing worse than a stubborn squirrel...

[Jackie in Tampa]

thanks leigh:thumbsup
she's my 'other baby':Love_Icon

[MoniqueClayton]

GUESS WHAT!!!! i just fed Izzy her formula for the night and I added a few dabs of honey and she LOVED it!!! i didnt have to force it, she just drank it like a bottle!!!!! I am sooooo happy i wanna cry!!! :jump I hope honey isn't bad for her cuz she loves it. Should i let the HHB sit in some honey so she will eat that too? :)

[4skwerlz]

GUESS WHAT!!!! i just fed Izzy her formula for the night and I added a few dabs of honey and she LOVED it!!! i didnt have to force it, she just drank it like a bottle!!!!! I am sooooo happy i wanna cry!!! :jump I hope honey isn't bad for her cuz she loves it. Should i let the HHB sit in some honey so she will eat that too? :)

Wonderful! :thumbsup

Sure, you can try a little honey on the blocks.

A little honey won't hurt her right now. Later on we can worry about gradually reducing the amount of honey.

Excellent job, Monique! :thumbsup

[Jackie in Tampa]

:banana :banana :banana :banana :banana :banana :banana :banana :banana :banana :banana :banana :banana :banana :banana :banana :banana :banana :banana

[Lulu-Bean's Mommy]

Good to hear!
It sounds like you're doing a wonderful job, Monique! Such a good mommy.:D

[MoniqueClayton]

Izzy's blocks came today and she was trying to help me open them!! She was going crazy and when I opened them she grabbed one and started chomping away!! YYAAAYYY!!! i guess she just didn't like the few jackie gave me because i didn't know i was to refrigerate them so they must have been stale. But shes a happy happy happy camper now!!:fireworks :fireworks :fireworks :fireworks :fireworks :jump

[4skwerlz]

Izzy's blocks came today and she was trying to help me open them!! She was going crazy and when I opened them she grabbed one and started chomping away!! YYAAAYYY!!! i guess she just didn't like the few jackie gave me because i didn't know i was to refrigerate them so they must have been stale. But shes a happy happy happy camper now!!:fireworks :fireworks :fireworks :fireworks :fireworks :jump

That's great news!:thumbsup Feeding Izzy a healthy diet will be a lot easier now...:)

You've done a wonderful job with her.:thumbsup

[Jackie in Tampa]

:thumbsup truthfully...her getting the calcium she needed so badly is making her appetite normal...and the blocks are going to keep her healthy ....everyday should be better!:crazy
Awesome Monique!:alright.gif
and the new recipe is the bomb!thanks Leigh!:Love_Icon
:wave123 hello Izzylicious! smooch!:Love_Icon
I love hearing good news after a rough day!...oh lala:grouphug

[mindy65]

That is great news. Did you contact the other lady that has her brothers and sisters and get them on the right diet before it is to late for them? I hope she is as eager as you were to making changes to there diet. Please let us know if you had any luck with that. Your a great mommy. min

[MoniqueClayton]

Yes, I went to their house last night and I gave them some formula and blocks. I showed her how to feed her formula and gave her a lot of the information she needs to get her little Marvin back on track. Marvin does have a lot of the same symptoms that Izzy had after she had her seizure. I think from the knowledge I gained from what Jackie taught me about MBD, that he has it as MBD well. He is lethargic and his legs have just recently because very weak and walks funny now. He is very paranoid and screams when he is sleeping just like Izzy did. She said that for a while he does not want to be touched or eat or drink just like Izzy did as well after she had her seizure. I gave her Jackies number incase she needs her help, but I think that she is just as committed to her baby as I am. That is the update for now.

[PBluejay2]

It sounds like this baby needs the emergency MBD treatment! If it is presenting these symptoms, changing diet won't be good enough, work fast enough.

Emergency Treatment for Metabolic Bone Disease (updated 3-31-09)Get calcium into the squirrel IMMEDIATELY, not later, not tomorrow, NOW. Delaying treatment can cause death or permanent paralysis.

You will need:

--Tums or calcium pills (any kind)
--a syringe, eyedropper, or spoon

Crush one Tums or calcium pill and add a little water or fruit juice. Use the syringe, eyedropper, or spoon to force-feed the mixture, a little at a time, until it is all gone. Feed a total of 600-800 mg of calcium, and spread it out through the day and night to keep his blood calcium levels as steady as possible.

If the squirrel is having seizures, weakness, or paralysis, the symptoms will usually improve within a few hours, but this does not mean the squirrel is cured. It will take many months to rebuild the calcium in the bones.

Long-Term Treatment for MBD

The next step to curing MBD is to fix the diet.

1. Remove ALL seeds, nuts, corn, and treats.

2. Follow the Healthy Diet For Pet Squirrels, which can be found at the top of the “Squirrel Nutrition” forum. (http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=16093) Your squirrel MUST eat rodent block or squirrel blocks every day. If your squirrel doesn't like rodent blocks, you can try crushing them up with peanut butter or avocado temporarily. You can also make a tastier version of squirrel blocks using the recipe at the top of the Squirrel Nutrition forum.

3. In addition to the Healthy Diet, you will need to continue giving extra calcium every day for several weeks. Either use the syringe/eyedropper or you can try putting the calcium on a small piece of fruit.

Week 1: calcium = 500 mg per day
Week 2: calcium = 250 mg per day
Weeks 3-8: calcium = 100 mg per day

The cause of the acute symptoms—weakness, lethargy, seizures, paralysis—is a drop in blood calcium levels. If these symptoms return at any time, you will need to give another emergency dose of calcium.

More Tips
MBD causes brittle bones that break easily. Try to keep your squirrel away from high places, where he might jump and break a bone. Also, if he is in a tall cage, either place him in a smaller cage, or pad the bottom very well.

Heat is very soothing for a squirrel with MBD. A heating pad turned to low and placed so they cannot chew the pad or cord, or a rice buddy (a sock filled with dry rice/beans and microwaved for about 20 seconds) will work.

[island rehabber]

:goodpost:goodpost:goodpost

[Jackie in Tampa]

:sad Sad news..Marvin is now running in the trees in heaven.
When I finally got him, he was in very poor shape and we couldn't bring him back. His journey was too short, but our love for him was GRAND!
Marvin was the third sq in this group of friends and was a big loss to his momma, a sweet girl, and me too.:Cry
You were loved little one...and we will remember you forever.:grouphug
Rest in Peace Sweet Squirrel:Love_Icon

Monique, I hope Izzy is doing well and would love an update!:Love_Icon
Mr.Electrician Marley is still here with us and he will be released here...I would love to talk to you about that for Izzy too, if he changes his mind and wilds up, choosing the trees!
I think about you two often, sending hugs to you both!:grouphug
Call me anytime if you need anything!:wave123

[4skwerlz]

:grouphug :grouphug :grouphug
You both tried so hard....

Rest in Peace, little Marvin.

[krawls]

:grouphug :Love_Icon :grouphug

[Katherine]

RIP little one..:grouphug

[Nancy in New York]

Oh Jackie...I am so very sorry for your loss. If you couldn't turn him around then nobody could...:grouphug :grouphug
RIP
Baby Marvin:Love_Icon

[virgo062]

:grouphug RIP baby Marvin

[Chickenlegs]

Bless you little Marvin. And bless all those that care for critters.

[island rehabber]

Rest in the arms of the angels, little Marvin; I'm so sorry you had to suffer like that. :(