THE ESBILAC ISSUE

[island rehabber]

For anyone reading this thread in the future.

The Esbilac issue has resolved itself.
I edited this thread by adding this post on 5/20/2017

When buying the powdered puppy esbilac, make sure that the third ingredient
on the can is Dried Whey Protein Concentrate.
We NO longer recommend Fox Valley 32/40 ever.

Here's the correct formula.

https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-VTCXht8/0/d17c683d/O/i-VTCXht8.jpg





In light of the recent problems rehabbers have been experiencing with Esbilac formula, it has been decided that the best alternative is Fox Valley 32/40.
http://foxvalleynutrition.com/prod/d...p?CID=1&PLID=1 (http://foxvalleynutrition.com/prod/details.asp?CID=1&PLID=1)
Nicholas P. Vlamis, President (Nick)
(800) 679-4666
If you call in your order and tell him you need it quickly he'll be happy to oblige. He can ship to you regular post 3-5 days and overnight. He's very nice and very easy to work with.
In the meantime you will need to feed your baby a home-made formula, but please for the sake of the baby, do not feed this for more than 4-7 days. It's a great temporary replacer milk but it lacks certain vitamins and minerals that the babies need to thrive. This recipe will ensure that your baby will be well nourished until your order from Fox Valley arrives.

Jackie (Jackie in Tampa) has graciously offered her temporary replacement formula recipe.
Jackie's Goat Milk Recipe
1 cup goats milk
1/3 cup heavy cream
1/3 cup dannon all natural vanilla yogurt

Mix well and keep in a covered plastic or glass container in the refrigerator. Replace after 48 hours.
Please note, this website has several links that still mention Esbilac and we need to keep these links active as they do contain excellent information so please keep in mind that Fox Valley is now the formula of choice for raising baby squirrels.

[lizharrell1]

Hey, IR. I haven't been on here much lately, but in trying to be prepared for upcoming baby season I am trying to find which formula has replaced Esbilac as the formula of choice. I never did personally experience any probs with the Esbilac powder, but I don't wish to take any chances. Legomom sent me this link. One thing I am not clear on: The squirrels will need 2 separate formulas? One formula for under 3 weeks and then the other formula for 3 weeks and over? Any help on this would be appreciated as I am trying to get prepared by having formula on hand. Before, it was no problem since I could purchase Esbilac locally, but this formula I will need to order. Thanks for the advice!!!
Liz:)
Oh, yeah. A local rehabber who does mostly bunnies and birds of prey, but also some squirrels used Zoologic and she swears by it. Any thoughts on that? However, I trust Shanon's opinion so I will be going with the Fox Valley. I was just wondering about the other formula.

[island rehabber]

Liz, the two Fox Valley formulas are offered so that after 4 wks of age rehabbers could switch to a higher-fat version, the 20/50. As for the Zoologic, I've never used it, but I believe you must combine it with MultiMilk, another Pet Ag product, in order for it to be right for squirrels. I'm not an expert on this one so maybe someone else will chime in. The reason we don't recommend Zoologic is simply that having to combine two separate products is daunting for inexperienced but well meaning folks trying to save a baby squirrel. It is really too bad that now there is no formula that is sold in retail stores -- everything must be ordered by phone or on line.

[lizharrell1]

Thanks IR for the info. I was just a little confused. The rehabber that uses the Zoologic never mentioned Multimilk, but then again, I wasn't too interested in other formulas at that time since I was having no issues with the Esbilac. I always added whipping cream and yogurt to the Esbilac. Will I need to add those to the Fox Valley as well? Lots of questions, I know, so sorry about that !!! Just want to be sure I am up to date on the latest!!!
Liz

[island rehabber]

Thanks IR for the info. I was just a little confused. The rehabber that uses the Zoologic never mentioned Multimilk, but then again, I wasn't too interested in other formulas at that time since I was having no issues with the Esbilac. I always added whipping cream and yogurt to the Esbilac. Will I need to add those to the Fox Valley as well? Lots of questions, I know, so sorry about that !!! Just want to be sure I am up to date on the latest!!!
Liz
No need to add anything to Fox Valley. IF you have a baby who isn't bulking up as much as you'd like, Fox Valley does have a product called Ultra Boost which is a higher fat supplement to go with the regular formula. FV developed it in response to some rehabbers who reported that their squirrels were much more muscular than when they had used Esbilac, but were not as chubby. :D

[Mickey's Mom]

In light of the recent problems rehabbers have been experiencing with Esbilac formula, it has been decided that the best alternative is Fox Valley 32/40.

Please note, this website has several links that still mention Esbilac and we need to keep these links active as they do contain excellent information so please keep in mind that Fox Valley is now the formula of choice for raising baby squirrels.

I haven't been on here in recent months (so swamped with babies and we still have a few left in homecare), so I'm wondering if someone could quickly summarize why Esbilac is no longer the formula of choice for raising baby squirrels. (I did search for "Esbilac" but all I could find was this one thread??)

This summer I did hear (through the Squirrel List and from Chris' Squirrels and More announcements) about some rehabbers having trouble with diarrhea and failure to thrive with Esbilac, but our facility never did have any widespread problems (we raised almost 120 babies from July through October). I suspect a lot of what we used this summer was the "old formula", but not all. Another difference may be that we've always used Esbilac + Multimilk for eyes-closed babies, and Esbilac mixed with 2 parts water for 5 wks and up, which I think is a different protocol from the folks who had problems.

But I guess my main question is, is there a definitive answer about what was "wrong" with the Esbilac and why we should move away from it? The things I read said PetAg had moved to a different manufacturing process, and at first people said it had too much fat content, then later said the opposite was true and to add cream. By that point I gave up on following the story because I wondered if any of it was truly fact-based. And if there are documented problems, is PetAg going to do anything to change the formula back?

I apologize if this is re-hashing something I should already know, but I'd like to be clear on what the issues are. We have a large quantity of Esbilac stock now, and I don't think our wildlife hospital will be willing/able to replace it. If used in combination with the Multimilk is it workable, and what symptoms should we look for to know if it's not working?

Thanks!!

[whopoopwrasse]

I wondered if any of it was truly fact-based.

You pretty much summed ip the whole story,

I called PetAg personally this summer and they told me that the processing was changed and that they were not planning on changing back and that their first priority was feeding PUPPIES and not squirrels even though they knew it was being used for squirrels. They did appologise for the problems but repeated that they made this product for puppies.

Maybe this new process didn't affect all baby squirrels since many reported they had no problems but we all decided it would be best to use FV since it really is formulated for squirrels and all who use it have nothing but good things to say about it.

[island rehabber]

You pretty much summed ip the whole story,

I called PetAg personally this summer and they told me that the processing was changed and that they were not planning on changing back and that their first priority was feeding PUPPIES and not squirrels even though they knew it was being used for squirrels. They did appologise for the problems but repeated that they made this product for puppies.

Maybe this new process didn't affect all baby squirrels since many reported they had no problems but we all decided it would be best to use FV since it really is formulated for squirrels and all who use it have nothing but good things to say about it.

That's exactly it. No one is quite sure why the 'manufacturing process change' made such a huge difference in baby squirrels (and bunnies too, I think). But the fact that so many had babies sicken and sometimes die with killer diarrhea -- well that IS a fact so TSB can no longer recommend Esbilac in good conscience. Most likely if your facility was using some 'new' Esbilac with MultiMilk and had no issue with it, then that's okay. However, you can understand why TSB did not choose to recommend that option, since for first-time squirrel baby rescuers it's far too confusing. Esbilac is available in some pet stores but MultiMilk is not....after much discussion, we chose to recommend Pedialyte and a goat's milk formula (both available in stores) for the first day or so while awaiting the Fox Valley.

[grinn75]

Quick question on the Fox Valley. I like to give my pet grey squirrel, Bean, formula just to ensure she is getting enough calcium. She is 4.5 months old now and have always used the Esbilac but don't want to any longer since we have had so many issues with diarrhea. What Fox Valley formula should I use as she grows into adulthood?

[island rehabber]

Quick question on the Fox Valley. I like to give my pet grey squirrel, Bean, formula just to ensure she is getting enough calcium. She is 4.5 months old now and have always used the Esbilac but don't want to any longer since we have had so many issues with diarrhea. What Fox Valley formula should I use as she grows into adulthood?

You should use the Day One 20/50 for squirrels 4+ weeks and older. It has a nice high fat content and she will love the vanilla taste.

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

Hey, IR. I haven't been on here much lately, but in trying to be prepared for upcoming baby season I am trying to find which formula has replaced Esbilac as the formula of choice. I never did personally experience any probs with the Esbilac powder, but I don't wish to take any chances. Legomom sent me this link. One thing I am not clear on: The squirrels will need 2 separate formulas? One formula for under 3 weeks and then the other formula for 3 weeks and over? Any help on this would be appreciated as I am trying to get prepared by having formula on hand. Before, it was no problem since I could purchase Esbilac locally, but this formula I will need to order. Thanks for the advice!!!
Liz:)
Oh, yeah. A local rehabber who does mostly bunnies and birds of prey, but also some squirrels used Zoologic and she swears by it. Any thoughts on that? However, I trust Shanon's opinion so I will be going with the Fox Valley. I was just wondering about the other formula.

I was talking to Nonda about the formula issue at the Michigan conference and she has no issue with fox valley, but she strongly recommends keeping with the fox valley 32/40 formula and NOT switching when the squirrels are older to the 20/50. The extra fat is good, but the reduced protein can be detremental to their development. Not enough to kill them, but they need the protein to grow. She recommends adding in heavy cream if they need the extra weight boost from fat.

Does anyone know if the Zoologic 33/40 and Multi-Milk were changed similarly to the Esbilac? I had a problem with Multi-milk this fall with massive diarrhea and a bunny died. Not sure if it was a bad can or what. I really don't trust PetAG much at this point.

[Kelly Brady]

I have received my new Fox Valley formula and LOVE IT! All my squirrels, including the litter of three (5 week olds) have had it now for two weeks. There is no constipation issues what so ever. I will never use Esbilac again because of the extreme reaction my little ones had to the new formulation of Esbilac. Fox Valley is extremely affordable and the owner was great about overnighting some to me prior to the holiday. I wanted to share how well all of my critters are doing on this wonderful formula.:thankyou

[island rehabber]

I have received my new Fox Valley formula and LOVE IT! All my squirrels, including the litter of three (5 week olds) have had it now for two weeks. There is no constipation issues what so ever. I will never use Esbilac again because of the extreme reaction my little ones had to the new formulation of Esbilac. Fox Valley is extremely affordable and the owner was great about overnighting some to me prior to the holiday. I wanted to share how well all of my critters are doing on this wonderful formula.:thankyou

:thumbsup:thumbsup

[Jackie in Tampa]

I was talking to Nonda about the formula issue at the Michigan conference and she has no issue with fox valley, but she strongly recommends keeping with the fox valley 32/40 formula and NOT switching when the squirrels are older to the 20/50. The extra fat is good, but the reduced protein can be detremental to their development. Not enough to kill them, but they need the protein to grow. She recommends adding in heavy cream if they need the extra weight boost from fat.

Does anyone know if the Zoologic 33/40 and Multi-Milk were changed similarly to the Esbilac? I had a problem with Multi-milk this fall with massive diarrhea and a bunny died. Not sure if it was a bad can or what. I really don't trust PetAG much at this point.



I just recently got the 'older than 4 weeks ' stuff, and my kids, who always love their formula, are snubbing it! grrr
and I have 8lbs...wish I would have got the other now...and especially if NS thinks so too...oh well...:sanp3
but I add yogurt and heavy cream to any formula...that's what makes it formula...!:D
FV does not mix as well as the old Esbilac did...and FV gets very thick when I add yogurt and Hcream... I always add extra water to help dilute it down to a thinner consistancy..still thicker than I prefer...but I do like it...the 32/40 smells so dang good too...just like IR said...vanilla cake!:thumbsup
My babies did great and look great...and that's what counts:)
:alright.gif Fox Valley:alright.gif

[whopoopwrasse]

I just recently got the 'older than 4 weeks ' stuff, and my kids, who always love their formula, are snubbing it! grrr
and I have 8lbs...wish I would have got the other now...and especially if NS thinks so too...oh well...:sanp3
but I add yogurt and heavy cream to any formula...that's what makes it formula...!:D
FV does not mix as well as the old Esbilac did...and FV gets very thick when I add yogurt and Hcream... I always add extra water to help dilute it down to a thinner consistancy..still thicker than I prefer...but I do like it...the 32/40 smells so dang good too...just like IR said...vanilla cake!:thumbsup
My babies did great and look great...and that's what counts:)
:alright.gif Fox Valley:alright.gif

Nick told me that if there's a problem, babies don't like it her will switch it for you :thumbsup probably for the cost of shipping...

[island rehabber]

yep, Jackie if you have 8lbs I would send it back to Nick & get the 32/40 :thumbsup

[squirrelsrule&bunniestoo]

The thickness and not such good mixing is one of the main things (besides the bloating and diarrhea) that I hated about FV formula. I tube my bunnies and I would go through so many tubes because it clogged. This year it seemed to mix quite well, although I was so greatful to have something that would help the squirrels gain weight that it could have been pudding thick and I would have been happy :D. Do you keep your FV in the fridge? I am having much better luck now that I refridgerate it (I didn't used to because the wildlife center where I volunteer doesn't and it doesn't say to on the package).


I just recently got the 'older than 4 weeks ' stuff, and my kids, who always love their formula, are snubbing it! grrr
and I have 8lbs...wish I would have got the other now...and especially if NS thinks so too...oh well...:sanp3
but I add yogurt and heavy cream to any formula...that's what makes it formula...!:D
FV does not mix as well as the old Esbilac did...and FV gets very thick when I add yogurt and Hcream... I always add extra water to help dilute it down to a thinner consistancy..still thicker than I prefer...but I do like it...the 32/40 smells so dang good too...just like IR said...vanilla cake!:thumbsup
My babies did great and look great...and that's what counts:)
:alright.gif Fox Valley:alright.gif

[momma2boo]

Fox Valley ROCKS! I found them while researching nutritional needs of a squirrel after Hurricane Charlie left me 3 babies and a rehabber who was overwhelmed with over 300 baby squirrels of her own. Boy ... it was a busy hurricane season for her and all those orphaned squirrels.

[island rehabber]

Via a wildlife rehab list, I received this link to Shirley Casey's latest and most comprehensive report on The Esbilac Issue:

http://www.ewildagain.com/Nutrition/Esbilac%20Manufacturing%20Changes.htm

For those unfamiliar with Shirley, she and her husband Allan are highly respected experts in wildlife rehabilitation, with particular emphasis on squirrels. Her rehab sanctuary, Wild Again (www.ewildagain.com (http://www.ewildagain.org)) is one of the finest of its kind according to many rehabbers nationwide. As a graduate of the Caseys' 2-day Squirrel School, I can say it was the best 14 hours I ever spent in a classroom in my life. Shirley is a top-notch researcher and has been closely monitoring and studying this Esbilac problem since last year. I personally will never go back to Esbilac, but for those wish to -- Shirley will tell you how to do it right. :thumbsup

[Mickey's Mom]

Via a wildlife rehab list, I received this link to Shirley Casey's latest and most comprehensive report on The Esbilac Issue:

http://www.ewildagain.com/Nutrition/Esbilac%20Manufacturing%20Changes.htm



I will second the praise of the Casey's comprehensive and fact-based approach to understanding this issue, and this excellent report. (It's 38 pages including appendices but actually quite readable and understandable.)
Anyway, this research finally explains why some rehabbers had such problems last year while others did not -- the changes in solubility and compactibility of the new process Esbilac were the issue. Since the product is no longer "instant mix", rehabbers who prepared the formula by just stirring into warm water and serving immediately had problems with diarrhea (and worse), while those who routinely made a days-worth batch of formula with hotter water, used more agitation, etc. did not. Using Multi-Milk or cream in addition to Esbilac also helped.

Anyone who wants to continue using Esbilac (as I will) really needs to read this report to understand how to prepare it correctly and avoid problems. I can report that the new process formula (combined with Multi-Milk) is producing great results so far this season. My pinkies have thrived on it and are about 3-4 weeks old now with normal stools and good weight gain.

As the Caseys have said in their Squirrel Rehabilitation Handbook, there is no one "correct" formula to use in raising squirrels. So there certainly doesn't need to be an ongoing FV vs. Esbilac vs. Zoologic controversy.

[island rehabber]

:goodpost
There should always be healthy competition between manufacturers, because it keeps everyone on their best behavior and best quality control practices. Thank goodness we have two good options for feeding our baby critters!

[exoticanimalrescue]

I have heard years back of many using it with success? We have a 4 week oldish baby and am thinking of the FV as we just found him trapped... My daughter has a huge fox squirrel that she raised from a hairless baby that fell 40 feet out of a tree. She will be 2 in August... I think she used Esbilac. I'm just curious about almond milk? We are vegetarians and curious if a little will hurt them.
We are on an island and thats all we had so am giving the little guy that tonight and going to order tomorrow..or to petstore.. Thanks Kim

[exoticanimalrescue]

She said they had to add alot to KMR. She used Esbilac on her squirrel she has now. Is NC andSC a legal state if you've dropped your license?thanks

[island rehabber]

Neither NC nor SC are legal states without a license...BE CAREFUL.

I would order the Fox Valley as soon as possible. Nick is wonderful to work with -- he's the owner but he answers the phone 90% of the time. He will rush the order to you, if necessary.
If you want to try the Esbilac, be very careful to strictly follow the Shirley Casey/Chris Clark instructions about using the "new" formula....

I have the same problem as you do -- I live on an island, even though I'm 15 miles from NY City! We have no Petco, no Walmart, and no veterinary clinic of any kind. Everything closes at 8:30pm. It's a challenge :D.

[exoticanimalrescue]

When did SC change? I rehabbed years back under a permit in another state but used to anyone could have a squirrelin SC...when we went to my Moms I was shocked at how many had them and how many didn'tknow about mbd:( I would love a copy of the law and will call them Monday as I gave my daughter the wrong info if it's changed :( Read this.. http://www.wfjlaw.net/nutkin-squirrel-orwigsburg-schuylkill-county-pennsylvania

[squirrel2010]

I joined this forum because I have been looking all over the internet for DAYS to find out what I SHOULD feed my baby squirrel. I found him Friday, and I called a vet that said, and strongly supported when I suggest Esbilac (reading google results), to feed him KMR Liquid, so i have been. The squirrel is 1 to 2 weeks old, I looked up squirrel charts. When i got him he was completely pink and tiny with whiskers, now he has dark shadow all down his head and back. Anyway, I initially fed him Pedialyte, heated, and gradually mixed in the KMR. Now, 6 days later, I am still feeding him KMR out of the can, mixing in a tiny bit of Pedialyte, and whipped cream for fat. He takes it and drink, I get him to pee and poop, and he goes right back to sleep. His stool isn't loose, its golden yellow, some brown, and is soft, i cant explain it really, but i do not think its diarreah. My question is, WILL HE DIE IF I KEEP FEEDING HIM KMR?? When I look at all the google results, its like a civil war between KMR and Esbilac, each side has its reasons of why the other is bad, or why KMR or Esbilac is poison, blah blah blah. I'm not interesting in ordering FOX Valley crap. I just need an honest answer, if I can raise him successfully on KMR, i fear switching to esbilac, even gradually, will kill him. To me, hes doing fine on KMR and passes all the dehydration test I can find to do. I dont care to know all the differences on why esbilac is better than KMR, and why fox valley is better than esbilac, I just would ver, very much appreciate if you could tell me if I am ok with the KMR. And if you would mind emailing me at tango1865@yahoo.com so I can get you advice quicker because that email i often check. Thank you

[island rehabber]

You have been sent my response. I would not feed another baby squirrel Esbilac, ever, and I would CERTAINLY not feed KMR.

[Runestonez]

I am almost afraid to ask...
Here in Ontario the rehabbers feed pretty much everything Esbilac.
They alright on Esbilac until around the time they started teething their bottom teeth. Then they all started to develop soft stools and finally diarrhea. I was on the phone to the rehabbers and our vet every other day for a week. The only thing they could advise me was to drop back to pedialyte and then slowly work my way back up to the full strength formula.
That made no sense to me since I had already tried adjusting the formula, added rice pablum powder, neomycin sulphate, etc...
I finally out of frustration decided to treat the bloating and gas...since that is something I recognize and can treat easily.
I started giving them .25cc Ovol before each meal and in about 4 feedings their stools had returned to normal.
I removed the Ovol and their stools started to soften after about 2 feedings...so I returned to Ovol and again back to normal.
I have to call the vet and check to see what I can do about this.
(I am NOT a rehabber...there are none in this area willing to take our little guys and the one place that will...the Humane Society...the Ministry of Natural Resources advised me that they will euthanize them because they are too much work at this age!)
So I am being very careful to try to follow the recommendations given to me so my babies aren't taken away!
But how long can I dose with Ovol safely?
I know with rabbits it isn't an issue...but what about squirrels?
I am going to try to scale back the Ovol to the lowest possible effective dose...they are approx. 29 days old today...<worried>

Danielle :)

[gs1]

runestone.... one word ...fox valley ...but we've no idea how long it will take to get here...

give them a call tomorrow ...

maybe we can find you some earlier .....

all the best....:Welcome

[europe]

Just wanted to put in a word about a succesful experience with red squirrels. We raised 3 from about 2 weeks old and will release them in a couple more weeks. We live in Europe and no-one had ever heard of Esbilac so finally after rehydrating solution and one unsuccesful formula for puppies settled on the puppy milk made by Royal Canine. Since then the squirrels have thrived. They are alert, healthy, shiny coats (especially since I started adding whipping cream and full cream yoghourt) and extremely active. It was easy to introduce fruit and veg, as well as some rodents pellets, and especially love the pine cones and bark, drinking water well as soon as we started to wean them. Will be very sad to see them go but hope to see them around in the garden.

Extremely resilient little things too as we had no choice but to take them on holiday with us in the car. ( I do not recommend this unless they are still very small and not yet moving about, one also has to be extremely organized and have a very patient husband! ) We set ourselves up on the beach with a tent, warming bottles and devised a way of heating up their milk which worked very well. There was really no-one I could leave them with and so were able to continue their 3 and 4 hour feeds without disrupting our holiday.
We arrived back home just as they started exploring their environment and made them a bigger cage which they love.

What a great experience and would be happy to take on any orphans in the future. We have no official rehabbers here. Will try and post some pics later

[Rhapsody]

I have always been told NEVER to feed kitten formula (or milk) to a baby squirrel... these two liquids are said to be a big no no as they can make a squirrel very ill and/or even kill them..... thats all I know on the subject of KMR. Now as far a Esbilac goes, I personally have never had any problems with feeding it to my squirrels. I generally only have one squirrel at a time and mix each feeding as needed (the powder is never premixed).

[Rhapsody]

What Fox Valley formula should I use as she grows into adulthood? You need to purchase FV 20/50 for Squirrels that are 4 weeks and older..... http://www.foxvalleynutrition.com/prod/products.asp?PLID=1
... is your Squirrel still drinking formula? - I ask as most Squirrels will wean themselves around 3 to 4 months old.

You can use Squirrel Blocks / Rodents Blocks when there is NO More Formula
HHB @ http://www.henryspets.com/
HT #2018 @ http://www.thecraftyrat.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=FS-FR-5lbs&Category_Code=VP

[Rhapsody]

I have always been told NEVER to feed kitten formula (or milk) to a baby squirrel...
these two liquids are said to be a big no no as they can make a squirrel very ill and/or even kill them.....
thats all I know on the subject of KMR.
Now as far a Esbilac goes, I personally have never had any problems with feeding it to my squirrels.
I generally only have one squirrel at a time and mix each feeding as needed (the powder is never premixed).
dated Nov 2010

I would like to go on RECORD as STATING.......
I NO LONGER USE or RECOMMENDED THE USE of ESBILAC for SQUIRRELS!!

Since I made the post above I lost a sweet 6 week old female squirrel
"Sandy" to the exact problem Esbilac was having with their New Formula
Mixture..... and have now changed over to FOX VALLEY.

I NEVER want to watch another baby die to such a DEATH..... :(

__________________________


Background - Unexplained problems emerge during 2009
http://www.ewildagain.com/Nutrition/Esbilac%20Manufacturing%20Changes.htm
Young animals that eat an inadequately dissolved formula are consuming less
nutrition and can develop diarrhea and grow more slowly. The inadequately
dissolved and undigested milk products in an animal’s GI tract are a great
place for bacteria to grow – and infections to develop.

___

[virgo062]

noted.....

[rygel1hardt]

With Esbilac loose bowels is not always the problem. I just got one last week that had been fed Esbilac and she hadnt pooped for the finders even once the whole five days they had her. She was so impacted with stool that her belly appeared bruised. It was another two days before I got her going well and was able to get all the impacted stool from her digestive tract. She is now fine on Fox valley 32/40 and eating well. She is gaining weight quickly and pees and poops normal pellets at every meal. I have noticed several new posters on this board and many have seemingly had constipated babies. I think this may be a new issue with pet ag products. If you are having success with it more power to you but I will NEVER use any of their products again. Stacey

[Nancy in New York]

With Esbilac loose bowels is not always the problem. I just got one last week that had been fed Esbilac and she hadnt pooped for the finders even once the whole five days they had her. She was so impacted with stool that her belly appeared bruised. It was another two days before I got her going well and was able to get all the impacted stool from her digestive tract. She is now fine on Fox valley 32/40 and eating well. She is gaining weight quickly and pees and poops normal pellets at every meal. I have noticed several new posters on this board and many have seemingly had constipated babies. I think this may be a new issue with pet ag products. If you are having success with it more power to you but I will NEVER use any of their products again. Stacey

Sounds very similar to what I had last year. I was given a baby that was fed Esbilac and he came to me bloated and impacted. I never posted the photos, but it seems this is the right time.
I wasn't 100% sure at the time that this was from the Esbilac, but now I am. I transitioned him to FV and he did beautifully.
When I removed the "impacted stuff" it was like concrete, and had the same color...whitish/grey. He would get impacted as soon as I removed what was already there, and I would start again, until it was out of his system.
And the bloat was terrible as you can imagine.....:shakehead

The day I got him.
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv95/nancym518/Spring%202011/IMG_4872-1.jpg

This was about a half hour after getting all of that crap out of his system.
I would start the procedure again, and then again until it all finally came out.
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv95/nancym518/Spring%202011/IMG_4875.jpg

This is what came out the first time....poor baby!
It was like cement.
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv95/nancym518/Spring%202011/IMG_4877.jpg

[island rehabber]

This truly does open up a whole new can of worms regarding the use of Esbilac for squirrels. I say it's just one big, unequivocal NO NO:nono...DO NOT USE IT.

(note to large wildlife "centers" that get BIG discounts from Pet Ag for using Esbilac: you're killing wildlife. How much is THAT worth to you? :pissed )

[HHRP]

When my Fox Valley shipment arrives how do I go about switching over from Esbilac?

[gs1]

susan ...it's always better to do a separate thread for any questions....

:thumbsup

i'm not a rehabber, i can't answer for you ... so do a separate thread and you'll be answered there....(the short unnofficial answer is you mix both formulas as normal and then give 3 parts of old and 1 part of new.. then 2:2
then 1 old : 3 new etc....

not mixing them together in the same syringe... just drawing up the amounts you need....


:D :Welcome :Welcome

you can use...different forums...the baby area or nutrition but if it's semi-urgent or you're not sure then use the non-life threatning one...threads can always be moved and better safe than sorrry....:thumbsup

[Rescue04]

i have used esbilac in the past with no really bad experiences.

[Kiki]

So does this issue also apply to Espilac's pre-mixed formula?

[Milo's Mom]

So does this issue also apply to Espilac's pre-mixed formula?

Yes it does. Also, if you simply MUST use Esbilac (not sure why this would ever happen) the powder is better. Mix it in VERY HOT water and place it in the fridge for 24 hours, THEN when preparing to feed add the yogurt and whipping cream.

Honestly, Fox Valley is MUCH better and it is A LOT cheaper and it smells a heck of a lot better too.

[vettechmarie]

Esbilac changed their formula recipe last year. The original recipe worked for sqs, but the new one can and does kill them. I am sure there are sqs out there that will still live long lives having been raised on Esbilac, but it is NOT worth the risk. FVN is 100x better than Esbilac is, was, or ever will be in my opinion, and on par with cost if not cheaper. Just my 2 cents :-):thumbsup

[Andrew743]

If anyone is still debating on whether or not to switch to FV from Esbilac. I HIGHLY RECCOMEND THAT YOU GET THE BABIES OFF ESBILAC IMMEDIATELY! I am completely new to this but the changes in bowel movements alone are drastic! The FV is so much easier on their systems, their poop has changed to the size and consistancy of when they first came to me, only difference is the color. NO MORE BLOATING AND NO DIARRHEA! DIARRHEA WILL HAPPEN ON ESBILAC!!! ITS UNAVOIDABLE! I FOUND OUT THE HARD WAY!:soapbox

Good luck to you all! My babies are doing awesome! HUGE IMPROVEMENTS THE MINTUE I TOOK THEM OFF ESBILAC!

~ Andrew

[island rehabber]

:goodpost :thankyou :goodpost


And remember: large wildlife centers and rescue organizations may still use Esbilac for squirrels & bunnies but that DOES NOT MEAN it is a good formula. It means that Pet Ag is still giving HUGE discounts to people who buy in high volume, and I guess money still talks even when babies' lives are at stake. :shakehead

[jojobabe]

After loosing Jojo, I am looking at, researching alot of stuff. If no one minds, I am going to share some things that I have found/or know.
IR is correct about Esbilac. Here is some more info:
Esbilac (puppy formula) -- literally thousands of squirrels have died needlessly over the years in the hands of humans because of being fed commercial formulas recommended on those politically-motivated wildlife-group web pages. This particular formula used to take longer than KMR for the harmful effects to set in, although now (and for the last three and a half years, since it has been found to be highly toxic and contaminated), it kills them much quicker, within a day or two. Has egg yolk (unborn chicken) in it, no magnesium, too many alien chemical additives and preservatives, and the ferrous sulfate blocks calcium, leading to broken bones, rickets, nervousness, convulsions, seizures, and sudden, unexpected death.
The manufacturer of the Puppy Formula has changed the way they manufacture their product. Some of the latest research by an independent Rehab Organization has found some very serious problems with the new product that can cause everything from bowel obstruction, intestinal infections and prolapsed rectums, not to mention some serious malnutrition problems in baby squirrels.
This new report sheds light on problems experienced by wildlife rehabilitators who fed formula made with Esbilac® powder last year, as well offering suggestions about how they may be able to use it with better results. The research, by Allan and Shirley Casey of Colorado, suggests a decrease in solubility, among other issues, may have caused gastrointestinal and growth problems seen in squirrels, opossums and other wildlife species. 

Esbilac® powder, a milk replacer designed for puppies, is manufactured by PetAg of Hampshire, IL. The powder is commonly used as a base for milk-replacer formulas fed to orphaned wild mammals in rehabilitation, sanctuaries, and zoos. The problems surfaced after the company changed their drying process in December 2008. As a result of the new process, the powder no longer dissolved as easily when mixed with warm water and used immediately.
The authors found that mixing the powder with very hot water, adding fats and probiotics and letting it sit in the refrigerator for at least four hours before using appears seems to help solve many of the GI problems that resulted in sickly wild mammals last summer. The fats were added to make the formula more closely resemble mother’s milk from squirrels, raccoons and rabbits. The probiotics helped break down milk proteins, making them easier to digest, as well as improve overall digestion and GI health. 



I have some alternatives to this until the 20/50 formula arrives and is really easy to make at home. Proven and very nutrious for squirrels.

[pappy1264]

Thank you for posting this. Sadly, we have seen many people with squirrels who used this formula and many lost their babies. If you have alternatives, please share. (if you would rather not post openly, you could pm them to me or email me at pappy1264@yahoo.com)