Help with two disabled baby flyers

[Brisby]

Hello, I need help with two baby flyers roughly 5 weeks old, going by the fact that their incisors have erupted and their eyes are open.

I have separated the mother from them because it appears she has been biting at their back paws, evidence being I saw her bitting on one after grooming them a bit. One has a whole foot of toes and two on the other; and the other baby has but one toe left counting them both. :( I have NOT made contact with them in any way beforehand, and had just seen them yesterday.

I have separated the mother from them, and am attempting to raise them the rest of the way myself, so far without any luck. I have fed babies 8+ weeks before, but not ones roughly 5 weeks. They haven't eaten in the past twelve or so hours from the formula. Whenever I go to give it to them, they reject it.

The formula itself consists of alternative milk powder for puppies, some whipping cream for fat, and water to distillate the mixture. I fed this exact formula to their parents over a year ago, and it never caused me any problems.

Help please? I am lost.

[Ardilla]

I was going to phone muffinsquirrel, our resident flyer expert, but I see she's online and reading this thread.

Could you give us more info about the squirrels? Is the mother tame? How long have you had her?

I've never heard of anything like this happening.

[muffinsquirrel]

Hi, and welcome to the board. Where in Texas are you located? I am in southeast Texas, about 25 miles above Beaumont. I will PM you with my number so you can phone if necessary.

Going 12 hours without food isn't good. Try them on some pedialyte, if you have any. Or use the recipe for homemade 'pedialyte'. (I'll go look that recipe up and post it for you.) This will keep them from dehydrating, which is the biggest danger at this point.

Are you using the Esbilac Puppy replacement food? That is about the only thing we recommend here. Do you have them with their box or cage half on a heating pad? (Make sure it's one that DOES NOT have the automatic shut-off feature.) They won't eat if they aren't warm, and if the formula is not warm. Remember, the momma's body temp. is around 100%, so that's how warm they need their milk.

If you are not too far away, we could meet somewhere in the middle and I will take the babies. I have been raising flyers for almost 10 years, and rehab squirrels of all sorts, with an occasional bunny or something thrown in for variety! :D

muffinsquirrel

[Brisby]

The mother is tame. I fed the mother myself over a year ago after being weaned from her mother. Though I'd describe her as hyper, but I had always just thought of that through her nature of being a female, them being territorial, as opposed to my much less hyper male.

Also, the wounds on the babies feet seemed to have 'healed up'. They're not fresh. Though, the mother has started biting one of the babies tails it seems.

Also, I live in Orange right near Beaumont. I want to meet, but I cannot drive yet (I'm 17). :\ My mom has offered to bring me if necessary however.

[muffinsquirrel]

Just spoke with him, and am on my way to get the babies. More later.

muffinsquirrel

[Ardilla]

:thumbsup

I hope they're going to be OK. Poor little things.

[Legomom]

Be safe & :thumbsup to everyone! :grouphug

[Jackie in Tampa]

Be safe and hugs to all!:grouphug

[merman]

Wow, this is good news.. :thumbsup
Hope babies are in good shape..

:wave123

[Brisby]

She just picked them up.

Thank you again Muffinsquirrel.

[muffinsquirrel]

Sorry to be so late, but it's really hectic around here. The two babies are still alive, but they don't look good. I have them on pedialyte every two hours, but it doesn't seem to make much of a difference. Tomorrow I will start them on diluted formula, alternating with pedialyte. It just makes you cry to see them! How could a momma squirrel do this to her babies? The healthier of the two has two toes on one back foot, and 3 on the other (I think). The other one has one toe on one back foot, and is missing NEARLY ALL of his other foot. Both of them have had the tip of their tail chewed off. They are really hard to feed - they look at me like "After all we have been through, now you're gonna poison us too?". It is a 'drop by drop' situation - there is absolutely NO ACCEPTANCE of the syringe and nipple, nor what it contains. I have to kind of sneak up on them and put a drop on their lips and hope they suck in instead of blowing out! They fight me every step of the way! And it's hard to see those tiny mouths when you are crying because they look so pitiful. They have top and bottom teeth, good coats, tails that are filling out well - oh, did I mention that they are each about 16 grams? It is just too sad for words.

Brisby, thank you for letting me have them - I just hope I can get them better. What happened to them is no fault of yours, and I am sure you were horrified when you saw them.

Everyone - prayers and good thoughts are needed for these babies. I really don't expect them to make it - they are so very very thin. It is going to be a long, tearful night. I'll check back in tomorrow sometime, but it may be late. I'll stay up tonight, and then, after Lance wakes up I will sleep and he will wake me up to feed again.

muffinsquirrel

[muffinsquirrel]

HURRAH!!!!!!!!!
:jump :jump :jump :jump :jump

They BOTH licked the pedialyte from the nipple at the last feeding!!! I am SO excited and happy! They took nearly 1 cc each. AND....then they both peed! I feel so much better. And they were both much more alert and lively. Keep your fingers crossed for them.

muffinsquirrel

[Jackie in Tampa]

:grouphug :grouphug :grouphug :grouphug I am lurking and sending every bit of POSITIVE VIBES I have to you three Muffin!:grouphug
I have never heard/seen a momma do that,I am in shock. Poor sweet mini's.
Good Luck and Thank you:grouphug


Thank you Brisby and Muffin!

[Legomom]

Those poor sweet babies...it just breaks my heart to hear about them.
Poor things are probably afraid that the nipple is going to start biting them.
Give each of them some nuzzling & kisses for me. :grouphug

[Ardilla]

Oh, Muffin, that first update from you was so sad, I my eyes started watering up here at work. Luckily school hasn't started yet--don't want students seeing me cry. But your next post made me smile! Tons of positive vibes for these little guys. I hope they've perked up with the rehydration and will now eat--sounds like they really need it!

:grouphug :grouphug :grouphug

Brisby, thank you SO MUCH for posting here on TSB. If anyone can get these poor babies through their ordeal, it's Muffinsquirrel.

[psychobird]

oh poor poor babies, i know hookbills will sometimes over preen babies and take toes and feathers, maybe that's what she was doing, or she felt stressed somehow. i have heard of other rodents eating their young for whatever reason, i don't see why flyers would be any different.
did you start them on a antibiotic?? flushing the area with diluted nolvasan twice a day will help fight infection also.
that must have hurt so bad, my heart hurts thinking about it

[island rehabber]

Bless you, muffinsquirrel! If anyone can turn them around, you can! I'll bet once they are hydrated they get a new-found appetite for their formula.....hoping and praying! :thumbsup

[muffinsquirrel]

:D They had their first feeding of diluted formula this morning!! Took it right on down, like they had been doing it every day for years! AND......they had pees and poops! I was so excited - you would have thought the Queen of England had called and invited me to tea! Today they are like two entirely different babies - eyes bright, exploring a little bit, and drinking down that formula! (Did I mention that they are taking their formula now? :D ) Although it is raining here right now, and will be for several days, all I see when I look outside is a beautiful, sunny day!

muffinsquirrel

[Ardilla]

All that's well and fine, MS, but are they taking their formula???

;)

Such great news! I'm sure you've been beyond patient in getting them to the point they understand the nipple is good and won't hurt them. And WOO HOO for POOPS!

[Legomom]

:alright.gif :alright.gif Just what I needed...wonderful, beautiful news. :wott Yeah!! Keep it up little ones & you'll be ruling Momma Muffin in no time! :jump

[Cleo_13]

I'm so glad they are in your hands. Poor little babies... Any idea why the mother would do that?

[Brisby]

:flash3 This is Brisby's mom I thank God for good people like muffinsquirrel.

When my son came down stairs at after 11:30 pm while I was asleep he woke me and told me he saw the mom biting on one of the babies feet and that the baby had made a sqeaking sound. He then said that she had bitten off the toes on one foot and that he had seperated the mother from her kittens. I was absolutely horrified.

We immediately went to Wal-Mart and got the stuff we had fed the mother and father during their infancy. We got home a little before 1:00 am and my son tried to get them to eat he was so upset. I do not know what had caused the mother to do this. I had told my son not to touch them because i know that as a kid i was warned of that as well.

I know some animals do things that do not make sense. We googled squirrels biting feet, mothers biting their babies, all to no luck. We were both upset. I am so glad he was able to get someone who could help and I excited that the squirrels are doing well. He loves his squirrels and even though the lady told us they would not breed in captivity, they did anyway. So we had ordered a larger cage to accompany our new arrivals, and we were all in anticipation of them.

I am very thankful for muffinsquirrel. Thank you for helping the squirrels. We appreciate you. I am looking forward to your updates. I was wondering why the breeder said they wouldn't breed in captivity and if anyone knew why the mother did this? She would bite them, appear to be confused when they sqeeked and then continue to groom them before making her way to their feet or tail and biting them again.

:thankyou

:jump :jump :jump :jump :jump :jump

[JFerret]

:flash3 This is Brisby's mom I thank God for good people like muffinsquirrel.

When my son came down stairs at after 11:30 pm while I was asleep he woke me and told me he saw the mom biting on one of the babies feet and that the baby had made a sqeaking sound. He then said that she had bitten off the toes on one foot and that he had seperated the mother from her kittens. I was absolutely horrified.

We immediately went to Wal-Mart and got the stuff we had fed the mother and father during their infancy. We got home a little before 1:00 am and my son tried to get them to eat he was so upset. I do not know what had caused the mother to do this. I had told my son not to touch them because i know that as a kid i was warned of that as well.

I know some animals do things that do not make sense. We googled squirrels biting feet, mothers biting their babies, all to no luck. We were both upset. I am so glad he was able to get someone who could help and I excited that the squirrels are doing well. He loves his squirrels and even though the lady told us they would not breed in captivity, they did anyway. So we had ordered a larger cage to accompany our new arrivals, and we were all in anticipation of them.

I am very thankful for muffinsquirrel. Thank you for helping the squirrels. We appreciate you. I am looking forward to your updates. I was wondering why the breeder said they wouldn't breed in captivity and if anyone knew why the mother did this? She would bite them, appear to be confused when they sqeeked and then continue to groom them before making her way to their feet or tail and biting them again.

:thankyou

:jump :jump :jump :jump :jump :jump



Brisby
I'm so sorry that you and your son had to see this! It sounds to me like the mom is a first time mom and just did not know what to do. I'm no expert in this area either, but, have known ferret breeders that have had this problem with a first time mom. I pray the babies will continue to do well with MS.

Jeanne

[4skwerlz]

Poor babies. :grouphug But they are in absolutely the best, most loving hands possible now. Sending prayers and good thoughts for these little tykes.

Muffinsquirrel is the best!
:bowdown :bowdown :bowdown

[Fireweed]

Brisby...thank you for caring so much!! :grouphug

Muffinsquirrel...thank you for being you! :grouphug

Health and happiness to you, baby flyers!

[RoadRunner]

I know you are busy and all, but we need an update. How are the little things doing??

[Mrs Skul]

:shine Hi Muffinsquirrel I am so excited your little ones are doing so good. It is like the TooCan bird said :wahoo "WOOHOO FOR COCOPOPS" :wahoo Have you thought of names? how about COCO and POPs :jump I am still praying for the little ones to get healthier and healthier. Love that MAMA MUFFINSQUIRREL :Love_Icon See you soon Christal