Converting human antibiotics doses to squirrel equivalents/ I am a math idiot

[valcap]

Hello to all you fine squirrel lovers. I hate to start our relationship off by demanding info from you right off the bat. Did I mention you all look smashing today?
I am a long time animal lover and rescuer, but have never experienced what has turned out to be the absolute JOY of the squirrel experience until last week when a 5 week old baby was dropped into my life. Well, more like i yanked a 5 week old baby out of danger(streetwalker of a neighbor's cat's mouth) and deposited it firmly into my life...but y'all know the story, and have lived some version of it yourselves, i'm sure. By the way, some have accused me of being long-winded...

I have fallen in love with this little guy and done everything by the book so he can grow up strong and healthy to be returned to the backyard he came from when the time comes. However, i believe, despite my best efforts, the esbilac he loves so has been his downfall and he is coming down with the dreaded aspiration pneumonia. Quite suddenly this morning he is clicking a great deal and not wanting to be put into his aquarium house. He is frantic to stay with me, which is unlike him. It is breaking my heart. It may be for warmth, or from fear, or both.

I have on hand a human prescription for Bactrim (actually the generic SMZ) 800-160 tab. I know i can dilute this in water but i cannot figure out what the dosage would be, try as i might. I am not gifted in calculations. I do not know how much he weighs, to further complicate the issue. From my educated guess, he was right around 5 weeks on Saturday,eyes opened, but not steady on his feet by any means. He is a male.

I also have Terramycin for animals in a powder form. I use it for my rescue ducks but again, have no idea how to translate dosage to squirrels. I have packets that contain 10 GRAMS of oxytetracycline per packet. That's a hell of a lot of antibiotic. It's meant to be mixed with drinking water. I'm thinking that's out as on option.

And lastly, i actually have baytril, 22.7 mg prescribed for a dumpster cat, but it expired in 2002. Why do i still have it in my supplies box? I think to inspire false hope for one glorious moment, only to have me crash and burn moments later.

Lastly, I have a hurricane expected here tonight so i really want to make sure Zippy(that's the little squirrel) is squared away before then. I can't bear it if i fail him.

Thanks in advance for all your help.

[FallensMommie]

For them to calculate proper dosage how much does he weigh?

In the mean time keep him warm...do you have a heating pad that you can put under a container.
Are you feeding him premix liquid or powdered Esbilac?
Are you feeding him with a syringe? If with a syringe what size syringe are you using?

[Apple Corps]

valcap - the Bactrim is of no value in treating the pneumonia

Use the Terramycin

The dose is 10mg per pound

If your fuzzer weighs 1/5 pound ( about 6 grams) you need to deliver 2mg

So:

Dissolve the packet in 10 cc of cool water and administer .25 cc of that solution ORALLY now - NOTE that is 1/4 of a cc

[valcap]

Hi Fallens!
I am feeding him powdered esbilac with a syringe. He does have a heating pad set on low, not inside his house, but underneath it.

I do not know his weight, but am currently tearing the house apart trying to find the food scales that used to reside in their proper place.

Thank you for taking the time to respond:)

[Apple Corps]

Also - administer 1 hour BEFORE or 2 hours AFTER any milk or milk replacement feedings - NOT WITH them.

That dose can be administered once a day - more to suggest later but I would get this lil baby on this at once - no time to waste when clicking is heard.


Do you have a 1 cc syringe (NO NEEDLE) ???

[Apple Corps]

Another also - Baytril is the drug of choice - can you get any? The 2002 expiration may be pushing it for use today - but may be worth a try depending on how things go.

The Terramycin solution goes in the fridge - save for only 24 hours - you will need more packets - or - can you get them???

[valcap]

Apple Corps, Thank you so, so much!
I am beside myself with worry about him.

Before i dose him, i want to make sure i am clear that the packet contain 10 GRAMS of antibiotic per packet, not 10 milligrams. Does that make sense?
Thank you so much for responding. I know you regulars respond to people every day with the same questions. And I know that most of the time the people asking the questions do more harm trying to "help" the animal than good.
I also know that the kindest, most decent human beings in the world are the ones who help animals with no thought for return. Thank you.

[valcap]

Apple, I do have the syringes( no needle!) and a butt load of packets of terramycin. And more available. I don't know if my vet office would be willing to prescribe baytril. It would probably depend on which vet is working, actually. One of them would not, one of them might. I will try it and see.

[FallensMommie]

Baytril is the drug of choice as AC stated. Please do contact the vet and ask for it.

[Apple Corps]

valcap - SPEED is CRITICAL now - better to get your current drug regimen started now unless you can get the Baytril w/i a couple of hours. It is Friday.

[Apple Corps]

Apple Corps, Thank you so, so much!
I am beside myself with worry about him.

Before i dose him, i want to make sure i am clear that the packet contain 10 GRAMS of antibiotic per packet, not 10 milligrams. Does that make sense?
Thank you so much for responding. I know you regulars respond to people every day with the same questions. And I know that most of the time the people asking the questions do more harm trying to "help" the animal than good.
I also know that the kindest, most decent human beings in the world are the ones who help animals with no thought for return. Thank you.

Let me check the package labeling again - sit tight

[Apple Corps]

Is the packet 6.4 grams in weight?

[valcap]

Hi, sorry, I am in and out now as i pick up my children from school. Yes, the packet is 6.4 oz. (181.4g)

He is very perky right now. No clicking noise at all, but sneezing here and there.

[Apple Corps]

Good Catch - my MISTAKE - 10 grams not mg.

That sounds like livestock size - can you get Baytril - the teramycin is a massive massive diluting job?

PM me your phone # as I have to leave shortly.

[Apple Corps]

Here is the problem - that packet delivers 10,000 mg of terramycin.

Your fuzzer needs around 2 or 3 mg.

IMO - that is way too big a diluting job to do with enough accuracy - you need lab level measurement glass and even at that......

BTW - you are no math dummy - you caught my error and understand the issue very well :thumbsup :thumbsup

You need to get Baytril if you can - or terramycin in a much smaller dose.

[valcap]

P.M. on the way. Thanks for endless patience:)

[TexanSquirrel]

Are we set here or not? About how much does the baby weigh? What's the dose supposed to be? That baby squirrel can't weigh six grams???:dono

[Apple Corps]

TexanSquirrel :bowdown :bowdown

First of all - an important lesson I learned today is to NOT rush typing and calculating, especially as I am headed out the door :nono :nono

TexanSquirrel is correct - there are

453 grams to the pound
125 grams for 1/2 pound
62 grams for 1/4 pound

The dosage is 2.5 mg for a 1/4 pound fuzzer (62 grams - not 6 grams) :thumbsup

The dosage I calculated is correct assuming the 1/4 pound weight is close - but we still need the weight.

[TexanSquirrel]

My calcs book has 1 pound = 454 grams
That makes 1/4 pound = 113.5 grams

So are we set? I think we need the weight of the squirrel and what the dose should be so we can figure how much to give....

[valcap]

Thanks to everybody who was so quick to help yesterday. I am so guardedly relieved to report that Zippy is doing so well today! After much hand wringing, second-guessing, and time spent calling area vets(my personal one included) explaining the situation and getting turned down, I decided to dose Zippy with the oxytetracycline. I realized that i also had it in tablet form in 100 mg doses. I cut it down to 10 mg, ground it, and dissolved it in distilled water. Gave proper dosage in syringe by mouth to baby and refridgerated the rest.
Held him in my lap on a heating pad, wrapped in blankets, upright most of the night, giving him loving. I was so, so worried.
By the morning his clicking was gone, and he is up and very feisty.
I am giving him pedialyte, and benebac. He seems to be well hydrated.

How many days should I continue with the antibiotics?
He is starving. Can i resume his formula? He is urinating and his stools are normal. (although i'm sure that is getting ready to change, with the antibiotic) Thank you for all your help, both on the forum and through p.m., esp. those of you who were welcoming and supportive:)

[Apple Corps]

That helped a lot - 100 mg vs 10,000 mg :thumbsup

You can continue him on Esbilac but remember to not give the formula and antibiotic together - see my earlier post.

I would continue him on the antibiotic for around 10 days.

A fresh solution is suggested every 24 hours - not sure how critical that is - may just be to sell more drug, may be a real issue.

:thumbsup :thumbsup :thumbsup

[jme2323]

hi there, i am glad to hear zippy seems better. that is good news.

as a dog rescuer, i always thought having some meds on hand would be good, but i am not sure how and where to get them. as a duck rescuer where do you do? would a farm/ feed store be good?

i only had leftover clavamox for my baby- and that wasn't the best and it was too late anyway :( but i have 3 dogs, 3 cats and a goat and really i could stand to have some emergency meds- especially when and if i have another baby i need to help. we live in a very wooded area and i fully expect some orphans sometime. i would like to be ready.

i will always have some esbilac on hand and the supplies and materials i used for vinny...now i know more too, and i think i can assess even quicker what may be needed. i would never use them for anyone with seeking advice/ counsel from very experienced people first (ie you guys!)...but in an emergency you can't rely on a vet to want to deal with your baby and or trust they won't accidentally do it harm with lack of knowledge of their own...and with 7 pets there are some things you really can manage at home.

anyway a recommended place to get meds would be great. plus maybe with my desire and interest in volunteering for other rehabbers, perhaps i will have access to even more supplies and treatments in the future should they be needed.

i would like advice on working with rehabbers too, if anyone can offer....but i should probably start another thread, or check out the old ones..as there are bound to be some i am sure.

anyway here's to zippy. best wishes for continued success, and for our ducks. i plan to raise some soon...when we get our pond cleaned up :)

thanks.
jme

[valcap]

Hi jme!
My heart just breaks for you and the loss of your sweet girlie. I was just telling my husband how insanely quickly the babies become wrapped around your heart. The first day I stumbled upon Zippy being mauled in my flower bed, i was struck by his adorableness, but glad to recieve the local rehabber's # from the pet shop where i bought his Esbilac. When they didn't return my call that night or next day, i was okay, because i was enjoying the experience. By the third day in, I was emotionally invested. To say the least.
Perhaps there is another little Squirrel soul waiting for you to find it right now...These crazy, life-changing experiences always seem to happen out of the blue, at the most random times, don't they?

As far as the antibiotics and supplies for my ducks, I get it from two places. I order their feed from a old-fashioned true feed store, because they special order the Masuzuri brand of waterfowl feed for me, which is the gold standard for ducks. Most of my other supplies I get at Tractor Supply. They have a limited range of medicines, antibiotics and vaccines available without a prescription. Basic penicillin, a couple of different varieties of broad spectrum antibiotics(but i personally prefer the terramycin). They have them in injectable or pillform, and some of them in powder form, which you dissolve in large tubs of drinking water for waterfowl.(or cows or pigs, etc) I am comfortable giving shots to the ducks, dogs, cat, bunny, but i just couldn't do it with Zippy. He's so tiny. It would have been so much easier, accuracy-wise. I chickened out, though.

If you do end up getting ducks, let me know if i can help you out in any way. I adore them. Although, suddenly squirrels are creeping up high on my favorites list!

You know it's funny, the night before i found the cat attacking Zippy, my Mother was visiting and I told her I was looking into getting a wildlife rehabber liscense. I'm not so sure about that anymore. I don't do detachment well, apparently.
Hope you are having a peaceful weekend.