What can this be?

[Mads]

One of the Fab 5 is looking horrible with these bumps all over his face and some on his legs and chest as well. The others look fine, just one is like this. What on earth could of happened? Can anybody give me an idea??
44574

44575

[pamela lee]

God Love it! Poor baby. I'm no expert but I believe it looks like Squirrel Pox. There are several threads here talking about treatment and care of poxy squirrels. Good luck and I'll be thinking about and praying for your baby.

[island rehabber]

Mads that could be squirrel pox. I will defer to those here who have actually seen it, as I have never, but that's my first guess. Can you recapture him for treatment?

[Mads]

I'm not sure that he could be caught now. He's a bit on the wild side.

[JLM27]

If it is squirrel pox it is a deadly and contagious disease. You should do all you can (maybe a havaheart trap?) to catch him and treat him and quarantine him ASAP from the rest. I'm not an expert, but I read other threads on this. Move fast!

[SkwerlGirl]

Aw, bless his little bones :shakehead

Catch him quick and treat him, before he spreads it to the rest of the community and they all die :shakehead

GOOD LUCK!!! :Love_Icon

[Buddy'sMom]

Mads, it looks to me as well like the pox pictures we have seen (if anyone thinks it looks like something else --- please jump right in and say so!). But, DON'T PANIC, since we now have treatments that have proven successful in numerous cases.

A few questions so we can figure out how you can best proceed:

1. Do the 5 still live together in one nest or nestbox, or have they gone their separate ways? It appears that close physicaly contact with an infected squirrel or their scabs or lesions would be the way it could be transmitted sq-to-sq. NOT by casual proximity.

2. Think very carefully whether it might be possible to trap him and keep him in a release cage for a week or two. That will make treatment MUCH easier and give you more options.

3. If not, does he still come to you for food? Is it possible he would take a piece of food from you TWICE A DAY, EVERY DAY for a while? This is not preferred since it is a bit haphazard, and your schedule might not coincide with his. But it might be possible.

4.Do you have a friendly vet for them? With the right info and guidance, you might be able to get a prescription for what you need to treat him. If you are without access to a vet, if you PM your location to me we may be able to get what you need. :)

There are other things you can do in general to help all of them -- we'll get to that later.

:grouphug :grouphug :grouphug :grouphug :grouphug :grouphug :grouphug :grouphug

[Mads]

Mads, it looks to me as well like the pox pictures we have seen (if anyone thinks it looks like something else --- please jump right in and say so!). But, DON'T PANIC, since we now have treatments that have proven successful in numerous cases.

A few questions so we can figure out how you can best proceed:

1. Do the 5 still live together in one nest or nestbox, or have they gone their separate ways? It appears that close physicaly contact with an infected squirrel or their scabs or lesions would be the way it could be transmitted sq-to-sq. NOT by casual proximity.

2. Think very carefully whether it might be possible to trap him and keep him in a release cage for a week or two. That will make treatment MUCH easier and give you more options.

3. If not, does he still come to you for food? Is it possible he would take a piece of food from you TWICE A DAY, EVERY DAY for a while? This is not preferred since it is a bit haphazard, and your schedule might not coincide with his. But it might be possible.

4.Do you have a friendly vet for them? With the right info and guidance, you might be able to get a prescription for what you need to treat him. If you are without access to a vet, if you PM your location to me we may be able to get what you need. :)

There are other things you can do in general to help all of them -- we'll get to that later.

:grouphug :grouphug :grouphug :grouphug :grouphug :grouphug :grouphug :grouphug

The fab 5 have all gone their seperate ways at this point. They join up on the deck together every now and then, although the 3 males are seen more than the 2 females. They no longer use the nest box I provided them.

I'm not sure that a capture would be good. I'm thinking that to feed him by hand with something he likes would be easier that to capture. But, I don't have a vet here that I would trust ...in CT we are an illegal state, and I am not a rehabber. What would I need to treat?

Also , been looking at the fly bot possibilities, and that also seems like it could be that. He doesn't appear to be sickly.....and eats peanuts vigorously like the others....he's running away quickly when he needs to when he sees the dog.

[wheezer]

That is definitely pox. I believe the best thing that can be done is good nutrition. Also many places on the board deal with this. This to me is the worst case ever and he was cured:thumbsup Check it out:http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11364&highlight=benny
I know some have used some hard core drugs which probably helped for sure. Some rehabbers think giving them heavy drugs could weaken their immune system but who knows. But others also cured them without these drugs so I would say it is up to you what route to take. Hopefully you can get meds in certain foods for your little one. Good Luck!:grouphug

[Buddy'sMom]

Bot fly warbles have an opening in each of them. I didn't see any in most of the lesions, though there was one that had a dark area. I wasn't sure whether we could see all the angles. Have you been able to look closely? Or is the picture as close as you have gotten. Also, it would be unusual (I think) to have that many bot fly warbles. There are a couple of Bot Fly threads where you could look at pictues ... in specific ailments.

It's good that he has a good appetite -- good sign that he isn't feeling too bad.

One of the things Jackie did was "supportive care" for her wilds -- easy access to water and lots of healthy food. And for the water, she put out "NutraFeron Tea" ... made from NutraFeron, a (human) immune system booster available from Shaklee. Here is some background info that I posted in the Sq. Pox thread:


However .... Shaklee Corp (www.shaklee.com) has a plant based interferon patented under the name Nutriferon. It was developed by the man that identified interferon. Nutriferon is a dietary supplement claimed to boost the body's natural interferon (it does not actually contain interferon, just boosts the body's production). Its ingredients include pumpkin seed extract, safflower seed extract, Asian plantain seed extract, and Japanese honeysuckle flower extract. It is readily obtainable (I'm working on that now to see the fastest way to get it to Jackie) and very affordable. Shaklee products are reputable and trusted.

It has been clinically tested to show none of the other's side effects. Shaklee does not promote their products for critter use. There are no formal recommendations from the rehab community. But it HAS been used in critters (not necessarily for squirrel pox …) with good results.

>From my VERY fast review of websites about this, and from other info that I trust, it seems worth a try.

Some of her wilds got pox; some did not. Of the "pox squirrels" some got a very mild case (just a few lesions). For most of the wilds, this is all she was able to do. We have no idea, of course, whether they would have fought it off on their own, but believe the healthy food (readily available so they didn't expend a lot of energy searching for it) and the "tea" must have given them a hand in fighting off the disease.

NutraFeron is avialble only through Shaklee distributors. We were able to find distributors in Jackie's area through listings via the Shaklee website. Then called til we found one that had it available and could meet Jackie with a bottle (I seem to recall a bottle was about $50-60 :dono )

Prescription meds really can only be given if they can be dosed somewhat reliably -- very hard with free wilds. Acyclovir needs to be given twice a day. The Gleevec was once a day, which made it easier, but is riskier, more experimental (Rachel lived, got better and appears healthy -- she's the only one that was treated with it).

There is also Nystop powder --- would you be able to handle him to put it on? Or is he too wild to sit still for that?

:grouphug

[Buddy'sMom]

Oh no...it does look like pox. :( Do you have stagnant water around your place? If I was you, I would contact Loopy Squirrel and see what she has to say, and maybe she can help you out. I really think this baby MUST be caught and treated immediately.
I aree it looks like pox -- and sent Loopy a PM asking her to look at the pictures and confirm pox (in the faint hope that I was wrong and there was something else it could be ....). But I think we are all recognizing what we are looking at. :shakehead

Mads ... would you be able to handle him enough for eye medication? Loopy has used antibiotics for badly infected eyes, and he has quite a few around his eye. Keep a watch on that -- if the lesions begin to close his eyes he really should be trapped and treated as he won't be safe if he can't see :Love_Icon )

:grouphug

[Mads]

I don't think I can handle him. Certainly not around his eyes. I've not touched the babies since before their release. I wanted them to be wild......I guess now, it would be great if they could still be handled. I'll check up on the shaklee products.

[TexanSquirrel]

I'm sorry to see this. Best of luck with him!

[Loopy Squirrel]

That definitely looks like pox. It doesn't look that bad, yet. It's hard to say with pox because each squirrel is affected differently. Some have mild cases which really don't need much interventions and others have it so bad that they are on deaths door. The problem is that it is hard to tell which squirrels are more compromised by just looking. A squirrel could only have a few lesions but be very sick and another can have many but still have strength and energy. Most of the ones I get are at the point of no return. I do not believe they would survive w/out intervention. If they were able they would not have been caught. It is always better to try to treat because at least this way you can guarantee that they they will get their meds and at least good nutrition. Even though these squirrels have been out for awhile I think that they'd suffer much less stress being captured than a truely wild squirrel. I worry sometimes that my wild ones suffer more stress just being handled and in captivity. It might be a comfort to your squirrel who is familiar w/ you to be in your care that way he doesn't feel like he has to compete w/ other healthy squirrels which can bring on more stress as wild animals hide their sickness until the very end stages. Some squirrels can get over this w/ only antibiotics for secondary infections and supportive nutritional and homeopathic care. I have been using the acyclovir for two reasons, number one I wanted to try it in the severly affected to see if it does work and if this could possibly be a new treatment option and secondly the squirrels that I recently received were very bad off and the old treatment protocol would only have prolonged their suffering and would not have been a cure. The acyclovir is a precription but you could probably get it from a regular doctor if you can't get it from a vet. I have heard some people on TSB who have close relationships w/ their family doctors and can get scripts for different meds. If you can get a hold of him, I am sure we all can figure a way to help you. I was just looking back at the pics and I did notice his eye is cloudy. This can and will be a problem because if you don't treat the ulceration he can loose the sight in that eye. If that eye is affected I am sure he'll sratch the other and both will end up w/ ulcerations. That is my biggest problem right now w/ the pox squirrel I currently have. Both eyes were severly affected and it's been well over a week of treatment and I am finally beginning to see a response to the eye meds.. It is still too early to tell if he'll be able to see well or not.

[Buddy'sMom]

I don't think I can handle him. Certainly not around his eyes. I've not touched the babies since before their release. I wanted them to be wild......I guess now, it would be great if they could still be handled. I'll check up on the shaklee products.
I didn't quite understand the Shaklee ordering system, but you might find that it's easier to order through someone that is already a participant -- if that's the case, let us know and we can work that out. One bottle lasted Jackie through the active pox outbreak in her yard, and she was putting lots of it out.

I need to log off for an hour or so but will check back a little later.

BTW -- don't second guess yourself about handling them or not as they were released .... it was the right thing to do and they are probably all well adjusted wild squirrels as a result. Even in Jackie's case where some of her wilds and releases would come sit on her lap, take food, she was not able to handle them enough or rely on them ALWAYS coming, to treat with meds. Really, you need either a very tame squirrel or one that is caged for the treatment duration.

:grouphug :Love_Icon :grouphug

[Buddy'sMom]

Thanks, Loopy!!

Mads, Loopy is a rehabber in FLorida that recently has seen and cared for a number of squirrels with pox (see Lylith's thread in the infirmary -- this is one that was recently released back to the wild).

:grouphug

[Mads]

That definitely looks like pox. It doesn't look that bad, yet. It's hard to say with pox because each squirrel is affected differently. Some have mild cases which really don't need much interventions and others have it so bad that they are on deaths door. The problem is that it is hard to tell which squirrels are more compromised by just looking. A squirrel could only have a few lesions but be very sick and another can have many but still have strength and energy. Most of the ones I get are at the point of no return. I do not believe they would survive w/out intervention. If they were able they would not have been caught. It is always better to try to treat because at least this way you can guarantee that they they will get their meds and at least good nutrition. Even though these squirrels have been out for awhile I think that they'd suffer much less stress being captured than a truely wild squirrel. I worry sometimes that my wild ones suffer more stress just being handled and in captivity. It might be a comfort to your squirrel who is familiar w/ you to be in your care that way he doesn't feel like he has to compete w/ other healthy squirrels which can bring on more stress as wild animals hide their sickness until the very end stages. Some squirrels can get over this w/ only antibiotics for secondary infections and supportive nutritional and homeopathic care. I have been using the acyclovir for two reasons, number one I wanted to try it in the severly affected to see if it does work and if this could possibly be a new treatment option and secondly the squirrels that I recently received were very bad off and the old treatment protocol would only have prolonged their suffering and would not have been a cure. The acyclovir is a precription but you could probably get it from a regular doctor if you can't get it from a vet. I have heard some people on TSB who have close relationships w/ their family doctors and can get scripts for different meds. If you can get a hold of him, I am sure we all can figure a way to help you. I was just looking back at the pics and I did notice his eye is cloudy. This can and will be a problem because if you don't treat the ulceration he can loose the sight in that eye. If that eye is affected I am sure he'll sratch the other and both will end up w/ ulcerations. That is my biggest problem right now w/ the pox squirrel I currently have. Both eyes were severly affected and it's been well over a week of treatment and I am finally beginning to see a response to the eye meds.. It is still too early to tell if he'll be able to see well or not.


This medication, acyclovir, I'm seeing that is used in treating herpes...is that correct?? If I know somebody with herpes, and they have this medication, can that be used??

[Mads]

NutraFeron is avialble only through Shaklee distributors. We were able to find distributors in Jackie's area through listings via the Shaklee website. Then called til we found one that had it available and could meet Jackie with a bottle (I seem to recall a bottle was about $50-60 )

I just ordered this.....hopefully it's be here soon...maybe I'll try some white tea for today. That builds the immune system..

[Buddy'sMom]

This medication, acyclovir, I'm seeing that is used in treating herpes...is that correct?? If I know somebody with herpes, and they have this medication, can that be used??
Yes, the medication is the same (acyclovir is primarily(solely maybe) approved as a human medicine, but has been finding some application in critters). The dosage would need to be adjusted, but we could figure the math out once you know the amount in the tablet.

Acyclovir should be given twice a day at minimum. Will he come to you for food twice a day?

It will be dissolved so it will be a liquid. Not really something that could be coated on a nut. Not sure it would mix with peanut butter even. When we were considering it for Jackie's sqs., I thought it might be possible to load the dose in a syringe and then inject it into a small piece of watermelon or grape or something like that. Are these foods that appeal to him enough that he would take it and eat it? Possibly it could be put on a small piece of bread if that would appeal. I know he has been weaned for quite some time, but if the smell/taste of Esbilac would interest him, it could be mixed with a little and put on a bit of bread.

:grouphug :Love_Icon :grouphug

[Buddy'sMom]

NutraFeron .... I just ordered this.....hopefully it's be here soon...maybe I'll try some white tea for today. That builds the immune system..
:thumbsup :thumbsup

Building their immune system is helpful. Not all squirrels who are exposed do get the disease and some fight it off without getting too sick. There may be many factors in that, but presumably squirrels with good immunity generally would do better. Offering a heathy diet and immune system support may be the very best you can offer to those that are running free.

Since the Fab 5 were released, you might not have paid too much attention to 4skwerls' recipe for "squirrel blocks" -- nutritionally sound food for those sqs that turn their noses up at rodent block. This gives them most of the nutrients they need in one place and you might consider making a batch to hand out on the deck. :) (But be forewarned that there are many supplements to buy and it would be a bit pricey to acquire them and then just make a batch or two ....:tilt )

:grouphug :Love_Icon :grouphug

[FallensMommie]

I thought squirrel pox too. My prayers are with you, I'm no expert so just here to show my support.

How about Benny's story:
http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11364&highlight=benny

[Mads]

:thumbsup :thumbsup

Building their immune system is helpful. Not all squirrels who are exposed do get the disease and some fight it off without getting too sick. There may be many factors in that, but presumably squirrels with good immunity generally would do better. Offering a heathy diet and immune system support may be the very best you can offer to those that are running free.

Since the Fab 5 were released, you might not have paid too much attention to 4skwerls' recipe for "squirrel blocks" -- nutritionally sound food for those sqs that turn their noses up at rodent block. This gives them most of the nutrients they need in one place and you might consider making a batch to hand out on the deck. :) (But be forewarned that there are many supplements to buy and it would be a bit pricey to acquire them and then just make a batch or two ....:tilt )

:grouphug :Love_Icon :grouphug

I just made a batch of squirrel scones. They will eat them much better than rodent block. I added a nutrient from solid gold , sea meal, which I use with my dog. I also put out some water spiked with pommegranite....they are liking that fine.

[Buddy'sMom]

:D Rodent block wasn't a big hit here, either, with Buddy. To say the least. :yuck :D

Not sure which of the scone recipes you use -- they have evolved a bit in an effort to add nutrients. GammasBaby's "healthier version" is good -- the Esbilac gives a good nutritional punch. I'm not familiar with the Solid Gold product, though I took a quick look at their website -- it's intriguing. I have been making GB's modified scone recipe with some added ground rodent block -- about 1/4 cup can be added without being noticeable.

One thing you should try to monitor with them, as best you can, is whether they seem to be having any breathing problems. Loopy Squirrel has seen breathing problems with the squirrels she has treated. As she mentioned, they have been quite bad off when they arrived in her care. We aren't really sure whether it's just the very sick ones that develop it, as a part of the disease or as a secondary infection. This was not seen in Jackie's squirrels, so it isn't always a part of the disease. But if breathing problems develop, an antibiotic would be in order.

:grouphug :Love_Icon :grouphug

[Apple Corps]

Mads - I've lost track - can you cage the poor lil pox squirrel or is it toooooooo wild to catch now?

[Girl Squirrel]

I have dealt with pox in rehab and seen in it my wild squirrels. One wild one I was dealing with had only a few lesions and since he would take food from me, I made sure to give him nutritional food. Since he was not used to the lesions he tried to scratch them off. This caused an infection in his cheek which brought him down fast. He was no longer able to eat and died from the infection. Once I had noticed the infection I did try to catch him but he caught on fast and would no longer let me get that close again. Next time I would try to catch the squirrel right away. Along with good nutrition they need a lot of rest for their body to fight off this virus. They may hate being in a cage but it is their best chance at recovery.

[Tomo]

It looks like squirrel pox. There has been an outbreak in Florida and my kid's doctor, Dr. P., sent me these photos. Looks like it!

[Jackie in Tampa]

:thumbsup
:wave123 Hello Mads, all excellent postings. The bottom line is twice a day faithfully...the only way is caged.....I tried to treat another sq besides Rachel with Gleevac, her name was Madge. I had hoped to be able to use the gleevac on her because it was only once a day. But She suddenly started being scarce somedays, I did manage to get in a couple doses. Madge had bad lesions on her eyes. I wanted so to help her, but she was not reliable. As it turned out Madge was the last to show signs of pox but is back to her old self:) .I really had originally wanted to treat them all, but reality is, if you can't get them in the cage....then the nutriferon in their water and veggies, nuts, good food are the best that you can do for your babies. I bleached all community areas and feeders daily, no standing water...
I also would recommend you catch this little boy immediately. IMMEDIATELY.
TSB has a massed alot of knowlege concerning pox in recent months. And many superb choice people devoted ALOT to get us to this point...and alot has been gained in 4 or 5 months due to the dedicated compiling of so many people efforts.
We've pretty much all, vets included, decided that acyclovir is the most promising virus med. I may get grief for this..but I would recommend Baytril..even knowing it puts a damper on their immune system, blah blah...the sq needing antibiotics for a secondry bacterial infection need treatment.Kick it's ass fast. This virus does not waste time doing damage. Kick it's ass fast. Big Dog Baytril.
If you have available acyclovir. It would need to be dosed. Buddys'Mom or AC have that on hand, and could be administered via food. But must be faithful twice aday dose. Girl you gotta trap that sq...:poke Home Depot has havahart traps, try using their old release cage, maybe booby trap it. Good luck catching him. Pm me with an update.TSB is behind you 100% Alot is available to help you.:Love_Icon
Gotta get up early and get him!:grouphug

[tatcat]

hey darlin, jackie knows what she is talking about...listen to her!!!:thumbsup

[Mads]

:thumbsup
:wave123 Hello Mads, all excellent postings. The bottom line is twice a day faithfully...the only way is caged.....I tried to treat another sq besides Rachel with Gleevac, her name was Madge. I had hoped to be able to use the gleevac on her because it was only once a day. But She suddenly started being scarce somedays, I did manage to get in a couple doses. Madge had bad lesions on her eyes. I wanted so to help her, but she was not reliable. As it turned out Madge was the last to show signs of pox but is back to her old self:) .I really had originally wanted to treat them all, but reality is, if you can't get them in the cage....then the nutriferon in their water and veggies, nuts, good food are the best that you can do for your babies. I bleached all community areas and feeders daily, no standing water...
I also would recommend you catch this little boy immediately. IMMEDIATELY.
TSB has a massed alot of knowlege concerning pox in recent months. And many superb choice people devoted ALOT to get us to this point...and alot has been gained in 4 or 5 months due to the dedicated compiling of so many people efforts.
We've pretty much all, vets included, decided that acyclovir is the most promising virus med. I may get grief for this..but I would recommend Baytril..even knowing it puts a damper on their immune system, blah blah...the sq needing antibiotics for a secondry bacterial infection need treatment.Kick it's ass fast. This virus does not waste time doing damage. Kick it's ass fast. Big Dog Baytril.
If you have available acyclovir. It would need to be dosed. Buddys'Mom or AC have that on hand, and could be administered via food. But must be faithful twice aday dose. Girl you gotta trap that sq...:poke Home Depot has havahart traps, try using their old release cage, maybe booby trap it. Good luck catching him. Pm me with an update.TSB is behind you 100% Alot is available to help you.:Love_Icon
Gotta get up early and get him!:grouphug

I didn't see him tonight. I called and called and he didn't come. There is another one that also has some lesions, not as badly, but some.

So Madge , was she treated or not? And it cleared up on it's own? Baytril....? Is that Child's baytril? Over the counter? I don't have access to acyclovir......I'll have to pm Buddy's Mom ......hopefully he comes around tomorrow.

[Apple Corps]

Mads - have you checked your PM from me?

[Sciurus1]

If you want some Acyclovir, I have some I can spare. Just let me know, and where you want it sent to. S1

[Jackie in Tampa]

Good luck this morning:thumbsup

[squirrel princess]

Can't give any advice:dono Hate that you are having to deal with this I remember when Jackie had the outbreak not fun for you are the
squirrels:shakehead Hope you get this under control looks like you have a lot of good help:thumbsup

[Jackie in Tampa]

Mads the plan is in place...we have to have him or them in custody....get busy! The perfect situation would be to have them back in release cage.:) I'll call after things settle down this morning...here!:crazy

POX Busters to the RESCUE...
...hope you can get them!

[Buddy'sMom]

I didn't see him tonight. I called and called and he didn't come. There is another one that also has some lesions, not as badly, but some.

So Madge , was she treated or not? And it cleared up on it's own? Baytril....? Is that Child's baytril? Over the counter? I don't have access to acyclovir......I'll have to pm Buddy's Mom ......hopefully he comes around tomorrow.
Mads, it sounds like you now have sources of acyclovir even though your local contact didn't pan out. But in order to treat them, you must be able to reliably give them dosed food twice a day ... that they will reliably sit and eat, and not go off and bury.

(fyi, acyclovir is an antiviral that stops the virus from multiplying, giving the squirrel's immune system a better chance to fight it off and recover; it doesn't outright kill the virus like an antibiotic would kill bacteria.)

Jackie's Madge was given a few doses of Gleevec. This is a different (human; prescription) drug that also acts to stop the virus. This use of the drug is highly experimental (only two cases so far) and the drug has more serious potential side effects.

"Baytril" is the brand name for a veterinary antibiotic that can be used for squirrels. It is prescription, not available over the counter. It does not affect the pox (which is a virus) but can be used if they develop a secondary infection (such as pneumonia) because they become debilitated from the pox. This is one reason to monitor their overall health, eating, breathing, activity level (and not only the number of pox lesions you see). So that other infections can be treated if needed. Each case seems to be different. Some that Jackie saw were quite mild, only a few lesions and not too much effect on activity. She also had more severely affected squirrels. And it ranges to the very very debilitated squirrels that Loopy has gotten.

I don't want to scare you with the worst cases OR give you potentially false hope with the best cases. It just depends on so many things. But the fact that the Fab 5 were healthy and have nutritional support is definitely in their favor! That may be enough ..... and if you can treat the poxy ones with acyclovir, that will help even more.

But we all need to keep in mind how difficult it is to treat wild squirrels. And trapping and caging them for 2-4 weeks is a balance ..... between helping them with meds and monitoring vs. stressing them so badly it makes them sicker. If caged, treatment will be far easier and more consistent. But if they are not very sick, they may fight tooth and nail to be free -- you would need to keep this in mind and be willing to perhaps set them free again if it becomes too bad. When squirrels are very sick, they don't seem to fight it but accept that they need help. But if they are not that sick, it might be different. On the other hand, the ones with mild cases (and likely to be stressed by confinement) are ALSO those that are in the best shape to fight it off naturally. .............. There are no easy, one-size-fits-all answers here.

:grouphug :Love_Icon :grouphug

[Jackie in Tampa]

Mads, it sounds like you now have sources of acyclovir even though your local contact didn't pan out. But in order to treat them, you must be able to reliably give them dosed food twice a day ... that they will reliably sit and eat, and not go off and bury.

(fyi, acyclovir is an antiviral that stops the virus from multiplying, giving the squirrel's immune system a better chance to fight it off and recover; it doesn't outright kill the virus like an antibiotic would kill bacteria.)

Jackie's Madge was given a few doses of Gleevec. This is a different (human; prescription) drug that also acts to stop the virus. This use of the drug is highly experimental (only two cases so far) and the drug has more serious potential side effects.

"Baytril" is the brand name for a veterinary antibiotic that can be used for squirrels. It is prescription, not available over the counter. It does not affect the pox (which is a virus) but can be used if they develop a secondary infection (such as pneumonia) because they become debilitated from the pox. This is one reason to monitor their overall health, eating, breathing, activity level (and not only the number of pox lesions you see). So that other infections can be treated if needed. Each case seems to be different. Some that Jackie saw were quite mild, only a few lesions and not too much effect on activity. She also had more severely affected squirrels. And it ranges to the very very debilitated squirrels that Loopy has gotten.

I don't want to scare you with the worst cases OR give you potentially false hope with the best cases. It just depends on so many things. But the fact that the Fab 5 were healthy and have nutritional support is definitely in their favor! That may be enough ..... and if you can treat the poxy ones with acyclovir, that will help even more.

But we all need to keep in mind how difficult it is to treat wild squirrels. And trapping and caging them for 2-4 weeks is a balance ..... between helping them with meds and monitoring vs. stressing them so badly it makes them sicker. If caged, treatment will be far easier and more consistent. But if they are not very sick, they may fight tooth and nail to be free -- you would need to keep this in mind and be willing to perhaps set them free again if it becomes too bad. When squirrels are very sick, they don't seem to fight it but accept that they need help. But if they are not that sick, it might be different. On the other hand, the ones with mild cases (and likely to be stressed by confinement) are ALSO those that are in the best shape to fight it off naturally. .............. There are no easy, one-size-fits-all answers here.

:grouphug :Love_Icon :grouphug
:goodpost Thanks BsMom.You have a way with words, exactly what I wanted to say, thanks...
Well Mads there it is...in a nutshell.
TSB is here, full force, what do you think can be done.
I know your sqs are ahead of the game just by having good foods provided by you, on he other hand mothers milk will always have the best source of healthy nutrition and regional immunities. :grouphug
Can you get new pics today?

[Apple Corps]

I agree - comprehensive & well said :thumbsup :thumbsup

[Mads]

I just saw my second little fab 5 that has a few bumps, it's not as much as the one I took photo's of, but it's definitly the same deal. Instead of bringing him a peanut, I brought him a spoon with almond butter. As soon as he licked it once, he then sat there and finished lapping up every last bit of almond butter. ( even as I continued walking around him ) I think the almond butter will work to administer any drugs. As soon as I see the other Fabber .....I will try the same, and he already knows he loves almond butter, so my guess is that he'll also happily lap it off a spoon. Perhaps that would be better than a capture....better for their spirit certainly.

[Buddy'sMom]

:thumbsup :thumbsup

[Jackie in Tampa]

:alright.gif we love almond better.....:D

[Mads]

The weather is terrible here...but I did see my Fabber. He's not looking as bad as I thought he might. His bumps are not really red, his eyes looked good, and I thought they were a bit more opened than they were yesterday. He ate ...loved his almond butter..... his behavior doesn't show a sick squirrel....there didn't seem to be any more bumps nor did they seem larger either. And then another fabber also here , was fine, and showed no signs of pox. I've noticed no pox on the other squirrels either....the really wild ones, (the ones that seem to want to hang on the deck and become one of the Five)...

I did wonder, and I know this is just a "wonder" , but I did see a small hornet nest that the hornets normally build under the bench on the deck, and that nest was torn from the underside of the bench and so I did wonder if the two little male Fabbers had something to do with the nest being torn down and maybe ended up getting stung several times.....I suppose maybe that's wishful thinking on my part though because I would assume somewhat that a squirrel could outrun a bunch of angry hornets.

The other thing that I wondered about was my husband told me that there were little chewing marks on the hose to the gas can and he thinks the Fabbers have been chewing on this. I told my husband that I doubt the Fabbers would want to drink any gasoline, but he's convinced they've been chewing on the hose....?? So, I did think
could these two fabbers been exposed to gas and are having an allergic reaction to it.......

Perhaps it's still early and perhaps other squirrels will start to get some bumps, I don't know, I'm just crossing all T's here.

:injail :injail

[Jackie in Tampa]

Hopefully not...but ears , eyes and toes, also genital areas are affected first, as far as what I have seen. I am only guessing a hornet would have swelled those eyes shut immediately and they would be getting better by now:thinking ...so I am still saying pox:(
gas:dono can't imagine....:shakehead
Glad they are being good little fabbers and coming home and cking in!:) :grouphug
Good Luck and hang in there:)

[Buddy'sMom]

Hornets? :thinking :dono Interesting thought. Perhaps unlikely since I only recal one thread that dealt with a squirrel being stung. But just because it doesn;t usually happen doesn't mean that two youngsters looking for trouble couldn't have found it. :dono (Do those two play/get in trouble together?) If it is from stings, I would think they would start going away pretty quickly now, after an initial redness and swelling. Whereas pox lesions take longer, and usually scab over first, then the scab falls off and the skin heals.

The PLACES are where pox is seen -- but that is largely because it is the exposed areas that can be bitten by mosquitos. It would be the same areas that are accessible to a hornet. Still, I think it is more likely pox.

The gas -- no. If they got any on them, it might redden the area, but not what you are seeing. However, it would not be good for them, and obviously is not good at all for the hose, so I'm guessing hubby has found a new place to store the gas can? :D

that's very good that they are not looking worse today, and are active with good appetites. :thumbsup

[Mads]

It's very good that they both have a good appetite for the almond butter on a spoon! I'm very excited about this. I think to disquise something in almond butter will be easy.....and they both just grab for the spoon to get the almond butter, but of course, they can't carry the spoon, so they do stay in one spot to lick it clean ....

And to answer your question, yes, these two seem to always hang together. I did notice some bumps on the back of the one that I took photo's of. I'm not positive they were there yesterday, but I was more concerned with his face and eyes.