Help with Abandoned Babies

[Nancy in New York]

Okay Nancy,
I better feed the babies & I do still have powdered Esbilac I can mix for them- it just wont have set for 6-8 hrs., although we've never had any trouble with the canned liquid.
So, how much should I start them on? The full 3 cc ea. dose per squirrel? Or smaller doses like the 1/2cc or 1-cc rehydration fluid & then build up?

What is the expiration on the powdered?
Can you buy a new can? I'm just not sure
how long it lasts after the expiration.
We feed according to weight in grams.
Do you have a weight on the little ones?
Going off board for a while, I'm sure others
will be on.

[Treecat]

Nancy,
Since I'm not completely sure about starting them on the formula,
I went ahead and gave them rehydration fluid again. That way I will have enough time to find out how to start the feeding formula right. I would think normally in healthy babies, I would feed a 3.3 or 3.7oz squirrel 3-3.5 oz every 3 or 4 hours about but I don't know on these guys since they're just coming off a day of rehydration fluid at a rate of .5cc every 1 or 2hrs. (overnight).
Do I start them slow at 1 CC & build up? And then, how often?
But is 1 cc every 2 hours going to be enough for a 3 oz baby?
Maybe 2 hours to start & build up to 3 cc every 3 or 4 hours according to their belly size?
Waiting to hear from you.
Thanks!

[SammysMom]

SInce we go by grams, not ounces for feeding, I will say that an ounce is 28g so they are about 84g. 5% would be where you start with formula, so you would give 4.2cc (4.2ml) per feeding about every 3 - 3.5 hours for now and judge how well they are eating and the feedings might need to be spread out a little longer.

[SammysMom]

You want the milk line to be just about gone before you give the next feeding.

[Nancy in New York]

You want the milk line to be just about gone before you give the next feeding.

Just in case you're unsure about the milk line, this is
a "color enhanced" photo, with the milk line between the
2 arrows.

[Treecat]

Hi Nancy,
Am just seeing your post and have only been feeding 1.5 to 2 ccs per feeding every 3 hours with .5 to 1.5 cc of hydration fluid in between, so I guess both feedings combined are still too low. I was afraid to jump them up from 1.5 cc every 2 hours to 4 cc every 3 hours with hydration fluid in between. They are fuzzy so not so easy to see the milk line.
Here's a picture of them together sleeping.

[SammysMom]

That is not nearly enough for them to eat. They really need at least 5% of nutrition (formula) per feeding.

[Nancy in New York]

Hi Nancy,
Am just seeing your post and have only been feeding 1.5 to 2 ccs per feeding every 3 hours with .5 to 1.5 cc of hydration fluid in between, so I guess both feedings combined are still too low. I was afraid to jump them up from 1.5 cc every 2 hours to 4 cc every 3 hours with hydration fluid in between. They are fuzzy so not so easy to see the milk line.
Here's a picture of them together sleeping.

Yes SammysMom is right about the correct amount of formula.
When we hydrate in between we don't count that as part of the 5-7%
of formula feeding.
They will need minimum of 4.2 ccs of formula every 3-3 1/2 hours.
They look well hydrated so I would think you can stop the hydrations in between .

[Treecat]

Great! Thank you so very much!
Whew! I'm still sighing with relief-so wonderful to see them sleeping peacefully!
The babies are becoming more regular with their pottying now too!
Am so glad for The Squirrel board!
Thank you!

[Treecat]

Hi Nancy,
Am worried now because the little girl started having loose bowels this morning.
I never used the canned premix formula.Just the powder, which is still within date.
I have been using distilled water with it though and now I see someone says not to use distilled water. Would that contribute? The little boy is fine.
The little girl went from barely passing stool to now passing light-colored soft mash textured stool.
So far isn't totally runny yet.
Should I start rehydration fluid in between feedings to help keep her from dehydrating?
She also seems to have trouble passing urine still. She dribbles when I stimulate her but doesn't completely empty her bladder. I'm wondering if it's from her trauma when she fell out of the tree onto the rocks.
Someone posted that a squirrel who has sustained injury to the back may not be able to empty their bladder properly.
Her back legs still hang limp most of the time.

[Nancy in New York]

Hi Nancy,
Am worried now because the little girl started having loose bowels this morning.
I never used the canned premix formula.Just the powder, which is still within date.
I have been using distilled water with it though and now I see someone says not to use distilled water. Would that contribute? The little boy is fine.
The little girl went from barely passing stool to now passing light-colored soft mash textured stool.
So far isn't totally runny yet.
Should I start rehydration fluid in between feedings to help keep her from dehydrating?
She also seems to have trouble passing urine still. She dribbles when I stimulate her but doesn't completely empty her bladder. I'm wondering if it's from her trauma when she fell out of the tree onto the rocks.
Someone posted that a squirrel who has sustained injury to the back may not be able to empty their bladder properly.
Her back legs still hang limp most of the time.

No to the distilled water. Just use tap water,
or bottled spring water. Most of use plain tap water.
You have the powdered puppy esbilac, correct?
Are you dissolving it with really hot water and letting it set for 6-8 hours
in the refrig.?
What is the expiration date again?
Do a couple of hydration feedings in between with the little girl.
Make sure the little boy isn't sucking on her, and there isn't a scab forming.
Generally, if sucking is involved, it's on the male for obvious reasons, but
it can happen to little females as well.
Does her tummy show any discoloration from trauma?
If you feel around down her spine and hip area does she seem to have
discomfort?
I don't like the sound of her back legs being limp.
Do you know of anyone that may have Gabapentin?
It's used for seizures and nerve pain.

I have a little one that had no use of his front limbs and
my vet put him on Gabapentin and Metacam.
We have a little female squirrel that was dog caught and
we put her on Gabapentin and Metacam and she did great.

Do you have infant ibuprophen?
We can dose that, and it may help reduce swelling
if there is any.

[Nancy in New York]

Oh one more thing.
If the loose stool continues, try this for a couple of feedings,
and see if that helps.

(Partial) Brat Formula Mix
3 tablespoons (already) mixed formula 2-1
1/2 tsp baby rice powered cereal
1/2 tsp banana baby food.

[Treecat]

This question doesn't need to be directed to only Nancy. She may not be available.
Does anyone else know if it is recommended to give rehydration formula in between formula feedings for babies with loose stool to prevent dehydration?
Also, am suspecting she may have a urinary tract infection. Seems like her urine is kind of cloudy & thought it would help to dilute it.

[Treecat]

GREAT TO HEAR FROM YOU!
Is Brat Formula the name of this mix?
Not sure where to get baby rice pwd cereal. Can I just use rice flour?
I wondered about mashing a banana or purifying it to add. I can look for banana baby food.
So far, Thank God it is not totally liquid -her stool.
Appreciate your getting back to me so quickly.

Oh one more thing.
If the loose stool continues, try this for a couple of feedings,
and see if that helps.

(Partial) Brat Formula Mix
3 tablespoons (already) mixed formula 2-1
1/2 tsp baby rice powered cereal
1/2 tsp banana baby food.

[stepnstone]

GREAT TO HEAR FROM YOU!
Is Brat Formula the name of this mix?
Not sure where to get baby rice pwd cereal. Can I just use rice flour?
I wondered about mashing a banana or purifying it to add. I can look for banana baby food.
So far, Thank God it is not totally liquid -her stool.
Appreciate your getting back to me so quickly.

No, not the same thing. Any grocery or food store that sells baby food will carry the
powered baby rice cereal & jarred banana baby food.

[Treecat]

Yes, I have the powdered puppy Esbilac. We have used it before without problems.
Expiration date is Aug '17
Yes, am dissolving it in hot water in advance 6- 8 hours.
No scabs on little girl.
No swellings or redness anywhere that I can tell.
Her front legs seem to be okay, but she never uses them to help hold the feeding syringe, like the little boy.
Just rests them on my hands.
No pain anywhere when I rub her spine or legs, except she makes little whining sounds after I feed her if her bladder is full. Seems to help when I rub her back.
She often pees just about 5 drops & I feel her bladder is still full, so am trying to stimulate her between feedings.
The vets around her don't seem to know much about squirrels & the zoo vet seems to put anything to sleep that he thinks won't be able to recover fully to survive out in the wild.
So am looking to you guys for the best options.
I can check with a local vet on the Gabapentin.
Thank you.

No to the distilled water. Just use tap water,
or bottled spring water. Most of use plain tap water.
You have the powdered puppy esbilac, correct?
Are you dissolving it with really hot water and letting it set for 6-8 hours
in the refrig.?
What is the expiration date again?
Do a couple of hydration feedings in between with the little girl.
Make sure the little boy isn't sucking on her, and there isn't a scab forming.
Generally, if sucking is involved, it's on the male for obvious reasons, but
it can happen to little females as well.
Does her tummy show any discoloration from trauma?
If you feel around down her spine and hip area does she seem to have
discomfort?
I don't like the sound of her back legs being limp.
Do you know of anyone that may have Gabapentin?
It's used for seizures and nerve pain.

I have a little one that had no use of his front limbs and
my vet put him on Gabapentin and Metacam.
We have a little female squirrel that was dog caught and
we put her on Gabapentin and Metacam and she did great.

Do you have infant ibuprophen?
We can dose that, and it may help reduce swelling
if there is any.

[Nancy in New York]

Can you tell me just the city that you live in?
We have several members in Texas with vets
and with any luck, perhaps one is close to you.

Another thought on the loose stools.
I think that you increased the formula because of their
weight. BUT perhaps we should have told you to do so
slowly, and not all at once. If she is being "overfed" she
may develope loose stools.
How much is she taking at each feeding.

[Treecat]

Ok, good to know. Thanks!
Will have to look in the store then, if it persists.
No loose stool mess this last feeding. We will see.

No, not the same thing. Any grocery or food store that sells baby food will carry the
powered baby rice cereal & jarred banana baby food.

[Treecat]

She is up to 4 ccs now today, but all day yesterday I kept her at 3 or 3.5 max toward the end of the day because of her belly size.
I have had to work up to it according to the roundness of their little tummies. Just couldn't see giving them 4 ccs yet. Would make their bellies tight, so I wasn't.
The boy got to 4 last night, but he is more aggressive and bigger.
The little girl just got there today. Maybe I should back up for her a bit?

Can you tell me just the city that you live in?
We have several members in Texas with vets
and with any luck, perhaps one is close to you.

Another thought on the loose stools.
I think that you increased the formula because of their
weight. BUT perhaps we should have told you to do so
slowly, and not all at once. If she is being "overfed" she
may develope loose stools.
How much is she taking at each feeding.

[Chickenlegs]

I'm sorry--likely missed something--are you expressing her bladder? I'm on the fly but thought I remembered you were helping her to pee. Memory is pfffffft so if I'm just blabbing, forgive. Little paralyzed babies can retain urine and get UTIs like THAT! Water between feedings will help but check her bladder so it's empty after every feeding. Also, if her legs are compromized, warm water therapy might help. Make sure she's healed before exercising her little legs tho.