WARNING DO NOT FEED Fox Valley 32/40

[Nancy in New York]

3 years ago, a discussion was started about pinkies not digesting Fox Valley 32/40 formula.
Since then this has occurred with older babies as well.
Seasoned rehabbers were losing babies, from undigested formula that sat in the babies tummies
like cement, with the milk line never disappearing.

I won't rehash the nightmares this caused.

Most people have since switched over to Powdered Puppy Esbilac for babies under 4 weeks
and some have continued with just the Esbilac until the squirrel is weaned.

This is just a reminder that Fox Valley 32/40 kills many/most pinkies, they cannot digest it.

We've been complacent about alerting members of this, thinking that most already knew.
I believe that after 3 years some felt the problem was rectified, (AS IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN!!!!)
because we don't bring it up.

However, in the past 3 years we have NOT recommended it to ANY new member, and this needs to be
mentioned again as a reminder.

This just happened again to a seasoned rehabber. She fed Fox Valley 32/40 and it sat like cement.
Three of the babies have died.
http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/s...ks-please-read

Discussion from 8/2013

http://thesquirrelboard.com/forums/s...ght=Fox+Valley

IF you have already fed this, a long time member has come up with this protocol below that has helped save his babies.

The trick for me seemed to be getting in as much water, as quickly as possible, once you see and feel the hardness in the belly. Not sugar water or Pedilyte, but plain water. I did this every hour (giving about .2-.3 ml) and ensure you stimulate after each, for 2 reasons. 1. You have to get that water out of the bladder, and it will burst if you don't. 2. You want that water to start working on the crud in the belly. After 8-10 hours, you should start seeing some movement out of the bowel (they will continue to poop, but you will start to see it more watery, which is what you want). At that time, start introducing diluted formula at the ratio of 25% Esbilac, 75% water. Feed this for the first half day. The second half day, I bumped up the ration to 50/50. I fed this for a day and then went to 75% Esbilac, 25% water and introduced full food the next day (and the blockage was gone!). So far, I am at 100% success rate. One note though. I check my pinkies after every feeding, so see if their bellies are hard or squishy. I would suggest everyone get in the habit of checking them after every feeding as habit and you can't go wrong in catching them before they bloat up. Once they take on that angry red color on their bellies (this is when their system goes septic), they are gone and can't be saved, so the trick is to catch them before this happens (hence, getting in the habit to see if their tummies are hard or not).

[island rehabber]

Thank you, Nancy. Having four pinkies right now, and watching their little bodies digest Esbilac just fine, thank you very much, reminded me of the horrors we all experienced with FV 32/40 a few seasons ago.

I believe we all became complacent or just frustrated at the fact that neither FV's owner nor a few others in the wildlife nutrition field seemed to take the problem seriously. Good rehabbers second-guess themselves; many of us thought it was our fault st first, not the formula. But it was SO many babies, and SO many good rehabbers, that there is no longer any doubt in my mind......
IT WAS THE FORMULA.

[Mommaluvy]

Just got a new report from a seasoned good Rehabber in my area.. Our friend ( also a TSB user ) went on vacation and was using the 20/50 per seeing what happened to my pinks and reading old reports here.. . My awesome friend And past mentor was squirrel sitting .. She thought our mutual friend had run out of 20/50 and that's why she sent it ... and put them on 32/40 ( transistoned) ( she is a seasoned Rehabber and I love her.. She just did not do a lot of pinks this year and did not know - we got next to no squirrels this spring )
Anyhow.. She had the same problem I had.

Skeletonal 2 - 3 week olds! Mixed litter of 8 now having the same symptoms as mine!
Half have died. They had been thriving.

I told her what to do to save them.. Let's pray they remaining bounce back.

I am right in thinking this was reported to Nick?

And anyhow .. It seems to me that FV may now be killing older infants not just 10 day and younger.

BTW she did not notice any problems with her possums.. However I did. I lost all ten of my pinky possums on Fv32/40.

[Nancy in New York]

Just got a new report from a seasoned good Rehabber in my area.. Our friend ( also a TSB user ) went on vacation and was using the 20/50 per seeing what happened to my pinks and reading old reports here.. . My awesome friend And past mentor was squirrel sitting .. She thought our mutual friend had run out of 20/50 and that's why she sent it ... and put them on 32/40 ( transistoned) ( she is a seasoned Rehabber and I love her.. She just did not do a lot of pinks this year and did not know - we got next to no squirrels this spring )
Anyhow.. She had the same problem I had.

Skeletonal 2 - 3 week olds! Mixed litter of 8 now having the same symptoms as mine!
Half have died. They had been thriving.

I told her what to do to save them.. Let's pray they remaining bounce back.

I am right in thinking this was reported to Nick?

And anyhow .. It seems to me that FV may now be killing older infants not just 10 day and younger.

BTW she did not notice any problems with her possums.. However I did. I lost all ten of my pinky possums on Fv32/40.

Oh you are definitely right about it killing even older babies.
That's why we say DO NOT USE FV 32/40 for anything, EVER!!!!!!!!!!

Nick was made aware of this by MANY people WAY back in 2013 when it started.
Still he chose to do nothing, and repeated that he was unaware of any problem.

Praying for the little innocent lives that are struggling to survive.

EDIT:

When we were told to go with the NEW Esbilac, in 2013 the member that mentioned the great results was a licensed Georgia rehabber.
She specifically said to look for the Dried Whey Protein Concentrate on the Powdered Puppy Esbilac.
I recently wrote this below:

I remember when this member came on, that I took note that she mentioned DRIED WHEY PROTEIN.
I compared it to the FV 32/40 which has dried milk protein, while the Fox Valley 20/50 has
DRIED WHEY PROTEIN CONCENTRATE.
Both Esbilac and Fox Valley 20/50 have DRIED WHEY PROTEIN CONCENTRATE.

Here's her post from 2013

I have had issues with FV setting up in the little ones guts and within a day or two they pass. I personally am not a fan of FV because Nick uses HIGH FRUCTOSE CORN SYRUP in squirrel milk.......this is something that I think is causing poor growth rates and diarrhea. It is NOT something that I eat and I am certainly NOT giving it to my little guys!
Now I am going to say that I have recently (along with several other seasoned rehabbers) tried the NEW Esbilac that has probiotics and Dried Whey Protein Concentrate!!! You have to look on the label to make sure of what you are getting!!!

Finally once again I am having the fat necked babies that are flourishing......one of my girls gained 7 grams yesterday!!!

I know what Esbilac has been and done in the past but they have changed the formula, who knows if it is because of all the phone call and flack that they got from rehabbers.......all I can say is it has changed and changed for the better.

I am getting fantastic weight gains, much less poo (not nearly as hard as when they are on FV) which makes me think they are absorbing/utilizing more of the nutrients.

I have tried everything on the market.......FV, MultiMilk, Old Esbilac, Century 21, Zoologic......and every mixture in between.

So far this is giving me the results of the Old Esbilac and the Old MulitMilk.

In case anyone wants to try I am mixing 2:1 Water to powder and adding in 1/8 part cream once they are up to 25 grams.

**** I have not tried this on anything under 20 grams, so I am not speaking for the pinkies but I would have to think it is better and my little ones dying from FV!!!

Good Luck !!!
Christy

[Nancy in New York]

I just took out the word pinkies in this thread's title,
just to make it clear.
Thank you Mommaluvy!!!!!!!!!!

[Mel1959]

So, just to be clear. It is just the FV 32/40 and NOT the FV 20/50 with regards to feeding to older squirrels?

[HRT4SQRLS]

Yes, FoxValley 20:50 is recommended for baby squirrels.
How old are your babies? If they are 3weeks or less there is a goat milk recipe that we can direct you to.

Please DO NOT USE ESBILAC!!! The warnings you have read about are true.

[Mommasika]

I would like to have the goat milk recipe on hand just in case. I just received my order from Henry’s and got the 32/40. I shall be emailing and asking if I can return for an exchange of another bag of the 20/50.

Mommasika

[BehrleJay]

Thank you, Nancy. Having four pinkies right now, and watching their little bodies digest Esbilac just fine, thank you very much, reminded me of the horrors we all experienced with FV 32/40 a few seasons ago.

I believe we all became complacent or just frustrated at the fact that neither FV's owner nor a few others in the wildlife nutrition field seemed to take the problem seriously. Good rehabbers second-guess themselves; many of us thought it was our fault st first, not the formula. But it was SO many babies, and SO many good rehabbers, that there is no longer any doubt in my mind......
IT WAS THE FORMULA.

Has anyone had this issue with 20/50? I'm having a similar issue now with 2 seven week olds. Thriving since I've had them but suddenly after about 2 weeks they seem bloated (2 of the litter, 1 first, 24 hours later another) stool is darker and harder and they're just lazy and not feeling well. I'm rehydrating now with a honey/pedialyte mix along with just water as they'll drink it. I cannot figure out what went wrong, they were PERFECT and then it's like someone flipped a switch.

[Spanky]

I have heard of no issues with the FV 20/50. They are not clicking (Aspiration Pneumonia) are they?

[BehrleJay]

I have heard of no issues with the FV 20/50. They are not clicking (Aspiration Pneumonia) are they?

No clicking, I've been listening every chance I get just to be sure.

[Mel1959]

Don’t give pedialyte for longer than 24 hrs. After that time switch to plain sweetened water.

Give a drop of infant GasX for the bloat.